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  1. - Top - End - #271
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    Default Re: Overwatch: Thread of the Game

    Quote Originally Posted by Keltest View Post
    Do you have anything that can check your CPU temperature? The fact that performance is worse in the heat makes me think that maybe your fans aren't working as well as they should, or that there is some other problem with its heat dispersal.
    I cleaned them very recently. It's just that the computer is fairly old, particularly the CPU (which is vastly dated compared to the GPU) and the summer temperatures are also affecting it. I'm bottlenecked by specs, not by the fans themselves, especially considering that my OW experience wasn't much better in the winter. Nothing is wrong with my fans per se; the computer is just tanking extremely. I was used to lukewarm performance, but now it's barely playable. I guess I could get some external heatsink stuff, but it's mostly just running on a toaster. It does heat up quite a lot, to like 60-70*C when OW is on, but I always figured it fairly understandable given that I'm very much a low-spec player. It used to do that before as well, except the game worked better.
    Last edited by Winthur; 2018-07-26 at 03:00 PM.
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  2. - Top - End - #272
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    Default Re: Overwatch: Thread of the Game

    Quote Originally Posted by Winthur View Post
    In other news I can't even play Wrecking Ball because Blizzard keeps making the game more bloated with each new patch and turning OW on, especially with the heat outside, drops me to 10 FPS whereas I used to enjoy a fairly stable 60-70 FPS on lowest settings. I reinstalled the game, removed all the caches possible and tried to "fresh" install while setting up a Draconian regime of my available RAM, but to no avail - my CPU bottlenecks me like crazy.
    I admittedly have a beast of a gaming PC, so perhaps my input should be taken with a grain of salt, but I have yet to see any profound frame-rate drops for Overwatch. Network latency problems? Sure. But I'm at a stable 60 FPs on my 2560x1440 display. I'd suggest that if you're suffering so badly that you're dipping down to 10 FPS, then yes, it's time for an upgrade.

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    Default Re: Overwatch: Thread of the Game

    Quote Originally Posted by Mutazoia View Post
    So, after playing with the new Symetria changes for a while, I have to say....meh.
    I agree with all of this. While I definitely need more practice with the new teleporter, I really think the only way in which her kit is better now is how she can throw her turrets. Honestly I would rather they just take that and add it to Symmetra 2.0 (while still letting her have 6 turrets). I guess the faster orbs are nice, but not at the cost of being unable to penetrate barriers. Not impressed with her new ult at all.

    I'll admit I was getting a little bored with Symmetra after 50+ hours with her, but I'm not happy with her rework at all, and probably will play her very rarely now.

    Oh well, at least Wrecking Ball is fun.


    Quote Originally Posted by Rynjin View Post
    Golly, sounds like she's a Support class or something.

    wait
    Symmetra was pretty much support in name only before. I'm pretty sure the only reason the developers resisted moving her to Defense was to prove their point that support =/= healing.

    These days she's not even support in name anymore, as she was moved to the Damage category with her latest rework.
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    Default Re: Overwatch: Thread of the Game

    Quote Originally Posted by Velaryon View Post
    I agree with all of this. While I definitely need more practice with the new teleporter, I really think the only way in which her kit is better now is how she can throw her turrets. Honestly I would rather they just take that and add it to Symmetra 2.0 (while still letting her have 6 turrets). I guess the faster orbs are nice, but not at the cost of being unable to penetrate barriers. Not impressed with her new ult at all.
    Symmetra's design kind of mandates that she be either very weak or wildly overpowered. If you make her tools effective, she dominates the entire game, if you don't, she doesn't. In her original packaging, she was an IQ test for the enemy team, now it seems like she's an IQ test for both the enemy team and a friendly team (ie: Can you make good use of her teleporter, and can the enemy manage to avoid slow projectiles and weedy turrets).

    I'll admit I was getting a little bored with Symmetra after 50+ hours with her, but I'm not happy with her rework at all, and probably will play her very rarely now.

    Oh well, at least Wrecking Ball is fun.
    She's much, much harder to use, and pretty much requires team voice communication now, and a team which will let Sym do shotcalling (and pray the shot-calls aren't wrong). I make it to be a nerf overall, at least if you interpret the outcome of a reduced pick rate as a nerf.

    Symmetra was pretty much support in name only before. I'm pretty sure the only reason the developers resisted moving her to Defense was to prove their point that support =/= healing.

    These days she's not even support in name anymore, as she was moved to the Damage category with her latest rework.
    Her teleporter and shield barrier had a fair bit of support utility, making your team harder to kill and quicker to respawn after a death. And that, to be frank, is really why they re-worked her: Torb/Brig/Sym made everyone into a tank. Just another way that Brig's introduction hosed up the Overwatch design space. I make it that Symmetra was edited out of the game specifically so that Brig didn't have to be taken out and reworked instead. In defense of the dev team, however, Symmetra was never very good, so a rework isn't indefensible.

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    Default Re: Overwatch: Thread of the Game

    Quote Originally Posted by The_Jackal View Post
    She's much, much harder to use, and pretty much requires team voice communication now, and a team which will let Sym do shotcalling (and pray the shot-calls aren't wrong). I make it to be a nerf overall, at least if you interpret the outcome of a reduced pick rate as a nerf.
    I agree that overall it's a nerf, and one which I don't think was warranted. Neo-Symmetra has some interesting possibilities, sure, but I find her primary fire, secondary fire, and ultimate underwhelming. At least she's more viable on attack now, whereas previously the majority of the time I considered her a throw pick on attack.


    Her teleporter and shield barrier had a fair bit of support utility, making your team harder to kill and quicker to respawn after a death. And that, to be frank, is really why they re-worked her: Torb/Brig/Sym made everyone into a tank. Just another way that Brig's introduction hosed up the Overwatch design space. I make it that Symmetra was edited out of the game specifically so that Brig didn't have to be taken out and reworked instead. In defense of the dev team, however, Symmetra was never very good, so a rework isn't indefensible.
    She was about as much a support character as Torbjorn or Sombra was (arguably less than Sombra). Under the old way of organizing, I'd describer her as a defense/support hybrid, leaning about 60/40 toward defense. As I've said, I think the main reason the developers were reluctant to reclassify her as defense is because they wanted to have a non-healer support character.

    I agree that Torb/Brig/Sym made for some quite durable teammates... and yet Symmetra's pick rate was supposedly terrible, so I guess it wasn't such a big deal after all? Much like when they crapped all over Lucio's speed boost, I think they solved the "problem" the wrong way.
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    Default Re: Overwatch: Thread of the Game

    The DVA short was pretty good! I've always been a fan of her since she is similar to a character I made for a TTRPG. I know people have wanted more DVA lore but I'm not sure if this is what they were asking for. We get to see (I think) that her superstar persona is just that, a facade put on for the benefit of the public. Most fan ficiton I've read has treated her status as a soldier pretty seriously, but it should be interesting to see if this shifts anything with her usual characterization.

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    Default Re: Overwatch: Thread of the Game

    Quote Originally Posted by solidork View Post
    The DVA short was pretty good! I've always been a fan of her since she is similar to a character I made for a TTRPG. I know people have wanted more DVA lore but I'm not sure if this is what they were asking for. We get to see (I think) that her superstar persona is just that, a facade put on for the benefit of the public. Most fan ficiton I've read has treated her status as a soldier pretty seriously, but it should be interesting to see if this shifts anything with her usual characterization.
    Its interesting to me that I kind of caught a whiff of PTSD in some of her character there. Maybe im just imagining things, but she seems to have a bit of unhealthy need-to-be-prepared-ness to her.
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  8. - Top - End - #278
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    Default Re: Overwatch: Thread of the Game

    Quote Originally Posted by Keltest View Post
    Its interesting to me that I kind of caught a whiff of PTSD in some of her character there. Maybe im just imagining things, but she seems to have a bit of unhealthy need-to-be-prepared-ness to her.
    It's an interesting choice of direction for her characterization, moving D,Va from a kind of meme-ish meta-character into a workaholic who carries the weight of the world on her shoulders. For one, her living a self-destructive lifestyle is a neat play on a character who self-destructs as her most iconic ability. It also alludes to the kind of burn out in the Korean professional gaming and idol industries which are overwhelmingly populated by teenagers and early 20-somethings that D.Va is the personification of, and for a lot of those involved is fairly unrewarding relative to the extreme costs it exerts.

    Quote Originally Posted by solidork View Post
    The DVA short was pretty good! I've always been a fan of her since she is similar to a character I made for a TTRPG. I know people have wanted more DVA lore but I'm not sure if this is what they were asking for. We get to see (I think) that her superstar persona is just that, a facade put on for the benefit of the public. Most fan ficiton I've read has treated her status as a soldier pretty seriously, but it should be interesting to see if this shifts anything with her usual characterization.
    I was half-expecting during the climax that she was going to yell "Nerf This!". Then I thought about it and how Hana Song in this short wouldn't. "Nerf This!" is a catch-phrase for her merchandise - you can see it all over the D.Va-branded junk food - it's not something a person would say while plummeting who-knows-how-many meters into the ocean to their likely death.

    I think the meme D.Va character in-game works for that specific reality - where it's an FPS with respawns and you fight clones of yourself wearing swimsuits for no particular reason - that meta it's-just-a-game attitude is fun. It's not so much in the lore sense where... well, she had to rushed to the hospital and defibrillated just to be alive after her Ultimate went off and no new mech would magically appear afterwards.

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    Default Re: Overwatch: Thread of the Game

    I've been messing around a lot in Mystery Heroes, and I just ruined a poor Mei's day with accidentally perfect timing on my charge.

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    Default Re: Overwatch: Thread of the Game

    Quote Originally Posted by Kitten Champion View Post
    It's an interesting choice of direction for her characterization, moving D,Va from a kind of meme-ish meta-character into a workaholic who carries the weight of the world on her shoulders. For one, her living a self-destructive lifestyle is a neat play on a character who self-destructs as her most iconic ability. It also alludes to the kind of burn out in the Korean professional gaming and idol industries which are overwhelmingly populated by teenagers and early 20-somethings that D.Va is the personification of, and for a lot of those involved is fairly unrewarding relative to the extreme costs it exerts.



    I was half-expecting during the climax that she was going to yell "Nerf This!". Then I thought about it and how Hana Song in this short wouldn't. "Nerf This!" is a catch-phrase for her merchandise - you can see it all over the D.Va-branded junk food - it's not something a person would say while plummeting who-knows-how-many meters into the ocean to their likely death.

    I think the meme D.Va character in-game works for that specific reality - where it's an FPS with respawns and you fight clones of yourself wearing swimsuits for no particular reason - that meta it's-just-a-game attitude is fun. It's not so much in the lore sense where... well, she had to rushed to the hospital and defibrillated just to be alive after her Ultimate went off and no new mech would magically appear afterwards.
    The short was cool, and I really liked that we finally got to see something more of D.Va. I just hope that they won't press that PTSD/exhausted angle too much. Overwatch already has plenty tired and world-weary characters, or characters who are haunted by their past with Soldier, Ana, Reaper, Hanzo and Bastion (if you count the omnic). D.Va's silly pro-gaming competitive spirit was actually a nice touch, and while there are plenty of super-competitive or silly fighters in media, D.Va manages to stand out through the unique combination of those traits.
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    Default Re: Overwatch: Thread of the Game

    Quote Originally Posted by GolemsVoice View Post
    The short was cool, and I really liked that we finally got to see something more of D.Va. I just hope that they won't press that PTSD/exhausted angle too much. Overwatch already has plenty tired and world-weary characters, or characters who are haunted by their past with Soldier, Ana, Reaper, Hanzo and Bastion (if you count the omnic). D.Va's silly pro-gaming competitive spirit was actually a nice touch, and while there are plenty of super-competitive or silly fighters in media, D.Va manages to stand out through the unique combination of those traits.
    I don't think the PTSD is that much of an issue, her comrades all did survive and the ending was - modestly - uplifting.

    For the short, having the other MEKA pilots be out of commission helped focus the work on D.VA and added to the sense of peril she was in because MEKA pilots have been seriously pummelled by the Gwui-shin before and the audience having this dramatized to us in a flashback from D.Va's perspective allows them to convey this to us economically. She's alone and her last mission didn't go well with five people.

    We've also never really seen the Korean part of the OW universe, it was described in limited detail within the fluff material but not dramatized in any way. So it helped establish the nature of that conflict, much like Reinhardt and Bastion's short gave a bit of context to the Omnic war in a way some flavour text on the wiki never could. Which is particularly important for D.Va because she's not really in the Overwatch sphere of characters - as in the in-universe organization and its members + those connected directly to them - much like the Junkers are their own thing and needed to be filled out more. and that D.Va mostly acts like a frivolous hyper-competitive cutesie gamer-girl in the game so you might assume she's more of a mascot character for the Korean military or her conflict is kind of trivial.

    An actual PTSD or burnout story is potentially interesting, but it doesn't really work without an advancing time-line to begin with and Overwatch has been snail-paced in developing its lore in general. I suspect they're thinking of a method which would make them the most money in the long-run, they are aware of the lucrative nature of this IP outside of gaming.

    I think it mostly established that there's a serious downside to being D.Va, which there wasn't really before. She's a character who everyone seemingly loves and doesn't really have any internal or external conflicts with the rest of the cast.

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    Default Re: Overwatch: Thread of the Game

    Back again, after a loooooong hiatus.
    I left a few weeks after Moira was released, so that was a while ago.

    Sunday's session (quickplay only) went very well. Not PotG, but pulled my weight and more.

    This morning? Not so much. But then I have a feeling that 7am on a work day it's basically only school kids playing. No, I am not dissing them, but I understand if you're 12 that teamwork might not be as high up as personal glory.

    Basically only playing three heroes: Lucio (my best), Junkrat and Moira. I am thinking about trying Brigitte. Swedish, and all that. ;)
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    Default Re: Overwatch: Thread of the Game

    I assume that you're in a low skill environment when you can win the game for the team by just trying to stay on the point for as long as you can rather than to fall back and regroup as Lucio or Moira...?
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    Default Re: Overwatch: Thread of the Game

    Quote Originally Posted by Avilan the Grey View Post
    I assume that you're in a low skill environment when you can win the game for the team by just trying to stay on the point for as long as you can rather than to fall back and regroup as Lucio or Moira...?
    Not necessarily. Ive seen a lot of videos where the enemy team gets tunnel vision and basically ignores the payload/point in favor of killing the enemy team over and over again, until they lose to somebody who camped on the payload while they were busy spawn camping.
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    Default Re: Overwatch: Thread of the Game

    Quote Originally Posted by Keltest View Post
    Not necessarily. Ive seen a lot of videos where the enemy team gets tunnel vision and basically ignores the payload/point in favor of killing the enemy team over and over again, until they lose to somebody who camped on the payload while they were busy spawn camping.
    In any event I am back after a very long hiatus and so far only doing quickplays until the next season starts.

    The reason for the hiatus was that I got rather tilted since (season 9?) my qualifications got frakked. 6 games in a row got ruined because of people deliberately quitting.
    It does seem better now. As in the whole environment seems a bit calmer and friendlier.

    Anyway I am the first one to admit that I am skilled enough to stay where I end up, but not skilled enough to do any serious climbing. Hopefully that will change
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    Default Re: Overwatch: Thread of the Game

    Quote Originally Posted by Avilan the Grey View Post
    In any event I am back after a very long hiatus and so far only doing quickplays until the next season starts.

    The reason for the hiatus was that I got rather tilted since (season 9?) my qualifications got frakked. 6 games in a row got ruined because of people deliberately quitting.
    It does seem better now. As in the whole environment seems a bit calmer and friendlier.

    Anyway I am the first one to admit that I am skilled enough to stay where I end up, but not skilled enough to do any serious climbing. Hopefully that will change
    I think Blizzard has seriously started cracking down on moderating bad play, and combined with the commendation stuff nets you a playerbase that will mostly at least pretend to be civil to each other.
    “Evil is evil. Lesser, greater, middling, it's all the same. Proportions are negotiated, boundaries blurred. I'm not a pious hermit, I haven't done only good in my life. But if I'm to choose between one evil and another, then I prefer not to choose at all.”

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    Default Re: Overwatch: Thread of the Game

    Quote Originally Posted by Keltest View Post
    I think Blizzard has seriously started cracking down on moderating bad play, and combined with the commendation stuff nets you a playerbase that will mostly at least pretend to be civil to each other.
    Yeah, it seems that way.

    Decent day today.
    Yeah I am nowadays a three trick pony instead of a one-trick pony but I am focusing on these three until I get good with them, because between them they work in basically all teams:

    Junkrat, Moira, Lucio.

    I am really falling in love with Moira atm, actually, but in Nepal and Greece no hero beats Lucio. I love love LOVE booping people out in thin air...
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    Default Re: Overwatch: Thread of the Game

    I recently got the game through humble bundle.

    And oh boy I am having fun with Brigitte. It remembers me of holy paladins with protection gear in Burning crusade.

    To the more competitive people is Brigitte a competitive character? I am guessing that being low level I get mostly paired with not so skilled people. But I am wondering if down the line I will be strongly countered. Mei is a pain, unless I get the drop on her, and Bastion (shooty mode) is annoying without cover other than those two I have been able to deal with mostly everything. (Winston sounds painful being a mobile tank, havent encountered any yet as an oponent)

    The other character I play the most is D.Va, basically to compensate lack of healer/tank in the team roster.
    Thanks a lot Gengy for the awesome... just a sec... avatar. :)

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    Default Re: Overwatch: Thread of the Game

    Quote Originally Posted by thethird View Post
    To the more competitive people is Brigitte a competitive character?
    Sure, she has the highest win-rate for Supports I believe.

    Realistically she's got numerous counters - engaging from sufficient range can deny most of her kit's power - so ideally you'd bring her out when facing dive heroes like Tracer or Winston who she's designed to counter or against a mirror brawl-oriented comp. Though reality is heavily subject to player skill differences.

    She's also considered cancerous by a segment of the community because of the ease of her shield-bash stun, the alacrity of her play-style overall while being perceived as over-tuned.

    Quote Originally Posted by thethird View Post
    The other character I play the most is D.Va, basically to compensate lack of healer/tank in the team roster.
    That's mostly why I started to play her for the majority of my beginning games. You can deal with things like a QM Bastion without team coordination with her and she can literally nullify a lot of Junkrat spam, which are kind of ubiquitous and actually still effective at the very beginning. Fortunately, D.Va never stops being relevant competitively and it's always useful to know how to play her well even if you drift off to other Heroes.

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    Default Re: Overwatch: Thread of the Game

    Baguette Lindorm is apparently according to all the "experts" on Youtube completely and utterly broken and the most OP thing that has ever existed.

    ...I also see* her played far less than you would think if that was the case. Me smells clickbait and / or rage rants.

    *As in see (or rather NOT see) her not only in my own pathetically bad games but on Twitch and Youtube among much better players. That said she gets played a lot but not more than Rein used to be, and he was "essential", not "OP".
    Last edited by Avilan the Grey; 2018-09-09 at 11:53 PM.
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    Default Re: Overwatch: Thread of the Game

    Brig is in that area where she is more or less balanced but very unfun to play against one of equal skill as you.

    She also directly counters a couple of the heroes that previously had no counters, so playeres who mained those characters never had to switch and now they do.

    These facts have lead to a LOT of salt being poured into the internet.

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    Default Re: Overwatch: Thread of the Game

    Quote Originally Posted by chainer1216 View Post
    Brig is in that area where she is more or less balanced but very unfun to play against one of equal skill as you.

    She also directly counters a couple of the heroes that previously had no counters, so playeres who mained those characters never had to switch and now they do.

    These facts have lead to a LOT of salt being poured into the internet.
    So basically she is now like almost all other supports and tanks? I don't see her more frustrating to play against than a Rein, a Hog or (god forbid) a Symetra of your own skill or higher.
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    Default Re: Overwatch: Thread of the Game

    Quote Originally Posted by Avilan the Grey View Post
    So basically she is now like almost all other supports and tanks? I don't see her more frustrating to play against than a Rein, a Hog or (god forbid) a Symetra of your own skill or higher.
    She can be immensely annoying for her propensity to shut down ults like Death Blossom or Whole Hog. That alone will cause some serious salt.
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    Default Re: Overwatch: Thread of the Game

    Quote Originally Posted by Keltest View Post
    She can be immensely annoying for her propensity to shut down ults like Death Blossom or Whole Hog. That alone will cause some serious salt.
    So in other words, she's good against the brainless.

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    Default Re: Overwatch: Thread of the Game

    Quote Originally Posted by Avilan the Grey View Post
    So basically she is now like almost all other supports and tanks? I don't see her more frustrating to play against than a Rein, a Hog or (god forbid) a Symetra of your own skill or higher.
    Brigitte has a 190 damage stunlock/animation cancel combo: Flail (35) cancel into Bash (50), Flail (35) then Whip (70). She's also got self-healing armor, meaning she's super-resilient versus chip damage.

    Also, there's no such thing as a Symmetra with skill, to say nothing of my own skill or higher.

    So in other words, she's good against the brainless.
    Her power is insane in solo-queue, but nearly worthless against a team with communication and coordination. She's basically replaced Roadhog as the solo-flanker carry, for the exact same reason: Against a team that's not mic'd up, she can hit your back-line and kill them before the enemy team can react. Yes, if your team actually sticks together and peels for each other, she's not that dangerous. How often do you get that team?

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    Default Re: Overwatch: Thread of the Game

    Quote Originally Posted by The_Jackal View Post
    Her power is insane in solo-queue, but nearly worthless against a team with communication and coordination. She's basically replaced Roadhog as the solo-flanker carry, for the exact same reason: Against a team that's not mic'd up, she can hit your back-line and kill them before the enemy team can react. Yes, if your team actually sticks together and peels for each other, she's not that dangerous. How often do you get that team?
    A Symetra or Hanzo with skill is truly terrifying. Sombra, too.
    I have not really had to deal with her as a flanker (Brigitte), but with the heroes I tend to play she's... not AS dangerous. Lucio is able to get away and / or flank himself. Or Boop. Moira has a heck of a range and also a good flanker with mobility if necessary. For both of those, at least on my level, I find Doomfist the worst one, so far. Admittedly I have barely played against him before my hiatus so he is still new to me.
    Also, at my very low skill level I get constantly hooked by Hog as Lucio, only to have them be completely surprised that I boop them off me easily.

    Things that makes you feel all warm and fuzzy inside: Taking down Pharah as Junkrat.
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    Default Re: Overwatch: Thread of the Game

    Quote Originally Posted by The_Jackal View Post
    Brigitte has a 190 damage stunlock/animation cancel combo: Flail (35) cancel into Bash (50), Flail (35) then Whip (70). She's also got self-healing armor, meaning she's super-resilient versus chip damage.
    I am actually working on finetunning that combo. That and using the bash to jump. One thing I found useful is that you can press both mouse buttons at the same time to bash "while" you raise the shield. I also find interesting that you can cancel animation on the ultimate (with the shield raising).

    Quote Originally Posted by Avilan the Grey View Post
    Things that makes you feel all warm and fuzzy inside: Taking down Pharah as Junkrat.
    Farah is annoying as hell with Brigitte, forgot to mention her, basically getting in range from here is not something that happens any time soon.

    For me the warm and fuzzy feeling is beating a Reinhardt at melee. Brigitte's ultimate gives a lot of self healing armor.
    Thanks a lot Gengy for the awesome... just a sec... avatar. :)

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    Default Re: Overwatch: Thread of the Game

    Quote Originally Posted by thethird View Post
    Farah is annoying as hell with Brigitte, forgot to mention her, basically getting in range from here is not something that happens any time soon.

    For me the warm and fuzzy feeling is beating a Reinhardt at melee. Brigitte's ultimate gives a lot of self healing armor.
    Yeah, I have a fundamental problem with a PVP game whose balance is built around such binary counters. "Swap off to someone the enemy can never even get near" is not a satisfying answer to me.

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    Default Re: Overwatch: Thread of the Game

    That pretty much comes down to Overwatch being a first person MOBA.

    At least you're not ****ed for 30 straight minutes because your pre-game pick is countered by the enemy team.

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    Default Re: Overwatch: Thread of the Game

    Quote Originally Posted by The_Jackal View Post
    Yeah, I have a fundamental problem with a PVP game whose balance is built around such binary counters. "Swap off to someone the enemy can never even get near" is not a satisfying answer to me.
    See, to me that makes a heck of a lot more sense than NOT doing it that way (besides they never have a single counter. A player over the skill level of "how do I move left" can in theory figure out how to counter any other hero except maybe Junkrat vs Pharah). The alternative would be a game where the individual heroes doesn't matter, and that would be well... as awful and unfun as PubG / Fortnite.

    Edit: And again, there are hard counters, and soft counters. Brigitte is only really difficult if a team is not working together. Otherwise she seems to die quite easily because the person playing her gets overconfident.

    1. Her shield only works forward.
    2. Said shields is only what? 600 points? That's about 3 hits with Junkrat balls before she loses it? Or 3 or 4 Pharah rockets? Or...
    3. Knockbacks works on her just like Rein even with the shield up. She flies quite well from a mine, for example.
    4. Moira has longer reach than her and can phase through a shield slam if quick enough
    5. Speaking of, her back is always unprotected. Just like Rein.
    6. etc. etc.
    Last edited by Avilan the Grey; 2018-09-11 at 01:04 AM.
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