Homebrew 3.5 feat : Iron Muscles

[LordDeath666]

Hows this sound???

You have spent years toning your muscles through vigorous and brutal training to the point that your muscles are tough enough to be armor itself

You use your strength in place of dexterity for AC

[brian 333]

Interesting idea. Is it a feat generally available? Or is this a Barbarian-specific feat? I could see this for Monks, too, but it seems a bit inappropriate for other non-fighter classes.

[LordDeath666]

Barbarian, 16+ str

[nonsi]

.
I see no common sense in tough muscles disabling dexterity.

Instead, I'd make it a feat with several prereqs that independently adds strength as natural armor.
Such a feat would need to account for something at high levels yet have significance at low levels.

Maybe something like this:

Iron Muscles
You have spent years toning your muscles through vigorous and brutal training to the point that your muscles are tough enough to grant you a certain degree of natural armor.
Prerequisites: Str 15, BAB +4, Improved Toughness feat
Benefits: You gain 1/4 your BAB as armor bonus to AC. This armor bonus cannot exceed your Str-bonus.

[Gorum]

.
I see no common sense in tough muscles disabling dexterity.

Instead, I'd make it a feat with several prereqs that independently adds strength as natural armor.
Such a feat would need to account for something at high levels yet have significance at low levels.

Maybe something like this:

Iron Muscles
You have spent years toning your muscles through vigorous and brutal training to the point that your muscles are tough enough to grant you a certain degree of natural armor.
Prerequisites: Str 15, BAB +4, Improved Toughness feat
Benefits: You gain 1/4 your BAB as armor bonus to AC. This armor bonus cannot exceed your Str-bonus.

So a 4th level non-human barbarian can't have both this feat and power attack? In my humble opinion, DnD 3.5 / 3.PF would be greatly improved with those three simple rules:

• These options: http://michaeliantorno.com/feat-taxes-in-pathfinder/
• Heavy armor provides +4 AC (+ magical enhancement), -15 ft on move speed and -4 to relevant skills, 16+ strength and proficiency each reduce these penalty by 5ft and -1 on skills.
• Light armor provides +2 AC (+ magical enhancement), -10 ft on move speed and -2 to relevant skills, 10+ strength and proficiency each reduce these penalty by 5ft and -1 on skills.
• BaB is added to AC as a dodge bonus.
• Average BaB never goes more than 2 under high BaB. Poor BaB and Base Saves never go below 4 under high base saves.

This way, high level monsters like the purple wurm don't auto-hit simply for the fact that AC don't scale. And fighters don't auto-fail their saves against a high-leveled caster's Hold Monster.

Now my approach still have huge problems:

• Every monster's AC has to be recalculated.
• Natural Armor needs to be nerfed.

But comes a point where it's not pathfinder anymore.

[Gorum]

Hows this sound???

You have spent years toning your muscles through vigorous and brutal training to the point that your muscles are tough enough to be armor itself

You use your strength in place of dexterity for AC

It makes the use of Dex as a dump stat too good as you negate it as a possible penalty altogether AND make it a bonus. This means a min-maxed 8th level half-orc would go from -2 to +6, before Bull's Strength. As a DM, I'd probably word it that way:

You may add your Str bonus to your AC. If you do, you don't apply a positive Dexterity bonus to your AC.

[brian 333]

It makes the use of Dex as a dump stat too good as you negate it as a possible penalty altogether AND make it a bonus. This means a min-maxed 8th level half-orc would go from -2 to +6, before Bull's Strength. As a DM, I'd probably word it that way:

You may add your Str bonus to your AC. If you do, you don't apply a positive Dexterity bonus to your AC.

I like the wording, which would allow negative a dex bonus to remain a penalty. See how this works:

You may substitute a positive Dexterity bonus to AC with your character's Strength bonus, but a negative Dexterity bonus still applies even with this feat.

Instead of Barbarian only, I could see a prerequisite for this feat being, "at least +1 Natural Armor bonus not granted by spell or magic item."

[Gorum]

Instead of Barbarian only, I could see a prerequisite for this feat being, "at least +1 Natural Armor bonus not granted by spell or magic item."

Why? The feat is already aimed at characters with a strength bonus. Why would the fighter, paladin, melee ranger or even melee sorcerer be disallowed the ability to tough up attacks?

[brian 333]

It just seemed like a flavor thing. Fighters and Paladins use armor for AC, Barbarians use ferocity and denial of pain. Feel free to disregard if you don't like the idea.

[nonsi]

So a 4th level non-human barbarian can't have both this feat and power attack

If it bothers you that much, you could simply nix Improved Toughness from the prereqs, possibly replacing it with 3 ranks of Autohypnosis (representing the discipline one would require for undergoing such training).

[LordDeath666]

.
I see no common sense in tough muscles disabling dexterity.

actualy if you look up what happens when a bodybuilder doesn't also work on flexibility it says "he becomes muslebound slowing down reaction speed" so it does make sence from what i understand in it.

[rferries]

I think the feat is fine - basically the inverse of Weapon Finesse. I would set the prerequisites simply at BAB+1, same as that feat.

[nonsi]

actualy if you look up what happens when a bodybuilder doesn't also work on flexibility it says "he becomes muslebound slowing down reaction speed" so it does make sence from what i understand in it.

Actually, it's not at all about muscle pumping, but about muscle (and bone) adaptation to punishment.
Now, you might say "hey, that guy's pretty slow", but the truth is that he was just inexperienced back then. Later on he became pretty awesome.

Al in all, I see nothing wrong with my proposal. It guarantees that the feat always counts for something, while never getting out of hand when taken by monsters with radical strength.