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    Default BisectedBrioche's Brilliant Bread Random Banter Bthread #243

    OK, I hope I'm doing this right! I've been waiting for an opportunity since I realised my handle alliterates with banter.

    Rules for Random Banter remain as always save that I have arbitrarily increased the number of threads required before you can start another one.

    1. Spam. For RB, one-word posts are generally considered spam. Likewise, posts that are nothing but *actions like this* are also be considered spam. Remember that the quality of the post's content is much better than the speed of your response.

    2. This isn't the Play by Post or Town forum, nor is it the Silly Message Board Games or Structured Games forum. Please avoid continuous roleplay or mock battles and fights such as the "competition for control of the universe".

    3. If it's already a thread, don't bring it to RB. RB has such a huge range of subject matter even restricted to the little snippets that probably don't warrant their thread, it doesn't need legitimate thread topics cluttering it up as well. The exception to this is to bring something off-topic from one thread, but on-topic for RB and the subject doesn't warrant a thread of its own.

    4. Don't advertise other threads in RB. Just because these new threads move at speeds more appropriate to a message board than an IM session doesn't mean you need to come over to RB and browbeat people into posting in your latest brainchild.

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    7. Random Banter can only be as good, or as entertaining, as you make it. Demands to be entertained will fall on deaf ears unless you can add something more meaningful to the conversation.

    8. As this is a public forum, where the current topic is nicely recorded for you, and not a conversation where you could have missed the beginning, please refrain from asking something to the effect of "What's the topic?". Please take the time to read up a bit first.

    9. Thread Creator must include the words "Random" and "Banter" as well as the thread #. Try to be concise as well.

    10. Every post should contain two visible, legible complete sentences, Subject and Predicate. C'mon, make your old English teachers proud.

    11. Remember, Random Banter is not your IM client. If you want to have a back and forth discussion with just one person, look in their contact information for IM details.

    12. Whenever a new thread is created, all "first post", "first-page", and all posts of that nature will be deleted by the administrators. Please avoid doing this, as it is frustrating for them to deal with one-lined posts like this.

    13. Double-posting is not your friend. We have edit buttons for a reason.

    14. Once you have made a Random Banter thread, you must wait for 20 threads before making another one.

    15. If you can avoid dibs calling on making the next thread, that will avoid people needing to wait if the thread hits 50 pages while the dibs-caller is asleep.


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    Last edited by BisectedBrioche; 2023-03-01 at 09:32 AM.
    Hi, I'm back, I guess. ^_^
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  2. - Top - End - #2
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    Default Re: BisectedBrioche's Brilliant Bread Random Banter Bthread #243

    Continuing previous convo:

    Quote Originally Posted by Anonymouswizard View Post
    The New 52 was a good thing.

    Adding all the lore back in literally three seconds after it happened? There's your issue,
    So the thing is, nobody really cares about the lore as the average buyer. Because the average buyer doesn't buy comics. Like by your logic, plenty of indie titles would be selling GANGBUSTERS on the open market because they lack an overarching lore or continuity.

    And, to be fair, some of them sell fairly well...for a comic. Something is Killing the Children was I think the bestselling comic of 2020, but that still only amounted to like 200k units sold?

    It's clearly not the lore that makes people not buy comic books...or at least Western ones. The same year SiKtC smashed the market with almost a quarter million sales, Demon Slayer sold I think 12 million volumes worldwide?

    It appears pretty clear that the problem goes a lot deeper than "much lore, no buy". There is something fundamentally wrong with the way comic books are marketed, presented, and written that makes them unappealing to the average buyer. No continuity reboot is gonna fix that, as evidence by the fact that no continuity reboot has ever worked in the past, and comics without long term continuity aren't selling all that well either.

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    Default Re: BisectedBrioche's Brilliant Bread Random Banter Bthread #243

    Resigned Disappointment: It is possible to purchase sugar-free Jelly Bellys and a bag of nothing but grass-flavored Jelly Bellys.

    It is not possible to buy both.
    Quote Originally Posted by Rynjin View Post
    Something is Killing the Children
    What's that about? I keep seeing it around but I can't find any info on it.
    I also answer to Bookmark and Shadow Claw.

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    Default Re: BisectedBrioche's Brilliant Bread Random Banter Bthread #243

    Quote Originally Posted by BisectedBrioche View Post
    OK, I hope I'm doing this right! I've been waiting for an opportunity since I realised my handle alliterates with banter.
    Quote Originally Posted by BisectedBrioche
    Banter Bthread
    You did it the most right!
    Cuthalion's art is the prettiest art of all the art. Like my avatar.

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    Default Re: BisectedBrioche's Brilliant Bread Random Banter Bthread #243

    So anyway today is the first day of March. Wow, February was a very quick month.
    It's time to get my Magikarp on!

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    Default Re: BisectedBrioche's Brilliant Bread Random Banter Bthread #243

    "All your favorite series are in a weekly magazine, and you can buy those weekly chapters as a collected volume, eight chapters or so per book" is basically perfect market play for comics, and that more than anything is probably why manga is more successful than western comics.

    Demon Slayer would not have drawn nearly as much attention if it wasn't in the same book as One Piece and people were like "I might as well read this since it is on the way to One Piece". That's the power of Jump Magazine, and things like it, and modern western comics could basically... not ever do this now. Which is ironic because it kinda used to be like this! Superman didn't originate in Superman, he originated in Action Comics 1, an anthology of sorts.
    Last edited by LaZodiac; 2023-03-01 at 09:40 AM.

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    Default Re: BisectedBrioche's Brilliant Bread Random Banter Bthread #243

    Quote Originally Posted by Rater202 View Post
    What's that about? I keep seeing it around but I can't find any info on it.
    Invisible monsters are stalking and killing humanity (mostly children, as they're easy prey; also children can see them and this bothers the monsters), main character is part of some Men in Black-esque organization that undergoes training and woo woo magic stuff to be able to see and fight them while also covering up everything.

    I only read the first arc, it was okay. Speaking of manga comparisons, yeah...tell me if you've heard basically that exact description before from a thousand D-grade Shonen Jump series that never make it past 30 chapters.

    The ending of the first arc tells a relatively satisfying, mostly complete story and I basically just hopped off after that point because I thought the pacing was pretty awful frankly. It's really good in the first two issues, as the mysteries slowly unfold and there's this unsettling stalking from and of the monster...but as per usual it's really hard to maintain suspense once you actually SHOW the monster, and after that the horror vibe completely dissipates with it becoming pretty much a straight action series for the next 3 issues.

    And that's after reading them back to back. I really don't know how people managed to maintain interest with those issues releasing over 5 MONTHS.

    Art's nice though.
    Last edited by Rynjin; 2023-03-01 at 09:48 AM.

  8. - Top - End - #8
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    Default Re: BisectedBrioche's Brilliant Bread Random Banter Bthread #243

    Quote Originally Posted by Rynjin View Post
    Invisible monsters are stalking and killing humanity (mostly children, as they're easy prey; also children can see them and this bothers the monsters), main character is part of some Men in Black-esque organization that undergoes training and woo woo magic stuff to be able to see and fight them while also covering up everything.

    I only read the first arc, it was okay. Speaking of manga comparisons, yeah...tell me if you've heard basically that exact description before from a thousand D-grade Shonen Jump series that never make it past 30 chapters.

    The ending of the first arc tells a relatively satisfying, mostly complete story and I basically just hopped off after that point because I thought the pacing was pretty awful frankly. It's really good in the first two issues, as the mysteries slowly unfold and there's this unsettling stalking from and of the monster...but as per usual it's really hard to maintain suspense once you actually SHOW the monster, and after that the horror vibe completely dissipates with it becoming pretty much a straight action series for the next 3 issues.

    And that's after reading them back to back. I really don't know how people managed to maintain interest with those issues releasing over 5 MONTHS.

    Art's nice though.
    Hey now, sometimes those D-grade Jump series last 205 chapters instead of those 30. Some ****ing how.

    Sounds generically neat though. Worth looking at the first arc.

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    Default Re: BisectedBrioche's Brilliant Bread Random Banter Bthread #243

    Could you people stop saying "Western Comics" when you mean "American Comics"? It's annoying.
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    Default Re: BisectedBrioche's Brilliant Bread Random Banter Bthread #243

    If you read further, tell me how it is. Some intrigue was set up for the second arc but I wasn't quite interested enough to see about the slow burn since it seemed like it was going a "we return to status quo for now but at the end of every arc this subplot will advance" route.

    Quote Originally Posted by Fyraltari View Post
    Could you people stop saying "Western Comics" when you mean "American Comics"? It's annoying.
    I don't mean American comics. There's plenty of ones from the UK, France, and other countries that fit the same bill, but worse. Nobody gives a **** about them.
    Last edited by Rynjin; 2023-03-01 at 09:54 AM.

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    Default Re: BisectedBrioche's Brilliant Bread Random Banter Bthread #243

    Quote Originally Posted by Fyraltari View Post
    Could you people stop saying "Western Comics" when you mean "American Comics"? It's annoying.
    I prefer "New World comics".
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    Default Re: BisectedBrioche's Brilliant Bread Random Banter Bthread #243

    Also, this thread title is going to make me hungry every time, isn't it?
    Quote Originally Posted by Peelee View Post
    I prefer "New World comics".
    Hell, half the time you* mean "American superhero comics" which isn't the entire production.

    *general, not you, Peelee.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fyraltari View Post
    Hell, half the time you* mean "American superhero comics" which isn't the entire production.

    *general, not you, Peelee.
    I mean what the general public would conceive of when they hear "comic book", yes. I'm not comparing Garfield or Asterix sales here, there's a clear context to this conversation.

    "American superhero" is a genre, and the most popular, but the one I was just talking about doesn't even fall into said genre. People (in general) still don't care about it.
    Last edited by Rynjin; 2023-03-01 at 09:57 AM.

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    Default Re: BisectedBrioche's Brilliant Bread Random Banter Bthread #243

    Quote Originally Posted by Fyraltari View Post
    Also, this thread title is going to make me hungry every time, isn't it?

    Hell, half the time you* mean "American superhero comics" which isn't the entire production.

    *general, not you, Peelee.
    Agreed. Generally if i express interest in comics is either DC Silver Age or Star Wars. And Star Wars comics are difficult to fet into whej you're starting out.
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    Default Re: BisectedBrioche's Brilliant Bread Random Banter Bthread #243

    Mmmm, new bthread smell. ...for some reason I now find myself wanting to go to my local bakery.
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    Default Re: BisectedBrioche's Brilliant Bread Random Banter Bthread #243

    Quote Originally Posted by Fyraltari View Post
    Could you people stop saying "Western Comics" when you mean "American Comics"? It's annoying.
    Tbh I do it because the UK comics industry is basically dead. I don't remember anything being easily available when I was a kid bar the Dandy and the Beano (home of the real Dennis the Menace), not even 2000AD, and I'm not sure even they get physically released anymore.

    Quote Originally Posted by Rynjin View Post
    "American superhero" is a genre, and the most popular, but the one I was just talking about doesn't even fall into said genre. People (in general) still don't care about it.
    Speak for yourself, IME it was always the humour comics that were popular over here.
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    Default Re: BisectedBrioche's Brilliant Bread Random Banter Bthread #243

    Quote Originally Posted by Anonymouswizard View Post
    Speak for yourself, IME it was always the humour comics that were popular over here.
    Most of the humor comics people like are comic STRIPS ("funnies"), not comic books. There are a few exceptions (like the aforementioned Asterix), but for the most part comic books fall into different genres.

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    Default Re: BisectedBrioche's Brilliant Bread Random Banter Bthread #243

    Quote Originally Posted by Rynjin View Post
    I don't mean American comics. There's plenty of ones from the UK, France, and other countries that fit the same bill, but worse. Nobody gives a **** about them.
    That's just not true. American superhero stuff is the one genre that requires 60 years of lore to parse and has each character have stories publusihed in three different series simultaneously, series that all need to print one issue a month. Most comic books are one-and-done.
    Quote Originally Posted by Rynjin View Post
    I mean what the general public would conceive of when they hear "comic book", yes. I'm not comparing Garfield or Asterix sales here, there's a clear context to this conversation.

    "American superhero" is a genre, and the most popular, but the one I was just talking about doesn't even fall into said genre. People (in general) still don't care about it.
    I think this might come down to different cultural views on coming books.
    Quote Originally Posted by Anonymouswizard View Post
    Tbh I do it because the UK comics industry is basically dead. I don't remember anything being easily available when I was a kid bar the Dandy and the Beano (home of the real Dennis the Menace), not even 2000AD, and I'm not sure even they get physically released anymore.
    It's my understanding that pretty much all of the U.K.'s publishing industry is especially borked these days.
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    Default Re: BisectedBrioche's Brilliant Bread Random Banter Bthread #243

    Quote Originally Posted by Fyraltari View Post
    That's just not true. American superhero stuff is the one genre that requires 60 years of lore to parse and has each character have stories publusihed in three different series simultaneously, series that all need to print one issue a month. Most comic books are one-and-done.
    Okay? I'm not sure how this is a counterpoint to what I'm saying here. Are any of those one-and-dones you mentioned actually selling well or do people not care about them?

    My entire point is that the lore here isn't the issue. People just don't care about comic books mostly.

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    Default Re: BisectedBrioche's Brilliant Bread Random Banter Bthread #243

    I'm not sure how typical I am, but a big reason I stopped regularly reading Marvel (I never read DC that regularly to begin with, but they have the same problem) was a feeling that nothing lasted. The obvious example are characters coming back from the dead, but it's equally true about almost any other changes big or small (there are exceptions, but they are very few), whether it's by an actual reboot or just a later writer having a different idea. I get why it is like that, a lot of superhero comics have been published for decades and will probably be published for decades to come, but it does make it hard for me to care about what happens.

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    Default Re: BisectedBrioche's Brilliant Bread Random Banter Bthread #243

    Ah, new Bthread. Exquisite.

    Anyway, comics have always been a niche thing even among the big names. Theyre fairly expensive and, frankly, people can often get much better media for their money.
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    Default Re: BisectedBrioche's Brilliant Bread Random Banter Bthread #243

    Quote Originally Posted by Rynjin View Post
    Most of the humor comics people like are comic STRIPS ("funnies"), not comic books. There are a few exceptions (like the aforementioned Asterix), but for the most part comic books fall into different genres.
    Despite me having named the two most popular comic books in the UK, both humour anthologies?

    Maybe different cultures have different dominant genres?

    Quote Originally Posted by Fyraltari View Post
    It's my understanding that pretty much all of the U.K.'s publishing industry is especially borked these days.
    Hey! Our indie TV and radio drama industries are slightly healthier than the US's.
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    Default Re: BisectedBrioche's Brilliant Bread Random Banter Bthread #243

    Quote Originally Posted by Rynjin View Post
    Okay? I'm not sure how this is a counterpoint to what I'm saying here. Are any of those one-and-dones you mentioned actually selling well or do people not care about them?
    I'm trying to find online figures to share, but pretty much, yeah.
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    Default Re: BisectedBrioche's Brilliant Bread Random Banter Bthread #243

    Quote Originally Posted by Anonymouswizard View Post
    Despite me having named the two most popular comic books in the UK, both humour anthologies?

    Maybe different cultures have different dominant genres?
    Donald Duck is pretty much his own dominant genre in Austria. At least, he used to be, dunno about contemporary.
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    Default Re: BisectedBrioche's Brilliant Bread Random Banter Bthread #243

    Quote Originally Posted by Anonymouswizard View Post
    Maybe different cultures have different dominant genres?
    I mean, it seems like (US)Americans have a much dimmer view of comic books than Europeans in general, seeing them as kid stuuf rather than an art form/legitimate medium in its own right. I suspect that's related to the industry over there being dominated by two giants who have insisted on milking the same characters for sixty years nonstop, but there's probably more to it.

    Hey! Our indie TV and radio drama industries are slightly healthier than the US's.
    I said publishing as in literature, non-fiction books, comic books and the written press.
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    Default Re: BisectedBrioche's Brilliant Bread Random Banter Bthread #243

    Quote Originally Posted by Fyraltari View Post
    Could you people stop saying "Western Comics" when you mean "American Comics"? It's annoying.
    I want to be clear that I was absolutely combining all non-manga into a grab bag of "Western comics" since my understanding of the discussion is that it was arguing the differences in sales- which are true. While I can't say anything myself for how well Asterisk sells, on a whole I was under the impression that comics weren't that profitible, except for Manga. If I was discussing the continuity snarl problems and the constant shift of writer, artist, and editor, I'd have specified cape comics.

    If that's incorrect, do advise.

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    Mmmm, new bthread smell. ...for some reason I now find myself wanting to go to my local bakery.
    God the local Japanese bakery closed a couple years ago and I've been longing for freshly baked bread oh nooo I'm die.
    Last edited by LaZodiac; 2023-03-01 at 10:47 AM.

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    Default Re: BisectedBrioche's Brilliant Bread Random Banter Bthread #243

    I tried the New 52 Teen Titans run. Less than 5 issues in we go into a crossover event with two other series I never heard of and had no desire to read to get the full story. It was also apparently a really bad crossover anyway.

    I tried one of the Guardians of the Galaxy books. Within the first 5 issues or so Starlord reveals he put his team under mind control to get them to work together and the team immediately breaks up. Which is a fair reaction but why the **** is THIS how you start your team book?!

    I dunno if I just picked like THE ABSOLUTE WORST RUNS EVER by sheer coincidence but I have no desire to pick out a third series to try. 52's first issue was actually pretty good but I didn't buy the next, so...

    Quote Originally Posted by Anonymouswizard View Post
    Hey! Our indie TV and radio drama industries are slightly healthier than the US's.
    Okay but that's not saying much.
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    Default Re: BisectedBrioche's Brilliant Bread Random Banter Bthread #243

    Quote Originally Posted by LaZodiac View Post
    I want to be clear that I was absolutely combining all non-manga into a grab bag of "Western comics" since my understanding of the discussion is that it was arguing the differences in sales- which are true. While I can't say anything myself for how well Asterisk sells, on a whole I was under the impression that comics weren't that profitible, except for Manga.

    If that's incorrect, do advise.
    Quote Originally Posted by Google
    The revenue from comic and graphic novel sales in North America reached 2.075 billion U.S. dollars in 2021, up significantly from the 1.28 billion U.S. dollars in 2020.
    That's revenue, not profits, but given how the comic scene is quite vibrant, i would imagine its not the bare-bones market toure making it out to be.
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    Default Re: BisectedBrioche's Brilliant Bread Random Banter Bthread #243

    Quote Originally Posted by HalfTangible View Post
    I tried the New 52 Teen Titans run. Less than 5 issues in we go into a crossover event with two other series I never heard of and had no desire to read to get the full story. It was also apparently a really bad crossover anyway.

    I tried one of the Guardians of the Galaxy books. Within the first 5 issues or so Starlord reveals he put his team under mind control to get them to work together and the team immediately breaks up. Which is a fair reaction but why the **** is THIS how you start your team book?!

    I dunno if I just picked like THE ABSOLUTE WORST RUNS EVER by sheer coincidence but I have no desire to pick out a third series to try. 52's first issue was actually pretty good but I didn't buy the next, so...



    Okay but that's not saying much.
    By all accounts you did in fact pick up the two worst books of the New 52, is my understanding. Oops.

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    Default Re: BisectedBrioche's Brilliant Bread Random Banter Bthread #243

    Quote Originally Posted by Peelee View Post
    Donald Duck is pretty much his own dominant genre in Austria. At least, he used to be, dunno about contemporary.
    Yeah, that is (or was) the case here in Sweden as well, as I understand it they do better in Europe than in their native US.

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