Question Concerning Libris Mortis

[Balkash]

well i love that book, but today i found something odd. in LM it says that you can play undead as characters. and it gives all these stats and such, but im wondering... for the barbarian, the barbarian's rage lasts 3 rounds + constitution modifier... but undead dont have constitution scores. so does this mean its just 3 rounds, or do undead use another modifier? i didnt see anything about it in LM, so does anyone else know? thanks in advance

[Volug]

so i've heard that undead use their strength mods for their fortitude saves, im guessing the same thing apply's here.
hoped that helped.

[Anxe]

A few undead such as the Vasuthant use Charisma for things like that.

[adanedhel9]

There's precident to use Charisma in place of Constitution (eg Concentration), but there's also precident to have Constitution have no effect (eg hit points). However, the Concentration thing is explicitly stated in the Undead type description; without any other support, I would assume that Constitution does not apply to any other statistic. So an undead's rage would (by default) last 3 rounds.

[Xefas]

I have some recollection of seeing it said somewhere that all special attacks and qualities that rely on CON change to CHA when something turns undead, such as the breath weapons on dragons. If I can find an exact quote, I'll post it, but for now, I'd say just use CHA for the barbarian's rage...they don't really need nerfing, now, do they?

[slexlollar89]

one time, my freind was a barbarian vampire, and he asked the DM about the rage thing. at the time, we had no knowledge of the cha deal, so the DM said to aply int to rage. the reason why is cuz the barbarian had become so angry that he couldnt read, he raged. the DM said this was an intilectual rage, and if the player used books as weapons, it could last an additional 3 rounds.

[Seffbasilisk]

I've read using Cha in place of Con in a number of things (but never Strength...where did you get that?) but I don't think it applies to the rage, capping an Undead Barbarian's Rage at 3 rounds, unless he invests in feats like 'Extend Rage' (Complete Warrior)