afroakuma's Planar And Other Oddities Questions Thread VII

[Khedrac]

Any resources fleshing those planes out? I'm willing and able to dive, just need some pointing in the right directions.

2nd Ed AD&D Manual of the Planes is a good starting point.

[Tzardok]

Are there any records on exemplar lords changing alignment? A Fallen member of the Hebdomad or a Codified Slaad Lord, for example?

Edit: Let's do this thing again: The Greater Powers of the Hindu pantheon are Brahma, Vishnu and Shiva, right? Are there any others? What alignments, domains and favored weapons would they have in 3.5?

[afroakuma]

Are Archons able to reproduce sexually?

Not with one another, no. With mortals, half-celestial results.

Do they fall in love with each other or marry?

Love, I expect so. Marriage, I would think not; an archon's duties to the broader society are too great a commitment. Who knows, though. Some of them might. I have no stake in the matter.

Do Eladrin have marriage or do they have more of a free love society?

There aren't exactly a ton of canon eladrin relationships to draw from. Their leadership are in a pretty committed menage a trois, so make of that what you will.

Did you ever think about which of the celestial races the First Fallen was a member of?

Nope.

Do you think the answer to this question is relevant?

Also no.

(Are there pirate Arrrchons? )

Sure, why not.

The Silver Sea Armada, colloquially known as Barachiel's Buccaneers, Lunia's Landless, or Paradise's Privateers, patrol a vast labyrinth of islands and shoals around Lunia which have been the site of Lower Planar incursion in ages past. Their shining vessels cut through the tranquil twilight of the layer, always hovering near the fiery dusklike skies caused by rifts to Baator, Carceri, and the Abyss. Beneath the waves, giant celestial mollusks filter the toxic waters of the Styx, producing the wondrous pearls of rueful remembering, weapons used against the marine forces of evil that attempt to invade the heavenly plane. They are constantly challenged by the fleet of Laginus, a cornugon admiral of the Infernal Second Command; the Stygian Infiltrators under the ultroloth Variolux; and the horrific flotillas of the tanar'ri, dispatched by Demogorgon, Dagon, Zuregurex, and others.

The Armada is chiefly staffed by hound archons and its admiral is the trumpet archon Oniyael, who coordinates efforts with the goddess Trishina, the zoveri militia, and other locals. Due to the great distance separating the rifts from the shore, the landbound residents of Lunia rarely need concern themselves with the distant vessels on the horizon, guarding ever against the dusk that never dies.

Edit: I'm thinking about making better stats for Queen Morwel than those in The Lazy Book, but I feel that I don't know enough about her. Could you give me all information about her that you think are necessary for that endeavor?

I mean there's basically nothing to give. She's a super-tulani. That's what you get. She was created on a TCG card. She is a publication afterthought. She's rumored to be sleeping with Ben-Hadar on the side, if that helps any.

Is Ehlonna the nature goddess a vegetation by any chance? If so does her followers follow her vegetation ways?

As a goddess she doesn't require sustenance, but given that her base of worshipers includes hunters and trappers, I don't think she advocates vegetarianism.

What is Cyronax's origin? Both in lore and published history.

In published history, he was first published with the rest of the Princes of Elemental Evil back in the 1st Edition Fiend Folio. Lorewise, he's a very ancient being who claims to be a scion of the Elder Elemental Eye (though this is likely untrue and something he's saying because all the "real" Princes of Elemental Evil are rumored to be children of the Elder Elemental Eye).

Any resources fleshing those planes out? I'm willing and able to dive, just need some pointing in the right directions.

Best single resource would be the 2E Planescape book The Inner Planes. The Planescape Monstrous Compendium Appendix III included a token few monsters for each, but we're talking a very tiny number.

Are there any records on exemplar lords changing alignment? A Fallen member of the Hebdomad or a Codified Slaad Lord, for example?

None spring to mind.

Edit: Let's do this thing again

Must we?

The Greater Powers of the Hindu pantheon are Brahma, Vishnu and Shiva, right? Are there any others? What alignments, domains and favored weapons would they have in 3.5?

Still just asking me to make things up wholecloth, I see.

Brahma is not identified separately from Brahman in the Vedic pantheon, which is to say he's functionally not a distinctive deity as opposed to a functional overdeity for said pantheon. As for the other two, and under protest:

Vishnu is lawful good; his realm, the Divine Lotus, is on Mount Celestia. His favored weapon is the mace. Vishnu's domains are Brahman, Glory^BoED, Good, Knowledge, Law, Protection, Renewal^FRCS, and Sky^RotW.

Shiva is nautral evil; his realm, the Vortex, is on the Negative Energy Plane. His favored weapon is the trident. Shiva's domains are Balance^SC, Brahman, Destruction, Entropy^FCI, Evil, Force^SC, and Retribution^SC.

Brahman Domain
Granted Power Once per day per cleric level, when you roll a natural 20, you may reduce the result by 5 to confer a one-time +2 insight bonus to another being within 60 feet. This bonus may be applied to any attack roll, saving throw, skill check, or ability check of their choice, but must be used within 24 hours or it expires without effect. A creature may not be granted more than one of these bonuses at a time. This ability is not an action.
1st - comprehend languages
2nd - divine insight^SC
3rd - attune form^SC
4th - restoration
5th - telepathic bond
6th - mass owl's wisdom
7th - mental pinnacle^XPH
8th - true creation^SC
9th - miracle

[Tzardok]

Sure, why not.

The Silver Sea Armada, colloquially known as Barachiel's Buccaneers, Lunia's Landless, or Paradise's Privateers, patrol a vast labyrinth of islands and shoals around Lunia which have been the site of Lower Planar incursion in ages past. Their shining vessels cut through the tranquil twilight of the layer, always hovering near the fiery dusklike skies caused by rifts to Baator, Carceri, and the Abyss. Beneath the waves, giant celestial mollusks filter the toxic waters of the Styx, producing the wondrous pearls of rueful remembering, weapons used against the marine forces of evil that attempt to invade the heavenly plane. They are constantly challenged by the fleet of Laginus, a cornugon admiral of the Infernal Second Command; the Stygian Infiltrators under the ultroloth Variolux; and the horrific flotillas of the tanar'ri, dispatched by Demogorgon, Dagon, Zuregurex, and others.

The Armada is chiefly staffed by hound archons and its admiral is the trumpet archon Oniyael, who coordinates efforts with the goddess Trishina, the zoveri militia, and other locals. Due to the great distance separating the rifts from the shore, the landbound residents of Lunia rarely need concern themselves with the distant vessels on the horizon, guarding ever against the dusk that never dies.

I wasn't expecting that. They are awesome!

I mean there's basically nothing to give. She's a super-tulani. That's what you get. She was created on a TCG card. She is a publication afterthought. She's rumored to be sleeping with Ben-Hadar on the side, if that helps any.

What does she sea in him?

Still just asking me to make things up wholecloth, I see.

I broke my promise; I'm sorry! Can you forgive me?

Brahma is not identified separately from Brahman in the Vedic pantheon, which is to say he's functionally not a distinctive deity as opposed to a functional overdeity for said pantheon. As for the other two, and under protest:

Vishnu is lawful good; his realm, the Divine Lotus, is on Mount Celestia. His favored weapon is the mace. Vishnu's domains are Brahman, Glory^BoED, Good, Knowledge, Law, Protection, Renewal^FRCS, and Sky^RotW.

Shiva is neutral evil; his realm, the Vortex, is on the Negative Energy Plane. His favored weapon is the trident. Shiva's domains are Balance^SC, Brahman, Destruction, Entropy^FCI, Evil, Force^SC, and Retribution^SC.

When deciding the domains of a deity, are you going from memory, do you have a list somewhere or do you use a ressource by someone else? If it's the last option, could you direct me at it?

Brahman Domain
Granted Power Once per day per cleric level, when you roll a natural 20, you may reduce the result by 5 to confer a one-time +2 insight bonus to another being within 60 feet. This bonus may be applied to any attack roll, saving throw, skill check, or ability check of their choice, but must be used within 24 hours or it expires without effect. A creature may not be granted more than one of these bonuses at a time. This ability is not an action.
1st - comprehend languages
2nd - divine insight^SC
3rd - attune form^SC
4th - restoration
5th - telepathic bond
6th - mass owl's wisdom
7th - mental pinnacle^XPH
8th - true creation^SC
9th - miracle

Looks good. Is this domain available to all deities of the Hindu pantheon, only to those two or something in between?

[afroakuma]

When deciding the domains of a deity, are you going from memory

Memory, though a cursory search provides this.

Looks good. Is this domain available to all deities of the Hindu pantheon, only to those two or something in between?

I would use it for all deities of the Vedic pantheon.

[Fooliscious]

In some of the more recent Forgotten Realms books Lloth tricked some wizards into summoning several abyssal lords (Demogorgon, Grazzt, and Malcanthet were the big ones I believe) to the Underdark so she could get them out of their layers. What benefit would this have exactly? Can she just swoop in and suck their domains into the demonweb pits?


Would the combined magical might of Menzoberranzan be enough to murder Demogorgon as it happened?

[Tzardok]

I decided to give a bit back to this thread and made short descriptions for the other Vedic deities mentioned in "On Hallowed Ground". I made a few changes to the portfolios and elevated a few powers to the Rank Greater:

Agni (CG Intermediate Power of Fire, Communication and Messages and Omens) has the duty of faciliating communication between the other gods and their worshippers. He ferries sacrifices to the gods and omens to the mortals. His favoured weapon is the scimitar, and he grants the Brahman, Chaos, Community^SC, Fire, Good, Oracle^SC and Renewal^SC domains.

Indra (CE Greater Power of Storms, Battle and Might) is one of the foremost leaders and defenders of the pantheon. His favoured weapon is the light mace, and he grants the Brahman, Chaos, Evil, Protection, Storm^SC, Strength and War domains.

Vayu (CN Lesser Power of Wind, Life and Destruction) is the incarnation of the air that every being needs to life, but also leads to devastating storms. His favoured weapon is the club, and he grants the Air, Brahman, Cellerity^SC, Chaos, Destruction and Renewal^SC domains.

Together those three gods are known as the Three Gods of Chaos. They share a divine realm in Limbo called "Swarga".

Brihaspati (LG Intermediate Power of Wisdom and Worship) is a deity of knowledge and meditation who reminds the mortals of their duty to worship their gods, for without worship the gods would wither and die, and without the gods the mortals would be helpless and unprotected. He has a divine realm on Lunia named "Nectar of Life". His favoured weapon is the quarterstaff, and his domains are Brahman, Good, Herald^BoED, Knowledge, Law and Meditation^CSEb.

Kali (CE Intermediate Power of Life, Death and the Circle of both), Shiva's wife, is a dualistic being of contradictions: protector and murderer, cruel and kind, the mother who devours her children. She rules the 643th layer of the Abyss, the Cavern of Skulls. Her favoured weapon is the trident, and her granted domains are Brahman, Chaos, Death, Destruction, Evil, Fury^{FC 1} and Life^CSEb.

Kartikeya (CG Demipower of War and Warriors) guides those who fight. He is a contemplative deity who teaches that a warrior should also be a philosopher. His realm "The Fortunes of War" is located on Ysgard's first layer. His favoured weapon is the spear, and he grants the Brahman, Chaos, Courage^SC, Good and War domains.

Lakshmi (CG Lesser Power of Fortune, Wealth and Beauty) teaches that good things come to those who do good. She lives with her husband Vishnu in his realm "The Divine Lotus" on Mercuria. Her favoured weapon are the darts, which her clerics fashion in the shape of lotus flowers, and her domains are Brahman, Chaos, Charm^SC, Good, Luck and Wealth^SC.

Mitra (LG Intermediate Power of Friendships, Contracts, Light, Warmth and Growth) is the god who binds people together, the protector of oaths and honor. He is a bringer of light and good into the world. His favoured weapon is the longsword, and he grants the domains of Brahman, Community^SC, Good, Glory^SC, Healing, Law, Pact^SC and Sun.

Surya (LG Greater Power of the Sun, the Day, Morning and Evening) is the most powerful of all the different deities in this pantheon that are associated with light and the sun. He ensures that the sun rises and sets when it is supposed to and through that keeps the motion of the world in order. His favoured weapon is the quarterstaff, and he grants the Brahman, Good, Glory^SC, Healing, Law, Meditation^CSEb, Sun and Time^SC domains.

Surya and Mitra share a divine on realm on Mercuria, named "Goldfire"

Puchan (NG Intermediate Power of Travel and Relationships) is a protector of travelers, a psychopomps and a god of marriage. His divine realm on Brux, "Restweal", is a haven for weary travellers. His favoured weapon is the lance, and he grants the Brahman, Family^SC, Good, Protection, Trade^SC and Travel domains.

Ratri (CN Lesser Power of Darkness and the Night) is a capricious goddess who doesn't care what you do under her protection as long as you show her thankfulness and respect. She is even more of an hermit than the rest of her pantheon, and her divine realm "The Dark of the Night" is hidden somewhere in Niflheim. Her favoured weapon is the chakram, and her domains are Brahman, Chaos, Illusion^SC, Night^{Dragon 342} and Trickery.

Rudra (NE Intermediate Power of Storms, Animals, Disease and Retribution) is a merciless god associated with the hurricane's roar and the wild beasts in the world. He is the last of a group of spirits called Rudras, which he devoured, and he is the one who punishes the sinners and hunts gods who neglect their duties. His divine realm is called "The Focus of Energy" and is situated in Mechanus. His favoured weapon is the longbow and his domains are Animals, Brahman, Evil, Pestilence^SC, Retribution^SC, Windstorm^SC and Wrath^SC.

Savitri (NG Intermediate Power of Light and Life) is another life giving and light bringing god. He is the Awakener, the Invirogator, who grants the drive to live, to do, to act. His realm is called "Domain of the Day-Long Sun" and lies in Amoria. His favoured weapon is the shortbow and he grants the Brahman, Good, Healing, Joy^BoED, Life^CSEb and Sun domains.

Soma (CG Intermediate Power of the Moon, Plants, Intoxication and Prophecies) is a moon god who is associated with a special drink, brewed from mysterious plants, that grants visions to those who drink it. He shares a realm with the Faerûnian moon goddess Selûne, "The Gates of the Moon", on Ysgard. His favoured weapon is the club, and he grants the domains of Brahman, Chaos, Good, Moon^SC, Oracle^SC, Passion^CSEb and Plants.

Tvashtri (CG Demipower of Invention and Creation) is not only associated with creating machinery and art, he is also invoked when trying to conceive. His rulership over invention doesn't seem to involve name-giving, as his realm in the Outlands has a very uninventive name: "Tvashtri's Laboratory" . His preferred weapon is the battleaxe, and his domains are Brahman, Chaos, Craft^SC, Creation^SC and Good .

Ushas (LG Intermediate Power of Dawn, Light and Beginnings) is Ratri's sister and the most powerful (or at least, most beloved) female deity in the pantheon. Ushas is a servant of Edit: Surya (Accidentally wrote Agni) and is generally associated with Beginnings, Awakenings and so on, putting her and Savitri generally into the same niche. She has a divine realm named "Morningglory" on Eronia. Her favoured weapon is the weaponless strike, and her domains are Brahman, Good, Hope^{Dragon 340}, Law, Renewal^SC and Sun.

Varuna (LN Greater Power of Cosmic Order, the Sky and the Sea) watches over the structure of the cosmos and it's continued working. The whole sky is his eye to watch the mortals and record who regrets their sins and who doesn't. Logically, his realm in Mechanus is named "The Vigilant Eye". His favoured weapon is the lasso, and his domains are Balance^SC, Brahman, Destiny^RoD, Law, Purification^SC, Sky^RotW and Water.

Yama (LN Intermediate Power of Death and Judgement over the Dead) is believed to be the first human who ever died. Through that he was given the role of guiding and judging the souls of the dead. His divine realm is situated in Mechanus and named "Yamasedana". His favoured weapon is the lasso, and his domains are Balance^SC, Brahman, Death, Law, Protection and Repose^PGtF.

SC: Spell Compendium
CSEb: Campaign Setting Eberron
FC 1: Fiendish Codex 1
BoED: Book of Exalted Deeds
RotW: Races of the Wild
RoD: Races of Destiny
PGtF: Player's Guide to Faerûn

Well. What does everybody think? Any grave mistakes I made?

[Hellpyre]

I decided to give a bit back to this thread and made short descriptions for the other Vedic deities mentioned in "On Hallowed Ground". I made a few changes to the portfolios and elevated a few powers to the Rank Greater:

Agni (CG Intermediate Power of Fire, Communication and Messages and Omens) has the duty of faciliating communication between the other gods and their worshippers. He ferries sacrifices to the gods and omens to the mortals. His favoured weapon is the scimitar, and he grants the Brahman, Chaos, Community^SC, Fire, Good, Oracle^SC and Renewal^SC domains.

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I'm used to messenger deities having the Travel domain, but other than that liiks okay.

Indra (CE Greater Power of Storms, Battle and Might) is one of the foremost leaders and defenders of the pantheon. His favoured weapon is the light mace, and he grants the Brahman, Chaos, Evil, Storm^SC, Strength and War domains.

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Any deity that protects should really have the Protection domain

Vayu (CN Lesser Power of Wind, Life and Destruction) is the incarnation of the air that every being needs to life, but also leads to devastating storms. His favoured weapon is the club, and he grants the Air, Brahman, Celerity^SC, Chaos, Destruction and Renewal^SC domains.

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Looks good. I kind of hate that Renewal is a better domain to fit a deity of Life than the actual Life domain, but it really is.

Together those three gods are known as the Three Gods of Chaos. They share a divine realm in Limbo called "Swarga".

Brihaspati (LG Intermediate Power of Wisdom and Worship) is a deity of knowledge and meditation who reminds the mortals of their duty to worship their gods, for without worship the gods would wither and die, and without the gods the mortals would be helpless and unprotected. He has a divine realm on Lunia named "Nectar of Life". His favoured weapon is the quarterstaff, and his domains are Brahman, Good, Herald^BoED, Knowledge, Law and Meditation^CSEb.

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Why is his divine realm called "Nectar of Life"? It doesn't seem to play well into his portfolio

Kali (CE Intermediate Power of Life, Death and the Circle of both), Shiva's wife, is a dualistic being of contradictions: protector and murderer, cruel and kind, the mother who devours her children. She rules the 643th layer of the Abyss, the Cavern of Skulls. Her favoured weapon is the trident, and her granted domains are Brahman, Chaos, Death, Destruction, Evil, Fury^{FC 1} and Renewal^SC.

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This is where I'd say the Life domain makes more sense than Renewal. Kali would oppose something like undead that are disruptive to the cycle.

Kartikeya (CG Demipower of War and Warriors) guides those who fight. He is a contemplative deity who teaches that a warrior should also be a philosopher. His realm "The Fortunes of War" is located on Ysgard's first layer. His favoured weapon is the spear, and he grants the Brahman, Chaos, Courage^SC, Good and War domains.

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Seems fine, no real complaints here.

Lakshmi (CG Lesser Power of Fortune, Wealth and Beauty) teaches that good things come to those who do good. She lives with her husband Vishnu in his realm "The Divine Lotus" on Mercuria. Her favoured weapon are the darts, which her clerics fashion in the shape of lotus flowers, and her domains are Brahman, Chaos, Charm^SC, Good, Luck and Wealth^SC.

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I feel like Lakshmi really kind of deserves to at least be an Intermediate power

Mitra (LG Intermediate Power of Friendships, Contracts, Light, Warmth and Growth) is the god who binds people together, the protector of oaths and honor. He is a bringer of light and good into the world. His favoured weapon is the longsword, and he grants the domains of Brahman, Community^SC, Good, Glory^SC, Healing, Law, Pact^SC and Sun.

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This looks completely fine.

Surya (LG Greater Power of the Sun, the Day, Morning and Evening) is the most powerful of all the different deities in this pantheon that are associated with light and the sun. He ensures that the sun rises and sets when it is supposed to and through that keeps the motion of the world in order. His favoured weapon is the quarterstaff, and he grants the Brahman, Good, Glory^SC, Healing, Law, Meditation^CSEb, Sun and Time^SC domains.

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I personally prefer a mace or similar weapon for a sun god. Makes for a better visual impact to have at least a vague resemlence to the iconography.

Surya and Mitra share a divine on realm on Mercuria, named "Goldfire"

Puchan (NG Intermediate Power of Travel and Relationships) is a protector of travelers, a psychopomps and a god of marriage. His divine realm on Brux, "Restweal", is a haven for weary travellers. His favoured weapon is the lance, and he grants the Brahman, Family^SC, Good, Protection, Trade^SC and Travel domains.

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Puchan seems closer to a TN than a real NG, but that's always a hard line. I'd say drop the alignment and the domain.

Ratri (CN Lesser Power of Darkness and the Night) is a capricious goddess who doesn't care what you do under her protection as long as you show her thankfulness and respect. She is even more of an hermit than the rest of her pantheon, and her divine realm "The Dark of the Night" is hidden somewhere in Niflheim. Her favoured weapon is the chakram, and her domains are Brahman, Chaos, Illusion^SC, Night^{Dragon 342} and Trickery.

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While Ratri isn't a moon goddess per se, she is traditionally associated with it. I'd probably tack on the Moon domain

Rudra (NE Intermediate Power of Storms, Animals, Disease and Retribution) is a merciless god associated with the hurricane's roar and the wild beasts in the world. He is the last of a group of spirits called Rudras, which he devoured, and he is the one who punishes the sinners and hunts gods who neglect their duties. His divine realm is called "The Focus of Energy" and is situated in Mechanus. His favoured weapon is the longbow and his domains are Animals, Brahman, Evil, Pestilence^SC, Retribution^SC, Windstorm^SC and Wrath^SC.

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Why in the name of all that is holy is a non-lawful God living in Mechanus?

Savitri (NG Intermediate Power of Light and Life) is another life giving and light bringing god. He is the Awakener, the Invirogator, who grants the drive to live, to do, to act. His realm is called "Domain of the Day-Long Sun" and lies in Amoria. His favoured weapon is the shortbow and he grants the Brahman, Good, Healing, Joy^BoED, Life^CSEb and Sun domains.

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You have a lot of gods with the Sun domain in this pantheon, huh?

Soma (CG Intermediate Power of the Moon, Plants, Intoxication and Prophecies) is a moon god who is associated with a special drink, brewed from mysterious plants, that grants visions to those who drink it. He shares a realm with the Faerûnian moon goddess Selûne, "The Gates of the Moon", on Ysgard. His favoured weapon is the club, and he grants the domains of Brahman, Chaos, Good, Moon^SC, Oracle^SC, Passion^CSEb and Plants.

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Where does good enter into his alightment from?

Tvashtri (CG Demipower of Invention and Creation) is not only associated with creating machinery and art, he is also invoked when traying to conceive. His rulership over invention doesn't seem to involve name-giving, as his realm in the Outlands has a very uninventive name: "Tvashtri's Laboratory" . His preferred weapon is the battleaxe, and his domains are Brahman, Chaos, Craft^SC, Creation^SC and Good.

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I feel like a lot of these deities are getting Good alignments when they don't have an aligned agenda.

Ushas (LG Intermediate Power of Dawn, Light and Beginnings) is Ratri's sister and the most powerful (or at least, most beloved) female deity in the pantheon. Ushas is a servant of Agni and is generally associated with Beginnings, Awakenings and so on, putting her and Savitri geerally into the same niche. She has a divine realm named "Morningglory" on Eronia. Her favoured weapon is the weaponless strike, and her domains are Brahman, Good, Hope^{Dragon 340}, Law, Renewal^SC and Sun.

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Generally looks fine to me.

Varuna (LN Greater Power of Cosmic Order, the Sky and the Sea) watches over the structure of the cosmos and it's continued working. The whole sky is his eye to watch the mortals and record who regrets their sins and who doesn't. Logically, his realm in Mechanus is named "The Vigilant Eye". His favoured weapon is the lasso, and his domains are Balance^SC, Brahman, Destiny^RoD, Law, Purification^SC, Sky^RotW and Water.

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Again, looks more or less reasonable to me.

Yama (LN Intermediate Power of Death and Judgement over the Dead) is believed to be the first human who ever died. Through that he was given the role of guiding and judging the souls of the dead. His divine realm is situated in Mechanus and named "Yamasedana". His favoured weapon is the lasso, and his domains are Balance^SC, Brahman, Death, Law, Protection and Repose^PGtF.

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I'm not sure, but I recall Yama being associated pretty strongly with time.

SC: Spell Compendium
CSEb: Campaign Setting Eberron
FC 1: Fiendish Codex 1
BoED: Book of Exalted Deeds
RotW: Races of the Wild
RoD: Races of Destiny
PGtF: Player's Guide to Faerûn

Well. What does everybody think? Any grave mistakes I made?

I'll finish later :P

Edit: I finished. May have glossed over some because I am tired.

[Caelestion]

As for Rudra, no one tells a god where he may or may nor place his domain. Besides, his listed duties are very lawful, even if he himself is not.

[Tzardok]

Exactly. Besides that, The Focus of Energy used to be the realm of the Rudras, who each had different duties and alignments. Rudra simply kept it when he remained as the only one. As for Nectar of Life: I have no idea. I didn't invent any of the realm names or locations. I just took them from On Hallowed Ground. Regarding Kali... I'll think about changes tomorrow. It's 01:33 am here.

[gkathellar]

As for Rudra, no one tells a god where he may or may nor place his domain. Besides, his listed duties are very lawful, even if he himself is not.

The canonical example of this is, of course, Gruumsh, a CE god whose realm is on Acheron - because that's where the war is.

[LordofBones]

Shiva's never really struck me as being evil in the myths. His more extreme actions (killing Kamadeva, killing Daksha) were things he was provoked into doing. Likewise, the mythological Indra was more on the neutral scale of things, and as king of the heavens he should have Nobility as one of his domains, in addition to Air and Water domains (in myth, Indra was responsible for freeing the waters of the world that had been sealed off by Vritra).

On the flipside, Ravana should probably be an Intermediate Power, if not Greater, considering his accomplishments. Priests of Shiva should generally be safe and even welcomed in rakshasa-ruled lands, considering the immense respect and veneration Ravana has for the elder deity.

Ganesha should also probably be on that list, lower than his parents Shiva and Parvati, but higher than his elder brother Kartikeya.

[Tzardok]

I'm used to messenger deities having the Travel domain, but other than that looks okay.

I feel that he is less of a messenger and more of a sender of messages. Does this make sense?

Any deity that protects should really have the Protection domain

Hmm... Well, why not. Changed.

Why is his divine realm called "Nectar of Life"? It doesn't seem to play well into his portfolio

On second thought, maybe because worship is exactly that for the gods?

This is where I'd say the Life domain makes more sense than Renewal. Kali would oppose something like undead that are disruptive to the cycle.

I don't know... Kali got beat really hard with the short end of the alignment stick. I have no idea wether she cares about undead. I'll hold off on changes until I hear from Afro.

I feel like Lakshmi really kind of deserves to at least be an Intermediate power

But this pantheon already has so many of them!

I personally prefer a mace or similar weapon for a sun god. Makes for a better visual impact to have at least a vague resemlence to the iconography.

Surya's iconography usually depicts him with a wand or staff. Quarterstaff was the best fit.

While Ratri isn't a moon goddess per se, she is traditionally associated with it. I'd probably tack on the Moon domain

We already have half a dozen sun gods; I won't add a second moon god with Ratri's description On Hallowed Ground making no mention of that.

You have a lot of gods with the Sun domain in this pantheon, huh?

I'm really glad Planescape didn't add more. Really, this pantheon has more sun gods than the Egyptians, and that's saying something. If I had to drop one, I think I would drop Savitri; he doesn't bring anything unique to the table.

I feel like a lot of these deities are getting Good alignments when they don't have an aligned agenda.

Does a deity need to have an agenda that fits their alignment? I'm not so sure about that.

I'm not sure, but I recall Yama being associated pretty strongly with time.

Didn't read anything like that anywhere. Here, Surya is the Time God.

Shiva's never really struck me as being evil in the myths. His more extreme actions (killing Kamadeva, killing Daksha) were things he was provoked into doing. Likewise, the mythological Indra was more on the neutral scale of things, and as king of the heavens he should have Nobility as one of his domains, in addition to Air and Water domains (in myth, Indra was responsible for freeing the waters of the world that had been sealed off by Vritra).

Shiva and Indra got the short end of the alignment stick, like Hades and Hekate did in the Olympian pantheon. D&D needs evil gods and some just get shoe-horned in. But for Indra there's at least precedent, as his more noble qualities were removed over time.

On the flipside, Ravana should probably be an Intermediate Power, if not Greater, considering his accomplishments. Priests of Shiva should generally be safe and even welcomed in rakshasa-ruled lands, considering the immense respect and veneration Ravana has for the elder deity.

Ganesha should also probably be on that list, lower than his parents Shiva and Parvati, but higher than his elder brother Kartikeya.

Sorry. I worked with On Hallowed Ground which has, if I'm informed correctly, the most complete description of the Vedic pantheon in D&D, so Ganesha and Parvati were most likely never added. Ravana is in D&D a Lesser Deity and not a part of the pantheon (except maybe as an outcast), as he is the evil king of the rakshasa and nothing more. Simply a monstrous deity.

This question came up during the feedback round: What's Kali's opinion on undead? Does she like them? Despises them? Apathetic?

[Caelestion]

The canonical example of this is, of course, Gruumsh, a CE god whose realm is on Acheron - because that's where the war is.

Devil's advocate requires me to point that in 2nd Edition, Gruumsh was indeed Lawful Evil, as were all goblinoids.

[Bartmanhomer]

Devil's advocate requires me to point that in 2nd Edition, Gruumsh was indeed Lawful Evil, as were all goblinoids.

Gruumsh must have changed his lawful viewpoint to a chaotic viewpoint.

[Hellpyre]

The canonical example of this is, of course, Gruumsh, a CE god whose realm is on Acheron - because that's where the war is.

Aside from Gruumsh being Lawful at one point, the thing I was really driving towards was that Mechanus is the exemplar of Law as a force. It's like having Fharlanghn show up living in the Seven Mounting Heavens of Celestia - it seems off to me to not share at least a alignment component with a strongly aligned plane a deity resides in.

[Caelestion]

In theory, Rudra's domain would eventually end up on a plane better suited to his alignment, but the planes aren't always that convenient. Witness Ilsensine's domain on the Outlands, for instance.

[Tzardok]

Aside from Gruumsh being Lawful at one point, the thing I was really driving towards was that Mechanus is the exemplar of Law as a force. It's like having Fharlanghn show up living in the Seven Mounting Heavens of Celestia - it seems off to me to not share at least a alignment component with a strongly aligned plane a deity resides in.

Also, why exactly do you care so much about NE Rudra being in LN Mechanus, but completely ignore CN Ratri living in NE Hades?

[Hellpyre]

Also, why exactly do you care so much about NE Rudra being in LN Mechanus, but completely ignore CN Ratri living in NE Hades?

Honestly? I didn't notice it. I was sort of nodding off while I looked through the second half :P

[Bartmanhomer]

Also does Gruumsh have a wife by any chance?

[afroakuma]

In some of the more recent Forgotten Realms books Lloth tricked some wizards into summoning several abyssal lords (Demogorgon, Grazzt, and Malcanthet were the big ones I believe) to the Underdark so she could get them out of their layers. What benefit would this have exactly?

Great way to make a bunch of enemies and Marie Kondo your way out of a surplus of drow...

Can she just swoop in and suck their domains into the demonweb pits?

Pfft, absolutely not.

Would the combined magical might of Menzoberranzan be enough to murder Demogorgon as it happened?

That's not really a useful or well-defined metric. Assuming they're not reading Internet message boards to max out their "wizards r hax" potential, I would assume no.

I have created a stir about real world religion in your thread, Fro

Thank you thank you so much.

This question came up during the feedback round: What's Kali's opinion on undead? Does she like them? Despises them? Apathetic?

Given that life is one of her key attributes, I can't imagine she's a great fan.

Devil's advocate requires me to point that in 2nd Edition, Gruumsh was indeed Lawful Evil, as were all goblinoids.

Indeed, but as of 3rd, orcs aren't even goblinoids.

Also does Gruumsh have a wife by any chance?

Well, mate moreso than wife, but yes. Luthic is his mate.

[Tzardok]

I'll finish later :P

Edit: I finished. May have glossed over some because I am tired.

I took your advice on Kali and replaced her domain.

Thank you thank you so much.

I'm gonna shut up now.

[afroakuma]

I'm gonna shut up now.

Just... remember that that's one of the fastest ways to destroy a thread. My priority is to keep this unlocked for questions. It's important if you're gonna do something like that to provide crucial context saying that the decisions people will question were made by someone else, in print, decades ago. To point out that Shiva, despite his official alignment being neutral evil, is a well-liked and respected deity within the Vedic pantheon who plays what they consider a vital role in the universe. Now can we give it a rest on the "filling out the reclusive powers" thing for a bit?

[Tzardok]

Just... remember that that's one of the fastest ways to destroy a thread. My priority is to keep this unlocked for questions. It's important if you're gonna do something like that to provide crucial context saying that the decisions people will question were made by someone else, in print, decades ago. To point out that Shiva, despite his official alignment being neutral evil, is a well-liked and respected deity within the Vedic pantheon who plays what they consider a vital role in the universe. Now can we give it a rest on the "filling out the reclusive powers" thing for a bit?

Not a single word on non-fictional deities from me. The next time I come up with something like that, I'll show it to the mods before posting and I'll put it into it's own thread.

[afroakuma]

Not a single word on non-fictional deities from me. The next time I come up with something like that, I'll show it to the mods before posting and I'll put it into it's own thread.

I would recommend against doing that. Just, again, you didn't warn me you were going to do that - I really should have guessed what you were up to but that's on me - and you didn't provide the necessary context to stop people debating real vs. fictional aspects, and you asked people to critique it which basically guaranteed that would happen.

If it's gonna happen at some point it's better it happens through me. It sounds like you're still gearing up so why don't you just get it all out of your system now and then we can just move past it.

[Gauntlet]

A few Eberron related questions:

- Are there any other instances of effects similar to the Moon Breaker? "Mortal" magic changing the position / alignment of the planes?

- The gods of Eberron don't really show up on the material plane at all in the setting. Do they still have their own extraplanar realms in the same way as the standard ones, or are they more like just metaphysical concepts?

[Alea]

- The gods of Eberron don't really show up on the material plane at all in the setting. Do they still have their own extraplanar realms in the same way as the standard ones, or are they more like just metaphysical concepts?

Eberron goes out of its way to avoid answering this question. Canonically the answer is unknown, and that’s very intentional.

The assumption is that the overdeity responsible for Eberron set up the rules, and like Ao’s but taken to an extreme, those rules are quite limiting on divine intervention, which is why we see such limited interaction from them. Or those rules are simply “no deities allowed,” and the beliefs of Eberron’s mortals are wholly made up. Or deities are allowed under such restrictive rules, and so no deities have bothered with the world—and the beliefs are still wholly made up. Or partially made up; maybe some deities are real and others are not. And of course, there isn’t any solid evidence of an overdeity in the first place—we assume it has one because worlds are supposed to, but it’s conceivable that in this, too, Eberron is the odd one out and the limitations—or ban—on deities is the result of some cosmic quirk rather than the actions of any overdeity. No one knows, and that’s how it should be, for Eberron.

If you want more than that, you’ll have to ask your DM—and you can’t expect the answer to extend beyond that particular campaign.

[Fable Wright]

- Are there any other instances of effects similar to the Moon Breaker? "Mortal" magic changing the position / alignment of the planes?

I think Vecna might be the closest thing, as removing him from Sigil required actual planar changes, which did such things as force the Demiplane of Shadow to spill from the Ethereal and BECOME the Plane of Shadow. The Outer and Inner planes can't be moved, and this is the only instance of transitory planes being moved that I can think of.

Unless you mean Gate Towns or planar layers sliding, which could be nudged on with magic.

[Tzardok]

I would recommend against doing that. Just, again, you didn't warn me you were going to do that - I really should have guessed what you were up to but that's on me - and you didn't provide the necessary context to stop people debating real vs. fictional aspects, and you asked people to critique it which basically guaranteed that would happen.

If it's gonna happen at some point it's better it happens through me. It sounds like you're still gearing up so why don't you just get it all out of your system now and then we can just move past it.

Oh for... that wasn't my intention at all and I'm sorry if it sounded that way. I already used up all my creative drive for a while. I just dislike dealing in absolutes, so I put in an "should I have another surge of motivation..." disclaimer.
Also, you couldn't have known I would do something like that so don't you dare blame yourself. This is the first time I did this and you couldn't have forseen it. I felt guilty for anoying you into making up stats for me and this guilt converted into the drive to somehow make up for it. And this somehow was statting the rest of the pantheon to show that I learned something and so you wouldn't suspect me of badgering you into making the rest. Does this sound in any way understandable? I think I'm rambling...
Anyway, a last thing I want to say: I deeply respect you, your knowledge and your work. I do not intent to annoy or anger you. So when that happens I feel sorry, and that leads to ill-thought-out things.
So. Shutting up now.

[afroakuma]

Oh for... that wasn't my intention at all and I'm sorry if it sounded that way. I already used up all my creative drive for a while. I just dislike dealing in absolutes, so I put in an "should I have another surge of motivation..." disclaimer.

No no I meant your remaining questions. Obviously you have some, you've come back to this well a lot.