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  1. - Top - End - #601
    Pixie in the Playground
     
    Flumph

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    Default Re: What are you reading right now?

    I just finished reading Broken Homes, the 4th book in the PC Peter Grant (aka Rivers of London) series. The first book in that series is great, and I liked 2 and 3 well enough, but Broken Homes aggravated me so much that I might decide not to read any more.

    Now I'm going back to reading more of the Chronicles of Amber. I read the first of these when I tried to do at least one book from each author in the D&D 5e PHB's Appendix E, and I liked the first Amber book well enough that I'm now on the fifth one (The Courts of Chaos). Although, to be honest, all of the Amber books so far have been one continuous story, so breaking them down into books feels a bit arbitrary.

  2. - Top - End - #602
    Librarian in the Playground Moderator
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    Default Re: What are you reading right now?

    Been working through the Broken Earth trilogy on my commute. I've reached the Stone Sky, and it's a great series with some really excellent world-building... but so, so much child abuse. I almost dropped The Fifth Season because of it, and it doesn't get terribly better in The Obelisk Gate, but it got VERY hard to listen to at several points.

    Since I'm listening, I want to shout out to the reader, Robin Miles. She is fantastic; a great range of voices that really help keep the characters straight, and separate the narration from speech. Seriously, she also did the Binti trilogy by Nnedi Okorafor (Binti, Home, Night Masquerade), and she is wonderful to listen to.
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  3. - Top - End - #603
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    NecromancerGuy

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    Default Re: What are you reading right now?

    Quote Originally Posted by Mark Hall View Post
    Been working through the Broken Earth trilogy on my commute. I've reached the Stone Sky, and it's a great series with some really excellent world-building... but so, so much child abuse. I almost dropped The Fifth Season because of it, and it doesn't get terribly better in The Obelisk Gate, but it got VERY hard to listen to at several points.

    Since I'm listening, I want to shout out to the reader, Robin Miles. She is fantastic; a great range of voices that really help keep the characters straight, and separate the narration from speech. Seriously, she also did the Binti trilogy by Nnedi Okorafor (Binti, Home, Night Masquerade), and she is wonderful to listen to.
    I love, love, love the Broken Earth trilogy; they've become some of my favorite books ever, honestly. Certainly intense, though.
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  4. - Top - End - #604
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    DruidGirl

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    Default Re: What are you reading right now?

    Reading The Goblin Emperor by Catherine Addison and the translation at the same time.

    Why is it that every time I read a book in the original and the translation, I come to the conclusion that the translation is bad? (Except from the LotR translation by Margaret Carroux, but the new translation by Krege again fits into the pattern.)

    Translating literature well is hard, and translators are badly paid, but I cannot help but feel that some mistakes made are intentional rather than accidental.

  5. - Top - End - #605
    Ettin in the Playground
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    I take it you've read a few of the Victorian 'translations' of M. Jules Verne's works? They're horribly bad. I didn't realize how much so until a friend gave me the new translation of Twenty Thousand Leagues Under the Seas that the Naval Institute Press did.

  6. - Top - End - #606
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    DruidGirl

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rogar Demonblud View Post
    I take it you've read a few of the Victorian 'translations' of M. Jules Verne's works? They're horribly bad. I didn't realize how much so until a friend gave me the new translation of Twenty Thousand Leagues Under the Seas that the Naval Institute Press did.
    In fact, I have not, I was basing my opinion solely on the Harry Potter translations, which did things like change the sexes of Rowena Ravenclaw and Helga Hufflepuff to male. Not consistently, just in that one song, and there were no pronouns in that, but seriously, "fair Ravenclaw from glen", and the translator was so progressive that it did not even occur to him that men are not often described as "fair" in the sense of "beautiful"?

    And the newer LotR translation.

    And that's admittedly all the books I read repeatedly in the original and translated version, but, still.

    That, and The Goblin Emperor, in which the translation has a character appear in a scene in which he does not appear in the original, I kid you not.

    Victorian translations? I suspect I would be horrified.

  7. - Top - End - #607
    Ettin in the Playground
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    Maybe, maybe not. Depends on if you're just trying to read or if you like playing the literary equivalent of a game of telephone, trying to work back through the translations to figure out how the original text got so tweaked. In the case of Verne, it turns out that most translators never saw the French text due to import/export laws, so they were doing translations of the translations (or in the case of Five Weeks In A Balloon, translating the Italian translation of the German translation of the French original, done by a gentleman who knew Latin but not Italian).

    But I like digging into this stuff on occasion. You learn such interesting things, like that 'cannon-fodder' is the English reverse translation of the German text for Shakespeare's Henry IV--"Food For Powder" in the original.

  8. - Top - End - #608
    Ettin in the Playground
     
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    Just powered through Tiamat's Wrath, book 8 of The Expanse. It's one of my favourites in the series, everything's been put in place for the big finale (the series is going to be 9 books long)

    Spoiler
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    The original crew are back together on the Roci, the politics are shaken up so that everything's nice and chaotic again, and the keys to the last mystery of the protomolecule builders are out in the open with the right people interested in what they unlock.

    Meanwhile, the horrible things from beyond space have properly woken up and noticed humanity and have also noticed that their old trick doesn't work on meat brains and are trying something new.

  9. - Top - End - #609
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    Default Re: What are you reading right now?

    Quote Originally Posted by Themrys View Post

    Victorian translations? I suspect I would be horrified.
    I think those changed all the units in the measurements to their rough english equivalents without bothering to actually do the conversions. Verne had done the maths so that everything makes sense but when you keep translating "1 000 kilometres" by "1,000 miles" it doesn't quite work.
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    the Vector Legion [is the IFCC's new pawns], mark my words. Way too much unfinished business there and they already know about the Gates.
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  10. - Top - End - #610
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    DruidGirl

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    Default Re: What are you reading right now?

    Quote Originally Posted by Fyraltari View Post
    I think those changed all the units in the measurements to their rough english equivalents without bothering to actually do the conversions. Verne had done the maths so that everything makes sense but when you keep translating "1 000 kilometres" by "1,000 miles" it doesn't quite work.
    To be honest, I probably wouldn't notice that particular problem, I am bad at math, and also am from a country where we use kilometres, so would translate that right back to where it makes sense.
    However, I have heard that wanting to keep translations close to the original is a relatively new phenomenon, so I expect any Victorian translation, even a direct one, to be of questionable quality.

    If even modern translations do things like change "Beshelar would have had an apoplexy" to "Beshelar seemed close to an apoplexy", Beshelar being the bodyugard who is not on duty, and therefore not present in that scene, as evidenced by the other two bodyguards being there ... yeah, well, it makes me seem close to an apoplexy.
    Last edited by Themrys; 2019-03-23 at 07:22 AM.

  11. - Top - End - #611
    Titan in the Playground
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    Quote Originally Posted by Themrys View Post
    This sounds perfectly horrible. (I would totally read a blog post that details its horribleness in detail, though. I am too easily bored to hate-read books myself, but I like reading reviews of horrible books.)

    Where was the feminism?

    I mean, sure, providing women who suffered under patriarchy with some much needed revenge fantasies against men might be counted as feminist cause if you squint, but I don't see how writing about men being flogged by dragon-venom soaked whips would work to achieve things like bodily autonomy or equal pay for women.

    So, where do you get the idea that the book had aspirations of feminism?
    It struck me as the sort of book where women suffer and are saintly, and men range from underdeveloped but sort of ok, to underdeveloped but actually scum. With most being scum. Which is by no means all, or even most, of feminism. But it's certainly a detectable undercurrent in some of its less pleasant, useful or worthwhile forms.

    Though perhaps it's more fair to say it's Lit Fic with pretensions to revealing great truths about gender with a seasoning of dragons, instead of feminist in particular. I say this because the narration was constantly pausing to say things about gender, in the sort of way that suggested the reveal of great universal truths.

    For instance, the main character's sister has a plan to become the local baron sort of dude's son's kept woman. This plan consists of, I am not making this up, trading public sexual favors with a nine year old boy for him giving her a whip he's planning to win in a foot race so she can walk around holding said whip. There's no reason to believe that said baron's son has a thing for women with whips, or a woman carrying a whip is understood as meaning "I'm looking to become a high class concubine" or anything like that. No, it's simply that guys universally flip out for hot women with whips.

    Which I find both somewhat obnoxious, and rather incorrect. I've only been a straight guy for literally my entire life, and whips do not, and have never, done anything for me. Maybe I've been doing it wrong all these years.

    (I feel compelled to note that, in an extremely cringe-inducing section, the main character describes her sister's physical attractiveness in lurid and quite graphic detail. The main character is like 8 years old or something.)

    You may be getting the impression that the book is messed up. This impression is not entirely accurate, in the sense that saying "Antarctica is chilly" is only vaguely hinting at the problem. There's levels of messupedness I haven't even touched on, and I literally cannot fully describe all the levels of messed up that occur without getting banned. And that's just what's in the first two chapters; online summaries suggest it gets *way worse.*
    Blood-red were his spurs i' the golden noon; wine-red was his velvet coat,
    When they shot him down on the highway,
    Down like a dog on the highway,
    And he lay in his blood on the highway, with the bunch of lace at his throat.


    Alfred Noyes, The Highwayman, 1906.

  12. - Top - End - #612
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    DruidGirl

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    Default Re: What are you reading right now?

    Quote Originally Posted by warty goblin View Post
    It struck me as the sort of book where women suffer and are saintly, and men range from underdeveloped but sort of ok, to underdeveloped but actually scum. With most being scum. Which is by no means all, or even most, of feminism. But it's certainly a detectable undercurrent in some of its less pleasant, useful or worthwhile forms.
    The thing is, feminism is about women. To be a feminist, you must work towards improving the lives of women. Or at least you have to have a wish to achieve something in that direction.

    Whether or not a woman hates men is completely irrelevant to her status as feminist or nonfeminist. Same as hating humans might be a common side effect of caring about the environment, but doesn't, on it's own, make an environmentalist, nor is it required to be considered one.

    If the book portrayed women as harming men in the same ways men harm women in the real world, one could debate there being some attempt at a social commentary, but men who molest nine year old girls don't do usually (or, like, ever) so in the hopes of becoming well-paid prostitutes.

    So, sorry to say, but I don't think this book has any aspirations above catering to a number of very weird fetishes.

  13. - Top - End - #613
    Ogre in the Playground
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    I'm about 2/3 of the way through Dragons of Autumn Twilight, and this book feels so very 80's to me. I know this series holds an honored place in D&D fiction, but it would be a stretch to say I'm loving it.

    Raistlin is of course the most interesting character, although I'm surprised at how blatant the "Raistlin is evil" hints are.

    Caramon comes off as a bit underdeveloped here, but I've read one of the later trilogies and found him more likable there.

    Tasslehoff is an annoying little butt. I absolutely understand why everyone hates kender.

    Flint, Sturm, Goldmoon, Riverwind and especially Tanis are all bland and forgettable. I feel like at least one or two of these characters could have been omitted and nothing of value would be lost.

    At least the world feels more fleshed out than it did in the Legends trilogy.
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  14. - Top - End - #614
    Ettin in the Playground
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    Default Re: What are you reading right now?

    If you didn't know, the group in the Chronicles Trilogy are the playtesters for the modules (actually the first Adventure Path, IMO). The editors at TSR demanded tie-in fiction for the setting, so Weis and Hickman basically novelized the AP. It's pretty evident which people were the roleplayers in the group.

  15. - Top - End - #615
    Ogre in the Playground
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    Default Re: What are you reading right now?

    Read Phantoms by Dean Koontz while on break last week. Enjoyed it and it had its moments, but overall felt like a less interesting version of It.*

    Also been working my way through Galilee by Clive Barker. Its an interesting read, but is very meandery, with no real clear direction. Which kinda seems the point with where I'm at (not quite halfway). Probably doesn't help that the previous CB book I read was the Scarlet Gospels, and that one was non-stop crazed action from page 1.

    Edit:
    *Which is funny, cause after checking publication dates, Phantoms was published 3 years before It. Go figure.
    Last edited by Wookieetank; 2019-03-25 at 01:04 PM.
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  16. - Top - End - #616
    Titan in the Playground
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    Default Re: What are you reading right now?

    Quote Originally Posted by Rogar Demonblud View Post
    If you didn't know, the group in the Chronicles Trilogy are the playtesters for the modules (actually the first Adventure Path, IMO). The editors at TSR demanded tie-in fiction for the setting, so Weis and Hickman basically novelized the AP. It's pretty evident which people were the roleplayers in the group.
    It also gets substantially less like a novelization of a dungeon crawl in the rest of the trilogy. That's really only a dominant factor in the first book; which isn't terribly surprising as it's not like there were a lot of examples of game-based novels to draw on.

    Also, Sturm is one of my favorite characters in the series, and I will go to the barricades over this. It'll be the great One Nerd Nerd Riot of 2019.
    Blood-red were his spurs i' the golden noon; wine-red was his velvet coat,
    When they shot him down on the highway,
    Down like a dog on the highway,
    And he lay in his blood on the highway, with the bunch of lace at his throat.


    Alfred Noyes, The Highwayman, 1906.

  17. - Top - End - #617
    Ettin in the Playground
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    Default Re: What are you reading right now?

    About a third of the way into Winter's Night they caught up with the group. Allegedly, they finished writing Spring's Dawning before the group started playing those modules. Not surprisingly, the quality of the books rises the further they get from the AP.

  18. - Top - End - #618
    Firbolg in the Playground
     
    2D8HP's Avatar

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    Default Re: What are you reading right now?

    I've less than 20 pages left (including the Afterward of the 297 page The Tangled Lands story collection by Bacigalupi and Tobias S. Buckell, which I've mentioned in other threads:
    Quote Originally Posted by 2D8HP View Post
    The new The Tangled Lands story collection by Bacigalupi and Tobias S. Buckell looks to have a Dark Sun like take on "magic has a price" (I haven't read it yet but I'm looking forward to it!).
    Quote Originally Posted by 2D8HP View Post
    Normally "Magitech" isn't to me taste, but the new The Tangled Lands "shared world" short story collection by Bacigalupi and Tobias S. Buckell has some and I think it's pretty good.

    Four 'shared world' novellettes titled:

    "The Alchemist"

    "The Executioness"

    "The Children of Khaim"

    and

    "The Blacksmith's Daughter"

    An obvious parable, but AWESOME!!!

    Steel against magic.

    Low born against high born.

    Suspenseful and 'page-turning'.

    This one is really good, and if another book is described as like it, I'm gonna get it!

    Recommended.
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  19. - Top - End - #619
    Ettin in the Playground
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    Quote Originally Posted by warty goblin View Post
    Also, Sturm is one of my favorite characters in the series, and I will go to the barricades over this.
    FTFY.
    Well, FTFM, actually.
    Last edited by BWR; 2019-03-26 at 06:39 AM.

  20. - Top - End - #620
    Titan in the Playground
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rogar Demonblud View Post
    About a third of the way into Winter's Night they caught up with the group. Allegedly, they finished writing Spring's Dawning before the group started playing those modules. Not surprisingly, the quality of the books rises the further they get from the AP.
    I've always figured Winter's Night was the strongest of the Chronicles. It's structurally probably the most ambitious, and while there's some definite low points (anything to do with elf politics) there's also some real high points, like the ending, the Dream, (depending on your comic relief tolerance) gnomes, Tarsis. Really there's a lot of upsides.

    Spoiler: Ending stuff
    Show

    I'd put the ending high on my list of tragic fantasy deaths; the writing is really quite good for Weiss and Hickman, and the raw enthusiasm they clearly had for the project makes it pop. And they don't wimp out and have him improbably survive, or come back from the dead, or any other lameness. Sturm just flat out dies, and I think there's two interesting things the book does with that.

    Firstly, the major impact of his death is on other characters, particularly Laurana who stealthily has a really cool character arc over the series. A lot of the time when a secondary character bites it in a heroic way in a fantasy novel it's while saving the world or killing a load of super-powered enemies or something like that. Sturm dies to give Laurana the time to, not so much save the day as temporarily unscrew a really screwed situation. And the immediate aftermath is Laurana chewing everybody out for thinking it was all heroic and worthwhile because the entire situation only came up because of petty infighting and stupidity. It's sort of weird to have the most overtly heroic sacrifice in the series followed up by a speech about how the whole thing was a goddamn waste.

    Secondly, it's a redemptive death, but in Sturm's eyes, not anybody else's. The other common way to off a supporting character is to have them be all anti-heroic or morally ambiguous, and then they die doing a good and we have feels about how they saw the light and redeemed themselves in the end and the universe is moral or something. Sturm has done absolutely nothing that requires redeeming; he's just flat out a very good person, albeit a rigid one whose moral drive makes him seriously unhappy a lot of the time. And the books are actually basically ok with him being that. There isn't a bit where he learns to lighten up and be less hard on himself, or cracks a joke and everybody's like "we've fixed him" or anything. His epiphany, such as it is, is that his unconventional friends have let him see the knighthood's failings, not that the values the knighthood claims are wrong. In the midst of disaster he realizes he's devoted himself to a deeply compromised and failing institution, and proceeds to do the most Sturm thing possible about it; i.e. eat a spear. Which ironically saves the knighthood that had failed him and everybody else so badly.

    There's something I kind of love about that.

    Also, once you read farther into the series, the entire thing becomes a soap opera with dragons. Kit kills Sturm, whom she had previously seduced after getting dumped by Tanis for being just a bit evil. Tanis is of course Sturm's best friend, and Sturm is off dying nobly to protect Laurana, who's been chasing after Tanis like a lovesick puppy for two novels. But Kit has re-seduced Tanis, and is in fact only killing Sturm in an afternoon break from elf-boinking so she can squeeze in a bit of world-conquering. But of course Tanis uses the time she's away to run away so he can end up with Laurana again. The downstream of all of this is that in about four novels Kit's soul gets stolen by a death knight because Love. It's just marvelous.



    Quote Originally Posted by BWR View Post
    FTFY.
    Well, FTFM, actually.
    It'll be a two-nerd nerd riot.
    Blood-red were his spurs i' the golden noon; wine-red was his velvet coat,
    When they shot him down on the highway,
    Down like a dog on the highway,
    And he lay in his blood on the highway, with the bunch of lace at his throat.


    Alfred Noyes, The Highwayman, 1906.

  21. - Top - End - #621
    Titan in the Playground
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    Default Re: What are you reading right now?

    I just finished Hornblower and the Hotspur. I rather enjoyed it. Obviously good reading for those who like mostly accurate Napoleonic era sailing ship stories that are still ripping good yarns. Which . . . I rather do, thank you very much.
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  22. - Top - End - #622
    Ettin in the Playground
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    Quote Originally Posted by warty goblin View Post
    Spoiler: Ending stuff
    Show

    I'd put the ending high on my list of tragic fantasy deaths; the writing is really quite good for Weiss and Hickman, and the raw enthusiasm they clearly had for the project makes it pop. And they don't wimp out and have him improbably survive, or come back from the dead, or any other lameness. Sturm just flat out dies, and I think there's two interesting things the book does with that.

    Firstly, the major impact of his death is on other characters, particularly Laurana who stealthily has a really cool character arc over the series. A lot of the time when a secondary character bites it in a heroic way in a fantasy novel it's while saving the world or killing a load of super-powered enemies or something like that. Sturm dies to give Laurana the time to, not so much save the day as temporarily unscrew a really screwed situation. And the immediate aftermath is Laurana chewing everybody out for thinking it was all heroic and worthwhile because the entire situation only came up because of petty infighting and stupidity. It's sort of weird to have the most overtly heroic sacrifice in the series followed up by a speech about how the whole thing was a goddamn waste.

    Secondly, it's a redemptive death, but in Sturm's eyes, not anybody else's. The other common way to off a supporting character is to have them be all anti-heroic or morally ambiguous, and then they die doing a good and we have feels about how they saw the light and redeemed themselves in the end and the universe is moral or something. Sturm has done absolutely nothing that requires redeeming; he's just flat out a very good person, albeit a rigid one whose moral drive makes him seriously unhappy a lot of the time. And the books are actually basically ok with him being that. There isn't a bit where he learns to lighten up and be less hard on himself, or cracks a joke and everybody's like "we've fixed him" or anything. His epiphany, such as it is, is that his unconventional friends have let him see the knighthood's failings, not that the values the knighthood claims are wrong. In the midst of disaster he realizes he's devoted himself to a deeply compromised and failing institution, and proceeds to do the most Sturm thing possible about it; i.e. eat a spear. Which ironically saves the knighthood that had failed him and everybody else so badly.

    There's something I kind of love about that.

    Also, once you read farther into the series, the entire thing becomes a soap opera with dragons. Kit kills Sturm, whom she had previously seduced after getting dumped by Tanis for being just a bit evil. Tanis is of course Sturm's best friend, and Sturm is off dying nobly to protect Laurana, who's been chasing after Tanis like a lovesick puppy for two novels. But Kit has re-seduced Tanis, and is in fact only killing Sturm in an afternoon break from elf-boinking so she can squeeze in a bit of world-conquering. But of course Tanis uses the time she's away to run away so he can end up with Laurana again. The downstream of all of this is that in about four novels Kit's soul gets stolen by a death knight because Love. It's just marvelous.

    Spoiler
    Show
    Sturm's death is a redemptive moment, but not for Sturm. He redeemed the Knights that rejected him, as an example of all they were supposed to be.

  23. - Top - End - #623
    Troll in the Playground
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    Default Re: What are you reading right now?

    I'm on a James Ellroy kick at the moment. I've got the Lloyd Hopkins trilogy and am shooting through them. I've already read 'Blood on the Moon' and have jumped straight into 'Because the Night'
    Interestingly while I like most of his work none quite measure up to 'LA Confidential' and I've never been sure if that's because its the first of his books I read or its just the best
    All Comicshorse's posts come with the advisor : This is just my opinion any difficulties arising from implementing my ideas are your own problem

  24. - Top - End - #624
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    Default Re: What are you reading right now?

    Quote Originally Posted by Rogar Demonblud View Post
    If you didn't know, the group in the Chronicles Trilogy are the playtesters for the modules (actually the first Adventure Path, IMO). The editors at TSR demanded tie-in fiction for the setting, so Weis and Hickman basically novelized the AP. It's pretty evident which people were the roleplayers in the group.
    That came up in the book club discussion, actually. While I am the only current D&D player in the group, there are a couple of people who played back in the olden days, and one of them talked a bit about this. Still, while it makes sense being a tie-in, and I've never played the module to know how I would enjoy that, for purposes of the novel I wouldn't have minded one or two fewer party members.


    Quote Originally Posted by warty goblin View Post
    It also gets substantially less like a novelization of a dungeon crawl in the rest of the trilogy. That's really only a dominant factor in the first book; which isn't terribly surprising as it's not like there were a lot of examples of game-based novels to draw on.

    Also, Sturm is one of my favorite characters in the series, and I will go to the barricades over this. It'll be the great One Nerd Nerd Riot of 2019.
    Without getting into too many specifics (in case I do ever read the rest of the series), was that true from the first book, or did he grow on you because of something in later books?
    Quote Originally Posted by 2D8HP View Post
    Work is the scourge of the gaming classes!

  25. - Top - End - #625
    Ettin in the Playground
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    Got around to reading the later 1632 books, and the (currently) last one really ticked me off. It was mostly Amazon's fault, but still.

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    The description on Amazon for the Kindle edition tells you that Pope Urban is assassinated, and Cardinal Bedmar is the new pope. Urban dies 95% of the way in, and Cardinal Bedmar isn't confirmed as pope when the book ends. Knowing that the assassination attempt succeeds takes all the tension out of the massive battle that dominates the last third of it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Velaryon View Post
    That came up in the book club discussion, actually. While I am the only current D&D player in the group, there are a couple of people who played back in the olden days, and one of them talked a bit about this. Still, while it makes sense being a tie-in, and I've never played the module to know how I would enjoy that, for purposes of the novel I wouldn't have minded one or two fewer party members.
    If you have the Annotated Edition, they comment on this a couple of times. As I recall, they say that their actual playtests didn't influence the story all that much, since when they were testing the module they lowered somebody into the well at Xak Tsaroth, with the result that everybody got eaten by a dragon.

    Mostly I think the first book focuses quite a lot on the combat encounter/dungeon crawl portion of the modules, while even by the next book they really stop doing that at all, unless it's also interesting for character reasons, or it's a really big plot deal or something. For instance there's two major dungeon crawl sequences in Winter Night that the narrative summarizes ex post facto in about a paragraph, because for plot reasons a rando thing needed retrieved, but the details didn't matter.

    That said, Autumn Twilight is easily one of the weaker mainline books. I might prefer it to Spring Dawning, but that's probably because, due to difficulties in actually finding the darn thing, I had read all the way up through the War of Souls trilogy before laying hands on the thing. To say it was spoiled is putting it mildly.

    Without getting into too many specifics (in case I do ever read the rest of the series), was that true from the first book, or did he grow on you because of something in later books?
    If I'm being honest, probably 75% of the reason I like Dragonlance is that I first read it when I was like 14 and had basically no friends. Also, literally everybody in my family disapproved of it in some manner or other, which made it perfect for entirely non-consequential acts of teenage rebellion. I really can't separate my nostalgia for the novels from the novels, and frankly would hate to even try. The closest I would come is to say that I love them to pieces, but I wouldn't in general recommend the series to adults. If the first book is at all interesting, I'd say it's worth at least giving the rest of the trilogy a shot though, since you're already involved.
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    Quote Originally Posted by warty goblin View Post
    If you have the Annotated Edition, they comment on this a couple of times. As I recall, they say that their actual playtests didn't influence the story all that much, since when they were testing the module they lowered somebody into the well at Xak Tsaroth, with the result that everybody got eaten by a dragon.
    I don't have the annotated edition, but someone else did and talked about it a litle, although they didn't mention the bit about everyone getting eaten.

    Anyway, I can see how the book was a learning experience for everyone involved, and while it's not my favorite thing it's also not unpleasant to read either. I can appreciate it for its significance to D&D even if I won't be listing it among my favorites anytime soon.


    If I'm being honest, probably 75% of the reason I like Dragonlance is that I first read it when I was like 14 and had basically no friends. Also, literally everybody in my family disapproved of it in some manner or other, which made it perfect for entirely non-consequential acts of teenage rebellion. I really can't separate my nostalgia for the novels from the novels, and frankly would hate to even try. The closest I would come is to say that I love them to pieces, but I wouldn't in general recommend the series to adults. If the first book is at all interesting, I'd say it's worth at least giving the rest of the trilogy a shot though, since you're already involved.
    I understand. I'm the exact same with the Shannara series.
    Quote Originally Posted by 2D8HP View Post
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    Quote Originally Posted by warty goblin View Post
    If I'm being honest, probably 75% of the reason I like Dragonlance is that I first read it when I was like 14 and had basically no friends. Also, literally everybody in my family disapproved of it in some manner or other, which made it perfect for entirely non-consequential acts of teenage rebellion. .
    I too was about 13-14 when I first read them, but had friends I played D&D with (which is why I picked up the Chronicles in the first place) and parents who were supportive of my gaming hobby. I still enjoy the Chronicles, but most other DL books aren't nearly as good.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BWR View Post
    I too was about 13-14 when I first read them, but had friends I played D&D with (which is why I picked up the Chronicles in the first place) and parents who were supportive of my gaming hobby. I still enjoy the Chronicles, but most other DL books aren't nearly as good.
    I personally still enjoy Chronicles and Legends, especially Legends. I also like the Minotaur trilogy, but everything else is a bit of a dumpster fire.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tvtyrant View Post
    I personally still enjoy Chronicles and Legends, especially Legends. I also like the Minotaur trilogy, but everything else is a bit of a dumpster fire.
    There's some great ones in there, but the quality varies. I like the Defenders of Magic trilogy pretty well.
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