Personal Woes and Advice 6

[Mith]

Words of wisdom are appreciated.

I play as a floorball goalkeeper. It is a pretty "grounded" position and my stance is almost always quite low, as seen in this picture. Sometimes opposition players stand in front of me, with their back at me, to block my view (i.e. interference). So far this has meant that there is a man's butt in front of my face, which means that I have to peak behind his waist and butt to see the ball.

Recently, I have played against a young woman, whose repertoire includes creating the aforementioned interference. There is something about having a female butt almost on my face during the games, and I have tried to analyze what it is my problem with this. I feel that men and women should be treated in the same way when we play (and everywhere, for that matter), and I am afraid that I might be sexually objectifying her if I looked at her butt from close range. That is why I try keep distance from her butt and position my face far from her butt, but this spoils my game. Nevertheless, I want to show that I am there to play the game and not look at her butt. On the other hand, my behavior is exactly the opposite from what I intend. I should behave in the same way with her butt almost on my face as I behave with a man's butt almost on my face. However, I feel uncomfortable in some undefined way when she does that and I have problems assessing my thoughts on the matter.

This is an example of blocking goalkeeper's sight, except that in her case, she is always facing the field and waiting:

To me, if you are not making specific objectifying instances on this, it shouldn't be an issue. However, I have never been on the receiving end of such instances, so take my attention with a grain of salt. But I would imagine that genuinely indiscriminate interactions feel very different than objectifying attention.

[el minster]

That actually sounds like a very good tactic to distract you with

[Kesnit]

I just need to rant...

I understand the “spoons” concept. But there comes a point where you just have to suck it up and keep going. The buck has to stop with someone, and if you are that someone, it doesn’t matter if you are tired, or stressed. You have to keep going because whatever it is has to be done. Out of spoons? Grab a fork.

I’m exhausted and stressed. But you know what - I’m still plugging along and doing what has to be done. Whining isn’t going to get anything accomplished. Taking a break just means everything is put on hold to be done later, along with all the new things that came up while I was ignoring the old.

I’m not superhuman. I am just human. I push though, crying but still going. And it makes me so mad that others can dump everything in me, knowing I’ll take care of it because I have to. Because I don’t subscribe to the “out of spoons” excuse. Because I take responsibility for my responsibilities.

[Mith]

I just need to rant...

I understand the “spoons” concept. But there comes a point where you just have to suck it up and keep going. The buck has to stop with someone, and if you are that someone, it doesn’t matter if you are tired, or stressed. You have to keep going because whatever it is has to be done. Out of spoons? Grab a fork.

I’m exhausted and stressed. But you know what - I’m still plugging along and doing what has to be done. Whining isn’t going to get anything accomplished. Taking a break just means everything is put on hold to be done later, along with all the new things that came up while I was ignoring the old.

I’m not superhuman. I am just human. I push though, crying but still going. And it makes me so mad that others can dump everything in me, knowing I’ll take care of it because I have to. Because I don’t subscribe to the “out of spoons” excuse. Because I take responsibility for my responsibilities.

I think the issue with "spoons" is that it got applied beyond it's function.

"Just push through it" doesn't work with executive dysfunction, or pain that means your limbs don't work quite right.

However, those who use "out of spoons" to avoid responsibilities are really applying the concept wrong, and thus weakening the strength of the concept.

[Tvtyrant]

My life has officially become, like, every Buck Owens song ever, y'all.

Spoiler: A whole lotta words

Show

I've been seeing this lady for the past couple of months-- we started dating back in May but we first met as classmates during our first semester at university and started really getting to know each other and spending time together around January. When my neck of the woods started going into lockdown due to the pandemic, she started inviting me around to her place, and I wound up spending every weekend for like a month and a half there, sitting on her couch and talking for hours about books and art and music and travel and politics and, you know, the whole shebang. We'd trade books, she'd give me one of hers and I'd give her one of mine, read them over the week, and then talk about them at her place. Turned out later that she'd been dropping hints throughout that time trying to get me to ask her out, which I eventually did.

I'm head over heels for her. Just for context, I'm 24 and in all my life-- all through high school and the early college years-- while I went on dates and saw people casually, I've never really found myself drawn to anybody or felt even a glimmer of being in love. So she's pretty special to me just by virtue of that, and it feels like we've shared some pretty special moments too.

If you're waiting for the 'but' in the story, here it is: but lately, I've had a sense that something's off. We've been texting back and forth much less the last couple of weeks, and that's at least partially on me-- there's definitely been times that I took a little too long to respond, a couple or a few days. But the cherry on top right now is that we last saw each other on Monday, and that night, I sent her a text to the effect of 'hey, sorry for the late text, I just wanted to wish you a good night and to say it was really nice seeing you today. I missed you :)'. Guess how that turned out?

If you guessed 'it's now Friday morning and Comrade ain't heard so much as a word back', I salute you and your perspicacity. So now I'm over here worried sick, and honestly just confused, because while I'm not the most perceptive man on the planet, I'm almost certain that if something were wrong, I'd have noticed the last couple of times we spent time together. If she'd been distant, if she'd been kinda quiet, if she wasn't really laughing and joking around, if she'd been avoiding physical contact-- I would've picked up on those things. But none of that was the case. Before I left her place on Monday she was in my arms with her hand stroking mine, we were joking around just like we usually do (she joked the second-to-last time I saw her that she was determined to get me to wear shorts, or really any non-jeans manner of lower body accoutrement), shoot, she even called me 'honey' on Monday, which was the first time either of us had used any kind of pet name like that. We made plans to see each other again the following Monday and I left feeling like nothing was noticeably different or wrong.

So, you know, there's a part of me that's holding out hope that, hey, maybe nothing's wrong between us. Maybe there's something going on in her personal life that I'm just not privy to. Maybe she didn't see the text. Maybe she's still annoyed at me for that time I didn't text her back for a few days. Maybe she just didn't feel it needed a response. Maybe, maybe, maybe. But there's another part of me that's got no stomach for wishful thinking, and that part of me has a real bad feeling that this thing we've got going ain't long for this world. Worse still, that she isn't planning to text me back at all, that she's just gonna ghost on me. Which is a real hard thing to think about, 'cause like I said, she's pretty special to me, and right now it feels like I couldn't possibly be less special to her.

If I don't hear back by tomorrow I'm probably gonna shoot her another text and ask if we can meet up real quick to talk, since if we're gonna part ways I'd at least rather do it in person. I just wanted to get this all off my chest 'cause it's sure been getting me down and like Buck Owens said, I don't want my friends knowin' that I feel so blue.

Spoiler

Show

Sounds like you should invite her for breakfast or lunch. Don't ambush her, just a "hey do you want to come over for lunch" would suffice. Especially if it has been okay to go several days between responses before now she might not think anything of it.

[2D8HP]

My life has officially become, like, every Buck Owens song ever, y'all.

Spoiler: A whole lotta words

Show

I've been seeing this lady for the past couple of months-- we started dating back in May but we first met as classmates during our first semester at university and started really getting to know each other and spending time together around January. When my neck of the woods started going into lockdown due to the pandemic, she started inviting me around to her place, and I wound up spending every weekend for like a month and a half there, sitting on her couch and talking for hours about books and art and music and travel and politics and, you know, the whole shebang. We'd trade books, she'd give me one of hers and I'd give her one of mine, read them over the week, and then talk about them at her place. Turned out later that she'd been dropping hints throughout that time trying to get me to ask her out, which I eventually did.

I'm head over heels for her. Just for context, I'm 24 and in all my life-- all through high school and the early college years-- while I went on dates and saw people casually, I've never really found myself drawn to anybody or felt even a glimmer of being in love. So she's pretty special to me just by virtue of that, and it feels like we've shared some pretty special moments too.

If you're waiting for the 'but' in the story, here it is: but lately, I've had a sense that something's off. We've been texting back and forth much less the last couple of weeks, and that's at least partially on me-- there's definitely been times that I took a little too long to respond, a couple or a few days. But the cherry on top right now is that we last saw each other on Monday, and that night, I sent her a text to the effect of 'hey, sorry for the late text, I just wanted to wish you a good night and to say it was really nice seeing you today. I missed you :)'. Guess how that turned out?

If you guessed 'it's now Friday morning and Comrade ain't heard so much as a word back', I salute you and your perspicacity. So now I'm over here worried sick, and honestly just confused, because while I'm not the most perceptive man on the planet, I'm almost certain that if something were wrong, I'd have noticed the last couple of times we spent time together. If she'd been distant, if she'd been kinda quiet, if she wasn't really laughing and joking around, if she'd been avoiding physical contact-- I would've picked up on those things. But none of that was the case. Before I left her place on Monday she was in my arms with her hand stroking mine, we were joking around just like we usually do (she joked the second-to-last time I saw her that she was determined to get me to wear shorts, or really any non-jeans manner of lower body accoutrement), shoot, she even called me 'honey' on Monday, which was the first time either of us had used any kind of pet name like that. We made plans to see each other again the following Monday and I left feeling like nothing was noticeably different or wrong.

So, you know, there's a part of me that's holding out hope that, hey, maybe nothing's wrong between us. Maybe there's something going on in her personal life that I'm just not privy to. Maybe she didn't see the text. Maybe she's still annoyed at me for that time I didn't text her back for a few days. Maybe she just didn't feel it needed a response. Maybe, maybe, maybe. But there's another part of me that's got no stomach for wishful thinking, and that part of me has a real bad feeling that this thing we've got going ain't long for this world. Worse still, that she isn't planning to text me back at all, that she's just gonna ghost on me. Which is a real hard thing to think about, 'cause like I said, she's pretty special to me, and right now it feels like I couldn't possibly be less special to her.

If I don't hear back by tomorrow I'm probably gonna shoot her another text and ask if we can meet up real quick to talk, since if we're gonna part ways I'd at least rather do it in person. I just wanted to get this all off my chest 'cause it's sure been getting me down and like Buck Owens said, I don't want my friends knowin' that I feel so blue.

Oh jeez, if you're 24 I assume she is too, in my experience (and the statistics I've seen) women that young are less interested in being someone's exclusive girlfriend, in many ways her gal pal's will be far closer to her, and who she mostly wants to spend time with, with a series of guys she's friendly but not "serious" with. She's much more likely to more interested in having an exclusive romantic relationship when she's closer to 30 years old, unfortunately that's the age when men start to stray more because that's the way of the world.
FWLIW I did get a permanent (with some hiccups) girlfriend when I was 24, but she was 29.

Spoiler: Some of my romantic history in my 20's

Show

[...]My first love and first real girlfriend was only 16/17 to my 19/20 and she was also 'spending time with' (cue Biz Markie) an "about 30 years old" man who gave her the Wire's 1977 "Pink Flag" album, and after I shared with her a bunch of albums she told me about it (and where she got it from) and we'd listen to it together.

After my tearful breakup with "K" it was 1989, I was now 21 years old and going to see Helios Creed in San Francisco, on the way to which I saw "N", an older than me (not yet but closer to 30 than 20) very Punk girl who was also going to the gig who I befriended back when I was 18 when we were both worked the refreshment stand at a local club (the one Green Day started in), I was surprised to see her back in California, and she was a different first to me before she left California again. Some months later I visited her in Ottawa where we went to a record shop that had pretty pricey British imports including "Pink Flag" which I paid $20 Canadian dollars (about $15 U.S.) for, which was the most money I ever spent on any piece of media until the late '90's, but I finally had my own copy of Wire's 1977 "Pink Flag", and it's 21 (short) songs.

Ottawa was weird, so clean it felt like a film set, we went to one Punk Rock show together (with an amazingly peaceful audience), crossed over to Francophone Hull, and visited a museum in Montreal. Montreal, despite being a French speaking city, felt more "American" somehow than Ottawa. The last day before I returned to returned to California she told me "Thank you for making me love you again", I sent her letters afterwards, she sent one back apologizing that she "Can't love you the same way" and I never saw her again,

I still have "Pink Flag", I still treasure it, and listen to it a lot, one of my favorite songs on it is the beautiful "Fragile":

♪♫♬
Tears fall in slivers, you broke my shades
The light too bright, let me bury my heart
Filter emotions of green, cowardicee gives blue
A restricted view, let me open my heart
I have a fleeting love
Searching when it lands
Fragile, needing precious hands
Fragile
You eat my energy, give me more rope
Nail in the wall, let me hang my heart
I have a fleeting love
Searching when it lands
Fragile, needing precious hands
♪♫♬

which is immediately followed by the ANTI-love song "Mannequin"
the lyrics of which I have often ached to say to bosses and co-workers.
Mannequin has been often recorded by other artists (and often sounds romantic despite the lyrics), but I've only seen it performed once, at a house party hosted by KALX D.J. Lisa Albright/Anaconda, where the band there that night performed it, and that night is the last time I saw the beautiful "J" before her suicide. We were both KALX volunteers, went on a few dates together, but that night we only spoke briefly as she was with a guy who stayed close to her and stared daggers at me (who could've been her brother, they did look enough alike). She's been gone decades now, but I still think of her, and "Mannequin" is among the songs that trigger those memories.

In June 1992 me and the women who I later married went to see "All the Vermeers in New York", it was my birthday that week, and she told me "I'm glad you were born", within a month she asked me to live with her, we each went on one last date with others that we'd pre-committed to, mine taking poor "A" to a show in San Jose that took me far too long to get to because I got lost and it's hard to read a map on a motorcycle at night (sorry!), D's was with "a tattooed guy', and the next half year when D and me lived on our unemployment checks was the happiest days of my life and I wasn't a punk anymore, though sadly (though she well deserved it) she never had as much of my love that I could give when I was even younger because my heart was smaller by then (too much scar tissue)[...]

[...]When me and "D" seperated in '98 (she moved back to Seattle to be with her dying father, I kept working at the motorcycle shop and paid rent so she could come back to California) I rode motorcycles more, and I also went to a couple of gigs again, I again went on a date with "K" (she had come back from her brief time at a college in Washington State, where weirdly my wife was then near) and I don't remember anymore a word we said to each other then. I met "B" who years ago had introduced me to "K", and afterwards did "salvage work" on me (she's who I saw a lot of movies with, in retrospect too many: "Sid and Nancy", "She's Gotta Have It", et cetera, that feature men being horrible to women) an X gig that I arrived at shedding a massive amount of water because I rode my motorcycle in a downpour to get there, she told me she was moving to the U.K. to be with her mother that she hardly knew growing up, and I never saw her again.[...].

[...]Eventually I saved enough to pay rent for months without a job, temporary quit the motorcycle shop (winter was coming and they really didn't need my hands for that season anyway) and I went to Seattle to be with my wife again, and after the awaited death of her Dad we returned together to Oakland, California, and we never really talked of our time apart.

"'tis better to have loved and lost than never to loved at all" - Someone long dead, maybe Shakespeare?,

I'd almost say no to that, lost love is pretty damn painful, but the songs you learn may make it worthwhile, even after it's gone.

Any dates you go on with a woman who isn't at least in her very late 20's I'd advise regarding as practice and toughening up your heart.

Try your best to learn to be a good friend and a good lover, but don't expect an exclusive or lasting relationship.

I do know long lasting couples who first met and dated in their earlier 20's (and even teens), but they got back together years later after "playing the field", it's heartbreaking I know but expect no steady long lasting boyfriend/girlfriend relationship at your age.

Sorry.

[Sir_Norbert]

Oh jeez, if you're 24 I assume she is too, in my experience (and the statistics I've seen) women that young are less interested in being someone's exclusive girlfriend, in many ways her gal pals will be far closer to her, and who she mostly wants to spend time with, with a series of guys she's friendly but not "serious" with. She's much more likely to more interested in having an exclusive romantic relationship when she's closer to 30 years old, unfortunately that's the age when men start to stray more because that's the way of the world.

Rather a broad generalisation, wouldn't you say?

My experience has been very different -- and while I accept that it may be atypical, I am sure that if more of us chimed in with our own experiences, they would add up to a wide variety of stories. I had my first serious relationship when I was 22 and she was 23; it lasted over a year and we were very serious and committed until it became clear that the distance was just too much of an obstacle. I'm now 37; my current partner is 28 and we've been together for four years, with ups and downs, but we've always managed to overcome them and we are still just as committed as ever.

[2D8HP]

Rather a broad generalisation, wouldn't you say?

Yes, very broad, also (in reconsidering it) very local and more applies to San Francisco (where I'm at) than say rural Utah, but from what I glean @Comrade is collegiate so I expect more like San Francisco.

My experience has been very different[...]

[...]I'm now 37; my current partner is 28 and we've been together for four years, with ups and downs, but we've always managed to overcome them and we are still just as committed as ever.

That's wonderful!
I wish you well.

---

EDIT:
In re-reconsidering, I see that you were in your 30's when you started your relationship with your love, I don't recall any statistics but I'd be interested in how such relationships fare compared to those where both are younger, though I seem to recall that (both partners) young marriages fare best in places where they're the norm and divorce is seldom, but older first marriages fare better where divorce is more common (and unfortunately there's less statistics for unmarried long-term relationships, so guessing is involved).

[HalfTangible]

Spent the last day trying to back up my computer, it's failed like six times, can't even bloody do THIS **** right

Existing feels a waste of time and breath. I've been on a job hunt for 7, almost 8 months now and it feels like I'm just "rotting here with headphones on" (as dad so eloquently describes it; I ****ing hate it when he's home). What the hell did I go to college and get three damn degrees for if every job listed as "entry level" is gonna require like 4 years of experience? My mom can't walk so I can't bloody leave the state and even if I could every response I get to those apps is "no". Yeah, I know, global pandemic started as soon as I came out of college, of course jobs are scarce, but ffs what am I supposed to do?!

"Go back to school?"

I went to college for ten ****ing years and it has done nothing for me why the **** would I go back again

[Tvtyrant]

Spent the last day trying to back up my computer, it's failed like six times, can't even bloody do THIS **** right

Existing feels a waste of time and breath. I've been on a job hunt for 7, almost 8 months now and it feels like I'm just "rotting here with headphones on" (as dad so eloquently describes it; I ****ing hate it when he's home). What the hell did I go to college and get three damn degrees for if every job listed as "entry level" is gonna require like 4 years of experience? My mom can't walk so I can't bloody leave the state and even if I could every response I get to those apps is "no". Yeah, I know, global pandemic started as soon as I came out of college, of course jobs are scarce, but ffs what am I supposed to do?!

"Go back to school?"

I went to college for ten ****ing years and it has done nothing for me why the **** would I go back again

I feel you. It took me a year to get a job after college, and two years after grad school. One of my best friends took two years to find a job after college and his degree is in mechanical engineering.

My suggestion is look for whatever awful seasonal work is available, amazon wearhouse or UPS or whatever. It sucks but you will have some money, and it will get people off your back. Then keep looking, eventually a job will show up. Other awful but always hiring jobs: Those storage places that line the highways always need minimum wage workers and no one thinks to apply there.

[Bartmanhomer]

Hello everyone. I feel like I need to vent how I feel about myself personally. I really need to become a better person and start actually like an adult. For anyone who may or may not know me, I've been on this forum since 2015 and my behavior is very dramatic most of the time and I always get into drama with mostly everybody in this forum and I feel very bad the way I treat other members in this forum. So I just need some advice to become a better person.

[Tvtyrant]

Hello everyone. I feel like I need to vent how I feel about myself personally. I really need to become a better person and start actually like an adult. For anyone who may or may not know me, I've been on this forum since 2015 and my behavior is very dramatic most of the time and I always get into drama with mostly everybody in this forum and I feel very bad the way I treat other members in this forum. So I just need some advice to become a better person.

I think you are fine? You don't have to be everyone's cup of tea, I definitely am not. I'm close with my best friend and his fiancee, but neither of them like to debate and sometimes they give me looks like they bit down into an olive thinking it was a cherry. Just do your best to be considerate and you will be fine.

[Grytorm]

Ah hello again. Ive kind of wanted to post something for a little while but i havent had anything in particular to say and typically when I have thought of this thread I have been too low of a mood to babble.

Anyway. I get to be home alone for two nights which is scary because I have been often on in a dangerous frame of mind. Ive definitely felt depressed. The funny thing is is that I find a big aspect of my depression is the lack of interest thing. I cant really focus on most books. Actually that isnt the funny thing. The funny thing is is that certain books such as the Stormlight Archive series can really strongly grab my attention which does a lot to make me feel better. But I doubt That that is particulArily transferable to other books that I enjoy.

Also another odd thing is that I am a fast reader. But I have anxiety about not reading as swiftly as I once did. And so I manipulate people into reminding me of how fast I read.

Now for generic problem thoughts. The ideas that play a part in my depression remain the same. By ideas I mean the particular thoughts which I recognize as being as much a symptom as a contributing factor. Im 26 living at home. Never had a relationship or a real job. I can sy I have more than one friend roght now which is good.

And I saw a job posting where I used to volunteer before the pandemic hit. I should apply but I havent yet due to a combination of procrastination and anxiety at seeing a gal/woman a few years younger than me who I had/have a crush on and enjoy talking to. But I actually got myself to ask her out maybe a year ago but she declined saying she didnt like dating people she knows from work. Also I later learned she is in a long distance relationship of some sort. Which anoyed me slightly that she didnt give that as the reason but I can guess reasons as why it is easier to not do that.

And there is another gal/woman who I want to try asking oit again several years since I spent much time with her. To some extent I rscognize that this would be a terrible desperate move. Good thing I havent done so.

Then I feel like I have a self actualization problem. I have a lot of ideas and hobbies. But I never feel like I do enough with them or ever make it into something meaningful. I play way to many video games but am not particularily adapt at any of them. I have some interesting ideas for rpgs to run but I never find the impetus to flesh them out. I have dozens of books waiting to be read. Numerous notebooks filled with pointless ideas going around in cidcles. I like the idea of writing a fantasy novel but I fail to put in the effort and anyway I am not a good writer. Just. Even what I do in life feels pointless.

Also I often find myself disgusting.

Thank you.

[Bartmanhomer]

I feel like social media is stressing out. There nothing good on social media anymore. It all negative and hurtful now. I need to vent out and take a break from it.

[The Fury]

I'm still kind of a jumble of incoherent thoughts. Some of these thoughts really bother me.

Does anyone else sometimes feel like you're trying your best? But it's just not good enough?

[HalfTangible]

Does anyone else sometimes feel like you're trying your best? But it's just not good enough?

Yes.

Constantly

[Jon_Dahl]

I am heartbroken.

I am moving to another city which is faraway from here, and today will be the last time that I will play with group face-to-face. We have played together for 11 years and over 170 sessions.

I have a permanent full-time contract to work as a teacher in the "faraway" city, so I don't think I will ever see my friends again. We will continue playing in roll20, but it's not the same.

[tomandtish]

I feel like social media is stressing out. There nothing good on social media anymore. It all negative and hurtful now. I need to vent out and take a break from it.

Nothing wrong with that. I try and have 3 days a week where I DON'T look at Twitter or other social media. Way to easy to start believing it represents the world as a whole instead of a relatively small but vocal percentage of it.

[Bartmanhomer]

Nothing wrong with that. I try and have 3 days a week where I DON'T look at Twitter or other social media. Way to easy to start believing it represents the world as a whole instead of a relatively small but vocal percentage of it.

I should try your methods then. Thank you.

[The Fury]

I feel like my fear is taking over. It's not rational, I know but I can't quite seem to intellectualize it away.

Nobody I know really thinks of me as a toxic person, but I feel like I am. I get so worried that I hurt people and it's hard to reconcile these feelings with a desire for companionship.

On that note, I feel like there's a disconnect between how I assume people see me, and how they actually see me. My friends actually do think about me and they're usually glad when I show up. I keep thinking that I don't exist to them unless I'm in the room. I... don't know how to feel about that. Sometimes I feel like it might be better if I didn't exist. This is in spite of having friends that care.

[Tvtyrant]

I feel like my fear is taking over. It's not rational, I know but I can't quite seem to intellectualize it away.

Nobody I know really thinks of me as a toxic person, but I feel like I am. I get so worried that I hurt people and it's hard to reconcile these feelings with a desire for companionship.

On that note, I feel like there's a disconnect between how I assume people see me, and how they actually see me. My friends actually do think about me and they're usually glad when I show up. I keep thinking that I don't exist to them unless I'm in the room. I... don't know how to feel about that. Sometimes I feel like it might be better if I didn't exist. This is in spite of having friends that care.

I don't know you personally, so I don't know your situation. But this seems like a common source of depression in people in their teens to early 20s before they come to grips with a tedious fact: You aren't a protagonist. You aren't that important. If you were a bother to people they would stop spending time with you, if you hurt people they would either call you out or cut you out. Unless you date a co-dependent person no one sighs wistfully while they wonder what you are doing, people might miss you for like a second or two out of their week. Everyone has a full life of their own, you factor into it as much as you put into it.

I think a large part of the issue is that school and then college force people together, so for me at least I took it for granted that people would be there when I wanted them. Finding out that you have to put consistent effort into friendship to keep them going is why most people hemorrhage their friend groups after college, it is too much work and we spend a lot of time with people we don't like that much already.

You aren't better off not existing in my opinion, you are much better off losing some ego. How much time do you spend thinking about any one friend who you don't have a crush on? That's how much time people spend thinking about you. That doesn't make you, or them, bad people. It just means you have your own lives.

TLDR: I think you might have a false sense of what friendship is like based on our media and forcing people together through most of their lives. They aren't as immediately important to you as you feel they should be so you feel bad about your emotional capacity, and they don't care about you to the degree you feel they should so you feel left out. The truth is you are all normal, the cultural perception of friendship is fake and most people have a period where they have to struggle through the disconnect. You and they aren't bad people or emotionally distant, the cultural standard is toxic and codependent.

Always important service announcement: If you are not speaking with a professional now would be a good time to start.

[The Fury]

I don't know you personally, so I don't know your situation. But this seems like a common source of depression in people in their teens to early 20s before they come to grips with a tedious fact: You aren't a protagonist. You aren't that important. If you were a bother to people they would stop spending time with you, if you hurt people they would either call you out or cut you out. Unless you date a co-dependent person no one sighs wistfully while they wonder what you are doing, people might miss you for like a second or two out of their week. Everyone has a full life of their own, you factor into it as much as you put into it.

I think a large part of the issue is that school and then college force people together, so for me at least I took it for granted that people would be there when I wanted them. Finding out that you have to put consistent effort into friendship to keep them going is why most people hemorrhage their friend groups after college, it is too much work and we spend a lot of time with people we don't like that much already.

You aren't better off not existing in my opinion, you are much better off losing some ego. How much time do you spend thinking about any one friend who you don't have a crush on? That's how much time people spend thinking about you. That doesn't make you, or them, bad people. It just means you have your own lives.

Always important service announcement: If you are not speaking with a professional now would be a good time to start.

Oh, believe me, I'm aware that I'm not that important. If anything I feel more like a supporting character than a protagonist. The thing that shocks me is that people I know actually think about me more than I thought they did.

I'm fully aware that people have their own lives, I'm just incredulous that they want me in them.

[Tvtyrant]

Oh, believe me, I'm aware that I'm not that important. If anything I feel more like a supporting character than a protagonist. The thing that shocks me is that people I know actually think about me more than I thought they did.

I'm fully aware that people have their own lives, I'm just incredulous that they want me in them.

Right, but why? What makes you incredulous? What makes you think you are toxic?

[The Fury]

Right, but why? What makes you incredulous? What makes you think you are toxic?

I guess I just feel surprised that people think about me at all.

As for my toxicity... I think it's a fear more than a belief. The idea of hurting someone I care about is something that terrifies me. I've even done it before, and I still feel horrible about it. Maybe I didn't mean to, but that's immaterial because I still did it. I still have that lingering worry. What if I do it again?

[Tvtyrant]

I guess I just feel surprised that people think about me at all.

As for my toxicity... I think it's a fear more than a belief. The idea of hurting someone I care about is something that terrifies me. I've even done it before, and I still feel horrible about it. Maybe I didn't mean to, but that's immaterial because I still did it. I still have that lingering worry. What if I do it again?

I think that is literally what makes you a non-toxic person. Caring about how you effect others and trying not to hurt them is the opposite of someone who is toxic, IE a user. You aren't always going succeed, because people are fragile and life is harsh, but caring at all is doing better then a lot of people do.

I'm a middle child within a family with huge emotional issues, and my role for my life has been to absorb other's problems while they throw tantrums if their mind isn't read perfectly. Then I went to college and built my identity around getting old men and women to praise me for anticipating their ideas and regurgitating back to them what they want to hear. I learned a lot from the last few years, like caring about yourself is ok and that other people don't need all of your energy to survive.

Which brings me back to the ego thing. You are assigning yourself too much importance and not enough respect. People don't need you, the world gets along fine without you. If you hurt them they will get over it. By the same token, they don't want you around because they need something from you, but because they like you. Stop thinking about how much damage you can do to them, because it isn't much. Think about how much happiness you can have with them, which is a lot.

[Kesnit]

Another rant...

My workplace has pretty much opened up with some restrictions. We are still able to work from home 1 day a week if our work schedule allows. Due to my schedule, I haven't been able to work from home since early July.

I looked at my calendar for yesterday and realized I finally had a day I could work from home. I set up everything I could to keep myself busy for the full day, then went to my boss to make sure there would not be a problem. Turns out the perspective new employee was coming in to meet my boss and see the office. He wanted everyone in the office to meet her. So I came in.

The prospective employee did come in and I said hi to her. That was it. I drove my 90 minute round trip commute and stayed in the office all day in order to say "hi, nice to meet you." My boss did say he would be fine with me working from home in the afternoon, but that mostly defeats the purpose. I still would have done my full commute, and I would not have been able to leave until 2:00 anyway because I had set up a video conference for 1:30 and would not have been able to get home in time to do it.

[Bartmanhomer]

So anyway my childhood friend who I know him at my old childhood school is going through a very tough time at the moment. He's hearing voices and being very aggressive to his family. He has been to a psych ward with his behavior and he's out. So far he's still hearing voices and being very aggressive to his family and his medication isn't working. I don't know what to do at the moment and I'm very sad about my friend.

[Grytorm]

Dark thoughts ideation.

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Hello again. I feel confident in saying that a I am not feeling particularily well at the moment. I'm thinking about desth as simpler than becoming a functioning adult. Cataloguing my faults is fruitless except to say my depressiin hinges on percieved failures. And failures seem to be what matters because I've been considering the idea that everything in my life I am unhappy about is my fault. Well most things I am unhappy about. The lack of external stressors is good though because my only case of major self harm occurred in response to difficulty with completing my university degree. I think I had something else to say but I am tired.

[The Fury]

Dark thoughts ideation.

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Hello again. I feel confident in saying that a I am not feeling particularily well at the moment. I'm thinking about desth as simpler than becoming a functioning adult. Cataloguing my faults is fruitless except to say my depressiin hinges on percieved failures. And failures seem to be what matters because I've been considering the idea that everything in my life I am unhappy about is my fault. Well most things I am unhappy about. The lack of external stressors is good though because my only case of major self harm occurred in response to difficulty with completing my university degree. I think I had something else to say but I am tired.

I've not been feeling great, so I probably won't be even nearly as helpful as I would like. For that I am sorry. I will try my best.

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It's very easy to see your failures, at least it's that way for me, an I suspect you too. Also, if you're like me, I imagine that it feels like your failures are so heavy and so numerous that it blinds you to the fact that you have good qualities too. So I guess my point is this-- maybe you can't see your better qualities right now. I assure you though, they are there and you do have them.

As for death feeling easier than becoming a functioning adult... that is a disturbing thought. No judgement of course. I've been there too. The number for the National Suicide Prevention Hotline is 1800-273-8255. I've had to call it before too, so just remember that help is out there.

[Grytorm]

I've not been feeling great, so I probably won't be even nearly as helpful as I would like. For that I am sorry. I will try my best.

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It's very easy to see your failures, at least it's that way for me, an I suspect you too. Also, if you're like me, I imagine that it feels like your failures are so heavy and so numerous that it blinds you to the fact that you have good qualities too. So I guess my point is this-- maybe you can't see your better qualities right now. I assure you though, they are there and you do have them.

As for death feeling easier than becoming a functioning adult... that is a disturbing thought. No judgement of course. I've been there too. The number for the National Suicide Prevention Hotline is 1800-273-8255. I've had to call it before too, so just remember that help is out there.

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The insidious thing about my depression right now if that I can recognize my positive traits but I am having a hard time valuing them very highly. I feel like I am too undisciplined to ever get anything done. To actually do anything I can feel proud of takes commitment I don't have. And it isn't just things like being single and unemployed but things like how i have always liked the idea of writing fantasy but I just don't have to commitment needed to practice. Similarily I have some good ideas for rpg games I could run but I haven't made myself develop them beyond an outline and a couple of names for a CoC scenario. And honestly I am not very good at roleplaying which feels disheartening because I have invested so much time and energy to the hobby.

Thank you for reminding me of the hotline I will make use of it if necesarry. And I doubt I will do anything to hurt myself because the time that got me hospitalized was brought about because of an important university deadline I had utterly failed to complete and the reaching the point where I would have to admit my failings to my family.

Thank you for your time and I hope you start feeling better soon.