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2007-09-19, 11:26 AM (ISO 8601)
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A good build that absolutly requires MAD
Monk/duelist
you get DEX to AC, WIS to AC, and INT to AC, only problem is. you need MAD
if you think about it it does make sense, both classes depend on you being unarmored and both classes use light weapons, but is it worth it.
what do I have to do to make this better, or more accesible?
"the world is not beautiful... Therefore it is." -kino no tabi
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2007-09-19, 11:30 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: A good build that absolutly requires MAD
Take the Kung-Fu Genius feat, which will swap your Monk Wis-to-AC to Int-to-AC.
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2007-09-19, 11:31 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: A good build that absolutly requires MAD
but I already have INT to AC from the Duelist levels?
does it stack?
"the world is not beautiful... Therefore it is." -kino no tabi
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2007-09-19, 11:36 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: A good build that absolutly requires MAD
It stacks the same way a Paladin of Tyranny/Hexblade/Black Guard all get Cha to saves. It will obviously depend on the DM's OK, but they are technically from different sources so should stack.
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2007-09-19, 11:44 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: A good build that absolutly requires MAD
I've had something similar approved before. Carmendine Monk and Invisible Blade's Canny Defense.
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2007-09-19, 11:51 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Mar 2007
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- Oregon, USA
Re: A good build that absolutly requires MAD
The duelist's Canny Defense and the monk's AC Bonus have different names, so they are definitely different abilities. Neither of their bonuses are typed, so they stack.
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2007-09-19, 12:09 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: A good build that absolutly requires MAD
Add in a level of Fist of the Forest for Con-to-AC too.
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2007-09-19, 12:24 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: A good build that absolutly requires MAD
Now here's the trick to it all...
You are nigh unhittable.
But what exactly can you do offensively? So as to make you a target, and convince the monsters to waste attacks on your dodgy little self.
This bears thinking about. With versatile unarmed strike you can at least use the precise strike ability, but you're still left with a lack of any good damaging options."It does me no injury for my neighbor to say there are twenty gods or no god. It neither picks my pocket nor breaks my leg."
- Thomas Jefferson
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2007-09-19, 01:22 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: A good build that absolutly requires MAD
The "source" in stacking rules refers to the spell, power, feat, or class ability - not the stat that modifies or determines how effective that spell, power, feat, or class ability might be.
You might want to look at Frozen Dwarf Hulk Smash.
Deepwarden replaces you Dex bonus with your Con bonus. Fist of the Forest gets its Con bonus to AC when unarmored. Rage increases your Con, as do various items and PrC. Frostrager also increases your natural armor bonus when you Rage, and allows you to be healed by cold damage when you rage. And Con is also your main source of hit points, the real bulwark of defense in combat.
Inertial Armor is also a great source of AC. Combine with anything that has high Dex and an animated shield or Force Screen, and you'll be fine.
The best way to maximize AC overall is to simply stack a lot of minor bonuses from different sources. Size, armor, shield, natural armor, deflection, fighting defensively, Dex, doge, etc.
You should also note that there's clearly a diminishing return on optimized AC. Too many types of attacks simply ignore it. So while everyone should want high AC, there's little reason to make an entire build that maximizes nothing but AC.Last edited by Person_Man; 2007-09-19 at 01:27 PM.
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2007-09-19, 01:23 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: A good build that absolutly requires MAD
The Duelist needs +6 BAB. Non core feats which have been mentioned already and non core class levels will help out your build a lot.
ToB is nice if allowed and Complete Warrior and Complete Adventurer have some nice options.
In a FRCS with Mad I'd see if I could get the Spellfire Wielder feat from Magic of Faerun.
For MAD I'd probably go Ninja - 3 (6 Skill points and Sneak Attack +2D6 (Nice with the Ascetic Rogue Feat and stacking with Unarmed Attack) or Swashbuckler -3 for Insightful Strike), Monk - 3 (Still Mind a requirement of PF) Psionic Fist or Fist of Zouken -3, Duelist - 2 and take 7 more levels of Psionic Fist or Fist of Zouken for 10 Level 1 - 5 known psi powers with 70 base PP. Depending on PC alignment maybe Assassin - 2 for another +1D6 Sneak Attack and Death Attack and Poison Use.
For MAD I'd probably take two weak flaws for two bonus feats.
Just core and SRD MAD: Barbarian - 1, Ranger - 1, Monk - 3, F- 2 (D10, +2 BAB and 2 Bonus Feats for your build), Duelist - 2, Psionic Fist - 10 (D20 SRD), Assassin, Rogue, Sorcerer (If using PF probably Shield (10 rounds sufficient for most fights) and (Color Spray or Ray of Enfeeblement (True Strike could be useful with an Assassin build and Death Attacks)) for this build) or another Duelist level - 1.
Psioinic Fist or Fist of Zuoken is nice for keeping most of your Monk bennies plus some powers like Force Shield and Inertial Armor level one powers (Both of which could both be duplicated with a level of sorcerer and using Mage Armor and Shield as known spells) which would also be nice with Abjurant Champion if psionics are not allowed. Haste and lots of other builds based on power selection.Last edited by CASTLEMIKE; 2007-09-19 at 04:07 PM.
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2007-09-19, 01:53 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: A good build that absolutly requires MAD
Methinks it would be easier to simply boost Dex and add that to your AC, and/or take AC booster items. You will probably end up with an AC nearly as high, and more room left to do other things.
I don't believe that two abilities of "your AC is modified by Int rather than Dex" equate to adding twice your Int mod to your AC. It's either redundant, or you can't swap out your Dex mod more than once because you only have one Dex mod. Plus veto on account of cheese.
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2007-09-19, 02:04 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: A good build that absolutly requires MAD
I'm pretty sure it doesn't either. See your AC is normally "Armor + Dex + Shield + Natural Armor + Deflection". Monk adds "+ Wis" to that list, and then you'd add "+ Int", and you don't add it twice because there'll already be a box that says "+ Int". But.. that made more sense in my head than trying to explain it..
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2007-09-19, 02:05 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Oregon, USA
Re: A good build that absolutly requires MAD
FeytouchedBanana eldritch disciple avatar by...me!
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2007-09-19, 02:08 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: A good build that absolutly requires MAD
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d20r Compilation PDF - last updated 9.11.14
d20r: Spells (I-L) - d20r: Spells (H) - d20r: Spells (G) - d20r: Spells (F) - d20r: Spells (E) - d20r: Spells (D) - d20r: Wizard class
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2007-09-19, 02:53 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: A good build that absolutly requires MAD
Handbooks:
Shax's Indispensable Haversack, TWF OffHandbook
Builds:
Archon of Nine, Jellobomber, King of Pong, Lightning Thief
Spells:
Druidzilla, Healbot, Gish
Iron Chef:
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2007-09-19, 03:01 PM (ISO 8601)
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- May 2006
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- Sunnydale
Re: A good build that absolutly requires MAD
Can you point me to where it says this is OGL content? Enlightened Fist is in Complete Arcane, and on page 2 of that book is the following:
This Wizards of the Coast™ game product contains no Open Game Content. No portion of this work may be reproduced in any form without written permission.
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2007-09-19, 03:44 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Mar 2007
Re: A good build that absolutly requires MAD
Thanks for catching my mistake. The post has been edited with the correct class Psionic Fist.
Here it is Hypertext D20 SRD under Psionic Rules (Psionic Fist):
http://www.d20srd.org/
Hope that helps.Last edited by CASTLEMIKE; 2007-09-19 at 04:01 PM.
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2007-09-19, 05:58 PM (ISO 8601)
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- The Land of Cleves
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Re: A good build that absolutly requires MAD
But what exactly can you do offensively? So as to make you a target, and convince the monsters to waste attacks on your dodgy little self.
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2007-09-20, 12:09 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Carnegie Mellon
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Re: A good build that absolutly requires MAD
Unfortunately, Stunning Fist is pretty easily saveable against.
Wow, grammar --. Still, not terribly useful, and there's way too many things out there that are unaffected (undead, constructs, etc.)Love the Third Amendment?