Anyone here play Final Fantasy XIV?

[Grif]

As a tank main who's been playing the game for several years - pulling one pack at a time is counterproductive, because a competent healer and a competent tank can hold two to three packs at once, while DPS AoE them down. It's why most classes got added AoE rotations in ShB, even.

Also, it's way more fun, because a single pack isn't really dangerous and wastes time more than threatens you.

Yeah. Tanks pull wall-to-wall precisely so that we can all clear the dungeon that much faster. You won't notice it immediately, but it'd shave up to 10-20 minutes off a dungeon run if done correctly. Of course, this is cognizant of the DPS ability to actually AOE and given how allergic some people are to it... well, it can sometimes end badly.

[Rynjin]

Yeah. Tanks pull wall-to-wall precisely so that we can all clear the dungeon that much faster. You won't notice it immediately, but it'd shave up to 10-20 minutes off a dungeon run if done correctly. Of course, this is cognizant of the DPS ability to actually AOE and given how allergic some people are to it... well, it can sometimes end badly.

IME it usually ends badly because "good tanks" try to do this in low/mid level dungeons when several classes don't even HAVE AoE rotations yet.

[Ignimortis]

IME it usually ends badly because "good tanks" try to do this in low/mid level dungeons when several classes don't even HAVE AoE rotations yet.

There is no dungeon where you can't do a double-pull and survive comfortably. Doing a triple-pull before 40 might be risky, but you have cooldowns. Doing a triple-pull in any 40+ content is viable if you know how to play tank and your healer isn't asleep. Wall-to-wall pulls are usually two or three packs. Doing 4 packs at once requires being way overgeared, but still possible, if not really needed most of the time.

[DeTess]

There is no dungeon where you can't do a double-pull and survive comfortably. Doing a triple-pull before 40 might be risky, but you have cooldowns. Doing a triple-pull in any 40+ content is viable if you know how to play tank and your healer isn't asleep. Wall-to-wall pulls are usually two or three packs. Doing 4 packs at once requires being way overgeared, but still possible, if not really needed most of the time.

I've seen a lot of tanks dying while double-pulling in Shadowbringer dungeons unless there was a white mage healer and the tank was actually really good, rather than just 'passable'. Multi-pulling in pre-stormblood dungeons should be fine, while my experience in stormblood dungeons suggests you might want to check with your healer as it goes well at times, and horribly poorly at others.

[Tome]

There's definitely a few dungeons where you can't do big pulls. Usually new content, but there's also stuff like the first room in Aurum Vale.

[PhoenixPhyre]

There's definitely a few dungeons where you can't do big pulls. Usually new content, but there's also stuff like the first room in Aurum Vale.

Arum Vale's the prime one I see people try it in and fail miserably. And wipes waste more time than single-pulls.

How much you can pull depends on:
* Tank skill, gear, and closeness to particular level-sync breakpoints. It's actually easier to big-pull in the max-level, but not current dungeons (ie the level 70 roulette near the end of SB), because your high-end gear is at full effectiveness. Aurum Vale, in particular, is right before the 50 breakpoint so it's level-synced (including gear) really hard.
* healer skill and gear, plus level-dependent variables. Low-level SCH, for instance, has basically no panic buttons. They can do steady state like a champ, but can't recover from a bad hit.
* which DPS classes you have along, and at what levels. Doing a big pull with a DRG and a MNK in anything but ShB content (where they actually get decent AoE routines) is a waste. Their AoEs suck at lower levels. Plus you'll spend time gathering things up when no one can get any damage on them. BLM on the other hand loves big pulls.

I main PLD, and the first few pulls with any new healer are always more limited than I think I can get away with. Because I'm testing to see if the healer will do his job and will be comfortable with things. Taking a extra minute is better than wiping and having to run back IMO.

[LaZodiac]

DPS AoE

*looks at my kit*

Yeah that... that um is going to have to be until level 70ish. Doom Thrust doesn't combo into anything and is literally mt weakest attack.

Also, it's way more fun, because a single pack isn't really dangerous and wastes time more than threatens you.

This, plus all the other arguments, are legit though. Like I do get it. But I'm still new to the game so maybe, in my first 8 person raid ever through the first of two end game dungeons, we can slow down a LITTLE bit, because HM that's a lot of... EVERYTHING, all at once.

Incidently, Shieldfried and Gunwrists are dead. At some point tonight maybe I'll be taking down the Praetorium, and presumably the last of the wannabe Judges. I'm pretty excited, all things told. I do wish the enemies got better characterization (and that Gunwrists McThot got a plot that wasn't "I am incredibly horny for Gaius Mannus").

Speaking of, the minor sub plot in the lead up to the end game where Biggs and Wedge make me get the heart of a dead Vivi from FF9 to make our mech walker sentient because it's easier than fixing the broken part it has... and the fact that she ends up dying because Wedge is horny, is kinda ****ing me up. There's a lot of unstated implications to the fact that we literally brought life to a machine using the soul of another living creature, and then recklessly endangered her because our mechanic wanted to show off to the girl he likes.

[Ignimortis]

I've seen a lot of tanks dying while double-pulling in Shadowbringer dungeons unless there was a white mage healer and the tank was actually really good, rather than just 'passable'. Multi-pulling in pre-stormblood dungeons should be fine, while my experience in stormblood dungeons suggests you might want to check with your healer as it goes well at times, and horribly poorly at others.

Dunno. Never had much trouble. Stormblood dungeons are comfortable as PLD to double/triple pull, fine enough as DRK (though ShB might have changed that because of DA+AD removal), kinda meh as WAR/GNB, but double pulls are still fine. Same goes for Shadowbringers. Many tanks just forget they have cooldowns for that, or cycle them improperly.

Arum Vale's the prime one I see people try it in and fail miserably. And wipes waste more time than single-pulls.

How much you can pull depends on:
* Tank skill, gear, and closeness to particular level-sync breakpoints. It's actually easier to big-pull in the max-level, but not current dungeons (ie the level 70 roulette near the end of SB), because your high-end gear is at full effectiveness. Aurum Vale, in particular, is right before the 50 breakpoint so it's level-synced (including gear) really hard.
* healer skill and gear, plus level-dependent variables. Low-level SCH, for instance, has basically no panic buttons. They can do steady state like a champ, but can't recover from a bad hit.
* which DPS classes you have along, and at what levels. Doing a big pull with a DRG and a MNK in anything but ShB content (where they actually get decent AoE routines) is a waste. Their AoEs suck at lower levels. Plus you'll spend time gathering things up when no one can get any damage on them. BLM on the other hand loves big pulls.

I main PLD, and the first few pulls with any new healer are always more limited than I think I can get away with. Because I'm testing to see if the healer will do his job and will be comfortable with things. Taking a extra minute is better than wiping and having to run back IMO.

Aurum Vale is...yeah, it sucks to double-pull there, unless you're good at cycling your cooldowns.

Looking at classes is also a valid concern, but every class has an AoE ability that's a DPS gain at 40 or earlier. Doom Thrust, Death Blossom, etc. GNB, WAR and PLD also have good AoE routines at 40, poor DRK got left out till 72.

*looks at my kit*

Yeah that... that um is going to have to be until level 70ish. Doom Thrust doesn't combo into anything and is literally mt weakest attack.

You get Sonic Thrust at 62, IIRC. But Doom Spike is still a potency gain as long as you hit 3+ enemies with it, a big gain for 4 and more enemies. Just be glad it's not using resources anymore - being out of TP after one fight was kinda bad...

Incidently, Shieldfried and Gunwrists are dead. At some point tonight maybe I'll be taking down the Praetorium, and presumably the last of the wannabe Judges. I'm pretty excited, all things told. I do wish the enemies got better characterization (and that Gunwrists McThot got a plot that wasn't "I am incredibly horny for Gaius Mannus").

You'll get that. 2.0 storyline is incredibly cliche and sorta boring, it's very standard Final Fantasy stuff and doesn't really improve on the formula of "here's bad guys, save the world/the country from them". It gets way better even in 2.X quests and especially afterwards.

[LaZodiac]

You get Sonic Thrust at 62, IIRC. But Doom Spike is still a potency gain as long as you hit 3+ enemies with it, a big gain for 4 and more enemies. Just be glad it's not using resources anymore - being out of TP after one fight was kinda bad...

You'll get that. 2.0 storyline is incredibly cliche and sorta boring, it's very standard Final Fantasy stuff and doesn't really improve on the formula of "here's bad guys, save the world/the country from them". It gets way better even in 2.X quests and especially afterwards.

I feel like overall my time is better spent focusing down the squishiest, most dangerous thing with my intensely powerful single target stuff until I'm at least able to Sonic Thrust, but that's a fair point. And yeah TP seems like an awful mechanic.

I mean it's cliche but it's not that bad really. The, as I've said before, underlying realization that every single person here has just survived the Apocalypse makes a lot of it work a lot better than it probably should. Five years ago the world ended and we're only just now sorting out the bones of the dead.

[lesser_minion]

There's definitely a few dungeons where you can't do big pulls. Usually new content, but there's also stuff like the first room in Aurum Vale.

Aurum Vale is pretty good for sac pulls (where the tank pulls a bunch of mobs and the rest of the group runs past and leaves them to die) IIRC, so from a certain point of view, it's one of the best places in the entire game to pull big. As long as the rest of your party is on board, at least.

[LaZodiac]

Aurum Vale is pretty good for sac pulls (where the tank pulls a bunch of mobs and the rest of the group runs past and leaves them to die) IIRC, so from a certain point of view, it's one of the best places in the entire game to pull big. As long as the rest of your party is on board, at least.

I mean I recently did Aurum Vale. I don't know if it has a hard mode or anything but it seems like a really easy area to just navigate without fight most of the mobs? It's the bosses that are the issue.

[Yuki Akuma]

Hey, LaZodiac. Once you finish a main story quest called "The Ultimate Weapon", you should go to the Steps of Nald in Ul'Dah and get a side quest called "The Rise and Fall of a Gentleman" from Wymond.

Trust me.

[DeTess]

Hey, LaZodiac. Once you finish a main story quest called "The Ultimate Weapon", you should go to the Steps of Nald in Ul'Dah and get a side quest called "The Rise and Fall of a Gentleman" from Wymond.

Trust me.

Let me second this. I'd personally not run through the entire line in one go, but use it is an intermission from the serious MSQ stuff from time to time, because sometimes you want/need serious politics, and sometimes... *flexes in a gentlewomanly way*

[LaZodiac]

Hey, LaZodiac. Once you finish a main story quest called "The Ultimate Weapon", you should go to the Steps of Nald in Ul'Dah and get a side quest called "The Rise and Fall of a Gentleman" from Wymond.

Trust me.

Let me second this. I'd personally not run through the entire line in one go, but use it is an intermission from the serious MSQ stuff from time to time, because sometimes you want/need serious politics, and sometimes... *flexes in a gentlewomanly way*

I have an ever so slight suspicion of what this could be based on like, random tumblr nonsense I end up seeing while bored at work, but I'm going to put it out of my mind until I'm done punching Ultima in the mouth.

Incidentally my plan was after beating Ultima to just go around the game world and do every quest of interest that I may have missed or skipped due to being 20 levels above the plot for all of the game. Look up where to find all the dungeons I missed and then just duty finder for them until I've done everything.

[Grif]

I have an ever so slight suspicion of what this could be based on like, random tumblr nonsense I end up seeing while bored at work, but I'm going to put it out of my mind until I'm done punching Ultima in the mouth.

Incidentally my plan was after beating Ultima to just go around the game world and do every quest of interest that I may have missed or skipped due to being 20 levels above the plot for all of the game. Look up where to find all the dungeons I missed and then just duty finder for them until I've done everything.

You might want to save the exp for a second job. No point overlevelling your main job when you can just do MSQs for it.

[LaZodiac]

You might want to save the exp for a second job. No point overlevelling your main job when you can just do MSQs for it.

I mean more collecting any dungeons and unlockable stuff I missed. But fair point.

Also um... oops. Beat Praetorium in a... fascinating sense.

My internet died right as we hit Ultima. When it got back, we had won, and I got the credit for it. I missed the entire final fight.

[Yuki Akuma]

I mean more collecting any dungeons and unlockable stuff I missed. But fair point.

Also um... oops. Beat Praetorium in a... fascinating sense.

My internet died right as we hit Ultima. When it got back, we had won, and I got the credit for it. I missed the entire final fight.

Honestly given everyone else was likely max level with the highest iLevel gear available in Praetoriam, you wouldn't have done much anyway.

But you can always run it again if you want. People run the MSQ roulette all the time, 'cause the rewards are awesome.

[LaZodiac]

Honestly given everyone else was likely max level with the highest iLevel gear available in Praetoriam, you wouldn't have done much anyway.

But you can always run it again if you want. People run the MSQ roulette all the time, 'cause the rewards are awesome.

I'll think about it. Will go to my inn room to look at the cutscenes I missed.

Also um I just started the quest "Corpse Groom" and am ****ing dying.

Y'all might not remember, but learning about Edda, the healer who's fiance died and got his head sliced off in Tam-Tara Deepcroft, all because the game wanted to show us how NOT to behave when things go poorly in a dungeon, is this weird incidental side story that I really really liked actually.

And now she's become a horrifying necromancer and I feel like my soul is leaving my body.

[Resileaf]

I'll think about it. Will go to my inn room to look at the cutscenes I missed.

Also um I just started the quest "Corpse Groom" and am ****ing dying.

Y'all might not remember, but learning about Edda, the healer who's fiance died and got his head sliced off in Tam-Tara Deepcroft, all because the game wanted to show us how NOT to behave when things go poorly in a dungeon, is this weird incidental side story that I really really liked actually.

And now she's become a horrifying necromancer and I feel like my soul is leaving my body.

It's a really sad "Not everything ends well" side story that really goes to show that despite everything, Eorzea is still a rather crapsack world.

[LaZodiac]

It's a really sad "Not everything ends well" side story that really goes to show that despite everything, Eorzea is still a rather crapsack world.

Hell of a thing to do, and truthfully I love that they did it.

Also, having now done Bowl of Embers Hard, I've a question. Should I grind out Primal's until I get one of their eikonic weapons for Dragoon?

[Yuki Akuma]

You can if you want. You'll get better weapons pretty much the moment you start Heavensward so it's only useful for glamour purposes.

Heck, given you're way overleveled, you could just buy a better weapon off the market board.

[LaZodiac]

You can if you want. You'll get better weapons pretty much the moment you start Heavensward so it's only useful for glamour purposes.

Heck, given you're way overleveled, you could just buy a better weapon off the market board.

That's a point. And hey, I'm not way overleveled any MORE, I'm only level 55, with the story being around 50ish. So I'm good now! I just kinda want all the weapons for a spear collection.

Also, how do you dye Vintage armour? I know how to get Augmented armour for Relic/Artifact, but I've got a handful of antique stuff I can trade in for Vintage armour and I wanna be able to dye it (since I think the Wyrm armour looks better then Drachen).

Also also, what do Tomestones of Poetic's do other than buy... some minor gear upgrades?

[Resileaf]

That's a point. And hey, I'm not way overleveled any MORE, I'm only level 55, with the story being around 50ish. So I'm good now! I just kinda want all the weapons for a spear collection.

It's so sad that the code they have to work with is so terrible that they can't make a proper transmog system. Would love to be able to collect all appearances in the game.

[Rynjin]

Also also, what do Tomestones of Poetic's do other than buy... some minor gear upgrades?

They buy you the best gear available at most given levels in an expansion. I was still wearing Ironworks gear over halfway through Heavensward.

[LaZodiac]

They buy you the best gear available at most given levels in an expansion. I was still wearing Ironworks gear over halfway through Heavensward.

So I should buy all of that. Got it.

[PhoenixPhyre]

So I should buy all of that. Got it.

And then, when possible, get the augmentation items for it. It'll carry you half-way or more into the next band of levels without needing upgrades.

[LaZodiac]

And then, when possible, get the augmentation items for it. It'll carry you half-way or more into the next band of levels without needing upgrades.

Do you augmented versions give you better stats or is it just for dying purposes like the Relic armour?

Also I am, or rather was, getting my Relic Weapon. Then I saw the two ways you need to get the champion's lance. Either bought... or crafted yourself. Welp.

[Guancyto]

You should get 600 poetics from meridium+praetorium. Use those to buy an Encrypted Tomestone, 10 Rowena's Token (Poetics), and a Carbontwine. Then go right next door to exchange the tomestone and the tokens for an item level 120 spear. Then hit up the very northeast of the North Shroud (it's right next to the guy offering a level 50 relic weapon quests) to exchange the carbontwine to augment that item level 120 spear to an item level 130 spear.

By far your biggest upgrade, and should last you all the way to 60. For very little effort, that's 5 item levels less than a completely finished relic weapon (which will take you absolutely forever).

The armor pieces are more optional, but still very worthwhile.

Augmentation is 10 item levels, so it's a straight upgrade to everything.

[LaZodiac]

You should get 600 poetics from meridium+praetorium. Use those to buy an Encrypted Tomestone, 10 Rowena's Token (Poetics), and a Carbontwine. Then go right next door to exchange the tomestone and the tokens for an item level 120 spear. Then hit up the very northeast of the North Shroud (it's right next to the guy offering a level 50 relic weapon quests) to exchange the carbontwine to augment that item level 120 spear to an item level 130 spear.

By far your biggest upgrade, and should last you all the way to 60. For very little effort, that's 5 item levels less than a completely finished relic weapon (which will take you absolutely forever).

The armor pieces are more optional, but still very worthwhile.

Augmentation is 10 item levels, so it's a straight upgrade to everything.

A bit late since I have been getting armour pieces, but I'll keep that all in mind. Didn't realize you could get the Encrypted Tomestones at the exchange as well!

Except in the case of the Drachen armour and other Relics, where augmentation does not actually improve it, just makes it dyeable.

[Lord Raziere]

I have started a character in this game. black mage. free trial.

and oh boy just from the first three levels of thaumaturge/black mage I can already tell its better than WoW and see no reason to go back ever. its not anything specific, its just that I can feel the effort put into all this. the character creation system is actually customizable, I don't know what the patron god choice is supposed to do, but I guess its an identity thing with no benefits or downsides, the starting area of Ul'dah for my Mi'quote is perfect. desert? raiding bandits? corrupt guards? a city of greed and violence? knives in the shadows? its as if they knew what exactly what I wanted!

and the cinematics....the looks, the everything....its all awesome. it certainly looks prettier than Wow. combat seems standard MMO stuff, but the spells look better and make sense for FF.

its worth the download at the very least and I'll at some point play more.