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  1. - Top - End - #631
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    ElfPirate

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    Default Re: The LA-assignment thread VII: LA LA Land

    Isn't the rule that a score of -- counts as 10 for things that key off it (barring an explicitly provided alternate score)?
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  2. - Top - End - #632
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    Thurbane's Avatar

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    Default Re: The LA-assignment thread VII: LA LA Land

    Not exactly:

    Quote Originally Posted by SRD
    Nonabilities
    Some creatures lack certain ability scores. These creatures do not have an ability score of 0—they lack the ability altogether. The modifier for a nonability is +0.

  3. - Top - End - #633
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    OrcBarbarianGirl

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    Default Re: The LA-assignment thread VII: LA LA Land

    Quote Originally Posted by PoeticallyPsyco View Post
    Isn't the rule that a score of -- counts as 10 for things that key off it (barring an explicitly provided alternate score)?
    It's too bad encumbrance is keyed of the actual strength number and not the modifier.

    If you have Str: - and try to pick up a ghost touch sword, you crash a tabletop game.
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    This thread, Questions that can't be answered... Answered by RAW by No brains, is Epic.
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    That is so stupid it's hilarious.
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    ...I've clearly been playing D&D for too long, because that made a demented kind of sense.
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  4. - Top - End - #634
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    ElfPirate

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    Default Re: The LA-assignment thread VII: LA LA Land

    Ah. Should have known it wouldn't be that easy.
    Quote Originally Posted by Darths & Droids
    When you combine the two most devious, sneaky, manipulative, underhanded, cunning, and diabolical forces in the known universe, the consequences can be world-shattering. Those forces are, of course, players and GMs.
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    Realism, the natural predator of D&D mechanics.

  5. - Top - End - #635
    Bugbear in the Playground
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    Default Re: The LA-assignment thread VII: LA LA Land

    ...
    I think there are instances of stuff with Dex -- having a -5 modifier for some of their Dexterity related things.
    Like the Udoroot. It appears to have +0 Dex mod for Initiative and Reflex saves, but for AC, it has -5 Dex.
    Unless that got changed in Errata.
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  6. - Top - End - #636
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    Thurbane's Avatar

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    Default Re: The LA-assignment thread VII: LA LA Land

    I seem to remember reading somewhere that creatures with no Dex score use Int as the initiative modifier instead of Dex, but I can't find a citation...

    [edit] Here we go:

    Quote Originally Posted by RC p.105
    Any creature that can move has at least 1 point of Dexterity. A creature that has no Dexterity score can’t move. If it can perform actions (such as casting spells), it applies its Intelligence modifier to initiative checks instead of its Dexterity modifier. The creature automatically fails Reflex saves and Dexterity checks.
    ...which still doesn't sync up with the Udoroot's stat block. Also, if it auto-fails Ref saves, why give it Lightning Reflexes?

  7. - Top - End - #637
    Bugbear in the Playground
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    Default Re: The LA-assignment thread VII: LA LA Land

    Quote Originally Posted by Thurbane View Post
    Also, if it auto-fails Ref saves, why give it Lightning Reflexes?
    So it can auto-fail with style, presumably.

  8. - Top - End - #638
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    Thurbane's Avatar

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    Exclamation Re: The LA-assignment thread VII: LA LA Land

    Quote Originally Posted by InvisibleBison View Post
    So it can auto-fail with style, presumably.
    It's other feat is Iron Will, despite being immune to 95% of things that call for Will saves by virtue of its plant traits.

    Not to mention it should have a 3rd feat by virtue of having 6HD.

    None of this is touched on in the XPH errata.

  9. - Top - End - #639
    Bugbear in the Playground
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    Default Re: The LA-assignment thread VII: LA LA Land

    Quote Originally Posted by Thurbane View Post
    It's other feat is Iron Will, despite being immune to 95% of things that call for Will saves by virtue of its plant traits.

    Not to mention it should have a 3rd feat by virtue of having 6HD.

    None of this is touched on in the XPH errata.
    At least they aren't packing Toughness.
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  10. - Top - End - #640
    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    MindFlayer

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    Default Re: The LA-assignment thread VII: LA LA Land

    Toughness would actually be more useful in this case.

  11. - Top - End - #641
    Bugbear in the Playground
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    Default Re: The LA-assignment thread VII: LA LA Land

    Quote Originally Posted by StevenC21 View Post
    Toughness would actually be more useful in this case.
    It really wouldn't.
    Remember, it only loses HP after it has been dug up and the roots are being attacked. Which means the party has already destroyed all the crowns, and the Udoroot can't do anything.
    Which means that, at most, it's going to take the party an extra attack, at most another 6 seconds/one round, in what might as well be narrative time, not combat time.


    Because, honestly, once it's dug up, I'm not going to make my players play out the attack and damage rolls necessary to finish it off.
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  12. - Top - End - #642
    Firbolg in the Playground
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    Default Re: The LA-assignment thread VII: LA LA Land

    Quote Originally Posted by InvisibleBison View Post
    So it can auto-fail with style, presumably.
    That wasn’t flaying. That was failing with style.
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  13. - Top - End - #643
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    ElfPirate

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    Default Re: The LA-assignment thread VII: LA LA Land

    Quote Originally Posted by StevenC21 View Post
    Toughness would actually be more useful in this case.
    Quote Originally Posted by javcs View Post
    It really wouldn't.
    If Toughness/Improved Toughness applied to the flowers as well, that would actually be relatively useful.
    Quote Originally Posted by Darths & Droids
    When you combine the two most devious, sneaky, manipulative, underhanded, cunning, and diabolical forces in the known universe, the consequences can be world-shattering. Those forces are, of course, players and GMs.
    Quote Originally Posted by OgresAreCute View Post
    Realism, the natural predator of D&D mechanics.

  14. - Top - End - #644
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    OrcBarbarianGuy

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    Default Re: The LA-assignment thread VII: LA LA Land

    will have to check what ghost walk says about equipment. Either way This thing has enough going for it that it handily beats a psion 2 levels above it at pretty much any level. I am not seeing much of an argument here against +3 based completely on equipment compared to a tier 1 caster. Even still it is far a head of the game.

  15. - Top - End - #645
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    Inevitability's Avatar

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    Default Re: The LA-assignment thread VII: LA LA Land

    There were a few 'borderline +2 and +3' votes, which for obvious reasons aren't counted as preferring one over the other.

    +2: 3 votes
    +3: 8 votes

    +3 it is.
    Have you had enough of unreasonably high LA's and unplayable monsters in 3.5? Then check out the LA-assignment thread! Don't hesitate to give feedback!

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  16. - Top - End - #646
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    Inevitability's Avatar

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    Default Re: The LA-assignment thread VII: LA LA Land

    Xeph


    A truly xeph-tional creature. Haha funny joke.

    Reasonably standard player race humanoid. +2 dex, -2 strength, 1 bonus power point, +1 on saves against most magic, darkvision, and the ability to 3/day increase speed by 10 to 30 feet for a few rounds (by RAW it's a standard action to activate, but it's pretty clearly intended by be swift). Favored class is soulknife but let's not honor that with an analysis.

    Notable option: the Xeph Celerity feat, which allows you to expend Burst uses to add an attack to your full attack. It's slightly synergetic with Soul Eater (especially the capstone), and such a character would probably be pretty neat.

    Clear +0, moving on.
    Have you had enough of unreasonably high LA's and unplayable monsters in 3.5? Then check out the LA-assignment thread! Don't hesitate to give feedback!

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  17. - Top - End - #647
    Firbolg in the Playground
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    Default Re: The LA-assignment thread VII: LA LA Land

    Xephs are uninspiring, but they’re no worse than other mediocre +0 races. +0 is fine.
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  18. - Top - End - #648
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    OrcBarbarianGuy

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    Default Re: The LA-assignment thread VII: LA LA Land

    ya pretty straight forward +0 base race not much to say about Xeph.

    Isn't that the last of the expanded psion monsters, what book next?
    Last edited by liquidformat; 2019-09-05 at 08:54 AM.

  19. - Top - End - #649
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    danielxcutter's Avatar

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    Default Re: The LA-assignment thread VII: LA LA Land

    Quote Originally Posted by liquidformat View Post
    ya pretty straight forward +0 base race not much to say about Xeph.

    Isn't that the last of the expanded psion monsters, what book next?
    Nope, we still have the psionic Yuan-ti.
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  20. - Top - End - #650
    Troll in the Playground
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    Default Re: The LA-assignment thread VII: LA LA Land

    +0. It's a race. That exists. And does stuff.

    As we crawl closer to the next book I have a few ideas. Fiend Folio is cool as it made an honest attempt to give reasonable looking LAs to monsters (although weird editing made it confusing. Khaasta is LA +0 but you cannot tell that at first glance.)

  21. - Top - End - #651
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    Dimers's Avatar

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    Default Re: The LA-assignment thread VII: LA LA Land

    Yep, xeph is straightforward LA +0. It gets, like, the opposite of an asterisk, it's so easy.
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  22. - Top - End - #652
    Bugbear in the Playground
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    Default Re: The LA-assignment thread VII: LA LA Land

    Xeph is a baseline +0. Nothing fancy.

  23. - Top - End - #653
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    OrcBarbarianGuy

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    Default Re: The LA-assignment thread VII: LA LA Land

    Fiend Folio would be a great one, I think also maybe something like sandstorm, frostburn, and shipwreck would be cool they don't have a crazy number of monsters each but an interesting variety there in.

  24. - Top - End - #654
    Barbarian in the Playground
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    Default Re: The LA-assignment thread VII: LA LA Land

    The Xeph is a mediocre LA +0. I suppose I do not have a strong preference for the next book; I am just patiently waiting until we can do the BoED, BoVD, and the Dragonlance books.

  25. - Top - End - #655
    Bugbear in the Playground
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    Default Re: The LA-assignment thread VII: LA LA Land

    Concur with LA +0 for the Xeph. They're hardly a standout, but for 0RHD it doesn't really take much to avoid a -0. I mean, really, a race that gives you nothing would be a +0, albeit on the low end.


    --
    As for the next book ... hmm. IIRC, Inevitability hasn't been particularly eager to do anything that wasn't printed with the 3.5 rules, which complicates things a little.
    So some rather useful books are out - seriously, WotC, why not reprint MM2 for 3.5?


    Perhaps we should finish the SRD and do the ELH next. Or some of the WotC web enhancement material.
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  26. - Top - End - #656
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    Inevitability's Avatar

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    Default Re: The LA-assignment thread VII: LA LA Land

    Personally most interested in the fiend folio (having to use the updated statblocks would be a bit annoying though) or the web enhancements. Thurbane had a list of those right?
    Have you had enough of unreasonably high LA's and unplayable monsters in 3.5? Then check out the LA-assignment thread! Don't hesitate to give feedback!

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  27. - Top - End - #657
    Firbolg in the Playground
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    Default Re: The LA-assignment thread VII: LA LA Land

    I’m going to reiterate my request for Fiend Folio (if the semi-updated stuff is kosher) and/or Thurbane’s “MM6” of online monsters.

    Which is, yes, just what Inevitability just said, but I woulda said it either way.
    In the Beginning Was the Word, and the Word Was Suck: A Guide to Truenamers

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    Come join the Iron Chef Optimization Challenge in the Playground E6 Appetizer Edition! We're currently cooking for round 27. Everyone is welcome!

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  28. - Top - End - #658
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    Default Re: The LA-assignment thread VII: LA LA Land

    Xeph is fairly unexceptional; not quite enough for LA -0, so LA +0 is fine IMHO.

    Quote Originally Posted by Inevitability View Post
    Personally most interested in the fiend folio (having to use the updated statblocks would be a bit annoying though) or the web enhancements. Thurbane had a list of those right?
    Yep, here's the link (just be aware that some of the linked pages are no longer active, so not all the creatures may be accessible): Monster Manual VI - Online Monsters; Being a compilation of monsters available freely online, that (mostly) did not appear printed in any books...

  29. - Top - End - #659
    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    MindFlayer

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    Default Re: The LA-assignment thread VII: LA LA Land

    Definite +0. Unimpressive maybe, but still definite.

    Worse than human or dwarf imho, but better than half-elf. Probably better than PHB +2 Dex/-2 Con elf, darkvision is always handy at low levels. Don't see it excelling at much, but again half-elf.

    Fiend Folio sounds solid. If the 3.0ish changes don't cause a lot of issues. Which they may.

  30. - Top - End - #660
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    Thurbane's Avatar

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    Default Re: The LA-assignment thread VII: LA LA Land

    Quote Originally Posted by Covenant12 View Post
    Fiend Folio sounds solid. If the 3.0ish changes don't cause a lot of issues. Which they may.
    I assume we'd incorporate the 3.5 update booklet for FF? Not that it fixed everything, but it's a start...

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