Trying to make a magical hand crossbow please help

[Boboscar]

Im trying to combine this with a hand crossbow for a rogue in my party let me know if it should still be uncommon or rare now. And what changes i should do if the base item is too strong for uncommon to make it rare worthy btw the rogue is lv 6 and is really clever so i want to reward that.

[Boboscar]

Poisoned Dagger (5e Equipment)

Weapon (dagger), uncommon

Many assassins prefer to kill with inconspicuous ways; however, many like to have poisoned daggers just in case. When covering this dagger with any type of poison, it retains its effect until you change the poison type.
This dagger is usually found with some type of poison covering it (DM's choice).


this is what im trying to add to the crossbow

[Xuc Xac]

Im trying to combine this with a hand crossbow for a rogue in my party let me know if it should still be uncommon or rare now.

If you're making it up just to give it to one character, it's not "uncommon" or "rare". There's just one of them. It's unique.

If "uncommon" and "rare" are game terms for power level instead of availability, then you need to specify what game this is for (and maybe post in the specific subforum).

[Boboscar]

Sorry this is my first post i am doing this for 5e dnd and i am having trouble with the whole putting the thread somewhere thing. And yes i am using it for power level not availability.

[Boboscar]

Thanks for the advice i appreciate it.

[Phhase]

Toxin Spreader
This hand crossbow has +1 to attack and damage rolls. In addition, there is a revolving mechanism fitted above the release. This mechanism has three ports where vials may be attached. If a vial containing an amount of a substance (three drops is enough) is attached to the mechanism and rotated into place, the crossbow will synthesize a minute amount of this substance and anoint all ammo fired from the crossbow with that substance. As an action, the user may rotate a different vial of substance into place, changing the firing effect.

As a fellow Very Clever Rogue, I would LOVE having this item. It's a poisoner's dream to be able to field test any weird liquid you find on any enemy without having to sacrifice the substance in the process. Give this item to your boi and I guarantee he won't go anywhere without an apothecary's worth of vials to take samples of stuff. When anything that fits in a vial is a potential weapon, the possibilities are endless. Just be ready for him/her to take samples of every little thing he can get his grubby fingers on, and to determine what effect they have. The sheer flexibility of this item is surely enough to put it in rare territory in terms of power level, at least, for a clever person. For an unclever person, it's just +1+1d6 basic poison to their hand crossbow attacks.

[Boboscar]

Thanks that sounds awesome. Definitely worth the rare power level.

[Kaptin Keen]

Toxin Spreader
This hand crossbow has +1 to attack and damage rolls. In addition, there is a revolving mechanism fitted above the release. This mechanism has three ports where vials may be attached. If a vial containing an amount of a substance (three drops is enough) is attached to the mechanism and rotated into place, the crossbow will synthesize a minute amount of this substance and anoint all ammo fired from the crossbow with that substance. As an action, the user may rotate a different vial of substance into place, changing the firing effect.

So .. it's a healing potion syringe pistol. You just reduce the tension of the string until it just pierces skin (say 1 hp damage), and you have infinite potions of cure critical wounds. As a Very Clever Rogue, that's what I'd use it for. Or maybe have a dwarven mastersmith adjust it, so it can be used in both ways. Have Wyvern Poison, Holy Water and Cure Critical settings for your semi-automatic needle pistol.

[Pauly]

You’re talking about a ballestrino or “assassin’s crossbow”. Here is a link to a guy who made a modern reproduction

https://youtu.be/eM9t3Zk4KCs

[Boboscar]

Yes yes i am but the one i have in mind will have an auto poison injector and never run out of said poison.

[Xuc Xac]

So .. it's a healing potion syringe pistol. You just reduce the tension of the string until it just pierces skin (say 1 hp damage), and you have infinite potions of cure critical wounds. As a Very Clever Rogue, that's what I'd use it for. Or maybe have a dwarven mastersmith adjust it, so it can be used in both ways. Have Wyvern Poison, Holy Water and Cure Critical settings for your semi-automatic needle pistol.

And what do you think a crossbow bolt dipped in healing potion would do? Would the "potion" even be effective when used in a non-potable manner and in a tiny fraction of a normal dose? You probably wouldn't even get that 1 hit point back after "injecting" it. If that worked, people would be using potions that way already. Why drink the whole potion when you can get the full benefit from a couple drops stabbed into your body? You don't even need a crossbow or even the whole bolt. Just dip an arrowhead in your potion and poke a little hole in yourself with it.

[Kaptin Keen]

And what do you think a crossbow bolt dipped in healing potion would do? Would the "potion" even be effective when used in a non-potable manner and in a tiny fraction of a normal dose? You probably wouldn't even get that 1 hit point back after "injecting" it. If that worked, people would be using potions that way already. Why drink the whole potion when you can get the full benefit from a couple drops stabbed into your body? You don't even need a crossbow or even the whole bolt. Just dip an arrowhead in your potion and poke a little hole in yourself with it.

How is that any different than the poison that is intended?

But hey, you don't like the idea, that's fine by me.

[Phhase]

So .. it's a healing potion syringe pistol. You just reduce the tension of the string until it just pierces skin (say 1 hp damage), and you have infinite potions of cure critical wounds. As a Very Clever Rogue, that's what I'd use it for. Or maybe have a dwarven mastersmith adjust it, so it can be used in both ways. Have Wyvern Poison, Holy Water and Cure Critical settings for your semi-automatic needle pistol.

I respect your moxie, but...hmmm. While I think the idea is certainly not without merit, I think your proposed method has too many drawbacks (as I would rule, in any case. Reducing tension also would reduce the effective range, and since a potion of healing is usually fully consumed to provide its listed effect, I do think that (as you may already have imagined) you'd have to use Cure Critical Wounds to get any appreciable, if recuded effect. Perhaps +1d4 healing. For delivering some potions in an appreciable dose (not certain which-may vary) I might recommend using actual tranq darts filled with fluid instead (I imagine you can fill 3-5 from a potion). Things that directly affect metabolic/physical processes like Glibness or Healing may require a greater injection, while things that are binary would probably work in a minuscule amount, just at a reduced duration or saving throw (Like Oil of Etherealness, for instance). A more potent brew, like a potion distilled into a concentrate, though, might work perfectly fine as a bolt coating. Would be hard to find, I imagine, though.

[Xuc Xac]

How is that any different than the poison that is intended?

A few drops of poison on a crossbow bolt are a normal dose. A few drops of healing potion are a tiny fraction of a dose.

[redwizard007]

A few drops of poison on a crossbow bolt are a normal dose. A few drops of healing potion are a tiny fraction of a dose.

In a game with flying, fire breathing, spell casting, six-limbed, several thousand year old dragons we are drawing a line at how much potion is enough for a magic crossbow to use... I mean, sure, we have to draw a line somewhere.

[Xuc Xac]

In a game with flying, fire breathing, spell casting, six-limbed, several thousand year old dragons we are drawing a line at how much potion is enough for a magic crossbow to use... I mean, sure, we have to draw a line somewhere.

That's ridiculous. If being pricked by a sharp object coated with a few drops of healing potion can have the same effect as drinking the whole vial, that means one potion is now effectively 500 potions. There's no reason to even track damage anymore. Anything that doesn't kill you instantly can be healed in moments. I don't think you want to do that to your game.

[redwizard007]

That's ridiculous. If being pricked by a sharp object coated with a few drops of healing potion can have the same effect as drinking the whole vial, that means one potion is now effectively 500 potions. There's no reason to even track damage anymore. Anything that doesn't kill you instantly can be healed in moments. I don't think you want to do that to your game.

Oh, hells no. I think it's nuts (as the designers have noted) to have at will no cost healing, but I probably wouldn't let it be a pez dispenser for poison either. At least not as an at will option. Just thought it's an odd place to take a stand on realism.

This is purely off the cuff, but I'd probably look to something that either added either precision damage, a set (and lesser) type of poison damage and the poisoned condition, or a status effect of some sort. If it required attunement, then scale the effect up a bit. Certainly not a "replicate any potion/poison ever" grab bag.

[Squire Doodad]

That's ridiculous. If being pricked by a sharp object coated with a few drops of healing potion can have the same effect as drinking the whole vial, that means one potion is now effectively 500 potions. There's no reason to even track damage anymore. Anything that doesn't kill you instantly can be healed in moments. I don't think you want to do that to your game.

Perhaps the bow has the ability to concentrate material via some magical means. Basically, a single potion is heavily focused into a single drop which then can be fired at people. Actually, it'd probably be better to make it be "a single potion makes for two doses of material; each dose is equal to 2/3 of a potion". That way, the user has a reason to use it for healing purposes but it is also not overpowered in the "1 potion=500 doses" sense. Otherwise, giving it a syringe-dart compatibility feature would work better.

There are exceptions of course; explosive materials will explode if concentrated, something-something-doesn't-stack-with-itself-via-multishot, and some things require the full dose to be effective in the first place. Also you could say that exposure to most poisons/potions of a certain efficiency will cause the mechanism to deteriorate due to having difficulty processing it. If the player sticks to that one weapon, then they can visit a machinist later on who provides the ability to upgrade that mechanism.

[Kaptin Keen]

A few drops of poison on a crossbow bolt are a normal dose. A few drops of healing potion are a tiny fraction of a dose.

These are the facts: You use one full vial of poison to coat one missile. You use one full vial of healing potion to get one healing effect.

The crossbow in question replicates the effect of one full vial of whatever is put in it. There is zero mention of dosage or volume needed - not anywhere in the entirety of the source material.

So this is you. And don't get me wrong, that's totally fine. You don't like the idea. Don't use it. I just thought this was a funny way of pointing out the crossbow might be slightly OP, and work for other stuff than it's obvious intention.

[Phhase]

These are the facts: You use one full vial of poison to coat one missile.

Three missiles per vial, actually. The entry for basic poison: "You can use the poison in this vial to coat one slashing or piercing weapon or up to three pieces of Ammunition. Applying the poison takes an action. A creature hit by the Poisoned weapon or Ammunition must make a DC 10 Constitution saving throw or take 1d4 poison damage. Once applied, the poison retains potency for 1 minute before drying." Sorry if it seems pedantic, but it felt wrong to me too, so I had to check RAW.

[Kaptin Keen]

Sorry if it seems pedantic, but it felt wrong to me too, so I had to check RAW.

Heavens no, if I'm wrong I'm wrong. Is this 5.0? I'm pretty sure it's really just one coating in 3.5, which is what I mostly play. But I don't have the time to look it up right now.

[Boboscar]

It is 5e and yes i agree that a few drops of healing potion is broken but i do want to reward my player so i might go with the concentration mechanics that hace been suggested already and turn a whole potion into a few drops using something in the crossbow. Thank you all for the help in figuring out what i wanted to do with this.

[Sparky McDibben]

Hey OP,

If I were you, I'd reward them with something that allows them to be flexible when called for:

Whisperdart
Weapon (hand crossbow), rare, requires attunement

You receive a +1 bonus to your attack and damage rolls with this magic weapon. In addition, you may use a bonus action to make ranged weapon attack at any point you can see within 60 feet. This attack does no damage. From that point, you create a sound or an image of an object that lasts for 1 minute. If you create a sound, its volume can range from a whisper to a scream, but cannot cause damage. It can be any sound you choose. The sound can be continuous or you can make discrete sounds at different times before the spell ends.

If you create an image of an object it must be no larger than a 5-foot cube. The image can't create sound, light, smell, or any other sensory effect, including directly dealing damage. Physical interaction with the image reveals it to be an illusion, because things can pass through it. If a creature uses its action to examine the sound or image, the creature can determine that it is an illusion with a successful Intelligence (Investigation) check against DC 15.

This is essentially a bonus action minor illusion, which for a rogue isn't all that broken. It's also up to the player to get the most mileage out of this weapon. Now, if they've already got minor illusion, this isn't great, but you might buff it to phantasmal force if that's the case.