70% caster party?

[Icewalker]

I'm making an adventure for pbp which will be 5-7 players, with the requirement that everybody in the party except 1 or 2 people be an arcane caster. The first adventure is going to be probably 50% smartness puzzles (ie riddles, chess puzzle), 25% mechanics puzzles (ie how can we use our limited spells to do this crazy thing), maybe 5% roleplaying and 10% fighting. Mostly a puzzle dungeon adventure.

Would anything go wrong with this party set up? Any arcane caster which I can get my hands on info for, so anything from Wizards to Wu Jen to Warblades.

First level party.

[Gralamin]

I'm making an adventure for pbp which will be 5-7 players, with the requirement that everybody in the party except 1 or 2 people be an arcane caster. The first adventure is going to be probably 50% smartness puzzles (ie riddles, chess puzzle), 25% mechanics puzzles (ie how can we use our limited spells to do this crazy thing), maybe 5% roleplaying and 10% fighting. Mostly a puzzle dungeon adventure.

Would anything go wrong with this party set up? Any arcane caster which I can get my hands on info for, so anything from Wizards to Wu Jen to Warblades.

First level party.

1) What happened to the other 10%?
2) Party setup at low levels will be squishy, but after that they should be fine.

[Icewalker]

70% is a rough estimate.

7 with 1 noncaster would be 85%, 5 with 2 noncaster would be 60%. Its a midrange

Sounds good. Seeing as almost or possibly everything to be handed out will be homebrew magic items, I can pass them healing stuff and the like.

[Yeygresh]

I think gramlin is talking about "The first adventure is going to be probably 50% smartness puzzles (ie riddles, chess puzzle), 25% mechanics puzzles (ie how can we use our limited spells to do this crazy thing), maybe 5% roleplaying and 10% fighting."

50+25+5+10=90%

Back on topic, your party is going to be squishy at first(as said already), and overpower later in the game.

Other than that, it looks fine.

[OneWinged4ngel]

I'm making an adventure for pbp which will be 5-7 players, with the requirement that everybody in the party except 1 or 2 people be an arcane caster. The first adventure is going to be probably 50% smartness puzzles (ie riddles, chess puzzle), 25% mechanics puzzles (ie how can we use our limited spells to do this crazy thing), maybe 5% roleplaying and 10% fighting. Mostly a puzzle dungeon adventure.

Would anything go wrong with this party set up? Any arcane caster which I can get my hands on info for, so anything from Wizards to Wu Jen to Warblades.

First level party.

A party of *all* arcane casters seriously wouldn't have any trouble overcoming absolutely any obstacle a party of a Fighter, Rogue, Wizard, and Cleric would be able to take on. You have no cause for fear from the class choices. If the party fails, it's the party's fault, not the fault of your restriction.

Also, Warblades aren't casters in any form. At all. They don't even have anything remotely like arcane spells.

[Human Paragon 3]

Make sure your players are on board with this. Puzzles aren't everybody's cup'o tea.

[Guy_Whozevl]

If the party starts at level 1, tone down some of the combat encounters, especially if the party has lots of Wizards, Wu Jens, and Sorcerers (basically low HP type guys). Their sucky AC combined with the damage some CR 1 monsters (or less) can do (Orc, I'm lookin' at you) can decimate them. If there are a few Hexblades and Duskblades, don't worry so much about this. Puzzles and riddles can also backfire on you. What may seem simple to you can take hours for the smartest party member to solve; basically, expect some of the puzzles to go unsolved. Just don't make the consequences for failing to finish a puzzle too harsh.

[Icewalker]

Warblade isn't what I meant, I meant warmage. My mistake.

But yeah, I'm not worried about them being overpowered at higher levels, because I'm homebrewing...everything. Meaning the BBEGs will have crazy overpowered stuff themselves.


The good news with the puzzles is I have the perfect way to give just little amounts of hints.

[Quietus]

The good news with the puzzles is I have the perfect way to give just little amounts of hints.

I'll bite. What's your method?

[Icewalker]

No general use method, it is adventure specific...and....I can't tell you

I'm gonna host the game as a pbp, which I plan to do a lot, but I think chances are I'll have to be careful so as not to give anything away beforehand. It'll probably be a week or two before I've started it up.

[Kurald Galain]

Would anything go wrong with this party set up?

Possibly.

First, if multiple players have the same idea of what are good spells, it's possible that they end up with almost entirely identical characters.

Second, if several characters are wizards, they can immediately pool their spells by copying from one another.

I'd suggest everyone take a different class. You can e.g. have a beguiler + warmage + cleric + druid + spellthief.

[RTGoodman]

I'd suggest everyone take a different class. You can e.g. have a beguiler + warmage + cleric + druid + spellthief.

I was thinking more along the lines of Beguiler - Duskblade - Wizard - Cleric - Something Else (maybe Warlock or Bard).

[Kurald Galain]

I was thinking more along the lines of Beguiler - Duskblade - Wizard - Cleric - Something Else (maybe Warlock or Bard).

I was going to say bard as a sixth, but I'm afraid the beguiler pretty much entirely upstages him.

Duskblade is nice. Warlock is very cool to play, but also very much underpowered compared to other casters (this wouldn't be so bad in a regular party, but in an all-caster party, ouch; if you use one, I'd suggest houseruling the warlock to gain one invocation every level).

[The Mormegil]

It's ARCANE casters only. Thet means, basically, that if you want 7 different spell lists, you must have:
Beguiler, Warmage, Dread Necromancer, Bard, Duskblade, Wizard, Wu Jen.

I excluded classes without casting at level one, and picked up only those with best spellcasting variety and class features variety also.

With these, you have all that you want: necro, evo, illusion and enchantments are always good, get the wizard be an abjurer or transmuter, the bard be the party healer (UMD and spells) and the duskblade focus on tanking. The Wu Jen is almost useless since it hasn't got anything strong at all, but it's that or a sorcerer (which has the same spell list of the Wizard).
The Wizard will cover the rest (divination for instance).

[lord_khaine]

or you could also allow psionics, a psion could stand up in a party of casters without either overshadowing or being overshadowed by the rest.

[RTGoodman]

I was going to say bard as a sixth, but I'm afraid the beguiler pretty much entirely upstages him.

Duskblade is nice. Warlock is very cool to play, but also very much underpowered compared to other casters (this wouldn't be so bad in a regular party, but in an all-caster party, ouch; if you use one, I'd suggest houseruling the warlock to gain one invocation every level).

I threw in Bard because he can do some buffing and back-up healing, and act as the face of the party (in the even that no one else does) when necessary.

Warlock is a weaker than the other casters, but if the game is 75% puzzles, 5% role-playing, and 10% combat (plus another 10% in there somewhere), he could be useful. Probably not, but I like the idea of a Warlock telling the (1st level wizards), "Hey, I may not have access to all those different neat-o things, but I can do this *shoots eldritch blast and then some other invocation* all day long!" And, of course, the warlock can also UMD scrolls and wands that any other party member has, meaning he has ultimate versatility in that regard. Oh, and lets not forget that, at 1st level, 1d6 touch attack is not terrible, especially since you're mostly relying on Duskblade (and Cleric, maybe) for damage output.

[Kaelik]

A apelthief fits well into the party even if no other weak casters do. Because of the steal spell options, he can "borrow" spells from many people and because of the number of people, they won't feel it as much as in a normal party. Also, given the party, at higher levels they might need to be facing magical enemies.

[Quietus]

No general use method, it is adventure specific...and....I can't tell you

I'm gonna host the game as a pbp, which I plan to do a lot, but I think chances are I'll have to be careful so as not to give anything away beforehand. It'll probably be a week or two before I've started it up.

Shoot me a PM? I have enough on my hands with my own massive PbP, so I won't tell anyone, promise.

[Aquillion]

At first level it should be fine (combat might get a bit hard on a group of all-first-level casters, but you say it's not going to have much.)

At higher levels, though, presenting puzzles to spellcasters can be a bit tricky, since it's hard to make a puzzle that can't be subverted with various types of scrying and divination, teleportation, stone shape, telekinesis, invisibility, flight, Ethereal Jaunt, time stop, and so forth. ("I gate in something with higher int and ask it to solve the puzzle for me!")

Even just reaching fifth (character) level could be enough to break many puzzles... Invisibility Sphere, Flight, Shrink Item, Gaseous Form, Clairaudience/Clairvoyance, and Dispel Magic will make many of the puzzles that worked until then suddenly nonfunctional.

[Icewalker]

Only the first adventure will have the mostly puzzle layout, actually. After that it may get more standard, although I do plan to have less fighting than traditional adventures.

I'm not too worried about two people having the same spell list: you could have two wizards, one of whom focuses on blasting and one who is a batman and they'd be totally different.

[Kurald Galain]

I'm not too worried about two people having the same spell list: you could have two wizards,

If you'd have two wizards, they'd copy from one another until they did have the same spell list

[Tor the Fallen]

Possibly.

First, if multiple players have the same idea of what are good spells, it's possible that they end up with almost entirely identical characters.

Second, if several characters are wizards, they can immediately pool their spells by copying from one another.

I'd suggest everyone take a different class. You can e.g. have a beguiler + warmage + cleric + druid + spellthief.

Or, you know, let the players talk about it amongst themselves. That's always a good way to do it.

[Icewalker]

Yeah, I plan to let people choose, with some restrictions (everybody picks a wizard, I require some changes...) etc.

[Josh the Aspie]

What about the arcane caster variant of the Sword Saint?