El Goonish ShiVe: Look! Squirrel!

[Fyraltari]

I am not sure I understand the "present-tense" thing in Grace's though bubble? Is it the idea that Grace is concerned that Sarah was not previously forgiven? Is there any reason that should matter if she doesn't know the context? If she did hear the context should she not be aware that Tedd and Elliot never thought there was anything to be forgiven for?

My guess is that she is reacting to "So what if my boyfriend isn't male all the time!? It doesn't change anything!" instead of "So what if my boyfriend wasn't male all the time!? It didn't change anything!" and drawing conclusions about Sam and Sarah's relationship. Or, less likley, if Sarah still thinks of Elliot as her boyfriend.

[Celestia]

My guess is that she is reacting to "So what if my boyfriend isn't male all the time!? It doesn't change anything!" instead of "So what if my boyfriend wasn't male all the time!? It didn't change anything!" and drawing conclusions about Sam and Sarah's relationship. Or, less likley, if Sarah still thinks of Elliot as her boyfriend.

Oh, yeah. That makes sense.

[Lamech]

Is that justin + ted in panel five?

[Mith]

Is that justin + ted in panel five?

Nah. It's Luke.

[Rater202]

So, Justin's plan to get looked upon with favor by a guy was doomed to failure.

If Elliot hadn't decided "maybe someone at the party should do it" it would have been all for not.

[Fyraltari]

So is everyone as confused as I am as to what Diane’s special font voice is supposed to be?

[The_Snark]

Yeah, I'm kind of lost there too. If it weren't for the commentary... and the last couple panels of Wednesday's strip, I guess... I wouldn't even have realized I'm missing something.

[mucat]

Apparently it's the same special font voice she's used in the past...but that doesn't get me any closer to figuring out what it is. It looks like Pizza Girl gets it, though, and was being snarky about how the reference wasn't quite on target.

[Vinyadan]

I think it's a convincing spell. People accept what they're being told. Pizza Girl may have been Smoke Guy, or was startled for some other reason, and used an excuse that Grace didn't doubt. Diane told a lie about why she came upstairs (because she felt uncomfortably attracted by Justin) and Grace accepted it. Then Pizza Girl told a lie to Grace, who probably will accept it.

Diane uses it to have people listen to her, and to say that she is a virgin, and everyone accepts that, believing her over their closer friends and acquaintances.

I only got here because the posts on this thread. I thought she was referring to an assumed inflatable bra worn by Grace.

[PoeticallyPsyco]

I think it's a convincing spell. People accept what they're being told. Pizza Girl may have been Smoke Guy, or was startled for some other reason, and used an excuse that Grace didn't doubt. Diane told a lie about why she came upstairs (because she felt uncomfortably attracted by Justin) and Grace accepted it. Then Pizza Girl told a lie to Grace, who probably will accept it.

Diane uses it to have people listen to her, and to say that she is a virgin, and everyone accepts that, believing her over their closer friends and acquaintances.

I only got here because the posts on this thread. I thought she was referring to an assumed inflatable bra worn by Grace.

I like the theory. My money is on pizza girl being a vampire hunter, though, since a fellow vampire hunter would have a lot more reason to be judgmental of Diane's use of her powers than the smoke wizard (and it's a few to many degrees of separation for me to assume the smoke wizard tracked down a different vampire hunter to learn their spell and just happened to use it here).

[Qwertystop]

I like the theory. My money is on pizza girl being a vampire hunter, though, since a fellow vampire hunter would have a lot more reason to be judgmental of Diane's use of her powers than the smoke wizard (and it's a few to many degrees of separation for me to assume the smoke wizard tracked down a different vampire hunter to learn their spell and just happened to use it here).

There's not much to say that "vampire hunters" in general would share spells, except possibly within the category "spells specifically useful for killing vampires" (i.e. creating magic weapons). Vocal convincingness magic is not that.

Also, in this theory where the pizza girl is the smoke wizard, she'd have gotten it from Diane when Diane was yelling at school. That's the last time we saw that character.

[Fyraltari]

But if it’s convincing spell, why would she used it on ‘hello’ alone in the sentence ‘hello I like your hair’?

[Rater202]

I don't really have time to double-check it, but I could have sworn that Pandora was shown speaking using the same or a similar font at least once.

Diane is half-elf(quarter-immortal.) It's possible that it's some power that immortals have that counts as a spell and Diane is immortal enough to use it but not immortal enough to be bound by the rules.

(Which might be another reason why the majority of immortals lied to themselves to think that their children were sterile.)

[DeTess]

But if it’s convincing spell, why would she used it on ‘hello’ alone in the sentence ‘hello I like your hair’?

It might be that Diane's not using it on purpose, so it slips in in her normal speech once in a while. That'd also explain the pizza-deliverers comment about not using it right, because for the lie that Diane told about her reason to come up there, the part she should have magicked was 'and for no other reason'.

[Kish]

I thought the implication was that Diane had unknowingly said something that sounded like a mangled quote.

[Vinyadan]

Even with the "Hello" , we see Ted become a lot more calm. Yes, I don't think she's aware of what she's doing. I think she has an intention (like calming Ted or being friendly) and the magic swoops in and takes care of that.

It's possible that it's an innate magic that was made available again when magic changed. Maybe, as was suggested, a feature due to human-elf-immortal mix.

[Lissou]

To me, the only thing the font accomplishes is make it harder to read dialogue. But if it's magic, I guess that would explain why it's a fancier font?

[Fyraltari]

I thought the implication was that Diane had unknowingly said something that sounded like a mangled quote.

That doesn’t really hold water. Dan never used a particular font for quotes, and I really can’t see how ‘hello’ would count as a quote if anything.

[Lizard Lord]

I would STILL consider Tedd to be an Artificer rather than a wizard.

[Gnoman]

That doesn't look like enough pizza.

[Fyraltari]

Spoiler

Show

She would need to see Tedd do magic to copy his spells, right? So do you think she expected him to cast a spell at the door or do you think she had something else in mind? Also she copied Diane’s voice power and she criticized her use of it? The gall!

[Rater202]

I would STILL consider Tedd to be an Artificer rather than a wizard.

I still think that Tedd "not being a spell user" is a bit overstated by the Whale, especially since it was directly in the context of using spells "of his own." Pandara said that Tedd will be able to cast spells at some point, so I figure that he'll have a means of magic use that counts as "his personally" using a spell at some point.

(The fact that Noriko seemingly didn't abandon Van also supports this.)

The Will of Magic says that calling Seers a "Wizard with a Quirk" is technically accurate, so being a Seer is closer to being a Wizard than to not being a Wizard.

This is, of course, assuming that she knows that Tedd is a Seer and not just that, as the son of two wizards, he's confirmed to be a wizard himself.

[Celestia]

That doesn't look like enough pizza.

With his many teenagers they have in that basement? Heck no. They should have ordered at least eight, maybe more.

[Rater202]

On second look, there's a distinctive shape in the fifth panel. Like a spikey stick figure, or beams of light radiating off of a really skinny guy.

Is that something we've seen before or do we think this is gonna be a situation like the outline of Pandora in the Caspaws poster and we'll see the same thing more clearly later.

[Lizard Lord]

I still think that Tedd "not being a spell user" is a bit overstated by the Whale, especially since it was directly in the context of using spells "of his own." Pandara said that Tedd will be able to cast spells at some point, so I figure that he'll have a means of magic use that counts as "his personally" using a spell at some point.

(The fact that Noriko seemingly didn't abandon Van also supports this.)

The Will of Magic says that calling Seers a "Wizard with a Quirk" is technically accurate, so being a Seer is closer to being a Wizard than to not being a Wizard.

This is, of course, assuming that she knows that Tedd is a Seer and not just that, as the son of two wizards, he's confirmed to be a wizard himself.

In EGS they might call it a wizard, but Jay was using D&D terms and Tedd's wand making makes him closer to D&D's Artificers than their Wizards. This will be true even if Tedd learns to cast spells without wands since Artificers do get spellcasting.

[Rater202]

In EGS they might call it a wizard, but Jay was using D&D terms and Tedd's wand making makes him closer to D&D's Artificers than their Wizards. This will be true even if Tedd learns to cast spells without wands since Artificers do get spellcasting.

You're assuming that "Bard" and "Druid" aren't specific kinds of magic users in this universe.

[Lizard Lord]

You're assuming that "Bard" and "Druid" aren't specific kinds of magic users in this universe.

I am and I am sticking to that assumption.

[Celestia]

In EGS they might call it a wizard, but Jay was using D&D terms and Tedd's wand making makes him closer to D&D's Artificers than their Wizards. This will be true even if Tedd learns to cast spells without wands since Artificers do get spellcasting.

Wizards can make wands, too. Articifers don't have exclusive claim to item creation.

[Kish]

I'm going to go out on a limb and say:

A seer is a "wizard with a quirk," in that while non-quirked wizards learn spells they see other people use and cast them directly, a seer learns spells they see other people use and puts them in items. The "quirk" is, on the minus side, that a seer cannot cast without an item (traditionally, but by no means limited to, a wand) and that they need to enchant the item before they can cast the spell, and on the plus side that anyone else can use the wand/item. There is not going to be some revelation of "and actually they can just cast spells directly, like Raven and Noriko, if they want." Dan may wrap his characters in cotton wool--and in fact he does--but it doesn't extend as far as "and there's no power that standard wizards have and my seer protagonist does not."

Jay is referencing Dungeons and Dragons. She is not alluding to in-world magic. She knows no more about what Grace is than when she asked "What kind of magic was THAT?!" She is alluding to having seen Diane give a compelling speech and Grace turn into a menacing part-animal form. Lizard Lord is speaking in those terms, D&D terms, not suggesting some new kind of EGS magic or that Tedd is not, in-world, a seer (as described above).

[Fyraltari]

On second look, there's a distinctive shape in the fifth panel. Like a spikey stick figure, or beams of light radiating off of a really skinny guy.

Is that something we've seen before or do we think this is gonna be a situation like the outline of Pandora in the Caspaws poster and we'll see the same thing more clearly later.

It’s the outline of Jay’s Smokey form placed behind her as if it were a shadow to confirm that they are one and the same. It’s a common visual technique for these kind of reveals.