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  1. - Top - End - #811
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    NecromancerGirl

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    Default Re: The LA-assignment Thread IV: Live Free or Hit Die Hard

    I like dragon eels, I really do, and the picture is nice, but to play... no. LA -0.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Keledrath View Post
    Libris: look at your allowed sources. I don't think any of your options were from those.
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  2. - Top - End - #812
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    Default Re: The LA-assignment Thread IV: Live Free or Hit Die Hard

    Give it a Shrieking ability and a stunning electrical AoE and an SLA to create sushi and water three times a day, and I'd start paying attention. Or, ooh, instead of making it more eel-y, make it more dragon-y! Dragons get a breath weapon, let's have the eel breathe ... um ... air.

    LA -0.
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  3. - Top - End - #813
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    OrcBarbarianGuy

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    Default Re: The LA-assignment Thread IV: Live Free or Hit Die Hard

    Quote Originally Posted by Dimers View Post
    Give it a Shrieking ability and a stunning electrical AoE and an SLA to create sushi and water three times a day, and I'd start paying attention. Or, ooh, instead of making it more eel-y, make it more dragon-y! Dragons get a breath weapon, let's have the eel breathe ... um ... air.

    LA -0.
    how about it shoots out a cone of water pressure?

    Anyways I looked ahead and i foresee dark times ahead, well at least maybe small storm elemental might be a +0...

  4. - Top - End - #814
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    GreatWyrmGold's Avatar

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    Default Re: The LA-assignment Thread IV: Live Free or Hit Die Hard

    Quote Originally Posted by No brains View Post
    I think Dunkleosteus and Dragons are plenty cool on their own. A mashup doesn't work. -0 LA
    It could if the dragons contributed anything more than an excuse to put them in a fantasy world (and superior hit dice, I guess). I mean, even the dragon turtle has a breath weapon, and they're basically at the bottom of the draconic totem pole alongside those little guys who just have stingers.


    Quote Originally Posted by Nifft View Post
    It's got seven visible limbs, but six of them are fins and the other one is a tail.
    *pseudobiology sense tingling*
    It has six limbs, like a dragon. Fins (specifically pectoral and pelvic) are limbs, as are those weird claw things that might or might not be limbs, but tails are not. Tails are just part of the vertebral column, no matter how useful they are.
    ...Yes, a pseudobiology sense is a terrible superpower. It mostly lets me identify young-Earth creationists slightly faster than normal.


    Quote Originally Posted by Dimers View Post
    Give it a Shrieking ability and a stunning electrical AoE and an SLA to create sushi and water three times a day, and I'd start paying attention. Or, ooh, instead of making it more eel-y, make it more dragon-y! Dragons get a breath weapon, let's have the eel breathe ... um ... air.
    Jokes aside...a bronze dragon/eel hybrid could be kinda neat. Though it'd need to work hard to differentiate itself from behirs...
    (And an air-breath-weapon dragon could be neat. Plenty of powerful mythical beings could command the winds to great effect; draw inspiration from that. Aerokinesis is useful for everything from sailing ships to putting out flaming grass.)
    I'm the GWG from Bay12 and a bunch of other places.

    Quote Originally Posted by The Blade Wolf View Post
    Ah, thank you very much GreatWyrmGold, you obviously live up to that name with your intelligence and wisdom with that post.
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  5. - Top - End - #815
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    NecromancerGirl

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    Default Re: The LA-assignment Thread IV: Live Free or Hit Die Hard

    Sound travels very well under water, and some whales are known to produce clicks as loud as 200 dB, which to me suggests dragon eels should have a line of sonic energy, to go with its blindsense. Maybe double the range underwater, to make it a bit more interesting.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Faily View Post
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    Quote Originally Posted by Keledrath View Post
    Libris: look at your allowed sources. I don't think any of your options were from those.
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  6. - Top - End - #816
    Firbolg in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: The LA-assignment Thread IV: Live Free or Hit Die Hard

    I really just meant that as a way to say "sucks that they not amphibious", but I like where y'all's heads are at.
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  7. - Top - End - #817
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    Default Re: The LA-assignment Thread IV: Live Free or Hit Die Hard

    Quote Originally Posted by ExLibrisMortis View Post
    Sound travels very well under water, and some whales are known to produce clicks as loud as 200 dB, which to me suggests dragon eels should have a line of sonic energy, to go with its blindsense. Maybe double the range underwater, to make it a bit more interesting.
    It could also have electricity powers, since it's an eel, and electric eels are a common trope. Perhaps its blindsense is related to electricity, as well as sonar? Oooo, perhaps it can muck up the magnetic reception organs in migratory birds, causing them to fly in circles until they fall from the sky in exhaustion -- at which point the Dragon Eel slurps up the lot of them.

    As far as breath weapons go, sonic is good, and electricity is a relatively safe choice because the Blue Dragons are far away in the deserts so nobody will fight them or file a breath weapon C&D trademark injunction.

  8. - Top - End - #818
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    OrcBarbarianGuy

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    Default Re: The LA-assignment Thread IV: Live Free or Hit Die Hard

    Quote Originally Posted by Nifft View Post
    It could also have electricity powers, since it's an eel, and electric eels are a common trope. Perhaps its blindsense is related to electricity, as well as sonar? Oooo, perhaps it can muck up the magnetic reception organs in migratory birds, causing them to fly in circles until they fall from the sky in exhaustion -- at which point the Dragon Eel slurps up the lot of them.

    As far as breath weapons go, sonic is good, and electricity is a relatively safe choice because the Blue Dragons are far away in the deserts so nobody will fight them or file a breath weapon C&D trademark injunction.
    I like where you are going with this, a breath weapon that can be Electric or sonic seems decent though it still won't be hitting +0 with just that at 14 hd of otherwise useless.

  9. - Top - End - #819
    Dwarf in the Playground
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    Default Re: The LA-assignment Thread IV: Live Free or Hit Die Hard

    Quote Originally Posted by GreatWyrmGold View Post
    *pseudobiology sense tingling*
    It has six limbs, like a dragon. Fins (specifically pectoral and pelvic) are limbs, as are those weird claw things that might or might not be limbs, but tails are not. Tails are just part of the vertebral column, no matter how useful they are.
    ...Yes, a pseudobiology sense is a terrible superpower. It mostly lets me identify young-Earth creationists slightly faster than normal.

    Detect Terminal Stupidity is an underrated class feature.

  10. - Top - End - #820
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    Default Re: The LA-assignment Thread IV: Live Free or Hit Die Hard

    Quote Originally Posted by Random Sanity View Post
    Detect Terminal Stupidity is an underrated class feature.
    The difference between detect terminal stupidity and detect pseudobiology is like the difference between detect evil and detect goblins. The latter lets you find some of the more annoying examples of the former, but it doesn't help with other annoying examples, nor with the really dangerous ones. (And even then, detect terminal stupidity and detect evil don't work on finding either in the place you need to watch out for them the most—your own mind and soul.)
    I'm the GWG from Bay12 and a bunch of other places.

    Quote Originally Posted by The Blade Wolf View Post
    Ah, thank you very much GreatWyrmGold, you obviously live up to that name with your intelligence and wisdom with that post.
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  11. - Top - End - #821
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    Default Re: The LA-assignment Thread IV: Live Free or Hit Die Hard

    Dread Blossom Swarm


    It's... a swarm of blood-sucking, flying, extraplanar plants. Not sure what else to say here.

    7 plant RHD are obviously never good. Plant immunities are nice, swarm immunities a mixed bag (not being able to receive buffs isn't cool). Ability scores disappoint, with abysmal strength and charisma, average wisdom, moderate dexterity and constitution and nonexistent intelligence (note that the latter, combined with being a swarm, means that making this playable is actually kinda difficult).

    Half damage from piercing and slashing weapons is nice, though being Tiny means the blossoms miss out on the far more useful immunity to weapon damage. Between Distraction and Poison Pollen anything that gets to close is very possibly going to lose actions, though it should be noted that the latter isn't friendly, affects a relatively large area, and can't be turned off. Try and find yourself a poison-immune party.

    The swarm's main mode of attack is a pitiful 2d6 swarm damage, as well as a 1d6 constitution blood drain that only works against immobile targets (nauseated doesn't count, paralyzed does). Neither of those is very deadly, but that's okay as the swarm is more of a BFC character anyway.

    Another notable ability is Regeneration 5, overcome only by cold and fire damage.

    Finally, the melee bouquet gets three bonus feats. Ability Focus (Poison Pollen) is something most would probably pick up anyway, Lightning Reflexes isn't great but nice to get for free, and Alertness would be nearly useless if Spot and Listen weren't two of its three only class skills.


    What to make of the dread blossom swarm? It's got a very useful, no-action, AoE support ability that'll cripple many a foe (at least before poison immunity becomes commonplace) but it hits allies too and can't be turned off. Furthermore, while a swarm can be granted an intelligence score with some shenanigans, it won't be easy or cheap. Then there's the usual issues of being incapable of using/wearing/wielding most items, except worse because instead of relatively humanoid animals this swarm consists of limbless flowers.

    With the dread blossom swarm's only significant non-defensive ability so easily negated, and the plethora of logistical issues involved with playing one, -0 LA should be perfectly balanced.
    Last edited by Inevitability; 2018-07-01 at 01:46 AM.
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  12. - Top - End - #822
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    Default Re: The LA-assignment Thread IV: Live Free or Hit Die Hard

    Quote Originally Posted by Inevitability View Post
    [CENTER]Dread Blossom Swarm

    It's... a swarm of blood-sucking, flying, extraplanar plants. Not sure what else to say here.
    Warblade 1 for Hunter's Sense, and the roses can stop and smell YOU.

    Quote Originally Posted by Inevitability View Post
    7 plant RHD are obviously never good. Plant immunities are nice, swarm immunities a mixed bag (not being able to receive buffs isn't cool). Ability scores disappoint, with abysmal strength and charisma, average wisdom, moderate dexterity and constitution and nonexistent intelligence (note that the latter, combined with being a swarm, means that making this playable is actually kinda difficult).
    7 plant HD could be overcome.

    The drain on immobile foes could be leveraged by a party immune to poison and good at lock-down, through spells or grappling or from their own poison.

    But no targeted buffs ever? That's worse than lacking Int or thumbs.

    Verdict: LA --, send flowers.

  13. - Top - End - #823
    Barbarian in the Playground
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    Default Re: The LA-assignment Thread IV: Live Free or Hit Die Hard

    7 Plant RHD, net -6 abilities in addition to having to fix the Int of "-", +1 natural AC; having no ground speed can be surprisingly distressing in adverse conditions, and your attacks are standard Swarm distraction (Nausea/easily made Concentration check), Con Drain, and a Poison that also flatlines versus protection against Paralysis (IE most things of ECL 10+). That is before you get into the grist of trying to equip a Tiny swarm with no manipulators and a body that is basically a swirl of flowers.

    For this, you get solid Regeneration, decent Fly speed, half damage from piercing and slashing, (mediore, Tiny) Swarm Traits, and a few specific bonus feats.

    Going to go with LA -0. Even in a group with immunity to all your abilities, you are still sucking up 7 Plant RHD to make use of your very limited abilities; if you are that desperate for Plant traits, go grab the weak if serviceable Woodling template. If you can get a manipulator you can be a caster, then ask yourself why you picked something with 7 RHD, -8 Cha, +0 Wis and needs to get Int from an effect. There is no point to playing this unless you are banking on its special abilities, and those will be played out somewhere between CR 10 and 12 for 90%+ of enemy encounters. An emphatic hard pass.
    Last edited by ViperMagnum357; 2018-06-30 at 04:33 PM.

  14. - Top - End - #824
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    Celestia's Avatar

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    Default Re: The LA-assignment Thread IV: Live Free or Hit Die Hard

    Definitely -0. It is virtually unplayable, and there is no way to advance it.
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  15. - Top - End - #825
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    Default Re: The LA-assignment Thread IV: Live Free or Hit Die Hard

    What's a BFC character?

  16. - Top - End - #826
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    Default Re: The LA-assignment Thread IV: Live Free or Hit Die Hard

    Quote Originally Posted by Caelestion View Post
    What's a BFC character?
    BFC = battlefield control, usually applied to spells, but this character would be an area which attacks so that's probably it.

  17. - Top - End - #827
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    NecromancerGirl

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    Default Re: The LA-assignment Thread IV: Live Free or Hit Die Hard

    Must be -0. Can't use items, and a simple gust of wind basically puts you out for the count.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Faily View Post
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    Quote Originally Posted by Keledrath View Post
    Libris: look at your allowed sources. I don't think any of your options were from those.
    My incarnate/crusader. A self-healing crowd-control melee build (ECL 8).
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  18. - Top - End - #828
    Bugbear in the Playground
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    Default Re: The LA-assignment Thread IV: Live Free or Hit Die Hard

    Going with -0 here.

    You're a melee BFC who can't use weapons, natural attacks, most items, targeted buffs(aka, nearly all of them), have 7 plant RHD, no scaling, cannot effectively go caster (you'd have issues with basically all kinds of components) even if we ignored the 7 plant RHD, and your three best options for attacks are unarmed swordsage, monk, and battle dancer - I think, swarms can use unarmed strikes, right?


    I don't think I'd play this if someone was playing me to do so.
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  19. - Top - End - #829
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    OrcBarbarianGirl

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    Default Re: The LA-assignment Thread IV: Live Free or Hit Die Hard

    Quote Originally Posted by Caelestion View Post
    What's a BFC character?
    Big Friggin'... uh, Chariot! Yeah!

    I think Thor rode one of those.
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    This thread, Questions that can't be answered... Answered by RAW by No brains, is Epic.
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    That is so stupid it's hilarious.
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    ...I've clearly been playing D&D for too long, because that made a demented kind of sense.
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  20. - Top - End - #830
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    MindFlayer

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    Default Re: The LA-assignment Thread IV: Live Free or Hit Die Hard

    Boy. If you overcome Int -, you basically inflict paralysis (hope party is immune poison) and nausea. You have good regeneration, so sending you in front might work out ok. Some enemies you near auto-lockdown, some you do 2d6 a round, ugh. And how do you progress? After ability focus, your abilities are great or worthless, and will be more the latter as you go up in levels. You have no skills or real abilities, you just move around and hope your side wins.

    Even if given Int 10/3d6 for free I don't see how this contributes and is enjoyable, -0 it is.

  21. - Top - End - #831
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    Default Re: The LA-assignment Thread IV: Live Free or Hit Die Hard

    I had a vague memory of the dread blossom swarm being, like, way OP for some reason. That said, actually looking at the abilities, it doesn't look like this is something that's going to be an especially OP PC against anything that can fight it. I have to agree with Covenant12's assessment of "You have no skills or real abilities, you just move around and hope your side wins."

    That picture is deceptive. Those things do not look like "foot-long crimson flowers." Unless that's maybe not a Medium critter they're sticking out of? But there's no way that blossom is a foot long. Especially not if the thorn/stem part is 6 inches.

    I think that this is truly beyond the powers of being fixed. Int --, no thumbs, flying swarm, cloud of save-or-lose but no advanceable abilities . . . I got nothing. I don't see how this can work. The dread blossom swarm wins against me. -0.

    I love that it has low-light vision rather than, like, blindsense.
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  22. - Top - End - #832
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    OrcBarbarianGuy

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    Default Re: The LA-assignment Thread IV: Live Free or Hit Die Hard

    ya that thing is no good -0 la indeed...

  23. - Top - End - #833
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    Default Re: The LA-assignment Thread IV: Live Free or Hit Die Hard

    Quote Originally Posted by Zaq View Post
    I had a vague memory of the dread blossom swarm being, like, way OP for some reason.
    Something something symbiotic template something something Savage Species something something.

  24. - Top - End - #834
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    NecromancerGirl

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    Default Re: The LA-assignment Thread IV: Live Free or Hit Die Hard

    If I had to advance it, I'd probably go with ardent/constructor. Wisdom is the one mental score that doesn't suck, manifesters don't manipulate any components, Practiced Manifester gets you some of your RHD back... not that it'd be a great constructor (for one, you need a custom mantle or two Expanded Knowledge feats to qualify), but you can create utility astral constructs to open doors for you, which is pretty cool. Use soulmelds to grab telepathy?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Faily View Post
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    Quote Originally Posted by Keledrath View Post
    Libris: look at your allowed sources. I don't think any of your options were from those.
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  25. - Top - End - #835
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    Default Re: The LA-assignment Thread IV: Live Free or Hit Die Hard

    Quote Originally Posted by ExLibrisMortis View Post
    Use soulmelds to grab telepathy?
    Bind it to your stem chakra.

  26. - Top - End - #836
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    Default Re: The LA-assignment Thread IV: Live Free or Hit Die Hard

    Quote Originally Posted by Inevitability View Post
    ...and nonexistent intelligence (note that the latter, combined with being a swarm, means that making this playable is actually kinda difficult).
    There's an argument to be made that the regeneration score has to represent growing new flowers rapidly, not just existing flowers knitting themselves back together. So a druid could theoretically awaken one (assuming that spell works on non-tree plants), let it grow alone in a field, and come back to a field of giant sentient edgelord roses who trace their lineage back to a floriarch who was granted life by the druid. Who they might therefore worship as a god.
    ...Which sounds like a heck of an adventure seed if the druid does the wrong stuff with their worshipers. But they wouldn't make good PCs.


    Quote Originally Posted by Nifft View Post
    Something something symbiotic template something something Savage Species something something.
    You know, using the symbiotic template with these bloodsucking flowers makes a lot more sense (and a much more interesting character design) than most applications of the template...
    I'm the GWG from Bay12 and a bunch of other places.

    Quote Originally Posted by The Blade Wolf View Post
    Ah, thank you very much GreatWyrmGold, you obviously live up to that name with your intelligence and wisdom with that post.
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  27. - Top - End - #837
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    Default Re: The LA-assignment Thread IV: Live Free or Hit Die Hard

    Quote Originally Posted by GreatWyrmGold View Post
    The difference between detect terminal stupidity and detect pseudobiology is like the difference between detect evil and detect goblins. The latter lets you find some of the more annoying examples of the former, but it doesn't help with other annoying examples, nor with the really dangerous ones. (And even then, detect terminal stupidity and detect evil don't work on finding either in the place you need to watch out for them the most—your own mind and soul.)
    Fair enough.


    Quote Originally Posted by Inevitability View Post
    [CENTER]Dread Blossom Swarm

    It's... a swarm of blood-sucking, flying, extraplanar plants. Not sure what else to say here.
    This is your Monster Manual on drugs. -0 and major props to anyone who can actually roleplay a sapient version of that.

  28. - Top - End - #838
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    Default Re: The LA-assignment Thread IV: Live Free or Hit Die Hard

    Quote Originally Posted by GreatWyrmGold View Post
    You know, using the symbiotic template with these bloodsucking flowers makes a lot more sense (and a much more interesting character design) than most applications of the template...
    Hivenest, maybe? If you can get your DM to allow a Tiny swarm.

  29. - Top - End - #839
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    Default Re: The LA-assignment Thread IV: Live Free or Hit Die Hard

    Quote Originally Posted by ExLibrisMortis View Post
    If I had to advance it, I'd probably go with ardent/constructor. Wisdom is the one mental score that doesn't suck, manifesters don't manipulate any components, Practiced Manifester gets you some of your RHD back... not that it'd be a great constructor (for one, you need a custom mantle or two Expanded Knowledge feats to qualify), but you can create utility astral constructs to open doors for you, which is pretty cool. Use soulmelds to grab telepathy?
    Can't realistically go incarnum - the only chakra slots you definitely have are the Soul, Heart, and/or Totem; per the Amorphous Body entry for Body Shape and Chakras (though technically Amorphous Body says explicitly "only two chakras - namely, the heart and soul", so Totem might be disallowed under the strictest RAW, but in such a game, you aren't playing this thing anyways). Except you can't get Soul or Heart until Epic levels, on account of too many RHD.

    Optimistically, you might be able to persuade the DM to mercy-grant you the No Limbs set of Chakras, but I would not wager my unlucky dice on being able to do so. Besides ... much better to spend your DM's mercy/generosity on other things.



    Although ... I suppose that per RAW, at least as far as I know, there's nothing explicitly requiring you to have a chakra you can bind to in order to shape a soulmeld. That is, AFAIK, you can shape soulmelds that would bind to chakras you do not have access to ... so, you could maybe get a third of the functionality out of Incarnum (unbound Soulmelds plus any Essentia investment), since binding soulmelds is probably more than half the point.
    Err, in other words, I think, per RAW, chakras/chakra slots only explicitly matter for binding soulmelds, not basic shaping. Could be wrong about that, though.
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  30. - Top - End - #840
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    Default Re: The LA-assignment Thread IV: Live Free or Hit Die Hard

    Quote Originally Posted by javcs View Post
    Can't realistically go incarnum - the only chakra slots you definitely have are the Soul, Heart, and/or Totem
    If you use Heart chakra with that subtype, expect to get sued by Blizzard.

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