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  1. - Top - End - #1
    Ettin in the Playground
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    Default Mount, the spell.

    Reading the Mount spell:

    You summon a light horse or a pony (your choice) to serve you as a mount. The steed serves willingly and well. The mount comes with a bit and bridle and a riding saddle.
    ...so you summon it to serve you as your mount, but it serves you "willingly and well." How well?

    Specifically, can you summon a light horse, then order it to fight for you? It is substantially better than anything on the Summon Monster I list (19 hp, 1d4+1 attack... not amazing, but beats Summon Monster I.) But, more importantly, even for a level 1 caster it will last 2 hours instead of the, oh, six seconds afforded by Summon Monster I. In wide corridors, it is, if nothing else, a much better way to search for traps, while also having a handy ally around to take a hit or two at low levels, and maybe land a few good hits itself.

    I'm guessing the above don't really work, though; the horse is just a horse, and no matter how well it serves you, you still need a DC 25 Handle Animal check and a full-round action to push it into attacking. I still think that this illustrates how awful Summon Monster I is. But wait! We can still do something. (Well, we can still drive the horse in front of us to set off traps and maybe take hits from very stupid monsters, at least)

    It says the horse comes with a bit and bridle, and the rules for summoning spells specifically say:
    When the spell ends or is dispelled, a summoned creature is instantly sent back to where it came from, but a summoned object is not sent back unless the spell description specifically indicates this.
    So you get to keep that. How much are a bit and bridle worth, anyway?

  2. - Top - End - #2
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    boomwolf's Avatar

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    Default Re: Mount, the spell.

    i don't think he fights.


    Quote Originally Posted by Cormag81 View Post
    2117: No matter how good a debater I am out of character there is no way to logically get out of falling after your paladin kills his patron god.

  3. - Top - End - #3
    Ettin in the Playground
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    Default Re: Mount, the spell.

    Nevermind that. I noticed something much more important: Aside from leaving behind a bit and bridle, the horse also comes with a riding saddle. Riding saddles are worth 10 gp (the bit and bridle is worth 2 gp.) So you can make a total of 6 gp per casting, even without trying to cheat people by selling the horse.
    Last edited by Aquillion; 2007-10-15 at 05:19 AM.

  4. - Top - End - #4
    Ettin in the Playground
     
    AslanCross's Avatar

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    Default Re: Mount, the spell.

    A bit and bridle cost 2 GP.
    The mount isn't a warhorse or warpony and will therefore panic in a fight. It will require some ride checks to get it to do what you want to do if you're in a combat situation.

    Edit: furthermore, it does say it serves you willingly and well as a mount, not as an animal companion. Therefore it will take the regular handle animal checks to push it to attack. Furthermore, attacking isn't something it can do well.
    Last edited by AslanCross; 2007-10-15 at 05:23 AM.


    Eberron Red Hand of Doom Campaign Journal. NOW COMPLETE!
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    "I dunno, you just gave me the image of a nerd flying slow motion over a coffee table towards another nerd, dual wielding massive books. It was awesome." -- Marriclay

  5. - Top - End - #5
    Troll in the Playground
     
    Lord Lorac Silvanos's Avatar

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    Default Re: Mount, the spell.

    Summoned creatures do not leave their equipment behind.

    If the spell was called Saddle and came with a horse I could see your point.
    All Yours Popcorn are belongs to me truly,
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  6. - Top - End - #6
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    Zombie

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    Default Re: Mount, the spell.

    Maybe I am tainted by the Paladins summoned mount idea, but surely there are better summonable trapsweepers then a horse ?
    As for taking and selling the saddle and bit, do not all changes to the summon rollback when the summon is dismissed/dispelled/runs out of time ?
    Including but not limited to,
    1. The summoned creature is if killed restored to life before going back
    2. Any negative debuffs go away (poison what have you)
    3. Bodyparts and blood also go away (like a chopped off spiderleg)

    Especially considering 3, any equipment that the mount comes with, would also disappear when the mount does.

    And if it does not, you be sure that the spell suddenly calls for a 20 gold material component

    Edit: Noticed the differences in time between mount and summon monster.
    If the time is important, put a couple sheep in a portable hole or something and use at your leisure. Unless the traps are poisonous it would double as rations.
    Last edited by Khanderas; 2007-10-15 at 06:01 AM.

  7. - Top - End - #7
    Ettin in the Playground
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    Default Re: Mount, the spell.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord_Silvanos View Post
    Summoned creatures do not leave their equipment behind.

    If the spell was called Saddle and came with a horse I could see your point.
    Where does it say that? I'm not arguing, since it makes sense, but it isn't in the basic rules for summoned creatures, which actually seem to imply the opposite (summoned objects remain unless the spell says otherwise.) While spells end, nothing is said about equipment, other objects the spell summoned, and so forth.

    (Although I suppose this particular brand of un-logic does lead to things like "I hack off the horse's limb. The limb is no longer alive, and is hence now an 'object', and remains when the rest of the horse disappears." Or summoning something, then petrifying it to keep it from going away, since it's now an object.)

    Edit: Noticed the differences in time between mount and summon monster.
    If the time is important, put a couple sheep in a portable hole or something and use at your leisure. Unless the traps are poisonous it would double as rations.
    For trapsweeping, I was thinking more along the lines of its value at low levels (when portable holes are expensive.) At higher levels, you probably have better options anyway.
    Last edited by Aquillion; 2007-10-15 at 06:13 AM.

  8. - Top - End - #8
    Troll in the Playground
     
    Lord Lorac Silvanos's Avatar

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    Default Re: Mount, the spell.

    Quote Originally Posted by Aquillion View Post
    Where does it say that?
    It takes the FAQ to clarify the RAI.

    Quote Originally Posted by FAQ
    What happens to a summoned monsterís equipment
    when it dies or the spell ends? What if itís not carrying the
    equipment any more? What if itís carrying something new?


    When a summoned creature goes away, so does everything
    it came with. If itís holding or wearing something it didnít
    appear with, that item drops to the ground in the creatureís
    space after it disappears.
    All Yours Popcorn are belongs to me truly,
    LLS

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    Avatar by Ink.

  9. - Top - End - #9
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    GnomeWizardGuy

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    Default Re: Mount, the spell.

    If you're looking to use it at low levels then there are better ays of getting trap sweeping than using up one of your few spell slots. Just buy twenty sheep and pay a shepherd boy to move them around for you. Lots of food and lots of trap sweeping for little real investment.
    Give them bread and circusses and the plebs wont rise against you. Give adventurers dungeons and trapped chests and they won't waste time looking to ransack your home and kill your wife.

  10. - Top - End - #10
    Firbolg in the Playground
     
    Person_Man's Avatar

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    Default Re: Mount, the spell.

    Mount is a great way to detect traps. However, if you use mount in this fashion, it almost always alerts everything in the dungeon that there's danger at their entrance. They can then attack the PC's en masse, or go out the back door and ambush them from behind. So you don't take damage from traps, but then you're at a huge tactical disadvantage.

  11. - Top - End - #11
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    TimeWizard's Avatar

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    Default Re: Mount, the spell.

    But a better tactical advantage then you alerting the whole dungeon by triggering the trap on yourself.
    Quote Originally Posted by HerrTenko View Post
    TimeWizard, you've got to do something about all that Clarity you've got. It starts by just ruining jokes, but soon you'll be dreaming of electric sheep and stuff. It can't be good for you.

  12. - Top - End - #12
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    OldWizardGuy

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    Default Re: Mount, the spell.

    See if your DM will let pay the research to discover the level 2 original spell War Mount.

    A War Dog would probably be a level 1 spell.

  13. - Top - End - #13
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    OldWizardGuy

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    Default Re: Mount, the spell.

    I remember seeing a spell that "trains" animals for a period of time. Don't remember the specifics but believe it was a first level divine (druid) spell. Not sure if it would work on a Mount as a summoned creature but worth a look if anyone recalls the spell name or source book.

  14. - Top - End - #14
    Firbolg in the Playground
     
    Mewtarthio's Avatar

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    Default Re: Mount, the spell.

    Quote Originally Posted by CASTLEMIKE View Post
    I remember seeing a spell that "trains" animals for a period of time. Don't remember the specifics but believe it was a first level divine (druid) spell. Not sure if it would work on a Mount as a summoned creature but worth a look if anyone recalls the spell name or source book.
    That's second level. I'm not sure if burning a first- and a second-level spell is worth it.
    Quote Originally Posted by Winterwind View Post
    Mewtarthio, you have scared my brain into hiding, a trembling, broken shadow of a thing, cowering somewhere in the soothing darkness and singing nursery rhymes in the hope of obscuring the Lovecraftian facts you so boldly brought into daylight.

  15. - Top - End - #15
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    OldWizardGuy

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    Default Re: Mount, the spell.

    Quote Originally Posted by Mewtarthio View Post
    That's second level. I'm not sure if burning a first- and a second-level spell is worth it.
    Do you recall the name and or source book of the spell? Thanks.

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