Finding the Right RPG for me

[Chaosticket]

Ive only played a few tabletop RPGs. 5th Edition Dungeons and Dragons is not for me. I play it and just compare it unfavorably to 2nd and 3rd edition as it cuts out pretty much everything I liked about them and just leaves the things I dont. I cant find a group that plays anything else, but I still have to search or never play RPGs with others.

I like gaining rewards for actions. Gold, experience, equipment.
I like ranged combat. If there is a game where you can end some combats without melee weapons, great.
I like faster paced games. Shouldnt take a hour of discussing if we should leave the building.

I dont like stereotypes such as "always chaotic evil orcs"
I dont like fixed classes and roles. They dont really represent personal abilities or growth, just another stereotype.

Im not really one for fixed limits in a Fantasy Fiction game where rules prevent people from having fun.
I prefer Science over Fantasy, but fusing them is fine. Steam/Magepunk things like Arcanum, Cyberpunks like Shadowrun, and so on are pretty interesting.

[Cespenar]

Honestly, though, only points 2 and 5 seem inherent to 5e, and even 2 could be argued to be inherent to Fantasy systems in general, not specifically to 5e.

I'd say explaining these points to a DM before starting a campaign could end up in you enjoying the game much better.

Otherwise, though Shadowrun seems to address points 2 and 5 as well as your preference of Sci-fi, so give that a try, I guess?

[JoeJ]

Since you said you like science fiction, you might find Traveller to your taste.

[Scripten]

I'm not entirely done with reading the book yet, but Stars without Number might be similar to what you are looking for. It's highly lethal and doesn't really go for power fantasy gameplay, but it hits a lot of your points. Technically it is a classed system, but the roles are much less rigorous than any version of D&D, IMO.

Also a large portion of it is free, which is always a nice thing.

[elanfanboy]

Get a group of your own together, and use a system that you enjoy. Get a bunch of green longs that you know from work and in turn introduce new people to our beloved pastime.

[LordEntrails]

I like gaining rewards for actions. Gold, experience, equipment.

I'm not aware of any system that doesn't do this. I'm sure there are some but...

I like ranged combat. If there is a game where you can end some combats without melee weapons, great.

I don't know of any systems that requires melee combat. It depends on the party and the opponents But limiting your self to only one type of violent conflict resolution is... limiting.

I like faster paced games. Shouldnt take a hour of discussing if we should leave the building.

This is not a charactersitic of D&D. It's a charactersitic of the GM and the group of players.

I dont like stereotypes such as "always chaotic evil orcs"

This is more about world building and how the GM presents it than any system.

I dont like fixed classes and roles. They dont really represent personal abilities or growth, just another stereotype.

Lots of classless systems out there. The first one that comes to mind is Star Frontiers since I'm playing a game it in. But there are lots to chose from.

Im not really one for fixed limits in a Fantasy Fiction game where rules prevent people from having fun.

I have no idea what you are insinuating here, but again, this seems like it is more about your interaction with the GM and other layers than anything to do with the system.

I prefer Science over Fantasy, but fusing them is fine. Steam/Magepunk things like Arcanum, Cyberpunks like Shadowrun, and so on are pretty interesting.

Batteltech, Traveller, Gamma World, (various) GURPS, (various) Star Wars, 40K...

Start your own group, then you get to decide what and how you play. If you make good decisions on those you won't have troubling building and keeping a group.

[tensai_oni]

I'm going to suggest Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay - explicitly the fantasy version, not 40k.

Plenty of loot and gold to be gained, and characters steadily improve over the course of the adventures.

Ranged combat is totally doable, and tends to be very dangerous.

The game is fast paced, there are no overly complicated rolls for action resolution and combat tends to be short, brutal and very lethal. This point is also why I am not recommending Legend of Wulin - it's a good system, but it's not fast paced at all.

Due to Fantasy Roleplay's focus on more down to earth, "gritty"/low-power adventuring, you will rarely find a situation where opponents you face must be evil just because, without justification or individual circumstance to explain it. I mean that may still be the case (and often may be if the GM isn't feeling creative) but there's a lot of room left for shades of grey and ambiguity. Compare to 40k which often boils down to "shoot the xeno/mutant/chaos cultist".

Characters have professions but how you advance is up to you. These are more an indication of what you did before you became an adventurer (or when more experienced, what you do when not adventuring).

[GrayDeath]

I'm not entirely done with reading the book yet, but Stars without Number might be similar to what you are looking for. It's highly lethal and doesn't really go for power fantasy gameplay, but it hits a lot of your points. Technically it is a classed system, but the roles are much less rigorous than any version of D&D, IMO.

Also a large portion of it is free, which is always a nice thing.

With Focus on the speed and it being free, I support this.

Also, as you already mentioned it, Shadowrun does a lot of the things you want (and 5th is even relatively fast ^^), and its cheap as well, give it a try too.

[kyoryu]

Check out BRP/RuneQuest.

[Knaight]

I could see you liking Burning Wheel, though it is very much fantasy and not sci-fi or space opera.

Beyond that there's the usual collection of generics - Fudge, Fate, GURPS, Open d6, Cortex +, HERO, etc. Of the ones on that list I suspect Open d6 is most likely to suit you, particularly as it supports space particularly well.

[Hurske]

Some of your points are strait GM world building issues.

But the others, sound exactly like what I'm running, Savage Worlds Interface Zero. It's cyberpunk without any fantasy. No classes, so you build what you want. Although there is melee, it's mostly gonna be ranged weapons dominant.

System is deadly too.

[JAL_1138]

Savage Worlds is good for quick, medium-crunch, fast-paced gaming, and has a metric $&@%-ton of supplementary rules and settings for different genres if core doesn't have what you need. There are some issues--the gear list is, er, not very well done in core or the fantasy supplement, for instance, and magic is much more limited than in D&D so it's not great if you like playing the "Batman Wizard" who has a spell for every situation, for example--but the rest of the game mechanics are great fun.

OpenD6 has a bunch of variants for different genres. I've never played anything in the system the old West End Games Star Wars RPG, but that one was fantastic, and Open D6 is (basically) the same game engine done as a generic system. And free, so far as I'm aware (as the "Open" name implies). From what I recall from Star Wars, it's not quite as easy/fast to run for large combats with a ton of characters/NPCs on the board as Savage Worlds, but not by much. The space combat and travel rules were pretty solid, without getting too fiddly. There were some balance issues with Force-users, not sure if and/or how that translates to the OpenD6 version since it doesn't have the Star Wars license though. Worth a look.

[Psikerlord]

I'm not entirely done with reading the book yet, but Stars without Number might be similar to what you are looking for. It's highly lethal and doesn't really go for power fantasy gameplay, but it hits a lot of your points. Technically it is a classed system, but the roles are much less rigorous than any version of D&D, IMO.

Also a large portion of it is free, which is always a nice thing.

Yep Stars with number, or Shadowrun Anarchy, might be up your alley

[lightningcat]

You could always go for the truest kitchen sink game ever written: Dungeon the Dragoning.
Yes it is a complete joke, but it is a functional game that seems to have everything you want.

Reward for actions? Yes. Although only a small minority of games don't have this.
Ranged Combat? Yes, guns are dangerous, bows are still useful, flamethrowers are a thing.
Faster paced? Well, this is a group thing more then a game thing, but the setting and game encourage you to move and do things.
No Stereotypes? Well, not so much, but more that every stereotype is easily broken.
No fixed Classes and roles? Emphasis on "Fixed" here. Classes are what the character is doing now, and how they are currently advancing. Think of it more like a life-path method for advancement instead of backstory.
Science over Fantasy? This game threw both of them into the blender with everything else and gives you the resulting smoothie.

This game is what actually prompted me to make my own game system. It proves that insanity is not always a bad thing.

[Andor13]

Almost any game would do from the sound of it. A lot of your wants are more table issues than system issues. It sounds like you want a system which is at least moderately crunchy, but which doesn't bog down in play. To me that reads like a system where character gen/advancement have a lot of bits, but the play is smooth.

Games like Hero or GURPs might suit. Shadowrun you mention. Eclipse Phase might work.

You can also see if there is a world you like, and hunt for a game for it, there are lots of IP specific games from massively popular properties like Star Wars (done several times) to really obscure stuff like Erma Felna EDF (Albedo.)

And Dungeons the Dragoning is worth at least a read, it's entertaining as hell. (My favorite review was someone complaining "Why doesn't this suck?")

[Rhedyn]

I'm a big fan of 3.X but didn't like 5e but wanted something that ran as fast or faster.

Enter Savage Worlds, my favorite RPG.

[Chaosticket]

Is there a game that is wide open and as fun in practice as theory?

D&d has such potential that is wasted so it seems better to play Shadowrun, Paranoia, or Rifts.

[2D8HP]

Is there a game that is wide open and as fun in practice as theory?...

Roll for Shoes

Check out BRP/RuneQuest.

A very strong seconding for BRP/RuneQuest, and also the variant of those rules (my favorite) Pendragon.

[Chaosticket]

Runequest sounds nice. Is there a Science setting for it?

[2D8HP]

Runequest sounds nice. Is there a Science setting for it?

Science Fiction?

The only BRP based ones I've owned have been Ringworld and Other Suns, but

this thread

lists some more.

[Rynjin]

Allow me to third Savage Worlds. It's real good, and can be used for any game from fantasy to sci-fi to RPG versions of Rambo.

[CharonsHelper]

I'm finishing up a TTRPG which I consider a "Swashbuckling Space Western". While I have classes - I consider it more of a class/point-buy hybrid. (Your class primary changes point costs.)

While melee has it's place - everyone needs a gun to not die horribly crossing open ground

In play-testing I've found the rules to be pretty streamlined, at least relative to D&D 2e & 3x (especially for a grid-based game).

#shamelessplug

[Foreverknight]

Champions!

[JoeJ]

Champions!

I've only played Champions a few times and that was long ago, but "faster paced" was not a phrase I'd use to describe the experience.

[2D8HP]

I've only played Champions a few times and that was long ago, but "faster paced" was not a phrase I'd use to describe the experience.

True, but other posts of Chaosticket seems to indicate that he really likes superpowers and the "build mini-game", and Champions is perfect for that.

Now all Chaosticket has to do is get a time machine and travel to when it was easier to find a table for Champions than for D&D (try 1991 in Berkeley, California on for size Chaosticket, but a few years forward or backwards should work IIRC. You'll have an even easier time finding a Cyberpunk or Vampire game).

[Chaosticket]

Good leads.

Rifts is #1 on my list right now.

Kitchen Sink settings are my favorite as the there are vast possibilities like an Immortal Gunslinger in Ancient Nippon. Rifts isnt the only one like that, just the one that comes to my head.

[JAL_1138]

Also worth noting is that Savage Worlds has a line of Rifts products as well, if the actual Palladium rule system for Rifts (which is somewhat notorious for poor layout, complexity, imbalance, and power creep, but does have way more published setting material for DMs and depth of crunch than Savage Rifts) isn't your cup of tea.

[Rhedyn]

Also worth noting is that Savage Worlds has a line of Rifts products as well, if the actual Palladium rule system for Rifts (which is somewhat notorious for poor layout, complexity, imbalance, and power creep, but does have way more published setting material for DMs and depth of crunch than Savage Rifts) isn't your cup of tea.

I have two of these Savage Rifts books (Players and GM guides).

They are very nice and crunch is pretty solid. It's a tad more complex than regular Savage Worlds, but that's what you get when you can start as a Dragon or Glitterboy among other things.

[Rynjin]

I'm enjoying playing a Burster arson investigator in a Savage Rifts PbP right now, it's fun.