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  1. - Top - End - #1
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    Scots Dragon's Avatar

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    Default Do you like the Forgotten Realms? If so why?

    As a wee thought experiment spin off from this thread, I figure it's worth asking the obvious question of why its fans like the Forgotten Realms as opposed to why certain people hate it. For me it's a combination of things that draw me to the Forgotten Realms, from its complexity in detail to many of its stories to the video games that got me into Advanced Dungeons & Dragons to begin with, but I'm pretty curious as to the opinions of the other denizens of the playground on this.

    Naturally if you've got a negative opinion on the Forgotten Realms feel free to use the thread linked above, rather than using this one.

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    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    BardGuy

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    Default Re: Do you like the Forgotten Realms? If so why?

    Back in 2e, I liked it because of the wealth of Specialty Priests made available. It was convenient to drag in a pre-assembled fantasy pantheon off the rack regardless of whether or not you were actually playing IN the FR. Plus, Specialty Priests added some flavour to differentiate Joe Cleric from Fred Cleric.

    Drizzt was neat... when I was a kid. I found The Crystal Shard in a pharmacy bargain box in my hometown when I was a wee lad and thusly started my adventures with Drizz 'n' the Boys... and the inevitable string of not-evil (and several evil) Drow PC's.

    The Dalelands are neat.

    As is the Savage Coast.

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    Troll in the Playground
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    Default Re: Do you like the Forgotten Realms? If so why?

    The strength of the Forgotten Realms is its extremely high level of detail. The history, the geography, the religions, everything is exhaustively detailed, sometimes down to the level of individual city blocks. There is really no other setting like this (though with the amount of work Paizo continues to throw at it Golarion is getting closer every day) in terms of just how much sheer information is available to be utilized and how many intricate interactions can be operated on for adventuring purposes. So, if having a great deal of detailed information to work with appeals to you, then the Forgotten Realms has lots of advantages.
    Now publishing a webnovel travelogue.

    Resvier: a P6 homebrew setting

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    Pixie in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: Do you like the Forgotten Realms? If so why?

    I'm indifferent to the setting, but it has a huge advantage - you can point to anywhere on the map and get adventure hooks, monsters, villains, everything you need to get started with a campaign. This is a great thing to have as a DM.

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    Default Re: Do you like the Forgotten Realms? If so why?

    It doesn't excite me to play in that gameworld if that's what the game is going to be, but it's not revolting either. As long as the focus in on the PCs, and it's a fun campaign as any other fun campaign for all reasons that makes a campaign fun the specific gameworld is irrelevant. Of course the fun is personal subjective. People can have great fun playing in Dark Sun Athas. I would not and never play such a game.

    Still, I do have a long personal history of fondness for Torm and Ilmater for their philosophies and an ironic for me since I don't like rogues in general a healthy respect for Mask due to DMs portraying the faith as sympathetic anti-heroes just right. The Church of Mask was never an enemy of the party in any game.
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    Default Re: Do you like the Forgotten Realms? If so why?

    I have fond memories of the Baldur's Gate series of games.

    As a single-player video game setting, the highly-detailed yet largely-irrelevant lore was perfect: you could indulge in it if you wanted, but it never interfered with the (very simple) plot of the game.

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    Pixie in the Playground
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    Default Re: Do you like the Forgotten Realms? If so why?

    i like it because it's easy to build adventures in it. villains, characters, cities, lore, history, etc. are already set up all i have to make a campaign and a set of adventures that makes sense to it.

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    Ettin in the Playground
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    Default Re: Do you like the Forgotten Realms? If so why?

    No; I already laid out my reasons in the thread in the 5e forum.

    To be more specific, though, I like the barebones setting of the original box set, which was nice and low-detail, with plenty of room for the DM to play and adventurers to roam.

    Heck; certain areas were specifically left blank with a promise they wouldn't be detailed.
    Quote Originally Posted by Grey Box
    A Note on Future Products: Certain areas of each of the enlarged maps of the Forgotten Realms will contain areas that will not have future adventures, modules, or
    sourcebooks set in them, and are left solely for use by the DM for development without fear of some later product invalidating that portion of his campaign. In the initial boxed set, those areas are:

    The Serpent Hills (east of the High Moor)
    The Wood of Sharp Teeth
    The Desertedge Mountains (outside the Dales), and
    The Nation of Sembia.

    The last mentioned, the nation of Sembia, is a large section of (partially) civilized land with the following borders: starting with the west, the Vast Swamp, the Daerlun, the path through Kulta, Saerb, and Archenbridge (including parts of Archendalel to Ordulin, east to the Dragon Reach, and bordered on the south by the Sea of Fallen Stars. This region, though discussed in the players' guide and in this book, will not have further adventures set in it, nor will its cities be explored or detailed. A DM with a campaign city or nation already designed may set that city in the area of Sembia without great difficulty caused by future products setting some epic adventures (or great disaster) in the same region.

    Further, the region across the Dragon Reach, from the River Vesper South and to the edge of Map 2 has been set aside for use by the RPGA network as a base for adventures and tournaments in the Forgotten Realms, and is left for the further explanation by those areas, or by the DM.
    This promise was, of course, quickly broken. But it shows that they started the setting out with (IMO) exactly the right idea - campaign settings need space.

    I think the post-spellplague realms is okay, but not particularly inspiring except for the Neverwinter campaign book. I can't easily picture setting a campaign there, but I wouldn't write off the possibility.

    Otherwise, I dislike the bloated, detailed-yet-still-generic mess that the setting grew into, where all mysteries were solved and all gaps filled in. I neither need nor want a setting with anywhere near that amount of lore/canon/etc. The only way I would consider running the Realms is with a hard reset to the original grey box, and a total negation of everything that came out after that. (None of the novels happened, none of the supplements or novels or adventures are canonical, etc.) And, like I mentioned in the 5e thread, I would run it with the full intention that the campaign would utterly wreck the place - like killing off major NPCs mentioned in the box set, blowing up major cities, and the odd 70's-style UFO/alien/robot/ray gun invasion at some point.
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    Bugbear in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: Do you like the Forgotten Realms? If so why?

    I like Forgotten Realms because it gives me a chance to kill Elminster repeatedly.

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    Default Re: Do you like the Forgotten Realms? If so why?

    The complexity and level of detail: it's not just a ''game world'', it's a ''storytelling world''. The amount of lore from just Ed Greenwood is insane, but then you have more from others that also love the Realms too. No other published world even comes close, and worse most modem ones take the ''Ebberon track'' of ''wow, look how awesome this is to for video game like combat adventures''.

    The Forgotten Realms is also artificial: there are powers that keep the world ''normal and stable'' right in the lore. This is a big plus as all other worlds go with the ''oh it's just like old time Europe, but with magic and things never change..wink, wink, don't think about it''.

    The Forgotten Realms is also a very powerfully made setting, in the lore and details and game mechanics(and this is even more tore, times ten, in 1\ or 2E).

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    Bugbear in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: Do you like the Forgotten Realms? If so why?

    Quote Originally Posted by Darth Ultron View Post
    The complexity and level of detail: it's not just a ''game world'', it's a ''storytelling world''. The amount of lore from just Ed Greenwood is insane, but then you have more from others that also love the Realms too. No other published world even comes close, and worse most modem ones take the ''Ebberon track'' of ''wow, look how awesome this is to for video game like combat adventures''.
    Indeed. The Forgotten Realms to me has always felt like more of a living setting because there's lore about the people living there and what their daily lives are like to a degree that most other settings just plain don't tend to have. The only other D&D setting to come close is Planescape's level of detail for Sigil.

  12. - Top - End - #12
    Ettin in the Playground
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    Default Re: Do you like the Forgotten Realms? If so why?

    Oh - since this is the nice thread, I will also say I like the Hordelands box set. Not the Horde metaplot from the 90's, just the box set, which added an interesting Central Asian area to the setting. Also, the relative lack of extra attention after its release is a pure positive, in my mind, because I much prefer pencil-sketch settings.

    I could more easily see myself running a Hordelands campaign than a regular FR campaign, honestly.
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    Barbarian in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: Do you like the Forgotten Realms? If so why?

    No. You did ask if we liked it. More that they have put all of their resources into this campaign world and ignored the more interesting worlds than any other reason. The world itself is fine for a very blah fantasy world, kind of like if you eat a cheeseburger for every meal, even if you liked cheeseburgers, it will get old after awhile.
    Last edited by Corsair14; 2017-06-22 at 08:03 AM.

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    Barbarian in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: Do you like the Forgotten Realms? If so why?

    Quote Originally Posted by Nifft View Post
    I have fond memories of the Baldur's Gate series of games.

    As a single-player video game setting, the highly-detailed yet largely-irrelevant lore was perfect: you could indulge in it if you wanted, but it never interfered with the (very simple) plot of the game.
    I find it ironic that one of the great things about Baldurs Gate at the time was the area was so undeveloped in the setting - sure, Waterdeep and Icewind Dale had plenty of information out there, but the stretch from Baldur's Gate to Calimshan was just a few bullet points and general themes - the focus at the time was very much the Dalelands, Cormyr, Zhentil keep and Ravens Bluff (for the RPGA). Now its completely flipped on its head, with everything being about the Sword Coast, and everything east of Anauroch being the forgotten backwater.

    As for things I like: one of the big benefits is that generally speaking, most D&D players (bar the complete novice, and even then computer gamers may have picked bits up) have at least a passing familiarity with the Realms and its organisations, it takes very little to get a player up to speed. Granted, I've never ran a full campaign in the Realms, but it is a great place to set one-offs and mini-campaigns where you don't want to waste valuable time explaining the set-up of the world (and I have used it as a starting point for a couple of campaigns that I then springboarded into Ravenloft).
    Last edited by Glorthindel; 2017-06-22 at 11:14 AM.

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    Default Re: Do you like the Forgotten Realms? If so why?

    I enjoy the Realms for the flavorful expressions it inspires:

    Oh by Lolth's bright blue panties!

    How in the holy name of Drizzt's giant codpiece will we...

    This exceeds Elminster's brothel tab!

    etc.

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    Bugbear in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: Do you like the Forgotten Realms? If so why?

    Quote Originally Posted by Glorthindel View Post
    I find it ironic that one of the great things about Baldurs Gate at the time was the area was so undeveloped in the setting - sure, Waterdeep and Icewind Dale had plenty of information out there, but the stretch from Baldur's Gate to Calimshan was just a few bullet points and general themes
    Except of course if you count Volo's Guide to the Sword Coast, which is where the BG geography and lore came from.
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    Default Re: Do you like the Forgotten Realms? If so why?

    Quote Originally Posted by Coffee_Dragon View Post
    Except of course if you count Volo's Guide to the Sword Coast, which is where the BG geography and lore came from.
    I feel it was a missed opportunity that they didn't throw Warlock's Crypt in there as a potential dungeon, technically fully detailed but literally impossible in difficulty, y'know, being Warlock's Crypt.

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    Default Re: Do you like the Forgotten Realms? If so why?

    Quote Originally Posted by Glorthindel View Post
    I find it ironic that one of the great things about Baldurs Gate at the time was the area was so undeveloped in the setting - sure, Waterdeep and Icewind Dale had plenty of information out there, but the stretch from Baldur's Gate to Calimshan was just a few bullet points and general themes - the focus at the time was very much the Dalelands, Cormyr, Zhentil keep and Ravens Bluff (for the RPGA). Now its completely flipped on its head, with everything being about the Sword Coast, and everything east of Anauroch being the forgotten backwater.
    IMHO it's somewhere between ironic and inevitable.

    "People like this! Let's make more of it! Let's stuff every corner of the setting to maximize the setting's book production!"

    ... when what they liked was the wide-open feel, which you just killed.

    Of course, you can get that wide-open feel back. You just need to throw a cataclysm or two at the setting, like 4e did.

    Those were some nice changes. Kill off the boring over-powered NPCs, and open up the map with some vast swaths of wild, unexplored ADVENTURE!

    Really, if we're being honest, that's what I like about any setting: the ability to have adventures in it.

    FR has done this, and it can surely be made to do it again.

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    Barbarian in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: Do you like the Forgotten Realms? If so why?

    While overall I'm not a fan of the setting, there are two things that do draw me to the setting enough to consider running in it.

    First is the large, detailed and diverse pantheon. More so than any other setting with which I have experience, the pantheon feels like something that might actually exist. Granted, a big part of that is the bloat, but still.

    The second is the red wizards. Thay itself is painfully cliche, and the prestige class is pretty meh. But the massive conspiracy by an evil cabal that is driven by good, if aggressive, buisness that has buisness itself as a goal us just so good. I particularly like the implied subtext that they make happily willing allies with good-aligned governments out of their own evil self-interest.

    It's a level of moral and political complexity I find simultaneously very realistic, very believable and very relevant in a way rarely found in DnD campaign settings.
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    Default Re: Do you like the Forgotten Realms? If so why?

    I do like it, but I recognize that a large part of that is familiarity and nostalgia.

    I've been playing, reading, and running the realms for 22 years, now. Computer games, a few novels, and, of course, RPGs. I know the pantheon pretty well. I know the geography, especially north and west of the Sea of Fallen Stars. I can, with only a little bit of work, start building plots that will feature a few different power players, incorporate major NPCs without them overshadowing the party, and otherwise use the Realms as my personal setting. I make a few changes to make it more comfortable (I tend to play without the Time of Troubles, but incorporating Kelemvor as a LN deity of the dead, relegating Myrkul to the god of the undead... still formidable, just not "evil deity who oversees basic aspect of life").

    What do I like about it? I like that there's ample good and evil... lots of wrenches could be working on any one nut, each twisting it their own way for their own reasons. If you dig a bit into Greenwood's conception of the Realms, he's done some thought into the different moral and social structures that might exist within the broad framework of D&D. Different regions support a lot of different playstyles and types of campaign, and there's a good balance between "enough detail" and "too much detail"... a fuzzy line to draw, to be sure.

    Most of its problems can be safely ignored without breaking the setting. It's flexible, large, and familiar.
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    Default Re: Do you like the Forgotten Realms? If so why?

    Quote Originally Posted by Mark Hall View Post
    I do like it, but I recognize that a large part of that is familiarity and nostalgia.

    I've been playing, reading, and running the realms for 22 years, now. Computer games, a few novels, and, of course, RPGs. I know the pantheon pretty well. I know the geography, especially north and west of the Sea of Fallen Stars. I can, with only a little bit of work, start building plots that will feature a few different power players, incorporate major NPCs without them overshadowing the party, and otherwise use the Realms as my personal setting. I make a few changes to make it more comfortable (I tend to play without the Time of Troubles, but incorporating Kelemvor as a LN deity of the dead, relegating Myrkul to the god of the undead... still formidable, just not "evil deity who oversees basic aspect of life").
    I've considered poaching the Raven Queen as a 'relatively minor regional interloper deity' for similar reasons since I'm not actually a huge fan of Kelemvor, and she's one of the few genuinely great aspects of D&D 4E's setting and lore.

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    Librarian in the Playground Moderator
     
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    Default Re: Do you like the Forgotten Realms? If so why?

    Quote Originally Posted by Narsil View Post
    I've considered poaching the Raven Queen as a 'relatively minor regional interloper deity' for similar reasons since I'm not actually a huge fan of Kelemvor, and she's one of the few genuinely great aspects of D&D 4E's setting and lore.
    Raven Queen would work, but I like keeping Kelemvor because he's already detailed... I can use Faiths and Avatars verbatim, or adapt it to whatever system I'm using.
    The Cranky Gamer
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    Default Re: Do you like the Forgotten Realms? If so why?

    Quote Originally Posted by Mark Hall View Post
    Raven Queen would work, but I like keeping Kelemvor because he's already detailed... I can use Faiths and Avatars verbatim, or adapt it to whatever system I'm using.
    True, and Faiths and Avatars really is one of the best books out there. I suppose you could just steal the entry for one of the death goddesses from Legends & Lore, though.

    In any case, I use her less as an outright replacement and more as an alternative option, possibly while poaching bits from Golarion's Pharasma for detail.
    Last edited by Scots Dragon; 2017-06-22 at 02:59 PM.

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    Bugbear in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: Do you like the Forgotten Realms? If so why?

    Quote Originally Posted by Mark Hall View Post
    lots of wrenches could be working on any one nut, each twisting it their own way for their own reasons.
    This also works if you drop a letter from "wrenches", know what I mean, nudge nudge.
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    Default Re: Do you like the Forgotten Realms? If so why?

    Quote Originally Posted by Coffee_Dragon View Post
    This also works if you drop a letter from "wrenches", know what I mean, nudge nudge.
    Stop posting, Greenwood.

    You're drunk again.

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    Default Re: Do you like the Forgotten Realms? If so why?

    I like the Forgotten Realms primarily because of its medieval stasis, classic fantasy feel, extensive and well-established pantheon, and ease of finding information on.

    That said, I don't run it, and rarely play in it.
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    Default Re: Do you like the Forgotten Realms? If so why?

    I loved just about everything about 1. ed.
    Fantastic boxed set. Great source books with good mix of flavor, background info, and rules.
    I actually didn't mind the copying of various Earth settings and time periods. It just made for more opportunities for people who wanted to play say an Egyptian or Greek inspired character.

    My group started going non-canon with our realms after the Time of Troubles (2. ed.), mostly because we think Cyric is a pathetic excuse for a god. We liked the Dark Three much better.
    In 3. ed. we ignored shadow magic. It just wasn't very interesting, and Shar is almost a worse antagonist than Cyric.
    4. ed. never happened at our table. We judged it a blatant attempt to import World of Warcraft mechanics into D&D, and the Sundering a feeble excuse for wiping the slate clean.
    We haven't gotten around to trying 5. ed. yet, but when we do, I'm pretty sure we will keep the timeline in the 1300's, when most of the setting still was originated in the mind of Ed Greenwood.
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    Ettin in the Playground
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    Default Re: Do you like the Forgotten Realms? If so why?

    Quote Originally Posted by Misereor View Post
    4. ed. never happened at our table. We judged it a blatant attempt to import World of Warcraft mechanics into D&D, and the Sundering a feeble excuse for wiping the slate clean.
    You know, I am continually fascinated how people just randomly drive-by edition war - especially when it's this far off-topic.
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    Default Re: Do you like the Forgotten Realms? If so why?

    Forgotten Realms became our favorite setting for our 2E campaign with the publication of Faith and Avatars, Demi-human Deities, and Powers and Pantheons. they breathed fresh life into a class that only I liked to play beforehand.

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    Default Re: Do you like the Forgotten Realms? If so why?

    Quote Originally Posted by obryn View Post
    You know, I am continually fascinated how people just randomly drive-by edition war - especially when it's this far off-topic.
    While the mechanics of 4th Edition aren't necessarily relevant, I would say that its treatment of the Forgotten Realms rather importantly is. The Spellplague drew a whole lot of criticism from fans of the Forgotten Realms.

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