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  1. - Top - End - #181
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    SamuraiGuy

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    Default Re: Age Of Sigmar II: I Can't Believe It's Not Magic!

    Quote Originally Posted by PraetorDragoon View Post
    I've seen rumours that the unit captains are low-key wizards like acolytes/pink horrors. Which could make them quite magic heavy.
    If that's the case, Twinstones seem almost an auto-include. Armies with a heavy Wizard presence usually end up somewhere between 50-150 points in Endless Spells, and one that boosts your important spellcasts is basically a gimme. You see it a lot with Tzeentch already.


    Speaking of Realmlords, their Warcry stats are in a White Dwarf and got leaked. Unit Rules here. Abilities here. Hopefully those links work. They seem solid - not as broken as some of the AoS warbands, but still good.
    Last edited by Requizen; 2020-05-12 at 11:47 AM.

  2. - Top - End - #182
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    Default Re: Age Of Sigmar II: I Can't Believe It's Not Magic!

    Quote Originally Posted by Requizen View Post
    If that's the case, Twinstones seem almost an auto-include. Armies with a heavy Wizard presence usually end up somewhere between 50-150 points in Endless Spells, and one that boosts your important spellcasts is basically a gimme. You see it a lot with Tzeentch already.


    Speaking of Realmlords, their Warcry stats are in a White Dwarf and got leaked. Unit Rules here. Abilities here. Hopefully those links work. They seem solid - not as broken as some of the AoS warbands, but still good.
    Hmm. Not fond of their long ranges, but they don't seem too brutal at first glance.
    Quote Originally Posted by Celestia View Post
    The British conquered the world in search of spices and then decided to use none of them.

  3. - Top - End - #183
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    Default Re: Age Of Sigmar II: I Can't Believe It's Not Magic!

    Quote Originally Posted by Requizen View Post
    Oh good, they updated the Twinstones. When they first posted it, it just had the first paragraph of rules so no one knew what it actually did lolol.
    Oh good, I was worried I had just missed it the first time around - I was actually going to post to see if I was the only one who didn't know what exactly this spell was supposed to do!

    Quote Originally Posted by Requizen View Post
    Yeah I might make one and link it here. I'm enjoying what I'm reading so far, and the fluff in it is actually quite interesting, more of a look into City-level stuff in AoS than we've seen before. And things like "What's up with Sylvaneth that don't just hang around with Alarielle in Ghyran?" and "How do outsiders react to the more rare Aelves like Khainites and Idoneth?". I'm digging it.
    I just got the pdf and am excited to get into it. Sounds like we're getting some good development of the Mortal Realms - the setting is growing on me, I admit.

    Quote Originally Posted by Requizen View Post
    Speaking of Realmlords, their Warcry stats are in a White Dwarf and got leaked. Unit Rules here. Abilities here. Hopefully those links work. They seem solid - not as broken as some of the AoS warbands, but still good.
    It's kind of funny seeing the chaos icons on all of the cards. Looks to me like the Stoneguard are probably carrying a lot of weight for the warband - their double (Mountain Stance) is cool because there's no minimum damage, so they could potentially take nothing, but if your opponent rolls four crits you'd probably still be out of luck. Lances of the Dawn also stands out to me as being pretty good. Not a lot of cheaper options unfortunately - two cavalry, three hammers, and a leader and a couple of sentinels and that might be it.

    Given that these are all new sculpts, does anyone else think that it's pretty likely we get a Lumineth Warcry starter box?
    Check out my miniature painting log! Trying to update weekly.

  4. - Top - End - #184
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    SamuraiGuy

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    Default Re: Age Of Sigmar II: I Can't Believe It's Not Magic!

    Quote Originally Posted by Don Qui Ho Tep View Post
    It's kind of funny seeing the chaos icons on all of the cards. Looks to me like the Stoneguard are probably carrying a lot of weight for the warband - their double (Mountain Stance) is cool because there's no minimum damage, so they could potentially take nothing, but if your opponent rolls four crits you'd probably still be out of luck. Lances of the Dawn also stands out to me as being pretty good. Not a lot of cheaper options unfortunately - two cavalry, three hammers, and a leader and a couple of sentinels and that might be it.

    Given that these are all new sculpts, does anyone else think that it's pretty likely we get a Lumineth Warcry starter box?
    Stoneguard are big, tough (with the double, at least), and hitty. But, they're Move 3, which is historically pretty bad to have. Granted, they're Move 3 in a faction that can get a good amount of Move 5 chumps alongside, which isn't anything to sniff at. All the choices seem pretty alright, and I'm a fan of the Cavalry in particular as good all-around troubleshooters.

    I doubt we get a Warcry specific box for them right off the bat, but maybe a Start Collecting with hey, many of the units usable in Warcry. But then also something big, so you're interested in AoS.

  5. - Top - End - #185
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    Default Re: Age Of Sigmar II: I Can't Believe It's Not Magic!

    A good point! Movement is key. Anything with movement of 3 is actually probably DOA. There are a few exceptions (like the Ogor Breacher that, combined with the quad* ability, is lethal), but the cavalry are probably the better choice for elite troops. It's actually one thing I am finding frustrating about the Splintered Fang - we played on Tabletop the other day and, except for my snake swarms (six inch move baby), I was getting outmaneuvered very easily. I like my warband a lot, it wins or ties more often than it loses, but only four out of 10 models have a movement greater than 4 and that has been the thing that has lost games, more often than not. I think I'd like to give Corvus Cabal another try, their mobility is a big strength.
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  6. - Top - End - #186
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    Default Re: Age Of Sigmar II: I Can't Believe It's Not Magic!

    I'm considering getting to AoS mostly to paint certain models but knowing I'll eventually end up with enough to put together an army and play. That said, I'd like to avoid painting another horde army. Can you get away with Seraphon or Sylvaneth armies of a low model count? How about skeletons/vampires (I assume not)?
    Quote Originally Posted by jedipotter View Post
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  7. - Top - End - #187
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    Default Re: Age Of Sigmar II: I Can't Believe It's Not Magic!

    Quote Originally Posted by Brookshw View Post
    I'm considering getting to AoS mostly to paint certain models but knowing I'll eventually end up with enough to put together an army and play. That said, I'd like to avoid painting another horde army. Can you get away with Seraphon or Sylvaneth armies of a low model count? How about skeletons/vampires (I assume not)?
    Seraphon is an extensive list and can be run from either Horde or Elite as you prefer. They even have support for a monster-only list, and you can't get more elite than that.

    Sylvaneth is more of a midstyle, not really horde but not that elite either. To properly play them you'll need their terrain though. You can play without, but a bunch of abilities key of them. Which is something to keep in mind if you want to just collect them for painting.

    Classic vampires & skeletons are a thematic horde army. Pure vampires centered around Blood Knights are elite, but you don't see them much. (Also, they're finecast and expensive).

    Skeleton-wise, there are also the Ossiarch Bonereapers, who are skeletal bone golems. They are an elite take on the skeleton army.
    Quote Originally Posted by Celestia View Post
    The British conquered the world in search of spices and then decided to use none of them.

  8. - Top - End - #188
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    Default Re: Age Of Sigmar II: I Can't Believe It's Not Magic!

    Quote Originally Posted by PraetorDragoon View Post
    Seraphon is an extensive list and can be run from either Horde or Elite as you prefer. They even have support for a monster-only list, and you can't get more elite than that.

    Sylvaneth is more of a midstyle, not really horde but not that elite either. To properly play them you'll need their terrain though. You can play without, but a bunch of abilities key of them. Which is something to keep in mind if you want to just collect them for painting.

    Classic vampires & skeletons are a thematic horde army. Pure vampires centered around Blood Knights are elite, but you don't see them much. (Also, they're finecast and expensive).

    Skeleton-wise, there are also the Ossiarch Bonereapers, who are skeletal bone golems. They are an elite take on the skeleton army.
    Agreed with Seraphon, I actually think Monster-heavy is quite good. I wouldn't go pure Monster, but Thunder Lizard subfaction makes your beasties super powerful.
    I think Sylvaneth wants at least one blob of Dryads. You can go pure Monsters with minimal Spite-Revenant battleline and some Kurnoths, but you'll struggle in a lot of missions imo.
    Both armies have access to Summoning, but neither relies on it.

    Pure Soulblight Vampires usually convert their Blood Knights out of other forces, but that army isn't super competitive. It's pretty fun, though.
    Bonereapers aren't elite at all. Best lists are running 60+ Mortek Guard, some pushing 100. You can build elite, but it's not particularly good, or at least not better than any other Death Elite build.

    Brookshw, if you want to play truly elite, as in the lowest model count available, the best ones right now are Ogors - mostly using Beastclaw, but even Gutbusters are pretty low model. Armies that have "viable" elite builds include Seraphon (monster mash), Khorne (Bloodthirster spam, though you'll want a summoning pool), Deepkin (Eels), Flesh Eaters (Monster Mash, will want summoning pool), and Stormcast (not hyper elite, but you can play as low as like 20 models and still be good).

    Many armies can build elite, but if you play anyone outside casuals you'll feel some suffering. But if that doesn't bother you, then you should mostly pick the ones that look cool. You can go pretty elite with Slaves to Darkness, for example, just spamming Mounted Heroes, Charios, and Knights.

    Edit: also worth noting that the Kharadron Overlords new Battletome has some elite capabilities, but didn't get a lot of time in the tourney scene before shut down. People theorize that with the buffs and point drop on boats, they're potentially quite good, and that Arkanaut spam is less reliable now with the changes to special weapons. A relatively elite force is likely fairly viable for them, though we'll find out more soon.
    Last edited by Requizen; 2020-05-20 at 10:24 AM.

  9. - Top - End - #189
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    Default Re: Age Of Sigmar II: I Can't Believe It's Not Magic!

    Quote Originally Posted by Requizen View Post
    snip
    Thanks Requizen and PraetorDragoon, all useful feedback. Ultimately I've narrowed the options to those with models I appreciated the aesthetics of, I don't expect to ever try for anything particularly competitive - likely just a few PUGs at the local shop, if even that.

    How do armies work in AoS? Similar to 40k, can I put some Sylvaneth & Seraphon together as they're both Order, or is it more regimented and you can only field one at a time? Realistically I'm just wondering if I can cherry pick the models I like and have a chance of putting them on the table without having to buy any, or at least minimal, filler.
    Last edited by Brookshw; 2020-05-20 at 10:35 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by jedipotter View Post
    Logic just does not fit in with the real world. And only the guilty throw fallacy's around.
    Quote Originally Posted by Vendin, probably
    As always, the planes prove to be awesomer than I expected.
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  10. - Top - End - #190
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    Default Re: Age Of Sigmar II: I Can't Believe It's Not Magic!

    Quote Originally Posted by Brookshw View Post
    Thanks Requizen and PraetorDragoon, all useful feedback. Ultimately I've narrowed the options to those with models I appreciated the aesthetics of, I don't expect to ever try for anything particularly competitive - likely just a few PUGs at the local shop, if even that.

    How do armies work in AoS? Similar to 40k, can I put some Sylvaneth & Seraphon together as they're both Order, or is it more regimented and you can only field one at a time? Realistically I'm just wondering if I can cherry pick the models I like and have a chance of putting them on the table without having to buy any, or at least minimal, filler.
    It's a bit more streamlined than 40k. There's no detachments, but everything is based on Keywords. If everyone has the same Keyword, and that Keyword has Allegiance rules, you get the benefits of that Allegiance. For instance, you can take some Seraphon and some Sylvaneth, who all have the Order keyword, and be an Order Allegiance Army (rules found in the Core Book). However, if all your models are Seraphon, you get Seraphon Allegiance abilities, which are more specific to the army and much, much stronger.

    For army building purposes, you just need to meet minimum Hero and Battleline restrictions, and can't go over the maximum Hero, Behemoth, or War Machine allotments. At 2000, that's 1 Hero and 3 Battleline minimum, and 6 Heroes, 4 Behemoths, and/or 4 War Machines maximum. Any unit that doesn't have those types, you can take as many or as few as you want.

    Armies have a specific Ally list, which you can find in their Battletome or in The General's Handbook. Up to 20% of your points AND up to 1/4 of the units (which can be tricky for Elite armies) can be Allied off of that list. Allied models don't count towards your minimum requirements, but do count towards your maximum allotment.

    Seraphon and Sylvaneth are Allies and both Order, so you could pick whatever you want and go Order, or you can pick one to be your main Allegiance and take a handful of Allies from the other Faction, as long as you don't take more than 400 points (in a 2k list) of them.

  11. - Top - End - #191
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    Default Re: Age Of Sigmar II: I Can't Believe It's Not Magic!

    Quote Originally Posted by Brookshw View Post
    Thanks Requizen and PraetorDragoon, all useful feedback. Ultimately I've narrowed the options to those with models I appreciated the aesthetics of, I don't expect to ever try for anything particularly competitive - likely just a few PUGs at the local shop, if even that.

    How do armies work in AoS? Similar to 40k, can I put some Sylvaneth & Seraphon together as they're both Order, or is it more regimented and you can only field one at a time? Realistically I'm just wondering if I can cherry pick the models I like and have a chance of putting them on the table without having to buy any, or at least minimal, filler.
    When you build your army, you pick your Alegiance, this is based on the keywords on the bottom of a warscroll. You can either be to your Grand Alliance (ORDER, CHAOS, DESTRUCTION, or DEATH) or the faction alegiance. To do so, every unit in your army must share that keyword. So with Seraphon and Sylvaneth together you can claim ORDER, as they are both ORDER. But you cannot be SYLVANETH or SERAPHON, as not everyone has this keyword.

    Army construction is based on Leader, Battleline, Behemoth and Artilery. Depending on your points level you have a required amount of Battlelines (think troops) and a limit on Leaders, Behemoths and Artilery.

    Alegiances hand out some bonuses and make some units Battleline. For example, Dryads are always battleline, but in a SYLVANETH army you can also use Tree-Revenants and Spite-Revenants as Battleline.
    Quote Originally Posted by Celestia View Post
    The British conquered the world in search of spices and then decided to use none of them.

  12. - Top - End - #192
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    Default Re: Age Of Sigmar II: I Can't Believe It's Not Magic!

    Got it, thank you both once again.

    Btw, Requizen,, congratulations on the forthcoming child. If you think your free time is about to take a hit just wait for the sticker shock.
    Quote Originally Posted by jedipotter View Post
    Logic just does not fit in with the real world. And only the guilty throw fallacy's around.
    Quote Originally Posted by Vendin, probably
    As always, the planes prove to be awesomer than I expected.
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  13. - Top - End - #193
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    Default Re: Age Of Sigmar II: I Can't Believe It's Not Magic!

    Quote Originally Posted by Brookshw View Post
    Got it, thank you both once again.

    Btw, Requizen,, congratulations on the forthcoming child. If you think your free time is about to take a hit just wait for the sticker shock.
    Thanks! Yeah I have a feeling hobby will take a back seat in basically every conceivable respect haha

  14. - Top - End - #194
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    Default Re: Age Of Sigmar II: I Can't Believe It's Not Magic!

    Out of curiosity, why are Dark Elves Armies of Order? There any fluff reason for their apparent switching of sides? I seem to recall them being closer to Chaos.
    Quote Originally Posted by jedipotter View Post
    Logic just does not fit in with the real world. And only the guilty throw fallacy's around.
    Quote Originally Posted by Vendin, probably
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  15. - Top - End - #195
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    Default Re: Age Of Sigmar II: I Can't Believe It's Not Magic!

    Short way: they're not your old dark elves.

    Long way: Order Serpentis and Darkling Covens are survivors/descendents of the elven kingdoms that existed in Ulgu, at least until chaos came and kicked them out. As far as I know, there's no direct line of descent from the druchii of old.

    Really, the only uniting factors of Order are: Build civilizations, hate Chaos, and aren't dead.

  16. - Top - End - #196
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    Default Re: Age Of Sigmar II: I Can't Believe It's Not Magic!

    Quote Originally Posted by RagingBluMunky View Post
    Really, the only uniting factors of Order are: Build civilizations, hate Chaos, and aren't dead.
    Yeah that's basically it. "Order" doesn't mean good guys, so much as it means that you're trying to defend creation from falling apart, and when you wage war it's for reasons more logical than the Orruks. It's not a perfect label, but having four Grand Alliances looks much nicer than a bunch of random factions with no connections.

    In the context of Cities, they fit because power-wise they're much closer to Humans or Duardin than they are to Stormcast or Daemons. All the mook-level mortals have to band together to survive in the Realms, otherwise they get wiped out by every passing army.

  17. - Top - End - #197
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    Default Re: Age Of Sigmar II: I Can't Believe It's Not Magic!

    In terms of elves at least, the Daughters of Khaine rulebook tells the story of how several of the New Elven gods and one half-daemon found the resting location of Slannesh after she had feasted on nearly the entire population of the old world's elves, thanks to Tzeentch playing back stabber. Using powerful magic, they trapped her and started extracting the souls, using them to forge new elves with no connection to the old world. Since these new elves are not part of Chaos, and are far more organized then any of the destruction races, they get placed under Order. They have a tenuous peace with each other but will quickly backstab each other should it mean their own kingdoms get more power or advantage. So no, Elves are not Good, Order is not Good, it just means they have goals and plans bigger then simply breaking or killing everything.

  18. - Top - End - #198
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    Default Re: Age Of Sigmar II: I Can't Believe It's Not Magic!

    Related to the ‘Order is not good’ thing, Nagash was originally part of the pantheon or Order, and has similar goals, the only reason Death is a seperate thing is because he wants to be at the top!
    Evil round every corner, careful not to step in any.

  19. - Top - End - #199
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    Default Re: Age Of Sigmar II: I Can't Believe It's Not Magic!

    Quote Originally Posted by Saambell View Post
    Order is not Good, it just means they have goals and plans bigger then simply breaking or killing everything.
    Death: Kill everything.
    Destruction: Break everything.
    Chaos: Kill everything, break everything.
    Order: No, thank you.

    The Darkling Covens and Order Serpentis are the perfect examples of 'The enemy of my enemy is also my enemy, just not right now.'
    Lawful Evil is a fun alignment like that.
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  20. - Top - End - #200
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cheesegear View Post
    Death: Kill everything.
    Destruction: Break everything.
    Chaos: Kill everything, break everything.
    Order: No, thank you.

    The Darkling Covens and Order Serpentis are the perfect examples of 'The enemy of my enemy is also my enemy, just not right now.'
    Lawful Evil is a fun alignment like that.
    Death is more "Free will causes Chaos, end free will" you either die and become bound to the will of Nagash, or go crazy and become bound to a Lunitic flesh eating king you'll slavishly follow.
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    Default Re: Age Of Sigmar II: I Can't Believe It's Not Magic!

    https://www.warhammer-community.com/...-do-they-play/

    Finally some more teasers for the pointy boiz.

    They seem a bit overdesigned - everyone is a wizard, also every unit has individual resources, also every unit has some brand new game-warping ability, also there's extra stuff that happens at setup, also they break the combat phase.

    That said, I think it depends heavily on the unit stats. Insanely strong abilities make sense if the individual units are relatively middling or even weak, and line(wo)men Aelves have always proven to be a bit on the chumpy side, even DoK units are pretty meh without their stacking buffs and passive abilities.


    I told myself I wasn't going to get roped into a new army, but... well, one army box isn't a committal, right? It's just a Warcry warband plus the fancy armor dude. And if I pick up some Alarith units and Vanari Sentinels to round out the warband, that's not really an army, right?

    ...right?

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    Default Re: Age Of Sigmar II: I Can't Believe It's Not Magic!

    Quote Originally Posted by Requizen View Post
    https://www.warhammer-community.com/...-do-they-play/

    Finally some more teasers for the pointy boiz.

    They seem a bit overdesigned - everyone is a wizard, also every unit has individual resources, also every unit has some brand new game-warping ability, also there's extra stuff that happens at setup, also they break the combat phase.

    That said, I think it depends heavily on the unit stats. Insanely strong abilities make sense if the individual units are relatively middling or even weak, and line(wo)men Aelves have always proven to be a bit on the chumpy side, even DoK units are pretty meh without their stacking buffs and passive abilities.


    I told myself I wasn't going to get roped into a new army, but... well, one army box isn't a committal, right? It's just a Warcry warband plus the fancy armor dude. And if I pick up some Alarith units and Vanari Sentinels to round out the warband, that's not really an army, right?

    ...right?
    Yeah, totally not an army. Totally.

    Stats will be interesting to see. Lots of power in their rules so far.
    Quote Originally Posted by Celestia View Post
    The British conquered the world in search of spices and then decided to use none of them.

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    Default Re: Age Of Sigmar II: I Can't Believe It's Not Magic!

    I'm getting fed up with Power Armor so am idly dreaming about possible next steps. One thing I want to do is something that feels like classic wood elves, with nimble little aelves running around under the feet of huge stonking trees. Living City is probably the best way of doing that, but does mean I can't use the lovely Namarti models. Alliance of Wood and Sea isn't bad but it's like 1500pts just for the basic requirements and I'm not really interested in the sharks or eels. So! Sylvaneth with Allies.

    At the moment, what I'm thinking of is this (using the leaked points):

    Allegiance: Sylvaneth

    Leaders
    Arch-Revenant (100)
    Branchwych (80)
    Spirit of Durthu (300)
    Treelord Ancient (260)

    Battleline
    10 x Dryads (100)
    10 x Dryads (100)
    10 x Dryads (100)

    Units
    3 x Kurnoth Hunters (190)
    - Scythes
    3 x Kurnoth Hunters (190)
    - Scythes
    3 x Kurnoth Hunters (190)
    - Greatbows
    10 x Namarti Reavers (120)
    - Allies
    10 x Namarti Thralls (120)
    - Allies

    Battalions
    Forest Folk OR Free Spirits (140)

    Total: 1990 / 2000
    Extra Command Points: 1
    Allies: 240 / 400
    Wounds: 129

    Forest Folk lets the Dryads retreat and charge, Free Spirits lets the Kurnoth Hunters and Durthu auto-run 6". I'm thinking mostly of the latter to be able to put some scary blocks of wood right up in the enemy's face, backed up by the Arch-Revenant and also allowing me to swap one block of Dryads for some kind of -Revenant, which will earn me points for an Endless Spell. I've not decided on spells, artefacts etc yet, but there's an area-of-effect healing thing that it might be fun to put on the Arch-Revenant to boost the Kurnoth Hunters up. If Durthu's running 6" in the expectation of a turn-2 charge, he really needs to get healed enough to be on his top row for the flat 6 Damage.

    I wish there were points for some of the lovely old Wanderer Cavalry, the Wild Riders or Sisters of the Thorn, or even just more Reavers. I could lose the Battalion for them, maybe.
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  24. - Top - End - #204
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    Default Re: Age Of Sigmar II: I Can't Believe It's Not Magic!

    Quote Originally Posted by LeSwordfish View Post
    I'm getting fed up with Power Armor so am idly dreaming about possible next steps. One thing I want to do is something that feels like classic wood elves, with nimble little aelves running around under the feet of huge stonking trees. Living City is probably the best way of doing that, but does mean I can't use the lovely Namarti models. Alliance of Wood and Sea isn't bad but it's like 1500pts just for the basic requirements and I'm not really interested in the sharks or eels. So! Sylvaneth with Allies.

    At the moment, what I'm thinking of is this (using the leaked points):

    Allegiance: Sylvaneth

    Leaders
    Arch-Revenant (100)
    Branchwych (80)
    Spirit of Durthu (300)
    Treelord Ancient (260)

    Battleline
    10 x Dryads (100)
    10 x Dryads (100)
    10 x Dryads (100)

    Units
    3 x Kurnoth Hunters (190)
    - Scythes
    3 x Kurnoth Hunters (190)
    - Scythes
    3 x Kurnoth Hunters (190)
    - Greatbows
    10 x Namarti Reavers (120)
    - Allies
    10 x Namarti Thralls (120)
    - Allies

    Battalions
    Forest Folk OR Free Spirits (140)

    Total: 1990 / 2000
    Extra Command Points: 1
    Allies: 240 / 400
    Wounds: 129

    Forest Folk lets the Dryads retreat and charge, Free Spirits lets the Kurnoth Hunters and Durthu auto-run 6". I'm thinking mostly of the latter to be able to put some scary blocks of wood right up in the enemy's face, backed up by the Arch-Revenant and also allowing me to swap one block of Dryads for some kind of -Revenant, which will earn me points for an Endless Spell. I've not decided on spells, artefacts etc yet, but there's an area-of-effect healing thing that it might be fun to put on the Arch-Revenant to boost the Kurnoth Hunters up. If Durthu's running 6" in the expectation of a turn-2 charge, he really needs to get healed enough to be on his top row for the flat 6 Damage.

    I wish there were points for some of the lovely old Wanderer Cavalry, the Wild Riders or Sisters of the Thorn, or even just more Reavers. I could lose the Battalion for them, maybe.
    I like Free Spirits a bit more for the build. It looks solid, though I think it might be a bit stronger with just bigger Dryad units rather than the Namarti.

    Were you thinking one of the Glades or just generic Sylvaneth?

  25. - Top - End - #205
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    LeSwordfish's Avatar

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    Default Re: Age Of Sigmar II: I Can't Believe It's Not Magic!

    Quote Originally Posted by Requizen View Post
    I like Free Spirits a bit more for the build. It looks solid, though I think it might be a bit stronger with just bigger Dryad units rather than the Namarti.

    Were you thinking one of the Glades or just generic Sylvaneth?
    The Winterbite glade looks too good to miss, really (only need to get a few exploding sixes on Damage 6 attacks to change the game). Either Oakenbrow or Harvestboon would keep Durthu trucking a little longer, and I could also use Harvestboon to buff the Kurnouths.

    For a more competitive context, the Namarti can definitely go: probably boost two units of dryads to 10 and swap the other for some Tree Revenants to teleport around for board control.

    The other thing I'm thinking about is lizards. It's surprisingly tricky to write a good lizard list, everything seems to cost about half as much again as you expect:

    Slann Starmaster (260)
    Saurus Scar-Veteran on Carnosaur (210)
    Skink Starpriest (120)

    10 x Saurus Knights (200)
    10 x Saurus Knights (200)
    5 x Saurus Knights (100)
    20 x Saurus Warriors (180)
    20 x Saurus Warriors (180)
    20 x Skinks (120)
    Bastiladon (220)
    Firelance Temple-host (160)
    1950pts

    The knights get +3" to run and charge when near the Carnosaur, and if I run them as Koatl's Claw they get +1 to hit on the charge and a total of seven attacks (two sets of jaws). Someone suggested losing the second block of Sauruses for another monster, which I like in theory (second bastiladon? Troglodon?) but in practice would mean no spare points for Endless Spells, and while I don't know precisely which ones i'd take, the Slann seems perhaps a little underwhelming without them, forced to use one of his spellcasts a turn on Arcane Bolt or similar. Could lose ten skinks for one I guess.
    - Avatar by LCP -

  26. - Top - End - #206
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    SamuraiGuy

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    Default Re: Age Of Sigmar II: I Can't Believe It's Not Magic!

    Quote Originally Posted by LeSwordfish View Post
    The Winterbite glade looks too good to miss, really (only need to get a few exploding sixes on Damage 6 attacks to change the game). Either Oakenbrow or Harvestboon would keep Durthu trucking a little longer, and I could also use Harvestboon to buff the Kurnouths.

    For a more competitive context, the Namarti can definitely go: probably boost two units of dryads to 10 and swap the other for some Tree Revenants to teleport around for board control.

    The other thing I'm thinking about is lizards. It's surprisingly tricky to write a good lizard list, everything seems to cost about half as much again as you expect:

    Slann Starmaster (260)
    Saurus Scar-Veteran on Carnosaur (210)
    Skink Starpriest (120)

    10 x Saurus Knights (200)
    10 x Saurus Knights (200)
    5 x Saurus Knights (100)
    20 x Saurus Warriors (180)
    20 x Saurus Warriors (180)
    20 x Skinks (120)
    Bastiladon (220)
    Firelance Temple-host (160)
    1950pts

    The knights get +3" to run and charge when near the Carnosaur, and if I run them as Koatl's Claw they get +1 to hit on the charge and a total of seven attacks (two sets of jaws). Someone suggested losing the second block of Sauruses for another monster, which I like in theory (second bastiladon? Troglodon?) but in practice would mean no spare points for Endless Spells, and while I don't know precisely which ones i'd take, the Slann seems perhaps a little underwhelming without them, forced to use one of his spellcasts a turn on Arcane Bolt or similar. Could lose ten skinks for one I guess.
    For Seraphon, Saurus and Carnos are probably the least effective units, sadly. Most competitive lists focus on Skink trickery, big monsters with support, artillery beasts, and magic. While Saurus aren't bad anymore (indeed some of the subfactions make them quite good), they still want to just run up and get stuck in combat, which is much less effective than the other options.

    That said, as a FLGS army for fun, I love this style of list. Fast, with some variance, and I really like that Battalion.

  27. - Top - End - #207
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    SamuraiGuy

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    Default Re: Age Of Sigmar II: I Can't Believe It's Not Magic!

    GHB 2020 has been out for a few days, so I thought I'd compile my thoughts on it.

    Not (technically) Matched Play

    Spoiler: Skybattles
    Show
    The new gimmicky Open Play thing.

    Do you like XWing or Aeronautica Imperialis? Well... this isn't that, though it's trying to be. But hey, unlike those games you can be a Stardrake, Terrorgheist, or Bloodthirster! So that's fun. If you have a friend or two, you all have big flying things, and an hour or two to kill, try it out.

    It's a neat little diversion. Like most of these GHB one-off inclusions, I expect to play it like once or twice and then never again. Like I said, if you really want to play this type of game full time, there's other options out there.


    Spoiler: Team Battles
    Show
    GHB2020 includes some new Open Play and Narrative Play rules for team battles. Narrative has some rules for team games with a GM and campaigns, which I'm sure people will try out.

    But who cares about that, now there's official Matched Play Coalition of Death rules! Basically both players on a team build a legal Vanguard 1000 point list, and play together as a cohesive team - just like every doubles event in history has run. However, there are some restrictions:
    -You can't use a Grand Alliance as your Faction. Sorry.
    -Players on a team have to have different Factions, so no double Stormcast or double Flesh Eaters.
    -Unique models are Unique across the team, so no double Kroak or Arkhan.

    Not only that, but various factions have different Ally levels. They posted the alliance levels here, but here's what they do:
    -No Coalition: Can't play together. Find new friends
    -Battle Forged: No downsides
    -Fractious: Neither player gets a Command Point on Turn 1
    -Desperate: Same as Fractious, plus you treat your ally like enemies for normal movement purposes

    As before, there's also a few things to note about the Coalition.
    -You pick one person to be the Warlord, and if there's any final decision or opposed team dice roll, they're in charge.
    -Both players pick only one Auxiliary Mission, and can't both pick the same.
    -When you do simultaneous actions, both players do it - which means in the combat phase, you both pick a unit to fight before the enemy does. This gives the charge and combat phase a bit extra depth, as you always want to outnumber your opponents, or potentially engage only one opponent at a time to overwhelm that army. Be tricky!

    Otherwise, you use the same Pitched Battle Missions that regular Matched plays, which is great because the Open/Narrative Coalition battleplans that people used to use at events are trash.


    Spoiler: The Anvil of Apotheosis
    Show
    This year's GHB includes a tool for Custom Hero creation. It has a point-buy system, so you pick a race and start with a basic stat wheel (wounds, save, move, bravery) and the Keywords appropriate, with some options for different Factions, for instance Grots can pick Spiderfang or Moonclan, and Ogors can pick Beastclaw or Gutbusters.

    Pick a Archetype:
    -Commanders (no Deathmage or Masterclan) get to pick either a +1 hit or +1 save Command Ability for a nearby friendly unit
    -Priests (no Daemon, Deathmage, Saurus, or non-Pestilens Skaven) get to pick either a d3 damage prayer, or a 6+ shrug prayer that they can put on a friendly unit
    -Wizards (level 1 only, no Duardin, Daemon, or Khorne) get one of 4 spells. 6+ Shrug to an ally spell, d3 damage and -1 save to an enemy spell, Horde clearing "roll a 5+ per model in the unit" spell, or return d3 wounds worth of models to a friendly unit spell. Worth noting that these are actually pretty insane compared to many generic Wizard's spells, making this likely the most common Archetype for many armies.

    Then, you point buy weapons (ranging from free 3/4+/4+/-/1 improvised weapons to purchased 3/3+/3+/-1/2 weapons). You can also pick a shield, which is a straight improvement to save by 1 (not a +1 modifier, importantly).
    The Bow is pretty good, though it's only 18" range. Otherwise, all the weapons are pretty similar, especially as you can boost them later.

    Choose whether or not to point buy a companion, regular Mount, or Monster Mount. These all come with baseline weapons, which are about what you would expect from each of their respective archetypes. They also give extra wounds and movement, naturally. You can boost them in the next step. The Monster is pretty darn expensive (taking up around 1/3 of the max points available), but even without boosting your mount, it's pretty good.

    Finally, point buy upgrades for your companion/mount, and then point buy upgrades for your Hero themselves. These range from improving Rend, Damage, Hit rolls, Wound rolls, or number of Attacks on a weapon, to Fly, to improved Saves, to more important ones:
    -Archmage gives you +1 to Cast and Unbind. Amazing, though expensive.
    -Archpriest makes your prayers go off on 2+ instead of 3+. Also very good, especially if your Faction has Prayers available.
    -Zealot lets your Run and Charge. Excellent for beatsticks.
    -Ethereal is expensive, but available. Yes, you can make a 3+ Ethereal character baseline. But you won't have much points left over for other stuff.
    -Inspiring lets nearby allies use the Hero's Bravery, and Battle Standard Bearer increases the range. Excellent for support on chump armies.
    -Consummate Commander is the most expensive, but it gives you a free CP at start of game. Potentially busted for some armies.
    -Ward gives you a 6+ shrug. Not insane, but it's something.

    You can potentially make some pretty nutty Heroes, and use the options available to shore up weaknesses in your army. Is it Matched Legal? Well, sorta? It shows you how to calculate your point buy points into Pitched Battle points (hint, just multiply by 10, it's likely what GW uses for their own base design), but it's not "legal" baseline. Talk to your opponent and TO. I don't think anything here is broken, but I can see why people wouldn't be keen on allowing them without consideration.


    Matched Play

    Spoiler: Pitched Battle changes
    Show
    Some new things with GHB2020:
    -You can't stack shrug saves, which wasn't available to a lot of armies, but happened enough that it was a problem. Take that, Skaven Monsters.
    -You're now limited on how many Endless Spells you can take (2, 3, or 4 depending on game size). This won't affect most armies, but there were some wacky lists that were abusing them.
    -Now, instead of using Kill Points as tiebreakers, you use Auxiliary Objectives, found below.
    -Faction Terrain can now be legally set up, as the restrictions were reduced to 3" from other terrain and 1" from objectives.
    -Triumphs are back to 3 options instead of the 6 from GHB2019. People forget them every game anyways
    -For scenery tables, now you use one table for all pieces of terrain instead of rolling for each one... which everyone was doing anyway. Terrain features are unchanged otherwise.


    Spoiler: Auxiliary Objectives
    Show
    Pick 2 at the start of the battle after set up, reveal them at the same time as your opponent. Whoever scores the most at the end of the game, wins tiebreaker. If both scored the same, it's a draw. Much better than Kill Points.
    -Aggressor: Hold all the Objectives in your opponent's Zone. Super easy in some missions for some armies.
    -Assassinate: Opponent picks one of their Heroes, kill it. As you pick after Set Up, this is potentially easy if they deploy all their Heroes forward, or don't pick it if they have some hiding that you don't think you'll reach. Basically never pick against Nagash unless you have some ranged pain to bring.
    -The Bait: Pick one of your units, get it killed. Tricky, as you can pick something that the opponent wants to kill, and they might shy away from killing it to prevent tiebreakers... depending on mission. Think hard about this one.
    -Cornered: Have 2+ friendly units in combat with the same Enemy Hero at the same time. Are you fast killy army? This is likely free. Are you shooty? Ignore.
    -Defender: No enemy units in your territory at the end of battle. Some Battleplans have very small deployment zones, far away from Objectives, like Shifting Objectives. Other missions, it's basically impossible.
    -Domination: Kill 3+ enemy units in one turn. Good against MSU if you're very killy, but this one seems more difficult than others.
    -Grudge: Pick a friendly and enemy Hero, yours has to kill theirs. Great if you have a big killy Monster Hero vs support Heroes.
    -Headhunter: Kill all enemy Heroes. Very matchup dependent.
    -Invader: Have more units in your opponent's Territory than they have in yours at the end. This is... interesting.
    -Marked for Death: Pick one enemy unit, kill it by the end. Interesting, in that you can force your opponent to play back with a unit they want to be aggressive with. Or maybe they just don't care about Aux Objectives.
    -Mass Panic: 2 enemy units fail Battleshock in the same turn. Some armies never take Battleshocks (OBR, CP spamming Cities, Bv10 stuff), but if you have a lot of -Bravery stuff, this might suit you. Still, usually only one unit at a time will be hit hard, so this seems a bit worse than others.
    -Overwhelm: A Battleline unit kills an enemy Hero. Again, matchup dependent, but some armies will take this 90% of the time, others 0%.
    -Pillage: Pick an enemy objective, score if a friendly unit with a 5+ wounds characteristic ends a turn within 3" of it. Mostly Heroes, but Monsters too. So easy for big fast Monsters, though your opponent can try to zone you out of it. You also can't just teleport to it.
    -Prey on the Weak: Kill all enemy Battlelines. Great if you're facing min Battleline choices (Stormcast are often like this, sometimes Sylvaneth and Idoneth as well, for example), awful against some armies.
    -Prized Possession: Pick a friendly Hero with an Artifact, score if they survive to the end. If that Artifact makes you tough and tanky, great. If it's on a 5 wound Hero and gives you extra CP... don't do it.
    -Seize Ground: Pick an enemy Objective, be within 3" of it after the 4th battle round. Seemingly easy, as it can be any unit and you can teleport to it, but very specific timing means they can zone you out when it counts. And as it's Battle Round, if you go first on 4, they can spend resources to kill you off.
    -Territorial: Hold the same objective 2 turns in a row. Is this free on Knife to the Heart and Total Commitment? Probably.
    -Vengeful Counter: Kill an enemy unit in the same turn that they kill one of yours. Do you want to brawl in the middle of the table, and aren't focused on attrition? Likely a good one for you.

    I like these over kill points, as it lets you plan for tiebreakers, especially if your army isn't focused on tabling the opponent. Often your army will pick the same 2 in most games, but keep the mission and enemy army in mind.


    Spoiler: Missions
    Show
    Most Missions are functionally unchanged compared to their GHB2019 counterparts, other than deployment zone changes and tiebreaker switching to Aux Objectives across the board. There are a couple differences, though, as well as some new missions:

    -Knife to the Heart: Deployment changes
    -Total Conquest: Deployment changes, slight Objective shift, you now get an extra point if a Leader is helping to hold one of your objectives
    -Duality of Death: Gone. And nothing of value was lost.
    -Battle for the Pass: Deployment changes, which is good because the 2019 version sucked
    -Starstrike: Reduced the number of landing zones back to the original 3 per objective.
    -Scorched Earth: Deployment rotated. Cannot raze enemy objectives while an Enemy Leader is near it. Get an extra Point if you Raze an objective with a friendly Leader nearby.
    -Total Commitment: Unchanged. Still completely screws any army that uses reserves.
    -Focal Points: Gain an extra Point if a friendly Monster helps hold an objective. Does this count for every monster holding an Objective?
    -Better Part of Valor: Deployment rotated. Scoring is the same, except only Battleline units can hold Objectives. If you're running the minimum number of Battleline, you have some choices to make. If you're one of those armies where every unit option is Battleline, you're in luck.
    -Shifting Objectives: Deployment zone shrunk. Get extra Points if Battleline hold Objectives.
    -Places of Arcane Power: Deployment zone change. Now uses the Leader pitched battle role instead of the Hero keyword for Objectives, which I think changes... nothing? Are there any Heroes that aren't Leaders?
    -Relocation Orb: Gone. Thank ****ing goodness.

    And two new missions:
    -The Blade's Edge: Six objectives close to the center of the board. Every turn after the first, the player going second removes one. Obviously designed to give more agency vs double turns, which means it'll be a very random mission, rarely ever the same. There'll be plenty of meatgrinder games given how close the 6 markers are, but armies with more range and trickery will play with finesse, ceding the double turn and forcing their opponents into bad positions. I like it.
    -Forcing the Hand: L shaped deployment zones with 3 objectives per side. In the enemy's turn, you pick which of your objective is the Primary. That objective is worth 3 to them, the rest are worth 1. This is super interesting because the Primary Objective is a big swing, but with five other 1-point objectives available, you can decide whether it's worth the risk or not. Again, a lot of objectives shoved into the middle, so there'll be plenty of meatgrinder games, but another one where risk assessment and board control will be the important things to consider. Another good addition.


    Three Missions with extra Leader scoring. Two with extra Battleline scoring. One with extra Monster scoring. Plan accordingly. Otherwise I think this year has a fairly reasonable Mission pool.


    Spoiler: Realms
    Show
    Realms are extremely streamlined in GHB2020. No more Realmscape table, no more massive Artifact or Spell lists. When you play in a Realm, you get the one Spell, the Feature (now just adds an extra Feature to all terrain), and the Command Ability. There's exactly one Artifact for each Realm as well, and none are as silly as Ignax Scales or Aetherquartz Brooch.

    Aqshy
    Spell: Fireball. 5+ cast, deals MWs. Better than Arcane Blast.
    Artifact: Incandescent Rageblade gives you exploding 6s to a single weapon. Potentially worth on Heroes with multiple attack dice.
    Feature:All terrain is Volcanic
    Command Ability: Give a unit +1 to Run and Charge. Nice.

    Chamon
    Spell: Metamorphic Warding, 7+, give a unit +1 to save. Excellent spell.
    Artifact: Plate of Perfect Protection reduces all Rend-1 to Rend- against the Hero. Very nice.
    Feature: All terrain is Entangling
    Command Ability: Give a unit +1 to hit in the Combat Phase. Nice.

    Ghur
    Spell: Wildform, 5+, +2 to Run and Charge. Just as good as ever.
    Artifact: Predator's Torc lets you reroll charges. It's... fine.
    Feature: All terrain is Deadly
    Command Ability: Make a friendly Monster treat it's damage table as if it had taken 0 Wounds. Potentially really good, potentially useless.

    Ghyran
    Spell: Shield of Thorns, 5+, unit causes d3 mortals when charged. Same as before.
    Artifact: Everspring Diadem restores one wound to the Hero per turn. Not great by itself, but if you can stack it with other abilities that do similar, like Living City, it becomes pretty cool.
    Feature: All terrain is Healing
    Command Ability: Spend a CP to cast Shield of Thorns from any Hero. Meh.

    Hysh
    Spell: Purity of Defence, 5+, reroll save rolls of 1 for a unit. Easier to cast than Mystic Shield, and can be cast together. Potentially good, if your army has good saves.
    Artifact: Syari Trueblade lets the Hero reroll hits in melee. Cool.
    Feature: All Terrain is Mystical, which is quite impactful (though better now that you can't stack shrug saves)
    Command Ability: Spend a CP to let a unit ignore Cover. That's... fine? It's not bad, but you're not going to be saving points for it.

    Shyish
    Spell: Ripples of the Necroquake, 7+, add 1 to casting rolls for casting Endless Spells for all friendly Wizards. With the limit to Endless Spells, it's not amazing, but it can be useful if you really need a specific one.
    Artifact: Gravesand Brooch lets the Hero reroll saves of 1. For a 3+ Hero, that's pretty good. Nice for baseline Ethereal Heroes, too.
    Feature: All terrain is Nullification. Careful if you're playing with Endless Spells.
    Command Ability: Spend a CP to give a unit a 6+ shrug. Nice.

    Ulgu
    Spell: Judgement of Shadow, 7+, roll a dice for each model in a unit and MW for each one under their armor save. Excellent if your army lacks horde clearing.
    Artifact: Trickster's Foil lets the Hero reroll Wound rolls. Cool.
    Feature: All terrain is Overgrown. This is way better than the old Ulgu Features that reduced shooting to 6", but still potentially crippling for shooting armies.
    Command Ability: Spend a CP to teleport a friendly unit 18" from the Hero, to 6" from the Hero and 9" away from enemies. Good for reinforcements, but can also jump a unit out of combat or onto an objective. A big downgrade from the old one, but still extremely useful for one point.

    Overall good changes. Less to remember, easier to parse, and nothing that breaks the game inherently. Each realm feels distinct, which is good, and there's none that feel awful to play in, which is better.

    Yes, the removal of Malign Sorcery artifacts does indirectly nerf Allegiances that have weaker Faction Artifacts, especially compared to Factions who have good ones and are unaffected. That said, if your entire gameplan hinged on having one artifact on a specific Hero, maybe that gameplan deserved to be broken.


    Then there's some stuff for Meeting Engagement, which is cool but literally nobody cares about anymore (at least that I talk to).

    Overall, I think this is an excellent GHB. Nice additions for Open/Narrative, good changes to Matched Play rules, excellent Realm and Mission updates. I can't wait to play with the rules... though it would be nice if COVID allowed such a thing to happen. There's a non-zero chance that GHB2021 will be out by the time I actually play seriously again

  28. - Top - End - #208
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    SamuraiGuy

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    Oct 2012

    Default Re: Age Of Sigmar II: I Can't Believe It's Not Magic!

    Lumineth Realm-Lords

    Yes, the pointy Aelves are finally out! Kinda sorta. Look, just keep blaming COVID.
    The first wave is out in the box set, anyways, and the book with it. So build your starting units, work on your paint scheme, and plan lists that probably won't see the table for... a while.

    Spoiler: Faction Rules
    Show
    Aetherquartz Reserves/Absorb Despair: Each unit gets a reserve of Aetherquartz. It's a bit like Relentless Discipline abilities for OBR, or Aethergold abilities for Kharadron - it's a resource to track unit by unit, for a one-time boost to that unit. One unit per phase can use their Reserve to get +1 to save, +1 to hit, cast an extra spell, or add 1 or reroll a spellcast. All of those are great. However, once a unit uses its Reserve, it loses one point of Bravery. That's where the second half of this comes in, Absorb Despair lets a Cathallar negate that Bravery debuff and instead give it to an enemy unit within 18". Position accordingly to set up Bravery Bombs.

    Lightning Reactions: In the Combat Phase, when you pick a unit to fight, you instead pick 2 units to fight. Cool. Keep this in mind when engaging, so you don't waste it by only getting one unit in or something similar. While half the units in the book aren't particularly choppy, getting more attacks, faster, is always good.

    Shining Company: Vanari units (pike-aelves, bow-aelves, and cavalry) that are set up with each model touching 2+ other models in the unit confer a -1 to hit on every attack that targets them, until they move out of that configuration. That's... insane. If you build Vanari-focused, you can have a whole army that's -1 to hit for basically nothing. Enjoy frustrating everyone, especially armies with 4+ or 5+ to hit.

    Enduring as a Rock: Alarith units (hammer-aelves, floaty rock mage, and big cows) can ignore Rend-1 if they declare they are taking The Mountain Stance at the start of your turns (and start of game). There is no downside. You will declare this every turn, unless they errata it.

    Tectonic Force: At the end of the Combat Phase, Alarith units force enemy units they're in combat with to make a 2" move that ends them at least 1" away from Alarith models. Then they follow up 1". That's not a huge push, but it is enough to mess up specific positioning, or objective holding, etc. It's not always gamebreaking, but hey, it's free.

    Sunmetal Weapons: Not a special weapon, but Vanari units all have this. Their main weapons (pikes, bows, or spears) all deal a MW on a to-hit of 6. Each unit also has a spell called Power of Hysh to make that happen on a 5+ to hit instead. Mortal wounds are good. Mortal wounds on your basic dudes that have good amounts of attacks is great.


    Spoiler: Command Traits
    Show
    There's only two generic Heroes for Lumineth currently, and they each have a set of Command Traits:

    Cathallar
    Spellmaster: Reroll 1 casting roll per turn. Good.
    Loremaster: Know an extra spell from the Lore. Fine for flexibility, but not as good.
    Warmaster: 4+ for an extra Command Point in your Hero Phase. This is quite good, as there are a few very good Command Abilities in the book.

    Alarith Stonemage
    Majestic: +1 Bravery to nearby friendly units, -1 bravery to nearby enemy units. If you're building a Bravery Bomb, it's cool, otherwise it's ok.
    Enduring: +3 wounds. Seems a bit weak for a squishy foot mage, but as you'll see later, you really want to keep these guys alive. It's good.
    Loremaster: Know an extra spell from the Lore. As above, it's fine, but the other choices are better.


    Spoiler: Artifacts
    Show
    Once again, split between the two Heroes:

    Cathallar
    Phoenix Stone: When a nearby Hero is killed, roll a dice. On a 6, it doesn't die and removes all wounds. Do you feel lucky?
    Silver Wand: Cast an extra spell in each phase. There are good spells in the lore, so it's fine.
    Blade of Leaping Gold: +3 attacks to a weapon. The Cathallar's weapon is kinda crap, but it does do d3 damage, so maybe you'll want it? ...no, if your Cathallar is in combat, you have other issues.

    Alarith Stonemage
    Heartstone Amulet: 5+ Shrug. Always good, especially with the Enduring trait.
    Ebony Stone: 4+ to ignore the effects of a spell or endless spell. Too specific to be selected unless you have no other options.
    Magmic Hammer: +1 damage to Arcane Bolt when you cast it. That's neat, but not neat enough.


    Spoiler: Spells
    Show
    There's two lores here. Cathallars and Vanari units get one, Alarith Stonemages get the other. Teclis knows everything because he's like that.

    Lore of Hysh - Cathallars and Vanari
    Speed of Hysh: 5+, double the move of a friendly unit. 12" move giant cows, or 28" move Dawnriders. Excellent.
    Solar Flare: 8+, pick a point within 10". Destroy any Endless Spell at that point, or if it's a Unit, 6+ per model in the unit for a MW. Then, any Wizard subtracts 2 from casting/dispelling/unbinding rolls while 12" from that point. It's bonkers, even if the range is a bit short.
    Lambent Light: 5+, pick an enemy unit with 18" and reroll all shooting hits against it. Excellent if you're running a lot of Sentinels.
    Ethereal Blessing: 6+, give a friendly unit Ethereal (ignore modifiers to armor). Great against some armies, awful against others. Do not this prevents the +1 to save Aetherquartz Reserve.
    Total Eclipse: 8+, enemies must spend 2 Command Points to use Command Abilities. Sure, some armies don't care, but this straight up breaks the back of some armies. And is just a flex in general.
    Protection of Hysh: 8+, 9" bubble of 5+ shrug save for all friendly units. Solid.

    Lore of The High Peaks - Alarith Stonemages
    Unyielding Calm: 4+, make a unit ignore Battleshocks. Neat, if you don't want to spend CP to ignore it.
    Crippling Vertigo: 6+, enemy units must roll 2d6 before moving, charging, or piling in. If they roll above their Bravery, they can't move. Get absolutely wrecked.
    Voice of the Mountains: 6+, give an enemy unit -2 Bravery this turn, and then instead -1 until your next Hero Phase. Did I mention there's a Bravery Bomb in this book?
    Living Fissure: 6+, draw a line, 2+ do deal d3 MWs to units below the line. Generic damaging spell type thing.
    Entomb: 7+, pick an enemy model. Roll above it's Wound Characteristic to kill it. If it's a 6 and they have 6+ wounds, deal d6 MWs instead. Yes, it can pop coherency. Yes, it can snipe 3 or 4 wound Elites. Dicey, though.
    Assault of Stone: 8+, Roll a dice per model in enemy unit, if you roll below their save, deal a MW. Horde clearing.


    Spoiler: Great Nations
    Show
    These are your Subfactions. Pick one when you write your list to get abilities and bonuses, but get locked into Traits and Artifacts. Or don't pick one and have freedom.

    Ymetrica
    Also makes Alarith Stoneguard Battleline
    Ability: Mountain Stance Alarith units (which again, is all of them, all the time), ignore Rend-2 as well as Rend-1. That's insane. You can make an entire army that ignores most Rend.
    Command Ability: After you use Tectonic Force with a unit, you can use it again on a different nearby unit. Only useful if you're outnumbered, but it is kinda cool.
    Trait: Instead of fighting, the General can just deal d3 MW on a 2+. Which is cool, because the Cathallar has a crappy weapon anyways, and it deals about the same amount of damage that a Stonemage would do anyways.
    Artifact: Once per combat, deal an extra damage with your weapon. Gain a 6+ Shrug save. Ignore Spells on a 5+. It's a bad version of all the Alarith Artifacts put together, but you get all of them at the same time. For something you're forced to take, it's pretty ok.

    Syar
    Ability: All units have 2 Aetherquartz instead of 1. More resources is better, though you'll probably have more than you'll ever need.
    Command Ability: When a unit could use an Aetherquartz reserve, spend a CP to use it even if another unit has already done it that phase. Need +1 to save twice in combat? Great. Need more spells to go off? Sure. When you need it, it's great.
    Trait: Force an enemy to fight your Hero, and gain +1 to hit against it. Your Generic Heroes are trash in combat, but if you need to fight, you need to fight.
    Artifact: Give the bearer's weapon an unmodifiable 3+/3+ to hit wound, and oppenents can't have saves better than 4+ against it. Again, you don't want to fight, but if you have to...

    Iliatha
    Ability: +2 Bravery to most units in the army. Cool.
    Command Ability: Give a unit with 2+ models rerolls to hit of 1 in either the shooting or combat phase. Like the generic one, but with no range restriction. Cool.
    Trait Ability 2: When you use a Command Ability, a nearby unit can also use a Command Ability without spending a point. Have 2 Heroes next to each other, use the above Command Ability on 2 different units for supreme hitting power.
    Artifact: When the bearer dies the first time, roll a dice. On a 4+ they remove all wounds and are fine. It's pretty alright.

    Zaitrec
    Ability: +1 to the first cast/dispel/unbind of each Wizard per turn. All Heroes know an extra spell. Wizard subfaction, got it.
    Command Trait: Get an extra unbind, and the second unbind per turn from that General can be rerolled.
    Trait Spell: All Wizards know Overwhelming Heat: 7+, pick an enemy within 24", halve the move of that unit. Then, if you roll under its save characteristic, it takes D3 MWs. That's excellent, and it can come from anywhere in your army.
    Artifact: 6+ shrug for the bearer. Becomes a 4+ if you have Teclis in your army. Teclis is great, so that's a very real possibility.

    Of the Great Nations, I personally like Zaitrec, but Ymetrica is excellent if you're going Alarith heavy. Syar seems tactical, but not worth the worse Trait/Artifact. Iliatha has some combos, but I don't particularly find that appealing. None seem particularly "bad", which is great.


    Spoiler: Heroes
    Show
    Three Named Heroes and two generic. Here we go:

    Teclis
    There's a lot to unpack here. First, he puts out a +1 cast/dispel/unbind aura for friendly Wizards, which again, includes Battleline Units. He can attempt to unbind any number of spells, and can automatically unbind one per turn. He can automatically dispel one Endless spell per turn. Additionally, allies within his aura (12" degrading) ignore Spells and Endless Spells on a 4+, and if they ignore, they can blast a nearby enemy for d3 MWs for good measure. Magical supremacy even Tzeentch is jealous of.

    Then there's his own magic. He either casts one spell which autocasts and cannot be unbound, two spells that autocast on 12s, or four spells that autocast on 10s. None of those rolls can be modified. Basically, assess how good your opponent is as stopping spells and cast accordingly. Even 11+ is hard to roll for an unbind, not to mention that the rest of your army is also casting spells.

    He has two spells, one that puts out a 5+ shrug aura at 18" (can't be up at the same time as Protection of Hysh), and the other deals d3 or d6 Mortal wounds to all enemies in 18".

    The downside is his statline. 16 Wounds on a 4+ is relatively sturdy, but not unkillable. Especially if he doesn't get his shrug spell up, he's quite delicate to ranged damage output. in combat, he has some good attacks, solid damage but low number of dice, but you'll want to leave him out of combat until it's safe to go in. He won't die to a stiff breeze, but he will definitely go down to a strong combat unit that gets to him if he doesn't get defenses up first.

    Well worth being more than 1/4 of your army, though not required to play the faction.

    Light of Eltharion
    An excellent beatstick. Expensive, but 6 pretty good attacks with +1 wound on the charge and exploding 6s is good. Not to mention, he ignores modifiers to his save, hit, and wound dice, and halves damage from multi-damage attacks. So he's a reliable beatstick that can survive a lot. Then he's got a MW shooting ability (not attack, so he can run or retreat and still do it), and a CA that gives nearby units Bravery 10. He's a great Hero to stand in the middle of the board and smack opponents.

    Avalenor
    The named Cow Hero. With 14 wounds on a 3+, and access to Mountain Stance, he's pretty tough. He puts out a -1 hit aura as well, which makes him even tougher in combat. Melee attacks are great, he has a cannon shot, and can treat his table as 0 wounds taken if near a Stonemage. The Command Ability gives d3 Alarith Aelf units (so Stoneguard) +1 attacks. Additionally, if a Hero sticks near him for 2 turns, that Hero can use a Command Ability without spending CP.

    Basically, he's a beatstick with some debuffing and buffing abilities. His damage output is pretty crazy with reasonable rolls, and he's durable enough to get in and stay there. Excellent Monster for the points.

    Scinari Cathallar
    As noted above, you want 1 or 2 just to ignore the Aetherquartz downside. Then, there's the Bravery Bomb. When a friendly unit would take a Battleshock test, on a 2+, they don't take it. Then, pick an enemy unit nearby, and that unit adds the models lost from the friendly unit to their Battleshock roll if they are also taking a test. Which means you can debuff a unit's bravery, let some Wardens die, and then spike the enemy's Bravery so they lose way more models than they would otherwise. Even those Seraphon or Daemons with Bravery 10 are suddenly losing multiple models.

    Her spell is also insane: 7+, pick an enemy unit. When it moves, charges, shoots, or fights, roll 2d6. If you roll above the Bravery of that unit, it doesn't do the thing. And you have a bunch of ways to reduce Bravery. Imagine a unit of Eels that get debuffed, charge into combat, and then roll a 9 on the dice and can't fight. That's very, very strong.

    Yes, she's squishy and trash in combat, but for the utility, that doesn't matter basically at all.

    Alarith Stonemage
    As noted with Avalenor, you'll want these guys to buff your Sprit of the Mountain Monsters, but they're also good in general. His spell goes off on a 5+, lets him fly, and halves an enemy unit's movement, which is great, especially in Zaitrec, so you can debuff two units. He also gives nearby Stoneguard units improved Rend, though they cannot pile in if you do so. Which isn't bad, depending on the positioning.

    If you're playing Alarith heavy, especially in Ymetrica, you'll want multiple of these guys.


    Spoiler: Units
    Show
    There's only 5 units in the book outside Heroes, but each one is pretty distinct in purpose.

    Auralan Wardens
    Battleline. Pike aelves with shields, they do what you'd expect. Better against enemies that charge them, because duh. The Leader loses the pike but gains Wizard, as well as once per game 2+ to deal d3 MWs. An excellent basic unit, especially with Shining Company, if a bit uninteresting.

    Also, for each one you take, you can make one unit of Sentinels or one unit of Dawnguard Battleline as well. Nice for listbuilding.

    Auralan Sentinels
    Bow Aelves. Like the Wardens, leader loses the bow but gains Wizard. Also, the Leader can let the unit fire indirectly at a unit they can't see, which is potentially really good if there's a lot of terrain on the board. The bows have two firing modes: 30" but 4+/4+/-/1, or 18" and 3+/4+/-1/1. While they don't have the pure shooting prowess of some archer units in the game, they provide reasonable fire support, especially if they get Power of Hysh to spam MWs at the enemy.

    Vanari Dawnriders
    Cavalry Aelves. At first glance, they seem a bit uninspired, but their Deathly Furrows ability gives them extra attacks against 1 wound or 2 wound models, making them quite adept at chewing through battleline units or picking off flanking models. With a 14" move, they're basically flying across the board, making them solid firefighters and flankers themselves.

    Alarith Stoneguard
    Baseline, they seem pretty unappealing. 4" move is almost always bad, and their attacks are ok but nothing special. But, of course, then you add in the buffs from Spirit of the Mountain, the Stonemage, Mountain Stance, etc, and they become pretty efficient killing machines for their price. Of the weapons, I think the Diamondpick Hammers are better. Due to their almost reliance on synergies, you can't really just shove a unit in your list for no reason, and I think they're better if taken in more numbers.

    Spirit of the Mountain
    Monster Cow. Unlike Avalenor, they aren't Heroes, which is odd since they have a Command Ability. That said, they have a lot of the same things that Avalenor has, just worse. Their -1 hit ability only affects 1 units instead of an area, their Hero-buffing Command Point saver is a shorter range, and their Command Ability is shorter range and affects 1 unit instead of d3. For the very low point differential, you'll usually take Avalenor, but these guys are no joke either, with the same shooting attack, damage 5 weapon, and durability from Mountain Stance. Monster mash lists are going to be interesting for sure!


    Spoiler: Endless Spells
    Show

    Hyshian Twinstones
    7+ to cast. As you cast near it, it powers up, and then you can draw the power to empower other casts. Did you know Teclis autocasts empower this? Even without him, did you know your basic units are Wizards? For how cheap it is, this should be a consideration in every single Lumineth list.

    Sanctum of Amyntok
    7+ to cast. It surrounds the caster and infers a -1 to hit and a +1 to save on them. Kind of like a Balewind, without the range boost but you can move with it. Unclear yet if it fits around Teclis's base, nor how it interacts with unit leaders casting it. I like it, but it's not better than the Twinstones for the same price.

    Rune of Petrification
    8+ to cast. A the start AND end of each move phase, nearby non-Lumineth take d3 MWs on a 4+. Then, -1 to Run and Charge. It's a solid area denial unit, and the fact that it happens twice per player turn is pretty good. That's potentially 6 MWs (with excellent luck) on the turn it comes down to everything in an area. And then slows them. The price is a bit prohibitive, however.


    Spoiler: Battalions
    Show
    Pretty straightforward here.

    Alarith Temple
    Either cow, a Stonemage, and 1-3 Stoneguard units. Units near a Hero from this Battalion can get rerolls to save, but only pile in 1". Probably a gimme Battalion if you're running Alarith-heavy Ymetrica.

    Auralan Legion
    A Cathallar, and either 1/1 or 2/2 Wardens and Sentinels. Units can reroll save rolls of 1 while near each other units from the battalion. Simple, but I like this one, as it lowers your drops a lot and makes your units even tankier on top of their natural -1 to hit.

    Dawnrider Lance
    2-3 Dawnrider units. Reroll hits of 1 on the charge. Simple, straightforward. If you're running 2-3 Dawnrider units, why not consider it? Makes your Cavalry charge exceedingly deadly.

    Teclian Vanguard
    Because every army needs a meme megabattalion. Teclis, 0-1 Light of Eltharion, 1 Alarith Temple, 1-3 Auralan Legions, and 2 Dawnrider Lances make you a one-drop that gets 6+ shrug saves across the board. At achingly bare minimum it is nearly a whopping 2600 points, so you'll literally never see this outside of "Apocalypse" games.


    And that's it! A reasonable launch size, but there's plenty of variance in the book just from first glance. I'm excited to start on mine, though it may be a while from time of writing before the rest of the range is released.

  29. - Top - End - #209
    Titan in the Playground
     
    LeSwordfish's Avatar

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    Default Re: Age Of Sigmar II: I Can't Believe It's Not Magic!

    Assault of Stone: 8+, Roll a dice per model in enemy unit, if you roll below their save, deal a MW. Horde clearing.
    Can you confirm this? Goonhammer is saying it's not per model it's per your casting roll, and 1s and 2s don't work, making it still occasionally scary but not nearly as bad as it seemed.
    - Avatar by LCP -

  30. - Top - End - #210
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    SamuraiGuy

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    Default Re: Age Of Sigmar II: I Can't Believe It's Not Magic!

    Quote Originally Posted by LeSwordfish View Post
    Can you confirm this? Goonhammer is saying it's not per model it's per your casting roll, and 1s and 2s don't work, making it still occasionally scary but not nearly as bad as it seemed.
    You are correct, I completely read it wrong. Either way it's not great, though might be ok for Teclis autocasting on a 12.

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