Warhammer 40K Tabletop XXX: Imperium After Dark

[Mr. E]

Yeah. But you can't make UNITS out of Chaplains, and Chaplains aren't even that good to begin with.
What you're about to see - judging by the Fast Attack logo on the shoulder pads - is that the stupidly named 'Rievers' - yes, that appears to be the name - are super-stealth ninja assassins. Now, while that's great for Night Lords - who specifically have a Primarch that's basically a Batman/Joker hybrid, and are explicitly The Bad Guys - and for Culexus Assassins that are...Anti-Life. But, for Ultramarines, it's not great.

I read that they look eerily similar to something Call of Duty has, and that maybe GW is trying to tap that crowd.

Mind you, even if they are always going to look slightly odd in a Ultramarine or Salamander's army, they do make abundant sense in, say, a Raven Guard force. I can't comment on the relative similarities or lack thereof to certain video game characters, but I always thought that the SM tactic of getting your newest recruits to run spec-ops was slightly bizarre. At least this way makes some sense. If they might not be the fluffiest in some chapter's armies, they will fit in nicely in others. That has always been the way with just about every special unit (e.g. Salamander's not taking assault marines).

[Drasius]

ION; So GW just introduced LOYALIST Marines with skull-face masks because Massive Edgelords only play Dark Eldar or Night Lords, and not Space Marines. So now if I get some, I have to paint them black and field them alongside Sisters of Silence with pink and/or blue hair (The M'Ladies). Also, I'll model their swords into Katanas, and the one that isn't in a helmet obviously has to wear a fedora. They might just be the dumbest models I've seen in a while, and I don't say that a lot about GW miniatures.

All the new loyalist muhreens (except the basic bolter boys) have been severely underwhelming and these reivers are no different. Since the new jump troops were actually assault marines with the firepower of devastators, these look like the other half - devastators with the firepower of an assault marine. I'm not sure what or who thought it would be a good idea though. Tacs have always been pretty bad at combat, giving them a pistol and ccw doesn't change that, it just makes them ASM without jump packs or access to a drop pod. Even with the second wound, they're still going to get shredded.

[Renegade Paladin]

All the new loyalist muhreens (except the basic bolter boys) have been severely underwhelming and these reivers are no different. Since the new jump troops were actually assault marines with the firepower of devastators, these look like the other half - devastators with the firepower of an assault marine. I'm not sure what or who thought it would be a good idea though. Tacs have always been pretty bad at combat, giving them a pistol and ccw doesn't change that, it just makes them ASM without jump packs or access to a drop pod. Even with the second wound, they're still going to get shredded.

Do we actually know anything about their rules? For all we know they may get to Infiltrate.

[Cheesegear]

Since the new jump troops were actually assault marines with the firepower of devastators

I like the look of flying Centurions. They look cool. Except I've used them in two games at this point, and they are certainly not 'flying Centurions' and both times they've been extremely underwhelming. Especially after yesterday when I started using Death Company with Boltguns. Hopefully when a Codex gets dropped, Inceptors will gain some upgrades so make them not terrible. I wouldn't mind at all, if Inceptors carried Multi-Meltas instead of Heavy Bolters.

But, Reivers, are indicative of the 'Gulliman problem'. Where the hyper-stylisation of a model just makes it look stupid.
During the Great Crusade, there was even a 'necessary evil' squad, Destroyer Marines. You'll notice how stupid they don't look. Even the crazy-guy Moritats, look fine.

[LCP]

Edit: Also its 'I before E except after C' GW. So Change. The. Freaking. Spelling.

Reiver is a word. Much like heir, weir, sleigh, vein...

[hamishspence]

Reiver is a word. Much like heir, weir, sleigh, vein...

And it crops up in GW fiction in the Cain books, almost every time Cain's referencing the Dark Eldar.

Looks like a Chaplain.

It does - specifically, the "skull-faced" chaplains rather than "skull-helmed" chaplains. Xavier was one. And there were a few others.

Spoiler

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[deuterio12]

Funny thing is, GW claims they wear skull faces to inspire terror on their enemies.

What enemies exactly? Are necrons gonna get scared of humie skulls? Tau? Orks? Daemons? Eldar that enjoy seeing Death Jesters performances? Those Khorne Berzekers that are looking for more skulls for the skull throne?

No, only normal humies would be afraid of humie skull motiffs. Those new reivers are indeed there to do the same job as the Night Lords when the emperor recruited them-terrorize normal humies into obeying the imperium.

Hilarity shall ensue when those guardsmen squads see the skull-faced bolt pistol+close combat weapon units pop out of nowhere and shoots the crap out of them.

[hamishspence]

Keep in mind that a large part of Chaos's armies is likely to be human - if a little mutated in some cases.

[LeSwordfish]

I quite like the new characters though. I think I saw a variant of the captain with Storm Bolter instead of sword, so hopefully these guys have actual options.

[Tome]

Keep in mind that a large part of Chaos's armies is likely to be human - if a little mutated in some cases.

Yeah, but have you seen the number of skulls on the average chaos model?

[lord_khaine]

Yeah, but have you seen the number of skulls on the average chaos model?

Far above regulation! the Heresy!

[Blackhawk748]

Reiver is a word. Much like heir, weir, sleigh, vein...

Ok, im wrong, but that word still looks wrong and it bugs me.

[Gwyn chan 'r Gwyll]

I saw somebody do a dictionary survey actually, and there were more "E before I" words than there were "I before E".

[Mystic Muse]

Well, no more recasts. Lack of instructions is actually a problem.

[Turalisj]

Reiver is a word. Much like heir, weir, sleigh, vein...

How hard is it to call them raiders?

[LeSwordfish]

How hard is it to call them raiders?

Honestly, with Inceptors, Incessors and Hellblasters, I think Reivers are frankly the best primaris name we have yet.

[Turalisj]

That's not very helpful

At least they'll fit in a blood angel army.

[9mm]

Far above regulation! the Heresy!

I'm fairly certain it's under regulation, also Heresy.

oh lets be honest, It's both and Heresy.

[Requizen]

The guy I sold my Scions to is looking to sell them himself (he's one of those ADD players who'll buy an army and sell it within a month). I'm thinking about buying it back, but there are rumors that they're going to nerf them, though maybe just Command Squads?

Still, would be interesting to pick them up and then snag some AM artillery/infantry pieces. Maybe not the "50 Conscripts + Yarrick + Scions" netlist, but a nice thematic force.

[Renegade Paladin]

Dude, they're amazing. I played a game of Maelstrom yesterday, and had three squads and a Prime in deep strike reserve, and I would just draw an objective card and drop a squad on it, and then plasma something to death. Worked like a charm.

[Cheesegear]

I would just draw an objective card and drop a squad on it, and then plasma something to death. Worked like a charm.

That's...Kind of his point. There are rumours of MTs being nerfed. So he's on the fence on whether to buy them or not.

[Renegade Paladin]

That's...Kind of his point. There are rumours of MTs being nerfed. So he's on the fence on whether to buy them or not.

They were literally just released. Unless we're talking about a Guard codex in the near future, I wouldn't be too worried about that.

[Cheesegear]

They were literally just released.

If they're planning to do 'hot fixes' or 'living Errata' like they said they would, it wouldn't matter. Then you go the slippery slope of MOBAs where you release a broken character to make everyone buy it, then nerf them a month later after you've made all your sales. That said, they said they would do that for Age of Sigmar, and they didn't, because it would ultimately mean less hard-copy book sales because why would you buy a book if they're just going to change it (quoth from GW Blackshirt)? GW released everything AoS online and said they'd fix it if it was broke, but they never did and just went straight into forcing people to buy books if they really wanted to play with their army properly.

We already know General's Handbook II is reducing - nearly? - all Fyreslayers' stuff by 20 Points. So maybe it's something like that? Anyway, rumours are that MTs are being nerfed (because everybody has already figured out that they're broke and GW is actually maybe listening). When that's happening or if it's even true is anybody's guess. After all, in order to nerf them, you only have to increase their PR/Points. That's all it takes. A single line in a .pdf to hot fix PR/Points and that's all you need to do.

The deciding factor to whether a unit is broken or not, is points cost, and whether or not a unit is worth paying for. What is the max points that people would be willing to pay for MTs? Make it that - or slightly more expensive - and suddenly they're not so broken anymore.

[Turalisj]

I just want them to nerf the ynari soulburst, it completely breaks action economy in the game.

[Requizen]

Yeah the FLG guys have heavily hinted that Scion Command Squads in particular may get an adjustment. Which isn't a big deal, I like the army anyway - thematically, tactically, and the models. Plus they mesh well with a variety of Imperial armies if I want to go more for a soup style.

I just sold all my outstanding Chaos stuff (farewell Be'lakor, we shared some good memories) so I can afford to get it back. Basically it's between that and a Necron FW spending binge.

[Parra]

Does the Tau Early Warning Overide ability trigger when a psychic ability allows you to teleport a troop around the battlefield such as the Ork or Gray Knight Psychic powers?

Both Orc and GK abilities say to remove the unit and reset up using exactly the same terms as the deepstrike abilities, which to me would allow the Tau EWO to trigger off them.

[Cheesegear]

Does the Tau Early Warning Overide ability trigger when a psychic ability allows you to teleport a troop around the battlefield such as the Ork or Gray Knight Psychic powers?

The EWO says nothing about models that were already on the table. The EWO only talks about units 'arriving mid-battle'. Except Orks and Grey Knights were already there. Orks and Grey Knights don't arrive mid-battle. So it probably doesn't count, RAW.

For a complex question like that, that actually could be ruled the other way (IMO), you'd have to ask GW's Facebook.

[Parra]

thats the problem, in my group some are arguing one way others the other. As you rightly point out it could be read either way.

The crux of the argument is that both GK/Ork abilities say to 'Remove' the unit from the battle field and then goes on to describe how to re-set up, which is word perfect for the various deep strike abilities set up. To me it seem clear that the GK/Ork ability was to allow an already deployed unit to deepstrike mid-battle and so should trigger the Tau's EWO (and the Necrons Etheral Interception)

[Cheesegear]

thats the problem, in my group some are arguing one way others the other. As you rightly point out it could be read either way.

At which point, you take it to Facebook, and you'll normally get an answer within a day or two.

[Gwyn chan 'r Gwyll]

So I noticed that the Sisters of Battle only get, what, a single half-paragraph of text and a single character in a larger splash in the entire Advanced Rules book. What are the chances that they're just being discontinued altogether?