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  1. - Top - End - #1
    Dwarf in the Playground
     
    WolfInSheepsClothing

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    Default Druid BarBEARian

    **Edited**
    I plan on playing as a **Barbarian 1/Druid (moon)** rest in my upcoming campaign, where I will be playing with a large group of First Time players.

    I have most everything planned out for him

    Hill dwarf, learn how to rage, circle of the moon druid, wildshape into a bear, rage in bear form, lather rinse and repeat, The standard druid/barbarian tank build.

    **I would like to know if there is any better way to play a damage sponge as a druid, Lizardfolk into Giant Snapping turtle sounded cool roleplay-wise (Named Bowser, Respectively). Or just what wild shape is best for this combo (Druid/Barb). Or if there is a better multiclass than barbarian. Any and all recommendations appreciated.**
    Last edited by SpicyBoi_Nezu; 2019-03-31 at 08:50 PM.

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    Default Re: Druid BarBEARian

    I play a similiar build.

    Ghostwise Halfling Barb1/Druid7 Currently.

    Anyway, Sentinel is a good feat for some forms, such as hitting with the Constrict on a giant constrict before an enemy attacks your friend to restrain them. Maybe get mage armor from magic Initiate, which is an improvement to some forms AC.

    In general, unless you're doing a lot of things outside of bear form you'll not need your stats a whole lot.

    Getting an Amulet of Health for that 19 con is quite nice. It'll boost your AC and HP in wildshape.
    Last edited by Snowbluff; 2019-03-27 at 05:37 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Snowbluff View Post
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    Default Re: Druid BarBEARian

    Quote Originally Posted by SpicyBoi_Nezu View Post
    I plan on playing as a Druid 6/Barbarian 4 in my upcoming campaign, where I will be playing with a large group of First Time players.

    I have most everything planned out for him

    Hill dwarf, circle of the moon druid, wildshape into a bear, bear totem barbarian, rage in bear form, gain resistance to all damage except psychic. The standard OP druid tank build.

    I just need to know if I should take the ability score raises, or take feats. If feats, which ones would be best, preferably ones that might help me in wild shape or with rage (I'm not 100% familiar with all of 5e, since I mostly play 3.5)
    Solid choice. Bearbarian is one of my favorite builds. Although, I recommend not taking Barbarian up to level 4. Most of the benefits of the multiclass stop at Barbarian level 1, and you should only go further if you absolutely plan to basically never cast spells in combat.

    1 Barbarian, Moon Druid X is a pretty difficult build to take down, as you're practically a full caster with some amazing forms. Not to mention the extra 3 Druid levels will get you access to CR 3 forms. You might think the "Resistance to all Damage Types" is a big deal, but nobody is going to be aiming their Fireballs at YOU, they'll be aiming for everyone else in your party that actually would be hurt by it.

    As for what feats to take, Moon Druid Barbarian is known for being irritatingly tanky, but without having much control or damage on the battlefield.
    Consider packing Sentinel, as it will make you much more difficult to ignore when enemies can't afford to ever leave your reach or attack someone other than the Bear that doesn't Care.
    Resilience: Constitution will help if you didn't start your first level as Barbarian (although you definitely should with this build if you can).
    Otherwise, I'd just wrack up your Wisdom (getting Resilience: Wisdom first), as it defines your spellcasting and Wisdom is what's used to deflect illusion and enchantment magic, which is a common problem for melee combatants.
    Last edited by Man_Over_Game; 2019-03-27 at 05:47 PM.
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    Barbarian in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: Druid BarBEARian

    You want to hit level 12 as a Barbarian 3/Druid 9, then hit level 14 as a Barbarian 5/Druid 9.
    Take the Mobile feat, be an Eagle totem.
    Why is that you might ask?
    Because you can become a Killer Whale with 20ft movement speed and Dash as a bonus action, that's why :P

    In seriousness, if you're going more than 3 in Barbarian, it's to get to Barbarian 5, otherwise stay at 3.
    There's not many feats that I can say work in Wild Shape (and are good), although there are quite a few that are "ask your DM".

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    Default Re: Druid BarBEARian

    Mobile, sentinel, and Resilient con are the three best choices for feats for a druid who owns on being in wildshape most of the time
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    Default Re: Druid BarBEARian

    Quote Originally Posted by Snowbluff View Post
    In general, unless you're doing a lot of things outside of bear form you'll not need your stats a whole lot.
    I think you are still going to need WIS and CHA. A lot of the spells and features commonly used against melee characters target those saving throws (you will learn to hate dominate beast).

    You also of course need STR 13, which is a bit of a waste when you spend so much time in beast shape, but you have no choice in that.

    Quote Originally Posted by Snowbluff View Post
    Getting an Amulet of Health for that 19 con is quite nice. It'll boost your AC and HP in wildshape.
    Oh yeah! You'll probably be fighting every other PC in the party for the item, however.

    Quote Originally Posted by SpicyBoi_Nezu View Post
    Hill dwarf, circle of the moon druid, wildshape into a bear, bear totem barbarian, rage in bear form, gain resistance to all damage except psychic. The standard OP druid tank build.
    You know, the more I think about this, the less I see the "tanky" bit. Assuming a polar bear or cave bear, you have AC 13 and 42 HP. How does this compare to a level 10 barbarian? How does the bear's multiattack compare to a barbarian with a greataxe and brutal criticals? Or a shield and a warhammer?
    Last edited by greenstone; 2019-03-27 at 10:36 PM.

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    Default Re: Druid BarBEARian

    It compares pretty poorly. Although, you do get to do plenty of fun stuff with a druid that a barb never could (like have an extra two bears backing you up, or being a giant elk for some extra damage, or being a big snake for restrain-on-hit for heaps of advantage for everyone, or krenshar yelling people prone).

    You do have a stack of HP, but druid damage tends to lag a bit.

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    Default Re: Druid BarBEARian

    Quote Originally Posted by greenstone View Post
    I think you are still going to need WIS and CHA. A lot of the spells and features commonly used against melee characters target those saving throws (you will learn to hate dominate beast).

    You also of course need STR 13, which is a bit of a waste when you spend so much time in beast shape, but you have no choice in that.



    Oh yeah! You'll probably be fighting every other PC in the party for the item, however.



    You know, the more I think about this, the less I see the "tanky" bit. Assuming a polar bear or cave bear, you have AC 13 and 42 HP. How does this compare to a level 10 barbarian? How does the bear's multiattack compare to a barbarian with a greataxe and brutal criticals? Or a shield and a warhammer?
    A level 10 Druid 9/Barbarian 1 has access to the Anklylosauraus, which has 15 ac, 68 hp, deals 21 damage with reach and knocks enemies prone on a DC 15 when they hit.

    A Druid can change into that twice per short rest. A level 10 barbarian has about 95 HP to last the entire day.

    After all that, you're still dealing with a level 9 druid with full health and spells and a list that's specialized around close-mid range combat.
    Last edited by Man_Over_Game; 2019-03-28 at 01:29 AM.

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    Default Re: Druid BarBEARian

    Quote Originally Posted by Man_Over_Game View Post
    A level 10 Druid 9/Barbarian 1 has access to the Anklylosauraus, which has 15 ac, 68 hp, deals 21 damage with reach and knocks enemies prone on a DC 15 when they hit.

    A Druid can change into that twice per short rest. A level 10 barbarian has about 95 HP to last the entire day.

    After all that, you're still dealing with a level 9 druid with full health and spells and a list that's specialized around close-mid range combat.
    Assuming your character has seen an Ankylosaurus before! I know some tables don't stick to that rule strictly, but if you're planning a build with the idea of wildshaping into a dinosaur make sure that you can put your character in a position to have seen one. (AKA ask your DM if they will let you shift into one without seeing one and/or will make sure you get the opportunity to see one)
    It would be a huge bummer to plan your power around a creature you can't actually shift into. Not that there aren't plenty of other good options for a moon druid though.

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    Default Re: Druid BarBEARian

    Quote Originally Posted by Galithar View Post
    Not that there aren't plenty of other good options for a moon druid though.
    There aren't :P

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    Default Re: Druid BarBEARian

    Quote Originally Posted by Man_Over_Game View Post
    A level 10 Druid 9/Barbarian 1 has access to the Anklylosauraus, which has 15 ac, 68 hp, deals 21 damage with reach and knocks enemies prone on a DC 15 when they hit.

    A Druid can change into that twice per short rest. A level 10 barbarian has about 95 HP to last the entire day.

    After all that, you're still dealing with a level 9 druid with full health and spells and a list that's specialized around close-mid range combat.
    So with resistance, that's 136 HP. On top of that, you can heal yourself as a bonus action for d8s, which are effectively doubled because of resistance for 9 HP each.

    The only problem with Moon Druid in my eyes is that AC score is basically dirt poor. Even as wizard can have a 16 at level one. Still, a lot of enemies will be hard pressed to drop a druid even if they hit every time.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Snowbluff View Post
    All gaming systems should be terribly flawed and exploitable if you want everyone to be happy with them. This allows for a wide variety of power levels for games for different levels of players.
    I dub this the Snowbluff Axiom.

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    Default Re: Druid BarBEARian

    Someone ran a Druid 2/Barbarian 4 version in a 6th level one-shot I ran a while back.
    BBEG's plan: sit in my Darkness and plink away at the party while I ignore this guy for now.

    That's really the only thing he could do against that, because even if I hit him, it's not doing enough to be worth it when the rest is still standing.

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    Default Re: Druid BarBEARian

    Quote Originally Posted by DarkKnightJin View Post
    Someone ran a Druid 2/Barbarian 4 version in a 6th level one-shot I ran a while back.
    BBEG's plan: sit in my Darkness and plink away at the party while I ignore this guy for now.

    That's really the only thing he could do against that, because even if I hit him, it's not doing enough to be worth it when the rest is still standing.
    And that's what Sentinel/Mage Slayer is for.
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  14. - Top - End - #14
    Barbarian in the Playground
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    Default Re: Druid BarBEARian

    I don't think the combo is nearly as good in practice as people online give it credit for. The problem is that you're enhancing an ability that you're already good at past the point where it does anything at the expense of more useful abilities, making yourself into an extreme lump. Being able to soak a lot of damage is good, but the straight druid or barbarian can do that well enough at that on their own to the point that they're rarely going to go down in a fight. Meanwhile a straight (or martial-focused) barbarian can do much more damage, while a straight druid has better control/minion/etc abilities, which means they're contributing more to the fight overall than the raging resistant ball of HP with little damage output. Compare what a straight barbarian (or maybe fighter/barb) can do with GWM and/or crit fishing, or how obnoxious a straight druid who's in an elemental form with a conjured elemental is (earth/earth is a lot of damage soak, swap around air for mobility, water for 'grapple while not grappleable' shenanigans, or fire for 'd10 damage to everyone every round').

    Since you're going with it, I'd take feats to try to boost your ability to make enemies attack you. Stuff like sentinel and mage slayer will give you an extra attack per round on your reaction. It's not as huge as the forums make it out, but it is a boost to your damage output once the DM realizes enemies should mostly ignore you. You don't need mobile, you can just soak AOOs if you don't want to take disengage.

    Quote Originally Posted by Galithar View Post
    Assuming your character has seen an Ankylosaurus before! I know some tables don't stick to that rule strictly, but if you're planning a build with the idea of wildshaping into a dinosaur make sure that you can put your character in a position to have seen one. (AKA ask your DM if they will let you shift into one without seeing one and/or will make sure you get the opportunity to see one)
    It would be a huge bummer to plan your power around a creature you can't actually shift into. Not that there aren't plenty of other good options for a moon druid though.
    It's not an unjustified assumption; at level 7 you get the polymorph spell, which doesn't have the 'must have seen the creature' requirement. So once you hit level 7, you can see any animal you want to by RAW by polymorphing a buddy into it. Obviously a DM can houserule to make your core subclass ability weaker, but that's a DM problem not a game system problem. And even if the DM is just houseruling to gimp your character (which for me is a 'OK, bye' moment), you're only one level away from being able to change into an earth elemental, which uses both wild shape charges but has better AC, tremorsense, a variety of attacks, almost twice the raw HP, a variety of resistances and immunities, and roughly the same damage output.
    Last edited by OverLordOcelot; 2019-03-28 at 09:21 AM.

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    Default Re: Druid BarBEARian

    Also, remember the other druid class ability at around this level, the Awaken spell. Having a permanent, talking buddy alongside you makes you quite a bit better on either damage or lockdown effects. Go flying as an eagle, find your buddy. Best 1000g you will spend.

    Also, this is why I always rate a Moon X/Cleric 1 combo as better than a Moon/Barb or a Moon/Monk combo. Having Bless makes you better at combat for very little resources, and the sheer spell diversity it gives you on preparation of niche stuff is excellent. Not sure when you'll find your buddy? Fine. Always have Awaken prepared. If you think Bearbarian is OP (be it the 9/1, the 7/3, or the 6/4 Moon/Barb variants at around lvl10), try a Moon 9/Cleric 1 some time. And even with concentration concerns on your spell-list, you'll wonder what you were smoking when you thought Barbs + Bears were worth even a level, let alone 3-4 of them.

    Honestly, any fighty domain is better than 2-3 rages per day for a Moon Druid. Or you can just choose whatever you want to be better at. Raging *is* nice, but more magic choice and an attack/defense/healing/whatever gimmick is quite a lot better. Rage works well with very multiattack forms (Giant Scorpion/Frilled Deathspitter/etc), whereas Domains tend to just be an extra thing you are good at, no matter what form you like (honestly, 4-5x extra War attacks a day tend to be more useful than 2-3 minutes of +2 damage raging a day. You know when you need to nova, you don't really know just how much a bit of extra damage sponging/tiny bit extra damage per attack actually made a difference in any encounter, except that it definitely meant you didn't have a spell going that was upping your damage/AC/to-hit/whatever a lot as well).

    Also, remember that you can happily cast Conjure Animals as a 4th/6th level spell. Sure, you don't get more creatures. But sometimes just having more uses of it is good enough (and makes you not mind trying out Giant Spitting Lizards, Rhinos, Krenshars, Frilled Deathspitters, Giant Spiders, etc). You get so many uses per day, that your wildshape forms are just to help that along, not to be Super-GWM-DPR man (although, Sentinel can make even your own personal damage look pretty nice in some forms. Anklysauri and stuff aren't terrible with a couple of attacks a round, especially with the odd War nova round chucked in). By about 9th-10th level, you easily have the option of always having some summons out in the average encounter if you want, even assuming 5-7'ish encounters a day, even before you worry about what sort of HP sack you'll personally become. Sometimes Polymorph is good. Sometimes Wildshape is good. But it's pretty rare when Conjure Animals and cantrip pinging isn't above average, even a slot up with no extra effect.
    Last edited by sambojin; 2019-03-28 at 10:31 AM.

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    Default Re: Druid BarBEARian

    Quote Originally Posted by DarkKnightJin View Post
    Someone ran a Druid 2/Barbarian 4 version in a 6th level one-shot I ran a while back.
    BBEG's plan: sit in my Darkness and plink away at the party while I ignore this guy for now.

    That's really the only thing he could do against that, because even if I hit him, it's not doing enough to be worth it when the rest is still standing.
    He didn't change to form with an improved senses? Like a Giant Spider with Blindsense 10 ft?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Snowbluff View Post
    All gaming systems should be terribly flawed and exploitable if you want everyone to be happy with them. This allows for a wide variety of power levels for games for different levels of players.
    I dub this the Snowbluff Axiom.

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    Default Re: Druid BarBEARian

    Anyway, for the OP'ers question, I recommend this:

    M.Dwarf Moon Druid 9/ War Cleric 1
    (honestly not too far off barb stuff, but better. Just use those spell slots on actual spells. That's what they're for. You already have enough HP).

    8Str/14Dex/14+2Con/8Int/15+1Wis/12Cha
    (27pt buy, +'s for racials, can switch Cha and Str if you want, or Int, but it's a nice spell save option and it's good to be a little talky).

    1st ASI: +2 Wis (now 18Wis/+4 modifier)
    (it's hard to not go for +2 prepared spells and better DC for them, and an extra War attack per day as well).
    2nd ASI: Sentinel
    (opportunity attacks if someone tries to move away, bargain! Stacks great with spells or War attacks, because they actually do want to get away, rather than just getting tickled by a HP sponge).

    You can sub out the Sentinel feat for Resilient: Con if you want more reliable magic, but you seem to want a melee combat focus, so that's what you get. Fairly reasonable lockdown melee. That can hit fairly hard on occasion.

    Pros: Good at everything. Except shooting.
    Cons: Uses limited resources to be so, and concentration prevents you from being good at everything at any particular time. You're just good at a thing, but it can be anything you want.

    Background: Sailor (it explains why you've seen so many weird beasts/dinos no matter where you were from, and Athletics/Perception is never bad for a Moon).

    See if you can backstory in an Awakened beast to begin with. Even if you start with less money. Because it's one of the first things you'll do anyway if you don't start with one. Try to keep it as just one though. It makes it far more likely to be DM approved.

    Growth Potential: next level is a doozy with elemental forms coming online. Can ASI in more Wis or Res:Con at 13. Just all around handy to have in a party. Hits just hard enough (or stacks DC save condition-inducing attacks enough) to stay relevant in combat, while also being a magical powerhouse. Gets stuff like Giant Snapping Turtle (plus Shield of Faith) for when you do want to go armoured (19AC isn't terrible, only large sized too, and a 4d6+4 damage attack for War bonus'ing) from the get-go, but has so many more complicated options too. Yes, you only get 4 War attacks per day. But you can easily cast a Flame Sphere and have a minute of bonus action "attacks" instead, that they will want to move away from by the end of their turn, thus triggering your Sentinel reaction. Or send in the Conjures. Or Pass without Trace around the entire problem. Or fly around it, whenever you want. Or Enhance Ability for you or your party as required. Or just Bless and cantrip spam. You have Druid resources. They are incredibly different to every other classes' resources. You'll get used to it.

    If you really, really want to, you could take a level of Monk at some time. Or of Barb. Might want to move some stats around, might not. But I think it'd be best to Druid from here on in. But if you really want a slightly better armoured or slightly hittier-but-can't-use-awesome-minute/hour-long-hitty-magic, you could take a lvl of Barb or Monk. There is that growth potential. But by about lvl9-11, Druids are all about scalable magic that just became amazing, and really "Imma just gonna do this for funsies" resource usage. They're awesome. Having War Cleric mini-action-surge attacks just makes it more fun to do wildshape stuff after this point. It won't be amazing, but it's the best you've got (for a 1lvl dip, and it's a way better dip than Fighter 2 or 3 for a Moon anyway).


    (also, see if your DM, considering you're a Dwarf without armour problems, and have the blessing of a War God saying "Yep, any weapon, any armour, all good, you know that stuff, use it", will let you wear metal armour. It'd be against everything holy if you couldn't. It's not a big thing for the character's power, but I mean, c'mon.......)


    Soooooo many things to do with a non-magic-limited Druid that's barbaric or even super-clericy. Refluff the effect as you want. Jaculi spirit swarm from Conjure Animals? That's a lot of decent rage-whirlwind/spirit-guardians doing pretty decent leaping damage. Damn perceptive/stealthy ones at that, that can meaningfully interact with the world in ways other than "Raarrrgh! Kill!!! Me spell/class-feature!"

    Repaint some stuff, or use as-is. You'll be fine. Bam. Ba-Bam! BAM! They are essentially your Dr Octopus arms. Kinda crappy, but kinda hitty too.
    Last edited by sambojin; 2019-03-28 at 03:00 PM.

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    Default Re: Druid BarBEARian

    Quote Originally Posted by SpicyBoi_Nezu View Post
    I plan on playing as a Druid 6/Barbarian 4 in my upcoming campaign, where I will be playing with a large group of First Time players.

    I have most everything planned out for him

    Hill dwarf, circle of the moon druid, wildshape into a bear, bear totem barbarian, rage in bear form, gain resistance to all damage except psychic. The standard OP druid tank build.

    I just need to know if I should take the ability score raises, or take feats. If feats, which ones would be best, preferably ones that might help me in wild shape or with rage (I'm not 100% familiar with all of 5e, since I mostly play 3.5)
    If Tough feat benefit would translate to your bear form, I'd say it's a solid choice (I'm pretty sure it's not RAI though because Tough represents how *your actual body* has improved. Not sure I would allow it too tbh).

    Otherwise, I'm not sure which feat would help you defensively. Offensively, Sentinel is the obvious choice, with Mage Slayer being a good alternative if you expect to face a lot of casters (otherwise it's best taken on a ranged build).
    Of course, you'll pick Resilient Constitution somewhere: because first you're still a Druid, and Druids have awesome spells, and second because you won't have enough rages for all fights every day.

    Prodigy feat in Athletics since, it brings a named feature, would totally be game (even if I find it very gamist ^^)
    Magic Initiate for an average +2 AC buff with Mage Armor and utility cantrips to complement your options could be nice too.
    Martial Adept could be a decent choice considering you'll be hanging for short rests anyways, a free Trip or Menacing attack are useful and very easy to fluff for a bear too. ^^

    That's about everything I see right now (there are also feats that are great on any Druid and many characters in general: Alert, Observant, Ritual Caster). But let's talk about priorities... XD

    Start with the beginning: Resilient: Constitution. You just can't go wrong with that (especially if that makes CON bump from 15 to 16) because of what said above: you're still a caster, frigging good at that too, and Moon Druid has the big merit of allowing cast and Wild Shape in the same turn and simply concentrate hereafter.

    You'll probably want to bump WIS at least to 18 whatever happens: for same reason as just above, plus it is one more prepped spell, plus it's important against all charm/fear/dominate effects.
    You'll definitely want Sentinel too to help keeping people aggro to you. And since you want to be a bear as often as possible, I'd say it comes first.

    So Sentinel at 8 and WIS at 12. After that, whatever you like.
    Quote Originally Posted by nickl_2000 View Post
    Mobile, sentinel, and Resilient con are the three best choices for feats for a druid who owns on being in wildshape most of the time
    My, how could I forget one of my all-time favorite feats? Mobile is indeed excellent. :)
    Quote Originally Posted by Man_Over_Game View Post
    A level 10 Druid 9/Barbarian 1 has access to the Anklylosauraus, which has 15 ac, 68 hp, deals 21 damage with reach and knocks enemies prone on a DC 15 when they hit.

    A Druid can change into that twice per short rest. A level 10 barbarian has about 95 HP to last the entire day.

    After all that, you're still dealing with a level 9 druid with full health and spells and a list that's specialized around close-mid range combat.
    Just lol.
    Quote Originally Posted by Galithar View Post
    Assuming your character has seen an Ankylosaurus before! I know some tables don't stick to that rule strictly,
    This.
    People should stop trying to metagame their ***** out.
    Unless DM just tells in session 0 "ok guys you'll be adventuring into a prehistorical setting" or "expect some time-travel/parallel dimension shenanigans".

    Only thing any player can count on in theory are common beasts (provided it's not a "frozen icy plane" or "full-desert" environment obviously) such as bear, wolf, domestic animals, bats etc... And the Elemental Forms since by exception to general Wild Shape there is no "must have seen" restriction (unless I misunderstand the wording ^^).

    Also, to OP, I strongly disagree that Barbarian 1 is enough to make you tanky. But it's a discussion we already "sold" with MOG in another thread so I won't restart it. ^^ (if I find the thread I'll link it).
    In short, imo you're very right to aim for Barb 4. I would start with first goal Druid 6 / Barb 1, then Druid 8 / Barb 2-3 depending on how often you meet elemental risks (optimally 2), then Druid 10 then Barb 4.

    Or, if you want to stay with bear form for whatever reason, fully embrace your vocation and go Druid 2 / Barb 1 -> Druid 3 / Barb 3 -> Druid 5 / Barb 5 -> Druid 5 / Barb X with possibly another multiclass in Life Cleric or Divine Soul Sorcerer and/or Warlock for Aid (if DM says it would convey to beast form but since it's a magical effect it's fair game imo), Fire Shield or Armor of Agathys. ^^
    Last edited by Citan; 2019-03-29 at 07:08 AM.

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    Default Re: Druid BarBEARian

    I'm not necessarily saying that you have to see dinosaurs. I'm saying that you have access to CR 3 creatures, LIKE THIS.

    Many DMs create custom creatures, or steal them from other resources. If your DM knows and understands the limitations of the Moon Druid (and he's the DM, so he should), he should recognize when the party should encounter new beasts so that your Wild Shape feature can grow.

    That was one example. If you were DMing, would you say that a level 9 Druid SHOULDN'T have a CR 3 beast form?
    Last edited by Man_Over_Game; 2019-03-29 at 10:03 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by KOLE View Post
    MOG, design a darn RPG system. Seriously, the amount of ideas I’ve gleaned from your posts has been valuable. You’re a gem of the community here.

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    Default Re: Druid BarBEARian

    Quote Originally Posted by Man_Over_Game View Post
    I'm not necessarily saying that you have to see dinosaurs. I'm saying that you have access to CR 3 creatures, LIKE THIS.

    Many DMs create custom creatures, or steal them from other resources. If your DM knows and understands the limitations of the Moon Druid (and he's the DM, so he should), he should recognize when the party should encounter new beasts so that your Wild Shape feature can grow.

    That was one example. If you were DMing, would you say that a level 9 Druid SHOULDN'T have a CR 3 beast form?
    I never said that.
    I don't think there is any reason for DM to babysit either, by deciding arbitrarily that just because Druid hit level 9 he "should" see (or "should have seen") a creature.

    It "should" just flow naturally from the world creation and adventuring events. So maybe Druid already saw some such creatures far long ago (like a Giant Scorpion because they dismantled a devilish cult located in desert and taming such), or maybe they roam in another region of the world and he'll motivate party to go there, or maybe it's a rare creature that a few specimens have been known to live in an obscure area (or a local landlort is passionate about rare creatures and keep them in a private zoo)...

    Just... You know... Not "ok, you reached level 9, tomorrow you'll see a Giant Scorpion" (in short. Official being "as you start traveling towards your objective, you hear some screeching and claps, there seem to be a peculiar creature not far. As you get closer, you discern a shape similar to a scorpion, albeit several times the usual size).

    This would be the same kind of flawed logic as something like...
    - "Hey, you know, you hit level 9. Let's say you've seen a Whale earlier, even though you live in desert".
    - "Hey, you're a Cleric, you're supposed to kick *** of undead. Good for you, I put lot"s of them in my Fire plane campaign"
    - "Hey, you're a Wizard, loot is spells for you, so no worries, every time you gain a level, you'll get a random encounter of a merchant with spell scrolls".

    Also, as a reminder, you weren't clear at all on the intent you speak of now. You *specifically* quoted Ankylosaurus, *in detail*, as it's indeed the best option usually of CR 3 beasts.
    Completely forgetting, by the way, that OP is set on role-playing a Bear druid which makes it irrelevant to thread. ^^
    Quoting you:
    A level 10 Druid 9/Barbarian 1 has access to the Anklylosauraus, which has 15 ac, 68 hp, deals 21 damage with reach and knocks enemies prone on a DC 15 when they hit.

    A Druid can change into that twice per short rest.
    Per the intent you defend now, wording "should" (many present in that post XD) have been "may have access" or "may see" or "could change".

    And if you go on the "DM create/picks custom creatures so world coherence is accessory", then it's wildly in "YMMV" category, which is equally void on a theorycraft discussion about comparative merits.
    Last edited by Citan; 2019-03-29 at 02:26 PM.

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    Default Re: Druid BarBEARian

    My bad on the Ankylosaurus choice. I had a tab of common Druid Wildshapes up, just picked out one from CR 3 and used it as an example.

    I didn't think the OP was explicitly only choosing Bears, though. People don't usually pick the Bear Totem Barbarian for its flavor, they pick it because it makes them incredibly durable. The CR 1 Bear Wild Shape form also happens to be incredibly durable and efficient as a low level form.

    I do agree on what you said, though. I feel disgusted with myself over seeing how many times I say Should. I Should probably shut up now.
    Quote Originally Posted by KOLE View Post
    MOG, design a darn RPG system. Seriously, the amount of ideas I’ve gleaned from your posts has been valuable. You’re a gem of the community here.

    5th Edition Homebrewery
    Prestige Options, changing primary attributes to open a world of new multiclassing.
    Adrenaline Surge, fitting Short Rests into combat to fix bosses/Short Rest Classes.
    Pain, using Exhaustion to make tactical martial combatants.
    Fate Sorcery, lucky winner of the 5e D&D Subclass Contest VII!

  22. - Top - End - #22
    Bugbear in the Playground
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    Default Re: Druid BarBEARian

    Quote Originally Posted by Snowbluff View Post
    He didn't change to form with an improved senses? Like a Giant Spider with Blindsense 10 ft?
    Nope. Bear the whole time.
    Not that it really mattered in the end, since the BBEG went down. Just took them a bit longer.

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    BardGuy

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    Default Re: Druid BarBEARian

    Quote Originally Posted by Man_Over_Game View Post
    My bad on the Ankylosaurus choice. I had a tab of common Druid Wildshapes up, just picked out one from CR 3 and used it as an example.

    I didn't think the OP was explicitly only choosing Bears, though. People don't usually pick the Bear Totem Barbarian for its flavor, they pick it because it makes them incredibly durable. The CR 1 Bear Wild Shape form also happens to be incredibly durable and efficient as a low level form.

    I do agree on what you said, though. I feel disgusted with myself over seeing how many times I say Should. I Should probably shut up now.
    Well... I was actually mocking *myself* on that "should" part you know... XD So we at least share responsability here ^^

    Also, I may have misunderstood OP, but probably not considering he stated the "bear" word like 5 times in post... XD

    So I'd suggest we try and find ways to improve his Beariness to highest levels o/
    Not sure how though... At least not without difficult multiclassing... ^^
    Last edited by Citan; 2019-03-29 at 06:35 PM.

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