A Monster for Every Season: Summer 2
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  1. - Top - End - #1
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    OldWizardGuy

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    Default Revamped Races (human, elf, dwarf, orc)... LA+1? Pathfinder-balanced?

    Racial Feats: These feats are gained as bonus feats, regardless of whether or not the creature meets the prerequisites.

    Racial Skills: These skills are always considered class skills. The creature may use them untrained and gains a +2 racial bonus on them.

    Human
    The youngest race, and the most versatile. Elves have magic, dwarves have crafts, and orcs have might - but the greatest individual spellcasters, creators, and warriors are invariably human.

    Spoiler: Human Traits
    Show
    +2 Intelligence, +2 to any other ability score, -2 to any ability score (including Intelligence): Humans are the youngest and cleverest of the races, with their own individual strengths and flaws.

    Medium: As Medium creatures, humans have no special bonuses or penalties due to their size.

    Normal Speed: Human base land speed is 30 feet.

    Adaptation: At first level, a human selects a particular type of adaptation. All skills associated with that adaptation are racial skills for her.

    Spoiler: Adaptations
    Show
    Agile
    Balance, Climb, Escape Artist, Jump, Move Silently, Perform (dance), Sleight of Hand, Tumble, Use Rope.

    Illicit
    Bluff, Disable Device, Disguise, Forgery, Hide, Intimidate, Move Silently, Open Lock, Sleight of Hand.

    Mystical
    Concentration, Craft (alchemy), Decipher Script, Heal, Knowledge (arcana, religion, the planes), Spellcraft, Use Magic Device. A human with the mystical adaptation may make Craft (alchemy) checks even if she is not a spellcaster.

    Perceptive
    Appraise, Gather Information, Knowledge (architecture and engineering, geography), Listen, Search, Sense Motive, Speak Language, Spot. A human with the perceptive adaptation gains 2 ranks in Speak Language, rather than a +2 racial bonus.

    Social
    Bluff, Diplomacy, Gather Information, Knowledge (history, local, nobility and royalty), Perform (oratory), Sense Motive, Speak Language. A human with the social adaptation gains 2 ranks in Speak Language, rather than a +2 racial bonus.

    Wilderness
    Climb, Handle Animal, Heal, Jump, Knowledge (dungeoneering, nature), Ride, Survival, Swim.

    Skilled: A human gains 8 extra skill points at 1st level and 2 extra skill points at each additional level.

    Racial Feats: Able Learner.

    Racial Skills: See Adaptation, above.

    Automatic Language: Common. Bonus Languages: Any (other than secret languages, such as Druidic). See the Speak Language skill.

    Favored Classes: Any two. When determining whether a multiclass human takes an experience point penalty, his or her two highest-level classes do not count.

    Dwarf
    A doughty and dependable race with great skill in their hands, the gods created the first dwarves from stones.

    Spoiler: Dwarf Traits
    Show
    +2 Constitution, +2 Wisdom, -2 Dexterity: Dwarves are as enduring and wise as the earth, and just as slow to react.

    Medium: As Medium creatures, dwarves have no special bonuses or penalties due to their size.

    Fey: A dwarf is a fey creature with the [Dwarf] and [Earth] subtypes.

    Steady Speed: Dwarf base land speed is 30 feet. Dwarves can move at this speed even when wearing medium or heavy armor or when carrying a medium or heavy load (unlike other creatures, whose speed is reduced in such situations).

    Artifice: A dwarf may use her character level as her caster level for meeting the prerequisites of item creation feats. She ignores all prerequisites for crafting magic items other than caster level (using her character level), gp costs, XP costs, and race. A dwarf may take 20 when making Craft checks (even when crafting masterwork items).

    Subterranean Senses: Dwarves have low-light vision, darkvision 60 feet, and tremorsense 5 feet. A dwarf can also intuit depth, sensing her approximate depth underground as naturally as a human can sense which way is up.

    Tunnelling: A dwarf equipped with the proper tools has a burrow speed of 5 feet. They must shore up the tunnel as though go (by packing the earth, building support beams, etc), but this allows other creatures to use the tunnel as well.

    Weapon Familiarity: Dwarves may treat dwarven waraxes and dwarven urgroshes as martial weapons, rather than exotic weapons.

    Racial Feats: Master Artisan.

    Racial Skills: Appraise, Craft (all skills), Decipher Script, Disable Device, Forgery, Knowledge (architecture and engineering), Knowledge (dungeoneering), Open Lock, Perform (sing), Search, Use Magic Device, and Use Rope.

    Automatic Languages: Common and Dwarven. Bonus Languages: Giant, Gnome, Goblin, Orc, Terran, and Undercommon.

    Favored Classes: Cleric, Fighter, and Paladin. A multiclass dwarf’s cleric, fighter, and paladin classes do not count when determining whether she takes an experience point penalty for multiclassing.

    Elf
    As old as the dwarven race, elves are a courtly people that lives in harmony with nature.

    Spoiler: Elf Traits
    Show
    +2 Charisma, +2 Dexterity, -2 Constitution: Elves are graceful in both thought and movement, but somewhat ethereal.

    Medium: As Medium creatures, elves have no special bonuses or penalties due to their size.

    Fey: An elf is a fey creature with the [Elf] subtype. Evil-aligned elves gain the [Evil] subtype, and good-aligned elves gain the [Good] subtype.

    Fast Speed: Elf base land speed is 40 feet.

    Arboreal Senses: Elves have superior low-light vision and darkvision 60 feet. An elf with levels in druid or ranger uses their character level instead of their class level for wild empathy checks.

    Glibly Gullible: Tales abound of elves that delight in tricking mortals - but who may be outwitted in turn. At first level an elf may choose to increase her racial bonus on Bluff checks to +6. If she does so, her racial bonus on Sense Motive checks becomes a -6 racial penalty instead.

    Weapon Proficiency: Elves receive the Martial Weapon Proficiency feats for the longsword, rapier, longbow (including composite longbow), and shortbow (including composite shortbow) as bonus feats.

    Racial Feats: Magical Aptitude.

    Racial Skills: Bluff, Handle Animal, Heal, Hide, Knowledge (arcana, geography, nature), Listen, Move Silently, Perform (all skills), Sense Motive, Spellcraft, Spot, Survival, Use Magic Device.

    Automatic Languages: Common and Elven. Bonus Languages: Draconic, Gnoll, Gnome, Goblin, Orc, and Sylvan.

    Favored Classes: Bard, Druid, and Ranger. A multiclass elf’s bard, druid, and ranger classes do not count when determining whether she takes an experience point penalty for multiclassing.

    Orc
    Almost as young as humanity, the orcs are far more brutal than any other race but maintain a strong oral history through their tribe elders.

    Spoiler: Orc Traits
    Show
    +2 Constitution, +2 Charisma, +2 Strength, -2 Intelligence, -2 Wisdom: Orcs are proud and have unmatched vitality, but are also somewhat rash and lack the crafts of the other races.

    Medium: As Medium creatures, orcs have no special bonuses or penalties due to their size.

    Fey: An orc is a fey creature with the [Orc] subtype.

    Fast Speed: Orc base land speed is 40 feet.

    Ironhide: Orcs have a natural armour bonus equal to one-third their character level (minimum +1).

    Nocturnal Senses: Orcs have low-light vision, darkvision 60 feet, and scent.

    Weapon Familiarity: Orcs may treat dire flails, orc double axes, and spiked chains as martial weapons, rather than exotic weapons.

    Racial Feats: Diehard and Endurance.

    Racial Skills: Climb, Handle Animal, Hide, Intimidate, Jump, Knowledge (dungeoneering, history), Listen, Move Silently, Spot, Surival, Swim, Use Rope.

    Automatic Languages: Common and Orc. Bonus Languages: Draconic, Giant, Gnoll, Goblin, and Abyssal.

    Favored Classes: Barbarian, Fighter, and Rogue. A multiclass orc’s barbarian, fighter, and rogue classes do not count when determining whether she takes an experience point penalty for multiclassing.

    New Feats

    Spoiler: New Feats
    Show
    Extra Adaptation
    You are versatile even for a human.

    Prerequisites
    Human.

    Benefits
    Choose another adaptation. You gain the benefits of that adaptation.

    If a skill is associated with multiple adaptations, the racial bonuses to that skill stack.

    Special
    A human may select Extra Adaptation in place of any other bonus feat (e.g. as a bonus fighter feat, as a bonus wizard feat, etc.).

    Fey Armour
    Like the fey of the wilderness, you fear only the touch of cold iron.

    Prerequisites
    Fey type, character level 2nd.

    Benefits
    You gain damage reduction/cold iron equal to one-half your character level. This damage reduction stacks with all other damage reduction you possess, provided that damage reduction is overcome by cold iron.

    Special
    A fighter may select Fey Armour as one of his bonus fighter feats.

    Improved Adaptation
    You are particularly adept with your racial skills.

    Prerequisites
    Human.

    Benefits
    You may always choose to take 10 on your racial skills, even when rushed or threatened. You never take penalties on those skill checks (e.g. the penalty to Spot checks when asleep, the penalty to skill checks from crushing despair, etc.).

    Special
    A human may select Improved Adaptation in place of any other bonus feat (e.g. as a bonus fighter feat, as a bonus wizard feat, etc.).

    Greater Adaptation
    You have mastered your racial skills.

    Prerequisites
    Human, Improved Adaptation, character level 12th.

    Benefits
    You may always choose to take 20 on your racial skills, even when rushed or threatened or when multiple tries would not be allowed.

    Special
    A human may select Greater Adaptation in place of any other bonus feat (e.g. as a bonus fighter feat, as a bonus wizard feat, etc.).

    Powerful Build
    You are tremendously large and strong, even for an orc.

    Prerequisites
    Orc, Con 14, Str 14.

    Benefits
    You gain the powerful build special quality, as a half-giant.

    Special
    A fighter may select Powerful Build as one of his fighter bonus feats.

    Unearthly Grace
    "She held out her hands to the creature, and it moved towards her, surprisingly graceful. It had a liquidness to its walk that was all wrong. Nothing that big and ugly should move like quicksilver, but it did... It moved like something beautiful."- Anita Blake, reflecting on the monstrous fey known as Bloody Bones

    Prerequisites
    Fey type, Cha 12.

    Benefits
    You gain the unearthly grace special quality, as a nymph. Add your Charisma modifier as an untyped bonus to all your saving throws and as a deflection bonus to your Armour Class.


    To do: racial items (elf-rope, elf-bread, orc-grog, etc); feat to allow you to Craft racial items from other races, rings of power (to complete the Tolkien theme :D).
    Last edited by rferries; 2017-09-02 at 03:42 AM.

  2. - Top - End - #2
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    nonsi's Avatar

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    Default Re: Revamped Races (human, elf, dwarf, orc)... LA+1? Pathfinder-balanced?

    .
    1. Dwarves moving at 1/2 speed compared to elves and orcs would put them in an obvious disadvantage most of the times where land speed is a factor.
    2. What does it mean that Diehard and Endurance are racial feats of orcs? Does this mean that other races no longer have access to them?

  3. - Top - End - #3
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    NecromancerGirl

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    Default Re: Revamped Races (human, elf, dwarf, orc)... LA+1? Pathfinder-balanced?

    He means they gain them as bonus feats:
    "Racial Feats: These feats are gained as bonus feats, regardless of whether or not the creature meets the prerequisites."
    Homebrew: If it is mine feel free to PEACH and/or use it.

    Extended Signature

    Well, it seems that life has deposited me here, yet again. Hopefully this time I get to stay a while, as I intend on revising some old homebrew.

  4. - Top - End - #4
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    Default Re: Revamped Races (human, elf, dwarf, orc)... LA+1? Pathfinder-balanced?

    Quote Originally Posted by NothingAbnormal View Post
    He means they gain them as bonus feats:
    "Racial Feats: These feats are gained as bonus feats, regardless of whether or not the creature meets the prerequisites."
    Right. Somehow managed to disregard that comment

  5. - Top - End - #5
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    NecromancerGirl

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    Default Re: Revamped Races (human, elf, dwarf, orc)... LA+1? Pathfinder-balanced?

    Quote Originally Posted by nonsi View Post
    Right. Somehow managed to disregard that comment
    [wave of hand] Bah, it's all good, I do that all the time
    Homebrew: If it is mine feel free to PEACH and/or use it.

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    Well, it seems that life has deposited me here, yet again. Hopefully this time I get to stay a while, as I intend on revising some old homebrew.

  6. - Top - End - #6
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    NecromancerGirl

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    Default Re: Revamped Races (human, elf, dwarf, orc)... LA+1? Pathfinder-balanced?

    First: I love these!, Second; sorry for the double post. Third: Time for a Peach
    Quote Originally Posted by rferries View Post
    Racial Feats: These feats are gained as bonus feats, regardless of whether or not the creature meets the prerequisites.

    Racial Skills: These skills are always considered class skills. The creature may use them untrained and gains a +2 racial bonus on them.

    Human
    The youngest race, and the most versatile. Elves have magic, dwarves have crafts, and orcs have might - but the greatest individual spellcasters, creators, and warriors are invariably human.
    Human Traits
    +2 Intelligence, +2 to any other ability score, -2 to any ability score (including Intelligence): Humans are the youngest and cleverest of the races, with their own individual strengths and flaws.
    Hmm, so you could thoretically cancel these out ofr a +2 to any score... with no penalty. I think this would be fine though.
    Medium: As Medium creatures, humans have no special bonuses or penalties due to their size.

    Normal Speed: Human base land speed is 30 feet.

    Adaptation: At first level, a human selects a particular type of adaptation. All skills associated with that adaptation are racial skills for her.
    AdaptionsAgile
    Balance, Climb, Escape Artist, Jump, Move Silently, Perform (dance), Sleight of Hand, Tumble, Use Rope.
    Hmm, seem alright, but my problem is that these are not balnced against each other, especially mystical with the all powerful UMD but UMD is always a pain for those that cheese it . And I would still take Illicit over this because I find most the skills there get more use (Bad for this: Climb, Balance?, jump, use rope VS bad for illicit: forgery and open lock (due to knock) along with disable device (depending on play style of course, I made knock give a bonus in my game on checks so these are actually better skills to have)
    Illicit
    Bluff, Disable Device, Disguise, Forgery, Hide, Intimidate, Move Silently, Open Lock, Sleight of Hand.

    Mystical
    Concentration, Craft (alchemy), Decipher Script, Heal, Knowledge (arcana, religion, the planes), Spellcraft, Use Magic Device. A human with the mystical adaptation may make Craft (alchemy) checks even if she is not a spellcaster.
    If a spellcaster or heavy UMD does not take this they either do not need it or they want the human BF of the normal
    Perceptive
    Appraise, Gather Information, Knowledge (architecture and engineering, geography), Listen, Search, Sense Motive, Speak Language, Spot. A human with the perceptive adaptation gains 2 ranks in Speak Language, rather than a +2 racial bonus.
    small quibble, I would probably give them knowledge (local) while not the best skill it matches with gather info nicely even if you do not use it as much (my players use it more, b/c I made it synergize a lot, course I hand out more skill points )
    Social
    Bluff, Diplomacy, Gather Information, Knowledge (history, local, nobility and royalty), Perform (oratory), Sense Motive, Speak Language. A human with the social adaptation gains 2 ranks in Speak Language, rather than a +2 racial bonus.
    And you just took the thing that half elves were used for, diplomancers (are we gonna get a half elf rework? B/C I believe Elrond was )
    Wilderness
    Climb, Handle Animal, Heal, Jump, Knowledge (dungeoneering, nature), Ride, Survival, Swim.
    Climb and jum are garbage most the time. 'til you make your party climb a mountain made from foreign invaders out of solid cold iron which rapidly drains nearby magic that is .
    Skilled: A human gains 8 extra skill points at 1st level and 2 extra skill points at each additional level.
    Damn, there goes the thought that people might stop wanting to play a human all the time .
    Racial Feats: Able Learner.

    Racial Skills: See Adaptation, above.

    Automatic Language: Common. Bonus Languages: Any (other than secret languages, such as Druidic). See the Speak Language skill.

    Favored Classes: Any two. When determining whether a multiclass human takes an experience point penalty, his or her two highest-level classes do not count.

    Dwarf
    A doughty and dependable race with great skill in their hands, the gods created the first dwarves from stones.
    Dwarf Traints
    +2 Constitution, +2 Wisdom, -2 Dexterity: Dwarves are as enduring and wise as the earth, and just as slow to react.
    like these better then the previous adjustments
    Medium: As Medium creatures, dwarves have no special bonuses or penalties due to their size.
    Hmmm, i would replace this with powerful build... See Goliath. i feel they are still small size in LotR
    Fey: A dwarf is a fey creature with the [Dwarf] and [Earth] subtypes.
    I like this for two reasons,
    A) Thematic
    B) it makes the choice of a spell caster to grab charm person not nearly as effective
    Slow But Steady: Dwarf base land speed is 20 feet. However, dwarves can move at this speed even when wearing medium or heavy armor or when carrying a medium or heavy load (unlike other creatures, whose speed is reduced in such situations).
    I would add something about overland distance and forced march (the dwarves of the iron hills (?) come to Thorin's aid and march nonstop to do so, I think)
    Artifice: A dwarf may use her character level as her caster level for meeting the prerequisites of item creation feats. She ignores all prerequisites for crafting magic items other than caster level (using her character level), gp costs, XP costs, and race. A dwarf may take 20 when making Craft checks (even when crafting masterwork items).
    [insert cheer]
    Subterranean Senses: Dwarves have low-light vision, darkvision 60 feet, and tremorsense 5 feet. A dwarf can also intuit depth, sensing her approximate depth underground as naturally as a human can sense which way is up.

    Tunnelling: A dwarf equipped with the proper tools has a burrow speed of 5 feet. They must shore up the tunnel as though go (by packing the earth, building support beams, etc), but this allows other creatures to use the tunnel as well.
    Love the dwarves so far
    Weapon Familiarity: Dwarves may treat dwarven waraxes and dwarven urgroshes as martial weapons, rather than exotic weapons.
    There is a feat (no idea where or what the name is) that gives you proficiency with racial weapons, I usually let everyone have it although it doe snot do much for humans
    Racial Feats: Master Artisan.

    Racial Skills: Appraise, Craft (all skills), Decipher Script, Disable Device, Forgery, Knowledge (architecture and engineering), Knowledge (dungeoneering), Open Lock, Perform (sing), Search, Use Magic Device, and Use Rope.
    Blech, replace use rope with knowledge (dungeoneering) as that covers your underground.
    Automatic Languages: Common and Dwarven. Bonus Languages: Giant, Gnome, Goblin, Orc, Terran, and Undercommon.

    Favored Classes: Cleric, Fighter, and Paladin. A multiclass dwarf’s cleric, fighter, and paladin classes do not count when determining whether she takes an experience point penalty for multiclassing.

    Elf
    As old as the dwarven race, elves are a courtly people that lives in harmony with nature.
    Could have sworn elves were older then dwarf race... and immortality should be in here somewhere.
    Elf Traits
    +2 Charisma, +2 Dexterity, -2 Constitution: Elves are graceful in both thought and movement, but somewhat ethereal.
    Nice switch from frail to ethereal I like it
    Medium: As Medium creatures, elves have no special bonuses or penalties due to their size.

    Fey: An elf is a fey creature with the [Elf] subtype. Evil-aligned elves gain the [Evil] subtype, and good-aligned elves gain the [Good] subtype.
    Hmm I know it is not too Tolkien, but for dnd style I would put law and chaos in there
    Fast Speed: Elf base land speed is 40 feet.

    Arboreal Senses: Elves have superior low-light vision and darkvision 60 feet. An elf with levels in druid or ranger uses their character level instead of their class level for wild empathy checks.

    Glibly Gullible: Tales abound of elves that delight in tricking mortals - but who may be outwitted in turn. At first level an elf may choose to increase her racial bonus on Bluff checks to +10. If she does so, her racial bonus on Sense Motive checks becomes a -10 racial penalty instead.
    Next Elf I draw up will be using this now... but 10 is a rather large bonus/penalty... maybe 6?
    Weapon Proficiency: Elves receive the Martial Weapon Proficiency feats for the longsword, rapier, longbow (including composite longbow), and shortbow (including composite shortbow) as bonus feats.

    Racial Feats: Magical Aptitude.
    Unless you redid it, in which ase you should put the link to yours as they are much better.
    Racial Skills: Bluff, Handle Animal, Heal, Hide, Knowledge (arcana, geography, nature), Listen, Move Silently, Perform (all skills), Sense Motive, Spellcraft, Spot, Survival, Use Magic Device.

    Automatic Languages: Common and Elven. Bonus Languages: Draconic, Gnoll, Gnome, Goblin, Orc, and Sylvan.

    Favored Classes: Bard, Druid, and Ranger. A multiclass elf’s bard, druid, and ranger classes do not count when determining whether she takes an experience point penalty for multiclassing.

    Orc
    Almost as young as humanity, the orcs are far more brutal than any other race but maintain a strong oral history through their tribe elders.
    Orc traits
    +2 Constitution, +2 Charisma, +2 Strength, -2 Intelligence, -2 Wisdom: Orcs are proud and have unmatched vitality, but are also somewhat rash and lack the crafts of the other races.

    Medium: As Medium creatures, orcs have no special bonuses or penalties due to their size.

    Fey: An orc is a fey creature with the [Orc] subtype.

    Fast Speed: Orc base land speed is 40 feet.

    Ironhide: Orcs have a natural armour bonus equal to one-third their character level (minimum +1).

    Nocturnal Senses: Orcs have low-light vision, darkvision 60 feet, and scent.

    Weapon Familiarity: Orcs may treat dire flails, orc double axes, and spiked chains as martial weapons, rather than exotic weapons.

    Racial Feats: Diehard and Endurance.

    Racial Skills: Climb, Handle Animal, Hide, Intimidate, Jump, Knowledge (dungeoneering, history), Listen, Move Silently, Spot, Surival, Swim, Use Rope.

    Automatic Languages: Common and Orc. Bonus Languages: Draconic, Giant, Gnoll, Goblin, and Abyssal.

    Favored Classes: Barbarian, Fighter, and Rogue. A multiclass orc’s barbarian, fighter, and rogue classes do not count when determining whether she takes an experience point penalty for multiclassing.
    orcs look good, but I think they could use a small power boost as the rest are better (but then, aren't they exposed to be )
    New Feats

    New Feats
    Extra Adaptation
    You are versatile even for a human.

    Prerequisites
    Human.

    Benefits
    Choose another adaptation. You gain the benefits of that adaptation.

    If a skill is associated with multiple adaptations, the racial bonuses to that skill stack.

    Special
    A human may select Extra Adaptation in place of any other bonus feat (e.g. as a bonus fighter feat, as a bonus wizard feat, etc.).
    I personally would make it at level 1, but then adventurers do travel and need to adapt so I guess leave it... (illicit/mystical human sounds fun)
    Fey Armour
    Like the fey of the wilderness, you fear only the touch of cold iron.

    Prerequisites
    Fey type, character level 2nd.

    Benefits
    You gain damage reduction/cold iron equal to one-half your character level.

    Special
    A fighter may select Fey Armour as one of his bonus fighter feats.
    Needs "DR from this ability stack with other sources of DR" type clause
    Improved Adaptation
    You are particularly adept with your racial skills.

    Prerequisites
    Human.

    Benefits
    You may always choose to take 10 on your racial skills, even when rushed or threatened. You never take penalties on those skill checks (e.g. the penalty to Spot checks when asleep, the penalty to skill checks from crushing despair, etc.).

    Special
    A human may select Improved Adaptation in place of any other bonus feat (e.g. as a bonus fighter feat, as a bonus wizard feat, etc.).
    Hmmm, always take 10 on UMD...
    Greater Adaptation
    You have mastered your racial skills.

    Prerequisites
    Human, Improved Adaptation, character level 12th.

    Benefits
    You may always choose to take 20 on your racial skills, even when rushed or threatened or when multiple tries would not be allowed.

    Special
    A human may select Greater Adaptation in place of any other bonus feat (e.g. as a bonus fighter feat, as a bonus wizard feat, etc.).
    And now 20 on UMD...
    Powerful Build
    You are tremendously large and strong, even for an orc.

    Prerequisites
    Orc, Con 14, Str 14.

    Benefits
    You gain the powerful build special quality, as a half-giant.

    Special
    A fighter may select Powerful Build as one of his fighter bonus feats.
    Just noticed that they are medium... uruk Hai should get this as a bonus feat XD
    Unearthly Grace
    "She held out her hands to the creature, and it moved towards her, surprisingly graceful. It had a liquidness to its walk that was all wrong. Nothing that big and ugly should move like quicksilver, but it did... It moved like something beautiful."- Anita Blake, reflecting on the monstrous fey known as Bloody Bones

    Prerequisites
    Fey type, Cha 12.

    Benefits
    You gain the unearthly grace special quality, as a nymph. Add your Charisma modifier as an untyped bonus to all your saving throws and as a deflection bonus to your Armour Class.
    An orc with one of these? A dwarf? More expected this to be an elfie thing...
    To do: racial items (elf-rope, elf-bread, orc-grog, etc); feat to allow you to Craft racial items from other races, rings of power (to complete the Tolkien theme :D).
    As always, this is a beaut. Keep up the good work!
    Last edited by Westhart; 2017-09-01 at 09:41 AM. Reason: Removed spoilers to clean up
    Homebrew: If it is mine feel free to PEACH and/or use it.

    Extended Signature

    Well, it seems that life has deposited me here, yet again. Hopefully this time I get to stay a while, as I intend on revising some old homebrew.

  7. - Top - End - #7
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    OldWizardGuy

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    Default Re: Revamped Races (human, elf, dwarf, orc)... LA+1? Pathfinder-balanced?

    Quote Originally Posted by nonsi View Post
    .
    1. Dwarves moving at 1/2 speed compared to elves and orcs would put them in an obvious disadvantage most of the times where land speed is a factor.
    Yes, agreed. I was balancing them against the original races but now they can stand a boost back up to 30.

    Quote Originally Posted by NothingAbnormal View Post
    First: I love these!, Second; sorry for the double post. Third: Time for a Peach

    Hmm, so you could thoretically cancel these out ofr a +2 to any score... with no penalty. I think this would be fine though.
    Hmm, seem alright, but my problem is that these are not balnced against each other, especially mystical with the all powerful UMD but UMD is always a pain for those that cheese it . And I would still take Illicit over this because I find most the skills there get more use (Bad for this: Climb, Balance?, jump, use rope VS bad for illicit: forgery and open lock (due to knock) along with disable device (depending on play style of course, I made knock give a bonus in my game on checks so these are actually better skills to have)

    If a spellcaster or heavy UMD does not take this they either do not need it or they want the human BF of the normal

    small quibble, I would probably give them knowledge (local) while not the best skill it matches with gather info nicely even if you do not use it as much (my players use it more, b/c I made it synergize a lot, course I hand out more skill points )

    And you just took the thing that half elves were used for, diplomancers (are we gonna get a half elf rework? B/C I believe Elrond was )

    Climb and jum are garbage most the time. 'til you make your party climb a mountain made from foreign invaders out of solid cold iron which rapidly drains nearby magic that is .

    Damn, there goes the thought that people might stop wanting to play a human all the time .

    like these better then the previous adjustments

    Hmmm, i would replace this with powerful build... See Goliath. i feel they are still small size in LotR

    I like this for two reasons,
    A) Thematic
    B) it makes the choice of a spell caster to grab charm person not nearly as effective

    I would add something about overland distance and forced march (the dwarves of the iron hills (?) come to Thorin's aid and march nonstop to do so, I think)

    [insert cheer]

    Love the dwarves so far

    There is a feat (no idea where or what the name is) that gives you proficiency with racial weapons, I usually let everyone have it although it doe snot do much for humans

    Blech, replace use rope with knowledge (dungeoneering) as that covers your underground.

    Could have sworn elves were older then dwarf race... and immortality should be in here somewhere.

    Nice switch from frail to ethereal I like it

    Hmm I know it is not too Tolkien, but for dnd style I would put law and chaos in there

    Next Elf I draw up will be using this now... but 10 is a rather large bonus/penalty... maybe 6?

    Unless you redid it, in which ase you should put the link to yours as they are much better.

    orcs look good, but I think they could use a small power boost as the rest are better (but then, aren't they exposed to be )

    I personally would make it at level 1, but then adventurers do travel and need to adapt so I guess leave it... (illicit/mystical human sounds fun)

    Needs "DR from this ability stack with other sources of DR" type clause

    Hmmm, always take 10 on UMD...

    And now 20 on UMD...

    Just noticed that they are medium... uruk Hai should get this as a bonus feat XD

    An orc with one of these? A dwarf? More expected this to be an elfie thing...


    As always, this is a beaut. Keep up the good work!
    1. Human ability scores can now be used to duplicate the Pathfinder ability scores, BUT they can also allow a bit more min-maxing. Humans are meant to be the most versatile race, after all!

    2. All adaptations are not created equal, no :D I basically started out with the themes and the extent of my balancing was just to give each theme 9 skills haha. I made a feeble attempt at trying to weight each skill according to its utility but that was quickly going to drive me crazy. The advantage of the adaptation is to use it to compensate for the class skills you don't already have; I do see how Mystical would be the default adaptation for powergamers but hopefully the campaign theme will tempt players to try others - Social for an urban campaign with a lot of role-playing, etc.

    3. Powerful build was on the drawing board for dwarves, yes! I just couldn't decide if they should be Medium with access to the Orc feat (allowing them to take on their traditional enemies the Giants on equal footing), or Small (with the associated benefits) with an automatic powerful build quality.

    4. Re: fey type - yes, it always bugged me that dwarves, elves, orcs etc, are all "humanoids". I'm considering switching Orcs to monstrous humanoids instead of fey though.

    5. Increased Slow But Steady to just Steady (30 foot movement, ignoring armour). Could add Endurance as bonus/alternative feat too.

    6. Re: racial weapon proficiency feat - probably easier to just take a level or fighter of Martial Weapon Proficiency, you get the racial exotic weapons either way I believe.

    7. Already had Knowledge (dungeoneering) as racial skill for dwarves; Use Rope was meant to be another "dwarves have great skill in their hands" skill but I agree it doesn't fit so well.Open to suggestions though!

    8. Yeah in Tolkien elves are older; they're the perfect Mary Sue race for him (immortal, pure, adept at magic, etc) but that would give them too much power to be a PC race so I watered them down to the archetypal "fey" - charismatic but not necessarily wise. May post homebrew Fey race later on (with racial feats to become dwarves, ogres, pixies, etc. - all the potential creatures of fairy tales combined in one race)

    9. Altered Glibly Gullible to +/- 6, per your suggestion (fits nicely with the +6 bonus to Wild Empathy of nymphs, dryads, etc).

    10. Magical Aptitude is a weak feat yeah, but all the racial feats were meant to be like that (Magical Artisan for dwarves is useless unless you decide to go all-out on the dwarven blacksmith archetype).

    11. Hmm! I gave orcs 2 bonus feats but assumed they were already powerful (for melee classes at least). Any suggestions? Perhaps rage as a SLA? (that improves to transformation at high levels?)

    12. Yeah Extra Adaptation was meant to reflect versatility of humans; they learn quickly (compared to the other races at least) even once fully grown.

    13. Edited Fey Armour as you say.

    14 (so many edits!). Yeah, but hopefully Greater Adaptation comes late enough (12th level) that it's ok?

    15. Depends...Powerful Build is arguably worth LA+1 by itself so might be too powerful as a bonus feat.

    16. Unearthly Grace- I've always liked the flavour quote. Fey creatures (even Red Caps, Banshees, Satyrs, etc) should be supernaturally graceful/charismatic, IMHO, as part of their flavour.

    Thanks again for the insight!
    Last edited by rferries; 2017-09-03 at 11:56 AM.

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    Default Re: Revamped Races (human, elf, dwarf, orc)... LA+1? Pathfinder-balanced?

    Quote Originally Posted by rferries View Post
    1. Human ability scores can now be used to duplicate the Pathfinder ability scores, BUT they can also allow a bit more min-maxing. Humans are meant to be the most versatile race, after all!
    Fair enough
    2. All adaptations are not created equal, no :D I basically started out with the themes and the extent of my balancing was just to give each theme 9 skills haha. I made a feeble attempt at trying to weight each skill according to its utility but that was quickly going to drive me crazy. The advantage of the adaptation is to use it to compensate for the class skills you don't already have; I do see how Mystical would be the default adaptation for powergamers but hopefully the campaign theme will tempt players to try others - Social for an urban campaign with a lot of role-playing, etc.
    Of course, I stopped worrying about Min/Maxers a while ago ('cept when I dm XD). Of Course I love throwing intelligent items at UMD types ^^
    3. Powerful build was on the drawing board for dwarves, yes! I just couldn't decide if they should be Medium with access to the Orc feat (allowing them to take on their traditional enemies the Giants on equal footing), or Small (with the associated benefits) with an automatic powerful build quality.
    Fair enough
    4. Re: fey type - yes, it always bugged me that dwarves, elves, orcs etc, are all "humanoids". I'm considering switching Orcs to monstrous humanoids instead of fey though.
    I would add a note for rangers and favored enemies, that they split fey up (they did it to humanoids... of course they could use the boost...)
    5. Increased Slow But Steady to just Steady (30 foot movement, ignoring armour). Could add Endurance as bonus/alternative feat too.

    6. Re: racial weapon proficiency feat - probably easier to just take a level or fighter of Martial Weapon Proficiency, you get the racial exotic weapons either way I believe.
    Races of Wild has elven courtblade and a few others you would not get... RoS has gnome quickblade and a few others...
    7. Already had Knowledge (dungeoneering) as racial skill for dwarves; Use Rope was meant to be another "dwarves have great skill in their hands" skill but I agree it doesn't fit so well.Open to suggestions though!
    hehe my bad... will think on skill
    8. Yeah in Tolkien elves are older; they're the perfect Mary Sue race for him (immortal, pure, adept at magic, etc) but that would give them too much power to be a PC race so I watered them down to the archetypal "fey" - charismatic but not necessarily wise. May post homebrew Fey race later on (with racial feats to become dwarves, ogres, pixies, etc. - all the potential creatures of fairy tales combined in one race)
    Sounds interesting!
    9. Altered Glibly Gullible to +/- 6, per your suggestion (fits nicely with the +6 bonus to Wild Empathy of nymphs, dryads, etc).

    10. Magical Aptitude is a weak feat yeah, but all the racial feats were meant to be like that (Magical Artisan for dwarves is useless unless you decide to go all-out on the dwarven blacksmith archetype).

    11. Hmm! I gave orcs 2 bonus feats but assumed they were already powerful (for melle classes at least). Any suggestions? Perhaps rage as a SLA? (that improves to transformation at high levels?)
    Hmm, maybe give them rage as a 1st lvl barb that stacks with actual classes... although the SLA's sound goo too...
    12. Yeah Extra Adaptation was meant to reflect versatility of humans; they learn quickly (compared to the other races at least) even once fully grown.

    13. Edited Fey Armour as you say.

    14 (so many edits!). Yeah, but hopefully Greater Adaptation comes late enough (12th level) that it's ok?
    Well, in my campaign I make it clear that spellcasters play with forces that are older then some gods so UMD is not as broken ;)
    There was a sherlock holmes quote I used somewhere...
    15. Depends...Powerful Build is arguably worth LA+1 by itself so might be too powerful as a bonus feat.

    16. Unearthly Grace- I've always liked the flavour quote. Fey creatures (even Red Caps, Banshees, Satyrs, etc) should be supernaturally graceful/charismatic, IMHO, as part of their flavour.
    Fair enough, although I would personally retexture it for dwarves... wisdom of the mountain maybe? same abilities but wisdom keyed?
    Thanks again for the insight!
    Ah, no problem, these look really nice!
    Last edited by Westhart; 2017-09-02 at 09:20 PM.
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    Default Re: Revamped Races (human, elf, dwarf, orc)... LA+1? Pathfinder-balanced?

    A few things I would suggest would be Human Expert should have Appraise, Diplomacy, Craft (all), Knowledge (all), Profession (All), Performance (All) and maybe Spellcraft or UMD... If they take Craft (Clockwork) then they could also take Disable Device, something along those lines.

    I love what you've done with Dwarf... I'll probably play your version of Dwarf from now on as you know how much I love Crafting Characters... XD

    I'm not sure how I feel about Dwarves having Powerful Build... I mean I love the idea... there should be allowed individuals of every race to have something akin to Powerful Build, but I'm not sure how many Dwarves would have it due to their Underground nature

    I love that you gave Elves Superior Low Light Vision! They deserve this!

    I'm not a huge fan of Glibly Gullible.... Maybe reduce it to +4/-4?

    Half-orcs/Orcs/Uroki should be Monsterous Humanoids and the larger Urroki should have Powerful Build, and maybe another +2 to Strength &/or Con, and additional rounds of Barbarian Rage...

    As for Racial weapons, I'd suggest just saying that all weapons with that particular races name in it's name is a Martial Weapon for that race. There's plenty of weapons that can be made with Lemmy's weapon creation system that could be associated with Humans...

    I kinda feel that the DR form the feat is a little too high... maybe cap it at 5/cold Iron, but it can be taken multiple times?

    I like the Powerful Build Prerequisites mostly... I would suggest you could alter it slightly by removing the races, and increasing the Ability requirements to 15 or 16 each... That would make sense thematically. Big and Strong. That would also keep it more in line of that kind of character being a melee character more likely than not. You should also think about limiting it to being taken at character creation/level 1 unless you're playing a youngish/child-young teen type character then I guess you could take it later, but I've only seen that a couple of times...

    Overall, these changes seem great! They are drastically different than the originals, and in some ways more 'powerful' but I really enjoy what I'm seeing here!

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    Default Re: Revamped Races (human, elf, dwarf, orc)... LA+1? Pathfinder-balanced?

    Quote Originally Posted by AOKost View Post
    I kinda feel that the DR form the feat is a little too high... maybe cap it at 5/cold Iron, but it can be taken multiple times?

    Well, if you change it I'll use the original in my games ;)
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    Default Re: Revamped Races (human, elf, dwarf, orc)... LA+1? Pathfinder-balanced?

    Thanks both from your comments! I think I'll digest these some more - considering making orcs into monstrous humanoids and dwarves into elementals (Earth) now, with the wisdom-based version of unearthly grace that was mentioned.

    Powerful build is arguably appropriate for dwarves - the smaller guys who are nonetheless fierce fighters.

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    Default Re: Revamped Races (human, elf, dwarf, orc)... LA+1? Pathfinder-balanced?

    Quote Originally Posted by rferries View Post
    Thanks both from your comments! I think I'll digest these some more - considering making orcs into monstrous humanoids and dwarves into elementals (Earth) now, with the wisdom-based version of unearthly grace that was mentioned.

    Powerful build is arguably appropriate for dwarves - the smaller guys who are nonetheless fierce fighters.
    I think that the orcs would fit better under monstrous humanoids.... and I love putting dwarves as earth elements, but if you do I think you may have to bump it to +2 LA for low power games ().

    Yes, I honestly prefer powerful build over just making them medium, more fitting... gets the bigger then a hobbit err halfling but smaller then a human feel.
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    Default Re: Revamped Races (human, elf, dwarf, orc)... LA+1? Pathfinder-balanced?

    Once again, you've made some awesome homebrews here.
    Quote Originally Posted by rferries View Post
    --Snip--
    4. Re: fey type - yes, it always bugged me that dwarves, elves, orcs etc, are all "humanoids". I'm considering switching Orcs to monstrous humanoids instead of fey though.

    --Snip--

    8. Yeah in Tolkien elves are older; they're the perfect Mary Sue race for him (immortal, pure, adept at magic, etc) but that would give them too much power to be a PC race so I watered them down to the archetypal "fey" - charismatic but not necessarily wise. May post homebrew Fey race later on (with racial feats to become dwarves, ogres, pixies, etc. - all the potential creatures of fairy tales combined in one race)

    9. Altered Glibly Gullible to +/- 6, per your suggestion (fits nicely with the +6 bonus to Wild Empathy of nymphs, dryads, etc).

    --Snip--

    16. Unearthly Grace- I've always liked the flavour quote. Fey creatures (even Red Caps, Banshees, Satyrs, etc) should be supernaturally graceful/charismatic, IMHO, as part of their flavour.

    Thanks again for the insight!
    4. If you're going for a Tolkien feel, orcs should probably be the same as Elves, since they are a race of former elves that were corrupted/forced to serve Morgoth (and later Morgoth's lieutenant/heir, Sauron). Otherwise, monstrous humanoid makes since.

    8. Technically, Tolkien dwarves are the older race - Eru gave the Valar the blueprints for Middle Earth and the plants and animals. And said 'build this. When it's ready, I'll make the elves and men to live in it.' When they were 95~% ready one of the Valar got impatient and tried to make men on his own. Eru was mad, but when he saw the dwarves had free will he decided they could stay. But since he didn't want to reward impatience he put them in suspended animation until after the elves were made...

    (incidentally, ents were created in response to the dwarves... one of the other Valar was jealous/upset that stinking dwarves were going to cut down her beautiful trees and got permission to make ents.)

    As for the Mary Sue-ness of the elves, wasn't as big deal in Silmarillion ear when a standard monster raiding band attacking a village might be 100 orcs led by a Balrog... By the third age, elves weren't overshadowing humans only b/c 99.9% of elves had forgotten how awesome they were...

    9. Love glibly gullible for a non-Tolkien setting.

    16. Huzza!

    Quote Originally Posted by rferries View Post
    Thanks both from your comments! I think I'll digest these some more - considering making orcs into monstrous humanoids and dwarves into elementals (Earth) now, with the wisdom-based version of unearthly grace that was mentioned.

    Powerful build is arguably appropriate for dwarves - the smaller guys who are nonetheless fierce fighters.
    Dwarves as elementals... interesting...

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    Default Re: Revamped Races (human, elf, dwarf, orc)... LA+1? Pathfinder-balanced?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ranged Ranger View Post
    Once again, you've made some awesome homebrews here.

    4. If you're going for a Tolkien feel, orcs should probably be the same as Elves, since they are a race of former elves that were corrupted/forced to serve Morgoth (and later Morgoth's lieutenant/heir, Sauron). Otherwise, monstrous humanoid makes since.

    8. Technically, Tolkien dwarves are the older race - Eru gave the Valar the blueprints for Middle Earth and the plants and animals. And said 'build this. When it's ready, I'll make the elves and men to live in it.' When they were 95~% ready one of the Valar got impatient and tried to make men on his own. Eru was mad, but when he saw the dwarves had free will he decided they could stay. But since he didn't want to reward impatience he put them in suspended animation until after the elves were made...

    (incidentally, ents were created in response to the dwarves... one of the other Valar was jealous/upset that stinking dwarves were going to cut down her beautiful trees and got permission to make ents.)

    As for the Mary Sue-ness of the elves, wasn't as big deal in Silmarillion ear when a standard monster raiding band attacking a village might be 100 orcs led by a Balrog... By the third age, elves weren't overshadowing humans only b/c 99.9% of elves had forgotten how awesome they were...

    9. Love glibly gullible for a non-Tolkien setting.

    16. Huzza!

    Dwarves as elementals... interesting...
    4. Good point! May leave them as fey then.

    8. Cool, I didn't know that (only read the first few pages of the Silmarillion, I admit).

    9. Yeah it doesn't really fit the flavour, except maybe for the wood elves/Mirkwood elves.

    16. Elemental is great flavour for animated stones (dwarves)... but the trouble is it comes with loads of immunities in game terms. Will probably just leave them as fey with the Earth subtype.

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    Default Re: Revamped Races (human, elf, dwarf, orc)... LA+1? Pathfinder-balanced?

    I got to ask one more time XD
    Are you going to make a Peredhil race (half-elf)
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    Default Re: Revamped Races (human, elf, dwarf, orc)... LA+1? Pathfinder-balanced?

    Quote Originally Posted by NothingAbnormal View Post
    I got to ask one more time XD
    Are you going to make a Peredhil race (half-elf)
    Ahhhh I'm sorry to disappoint but I've always hated the ideas of half-elves, personally! :D You should go ahead and make one though. Sorry also for not responding earlier, I must have overlooked the request.

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    Default Re: Revamped Races (human, elf, dwarf, orc)... LA+1? Pathfinder-balanced?

    Quote Originally Posted by rferries View Post
    Ahhhh I'm sorry to disappoint but I've always hated the ideas of half-elves, personally! :D You should go ahead and make one though. Sorry also for not responding earlier, I must have overlooked the request.
    o.0 "buh..."
    Alright... Oh and the earlier request I worked in while peaching no problem.
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