The LA-assignment thread VII: LA LA Land

[danielxcutter]

I'm okay with the +2, since that's around the CR of a base Chronotyryn - yes, I know ECL and CR are entirely different measuring scales(didn't one of the Inevitables have a 1/week Earthquake SLA? Encounter-changing on a monster, underwhelming for a PC), but still.

[Thurbane]

Gotta say, my wife is the most extreme arachnophobe I've ever met (and I'm a mild one myself): not sure how she'd react to the picture, to be honest.

Question: how to we deal with monsters that have been updated in later supplements? I've skimmed the comments, but has anyone mentioned that this was updated in DotU?

In some cases there will have been virtually no changes other than formatting, in others the monster gets changed quite a bit...

[edit] Oh, and mark me down for LA -0 no matter which version we are rating. This things does not get anything remotely approaching making up for 12 Aberration HD and a -8 to Int. [/edit]

[ZamielVanWeber]

I mentioned the DotU one in passing. We only took the updated versions into account when we got there normally so I as not worried about it.

[Blue Jay]

I mentioned the DotU one in passing. We only took the updated versions into account when we got there normally so I as not worried about it.

Me too! Me too!

Here's a summary of noteworthy changes in the DotU version:

• Climb speed added (I didn't even notice that it wasn't there in FF)
• Leg rakes renamed "claws"
• Impale instead of Constrict (basically the same thing, except less damage)
• natural armor improved by +3
• Leg regeneration was removed (but it was really more of a weakness than a strength, so no big loss)
• Frightful Presence, Pounce, Magic Strike and Scuttling Charge added

The DotU version is obviously better, and Scuttling Charge (non-linear charging) is kind of awesome, but I think it would still be LA -0. You'd still need to reduce the racial Hit Dice a bit before I'd consider LA +0.

[Inevitability]

Crawling Head

The combination of meatshield stats, necromancy SLAs, a vorpal bite attack and a flavorful reservoir of power sure sounds appealing. Sadly, 28 undead RHD, terrible move speed and a lack of real focus condemn this to -0 LA. Also, you can't go out in the rain without starting to die.

[Covenant12]

You know, at ECL 20 this might just be playable. Probably still earn -0, but with effort functional.
Harm as needed, fear spell at-will and quickened a few times, wail of the banshee 3/day. Frustratingly limited and scales nowhere, really. But I think it could contribute. 30 Str is not great with 20+ undead RHD as a beatstick, though. Note stat block of +23 to hit at 28 RHD. Napkin math says that's sadly correct.
You basically live off death, fear, and maybe created undead. Rain damaging you sucks but it looks like 1d6/round, and again harm on self many times.

LA: -0 for the 28 RHD though, that's just too many. Everything is immune fear and death effects, and if isn't you face CR 28 enemies with caster level 20 spell-likes. Caster level 20 at RHD 28 means I think they don't scale at all.

[Efrate]

-0. Nice minion for a necromancer. Bad as pc.

[danielxcutter]

What CR is this? Not going to even add the image for this one?

[Inevitability]

What CR is this? Not going to even add the image for this one?

The image is right there?

CR is 20.

[ZamielVanWeber]

Epic without real spellcasting? -0. You could at least take an epic destiny I suppose...?

[remetagross]

The image is right there?

CR is 20.

Somehow I dont' see any image either...at any rate, LA -0 for me too.

[No brains]

I see the image. For those who can't see, Imagine a bloated and flabby gray humanoid head that has root-like veins spreading out from the bottom of its neck and a shark-like mouth.

Get an even bigger golf club and tee it away. -0.

[remetagross]

Ah, there it is. Darn, it's ugly.

[Netbrian]

-0. Though it'd be fun to see one using a trenchcoat and stilts to pretend to be a Perfectly Normal Human.

[liquidformat]

pretty straight forward -0 LA, I also see the image.

[Inevitability]

-0. Though it'd be fun to see one using a trenchcoat and stilts to pretend to be a Perfectly Normal Human.

Apparently the head is Huge-sized, so that would be hard.

I guess you could pass as a mountain giant, though.

[Blue Jay]

I see the picture, but I wish I didn't. Trigger warning, man!

Yeah, LA -0 for the bloated dead head.

[Zaq]

Is it even threatening as a monster at CR 20?

[ViperMagnum357]

Blech. Nothing to work with here, and the rain damage is more of an insult that anything, what with the massive self healing. LA -0 for Kaneda's head.

[Thurbane]

Mark me down as not being able to see an image either.

You know, if it didn't have 28 HD, this thing might have some potential: decent ability mods for Str, Int, Wis and Cha; a few special attacks; SLAs that you can quicken by eating heads. The weird water vulnerability doesn't help either.

You are not suited to epic play: easy LA -0.

If you really want to play an undead giant's head, maybe take a look at Deathshead from ToM. A lot less HD to deal with...although 10 is probably still too many...

[Sutr]

Was going to make a post about quickened heals every round being cool with advanced minionmancy then realized that it didn't have the ability to control those undead it was creating or at least not all day. All my plans were based on commoners being easy to fill the heads. Without being able to divert minions to do it though -0 with potential with quickened wale of the banshee, and heal if only it actually controlled those minions. If only it had rebuke. The analysis brought an interesting question does anyone know if coup de gras counts for vorpal? Its the difference between roughly 40 heads per day and accidently killing 760 people to eat those 40 heads.

[Covenant12]

Is it even threatening as a monster at CR 20?

For a generic party? I'd say yes. The high-op side of this board would be immune death and mind-affecting 24/7, but I don't think that's a balance point for a monster manual. Death effect immunity isn't common. Affordable at 20 (Soulfire my favorite), but not trivial.

CR 20 and can sling 2 of wail of the banshee or finger of death per round. Fear as well, but mind blank for the party is very encouraged at 20. This book gives it an amazing version of quicken spell-like ability, without party-wide death effect immunity chance of one or more party members dying is high. Which can be affordably reversed, but I'd count that as spending resources. While it can't control the created undead, it might get some decent ones to follow it out of fear/coercion.

Vorpal on 19-20 as written, but at +23 to hit the odds are quite poor. But yes, I think CR 20 is saner than most in 3.5 monster manuals.

[Inevitability]

Crypt Thing

Well, this sure is interesting, if nothing else.

Crypt things are medium-sized undead with unimpressive stats (+6 dex, +4 wis, +2 cha) and 6 RHD. They have a little bit of natural armor and some weak claw attacks. They also get Deflect Arrows as a bonus feat for some reason.

Crypt things have +4 turn resistance, but it only seems to work when within 50 ft. of 'the location or object it guards'. In theory that'd keep you from benefitting from it in a typical adventure, in practice you can just guard a random bauble and put it in your pocket. Either way, turn resistance is too niche to matter much.

The final ability a crypt thing has, and the most hilarious by a wide margin, is Scatter Defilers. Every creature within 30 ft. of the Thing (but no more than it has hit dice) get teleported 10d10 times 10 feet in a random direction (anywhere from 100 to 1000 feet, for those keeping track). It seems like it can't shift people up or down, it's only 1/day, and it isn't all that great if your enemies aren't in a hostile dungeon, but there's hardly a more hilarious way for a DM to split the party.

Anyway, -0 LA: the teleportation shenanigans are fun but not useful.

[unseenmage]

Does Scatter Defilers just outright disperse swarms, mobs, and hiveminds?

Could be useful for a plague bearing Thrallherd build.

Still -0 for what appears to be some old guy with a towel over him straining on the throne.

[Celestia]

You could take levels in bard with Perform (Storytelling) and inspire your allies with tales from the crypt.

[Efrate]

In a low threat dungeon for a low level low op this is a great party splitter to force each pc to grasp with its weaknesses and get creative. And then hopefully understand their allies better and how they can work together to compliment each other and have the whole be greater than the sum of its parts.

As a PC it is a -0.

[liquidformat]

You could take levels in bard with Perform (Storytelling) and inspire your allies with tales from the crypt.

This seems like the most reasonable build for the Crypt Thing Keeper!

-0 LA, I would be willing to move it to +0 if it was given perform skill, bardic Knowledge, and Bardic Music.

[No brains]

You could take levels in bard with Perform (Storytelling) and inspire your allies with tales from the crypt.

This seems like the most reasonable build for the Crypt Thing Keeper!

-0 LA, I would be willing to move it to +0 if it was given perform skill, bardic Knowledge, and Bardic Music.

Eh, for +0, you would also need Skill Focus: Groaner Puns.

[liquidformat]

Eh, for +0, you would also need Skill Focus: Groaner Puns.

is that like a database that has all of Groaner's Puns?

[Covenant12]

Firm -0, no real redeeming features.

+6 Dex is nice, until you realize once you pay for weapon finesse -3 BAB means you still aren't good at anything. 2 1d6 attacks, +0 str, and at 6 RHD beatsticks are getting iteratives.
2+Int skills and +0 int, no real abilities but teleport everyone randomly once a day.

Extreme case of undead: make it better with more hd padding.