Personal Woes and Advice 5

[WarKitty]

Why move clothing to the car? And what documents need to be in a safe deposit box? Only thing I have in ours is our will and the deed to our house. Everything else is pretty easily replaceable (frankly even both those can be replaced but the cost is higher). Otherwise the plan looks good. If you're worried about your parents' reaction consider maybe changing the order of things and line up the Apt first. For a phone also consider a pay as you go phone to start with, if you're looking at bare essentials. Generally cheaper than a plan though clearly far more limited.

The idea is if I have to leave in a hurry, I won't be immediately having to push to get more stuff. So basic identity documents would be in a safe deposit box, and I'd have enough clothing to be presentable at work. Mind, this isn't an ordered list either.

[ve4grm]

The idea is if I have to leave in a hurry, I won't be immediately having to push to get more stuff. So basic identity documents would be in a safe deposit box, and I'd have enough clothing to be presentable at work. Mind, this isn't an ordered list either.

Just to note, a basic fireproof safe (they have ones that are about briefcase sized) might be more affordable/practical than a safe deposit box. Just something to look at.

[OACSNY97]

Kitty-
I think it looks like a decent list and I'm happy to hear that the finances might not be quite as bad as originally thought.
I bolded the part about talking with your priest. Could you ask him if he knows if any of the other parishioners, especially the little old ladies, have an extra bedroom they'd be willing to rent to you below market rates, possibly in exchange for some housework/ light maintenance? By housework, I'm talking things like running the vacuum in the living room once or twice a week, taking out the trash, changing the light bulbs in the ceiling fixtures, watering the plants and maybe shoveling the walk, all things that a person who's still mobile enough to be at home but still has trouble doing while getting around with a cane. I would definitely spell out what's expected in the rental agreement if you go this route.

Good luck and good wishes.

Ok, plans!

(1) Tell parent that I've looked at my budget and found that I'm actually doing better than I thought and I'll be looking at apartments.

(2) Actually do budget. I looked at a few accounts and I may be doing better than I thought. I think I'm hitting at the line of "not good, but liveable."

(3) Talk to priest; inquire about local resources. Talk to some more local resources as well. I suspect either food or medical expenses will be easier than housing, although it might be hard.

(4) Obtain one safe deposit box and one PO box. Move critical documents to safe deposit box. Back up laptop/phone important stuff onto USB, put that there too. Get new dress pants (weight-change friendly) hemmed and move minimal dress clothing to car.

(5) Buy new phone and get on own phone contract. Will have to look into logistics here more. Looks like if I can't get my own contract it's best to not get a new phone yet.

(6) Start looking at apartments.

Anything I've missed?

[dehro]

Talk to friends to see if they have access to housing solutions and/or can provide moral support

[Tvtyrant]

I actually have talked to someone, and the answer is basically "there's pretty much nothing available for you."

I can't use any emergency housing because it has limits on the hours it's open and you have to be in at a certain hour and out at a certain hour. Most assistance is based on whether an average person of your gross income would need that assistance, meaning I'm not eligible since my income is too high. The affordability criteria for healthcare is based solely on premiums. I'm not legally an abuse victim because there is no category for adult children. Basically, the problem is that on paper I have enough money because no one's looking at the full picture.

Having done it myself, you might be able to watch people's houses as a way to get free housing. See your local priest/school to see if people need a house sitter, jump between houses as they open up and maybe see if people want a live in housekeeper.

Sometimes you need to get away regardless of finances.

[TechnOkami]

I'm 99.9999999...% sure I live in the U.S., unless we're entering evil demon scenarios here. I do however work night shift.

I'm 99.9% sure you're wrong, given she's talking about medical insurance and we have the NHS?

Hm, I wonder why my brain correlated WarKitty with UK then... maybe they mentioned it or was talking about it, dunno.

Either way I'm wrong. Carry on.

[WarKitty]

Just to note, a basic fireproof safe (they have ones that are about briefcase sized) might be more affordable/practical than a safe deposit box. Just something to look at.

The idea here is more, if I have to leave, minimizing stuff I have to grab. So if they're in a safe deposit box outside of the house, I don't have to get them when I leave the house.

[2D8HP]

Ok, plans!...

Looks good WK!

You know them best, but from how you described them, it may not be wise to inform your parents of your plans.

Also, crunch the numbers, but reducing your income enough to get Medicaid my be best.

[WarKitty]

Looks good WK!

You know them best, but from how you described them, it may not be wise to inform your parents of your plans.

Also, crunch the numbers, but reducing your income enough to get Medicaid my be best.

I don't think it will. Looking into it, I'm actually at the point where I'm just going to be able to have expenses meet income. (I have the savings to pay the car loan off in a lump sum, which will help.)

I think telling them that I'm apartment hunting and moving out will be fine, but I'm not mentioning the rest. The income limits for medicaid around here are extremely low - to the point where I'd question whether rent + gas + necessities would be affordable on that income around here. I'd be having to cut my income in half to qualify for medicaid.

[2D8HP]

Yesterday my brother (who lives on the other coast) told me that he's in town because our father's been hospitalized (my brother must answer his phone during the weekend, I usually leave it off, and it's voicemail is usually swamped by telemarketers).

My brother told me that he already visited our father who now "Looks like a skeleton", "Has a tumor", "Isn't sane", and is "Contsntly raving and demanding a cigarette".

OH JOY!!!

[WarKitty]

One more thought on therapy:

Many of the things I can articulate about therapy now, I couldn't articulate while I was in therapy. It took me weeks or months after the visit to figure out what was wrong and why it was bothering me. For example, I always could kind of tell that the whole "boundaries" lecture drove me up a wall, because couldn't they see that was just a way to get hurt worse? But it took me a very long time to realize that's because almost every serious boundary issue in my life was in a situation where I had relatively little control due to some sort of external (e.g. legal or financial) tie, while the typical approach the therapists were taking to boundaries assumed the primary reasons for allowing boundary violations were psychological or emotional. And looking back I think the therapists were just assuming I needed to be pushed harder to overcome my psychological issues, or wasn't ready to work on them or something, when the truth was I was afraid of retaliation that I wouldn't have a lot of power to protect myself against and that had a high probability of either not actually stopping the boundary violations or putting me in a worse position.

So it's not necessarily an issue of me not talking to them, but that by and large when the problems are there I don't really know how to articulate what's going wrong other than "I know that's a bad idea, I feel like this isn't applicable here," but without being able to put my finger on why. And then maybe 6 months later I'm thinking over it and finally realize "oh that's why."

[2D8HP]

One more thought on therapy....

.
It really sounds like you didn't need a therapist (turned in psychology), but you needed an effective social worker instead (but what I've heard from ex-social workers, is that can't really be much help to anyone unless you cheat and risk your job).

Something something be born in Canada or Scandinavia instead (but those long dark nights of winter are there own kind of depressing, certainly Seattle was, and it's not as far north).

But I still wonder, why did you leave school?

From those earlier posts it seemed like you were happier in college.

Since you successfully got to go to college, why didn't you go to graduate school?

Yes it would mean more loans, but in for a dime, in for a dollar, keep on that train as long as possible.

[WarKitty]

.
It really sounds like you didn't need a therapist (turned in psychology), but you needed an effective social worker instead (but what I've heard from ex-social workers, is that can't really be much help to anyone unless you cheat and risk your job).

Something something be born in Canada or Scandinavia instead (but those long dark nights of winter are there own kind of depressing, certainly Seattle was, and it's not as far north).

But I still wonder, why did you leave school?

From those earlier posts it seemed like you were happier in college.

Since you successfully got to go to college, why didn't you go to graduate school?

Yes it would mean more loans, but in for a dime, in for a dollar, keep on that train as long as possible.

Did college. Did grad school. Ended up not being able to keep on past my MA and had to take a break because my health came crashing down. I honestly don't think the happiness would have stayed in any case. Some of it was that the issues really hadn't hit. But a lot of it - it wasn't the academics that I was happy with, it was the social environment and the people I had around me more than anything else. And I was relying on my parents' health insurance (per Obamacare, up til I turned 26), because college and grad school tend not to offer real health insurance to students.

[2D8HP]

...it was the social environment and the people I had around me more than anything else..

.
What social outlets do you still have?

A bar/cafe with regulars?

Church?

Adventurers League/Pathfinder Society/game shop with a backroom?

Volunteer activities?

(From what you've described of your health, work schedule, and your job/apartment hunting you don't have much time, but:
Social Interaction Is Critical for Mental and Physical Health - The New York Times)

Getting into a place with room mates (replicating a dorm) sounds best for you right now.

[kyoryu]

For example, I always could kind of tell that the whole "boundaries" lecture drove me up a wall, because couldn't they see that was just a way to get hurt worse?

They start with the presumption that most people are generically functional, and not abusive.

If you're dealing with abusive people, then setting boundaries is a sure way to get into hotter water, as nothing sets off abusive people like being told "you can't do this."

A decent psychologist will figure the situation out reasonably quickly, especially if you can give some examples of when you've tried to set boundaries.

[Bartmanhomer]

One more thought on therapy:

Many of the things I can articulate about therapy now, I couldn't articulate while I was in therapy. It took me weeks or months after the visit to figure out what was wrong and why it was bothering me. For example, I always could kind of tell that the whole "boundaries" lecture drove me up a wall, because couldn't they see that was just a way to get hurt worse? But it took me a very long time to realize that's because almost every serious boundary issue in my life was in a situation where I had relatively little control due to some sort of external (e.g. legal or financial) tie, while the typical approach the therapists were taking to boundaries assumed the primary reasons for allowing boundary violations were psychological or emotional. And looking back I think the therapists were just assuming I needed to be pushed harder to overcome my psychological issues, or wasn't ready to work on them or something, when the truth was I was afraid of retaliation that I wouldn't have a lot of power to protect myself against and that had a high probability of either not actually stopping the boundary violations or putting me in a worse position.

So it's not necessarily an issue of me not talking to them, but that by and large when the problems are there I don't really know how to articulate what's going wrong other than "I know that's a bad idea, I feel like this isn't applicable here," but without being able to put my finger on why. And then maybe 6 months later I'm thinking over it and finally realize "oh that's why."

I go to therapy twice a month and it's helping me a lot. But I understand where you're coming from. Therapy is not for everyone.

[Tvtyrant]

One more thought on therapy:

Many of the things I can articulate about therapy now, I couldn't articulate while I was in therapy. It took me weeks or months after the visit to figure out what was wrong and why it was bothering me. For example, I always could kind of tell that the whole "boundaries" lecture drove me up a wall, because couldn't they see that was just a way to get hurt worse? But it took me a very long time to realize that's because almost every serious boundary issue in my life was in a situation where I had relatively little control due to some sort of external (e.g. legal or financial) tie, while the typical approach the therapists were taking to boundaries assumed the primary reasons for allowing boundary violations were psychological or emotional. And looking back I think the therapists were just assuming I needed to be pushed harder to overcome my psychological issues, or wasn't ready to work on them or something, when the truth was I was afraid of retaliation that I wouldn't have a lot of power to protect myself against and that had a high probability of either not actually stopping the boundary violations or putting me in a worse position.

So it's not necessarily an issue of me not talking to them, but that by and large when the problems are there I don't really know how to articulate what's going wrong other than "I know that's a bad idea, I feel like this isn't applicable here," but without being able to put my finger on why. And then maybe 6 months later I'm thinking over it and finally realize "oh that's why."

The only viable advice for an abusive relationship is to tell the person to get out of it. There isn't a lot they can do for someone who is stuck in an abusive situation, the victim isn't going to get mentally healthy under those conditions and the abuser isn't going to stop.

There is a reason abuse advice starts with acknowledging the victim is going to have a hard time being convinced they need to be extricated, and then healing starts by them leaving and cutting off contact.

[WarKitty]

The only viable advice for an abusive relationship is to tell the person to get out of it. There isn't a lot they can do for someone who is stuck in an abusive situation, the victim isn't going to get mentally healthy under those conditions and the abuser isn't going to stop.

There is a reason abuse advice starts with acknowledging the victim is going to have a hard time being convinced they need to be extricated, and then healing starts by them leaving and cutting off contact.

I mean, it's not just that it was in an abusive situation, but that the abusive situations I was in were ones where the ties were largely external rather than internal. So it's not that I needed to be convinced that I needed to be extricated, it's that I'm sitting there going "I'd love to be out, but I don't currently have the resources that I need to feel I can exit without putting myself into an even worse situation." But I feel like therapists tended to get stuck on the convincing me that I needed to put up boundaries and cut people who wouldn't respect them out.

[2D8HP]

...I don't currently have the resources....

....I feel like therapists tended to get stuck on....

.


I know that there's lots of absurd pedalling of "positive thinking" as means of achieving wealth, but there's an old Scottish saying that, "If wishes were horses, beggars would ride".

Did you expect to be hypnotized into affording better housing?

Therapists can only work on a patients mental state, as far as I know they're not much help with finances.

It really sounds like you were craving economic counseling rather than psychological (not that that would help either, poor is poor).

What were you expecting with therapy?

I really hope you weren't spending much on it.

[WarKitty]

.


I know that there's lots of absurd pedalling of "positive thinking" as means of achieving wealth, but there's an old Scottish saying that, "If wishes were horses, beggars would ride".

Did you expect to be hypnotized into affording better housing?

Therapists can only work on a patients mental state, as far as I know they're not much help with finances.

It really sounds like you were craving economic counseling rather than psychological (not that that would help either, poor is poor).

What were you expecting with therapy?

I really hope you weren't spending much on it.

I don't really know. All I know is that everyone in my life was telling me (and often still does) "You're never going to get better without therapy, no one can help you unless you're willing to get better and the way to get better is to GO TO THERAPY." Like literally, the answer you get from 99% of people when I talk about situations is "that's a question for the therapist!" So I guess I assumed that it wasn't the case that everyone around me was crazy and there must be something to this whole therapy idea.

[Lacco]

I don't really know. All I know is that everyone in my life was telling me (and often still does) "You're never going to get better without therapy, no one can help you unless you're willing to get better and the way to get better is to GO TO THERAPY." Like literally, the answer you get from 99% of people when I talk about situations is "that's a question for the therapist!" So I guess I assumed that it wasn't the case that everyone around me was crazy and there must be something to this whole therapy idea.

Often people don't want to provide advice/answers to complicated questions because if something bad happens as result, they get blamed for it.

I never went to therapy. And I was, in one part of my life, very close to definition of "insane". Yet, the changes - the positive ones - came usually from other people. Not when I asked for it, but when I listened to what they said.

I was maybe lucky that the people around me were quite wise (astonishingly, I was saved from my worst "me" by girl who was 15 at that time - and she did it again when I was 20).

You can get better without therapy - but sometimes it is good to get help. And sometimes it helps to just throw everything behind your head and stop worrying. I know, easy to say.

Also, the part about resources and getting into "worse" situation... worse in what way? Economical, as 2D8HP suggests? Or what do you mean?

[WarKitty]

Also, the part about resources and getting into "worse" situation... worse in what way? Economical, as 2D8HP suggests? Or what do you mean?

Most of the time we're talking economic. As in, "I'd like to leave this situation, but if I do I'm not sure I'll have a place to live." Potentially being separated from friends and other support systems has also come up (think "If you don't go along you'll be banned from campus").

[Lacco]

Most of the time we're talking economic. As in, "I'd like to leave this situation, but if I do I'm not sure I'll have a place to live." Potentially being separated from friends and other support systems has also come up (think "If you don't go along you'll be banned from campus").

Then the step "Do actual budget" is the most important thing. There are lots of things you can save money on - and that are just luxuries you can do without. And "worse" economically... well, it depends on how much worse, especially when compared to the "pleasant" stuff you go through with your current "flatmates"...

It's a matter of priorities. There are few people around here who say "It's better to cry in Porsche than to laugh in Skoda" (replace with your local equivalents), but I prefer laughing in Skoda to any crying. And it's better to lose some money than to lose your mind. Or worse.

[WarKitty]

Then the step "Do actual budget" is the most important thing. There are lots of things you can save money on - and that are just luxuries you can do without. And "worse" economically... well, it depends on how much worse, especially when compared to the "pleasant" stuff you go through with your current "flatmates"...

It's a matter of priorities. There are few people around here who say "It's better to cry in Porsche than to laugh in Skoda" (replace with your local equivalents), but I prefer laughing in Skoda to any crying. And it's better to lose some money than to lose your mind. Or worse.

I mean, for me the problem was more "I did the budget, I added up rent, food, transport to work, and medical care, and the total sum of that was greater than the sum of the available money."

[Cozzer]

And it's better to lose some money than to lose your mind.

Well, there is a threshold under which poverty can only hurt your mental (and physical!) health even further, and I'd say "not having a place to live" is beyond that, especially in winter.

I think WarKitty's plan of slowly building towards a long-term sustainable life, and as soon as it's done telling the parents "ok well I'm going to change jobs/home/everything gottagobye, see you never and thanks for nothing!" is the best way to go.

[WarKitty]

Honestly, I don't really want to go over the financial options again. Suffice it to say when I'm looking at money, I'm pretty well talking the point of "I'm not sure I'd be able to keep a roof over my head", or at least "I'm not sure that once I pay rent and food I'll be able to afford medicine." Not "I'll have to give up coffee out and cable."

The point about therapy though is that I felt that the assumption in therapy was that I was making an emotional calculation where I didn't think I deserved boundaries or something. Whereas I was making very pragmatic calculations about the consequences I might suffer for enforcing the boundaries, and coming to the conclusion that the consequences for enforcing boundaries at a given time might be worse than the consequences of not enforcing them.

[Chen]

The point about therapy though is that I felt that the assumption in therapy was that I was making an emotional calculation where I didn't think I deserved boundaries or something. Whereas I was making very pragmatic calculations about the consequences I might suffer for enforcing the boundaries, and coming to the conclusion that the consequences for enforcing boundaries at a given time might be worse than the consequences of not enforcing them.

And did you explain all this to the therapists? I mean as people said, they can't solve non-mental health issues. If they tell you to set boundaries I presume your response would either be "I've tried and it doesn't work" or "I don't want to try because the risk is too great". At which point I'm not sure what they can tell you besides "Get out of the situation", if it's the situation that is causing the mental health problems to begin with.

[dehro]

Warkitty..
some time ago I wrote you a pm.. not sure you ever received it.

[WarKitty]

And did you explain all this to the therapists? I mean as people said, they can't solve non-mental health issues. If they tell you to set boundaries I presume your response would either be "I've tried and it doesn't work" or "I don't want to try because the risk is too great". At which point I'm not sure what they can tell you besides "Get out of the situation", if it's the situation that is causing the mental health problems to begin with.

That's what I was trying to explain earlier. At the time I was dealing with therapy, it was for me more of a "I have a sense that this is a really terrible idea and everything's going to go to hell if I try this, but I can't put my finger on why exactly." I don't think I could have come up with something as coherent as what you were saying, I think it took me til like a year or more of being out of therapy to actually get to where I could clearly explain that.

[WarKitty]

Well, I have a lease move-in dec 1.