Grrl Power V: Probably Not an Octopus

[Dragonus45]

Yea, Sydney's power set is one of someone best used to deal enemies largely impervious to normal fire, giant kaiju type people or things, or super vehicles. It's fairly difficult for her to deal with anything smaller without causing disproportionate harm for a law enforcement officer. Or to everything in a 5 mile radius.

[Traab]

I dunno man, the thing is, guns are not a de-escalation tool. Even in a world of supers the line between guns being a lethal weapon and guns being at most an annoyance is thin. Im pretty sure more than half of arcswat could be killed by a bullet if caught off guard. Lets start with the obvious, peggy, halo for sure, I am pretty sure that while math is likely quick enough to catch a bullet or deflect it or something, that he isnt so physically tough he is bullet proof, heatwave isnt that physically durable, neither is jiggawatt or harem. Max, hiro, and anvil are probably the only truly bulletproof ones on the team, even dabbler would probably be riddled with bullets if she didnt have her tech/magic up to block it. Im sticking with its use as a universal threat as its primary value to sydney seeing as actually using one is something that would reduce her to a regular human in a serious situation which defeats the entire point of arcswat. If guns were enough to handle the situation, why are the supers there at all? Again, there probably are very specific scenarios where that would make sense, but generally, it is a waste of resources.

[HandofShadows]

If someone points their finger at you is your first impulse to stop what you are doing and put your hands up? Even if you know that person can burn a hole through you? The reaction to surrender isn't there. But if someone points a gun, that would be your first impulse. As someone who has had a gun pointed at them and was threaten to be killed, I know how much "built in" reactions are important.

[Keltest]

Im not much of a gun enthusiast, but from my understanding one of the first rules is "don't point your gun at something you aren't prepared to kill", and if Sydney is in a situation where she feels the need to use lethal force, her orbs are almost certainly going to serve her better. If nothing else, she cant shoot a gun from inside her shield. I even recall the comic itself pointing out that no, its not supposed to be used as a bluff.

[Ibrinar]

If someone points their finger at you is your first impulse to stop what you are doing and put your hands up? Even if you know that person can burn a hole through you? The reaction to surrender isn't there. But if someone points a gun, that would be your first impulse. As someone who has had a gun pointed at them and was threaten to be killed, I know how much "built in" reactions are important.

I disagree with the comic, with known supers with relevant powers yes it would be. Unless I think we are in a non confrontational situation and it is just a gesture. (As for guns in non confrontational there my reaction would be "don't point that at people" because I have less trust in them not going off than I would have with superpowers.)

Guns are a learnt threat (picked up via media for many) people are entirely capable of learning supers are a threat by watching them on TV and if the super is being threatening about their gesture then they will act accordingly. Main limitation is when somebody doesn't know the super they will have no idea what kind and how much of a threat they are.

[sihnfahl]

Yea, Sydney's power set is one of someone best used to deal enemies largely impervious to normal fire, giant kaiju type people or things, or super vehicles. It's fairly difficult for her to deal with anything smaller without causing disproportionate harm for a law enforcement officer. Or to everything in a 5 mile radius.

I dunno, I can think of various uses for her orb powers that are small scale and don't cause property damage...

[Rogar Demonblud]

Decent advice for Sydney today. And given the amount of sugar we see her eat I'm starting to wonder if Seneca is a Sato Expy.

[Traab]

I dunno, I can think of various uses for her orb powers that are small scale and don't cause property damage...

Her lighthook alone is ideal for restraining anything not capable of hurling cars or above around. Her ppo on the other hand currently lacks a stun function. Might be mixed in with the large assortment of upgrades though. So yeah she has options for if she doesnt want to blow up armored vehicles or set fire to everything. I honestly cant think of a time where her use of a gun would be preferred to use of her orbs.

As for the person talking about learned responses, yes, in time that might be the case, however, supers are literally only now coming out into the open. There has been no time for human culture to develop the built in response along the lines of someone pointing a gun at you to a super pointing their activated power at you. Combine that with the sheer variety of powers out there, and its going to be hard to develop it at all because "Guy holding giant boulder" isnt going to have the same effect as "guy with glowing fist" who isnt going to have the same effect as "woman creating a shimmering effect on the ground around you"

[Rogar Demonblud]

I believe what you're looking for would be less fear of *SPECIFIC ACTION* and more general fear of the unknown with supers. There's a reason a lot of stories that deal with the people in the street side of a supers-verse have a distinct horror element of surviving in a world run by monsters.

[Rogar Demonblud]

That went better than I expected.

[Kantaki]

That went better than I expected.

Well, she did avoid grievously injuring herself ( again).

Also, she probably did better than I would.
Not that I ever even held a gun...

[Dragonus45]

I have an uncle who always takes a 454 along when we go hunting in case of bears, and I really feel like the amount of oomph here is being oversold. I can see that as Sydney just being Sydney but that just makes me more mad. This **** isn't a toy and goofing off with a full fall like that on a range can lead to a bad ricochet seriously harming someone.

[Forum Explorer]

I have an uncle who always takes a 454 along when we go hunting in case of bears, and I really feel like the amount of oomph here is being oversold. I can see that as Sydney just being Sydney but that just makes me more mad. This **** isn't a toy and goofing off with a full fall like that on a range can lead to a bad ricochet seriously harming someone.

I think it's actually a matter of the amount of oomph being oversold. The guy writing the comic has never fired a gun if I recall correctly and while he's doing his best to keep a realistic idea on how guns are fired, gun safety, ect, he doesn't actually have the experience to know that even a powerful pistol still doesn't have the power to knock you over.

[Traab]

I think it's actually a matter of the amount of oomph being oversold. The guy writing the comic has never fired a gun if I recall correctly and while he's doing his best to keep a realistic idea on how guns are fired, gun safety, ect, he doesn't actually have the experience to know that even a powerful pistol still doesn't have the power to knock you over.

Or he has watched the youtube videos of idiots holding guns and giving themselves concussions from the recoil. They may not be able to launch you backwards but I could see them sending your arm flying and knocking you off balance. The rest is klutzy sydney. At most its a bit of an exaggeration. It might even be more her being terrified of the recoil she knows is coming and actually jumping back herself, "jumping the gun" so to speak.

[Max_Killjoy]

In the comments, he specifically mentions that it's Sydney over-reacting, not the gun, that causes her to pratfall.

[Dragonus45]

In the comments, he specifically mentions that it's Sydney over-reacting, not the gun, that causes her to pratfall.

Pratfalling with a loaded .454... someone please smack her on the back of the head. If it was just him overselling then recoil that would be one thing, but for reason this odd bit of gun negligence just has he all sorts of mad.

[Rogar Demonblud]

When Peggy hears about all of this Sydney is gonna do aaallllll the PT in the world at double-quick.

[Max_Killjoy]

When Peggy hears about all of this Sydney is gonna do aaallllll the PT in the world at double-quick.

Or Seneca... since she's the instructor.

[Dragonus45]

Or Seneca... since she's the instructor.

Both? Yea, both.

[lord_khaine]

When Peggy hears about all of this Sydney is gonna do aaallllll the PT in the world at double-quick.

Hear about what?
That Sydney is allowed to try a shot with a hand cannon?
Or understandedly stumbles as she is scared by the shock and the noise?

Nothing to get at there.
Though i do agree, this is a colossal waste of Sydney's time. She should be shooting with her orbs, not a gun.
If its a situation where Sydney with a gun makes a difference, then its overkill to send Sydney.

[Rogar Demonblud]

Sydney is screwing around. She was not forced to take a step back. She threw herself a couple meters back while screaming and waving her arms about, requiring the range master to grab the pistol before it slammed into something and risk an accidental discharge. Then, she was explicitly told not to do something by the rangemaster, went and did it anyway and got hurt (again).

If she shows such a complete lack of discipline with something as relatively safe as firearms, do you really want her waving that PPO around?

[Forum Explorer]

Sydney is screwing around. She was not forced to take a step back. She threw herself a couple meters back while screaming and waving her arms about, requiring the range master to grab the pistol before it slammed into something and risk an accidental discharge. Then, she was explicitly told not to do something by the rangemaster, went and did it anyway and got hurt (again).

If she shows such a complete lack of discipline with something as relatively safe as firearms, do you really want her waving that PPO around?

In Sydney's defense she very didn't want to shoot that gun, but was pressured into it. And for the gun twirling, she did make sure that the gun was completely safe first. Well, to everyone else anyways.

So I wouldn't describe it as a complete lack of discipline.

[Kantaki]

If she shows such a complete lack of discipline with something as relatively safe as firearms, do you really want her waving that PPO around?

No. But I knew that without seeing this embarrassment for her teachers.
Sydney never was the kind of person I'd trust with that amount of power.
Any amount of power actually.

[lord_khaine]

Then, she was explicitly told not to do something by the rangemaster, went and did it anyway and got hurt (again).

And for the gun twirling, she did make sure that the gun was completely safe first.

Yeah. That bit is incorrect. She was told not to do it with a loaded gun. So she emptied it.
And got a silent permission to try her stunt. Since Seneca had the chance to tell her off on that as well.

No. But I knew that without seeing this embarrassment for her teachers.
Sydney never was the kind of person I'd trust with that amount of power.
Any amount of power actually.

Teachers fault. She should be in a desert training with the PPO.
Who by the way as such things go is far safer. Or perhaps the correct team is more reliable.
It unfortunately can destroy a lot more. But on the other hand its also a lot less likely to go off accidentially.

[Rogar Demonblud]

"Accidentally" is not the issue. "Without thinking it through" is. Granted, Sydney bounced between the two constantly, but the second is far more likely to have consequences that should be foreseen (NDT and spicy food from hell, FREX).

[Keltest]

"Accidentally" is not the issue. "Without thinking it through" is. Granted, Sydney bounced between the two constantly, but the second is far more likely to have consequences that should be foreseen (NDT and spicy food from hell, FREX).

Sydney has a lot more respect for the PPO than I think you give her credit for. By her own admission, she's a little intimidated by its power and is leery of just cutting loose with it absent a big dumb target she can safely unload on.

[Rogar Demonblud]

So she can use it safely because she's intimidated by it because she's unfamiliar with it? Then we need to make sure she is NOT trained in it. We were just shown that familiarity leads to contempt for Sydney, and that is a lethal attitude when weapons are involved (not specific to Sydney, as that's the reason for most accidental shootings).

I repeat: Sydney needs to learn basic discipline before anything else happens.

[Keltest]

So she can use it safely because she's intimidated by it because she's unfamiliar with it? Then we need to make sure she is NOT trained in it. We were just shown that familiarity leads to contempt for Sydney, and that is a lethal attitude when weapons are involved (not specific to Sydney, as that's the reason for most accidental shootings).

I repeat: Sydney needs to learn basic discipline before anything else happens.

So she needs to learn discipline, but she isn't allowed to be taught or learn how to develop it? That's ridiculous.

[Rogar Demonblud]

No, she isn't to be taught weapons until she learns discipline.

[Max_Killjoy]

At some point people have to remember that this is at its core a comedy comic, not a dead serious examination of superhero life.