Personal Woes and Advice 6

[darkrose50]

They are flying in trainers ~800-miles from home office today. They are not insurance agent trainers, but are customer service trainers. I wanted to show my new managers the manual that they made for us last year, but EVERYONE threw it away.

We will likely spend half the day role-playing (not the good kind) on how to talk to people over the phone . . . what we do every day.

We will likely ask a bunch of insurance agent questions that they will not know the answers to. They will take the questions down, and tell us that they will get back to us, and then never do. About 20% of the time they will bring an insurance agent manager who knows stuff.

They will likely hand out charts full of copious mistakes. Other than the wrong information here or there, they will often forget titles and years. The year for a chart is crazy important, as things change from year-to-year (printed on stacks of vinyl). 2019 prices, and 2020 prices could be wildly different. They will use different terms for the same thing, and not explain why (aside from being confusing to me, it is confusing to the customer even more). They will toss in *'s and not explain what they mean.

It drives my OCD nuts.

[Illven]

Id be better off dead.

[HalfTangible]

Id be better off dead.

That isn't true.

[The Fury]

Id be better off dead.

Why do you say that? Don't get me wrong, I've felt that way too. Even if it feels true, it isn't.

[WarKitty]

Id be better off dead.

I've been there. It will pass.

I hope I'm not being nosy but I looked at your post history. You mentioned the anniversary of your mom's death. That sounds like a pretty hard time - I don't know how long it's been or how close you were or anything, of course. But I know that's a pretty emotional time for a lot of people.

You don't need to worry about the future right now. Just take it one day at a time and make sure you get enough good food and some sleep as best you can.

[FinnLassie]

Grandpa's memory has plummeted. He now is off to take care of our foals and horses as he visits the farm.

The last horses were put down in 2014.

[sktarq]

That kind of deterioration is...hard...and can be emotionally devastating for the people close to the person.

I hope you have people close to you that can support you through this.
And don't be afraid to talk about some of the big questions of what-is-self, the emotion that i can only call anticipatory-grief, etc even if those topics don't seem totally relevant. They are. Those kinds of thoughts and having to psychologically deal with them are important. Just as much as him being frustrating or the like.

And also hope that you still have some time when he is aware and lucid...treasure it, drink every moment while you can. As hard as it can be to watch, regretting avoiding it is likely to be worse in the future.


If you have not dealt with it before...very much pick your battles...unless it is going to be an active problem (like unsafe driving for example) don't be pushy about having to correct everything, its not worth it.

Sadly there is often not as much classical social support for this kind of deterioration and loss as there is for say, a sudden death in the family etc. So things can get weird.

[FinnLassie]

Thanks. I've been expecting this, but it still hurts. I've not been able to visit my grandparents since, oh hell, May or June? And now this summer things have taken a turn, and clearly September hasn't served him any better.

His memory has been finicky for a couple of years now. I've been the person reporting my family about the changes - up until this summer, I made sure to visit them every 2-3 months. But after last christmas, when gramps had a... sort of a seizure due to his specific form of arthritis, I've just not recovered from it. It's still super painful. It feels awful.

[sktarq]

Yeah...it will feel awful.

Not much youcan directly do.
Depending on how aware he is of the problem and what the nature of it is, keeping mentally active with things like puzzles etc may slow it down, but its kinda late to make such changes but may be worth seeing a doctor about.

Be strong,
Don't be all stereotypical silent suffering Scandinavian - talk to people (friends, hopefully councilors at uni, a priest if that's your deal)

i wish you all the best, PM if you need,
And you have my sympathies

[FinnLassie]

It's kinda hard to be like those pesky Scandinavians, when I'm not one. Finland's not a part of Scandinavia, but the Nordic countries.

[sktarq]

It's kinda hard to be like those pesky Scandinavians, when I'm not one. Finland's not a part of Scandinavia, but the Nordic countries.

Yeah....but I thought you were from Bergen

[HalfTangible]

Had a bit of an episode last night. I curled up into myself in my hotel room (I was at a convention) and started saying "I don't deserve to live" over and over and couldn't stop for a few minutes. I sobbed into my pillows for a while, felt worthless and alone. 2 hours before that I'd been happy and skipping around Delta H Con, enjoying myself. It wasn't set off by anything in particular as far as I can tell, it just kinda happened.

I'm feeling better now. Talked with some friends about it. One of them pointed out to me that my mood has been on a downward trend for months, and I've talking every morning about things I don't wanna bring up here. It didn't feel like a big deal in isolation, just something I had to deal with when I woke up in the morning, but the fact that it kept happening often enough that she'd noticed it as a trend was... a bit of an eye opener.

I thought I'd been doing better, and in some ways I have. But others... not so much.

[sktarq]

What is it about me when I'm barely barely holding it together, want to scream in grief from a death in family, that suddenly makes me far more approachable for small talk by total strangers?
Normally I wouldn't mind.
But now?

[Recherché]

My father died less than a month ago and people I barely know keep trying to be buddies with me and asking me to talk about it. I think they mean well but its still more emotionally distressing than helpful. I have my people that I'm close to. They're the people I'm crying with. They're the ones who know that I can't sleep because I keep having nightmares about his body. The acquaintances who keep trying to be helpful are not them and it brings up the pain more than it helps.

[sktarq]

Weirdly that sounds like a time when social rituals could be helpful....and I'm sorry for your loss...that sounds like it hurts.

[toysailor]

Revisiting some of my old internet hangouts.

Time sure flies. Graduated, got a job, got married, got divorced, got depressed, got better. Life has its ups and downs, but I reckon if we never give up and keep trying, everything's gonna be alright.

Stay gold everyone.

[Grytorm]

I feel like going on about something, but I don't have anything in particular to talk about. I could berate myself and how I am not getting much done but that hasn't felt overwhelming as of late. I could talk about ongoing loneliness of course and how I sort of have a crush on a woman who works at the cattery I volunteer at. But at the same time I kind of recognize more a desire for intimacy that tends to latch onto women near my age out of desperation and general ineptitude. She is friendly and involved in RPG stuff and a LARP, so I do want to be friends with her as well. Typing further stuff from here seems difficult because I cannot decide between asking for advice on how to not make a fool of myself and going on a relatively short extended pity party where I call myself a fool for having hope and expressing self loathing for my difficulty maintaining functional friendships and with women I have pined over. It would probably be easier if I was any good at maintaining functional relationships with anyone. Also if I had a better understanding of how to talk to people and what I want out of those who might be friends and acquaintances.

Edit: Hiding out of sight behind a fence is so much easier.

Also, sorry if this was incomprehensible gibberish. I am at times bad at communicating.

[jdizzlean]

I feel like going on about something, but I don't have anything in particular to talk about. I could berate myself and how I am not getting much done but that hasn't felt overwhelming as of late. I could talk about ongoing loneliness of course and how I sort of have a crush on a woman who works at the cattery I volunteer at. But at the same time I kind of recognize more a desire for intimacy that tends to latch onto women near my age out of desperation and general ineptitude. She is friendly and involved in RPG stuff and a LARP, so I do want to be friends with her as well. Typing further stuff from here seems difficult because I cannot decide between asking for advice on how to not make a fool of myself and going on a relatively short extended pity party where I call myself a fool for having hope and expressing self loathing for my difficulty maintaining functional friendships and with women I have pined over. It would probably be easier if I was any good at maintaining functional relationships with anyone. Also if I had a better understanding of how to talk to people and what I want out of those who might be friends and acquaintances.

Edit: Hiding out of sight behind a fence is so much easier.

Also, sorry if this was incomprehensible gibberish. I am at times bad at communicating.

it doesn't have to start out romantic, she likes rpg/larp, and you do to apparently, start there. be friends first, then see if there's more. putting all the pressure on yourself to be something in the beginning just makes it harder. small steps forward.

[Rydiro]

it doesn't have to start out romantic, she likes rpg/larp, and you do to apparently, start there. be friends first, then see if there's more. putting all the pressure on yourself to be something in the beginning just makes it harder. small steps forward.

On the other hand, thats not a good move towards a romantic relationship. Basically you are friendzoning yourself.
I agree that friendship is probably the best thing to aim for atm. But be honest with yourself. If you find out you definately want more at some point, be honest and tell her.

[FinnLassie]

On the other hand, thats not a good move towards a romantic relationship. Basically you are friendzoning yourself.
I agree that friendship is probably the best thing to aim for atm. But be honest with yourself. If you find out you definately want more at some point, be honest and tell her.

I don't understand how that's friendzoning himself? I've noticed that relationships have been much better when you've built a friendship before a romantic relationship.

Like, forming a platonic relationship with a person doesn't harm anyone, as long as you as a person decide that ok, this is the goal. The important thing is to not expect things to go to the romantic territory as you enter the relationship, the job is to get to know to people. I know some guys think I've friendzoned them, but in reality they tried to become friends with me just to make me like them and become a couple.

Of course it's easier said than done, first becoming friends someone that you think you might like. Grytorm, as you said yourself, you're not sure where the possible crush stems from - is it out of the feeling of need, or pure interest? I've been there, and it can feel like hell. And in my case, I've hurt myself and others when I've entered a relationship and then realised it was just because I thought I liked someone, when in reality I had a couple of issues to deal with. So, now, it's best to tread with care, and be kind to yourself. Get to know this person. And at the same time, get to know yourself. If you feel uncertainty or need help, then you're always welcome here to ask for advice... just as you did now.

[Rydiro]

Like, forming a platonic relationship with a person doesn't harm anyone, as long as you as a person decide that ok, this is the goal. The important thing is to not expect things to go to the romantic territory as you enter the relationship, the job is to get to know to people. I know some guys think I've friendzoned them, but in reality they tried to become friends with me just to make me like them and become a couple.

Yes I meant that last thing. Its a bad idea to use friendship as a vehicle to get into a relationship. Thats when a friendship really does hurt at least one side.

So friendships are a bad way to 'get' romantic partners.

[Grytorm]

Nods. I'm just really bad at friendship stuff at least, I think I am. I guess in a way I don't know what I want out of friendships and that makes me attempts at navigating interpersonal relationships more difficult. I think I probably would end up a jerk if I didn't react to mild social censure with massive feelings of guilt and a strong desire to isolate myself. Like the time I spent a week during a study abroad trying to not look directly at any of my classmates after a series of really stupid text messages. Thinking about it still makes me feel like an awful person which I probably deserve.

Part of the problem is that I am not very good at reaching out socially. I had about one friend in high school and pretty much very rarely spent time with anyone outside of class. In my one year living in a college dormitory I only spent time with others in the dorm outside of stuff organized by the RA a handful of times. That time, that time, that time, that time, that time, and that time. Six times. And twice at a game store.

Was tpying more but my time at community college was the happiest I had been since high school and I had friends on the bus which I took to get into the small city from where I lived with my parents in the country. Played some Magic the Gathering. Stuff. Posted here several times about loneliness and hopeless crushes. Then that came to an end.

Back to the university, a closer one so I could still live with my parents. I gradually became more isolated. Normal stuff for me. No connections with my classmates outside of class. Bungled attempt at getting a date ended up with one of the few friends who consistently talks to me. Went to Mexico. Sent stupid texts. Felt very ashamed. Did social things with the group maybe three times (outside of program stuff). Came back. Continued to live in isolation with the bonus that thanks to the text messages and further idiocy I ended up strongly averse to everyone who I could have been friends with from the program and would freak out and take evasive maneuvers at the sight of them. Also was in a social connectedness group for a while but lost contact due to changes in schedule.

Other things happen as they do. Joined a gaming group thing which is kind of open to people just showing up. Do volunteer work cleaning up after numerous cats.

That reminds me of the another thing where I dropped almost all involvement with a local library because of a bad experience with a staff member there I had thought of as a friend. Doesn't really matter.

Remembering and typing all this. Emotionally it has had little effect on my mood. In general I have been more depressed since the last post but typing this doesn't seem to have mattered much. While typing the process of remembering wasn't particularly emotional. But now as I wrap up my mind is drifting a little towards hopelessness and the prospects of inescapable isolation. And to a lesser extent my feelings that at twenty five I have wasted my youth and potential and that everything going forward will be ash compared to what could have been.

[halfeye]

to a lesser extent my feelings that at twenty five I have wasted my youth and potential and that everything going forward will be ash compared to what could have been.

Albert Einstein didn't have any chance of being Neil Armstrong, and Neil Armstrong couldn't have been Albert Einstein.

[Bartmanhomer]

Hey everybody. I feel very lonely. A good friend of mine that I know from another forum left a few weeks due to some issues with another member of that forum. She always critiques my Pathfinder Fan-fiction stories and we write letters together. Now I feel very lonely without her and I've no one to talk to. I feel very sad.

[Velaryon]

I've found myself in a bit of a moral quandary (perhaps of my own making, after a fashion) and I'm not sure what to do. I don't know that this thread is really the place for it, and if not please feel free to ignore me or for a mod to delete my post.

Here's the short version:

Spoiler: Tl;dr Version

Show

A close friend of mine has been deliberately excluded from a social gathering to which I have been invited, among people he also considers friends. I feel trapped between respecting the hosts' decision to invite whom they please and loyalty to my friend, and am unsure whether I should/want to attend.

Now for the detailed version:

Spoiler: Detailed Version

Show

One of my friends (let's call him R) has been left off the guest list for an annual party to which R has been invited in past years, and to which I also am invited. I inquired of the hosts (L and A) whether it was intentional because R has been forgotten about a couple times in the past, and learned that it was on purpose. I was given two reasons: first, because they thought another friend they're closer to (Z) was on somewhat bad terms with R, and second because they felt R had been distant with them regarding some difficulties L and A went through this year (for example, L had some serious health issues and R never spoke to them or offered encouragement or help or anything).

With regard to Z, there may be some lingering issues between him and R but I do not know details. I do know that they are civil and seem to be fine talking and hanging out, as I talk to them both a lot (and sometimes together). I also know that R can be a bit oblivious and that Z shies away from conflict and has a bad habit of not telling people when he's upset with them.

With regard to L and A's situation, I think it's very likely that R was out of the loop. Most of their updates on L's health problems were given to friends via a group chat on Messenger to which R was never invited, so it's not fair to fault him for being unaware of anything said there. R also has difficult work hours that limit his social availability, which makes it easier to forget about him when it comes to including him in stuff.

None of which is my business. I respect L and A's right to choose whom to invite and not invite to their party. Here's where I have a problem though: I am severely uncomfortable with situations in which a group of people, particularly friends, deliberately excludes someone. It stems from having this done to me in childhood when one friend whom I fought with frequently used to influence other friends to hang out and exclude me. I've also been in situations where I'm invited into a group thing where someone is being deliberately excluded, and I feel deeply uncomfortable and guilty when I'm there.

I know it's dumb to feel caught between friends when I'm the only one putting myself there, but this is a huge sticking point for me and I will feel terrible about myself if I feel like I'm letting down a friend by participating in their exclusion.

I know that R would want to go to this party and that his feelings would be hurt if he finds out he's not being invited (to my knowledge he is not yet aware of this). I also have been looking forward to this party, but am unsure how much I want to go if one of my best friends is unwelcome, not just on his behalf but because I know I will feel uncomfortable and guilty if I am there.

Should I skip the party out of loyalty to a friend who has not asked me to do any such thing? Should I go and try to ignore any feelings of discomfort or letting R down? Should I just mind my own business and go/not go as I feel like, independently of what else is going on?

[Tvtyrant]

I've found myself in a bit of a moral quandary (perhaps of my own making, after a fashion) and I'm not sure what to do. I don't know that this thread is really the place for it, and if not please feel free to ignore me or for a mod to delete my post.

Here's the short version:

Spoiler: Tl;dr Version

Show

A close friend of mine has been deliberately excluded from a social gathering to which I have been invited, among people he also considers friends. I feel trapped between respecting the hosts' decision to invite whom they please and loyalty to my friend, and am unsure whether I should/want to attend.

Now for the detailed version:

Spoiler: Detailed Version

Show

One of my friends (let's call him R) has been left off the guest list for an annual party to which R has been invited in past years, and to which I also am invited. I inquired of the hosts (L and A) whether it was intentional because R has been forgotten about a couple times in the past, and learned that it was on purpose. I was given two reasons: first, because they thought another friend they're closer to (Z) was on somewhat bad terms with R, and second because they felt R had been distant with them regarding some difficulties L and A went through this year (for example, L had some serious health issues and R never spoke to them or offered encouragement or help or anything).

With regard to Z, there may be some lingering issues between him and R but I do not know details. I do know that they are civil and seem to be fine talking and hanging out, as I talk to them both a lot (and sometimes together). I also know that R can be a bit oblivious and that Z shies away from conflict and has a bad habit of not telling people when he's upset with them.

With regard to L and A's situation, I think it's very likely that R was out of the loop. Most of their updates on L's health problems were given to friends via a group chat on Messenger to which R was never invited, so it's not fair to fault him for being unaware of anything said there. R also has difficult work hours that limit his social availability, which makes it easier to forget about him when it comes to including him in stuff.

None of which is my business. I respect L and A's right to choose whom to invite and not invite to their party. Here's where I have a problem though: I am severely uncomfortable with situations in which a group of people, particularly friends, deliberately excludes someone. It stems from having this done to me in childhood when one friend whom I fought with frequently used to influence other friends to hang out and exclude me. I've also been in situations where I'm invited into a group thing where someone is being deliberately excluded, and I feel deeply uncomfortable and guilty when I'm there.

I know it's dumb to feel caught between friends when I'm the only one putting myself there, but this is a huge sticking point for me and I will feel terrible about myself if I feel like I'm letting down a friend by participating in their exclusion.

I know that R would want to go to this party and that his feelings would be hurt if he finds out he's not being invited (to my knowledge he is not yet aware of this). I also have been looking forward to this party, but am unsure how much I want to go if one of my best friends is unwelcome, not just on his behalf but because I know I will feel uncomfortable and guilty if I am there.

Should I skip the party out of loyalty to a friend who has not asked me to do any such thing? Should I go and try to ignore any feelings of discomfort or letting R down? Should I just mind my own business and go/not go as I feel like, independently of what else is going on?

I'm going to just call L and A: LA to save time. LA seem to be moving to cut R out of their lives or don't consider R important to begin with. They have forgotten R on occasions before, they did not message R about the illness, and now they are deliberately excluding R from their meetings.

There is a good chance that R is going to be lifted out of the group. If R is socially awkward this might be someone finally deciding to fix the broken stair, and everyone else is now aware of that issue (broken stair is a metaphor for allowing moderately toxic individuals to continue within a group out of momentum.) LA might have disliked R before and now has an excuse to exclude R, or other issues could be going on you aren't aware of.

I would talk to the other individuals in the group and see what they think. If you are adults chances are you can just be friends with both groups, but excluding yourself in protest will likely just see you cut out as well.

[HalfTangible]

January and February was a very, VERY bad pair of months for me. And not because of the forum going down.

See, my pappaw (grandfather on mom's side) needed to go into the hospital for surgery on one of his major arteries near the heart. He's gonna be laid low for a couple months. The surgery went fine and he's in good spirits now, that wasn't the main problem. The problem was Mammaw. She's been going through dementia for a few years now, and she can't be left alone. Pappaw has been seeing to her physical needs, but after major heart surgery, that's no longer an option, he needs to rest. Which she won't let him do. So for 2-3 months (around 1-2 left now) we need to take care of her at our house. We knew it'd be difficult, but our aunt couldn't take her (because there isn't always someone home in their house).

Hoo boy. There is not a word in the english dictionary to describe how much of an understatement "this is gonna be hard" was.

She will not let my mother sleep more than a few winks and requires that someone be in the room with her every hour of every day. She needs a massive breakfast every morning that requires a lot of cooking. Medicine every 5 hours. She forgets things within a minute of you telling her and will argue incessantly with you that she did not do a thing you clearly just saw her do. She needs her diaper changed but can't physically do it herself without help, which falls on me because I'm the only person in the house with fully functioning legs. My personal highlight has got to be taking a dump on top of the toilet seat (not the lid, the seat), then laying one on the nightstand that we didn't find for a few hours.

We hired some professional help for her physical needs, including a shower. She quit after the second day because of some truly disgusting and unsanitary conditions in the house. Trash was shoved into the pantry and under the sink, there was poop in her pants and on her bathrobe (this was the same day that the poop on the toilet seat and nightstand happened). I do not blame her in the slightest for quitting; I spent most of the time that she was there looking after mammaw just trying to get the house back into workable conditions. (We've hired some more help that will be coming three times a week)

Meanwhile my aunt went to clean out Mammaw and Pappaw's house a bit, and while I haven't seen it myself, it's become abundantly clear that Pappaw has only been able to take care of her immediate needs. Just enough so that we didn't realize how bad she'd gotten. We did visit on occasion, but a thorough cleaning has revealed trash everywhere, mildew and other things that make the situation truly appalling.

I have no idea how pappaw managed to keep up with this. Mom's at the end of her rope and so am I. I'm trying to help how I can (primarily by staying with mammaw a few hours so that mom can get some sleep) but I can't do that permanently. Mammaw relies a ton on my mom and there's only so much I can do to support them while also job-hunting (which isn't going well and I've basically given up on it until this **** is over if I'm honest). Mom tells me she was always selfish, but the dementia has made it so much worse. Not ten minutes before writing this post she took mom's medicine instead of her own and wouldn't let go of it (she managed to take a potassium supplement and I had to pry the other pill out of her hand). The fact that my mother is in a wheelchair is not helping matters for obvious reasons. It's like looking after someone else's cat but it talks back to you.

And now mom wants pappaw to come here tomorrow while he's recovering, to stay with us while aunt's part of the family finishes cleaning out their house. This is a terrible, TERRIBLE idea and I have made my disapproval as clear as I can.

[Sermil]

January and February was a very, VERY bad pair of months for me. And not because of the forum going down.

Ugh, I feel for you. Dementia is the worst. Having to fight the person you're trying to help is so, so hard.

Not much useful to say, but sympathy.

[The Fury]

So, I'm having some trouble with a friend. In particular I'm not sure if it's better for me to be emotionally closer or give him some space. I feel like he might be a little afraid to tell me what he needs from me because he's said that he feels bad about asking me for things. Even though I've outright told him that it's OK and I don't mind.

It doesn't help that I have my own issues with this sort of thing too. I've gotten so used to rejection that unless people specifically say that they want me around, I usually assume that they don't.

A scenario I keep playing over is a day where my friend had a pretty bad emotional breakdown. It was on a day where we normally meet up in the afternoon, usually with one or two other people. I let him know that I was still available but made a note to myself to not take it personally if he just needs space. Also, not take it personally if he doesn't want to tell me about the breakdown. Eventually he did invite me to meet up with two other people in the library. He even told me about the breakdown, (I won't get into the specifics here. Even though I'm not using any real names, it just feels really inappropriate.) Later my friend said that he needed to go to the store and asked if anyone wanted to go with him. The other two people there volunteered before I could say anything. Since someone needed to stay behind to save our spot, I took this to mean it should be me. Then my friend said, "Oh, you're both coming? ...I sort of hoped that The Fury would go with me."

Neither of the two seemed keen on the idea of staying behind. One of them suggested that my friend choose who goes with him. This made him visibly uncomfortable, so I tried my best to defuse the situation with, "It's OK. Both of you really seem to want to go, and someone needs to stay. It can be me, I don't mind."

I'm not sure that I handled that quite right. I love my friend very much and I want to do right by him, I just worry that I'm not quite the friend he needs right now. For that matter I don't know if the right thing is to try to get closer or back off.

[dehro]

Kinda hard to give solid advice with no details to go by. From what you wrote however, you seem to be a considerate friend who is thinking about other people's welfare and who's heart is on the right place. Whether you're friend recognises that depends on their mental state and general empathy/closeness towards you.
It seems to me you're doing the best you can.