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Thread: House of X

  1. - Top - End - #151
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    EvilClericGuy

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rater202 View Post
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    Following the Terrigen mist and the mass death/sterilization of mutants, Bastion and a few other Sentinels ran into a bug in their programming and decided that if mutants went extinct, they'd follow soon(It's compared to a robot maid intentionally making messes to clean up so it won't be deactivated) and deciding to protect mutants only to hunt them again once the population was sustainable.

    This lead him to ally with Emma Frost(Went crazy when Scott died,) Alex(Still evil from Axis at the time,) Shaw, and Miss Sinister to try and manufacture mutants using a virus harvested from some mutants from the Ultimate universe who ended up in the main timeline after secret Wars.

    When Magneto's x-men team foiled the plot, Bastion was destroyed.
    Yeah I read those issues. I didn't recall Bastion being destroyed though. Not doubting you, more doubting my memory. Anyway, he's a robot. I'm sure he can be brought back. That's happened at least once already, right? Now that there are a lot more mutants his issues in that story arc have been solved so he should be ready to get back to hunting mutants.

    Maybe those Sentinels that Cyclops convinced to go attack the Sun can show up again at some point.

  2. - Top - End - #152
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    Bastion was destroyed utterly, not a piece left. To bring him back would require them to get an AU one.

    The Sentinels that went to attack the sun either burned up in the sun or ran out of juice and are now space debris.

    That was kind of the point of tricking them into flying into the sun.
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    Quote Originally Posted by zimmerwald1915 View Post
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  3. - Top - End - #153
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    I am here for Marauders energy.
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  4. - Top - End - #154
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    EvilClericGuy

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ramza00 View Post
    I am here for Marauders energy.
    I wasn't sold on the premise originally. I was going to stick with X-Men, New Mutants, and Excalibur*, but I asked the guy at my local shop to hold the #1s of all of the series so I could check them out and then decide if I want to keep them. I think I will give Marauders a chance. There's room for machinations with Emma Frost and Sebastian Shaw and I am wondering why Kitty can't use the gates. Although I am also wondering why she had to bring alcohol for Logan. He should be able to just use the gates and go buy some. I did like
    Spoiler
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    Iceman realizing that the Pyro on the boat was the original. Paraphrasing "The costume, the accent, holy crap you're the original Pyro!" "Yeah, I got drunk and passed out in the hold"


    * This is almost entirely due to Apocalypse, who will hopefully be treated as a real character. They've tried from time to time to do that and not just have him be the end boss and then it seems like nothing comes of it and he goes back to being the big bad again. Alternatively, if they were to completely embrace that and give me books of just Apocalypse monologuing I would also buy it. I'm hoping for Apocalypse the leader, the elder, the guy that's got a lot to say after having lived for 5,000 years and less Apocalypse the field general trying to take over/enslave/destroy the world. The preview pages have me hopeful.

  5. - Top - End - #155
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    Presumably, Logan found out that kitty was coming by ship and asked her to stock up on supplies for him since she had an entire ship's hold to work with.

    I mean, he more of less said to fill the hold with cases of beer, in addition to the Whiskey, ribs, that one fancy things, and so on.

    To get that much himself he'd have to take multiple trips to carry it all.
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    Quote Originally Posted by zimmerwald1915 View Post
    Meteor
    You are a meteor
    Falling star
    You soar your
    Way down the air
    To the floor
    Where my other
    Rocks
    Are.

  6. - Top - End - #156
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    EvilClericGuy

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rater202 View Post
    Presumably, Logan found out that kitty was coming by ship and asked her to stock up on supplies for him since she had an entire ship's hold to work with.

    I mean, he more of less said to fill the hold with cases of beer, in addition to the Whiskey, ribs, that one fancy things, and so on.

    To get that much himself he'd have to take multiple trips to carry it all.
    Yeah, but he could've had it a lot faster and made sure that he actually had it. I guess I just don't see the point of worrying about someone bringing something by ship when you have access to gates to teleport you all over the world in combination with people who can themselves teleport and people with super strength. Getting stuff and/or people into/out of areas where the gates are guarded by people who don't want anyone using them? Sure, use a normal mode of transportation like a ship (although the aforementioned teleporting mutants should negate the need for a ship here too). These are some of the reasons I was skeptical on this title. Maybe I'm just used to seeing Scott have Illyana teleport them wherever they need to go.

  7. - Top - End - #157
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    He seems more concerned about getting a supply of the stuff.

    Having Kate bring in the first batch means he has more time to work out a permanent solution.

    Logan lives on the moon now. Crossing borders every week to buy beer is gonna be one hell of a hassle.
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    Spoiler: Ode To Meteors, By zimmerwald
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    Quote Originally Posted by zimmerwald1915 View Post
    Meteor
    You are a meteor
    Falling star
    You soar your
    Way down the air
    To the floor
    Where my other
    Rocks
    Are.

  8. - Top - End - #158
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    EvilClericGuy

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rater202 View Post
    He seems more concerned about getting a supply of the stuff.

    Having Kate bring in the first batch means he has more time to work out a permanent solution.

    Logan lives on the moon now. Crossing borders every week to buy beer is gonna be one hell of a hassle.
    I would argue that going from the moon to somewhere in the U.S. where there is a gate is likely easier than whatever he was doing before the gates. The gates are instantaneous. Just do whatever he was doing before, except make the meet up/delivery point be one of the gates. Teleportation solves lots of logistical problems far more effectively than a boat.

    Speaking of teleportation, the book I have been most anticipating, Excalibur, came out this week. The spoiler free stuff first: This seems to mainly involve Betsy Braddock and Apocalypse. Magic is central to the story. Apocalypse, despite being with the X-Men, is still his usual self. I felt a monologue coming at any moment. I suppose the opening page may count as one.

    Now some spoiler stuff:
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    Apocalypse is a sorcerer? I know I shouldn't be surprised, but I am somewhat. I recall reading something about him acknowledging or embracing the mystical in some write up about him back in the 90s but I never saw it come to anything in the comics so I just assumed it got thrown in at random. Anyway, I'm cool with it. He's thousands of years of old and seen all kinds of things so it's not out of the question.

    Also, as I mentioned above, he is still basically the same character. Maybe more optimistic, definitely appearing to be more into the "thinker/philosopher" role while largely maintaining the same attitude. He's a little softer when dealing with most of the mutants (as in, he acknowledges them and doesn't become openly hostile), except Gambit who he basically dares to make a move against him after Gambit talks trash about him. Oh and apparently he has a new name but it's a Krakoan glyph.

    The opening page is a message that Apocalypse sends to the other Sorcerers of Earth announcing himself and proclaiming that mutants are on the rise, as well as their magic. One part makes me think he is rethinking Survival of the Fittest.

    Things are apparently not well in Otherworld. I won't lie, I'm not really in the know on Otherworld (didn't read much Excalibur), so I don't know how much of what is happening there is out of the ordinary. But as of now, Morgan La Fey is ruling there, there is a Krakoan gate in her scrying pool (that the mutants didn't put there), La Fey wants to fight the mutants, Betsy is now Captain Britain while Brian is trapped under La Fey's control in Otherworld, and Jamie is alive again. That last one is a source of some issues people have been talking about. Jamie seems to be totally anti-human now, including his human brother.

    So, there's a lot happening in this issue.

  9. - Top - End - #159
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    EvilClericGuy

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    So two more number 1s came out this week, X-Force and New Mutants. X-Force is supposed to be similar to previous versions of the team based on the solicits. New Mutants features a mix of some of the younger teams, mainly the New Mutants, going to space.

    X-Force features a follow up to Marauders 1 with Kitty showing up with mutant refugees from Russia while New Mutants features the team hitching a ride with the Starjammers into Shi'ar space in a follow up to X-Men 1. So, at least for these issues, the stories are intertwining between the various books. I assume they will diverge as the issues advance, but I could be wrong.

    Spoilers:
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    X-Force:
    Domino tries to infiltrate an anti-mutant group, but gets outed when they do blood tests looking for the X-Factor gene. A group of assassins from this organization is able to get into Krakoa via airdrop by making it appear that they are Domino using her DNA. A close look tells me that they probably did this by grafting strips of her skin onto their own. Black Tom Cassidy is the security for the island since he can interface with Krakoa. He tries to warn Xavier that too many people can come and go and there are too many vulnerabilities. Xavier says all mutants can be trusted. One of the assassins gets off a lucky shot and appears to kill Xavier. The last shot is Cerebro that has been shattered by a bullet. Not sure how well the resurrection set up works without him. This was a book that I wasn't planning on getting but I will give it a chance after reading this issue.

    New Mutants:
    The book starts with a flashback to the resurrection of Wolfsbane. Cypher tries to get Mondo to bond with Krakoa, unsuccessfully. Krakoa tries to bond with Mondo and it works for a moment but Krakoa backs out. Some of the New Mutants along with Mondo and Chamber are talking about how good things are when they comment that Cannonball should be here to see this. So, they decide to hitch a ride with the Starjammers to Shi'ar space to get Sam. Corsair gives them a lift that sees Roberto win a bet as to who will win a sword fight between Raza and Magik. Magik wins by cutting off his robo arm. They go to a space station where Corsair tells them a story to get them to stay on the ship. This is a cover because they are going to commit a heist. They go aboard anyway and end up arrested by the Shi'ar while the Starjammers leave them behind. Roberto says that he knows a good space lawyer. Overall it was nice seeing the interactions of members of two of the "next-gen" teams as well as their interactions with the Starjammers. I get the impression this is going to be more of a character driven book than a plot book, but it's only one issue and I could be wrong.

  10. - Top - End - #160
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    New comic for X-Men #2 and Fallen Angels #1.

    Spoiler: Explaining a religious / culture reference that I did not get on first read
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    I did not get this at first, but Kwannon is a name transliteral for Kuan Yin.

    Kuan Yin being another name for Guanyin or Guan Yin (Chinese name), though you often see in Japanese the name being Kanzeon or Kannon.

    The indian name for this same / similar character is Avalokiteśvara. If you have read Naruto and Bleach two different figures name drop and "invoke" Avalokitesvara as part of their ultimate attacks. That said there are some cultural differences between Guanyin and Avalokitesvara for culture, religion, and so on evolve over time and ideas can splinter when two cultures thousands of miles away are adding to meaning and lore over human time and space.

    -----

    I am not explaining the further significance of a "Divinity" who is tied to "Mercy" rejecting "Paradise" in order to "help others." For I do not want to break the rules of this forum. That said this cultural character is very important source of meaning to some people in this world.

    I bring this up for it is literally the first page of the comic, and the significance may be lost on people even if its this story's thesis statement. Kwannon is a weird way to spell that name but it makes sense from a transliteral / head rhyme standpoint.

    -----

    Sidenote the vision tells Psylocke to go back to the train, and it all began with the train at Tokyo. Is this trying to reference the religious cult that did the Tokyo Sarin Gas Attack on the Subway? I am not sure if I am liking this comic Fallen Angels.
    Last edited by Ramza00; 2019-11-13 at 01:43 PM.
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  11. - Top - End - #161
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ramza00 View Post
    New comic for X-Men #2 and Fallen Angels #1.

    Spoiler: Explaining a religious / culture reference that I did not get on first read
    Show

    I did not get this at first, but Kwannon is a name transliteral for Kuan Yin.

    Kuan Yin being another name for Guanyin or Guan Yin (Chinese name), though you often see in Japanese the name being Kanzeon or Kannon.

    The indian name for this same / similar character is Avalokiteśvara. If you have read Naruto and Bleach two different figures name drop and "invoke" Avalokitesvara as part of their ultimate attacks. That said there are some cultural differences between Guanyin and Avalokitesvara for culture, religion, and so on evolve over time and ideas can splinter when two cultures thousands of miles away are adding to meaning and lore over human time and space.

    -----

    I am not explaining the further significance of a "Divinity" who is tied to "Mercy" rejecting "Paradise" in order to "help others." For I do not want to break the rules of this forum. That said this cultural character is very important source of meaning to some people in this world.

    I bring this up for it is literally the first page of the comic, and the significance may be lost on people even if its this story's thesis statement. Kwannon is a weird way to spell that name but it makes sense from a transliteral / head rhyme standpoint.

    -----

    Sidenote the vision tells Psylocke to go back to the train, and it all began with the train at Tokyo. Is this trying to reference the religious cult that did the Tokyo Sarin Gas Attack on the Subway? I am not sure if I am liking this comic Fallen Angels.
    I believe the train comment is about the first few pages of the book where there's an incident on a train.

    I'll edit this later and add my thoughts on these two issues.

    Edit: Later is now

    Thoughts on X-Men 2 and Fallen Angels 1:
    Spoiler
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    First I should note that I don't believe these issues need to be read in a particular order. I don't recall anything that happened in one was referenced in the other.

    Also, even though he is barely in only one of these issues, I just want to mention that I am really liking that they are writing Apocalypse like a character and not just a plot device right now. I think there's potentially a lot to work with there so it's nice to see them do something with it.

    Fallen Angels: Being up front, I was not going to pick up this book until I realized that the books were as connected as they have been. That said, it was okay. It focused on Kwannon (who is going by Psylocke) dealing with a new "power" (I guess, it's not entirely clear yet) that is using a techno drug to build up something. It's name is Apoth and it seems happy that mutants are out of the way so mankind can evolve. Kwannon also apparently has a daughter who might be caught up in all of this.

    So far, everyone seems to be reacting pretty strongly to Xavier being killed in X-Force. This is kind of odd given that we know they can resurrect him. Magneto initially denies Kwannon her request to leave Krakoa and investigate her vision involving Apoth. Then he tells her to go talk to Mr. Sinister. Sinister gives her the go ahead but tells her to gather a team. She gets X-23 and later Sinister tells her to take Kid Cable. Sinister is being written like his older self here, not the goofball.

    I did have a favorite line in this issue: Kwannon "Sinister, I'm trying to prevent an apocalypse"
    Sinister "Apocalypse is a blue man with a very bad temper. And none of my concern."

    That one got a chuckle out of me. The rest of the book is pretty serious though. Overall I thought it was okay. I will see where the story goes. Hopefully the Apoth plot is a transhumanism related plot to tie into the future that Moira is trying to prevent.

    X-Men #2: I believe this series is supposed to be individual, self-contained stories. This one is about Cyclops and two of his kids, Rachel and Kid Cable, going to investigate another island drifting towards Krakoa. Krakoa is in turn also heading towards this island. The island is apparently filled with monsters and has what appears to be a volcano with tentacles coming out of it as a prominent feature.

    Kid Cable and Cyclops still come off as a little off here. Cyclops notes that he has more hours in a cockpit than in therapy. Kid Cable thinks a good gift to give to a stranger that they can't communicate with is a thermal grenade, which ends with the results any sane person would expect.

    The other island is Arakko. Eventually the Summers family meets an inhabitant of the island. The Summoner. The Summoner speaks to it's mother who's main advice is "Find HIM. Follow HIM." When they initially meet, the Summoner can't understand the mutants and vice versa, leading to Kid Cable's attempt at friendship by giving the Summoner a thermal grenade. Which he then detonates as he notices the shiny button. Eventually Rachel implants the Krakoan language into the Summoner and they are able to get past their first
    contact mistake.

    Once they do that, the two islands meet up and "merge". The characters react to seeing this as if the two islands just had sex with each other. Cyclops' comment is golden. Kid Cable "What. Was. That?" Cyclops "Well, son, I think that's how all my best mistakes have happened" And then the two islands are one.

    The final exchange between Cyclops and the Summoner is interesting: Cyclops "Hey! Where are you going? What happens now?" Summoner " I'm not going anywhere... because now I live here... and I live here because he lives here."

    In the final few pages you find out who "he" (and HIM) is. It's Apocalypse. The Summoner says that he was sent to find him and tell him that the walls hold, for now, but they are failing. His children hold the point, but Arrako will soon fall. The Summoner is the child of the original War. As in, the original that went with Apocalypse to stop the demon invasion thousands of years ago. And then the two have this exchange: Summoner "Will you save us? Can you save us?" Apocalypse "I can. I will. For I mean to save all of my children... those of Krakoa… and those of Arakko" And then Apocalypse hugs the Summoner like a parent hugging a child.

    For me, the final couple of pages made this issue. Seeing what appears to be a sensitive side to Apocalypse is virtually unheard of. The line about saving his children does leave me wondering. Is he speaking metaphorically and likely meaning all mutants or is he speaking literally and he has other children aside from Clan Akkaba? I know that Chamber and Blink are his descendants and he had a child with Famine, but presumably there are others. And of course there is Evan.

    Final note, the art. Both issues have some consistency issues with the other books. Mr. Sinister appears with more of a beard here than he has in his last few appearances. Apocalypse appears like has for years instead of his new monk-esque look that he had in Excalibur. I would hope for more consistent art.

  12. - Top - End - #162
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    New Mutants seems to imply X-Men have undone the bus deaths in Kyle and Yost's New X-Men and even pushed characters back into square one, judging how Rockslide is back to his original form and not the cool one. And they made that a background event to focus instead on old mutants.

    In other words, X-Men have spit in my face and I'm not touching any of this garbage pile of books ever again. Especially if you say I need to read all these awful books to get what is going on in one I wanted to read.
    Last edited by Man on Fire; 2019-11-16 at 08:20 AM.

  13. - Top - End - #163
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    New Mutants is focusing on the New Mutants...

    And other young mutants.

    While the actual New Mutants are in space, other issues will be handling other things.

    The third fourth and fifth issues are gonna be Glob, Armor, and the Albino twins from Extermination going around asking mutant children who elected not to come to Krakoa why they did so and visiting with human friends.

    Every death is being undone. The Bus deaths. The Genoshan Genocide. All of them. Skin and Synch were in the last of the prolog books during the big party scene. Everyone's coming back. That's the point.

    And Rockslide is a geokinetic psychic entity in a constructed mineral body. He looks like whatever he wants to look like.

    I legitimately don't see what you're complaining about. And I'm sorry, but we were told ahead of time that, yes, you do need to read the whole thing.

    At least all of HOXPOX.
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    Spoiler: Ode To Meteors, By zimmerwald
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    Quote Originally Posted by zimmerwald1915 View Post
    Meteor
    You are a meteor
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    Way down the air
    To the floor
    Where my other
    Rocks
    Are.

  14. - Top - End - #164
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rater202 View Post
    New Mutants is focusing on the New Mutants...

    And other young mutants.

    While the actual New Mutants are in space, other issues will be handling other things.

    The third fourth and fifth issues are gonna be Glob, Armor, and the Albino twins from Extermination going around asking mutant children who elected not to come to Krakoa why they did so and visiting with human friends.
    Hey, you know what Glob, Armor or these twins are not? Characters from Academy X, those who constantly and systematically get omitted and pushed int othe background in everything. Characters who in this entire godawful relaunch once again have been reduced to background props you could replace with a lamp.

    Also, after NextGen, I came to hate Glob Herman and all of Ed Brisson's creator's pets. After the way this writer treated Anole he is dead to me.

    Every death is being undone. The Bus deaths. The Genoshan Genocide. All of them. Skin and Synch were in the last of the prolog books during the big party scene. Everyone's coming back. That's the point.
    Then you should make the story out of it. Show them adjusting to having come back, show their friends' reactions. Not throw them in the background just like a thing to get over with and forgotten. If you do that, then you end invalidating entire tragedy and everything the surviving kids went through, reducing it to a cheap joke or even less. And when you do that, then congratulations, X-Editorial once again spit in the face of NXM fans.

    And Rockslide is a geokinetic psychic entity in a constructed mineral body. He looks like whatever he wants to look like.
    And he just decided to abandon the form he loved and found more cool in favor of looking exactly like back when no one treated him or his friends seriously but as inexperienced kids who don't know life? It sounds to me like an editorial mandate.

    I legitimately don't see what you're complaining about. And I'm sorry, but we were told ahead of time that, yes, you do need to read the whole thing.

    At least all of HOXPOX.
    Then they do books wrong. I'm not gonna waste my time on 8 books I do not want and never wanted to read just to get what is going on in ONE book I was interested in for the creative team. I will read 9 books I do want to read instead.

  15. - Top - End - #165
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    Quote Originally Posted by Man on Fire View Post
    Hey, you know what Glob, Armor or these twins are not? Characters from Academy X, those who constantly and systematically get omitted and pushed int othe background in everything. Characters who in this entire godawful relaunch once again have been reduced to background props you could replace with a lamp.
    It's an ensemble piece with over 80 confirmed characters over eight books.

    You can't just read the first issue of one book and then complain that your favorites aren't involved. You don't know that yet.
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    Spoiler: Ode To Meteors, By zimmerwald
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    Quote Originally Posted by zimmerwald1915 View Post
    Meteor
    You are a meteor
    Falling star
    You soar your
    Way down the air
    To the floor
    Where my other
    Rocks
    Are.

  16. - Top - End - #166
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rater202 View Post
    It's an ensemble piece with over 80 confirmed characters over eight books.

    You can't just read the first issue of one book and then complain that your favorites aren't involved. You don't know that yet.
    Oh, but they are involved. In the background. As props. Wallpaper. As they were for something like a decade now. And if there was then something that would THE BIGGEST DEAL POSSIBLE FOR THEM wouldn't be relegated to a single background panel in a book about someone else.

    X-Men are dead to me for this. The franchise has shown it hates my generation and it hates all the fans who didn't "fall in the fold" of worshipping same people from 60 years ago only. And I'm certainly not so pathetic to follow 10 or so books that openly spit in my face just out of vague promise maybe one day a character I actually care about will make more than a cameo in the background.

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    I think you're irrationally invested in the team from your childhood.

    The "biggest deal ever" for those characters is also the biggest deal ever for thousands of characters.

    You want them to spend an entire issue talking about literally everyone who was resurrected?
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    Spoiler: Ode To Meteors, By zimmerwald
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    Quote Originally Posted by zimmerwald1915 View Post
    Meteor
    You are a meteor
    Falling star
    You soar your
    Way down the air
    To the floor
    Where my other
    Rocks
    Are.

  18. - Top - End - #168
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    Quote Originally Posted by Man on Fire View Post
    Oh, but they are involved. In the background. As props. Wallpaper. As they were for something like a decade now. And if there was then something that would THE BIGGEST DEAL POSSIBLE FOR THEM wouldn't be relegated to a single background panel in a book about someone else.

    X-Men are dead to me for this. The franchise has shown it hates my generation and it hates all the fans who didn't "fall in the fold" of worshipping same people from 60 years ago only. And I'm certainly not so pathetic to follow 10 or so books that openly spit in my face just out of vague promise maybe one day a character I actually care about will make more than a cameo in the background.
    New Mutants #1 is only 36 pages long plus a cover. How was it supposed to keep everyone happy when you can only have so many characters in a story without putting many Characters in the Background?

    What there is
    New Mutants
    Helions
    Gen X
    Academy X New Mutants 00s, Academy X Helions 00s.

    And like 5 other teams besides this. How can you make everyone happy and include the roster of several dozen characters in a book of 36 pages.

    Just relax we will see more X Books in the future. Relax or do the opposite and send in your own story idea / pitch to Marvel comics.
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  19. - Top - End - #169
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    Default Re: House of X

    Quote Originally Posted by Rater202 View Post
    I think you're irrationally invested in the team from your childhood.
    Which I've only read in my 20's. Not even a decade has passed.

    The "biggest deal ever" for those characters is also the biggest deal ever for thousands of characters.

    You want them to spend an entire issue talking about literally everyone who was resurrected?
    They could have spent so much on resurrecting everyone else but they couldn't give Academy X even a one-shot. A single 20-pages one-shot is all I'm asking for and it's too much. Just simply do not have their biggest tragedy be undone unceremonially off-panel because it looks like you are ashamed of ever allowing these characters to grow and have developed and want to force them back into roles they long ago outgrew. Then again with them doing a New Mutants book they should be doing 30 years ago when instead they stabbed that book in the back for Rob Liefeld's shiny toys, it seems like being a middle-aged has-been trying to relive their "glory days" is all X-Men are about anymore.


    Quote Originally Posted by Ramza00 View Post
    New Mutants #1 is only 36 pages long plus a cover. How was it supposed to keep everyone happy when you can only have so many characters in a story without putting many Characters in the Background?

    What there is
    New Mutants
    Helions
    Gen X
    Academy X New Mutants 00s, Academy X Helions 00s.

    And like 5 other teams besides this. How can you make everyone happy and include the roster of several dozen characters in a book of 36 pages.
    Then they shouldn't be relegating what is a big deal for a different team to a BACKGROUND for their "preferred" team.

    Just relax we will see more X Books in the future. Relax or do the opposite and send in your own story idea / pitch to Marvel comics.
    You do realize this is literally THE LAST thing you should do? Marvel has strict "we do not accept unsolicited material" policy.

    Also, I want to point out Academy X fans have been getting the "be patient, there will be more X-Books in the future" for nearly a decade right now. Instead, the only thing that ever comes out is more of the same 10 people, while characters I like are being lucky if they get a background role or be on a cover to fool their fans into buying this crap. I'm sick of it. The franchise has shown me too many times it thinks my generation and my entire part of the fandom doesn't belong and does not matter, why should I stick to just to get more books about one of my most hated comic book characters Wolverine?

  20. - Top - End - #170
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    Default Re: House of X

    Quote Originally Posted by Man on Fire View Post
    They could have spent so much on resurrecting everyone else but they couldn't give Academy X even a one-shot. A single 20-pages one-shot is all I'm asking for and it's too much. Just simply do not have their biggest tragedy be undone unceremonially off-panel because it looks like you are ashamed of ever allowing these characters to grow and have developed and want to force them back into roles they long ago outgrew. Then again with them doing a New Mutants book they should be doing 30 years ago when instead they stabbed that book in the back for Rob Liefeld's shiny toys, it seems like being a middle-aged has-been trying to relive their "glory days" is all X-Men are about anymore.
    That is not how comics work, we only know 1 week to 3 months in advance what comics are going to get published and even then we may know nothing about them.

    For example I am excited for Incoming! #1 Something that will be published December 26th and it will be a 96 page one shot. We know nothing about Incoming besides its tag line

    "The most monumental story of 2020 kicks off here!"
    and
    "One Will Unite Them!"

    and we know nothing else, besides a teaser image and a youtube trailer. Links below

    Spoiler: Incoming Teasers.
    Show






    Why am I excited? Well that is Teddy Altman aka Hulkling on the cover. It is totally his sword, and his kree / skull body when he is not shapeshifted into a human but is in his green battle form. I love and adore Teddy and Billy from Young Avengers and we barely had any good content from them since the 2014 run. Yes we had some New Avenger stuff I found mostly forgettable [some of it was good, but most I can care less about Sunspot]. And we finally got a great one shot in 2019 by Anthony Oliveira in Warscrolls #2 that was a 12 page long story and we got some 2 short story events with Death Head (2019) and Strikeforce (2019)
    by Tini Howard, aka the author of Excalibur. But until May 2019 we have been lacking good Wiccan and Hulkling content for 5 years from Jan 2014 to May 2019.


    And we did not know that teaser image for a comic that comes out in Dec 26th till late August, and the youtube trailer I linked did not come out till 2 days ago in November. [I did not know of it till I wrote this post, when I was looking up the August date.]

    There can still very much be Academy X content, even their own books, for we do not know what is in the cards until 1 week to 3 months prior to publication. And the 3 months amount may just be the name of the comic but we know nothing inside of it.

    This is literally how comics work. I am sorry Academy X was not one of the first 6 Dawn of X Books, but that does not mean it will not happen!


    Marvel has strict "we do not accept unsolicited material" policy.
    Actually you do reach out to Marvel and give them "pitches" do not give them fully developed stories, but you give them "ideas for a story."

    You have to play the game "coy" but that is what Marvel wants. Why you have to play the game coy, it has to do with legal reasons where the actual "work" you do besides the pitch must be with you on some form of retainer via Marvel. This way you can't sue them later and say these "characters" I created were actually mine and not Marvels and I should get royalty rights. It has to do with all the stuff going back to the 1960s and how Jack Kirby and Stan Lee literally had a bitter divorce of how much Marvel owed Jack Kirby that went all the way to the supreme court.

    Likewise Marvel and DC "buy ideas" even if those ideas are never ever going to be developed by Marvel and they stick in a vault, and now the author who pitched those ideas can't create something similar enough under their own pen, or pitch it to another company. This sucks for the author even though Marvel "bought the idea", and the author got paid, for it sucks for they may be really good ideas but they never get developed, or upper management vetoes the idea for they are "conservative" and do not think the idea will sell even if you have an established track record and the lower management has bought the idea and the author is super excited about it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Man on Fire View Post
    Also, I want to point out Academy X fans have been getting the "be patient, there will be more X-Books in the future" for nearly a decade right now. Instead, the only thing that ever comes out is more of the same 10 people, while characters I like are being lucky if they get a background role or be on a cover to fool their fans into buying this crap. I'm sick of it. The franchise has shown me too many times it thinks my generation and my entire part of the fandom doesn't belong and does not matter, why should I stick to just to get more books about one of my most hated comic book characters Wolverine?
    I understand this hatred for I am a Young Avengers fan [even though I love the X-Men as a concept more, and I am not a big fan of The Avengers. Go Emma, asking where were the Avengers when 16 million mutants died!]

    But that is my point, comics can happen where characters get nothing for years, almost half a decade or decade. What you need is an interesting writer to make a pitch, and the pitch to be bought by the various levels of Marvel upper management and suddenly you have a book.

    It stinks that this is the game you play, but it is an entirely rational system and it is not pettiness of them being against Academy X in principle.
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  21. - Top - End - #171
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    Default Re: House of X

    Quote Originally Posted by Man on Fire View Post
    They could have spent so much on resurrecting everyone else but they couldn't give Academy X even a one-shot. A single 20-pages one-shot is all I'm asking for and it's too much. Just simply do not have their biggest tragedy be undone unceremonially off-panel because it looks like you are ashamed of ever allowing these characters to grow and have developed and want to force them back into roles they long ago outgrew. Then again with them doing a New Mutants book they should be doing 30 years ago when instead they stabbed that book in the back for Rob Liefeld's shiny toys, it seems like being a middle-aged has-been trying to relive their "glory days" is all X-Men are about anymore.
    How much page time do you think they are dedicating to showing people being resurrected? Aside from the issue during House/Powers of X (not sure which one) where they talk about being brought back and Excalibur where they show Jamie being brought back I don't think they have actually focused on showing anyone else being brought back. So far, almost everyone that isn't a main character in one of the books is "just a background character". They really can't hope to cover everyone.

    They also haven't really shown anything in the interim between where Uncanny left off and this story line. If I were a betting person I would put money on that being explored because it is a somewhat jarring transition. Your hoped for coverage could easily be in there. Or, since they seem to be lumping all of the younger teams into the New Mutants book, they will probably show up there at some point.

    We're one issue in on the new books (aside from X-Men) after the relaunch that reset to the new status quo. I can understand wanting a book focused on the characters that you want, but you need to give it time. Don't buy the books until you see what you want.
    Also, I want to point out Academy X fans have been getting the "be patient, there will be more X-Books in the future" for nearly a decade right now. Instead, the only thing that ever comes out is more of the same 10 people, while characters I like are being lucky if they get a background role or be on a cover to fool their fans into buying this crap. I'm sick of it. The franchise has shown me too many times it thinks my generation and my entire part of the fandom doesn't belong and does not matter, why should I stick to just to get more books about one of my most hated comic book characters Wolverine?
    Which same 10 characters? I don't think Angel has even shown up yet and he's one of the original 5. Beast was barely in X-Force #1, also one of the original 5. I think Apocalypse has had more page time than Iceman so far. Wolverine has barely been involved. Colossus has so far just been unconscious on a boat for a panel or two while Kwannon had most of a comic focusing on her.

    They can't make books focusing on everybody. We're one issue in with more series starting next year. Don't buy them if they don't interest you. I want to see all of these characters at some point, but they have to start somewhere. I'm with you on the not too hyped about Wolverine train. But I also understand that if they are trying to relaunch the brand to recapture the old glory now that Disney owns it all then it makes sense to focus on the characters that are popular. They keep coming back to certain characters for a reason. I suppose a chicken and the egg argument can be made as to whether they keep bringing back because they are popular or they are popular because they keep bringing them back. I personally believe it is because the characters sell. Viewed in that light, don't blame Marvel for not putting out books that feature characters that don't sell (even though they do with certain other characters for nebulous reasons).

    I liked the Avengers Academy series. I haven't read the two other series that I hear feature them (Avengers Arena and Avengers Undercover). Partially because I hear they are bad and partially because I haven't read Runaways and they are also part of it from what I understand. But I would like to see more with those characters and as far as I know outside of those two other stories of dubious quality they don't really ever show up again. All this while the Avengers are more or less the same people for decades on end. So, I feel you on this one.

  22. - Top - End - #172
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ramza00 View Post
    That is not how comics work, we only know 1 week to 3 months in advance what comics are going to get published and even then we may know nothing about them.
    There can still very much be Academy X content, even their own books, for we do not know what is in the cards until 1 week to 3 months prior to publication. And the 3 months amount may just be the name of the comic but we know nothing inside of it.

    This is literally how comics work. I am sorry Academy X was not one of the first 6 Dawn of X Books, but that does not mean it will not happen!
    We literally are days from knowing what will be published in February of 2020 and so far there is not an indicator nor is it even implied we will see any of Academy X kids in anywhere beyond a wallpaper. Then again, knowing that time Jason Aaron LIED about having an issue of Wolverine and the X-Men focus on these characters only for it to be about Quentin Quire, I do not trust the marketing department either.


    Actually you do reach out to Marvel and give them "pitches" do not give them fully developed stories, but you give them "ideas for a story."

    You have to play the game "coy" but that is what Marvel wants. Why you have to play the game coy, it has to do with legal reasons where the actual "work" you do besides the pitch must be with you on some form of retainer via Marvel. This way you can't sue them later and say these "characters" I created were actually mine and not Marvels and I should get royalty rights. It has to do with all the stuff going back to the 1960s and how Jack Kirby and Stan Lee literally had a bitter divorce of how much Marvel owed Jack Kirby that went all the way to the supreme court.

    Likewise Marvel and DC "buy ideas" even if those ideas are never ever going to be developed by Marvel and they stick in a vault, and now the author who pitched those ideas can't create something similar enough under their own pen, or pitch it to another company. This sucks for the author even though Marvel "bought the idea", and the author got paid, for it sucks for they may be really good ideas but they never get developed, or upper management vetoes the idea for they are "conservative" and do not think the idea will sell even if you have an established track record and the lower management has bought the idea and the author is super excited about it.
    No, this is one of the most naive things I heard. You plain and simply do not "sell" Marvel your ideas. Ideas are cheap, anyone can provide them. Ideas are literally the easiest thing to come up with. They do not need nor want ideas of randos online.

    But that is my point, comics can happen where characters get nothing for years, almost half a decade or decade. What you need is an interesting writer to make a pitch, and the pitch to be bought by the various levels of Marvel upper management and suddenly you have a book.

    It stinks that this is the game you play, but it is an entirely rational system and it is not pettiness of them being against Academy X in principle.
    We actually know that yes, the editorial is actively shooting down ideas involving them. We know that since current X-men editor Jordan White is acting openly condescending and outright passive-aggressive to any fan that asks for their return and is trying to push a lie they do not sell, even though when their book was going it was outselling Superman, Action Comics, Wonder Woman, JLA and Friendly Neighborhood Spider-Man.

  23. - Top - End - #173
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    Default Re: House of X

    Quote Originally Posted by Man on Fire View Post
    We literally are days from knowing what will be published in February of 2020 and so far there is not an indicator nor is it even implied we will see any of Academy X kids in anywhere beyond a wallpaper. Then again, knowing that time Jason Aaron LIED about having an issue of Wolverine and the X-Men focus on these characters only for it to be about Quentin Quire, I do not trust the marketing department either.
    Like I said earlier we only know 3 months in the future. Currently it is mid Nov, we will soon know what will be published in February.

    No, this is one of the most naive things I heard. You plain and simply do not "sell" Marvel your ideas. Ideas are cheap, anyone can provide them. Ideas are literally the easiest thing to come up with. They do not need nor want ideas of randos online.
    I know people who have published with Marvel.

    -----

    We are at an impasse, I do not care to have any further conversation on this matter. I too hope to see more team books with other teams besides the normal X-Men, and this includes Academy X / New Mutants Vol 2 of the 00s characters. We are actually in so much agreement here, where we disagree is whether Editorial is trying to spite Academy X fans for they just hate Academy X fans.
    Last edited by Ramza00; 2019-11-16 at 08:49 PM.
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  24. - Top - End - #174
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    Default Re: House of X

    I have a question related to the overall publishing scheme at Marvel related to the X-Men but not necessarily this current series. Hopefully someone here has an idea or can point in me in the right direction.

    How do the timelines for publication of Marvel Masterworks, Epic Collections, Omnibus Editions, etc all go together? Do they cover the same issues in a certain order? Like do they do the Masterworks and then the Omnibus that covers those issues? Also, is there any rhyme or reason to the reprint schedules on the Omnibus Editions?

    I have Uncanny X-Men Omnibus Vol 1 and Vol 2. I would like to get Vol 3 but it is out of print at the moment and I am not going to pay the ridiculous secondary market prices.* I also have the Fall of the Mutants Omnibus and the Inferno Prelude Omnibus. I'm probably going to get the Mutant Massacre Omnibus too. My ultimate goal is to have print versions of the X-Men/Uncanny X-Men run from start to finish. Between floppies and collected editions I have all but a handful of issues from 475 onward, about 40 odd floppies in the 300s, and slowly getting the collected editions for everything before that. So, I am wondering if anyone has any idea if they are going to reprint Uncanny Omnibus 3? And/or any idea in what form the issues between Omnibus 3 and the Mutant Massacre will show up? Omnibus 4 (and 5 maybe)? Likewise, any idea if the Inferno Omnibus will be reprinted?

    * I know I can get Marvel Unlimited to read them, and I might still do that because there are plenty of other books that I want to read. I also know at least one place I can read them for considerably less if I so desire. However, I prefer to read physical copies if I can at all help it.

  25. - Top - End - #175
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ramza00 View Post
    Like I said earlier we only know 3 months in the future. Currently it is mid Nov, we will soon know what will be published in February.
    Too bad that I've heard the same excuse 3 months ago when House of X and Powers of X were starting. And I heard it every month for the entire year. And the year before it. And the year before that. And so on and on.

    I know people who have published with Marvel.
    You, me, everyone with a twitter account.....

    where we disagree is whether Editorial is trying to spite Academy X fans for they just hate Academy X fans.
    It doesn't really matter if they want to do it or not, they're still spiting us with this bullmanure.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tyrant View Post
    How much page time do you think they are dedicating to showing people being resurrected? Aside from the issue during House/Powers of X (not sure which one) where they talk about being brought back and Excalibur where they show Jamie being brought back I don't think they have actually focused on showing anyone else being brought back. So far, almost everyone that isn't a main character in one of the books is "just a background character". They really can't hope to cover everyone.

    They also haven't really shown anything in the interim between where Uncanny left off and this story line. If I were a betting person I would put money on that being explored because it is a somewhat jarring transition. Your hoped for coverage could easily be in there. Or, since they seem to be lumping all of the younger teams into the New Mutants book, they will probably show up there at some point.
    Oh great, so my "only hope" is a book co-written by an overrated hack that wrote the very thing that pissed me off in the first place, showing he has zero respect or care for these characters and a homophobe who shouldn't be allowed anywhere near these characters after what he did in Disassembled and NextGen. Nah, we know that's nto true, apparently, the only team that matters to them is the 80's team and the homophobe is running his OC Squad + Armor as a B-Plot.

    We're one issue in on the new books (aside from X-Men) after the relaunch that reset to the new status quo. I can understand wanting a book focused on the characters that you want, but you need to give it time. Don't buy the books until you see what you want.
    Too bad that X-Men relaunch on yearly basis. Next year they'll relaunch everything for "phase II" or some other nonsense. They are always setting up status quo they'll roll back in five minutes just to keep things always about the same characters.

    Which same 10 characters? I don't think Angel has even shown up yet and he's one of the original 5. Beast was barely in X-Force #1, also one of the original 5. I think Apocalypse has had more page time than Iceman so far. Wolverine has barely been involved. Colossus has so far just been unconscious on a boat for a panel or two while Kwannon had most of a comic focusing on her.
    Wolverine, Xavier, Magneto, Cyclops, Jean, Emma, Cable, Kitty Pryde, Gambit, Rogue....

    They can't make books focusing on everybody. We're one issue in with more series starting next year. Don't buy them if they don't interest you. I want to see all of these characters at some point, but they have to start somewhere. I'm with you on the not too hyped about Wolverine train. But I also understand that if they are trying to relaunch the brand to recapture the old glory now that Disney owns it all then it makes sense to focus on the characters that are popular. They keep coming back to certain characters for a reason. I suppose a chicken and the egg argument can be made as to whether they keep bringing back because they are popular or they are popular because they keep bringing them back. I personally believe it is because the characters sell. Viewed in that light, don't blame Marvel for not putting out books that feature characters that don't sell (even though they do with certain other characters for nebulous reasons).
    Again, when NXM was canceled it was outselling Superman, Wonder Woman, JLA and even one of the Spider-Man books. There is literally zero evidence they weren't selling and we simply do not know how would they sell in the modern market. We might as well speculate editorial refuses not put out their book because of fear it will sell and take away an excuse to not give them a time in the spotlight.

    I liked the Avengers Academy series. I haven't read the two other series that I hear feature them (Avengers Arena and Avengers Undercover). Partially because I hear they are bad and partially because I haven't read Runaways and they are also part of it from what I understand. But I would like to see more with those characters and as far as I know outside of those two other stories of dubious quality they don't really ever show up again. All this while the Avengers are more or less the same people for decades on end. So, I feel you on this one.
    You do not lose anything on skipping Arena and Undercover, I hate both of those books with passion. Hazmat is in current Captain Marvel series and it's pretty good.

  26. - Top - End - #176
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    Quote Originally Posted by Man on Fire View Post
    Oh great, so my "only hope" is a book co-written by an overrated hack that wrote the very thing that pissed me off in the first place, showing he has zero respect or care for these characters and a homophobe who shouldn't be allowed anywhere near these characters after what he did in Disassembled and NextGen. Nah, we know that's nto true, apparently, the only team that matters to them is the 80's team and the homophobe is running his OC Squad + Armor as a B-Plot.
    Maybe you should consider moving on. I don't mean that as an insult or anything. You obviously have some very strong feelings about this and I'm not sure there is anything anyone can say that will sway you to see things any other way. I'm in a similar spot with Star Wars, though I wager I'm considerably more invested in that. If I can at least give it serious thought, you can too. I felt a lot better about halfway through Episode VIII when I consciously decided I didn't care what happened in the rest of the movie and I was just going to watch the train wreck unfold.
    Too bad that X-Men relaunch on yearly basis. Next year they'll relaunch everything for "phase II" or some other nonsense. They are always setting up status quo they'll roll back in five minutes just to keep things always about the same characters.
    Have you actually read House of X/Powers of X? I think it's reasonably safe to say that this is meant as a major shift that is meant to last for years.
    Wolverine, Xavier, Magneto, Cyclops, Jean, Emma, Cable, Kitty Pryde, Gambit, Rogue....
    Cable is dead, it's Kid Cable right now. Emma and Kitty Pryde have been contained to one book. As have Gambit and Rogue, and they are overshadowed by Besty Braddock and Apocalypse. In the post HoX/PoX books, Kwannon has had more page time than Wolverine. Kwannon. I think Apocalypse has too.

    But again, if you're relatively certain that some characters are more popular than others, why would you not use them? I despise Wolverine most of the time. As a consequence, I generally don't read his comics.
    Again, when NXM was canceled it was outselling Superman, Wonder Woman, JLA and even one of the Spider-Man books. There is literally zero evidence they weren't selling and we simply do not know how would they sell in the modern market. We might as well speculate editorial refuses not put out their book because of fear it will sell and take away an excuse to not give them a time in the spotlight.
    It could easily be exactly what you are saying, they have no idea how it will sell so they aren't going to risk it yet. Maybe after they have a solid foundation they can expand.
    You do not lose anything on skipping Arena and Undercover, I hate both of those books with passion. Hazmat is in current Captain Marvel series and it's pretty good.
    Yeah I'm in no hurry to read them. If I find the collected editions on the cheap I will get them and read them at some point. Glad to hear at least one character is being used.

  27. - Top - End - #177
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tyrant View Post
    Maybe you should consider moving on.
    That's pretty much what I'm saying I'm going to do?

    Have you actually read House of X/Powers of X? I think it's reasonably safe to say that this is meant as a major shift that is meant to last for years.
    And that stops them from relaunching all the books again for a "phase II" how exactly?

    Cable is dead, it's Kid Cable right now.
    Potato, potatoe.

    But again, if you're relatively certain that some characters are more popular than others, why would you not use them?
    Because it stifles creativity where everything must be only about the same people, it creates an environment where no character who isn't already superpopular can naturally build their fanbase and rise to popularity anymore which is ironic when you consider there were times when X-Men themselves had to go through that for years. It also creates a grotesque situation where it is "safer" to force a "classic" character into a role that goes against all they stand for, despite the fact it could be much better fulfilled by one of the less popular characters, like they did with Moira. Because it keeps the franchise ever in one place and doesn't allow for the same natural growth that X-Men got its popularity from. Because it becomes boring as you realize the creative team is not allowed to take any risks with popular characters and just crumming out stories that present nothing of value to the reader except most shallow power fantasy.

    I despise Wolverine most of the time. As a consequence, I generally don't read his comics.
    Same, there was no Wolverine book I liked in my life except one where Logan was replaced by Laura.

    It could easily be exactly what you are saying, they have no idea how it will sell so they aren't going to risk it yet. Maybe after they have a solid foundation they can expand.
    A which point they'll relaunch all the books to keep the sales up as they have done for the last several years. And once again it will be time to lay down the "solid foundation" and never expand and NXM will once again be threw into the background. Besides, after what they have just done in New Mutants it is clear there is no longer any point AND the creative team is unwilling to ever do that anyway. You do not go and put that big of a signal that all the pain these kids went through doesn't matter, you do not spit in the fans' faces s hard and then expect them to round up to buy your books.

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    Default Re: House of X

    Two more X-Books came out this week, Excalibur #2 and Marauders #2. Excalibur is following very closely from the last issue while Marauders isn't quite as directly connected. Excalibur focused a little less on Apocalypse in this issue, but he is still central to the events of the book.

    Some spoiled comments:
    Spoiler
    Show
    Marauders #2:This issue features some machinations between Emma and Sebastian Shaw. Shaw is supposed to only be dealing with the black market of Krakoan flowers and apparently he went beyond his mandate. In response, the Marauders attacked and sank his boat, which was being guarded by Batroc. Batroc tries to reason with them, but Captain Kate is there to send a message. With that done they head to shore and get drunk. Kate gets some knuckle tattoos and Pyro gets a face tattoo. Iceman ponders where he could get a tattoo that wouldn't show when he turned to ice mode.

    Pyro seems to still be in disbelief that he is back to life. He and Kate are heavily drinking. They hook up with Bishop and then Gateway teleports them to London where they get a new (heavily armed) boat. Kate goes to the Hellfire Club where she gets to rub it in Shaw's face that she is now the Red Queen (complete with pirate outfit).

    Based on one of the info dump pages, Kate and her crew might just be a distraction to conceal other activities of the Hellfire Trading Company.

    Excalibur #2: Gambit, Rogue (still in a magic coma, glowing on a bed of flowers), Jubilee, and Betsy catch a ride from Kate to the lighthouse from the old Excalibur run. Or at least to where it used to be as it is no longer there. There's a flashback featuring Apocalypse watching two mutants try to escape in a boat in what I assume is the same location. They end up drowning and Apocalypse does not try to save them as they brought it on themselves.

    The team is attacked by sea monsters and driven onto land. Betsy talks with some druids who welcome and accept her as the new Captain Britain. They tell her that Krakoa can take root there so the flowers that Rogue is laying on form a new lighthouse with her as the light. Jubilee has a dream of Apocalypse grabbing Shogo and bringing him there with a very threatening tone. She decides to go get Shogo from Krakoa.

    Coven Akkaba attacks the new lighthouse. Apocalypse tells Betsy that they are humans who used to serve him. They are magic users who thought he would spare them for serving him (this is apparently not what he planned). He teleports there and wipes them out. It's implied that he could be the one who planted the Krakoan gate in Otherworld. Apocalypse tells them that if they want to have any chance of saving Brian that they have to go to Otherworld right now. They don't want to leave Rogue unguarded, so Apocalypse whips out a giant hammer and says he will defend the lighthouse. He also says that he and Rogue together can't be beaten (though he doesn't elaborate on that). Jubilee says she needs to go to Krakoa to take Shogo back. Apocalypse offers to watch him, but Jubilee declines his offer. Instead he gets sucked into Otherworld with the team. Shogo may or may not have been turned into a giant dragon.

  29. - Top - End - #179
    Troll in the Playground
     
    Ramza00's Avatar

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    Jul 2006
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    Default Re: House of X

    So theme wise I think it is obvious.

    Spoiler
    Show

    Apocalypse is the big bad of Excalibur long term. The two twin dying with the English Channel and being the future foundation of the Lighthouse, parallels Elizabeth and Brian Braddock way too nicely. Apocalypse is indifferent / ambivalent of what happens to those 4 mutants plus Brian. He will sacrifice, sacred mutants, in order to unlock the "sacer" power. Mutant power is the ends that Apocalypse craves, and he is treating mutants as means to that end. Pretty much Kantian aka Duty / Obligation vs Consequentialist ethics.

    ----

    I loved both chapters. But I loved Marauders more than Excalibur. The one flaw in Marauders is they need to have the colorist get dark skin right, for it does not look that way at night, even if you shine blue light on it. It happening in two different chapters with 3 characters now [though less so with Bishop] is really getting to me. Hopefully they will fix it before it goes trade paperback, and fix it in future chapters.
    Stupendous Man drawn by Linklele

  30. - Top - End - #180
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    EvilClericGuy

    Join Date
    May 2007
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    Default Re: House of X

    Quote Originally Posted by Ramza00 View Post
    So theme wise I think it is obvious.

    Spoiler
    Show

    Apocalypse is the big bad of Excalibur long term. The two twin dying with the English Channel and being the future foundation of the Lighthouse, parallels Elizabeth and Brian Braddock way too nicely. Apocalypse is indifferent / ambivalent of what happens to those 4 mutants plus Brian. He will sacrifice, sacred mutants, in order to unlock the "sacer" power. Mutant power is the ends that Apocalypse craves, and he is treating mutants as means to that end. Pretty much Kantian aka Duty / Obligation vs Consequentialist ethics.

    ----

    I loved both chapters. But I loved Marauders more than Excalibur. The one flaw in Marauders is they need to have the colorist get dark skin right, for it does not look that way at night, even if you shine blue light on it. It happening in two different chapters with 3 characters now [though less so with Bishop] is really getting to me. Hopefully they will fix it before it goes trade paperback, and fix it in future chapters.
    Spoiler
    Show
    I'm not entirely sure Apocalypse is the long term villain. On the one hand, yeah, it's Apocalypse, of course he's the villain. On the other hand, the way X-Men #2 ended coupled with the possibility that some of Age of X-Man rubbed off on him leads me to hope that they don't just go down that simplistic path. I think (and hope) that if they portray him as the villain we eventually see that he truly was doing whatever it is he is doing for the betterment of mutantkind and that he is willing to take the hit and be portrayed as the villain if that's what it takes. Alternatively, just show that he's playing the long game. They haven't really addressed what happens if mutants die of old age. Do they get resurrected too? If not, he just has to wait and eventually he will probably rule it all since he's immortal.

    In other words, I'm hoping it's him just being amoral and not outright evil. I think I saw someone on reddit put it best. Amoral is him being good. He hasn't kidnapped and brainwashed anyone yet so he's being good.

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