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  1. - Top - End - #1
    Pixie in the Playground
     
    PaladinGuy

    Join Date
    Jun 2018
    Gender
    Male

    Default CC's without any magic

    So, today i was watching critical role and a pit fight encounter presented itself for barbarian of the party, grog. And travis willingham described awesome moves like thunderclapping both ears, shoving thumbs in eye sockets, aiming kicks to kneecaps to bust knees and a whole lot of moves. All these moves for rolling 1d4/2+STR MOD equal of dmg and nothing else.

    Now, normally those moves would deafen, blind, make you limp and so on in real life. But they would also bring a ton of pain. But since dealing a lot of dmg and dropping a control effect on a foe will be too strong i would like to implement these phsical effect in a game that i'm DMing currently in a balanced way. So that not only casters or battlemasters are the only CC guys in the game. (yeah i know you can shove, trip, push/pull but there are a lot of CC's in the game and if a pin costs enemy half his movement speed to get up a busted kneecap might do something similar.)

    So what are your advices on this issue how should i implement these mechanics in the game. How should the save be like how should i calculate the DC of such attacks. Should they be an action or an attack action.

    Pls keep in mind that although i'm aiming these to be realistic, priority is to make them balanced. Any idea is welcome :)

  2. - Top - End - #2
    Titan in the Playground
     
    Imp

    Join Date
    Feb 2017

    Default Re: CC's without any magic

    I would probably make it use an attack roll vs a CON save, dealing no damage but if the opponent fail the condition applies 'til the end of their turn.

  3. - Top - End - #3
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    NinjaGuy

    Join Date
    Jul 2013

    Default Re: CC's without any magic

    There's a couple ways that I could see execution of this:
    1. Individual body parts are more difficult to hit - an attempt to hit a throat, ear, et cetera, will be at disadvantage.
    2. For the same reason as number 1, the target must fail a dexterity throw or they can move that body part out of the way
    3. Use Stunning Strike as a model, and require one to expend some resource, and the target must fail a constitution save.
    4. To unlock the ability to target individual body parts, you must have some sort of feat. Tavern brawler, Martial Adept, Savage Attacker, Sharpshooter, or one of the weapon mastery feats
    5. Allow anyone to learn the "Snare" spell, or purchase "Snaring rope", et cetera



    In my signature, I have a homebrew marksman class called "Deadeye" with a Called shots feature - it was based on the Called shots mechanic in Pathfinder, converted to 5e. I also used the Maneuver mechanic/Superiority dice from the Battlemaster fighter and Spell-less Ranger.
    Last edited by Vogie; 2018-10-31 at 10:19 AM.
    Always looking for critique of my 5E homebrew!
    Including new Base Classes, a better Ranger, and Subclasses based on:
    • Books
    • TV Shows
    • Marvel Cinematic Universe
    • League of Legends IP
    • Planeswalker-themed Subclasses based on Magic: The Gathering
    And MORE!
    Quote Originally Posted by Bjarkmundur View Post
    ... does this stuff just come naturally to you? Do you even have to try anymore xD
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    Vogie is the sh**. I don't really have anything to contribute to the topic, just wanted to point that out.

  4. - Top - End - #4
    Ettin in the Playground
     
    BlueKnightGuy

    Join Date
    Aug 2018
    Location
    Between SEA and PDX.
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    Male

    Default Re: CC's without any magic

    In a circumstance where a character wants to do something cool, and something else already provides that option, there needs to be a penalty for the improvised action; something that makes the investment to rely on those tactics worthwhile.

    In this case, many of these things can be done by the Battlemaster, who uses Superiority Die. Since the Barbarian isn't using those, we need to make these options strictly worse than investing in the Battlemaster, especially since there is no resource being spent by the Barbarian.

    My recommendation is to make it so that the attacks have no modifier to damage, and instead use a save of 8+damage modifier. They aren't proficient in these improvised attacks, so no proficiency to your DC, sorry.

    So in this case, a barbarian with a +4 mod with a kick that knocks someone prone would deal 1 damage (as the minimum for an unarmed attack), and tack on a Constitution DC of 8+4 (12). If the Barbarian was Raging, I'd allow the bonus rage damage to be applied to the damage.

    For more powerful effects, like Blindness or Stun, they get a saving throw attempt at the START of their turn, not the end, as those are strictly better than things like Prone, Deafness, or Grappled.


    Alternatively, Exhaustion can be representative of these kinds of effects. Implementing a system where you make Constitution saves against "Pain DC's" that inflict temporary Exhaustion, called "Pain". Pain works exactly like Exhaustion, and stacks with Exhaustion for determining the downsides from the Exhaustion table, but a stack of Pain is removed for every individual source of healing you receive, including Hit Die used. Using something like this would be a lot more controllable and usable than allowing every condition possible on free Battlemaster Maneuver knockoffs. I'd use a similar thing as I mentioned before, removing the damage modifier on the attack for an 8+Mod Constitution DC (Constitution because at that point, the attack has already hit).
    Last edited by Man_Over_Game; 2018-10-31 at 10:35 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by KOLE View Post
    MOG, design a darn RPG system. Seriously, the amount of ideas Iíve gleaned from your posts has been valuable. Youíre a gem of the community here.
    Quote Originally Posted by Man_Over_Game View Post

    5th Edition Homebrewery

    Prestige Options, changing primary attributes to open a world of new multiclassing.
    Adrenaline Surge, fitting Short Rests into combat to fix bosses/Short Rest Classes.
    Pain, using Exhaustion to make tactical martial combatants.
    Fate Sorcery, lucky winner of the 5e D&D Subclass Contest VII!

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