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  1. - Top - End - #1
    Troll in the Playground
     
    BardGuy

    Join Date
    Jan 2009

    Default [In Nomine] The City of Pentagram

    This is a game using the In Nomine system, by Steve Jackson Games.

    Spoiler: Premise
    Show

    Star Valley is a middle-sized metropolitan area on the coast of California.

    In known history, it started as a small mining town during the California Gold Rush, and the town eventually became a gathering place for occultists and became known as Pentagram for the odd star-like shape of its valley. It continued as a small mining and industry town, with some spots near the coast as a tourist and rich retirement area and a small community college. Eventually it was renamed Star Valley out of religious concerns. During the ‘dot-com’ explosion, it became a sort of second-rate Silicon Valley due to a mix of lenient tax codes and some strong entrepreneurs. Currently, there is some strife between the tourists/retirees/software side of town and the mining/industrial side of town.

    In celestial interest, it started in time immemorial as a Tether of Flowers. During the California Gold Rush, a small and weak Tether of Lust was found and claimed (though it has grown in the centuries). Since then, the occult interest formed a Tether to Fate, over which a college was later founded; but this was later countered by another center of learning forming a Tether to Destiny.

    At that point, it was noticed that each Tether was at one of the points of the pentagram that shaped the landscape of the area. David’s Servitors confirmed that there were powerful ley lines… but that is odd as ley lines usually don’t influence the formation of Tethers. Nonetheless, he stationed two angels to watch over the area; and Litheroy also sent a Servitor to seek understanding. Eventually a fifth Tether, of The Sword, formed at the final point of the pentagram.

    The war between Heaven and Hell is a cold one currently. During the dot-com bubble, there was a strong fight between the forces of Lightning and Technology, but Lightning lost a few months before the dot-com industry crashed. It appears that Vapula withdrew most of his demons, and Jean has not replaced his. After that, although it seemed to annoy the militant forces on both sides, the war has been relatively quiet, with just occasional skirmishes between Soldiers and the very rare killing of a vessel. Even after a demon redeemed about ten years ago and passed on significant information to Heaven, the War remained cold. Even the militant angels are content enough, with their Tethers outnumbering the demonic Tethers.

    But now things are uncertain. Within the past month, a massive fire erupted in central downtime’s poorer district, turning several blocks into charred ruins, killing dozens, and displacing and injuring hundreds. In the process, a demonic Tether to Fire formed. A large one, directly in the center of the pentagram formation. In mundane terms, a new gang called the Burnt have incorporated many of the lesser gangs and are growing in power, and strife between the rich and poor is increasing. It’s even rumored that Yves commented on “coming troubles” and Gabriel let loose some unnerving words amidst shrieks of rage at the formation of another Tether for Belial.

    You are angels whose masters are interested in the change in this city. Will the War remain quiet, now that a new Tether has upset the balance of power? How will your coming shape its future?


    Spoiler: BIG 16
    Show
    1. What game system are you running (D&D, Call of Cthulu, Palladium, GURPS, etc.), and if applicable what edition (Original, Classic, Revised, 1st, 2nd, 3rd, 5th, 10th, etc.)?
    In Nomine, by SJG

    2. What 'type' or variant of game will it be (i.e. "Shadow Chasers" or "Agents of Psi" for d20 Modern)? What is the setting for the game (eg. historic period, published or homebrewed campaign setting, alternate reality, modern world, etc.)?
    Standard angels. The game will be fairly "fast pace" with there generally not being a lot of downtime. That is, sometimes you'll have a day, maybe two, of downtime, but usually it'll be one thing after another or balancing a couple different priorities.

    3.How many Players are you looking for? Will you be taking alternates, and if so, how many?
    3 minimum. Maybe up to 6. 3-5 is ideal. I'll probably start with extra players if there is interest, as folk tend to drop off PbP.

    4.What's the gaming medium (OOTS, chat, e-mail etc.)?
    GitP forums.

    5. What is the characters' starting status (i.e. experience level)?
    Standard. See this post for tips.
    NOTE: although building as a standard angel, you can be as young or old as you want. Maybe you were just filing paperwork in heaven for centuries, or maybe you were a demon and got redeemed.

    6.How much gold or other starting funds will the characters begin with?
    Wealth is based on your Role and Status. Even without a Role, you can be assumed to have some basic gear, including a smartphone and basic fake ID.

    7. Are there any particular character classes, professions, orders, etc. that you want... or do not want? What are your rules on 'prestige' and/or homebrewed classes?
    NA

    8. What races, subraces, species, etc. are allowed for your game? Will you allow homebrewed races or species? 'Prestige' races or species?
    Angels. Includes Bright Lilim as an option.

    9. By what method should Players generate their attributes/ability scores and Hit Points?
    Per standard rules.

    10. Does your game use alignment? What are your restrictions, if so?
    NA (well, sorta. You play as angels.)

    11. Do you allow multi-classing, or have any particular rules in regards to it?
    NA.

    12. Will you be doing all of the die rolling during the course of the game? Will die rolls be altered, or left to the honor system? If players can make die rolls, which ones do they make, how should they make the rolls, and how should they report them?
    Ideally, players roll their stuff and I roll for NPCs. I’ll roll passive stuff for players. Generally on the forum, though I may roll in real life and post results, or keep them hidden if the players don’t know there is a roll (e.g., Perception checks.)

    13. Are there any homebrewed or optional/variant rules that your Players should know about? If so, list and explain them, or provide relevant links to learn about these new rules.
    Yes. See In Nomine homebrew in my signature.
    Of import: including a homebrew Archangel of Redemption (although if a consensus of players don't like that concept, I'll drop her. I like it, but she's not crucial to the plot). Simplified rules on Sensing Noise. Simplified rules on armor.
    I'll also modify some Choir and Servitor Attunements, based on brokenness/usefulness. For example, Michael's Howl power is just broken powerful. In contrast, I find the Choir Attunements of Creation that just let you create stuff to be weak, so I'd probably modify those to give you a free artifact/talisman.
    Also: talismans cost the skill rank bonus + 1, not 2*skill rank bonus.

    14. Is a character background required? If so, how big? Are you looking for anything in particular (i.e. the backgrounds all ending up with the characters in the same city)?
    At least skirt length, but I’d probably enjoy a lengthy write-up. See "The Interview" spoiler later on in this post, though.

    15. Does your game involve a lot of hack & slash, puzzle solving, roleplaying, or a combination of the above?
    Depends on how the players want to do it. You can go in as brutal demon-killers of War or The Sword, but beware anger about bringing heat to the War without permission from the Seraphic Council. You can also play it subtle and sneaky, with politics and such. Or a mix. The game can very much be a split-the-party game.

    16. Are your Players restricted to particular rulebooks and supplements, or will you be allowing access to non-standard material? What sources can Players use for their characters?
    Core rule book + Liber Canticorum. You can pick any non-restricted Songs that aren’t deemed “potentially overpowered”. Even then, if you want a potentially overpowered, ask me and I might allow it. Relics will be approved on a case-by-case situation.


    Spoiler: The Interview
    Show

    As new angels in town, the game opens with you all gathered at a Tether as the Triad of Judgment interrogates, er, that is, greets you. As part of character creation, please answer these questions below.
    This is meant to give a sense of RP and player personality.

    1. State your names, your Choir, and your Superior.
    2. How old are you and what is your first memory after your creation?
    3. What is your fondest memory?
    4. What is it about your Superior and their Word that appeals to you so much?
    5. What is your view on Discordant and overly Dissonant Angels?
    6. If a friend of yours became an Outcast, would you turn them in?
    7. What are the top three things you appreciate about the Corporeal World?
    8. What are the three things you dislike the most about the Corporeal World?
    9. Tell me three moments of your life that defined who you are today?
    10. If you had to listen to one mortal song on repeat for a whole day, which would it be? And what style of music do you like the most out of all the human genre’s?
    11. Tell me two moments of your life you regret. One during your time in the Celestial Realm, and one during your time in the Corporeal World.
    12. How do you feel about God’s abandonment of Heaven and the Angels?


    EDIT THE THIRD: Please include a couple things you would enjoy or aspirations for your character you'd like to see. You won't necessarily reach them (e.g., none of you are likely to get Word-bound), but you could make progress. I want an idea of what you would find fun. There is a general plot to the game, but it's rather sandboxy in how you accomplish your goals, with multiple endings depending on what does or doesn't happen.
    Also, In Nomine can have mature themes. While I will follow forum rules of fading to black, if you have any 'trigger' things you'd rather I avoid, please let me know, as well as to the degree of avoidance. As an example: besides perhaps a Servitor of Gluttony making a cannibalism joke or a note to something having happened in the past, I don't plan on anything involving violence to young children. I've got young kids, and those sort of scenes make me uncomfortable, so I won't be including it in my game.


    Except for unusual circumstances or during holidays, I'd like players to be able to post at least 3 times per week. I'll plan to do updates on Monday, Wednesday, and Friday. I may post more often, especially to try to resolve combat or a lengthy conversation, but I think I can usually do 3 good posts per week. I also find I need about that posting rate for me to stay invested in the game.

    Lastly, I'd like all the PCs to get along, even if your styles (e.g., combat vs. stealth) or Superiors (e.g., War and Flowers) don't get along. You can have some opposition, but we should be able to work alongside each other.

    I have ideas for what NPCs are operating in town, but I might shift it up depending on player concepts so as to not have redundancy.


    EDIT: one thing I'm banning is the Kyriotate of Destiny attunement, as being able to possess and mind-read almost anyone (including most demons) is a bit too powerful. The Attunement still exists in-game, but just not for PCs.

    EDIT 2: I understand if homebrew stuff makes folk nervous, so I am fine dropping it and doing stuff by the core rules if desired. I think the only change I really want to implement is armor, for ease of mechanics, and (unless there's a big resistance) simplified rules for celestial Noise. The rest (like my homebrewed Archangel) is stuff I like, but not something I like so much I want to push away players.


    Spoiler: DRAFT Known demons in town
    Show

    This may change some based on PC choices and as I finalize some notes, but here's what your PCs would know coming to town. They'd also be briefed of local angels, but that is very subject to change based on what PCs are made.

    There may be other demons in town or some of this might be misinformation, but this is what the angels know. Some intel may be out-of-date, as most of it was from a redemption about a decade ago.

    Bethrezen, Balseraph of The War, Knight
    An ancient and powerful demon, it is said he fought alongside Baal during the rebellion. It is said he used to have roles as rulers or generals, but has moved to a more administrative role. He avoids any mundane role, instead coordinating the efforts of the demons in town and protecting their assets. He carries the Knight distinction, multiple vessels, and a dangerous artifact.

    Galafarsel, Habbalah of Fate, Seneschal, Demon of Necessary Apokatasis
    The Seneschal of Fate, he serves as an arrogant and difficult yet respected professor at the small college’s philosophy department. It is known that he recruits Soldiers of Hell and sorcerers, fostering both occult practices and furthering his Word by the idea of “you will be saved, so why worry about sin?”
    Unlike most Habbalah, he is not bothered by being called a demon. He is known to be powerful, but generally leaves angels alone as long as they leave him alone. Often courteous, but rather unsettling and rude if agitated.

    Madrizel, Balseraph of Lust, Seneschal, Knight
    Currently with the role of Madison Rourke, heir to a rich family, socialite, and owner of the Oblivion club. She grew in power after discovering this Tether back when it was a small brothel during the California gold rush. It’s known she deals in drugs and dark desires of the flesh. She maintains her Tether as a ‘neutral zone’ and does not tolerate fighting there, even towards angels. But most angels think it's just a ploy to seduce and corrupt angels, so visiting is frowned upon.
    She has several staff in-the-know, presumably even some demons working under her. It’s unclear exactly who is a demon, a servant or Soldier, or an imp or gremlin.

    Demons of Fire – the information below is from the demon that redeemed about a decade ago. Heaven is not completely sure of the current status of demons of Fire. Did someone new arrive to become Seneschal, or were one of these promoted? It's possible some even left in the meantime. Although numerous, most were considered fairly weak, but that could have been subterfuge.
    ??? – a Calabim active in the local gangs. Trip was his Role’s nickname in the gang. Pretty sure he is still active in town and now a leader in the Burnt.
    Brinniah – an Impudite of Fire with a role (Brittany) as a prostitute.
    Flavius – a Djinn of Fire and good friend of Trip’s. Has a comic-relief personality, actually going by Flavius and laughing along with the mockery from his fellow gangsters.
    ??? – a shedite of Fire.

    Megulliel, Shedite of the Game
    Not much is known about him, besides his focus on finding and destroying demons who would betray Hell. He’s offered to trade intel with angels in the past, but otherwise avoid angels. Despite being a shedite, he does not appear very interested in corrupting humans. He is also known to be very powerful in celestial combat; one blow from him has shredded a Force from weaker angels. He’s often sent to other cities to hunt Renegades. He's at least claimed that he's often away from Star Valley on jobs to hunt down Renegades, but that this is just his base of operations.

    Ikorial, Impudite of Technology
    Not much is known about him; he seems to keep a low profile and deal mostly by offering demons medical care or essence in exchange for favors. Mary Sherlock (Ofanite of Redemption) thought he’d be a good Redemption candidate, but she wound up killing his vessel when trying, so his current vessel and Role are unknown. Rumored to be a former Mecurian of Lightning who fell during the middle ages.

    Kimberly, of Technology
    Her Band is unknown, but suspected as a Balseraph based on her powers.
    Goes around scamming people (and companies) by selling them technological ‘wonder solutions’ with one vessel, then offering IT solutions to then fix it with another. Also tries to find skilled humans and point them towards businesses or labs run controlled by Vapula. It’s rumored some companies in town are under demonic control due to her trickery, but unclear which. Either has Celestial Form or an assortment of vessels.

    Fatima, Lilim of Dark Humor or Gluttony
    It’s not clear who she serves, but she seems friendly with both Superiors. She was running a bakery specializing in expensive desserts for the upper-class, but Ramiel (as a reliever of War) discovered what she was and killed her about three years ago. The angels suspect she’s back in town but her current Role or vessel are unknown.

    Kushtiel and Kashtiel, demons of Factions
    Two demons of Factions that opposed Stone. One is a shedite, but the other’s Band is unknown and it’s unclear which is which. It’s believed they are still in town since being ousted from the survivalist camp that Stone protects, but it’s not clear where they operate now.

    unknown demon of Greed
    Mammon has at least one Servitor in town (or did have one about ten years ago), but he appears to be very paranoid and secretive. Also is rumored to be stationed here as punishment for some failure during the Great Depression.
    To be clear, the 'run away' demons are Bethrezen (for corporeal combat) and Meguilliel (for celestial combat).



    Spoiler: DRAFT angels in the City
    Show

    Still subject to change
    Jerechial, Cherub of the Sword, Seneschal, Vassal
    Seneschal of a Tether to The Sword, he runs a veterans’ and biker’s bar the Tether is housed in. His vessel is a retired soldier, gruff but kind, Jeremiah Howser. He’s an honorable and loyal Servitor of Laurence. Fosters the spirit of a soldier and honor, plus coordinating martial angels (few that there are) and local Soldiers against the demons.

    Origenus, Elohite of Destiny, Seneschal, Angel of Apokatasis, Vassal
    A Word-bound Seneschal of the Tether to Destiny, he is the librarian at the local university. Quiet and reserved, he works to help students reach their destinies.
    As Word-bound to a theological concept, he honesty believes every human could be saved in the end, albeit it perhaps only a remnant left after time suffering in Hell, and assuming the Forces haven’t dispersed. He is uncertain about all demons being saved, but hopeful. He opposes the Seneschal of Fate, who is rumored to be his friend from before the Fall.

    Mary Sherlock (celestial name unknown), Ofanim of Redemption
    Her true name is unknown, but she was sent to the city a couple months after a demon of The War redeemed. Some think she is that demon; others that she is one who was given the intel and delivered it to the city. Regardless, the fact that both The War and The Game would want the redeemed destroyed seems reason to keep it private. Her true name is unknown, but she has a vessel of Mary Sherlock, a young college student and librarian assistant working under Origenus.

    Daisy, Kyriotate of Flowers, Seneschal, Friend
    A kyriotate of Flowers who helps maintain the national park Tether, Torel Gardens. She usually possesses the plants of the forest, but also helps the park rangers do their jobs. Her actual name is celestial syllables unpronounceable on earth, but she tends to go by Daisy when a human name is needed. She is rather alien for a Servitor of Flowers, focusing on protecting plantlife more than the metaphysical concepts of Flowers.

    Valufiel, Malakim of Animals, Vassal
    Usually at the national park Tether, he is focused on protecting its natural wildlife, though he works for animal rights in the city in large. His vessels include one of the park rangers, Vincent Fiel, and a wolf. It’s rumored he also has another vessel used for eco-terrorist acts (usually in other cities), but it’s unclear if that’s true or not.

    Adewale, Seraph of Judgement, leader of the local Triad
    A relatively new angel to this city, as the former leader of the Triad was promoted to a job in Heaven about a year ago. Adewale is much more of a prick. He expects the local angels to drop whatever they are doing when he calls. His vessel is Adam Walker, a young African-American district attorney.

    Fortisimos, Cherub of Judgement
    A member of the local Triad, he appears as a soft-featured, slightly chubby male in his early 20s, who has a kind and humorous demeanor. However, he is rumored to be powerful, including that he celestially slew an Outcast Servitor of Eli just six months ago, after the angel fled the local Triad. He does not have a Role.

    Rezzial, Malakim of Judgement
    A taciturn angel, even for his Choir and Word, he tends to simply sit back and quietly offer advice. He carries an artifact sword. His role is Father John-Mark Ramon, a priest-monk at a small Catholic monastery in town.

    Gaspariel, Kyriotate of Stone
    Medim, Mecurian of Stone
    Their current project is fostering the values of community and training humanity by managing a survivalist camp. This group of humans was almost turned into a radical white supremacist group by demons of Factions, but the Servitors of Stone managed to limit the radical aspects and turn them more towards community (if an isolationist community) and training for strength. They do some community outreach in the main city, but live in a commune a few miles out of town.
    The kyriotate possesses members of the commune as needed to help shape it. The mecurian is named Lucia Smith (formerly Lucia Rodriguez), wife to one of the leaders of the commune.
    These two angels usually avoid activities in town, but have stated they will help against the demons of Factions, should they be found again.

    Ramiel, Cherub of War
    Originally a reliever who was building up a Role to be given to an angel, he proved himself and was awarded Forces to fledge as an angel plus the continual use of his role. He lives as the 15-year-old Malcolm Price at the local high school. Malcolm's role is that of a foster kid, and his adoptive parents are ignorant of the War.

    Andreson, Seraph of Revelation
    Kind of an odd duck in the town, Andreson (not Anderson) was a Servitor of Love, before Andrealphus fell and became the Demon Prince of Lust. Andreson lost most of his memories, including his original name, between losing Forces during the fighting of the Fall and winding up in Limbo for a couple millennium. With a sense for truth and investigation, he chose to serve Litheroy after he returned. As with all angels of Revelation, he does not have a Role, and he basically lives as a crazy, homeless person.
    Last edited by JeenLeen; 2019-12-12 at 02:58 PM.

  2. - Top - End - #2
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    Mordar's Avatar

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    Mar 2008

    Default Re: [In Nomine] The City of Pentagram

    Hello -

    Certainly interested...this is a game high on my list of "always wanted to play but never got to". Would you accept a complete In Nomine novice, assuming other criteria (e.g. Interview) are sufficiently acceptable?

    - M
    No matter where you go...there you are!

    Togashi Ishi - Betrayal at the White Temple
    Da Monsters of Da Midden - GitP Blood Bowl Manager Cup Season VI

  3. - Top - End - #3
    Troll in the Playground
     
    BardGuy

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    Jan 2009

    Default Re: [In Nomine] The City of Pentagram

    Quote Originally Posted by Mordar View Post
    Hello -

    Certainly interested...this is a game high on my list of "always wanted to play but never got to". Would you accept a complete In Nomine novice, assuming other criteria (e.g. Interview) are sufficiently acceptable?

    - M
    That's fine. I was a new player until about a year ago, but it's quickly become my favorite system. If you're curious about some things, the link to the OOC thread for the game I'm playing in is in my signature. I don't think I'm as good a DM or storyteller as the guy running that, but I hope to do well and something in a similar vein. The first few OOC also have some setting details and mechanics questions. I'd be happy to ask more.
    Note too the char-gen tips link in the Big 16.

  4. - Top - End - #4
    Orc in the Playground
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    Jun 2019

    Default Re: [In Nomine] The City of Pentagram

    *scrubbed*
    Last edited by flat_footed; 2019-12-22 at 09:47 AM.

  5. - Top - End - #5
    Troll in the Playground
     
    BardGuy

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    Jan 2009

    Default Re: [In Nomine] The City of Pentagram

    Update: I'm updating the main post with this too, but noting that I'd like a couple things you'd enjoy or personal goals for your PC. Not to say you'd reach it, but it gives me an idea what'll be fun for you.

    Quote Originally Posted by UselessBlob View Post
    *scrub the post, scrub the quote*
    Sadly I don't.
    That said, the official FAQ and some wikis have some setting information. If you have a concept, I could walk you through what particular aspects and Songs would be fitting.
    Last edited by flat_footed; 2019-12-22 at 09:48 AM.

  6. - Top - End - #6
    Orc in the Playground
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    Jun 2019

    Default Re: [In Nomine] The City of Pentagram

    From what I can gather, a former Calabite would be cool. Would that be an Ofanite, or could a Redeemed demon become something other than their counterpart?

  7. - Top - End - #7
    Troll in the Playground
     
    BardGuy

    Join Date
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    Default Re: [In Nomine] The City of Pentagram

    Quote Originally Posted by UselessBlob View Post
    From what I can gather, a former Calabite would be cool. Would that be an Ofanite, or could a Redeemed demon become something other than their counterpart?
    That would be an Ofanite. Falling/redeeming always put you to your corresponding form.
    It is said that Lucifer will sometimes change what Band a demon is if they request that as their boon when first meeting him, but I think other than that it's not possible. It's theoretically possible another Superior could unweave the Forces making up a celestial and reweave them into a new Choir/Band, but I reckon there's good odds of extensive memory loss, personality change, and wasted resources, so few would. If you're an Ofanite and they want a Mecurian, they'd just make a Mecurian and assign you to other work.

    I will warn you, though, that I find the Ofanites to be the most... annoying/useless of the Choirs, as a player. I don't mind them as characters in a game I run, but I don't want you to be disappointed, so here's my warning.

    Their dissonance condition is basically "not taking action or moving when they have the option to". I wouldn't be super-restrictive about that, and it's not like you can't ever sit and wait if that's part of a plan as long as there's nothing better to do or another option that's helpful, but it's troublesome.
    To quote: "The primary dissonance of the Ofanim is inaction. If they the opportunity to indulge their mobile natures, they feel compelled to. Being imprisoned, bound, or otherwise unable to act is frightening [but not dissonant], but being physically free to act and not doing so is terrifying [and dissonant.] Inaction in the face of an overwhelming compulsion is darkly dissonant."

    Also, their Resonance powers are a bit confusing and all seem usually useless. The include
    1) add the check digit of your Resonance roll to any Agility skill.
    This one is pretty handy for avoiding damage in combat, as you can add it to Dodge. It is dissonant to fail your Agility roll, though, but if you have decent Agility + Dodge (12 or higher), you can't fail except on rolling 6-6-6, so the risk is minimal.
    However, it takes an action to use a Resonance, so it's a decent pre-combat buff or to boost a skill check to superhuman levels. But seems risky/kinda-useless otherwise.
    2) get a sense of how to get to somewhere, based on local understanding. Basically gives you an intuitive local knowledge. Not like "get to Bob's house" or finding an exact address, but finding the best restaurant (if there's a local consensus) or finding a bar where gang X hangs out or a place selling apples. Discerning community-known location stuff.
    3) if in celestial form, move really fast (1-6 miles per minute, that is, 10-60 miles per hour). It is handy, but a car is almost as fast/faster, and it means using up essence to shift forms.

  8. - Top - End - #8
    Orc in the Playground
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    Jun 2019

    Default Re: [In Nomine] The City of Pentagram

    Yeah, that is annoying. The wiki didn't have any mechanical details about the Choirs, so I'm shooting in the dark. I really just liked the destruction part of Calabim. Elohim are neat too.

  9. - Top - End - #9
    Troll in the Playground
     
    BardGuy

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    Default Re: [In Nomine] The City of Pentagram

    Quote Originally Posted by UselessBlob View Post
    Yeah, that is annoying. The wiki didn't have any mechanical details about the Choirs, so I'm shooting in the dark. I really just liked the destruction part of Calabim. Elohim are neat too.
    The Elohim resonance is pretty cool.
    Their dissonance is that they cannot act based on emotion. That doesn't mean you can't have emotions or even express emotions (although expressing emotion a lot would look strange to other angels), but they can't be your motivation or influence your actions. I've heard some say they're the hardest choir to play.

    As for others, in case the wiki is unclear:
    Seraph: can detect the truth of things. Dissonant to lie (but not to misdirect or deceive).
    Cherub: can attune to things via touch and then sense their location and if someone is planning harm to it. Dissonant to betray the trust of their ideals or the trust of their attuned, or if their attuned is destroyed. (Dissonance can vanish if the breach is healed.)
    Elohite: can sense emotion, emotional motivations, and what actions will lead to what. Dissonant to act on emotion.
    Ofanite: covered this
    Malakim: can sense the target's sense of honor, via sensing most honorable/dishonorable deeds they have done. Dissonant to violate oaths; all have 4 oaths, two of which are basically "don't let evil survive if you can help it" and "don't be captured by Hell" plus two others.
    Malakim are known as the best fighters. Mechanically, they aren't any better than others, but they have two boons: 1) they cannot fall, 2) if they die corporeally, they don't suffer Trauma.
    Kyriotate: use Will instead of Perception. Can possess a target, suppressing their mind and controlling them. Dissonant if the target is left in a worse condition than when possessed (definitely if injured, but screwing them up socially or leaving them in a desperate situation could also count). Can possess demons or animals, and multiple targets at a time. (Shedim, the demonic counterpart, can only possess 1 thing, and only humans.)
    Mecurian: sense the person's sense of identity and self, or the relationships between people. Dissonant to use violence on humans (but it is okay to harm humans.)


    Note that how much intel you get depends on the check digit. For example, with Seraphs: a 1 means you know if the statement is completely true or if there's any falsehood in it. At 4, you know completely if they think they are lying/being honest and why. At 6, you know that and what the objective Truth actually is. But it is limited to contexts the person would know about. E.g., you can't pull some random guy on the street and ask what the human guise of the Demon of Fate is and expect to read the Truth, since he has no idea what you are asking about.

    In contrast, the demons:

    Balseraph: all balseraphs believe a lie about themselves and the world, and they never Lie mechanically. If they make a resonance roll, they believe everything they say. They can make someone who fails to resist their Resonance believe anything (though if directly contradicted or proved false, they suffer dissonance).
    Djinn: as cherubs, but only dissonant if they harm the attuned, except if the attuned asks for it (even by mistake).
    Habbalah: they all believe they are the real angels, judging humans and killing them for failing. Inflict emotional extremes via resonance rolls.
    Calabim: all suffer Discord, through which they unleash destructive chaos on the world (damaging things via their Resonance)
    Shedim: possess humans, riding along with the human and corrupting them. Dissonant not to corrupt someone 1/day.
    Impudite: like Mecurians, it's dissonant to kill a human. Can use Resonance to charm someone then drain away essence.

    There's also Lilim. Their Resonance uses Perception, unless the rest of demons which use Will. They see the Needs of somebody and, if they fulfill it, they get a geas on the person. The person can resist having to fulfill a geas via a Will roll (and if they succeed, the lilim suffers dissonance.)
    Redeemed Lilim are still lilim, mechanically.

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    RedKnightGirl

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    Default Re: [In Nomine] The City of Pentagram

    @Mordar, @UselessBlob: Do you two prefer being more war sided or peace sided? Curious because we'll hopefully mesh, and I'm okay with tweaking ideas if it's necessary. What Superior do you think you'll go with?

    @JeenLeen: No clue how to make a character for this, but it looks fun and cozy.

    Drawn to the feel of a Mercurian, maybe a Lilim? They both seem the best diplomats and most human. The first idea is basically a wunder-kid police officer vessel. Very high Level, high Fast Talk, passable ranged combat for self-defence, but a terrible Singer. This is partially out of OOC fear to avoid mechanics I clearly don't understand, even if I love the idea of Song of Harmony / Shield / Tongues / Healing. So (s)he should basically pass for either a ridiculously talented human, or more critical eyes presume it's a Soldier on the side of a peace faction. Just a rough idea if I can get it all together.

    If not this, the idea can be reworked as a paramedic? What are easy Roles to fit into the story?

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    Default Re: [In Nomine] The City of Pentagram

    Okay, I'm thinking an Elohite under Dominic, possibly as a detective looking into the fire or the gang activity (or both, if they end up connected). I tend to lean towards more intelligent characters, but I don't know what the skills are so I can't quite commit to that.

    @JoyWonderLove definitely on the side of war. Peace is great and all, but it just means that the forces of Hell are working to corrupt humanity unchecked. After the war is over, then there's real peace.

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    Default Re: [In Nomine] The City of Pentagram

    I'm fine with Peace or War. Both could be fun ways to run it. Or a middle-way with folk like Trade, Wind, etc. who can act in different ways or mediate between War/Peace.

    I don't plan on the game doing much in the Marches (the dream/ethereal realms), so I think you'd be kinda bored if you wanted to serve Blandine (Archangel of Dreams), though it could work well enough as night-scrying folk in town suspected of being demons or allied with demons, stuff like that. I guess prefer no Dreams unless you can work with folk during the day.

    Another homebrew I forgot: I plan on limiting attacks to 2 per round. With the Numinous Corpus Songs in Liber Canticorum, it's possible to get 3-4 attacks per round. That breaks action economy -- I know from the game I'm playing in where I get three attacks -- and I think it's best to disallow it to PCs and enemies. So 2 attacks max, except for NPCs using stuff like Baal's Art of War attunement.

    Also, for Servants, if you want one: just some normal humans helping. Familiars are a little broken in that they provide a lot of extra essence and Songs. Soldiers or marital humans can break action economy similar to too many attacks.

    That said, you can make a brutally effective martial angel at char-gen and still be mediocre at some other stuff. Decent build. 4-5 Corporeal Forces and 6 ranks in fighting could let you one-shot most humans with a punch and be brutal against non-marital demons.

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    Default Re: [In Nomine] The City of Pentagram

    Quote Originally Posted by UselessBlob View Post
    Okay, I'm thinking an Elohite under Dominic, possibly as a detective looking into the fire or the gang activity (or both, if they end up connected). I tend to lean towards more intelligent characters, but I don't know what the skills are so I can't quite commit to that.

    @JoyWonderLove definitely on the side of war. Peace is great and all, but it just means that the forces of Hell are working to corrupt humanity unchecked. After the war is over, then there's real peace.
    The skills are here: innomine dot fandom dot com/wiki/Skill

    UselessBlob, the Burnt activity and Fire Tether absolutely look interesting, and Dominic is easily one of the most incorruptible (?) Superiors. He's literally brought charges against other Archangels in the past (including Michael of War). So, you can imagine how popular Dominic is with the others. That gives me a little more freedom to choose almost whoever as a superior; Dominic is pretty neutral to most others.

    Anyway, if I go with the police officer, want to say in the past five years or so we helped each other solve a crime? Makes sense for Detective and Police Officer vessels to help each other.

    Quote Originally Posted by JeenLeen View Post
    I'm fine with Peace or War. Both could be fun ways to run it. Or a middle-way with folk like Trade, Wind, etc. who can act in different ways or mediate between War/Peace.

    I don't plan on the game doing much in the Marches (the dream/ethereal realms), so I think you'd be kinda bored if you wanted to serve Blandine (Archangel of Dreams), though it could work well enough as night-scrying folk in town suspected of being demons or allied with demons, stuff like that. I guess prefer no Dreams unless you can work with folk during the day.

    Also, for Servants, if you want one: just some normal humans helping. Familiars are a little broken in that they provide a lot of extra essence and Songs. Soldiers or marital humans can break action economy similar to too many attacks.

    That said, you can make a brutally effective martial angel at char-gen and still be mediocre at some other stuff. Decent build. 4-5 Corporeal Forces and 6 ranks in fighting could let you one-shot most humans with a punch and be brutal against non-marital demons.
    Blandine seems pretty bland. Clue in the name. Currently rolling the dice between Metanoia, Flowers, Michael, Gabriel. They all have an idea or approach I like in some way.

    I have a rough build and first interview coming together. Not much of a fighter so far.
    Last edited by JoyWonderLove; 2019-11-24 at 02:49 PM.

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    Default Re: [In Nomine] The City of Pentagram

    Cool. And PCs knowing each other in the past (either in the current vessels or from centuries ago, or anything in between) is fine and welcome. I like reasons for the PCs to trust each other.

    Keep in mind that you all are new to the city. But I can definitely see transferring some anti-crime staff to this city after fires and the crime uptick. (And, if Dominic wants you there, other Servitors of Judgement have influence in police networks, FBI, CIA, and such to smooth such a transfer. He's incorruptible, but that doesn't mean he doesn't utilize connections to bolster the law and Judgement.)
    I will note that I tend to see Judgement in general as "kind of a prick", but not all of them are, and Dominic doesn't mean to be: he's sincerely trying to protect Heaven. But, like most Archangels, he is overly focused on his Word to such a degree that he causes dysfunction. But, as I said, that's true of all of Heaven; if they actually worked together well, they probably could have won.
    Hell's just even more dysfunctional

    ---

    On combat: combat in PbP can be really dry. I think the mechanics of In Nomine help it go along fairly quickly -- much better than D&D -- but it's still slow. If we're in a fight, I will probably try to post as quickly as you can to resolve it quickly. Similar to how I would a heated discussion that is slowing down game progression. (On the other hand, it's okay if we spend a week or two on a single fight, especially a big one.) So I'm very much okay if you don't make martial angels. Just do be prepared to run if you run into a couple of the bigger martial demons.
    The write-up I will give of known NPCs (both angelic and demonic) will give you insight into one or two demons that you should flee if you encounter and aren't very skilled combatively. Right now I have one known one for martial combat and one for celestial combat. But I plan to be a good DM and it's not like they'll be gunning for you unless you directly mess up their plans (which you may by late-game, no promises there, but it's not something that has to happen early-game. And running is an option. Well, except for Servitors of Michael: War's dissonance condition is running from battle.)

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    Default Re: [In Nomine] The City of Pentagram

    On skills: if a skill isn't covered by something listed in the core rulebook (and, by extension, that wiki I suppose--haven't checked it yet), it can be covered by a Role. A Role as a detective or PI, for example, would include knowledge of how to survey a crime scene, use police bureaucracy, take fingerprints, etc. But it wouldn't include Lockpicking or Lying, since those are specific skills.

    FYI: my personal knowledge of police bureaucracy and PI stuff comes from shows like Dexter or Jessica Jones. Just FYI for you to have an idea what I'd be imaging. I'm fine with playing it more cinematic or realistic, as fits your preferences. I think more cinematic would be more fun/powerful for you, though.

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    Default Re: [In Nomine] The City of Pentagram

    Quote Originally Posted by JoyWonderLove View Post
    @Mordar, @UselessBlob: Do you two prefer being more war sided or peace sided? Curious because we'll hopefully mesh, and I'm okay with tweaking ideas if it's necessary. What Superior do you think you'll go with?
    Hope to have something built tomorrow...was definitely thinking of something more peace-side, but TBD.

    - M
    No matter where you go...there you are!

    Togashi Ishi - Betrayal at the White Temple
    Da Monsters of Da Midden - GitP Blood Bowl Manager Cup Season VI

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    Default Re: [In Nomine] The City of Pentagram

    I have a bad habit of writing out characters only to realize I don't feel if I can write them properly, or just don't like them, and then abandoning it. So consider this kind of a first draft idea.

    Please read and review when you like.


    Camael, Mercurian of Redemption.

    Corporeal Forces: 3
    Ethereal Forces: 3
    Celestial Forces: 3

    Skills:

    Fast Talk: 6 Pinnacle.
    Pistol: 4 Expert. Minimum two skills necessary for Policeman.
    Dodge: 3 Competent practitioner, professional.
    Detect Lies: 3 Competent practitioner, professional. Minimum two skills necessary for Policeman.

    Attunement:

    Mercurian of Redemption choir attunement, free.

    Role: Police Officer, Level 3, Status 3. Cost: 5.

    Vessel: Level 3 vessel, Body Hits: 36, Charisma: 3. Cost: 15.



    Spoiler: Interview
    Show


    1) State your names, your Choir, and your Superior.

    “I understand the reception – judgement rarely invites redemption. Name's Camael. I sing among the choir most humble,” she flapped her wings. “That my rise is all the finer. It's my great joy to serve Metanoia. But I was told I'd get a briefing first – not an interview? In case the two are linked, I'd love to help turn the Fire or Lust Tethers to sense. Those sound like perfect opportunities for redemption. Just keep me clear of Fate, alright? I'd rather not rumble with folks that specialise in bring out the worst in you. Really, all Redeemed should probably avoid.”

    2) How old are you and what is your first memory after your creation?

    “Nine Earth years? My first memory was walking down this almost gallery of hearts, deep inside this stone building. I was being shown all these different types before eventually getting lead to my own. Then it was explained why I was made, when so many others weren't.”

    3) What is your fondest memory?

    “Well, when I was first getting used to my wings, the Relievers had this ongoing contest, right? To see who could glide the farthest. We kept going from higher and higher points of Metanoia's Cathedral, to the farthest point you could go beyond the walls. Winner gets essence. I know, because I'd been giving it away for the past week. And don't let anyone claim Relievers are beyond conning newly minted angels out of mana! Bunch of essence-stealing honeybees if you ask me.

    “Anyway! So I do this running leap, and launch eagle high. Wings sharp, arms close, eyes open, I'm soaring further and faster than ever before. Before I've even landed, I know I've arrived. No way are those little lint-bodies winning this time! Except, then I look down, and realize just how fast I'm going. And then I tense up. And suddenly, I'm losing altitude. When I look up again, I realize I'm about to be a lot more intimate with a stone wall than I'd ever want to be. And now, I'm somewhere between too scared to do anything, and too stubborn to flap my wings, because then I lose. Again.

    “So I'm about to hit this wall only for this huge gust of wind to hit me instead – from below. I'm told I made a sound like a goat getting shot out of a canon. Anyway, so this gust of wind hits, right? And I get thrown end over end until I finally land on my back on some nearby roof, hard. Before I know it, this Reliever was on top of me, panicking that she was oh so sorry. That she should never have agreed to it. So eventually, I realize not only had Elyse saved me – but on every other flight I had done, she gave me a little boost. Just enough to make me want to climb a little higher. Fly a little farther. The whole time the Relievers weren't trying to rob me. They were encouraging me.

    “The essence they took was just honey on top.”

    4) What is it about your Superior and their Word that appeals to you so much?

    “The Humans have a saying. Faith is the thing hoped for, the evidence of things not seen. So what use is Judgement if it ends in recidivism? Why hope for War if it endlessly leads to hate? What purpose in Stone when we never move forward? Metanoia doesn't appeal to just me. Redemption is everything everyone in Heaven has ever hoped for, and the evidence of a prayer fully seen.”

    5) What is your view on Discordant and overly Dissonant Angels?

    “Bread loves butter. If I can't help them, then I should be able to put them in contact with someone that can.”

    6) If a friend of yours became an Outcast, would you turn them in?

    “If I turned in that Outcast, would I really be their friend?”

    7) What are the top three things you appreciate about the Corporeal World?

    “German Shepherds, Everything Is Figureoutable by Marie Forleo, music – vanilla ice cream. Hey, I never said I'd stick to your rules.”

    8) What are the three things you dislike the most about the Corporeal World?

    “Vodka, rocky road ice cream, break ups. Don't look at me like that.”

    9) Tell me three moments of your life that defined who you are today?

    “Moments – not memories? Uh. Getting drunk with an alcoholic so I could empathise with why it had a hold on him, and then throwing up on him. Getting fired from an ice cream parlour after giving a tub of Rocky Road away to the homeless. Dumping a lover because I was too selfish to love as deeply as they deserved. You know, being human has a really high learning curve.”

    10) If you had to listen to one mortal song on repeat for a whole day, which would it be? And what style of music do you like the most out of all the human genre’s?

    “Easy! Toby Mac – Forgiveness. Because we all make mistakes sometime. I love a little Gospel, a little Conscious music, a little R&B. There's great songs and artists sprinkled everywhere.”

    11) Tell me two moments of your life you regret. One during your time in the Celestial Realm, and one during your time in the Corporeal World.

    “The Celestial Realm, you'll know, has Cathedrals. More that most realize. Maybe more than most know. A lot of them are empty, too. You're told not to go into them. Any of them. But I,” Camael shifted uncomfortably. “Um. Well. I was just newly made, and was looking for the exact Cathedral I'd take over. When I become an Archangel.” She shrugged, chagrined. “Only Yves really knows our true destiny, right? So you may as well aim high. Anyway, found it! Or, at least, I thought I did. The Cathedral that would be mine. So – I went inside. Mistake. There was this ocean of sadness inside, a screaming silence. Like the collective despair and grief of every orphaned soul that had ever been abandoned and would never be adopted. It was...horrible. I was crying, but I don't know exactly why. Paralysed, for all the thick energy. I blacked out soon after. Turns out, Elyse saved me.”

    Camael shook her head, head bowed. “Obviously, I should never have done that. And I never will, ever again. Now, I just walk around them.” She brightened then, head rising. “But at least I've narrowed down my choices. There's three or so Cathedrals I like the look of. Three, just in case one gets snatched up before I fully work my way up. And I promise you, just like I did Metanoia: I'll fill it. With every kind of good and loving soul you can imagine. Single-handedly, if I have to.”

    B) And during your time in the Corporeal World.

    “Throwing up on an alcoholic isn't regretful enough for you? Okay. On the Corporeal World, I – no, my vessel, she used to work for the Crisis Intervention Team. We got called out to a woman threatening to jump off a ten story. Things were going well. Until they weren't.” Her face turned sour. “After that, I – I felt like a worthier soul should be given a chance on the CIT team. So I took a step down. Now the vessel is a police officer. Still plenty of opportunities to help humanity move forward. Just nothing as intense as that last call. At least, not as frequently.”

    12) How do you feel about God’s abandonment of Heaven and the Angels?

    “Why complain about a tropical sunset when others are struggling in the Antarctic? We had direct experience with the Utmost Divine. Knowledge of the All, instead of blind faith. Humanity doesn't have that. So, if anything, I feel honoured. We've been entrusted with the Earth. With setting things right. In a way, that why Redeemers are. It's our air. And I intend to breathe deep.”

    Last edited by JoyWonderLove; 2019-11-25 at 10:12 PM.

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    BardGuy

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    Default Re: [In Nomine] The City of Pentagram

    Quote Originally Posted by JoyWonderLove View Post
    I have a bad habit of writing out characters only to realize I don't feel if I can write them properly, or just don't like them, and then abandoning it. So consider this kind of a first draft idea.

    Please read and review when you like.

    <snip>
    Mechanically, looks sound. If you go all 6s in your stats (Strength/Agility/Int) etc., your accuracy with a pistol is a base of 10 (almost never miss) and you've got a dodge of 9 (also good), so you should do decent in combat. Without having any Songs, you might feel a little mundane, but your cop role should give you access to a lot of useful information and influence, and you can always buy Songs with xp as the game progresses.

    From the interview: really liked it. Nice play on being an angel created by Metanoia, rare as they are. I also liked the touch about abandoned cathedrals. Do you have any set idea who Elyse is, or should I play that as works for the game?
    Also I laughed at the line "“If I turned in that Outcast, would I really be their friend?”

    The only thing that seems problematic is that, as a police officer, sometimes you are expected to shoot bad guys. And as a Mecurian, it's dissonant for you to hit human bad guys. But many cops can go their whole career without having to fire at someone, or just firing warning shots, so you'd be okay enough. Just be warned you probably have to use that Fast Talk skill sometimes to talk yourself out of trouble about why you acted like you did (or why your aim was so bad), but maybe that's why you put Fast Talk at 6.

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    Default Re: [In Nomine] The City of Pentagram

    I put a draft of the known demons in town in the opening post. You would have been briefed by your Archangel before sent to town.

    ---updated---

    Quote Originally Posted by Mordar View Post
    Hope to have something built tomorrow...was definitely thinking of something more peace-side, but TBD.
    If JoyWonderLove goes with Redemption, they can work well with Peace or more martially-minded. Judgement's really the only one they don't get along with. (The Sword also doesn't like them, but they have no problem with The Sword.)

    For Peace, most any could work with that concept. I forgot to mention this in the OP, but I am allowing Archangels like Zadkiel, who are very fine with killing what needs killing. Metanoia is fairly Peace-y. Trade is a good neutral option, although I admit I find them mechanically a bit dull.

    If you wanted to be more martial, Michael is always an option. Gabriel, Janus, and Jordi are also options. I could also see Jean wanting to send one of their more combative angels to help against Technology; the Ofanite of Technology attunement is actually really good at damaging foes (just don't have allies right beside you!)

    I know UselessBob said he's leaning War-oriented, but anything besides Flowers can be a good ally to war-oriented angels.
    Last edited by JeenLeen; 2019-11-26 at 11:35 AM.

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    RedKnightGirl

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    Default Re: [In Nomine] The City of Pentagram

    Quote Originally Posted by JeenLeen View Post
    Mechanically, looks sound. If you go all 6s in your stats (Strength/Agility/Int) etc., your accuracy with a pistol is a base of 10 (almost never miss) and you've got a dodge of 9 (also good), so you should do decent in combat. Without having any Songs, you might feel a little mundane, but your cop role should give you access to a lot of useful information and influence, and you can always buy Songs with xp as the game progresses.
    Great.

    Quote Originally Posted by JeenLeen View Post
    From the interview: really liked it. Nice play on being an angel created by Metanoia, rare as they are. I also liked the touch about abandoned cathedrals. Do you have any set idea who Elyse is, or should I play that as works for the game?
    Also I laughed at the line "“If I turned in that Outcast, would I really be their friend?”
    Thank you! Really glad you liked the interview. I'm never sure when I missed the mark totally or happen to write something fun, so it means something when others appreciate it.

    Anyway, Elyse really was a last second addition.

    Jeen, your impression of her adds the uncomfortable and much more sinister idea that The Game has spies in Heaven (grey angels hedging their bets because Heaven is losing? Bright Lilim that somehow still owe him favours?), keeping an eye on angels of interest. Like semi-rare newly minted Metanoia angels.

    What I imagined was boring compared to that. A Reliever. Either one quietly assigned to protect and guide Camael without her knowledge, or else just one that liked and knew her well enough to stay alert, and so happened to pull her out of the fire (twice). This because Camael wouldn't make it past her especially incompetent, overambitious baby angel years without a guardian.

    So, is both a possibility? Neither? Somewhere in between?

    Quote Originally Posted by JeenLeen View Post
    The only thing that seems problematic is that, as a police officer, sometimes you are expected to shoot bad guys. And as a Mecurian, it's dissonant for you to hit human bad guys. But many cops can go their whole career without having to fire at someone, or just firing warning shots, so you'd be okay enough. Just be warned you probably have to use that Fast Talk skill sometimes to talk yourself out of trouble about why you acted like you did (or why your aim was so bad), but maybe that's why you put Fast Talk at 6.
    You're right the angel has more a restrictive combat approach. The reason I barely went with Mercurian above a Lilim (unless I bin this idea....) is that I'm hoping between maxed Charisma 3, Fast Talk 6, the Mercurian ability to pinpoint a ton of details about someone with a good Perception roll, and the redemption attunement to make bad guys trust you, I'm hoping to just about keep most humans out of a fight. Or at least get them to focus elsewhere.

    Does that sound like a fair stacking of the deck towards peace? Or is there a better way? Or is the intent a little unrealistic?

    Quote Originally Posted by JeenLeen View Post
    I put a draft of the known demons in town in the opening post. You would have been briefed by your Archangel before sent to town.

    If JoyWonderLove goes with Redemption, they can work well with Peace or more martially-minded. Judgement's really the only one they don't get along with. (The Sword also doesn't like them, but they have no problem with The Sword.)

    For Peace, most any could work with that concept. I forgot to mention this in the OP, but I am allowing Archangels like Zadkiel, who are very fine with killing what needs killing. Metanoia is fairly Peace-y. Trade is a good neutral option, although I admit I find them mechanically a bit dull.
    Love the list of potential demons. If Redemption wins the day, Madrizel and the Burnt are probably who Camael wants to undermine the most? Galafarsel she would rather avoid. The rest comes down to whatever supports her goals / the team (of PCs) / fun.
    Last edited by JoyWonderLove; 2019-11-26 at 04:33 PM.

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    Default Re: [In Nomine] The City of Pentagram

    Quote Originally Posted by JoyWonderLove View Post
    Anyway, Elyse really was a last second addition.

    Jeen, your impression of her adds the uncomfortable and much more sinister idea that The Game has spies in Heaven (grey angels hedging their bets because Heaven is losing? Bright Lilim that somehow still owe him favours?), keeping an eye on angels of interest. Like semi-rare newly minted Metanoia angels.

    What I imagined was boring compared to that. A Reliever. Either one quietly assigned to protect and guide Camael without her knowledge, or else just one that liked and knew her well enough to stay alert, and so happened to pull her out of the fire (twice). This because Camael wouldn't make it past her especially incompetent, overambitious baby angel years without a guardian.

    So, is both a possibility? Neither? Somewhere in between?
    I didn't mean to imply anything sinister. Probably, I'll keep her as a reliever active in Heaven. Maybe a former imp or gremlin who might want to share intel on a previous master. Given Metanoia's nature, most of her relievers are former imps/gremlins.

    Although there are certainly rumors that there are spies amongst her ranks, most Archangels (e.g., everyone except Dominic) accept her greys as harmless, at least as long as they stay in the Cathedral and don't spread dissonant ideas (in both the mechanical/metaphysical Dissonance sense and just bad ideas. As a player in another In Nomine game pointed out, the Fall happened due to one angel spreading bad ideas, so bad ideas are dangerous and worth destroying celestials over.) And she does police her own: if she suspects someone of being loyal to past allegiances, they go to the Brig.

    You're right the angel has more a restrictive combat approach. The reason I barely went with Mercurian above a Lilim (unless I bin this idea....) is that I'm hoping between maxed Charisma 3, Fast Talk 6, the Mercurian ability to pinpoint a ton of details about someone with a good Perception roll, and the redemption attunement to make bad guys trust you, I'm hoping to just about keep most humans out of a fight. Or at least get them to focus elsewhere.

    Does that sound like a fair stacking of the deck towards peace? Or is there a better way? Or is the intent a little unrealistic?
    That's a good expectation. Most humans will trust you implicitly with your Charisma. Actually, I think you can't fail a 'First Impressions' roll. Base 6 + 3 Status + 3 Charisma = 12. So folk always* have a good first impression towards you and are helpful. That's pretty good.
    You also can't fail a Fast Talk roll, so similarly good, though a very willful person might see through it. (If I recall correctly, the check digit of your roll is a penalty to their roll to see through the fast talk.)

    *except infernal interventions. So, 1/256 of the time someone distrusts you. Not bad.

    You probably want to pick up the Corporeal or Ethereal Songs of Harmony eventually. Corporeal lasts rounds, but it makes combat literally impossible (no way to resist, either). Ethereal lasts minutes, but people can try a Will roll to attack; but it does enforce rational conversation.

    I could see you buying the Mecurian of War attunement eventually, especially if you are helping in the War (even if by redeeming demons or their servants). It allows you to see what the "cost of peace/diplomacy" is, that is, what would be necessary for any two people you met who are in conflict with one another to be at peace. Michael isn't friendly with Metanoia, but nor is he opposed, and he could see the strategic advantage of helping a Redeemer who removes enemy combatants.

    I'll need to look over the mechanics of the Impudite Resonance. It's... strange, in that it factors in the Forces of who you target as a modifier to your roll. (Which is part of why it's hard for Impudites to successfully target celestials.) Plus you have to first roll to Charm them, then roll to drain essence.
    And I don't know if you thought about it, but you could probably pose as an Impudite to some demons. Sure, they might be mad you tried to drain their essence, but gives you an in to talk to them.

    And in a general sense for your idea: nothing mechanical, but I have a sense for each NPC of how redeemable they are. Some demons are just completely selfish and/or loyal to their Prince that it's inconceivable. Even if they might go Renegade out of fear of being destroyed for failure, they wouldn't be willing to serve Heaven or care about humans. But some others are more neutral and could be persuaded. And a couple might even be prime candidates.


    EDIT: if you wanted to leverage your points a little bit, I could see dropping to Charisma 2 and putting those 2 points in a Song of Harmony. Or in Celestial Motion: at rank 2, it's basically a "dimension door" range teleport, but that's good for getting yourself (or a comrade) out of danger if peace talks break down. It would mean that 1/36 of the time folk get a negative first impression, but... still not bad.
    Last edited by JeenLeen; 2019-11-27 at 09:14 AM.

  22. - Top - End - #22
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    RedKnightGirl

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    d6 Re: [In Nomine] The City of Pentagram

    Quote Originally Posted by JeenLeen View Post
    I didn't mean to imply anything sinister. Probably, I'll keep her as a reliever active in Heaven. Maybe a former imp or gremlin who might want to share intel on a previous master. Given Metanoia's nature, most of her relievers are former imps/gremlins.

    Although there are certainly rumors that there are spies amongst her ranks, most Archangels (e.g., everyone except Dominic) accept her greys as harmless, at least as long as they stay in the Cathedral and don't spread dissonant ideas (in both the mechanical/metaphysical Dissonance sense and just bad ideas. As a player in another In Nomine game pointed out, the Fall happened due to one angel spreading bad ideas, so bad ideas are dangerous and worth destroying celestials over.) And she does police her own: if she suspects someone of being loyal to past allegiances, they go to the Brig.
    Neat. Your way would actually add true character depth and new insights, and so is a lot better story wise. I just loved the Reliever pictures, felt a spiritual baby sister was necessary, and liked the name Elyse. Tada. Elyse: angel saver extraordinaire.

    Quote Originally Posted by JeenLeen View Post
    I could see you buying the Mecurian of War attunement eventually, especially if you are helping in the War (even if by redeeming demons or their servants). It allows you to see what the "cost of peace/diplomacy" is, that is, what would be necessary for any two people you met who are in conflict with one another to be at peace. Michael isn't friendly with Metanoia, but nor is he opposed, and he could see the strategic advantage of helping a Redeemer who removes enemy combatants.
    Perfect. My very first draft before this was completely a Michael Mercurian, partly because I loved that diplomacy ability. So it's fantastic you're okay with me potentially buying it. Is that one of the custom house rules, is my newness to the rules showing, or do I have the wrong version of In Nomine? For buying from the choir attunement of someone else's Superior goes, the (outdated?) version I'm reading on page 36 says we can only buy other Choir Attunements specifically from our Superior (Metanoia for me) for 5 character points. Even while it also says buying the more expensive Servitor Attunements for 10 character points is acceptable and open for everyone.

    Quote Originally Posted by JeenLeen View Post
    That's a good expectation. Most humans will trust you implicitly with your Charisma. Actually, I think you can't fail a 'First Impressions' roll. Base 6 + 3 Status + 3 Charisma = 12. So folk always* have a good first impression towards you and are helpful. That's pretty good.
    You also can't fail a Fast Talk roll, so similarly good, though a very willful person might see through it. (If I recall correctly, the check digit of your roll is a penalty to their roll to see through the fast talk.)

    *except infernal interventions. So, 1/256 of the time someone distrusts you. Not bad.

    You probably want to pick up the Corporeal or Ethereal Songs of Harmony eventually. Corporeal lasts rounds, but it makes combat literally impossible (no way to resist, either). Ethereal lasts minutes, but people can try a Will roll to attack; but it does enforce rational conversation.

    And in a general sense for your idea: nothing mechanical, but I have a sense for each NPC of how redeemable they are. Some demons are just completely selfish and/or loyal to their Prince that it's inconceivable. Even if they might go Renegade out of fear of being destroyed for failure, they wouldn't be willing to serve Heaven or care about humans. But some others are more neutral and could be persuaded. And a couple might even be prime candidates.

    EDIT: if you wanted to leverage your points a little bit, I could see dropping to Charisma 2 and putting those 2 points in a Song of Harmony. Or in Celestial Motion: at rank 2, it's basically a "dimension door" range teleport, but that's good for getting yourself (or a comrade) out of danger if peace talks break down. It would mean that 1/36 of the time folk get a negative first impression, but... still not bad.
    What you're saying about dropping Charisma really does resonate. It's this perpetual see-saw between what's practical, versus creative vision and fun. Worse because the Reaction rolls on page 44 mention we might be able to get away with Fast Talk for them. And Fast Talk was pumped because persuasion / diplomacy roughly sounds like it falls under it.

    Really, now that you mentioned it Jeen, I'm tempted to nickle and dim character points. Then send them into Song of Harmony like you said, focusing on Ethereal first, and then eventually branching into all Songs of Harmony. But then I have to be even more uneasy about combat, so, again, see-saw. Would love to see how it's going for the others, as their ideas can and will change mine, even if only in nudges while we all try to jel.

    Also, very much into the idea of characters being on a spectrum instead of all being closed to the idea of redemption. Cue Mordar and I messing with the city-spiritual politics and interacting with the inbetweeners (Dissonants, Outcasts, etc) seems like it could be a lot of fun imo. While UselessBlob outright wins us the war through more direct means.
    Last edited by JoyWonderLove; 2019-11-27 at 09:49 PM.

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    BardGuy

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    Default Re: [In Nomine] The City of Pentagram

    Regarding Choir Attunements and Servitor Attunements

    My understanding of the rules -- which could be wrong -- is that you can buy the Choir Attunements of your archangel (assuming they aren't restricted to a given Choir because they work off that Choir's resonance) for 5 points. You can also buy the Choir Attunements of other archangels for your choir for 5 points.
    So, for example, a Seraph of War could buy the Ofanite of War or Mecurian of War attunements, since they are also War. He couldn't buy Cherub of War, though, since that is based on a cherub's resonance.
    He can also buy the Seraph Attunement (but only the Seraph one) of other archangels.

    Servitor Attunements are allowed if you follow that Word. So angels of War can buy Michael's Servitor attunements. But not other angels.
    ...or maybe the rules do allow you to, but it's a very, very rare thing for exceptional service to the other archangel and/or its Word.

    However, having an Attunement to another archangel usually requires doing some service to them and/or that archangel being affiliated with them, or at least non-hostile. For example, Michael would probably never let one of his angels take a choir attunement of Destiny or Flowers. Likewise, Novalis wouldn't let hers take War attunements.

    During char-gen, I'm okay with you having an attunement to an allied or associated archangel. For a neutral one, I'd probably allow it. Just work into your backstory some reason they like you.

    ---

    By the way, I think the best offensive angel would be a Seraph of The Sword. They could buy the Seraph of War attunement and Mecurian of The Sword attunement. Seraph of War deducts Corporeal Forces from the enemy's dodge; Mecurian of the Sword adds Corporeal Forces to your Dodge. So someone with high (5-6) Corporeal Forces and those attunements would greatly hinder the dodge of anyone they are attacking, and their dodge would be high enough that they'd probably always soak/avoid close to 6 damage each attack.

    NOTE: those attunements are probably only worth it if you have 5 Corporeal Forces, since those 5 points could just as easily buy 5 Dodge or 5 <some attack skill>. But I think that's the only good way to boost your accuracy above having 6 points in the skill and a maxxed stat.

    I'll also mention that most of the Numinous Corpus that allow attacks seem like traps, mechanically. I think you're generally better off putting points into the Fighting skill instead of getting a Song that gives you a physical attack instead of punching. Tongues is sorta an exception, as at rank 4 you can do Mind hits into of Body hits, which is super-powerful against some martial angels.
    Tail is an exception as it gives you an extra attack instead of replacing your main attack.

    But, to anyone making a martial build, you really don't need to min-max to succeed. But you are welcome to if you wanna.

  24. - Top - End - #24
    Orc in the Playground
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    Default Re: [In Nomine] The City of Pentagram

    I managed to find the core rulebook through unimportant means, so I can get started actually putting something together. I have questions about one of Dominic's Servitor Attunements, though. When using Heavenly Judgement, are the strikes automatic hits, and what crimes (besides murder) could be considered severe enough to merit execution?

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    BardGuy

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    Default Re: [In Nomine] The City of Pentagram

    Regarding attunements, I forgot to mention that, although the rulebook doesn't give a metaphysical basis, this is my 'headcanon':

    You can buy Attunements because they resonate with your Word or your Choir. You can buy any attunement (Servitor or Choir) of your Word because you are attuned to that Word; hence a Seraph of War being able to buy Mecurian of War. You can also buy Choir attunements that resonate with your Choir; hence a Seraph of War being able to buy Seraph of the Sword.

    But you can't buy something you have no relationship with. So no Seraph of War buying Malakim of Fire, regardless of how handy it might be. Also why you can't (normally) buy Servitor Attunements of other Words.

    However, you don't necessarily lose attunements if you switch Superiors, even if it would normally be impossible. Sometimes your new or old master will strip an attunement, but it would be possible for a Seraph of War to have the Malakim of Fire attunement, if they were a former Seraph of Fire who decided to switch from Gabriel to Michael (and neither Gabriel nor Michael insisted the attunement be removed.)

    I also remembered a canon example of a Gabrielite having one of Yves' Servitor Attunements. So it can happen, but is rare enough assume it can't for spending character points.

    Quote Originally Posted by UselessBlob View Post
    I managed to find the core rulebook through unimportant means, so I can get started actually putting something together. I have questions about one of Dominic's Servitor Attunements, though. When using Heavenly Judgement, are the strikes automatic hits, and what crimes (besides murder) could be considered severe enough to merit execution?
    It does automatically hit.
    As for what is "not less than murder"... hmm... murder is the unjust death of a human. So I would think something that destroys someone's life in a similar way. I'd put rape and severe child abuse in the same category, as that robs someone and damages them in so many ways. Willingly and knowingly destroying someone's life for one's selfish means, such as making them a life-ruining drug addict, seems equivalent.
    We could resolve other cases in a case-by-case manner. That might be more lenient than the rules intend, but if you're spending 10 points on a power (much less one costing 7 essence), it better be good!

    But that definition of "as bad as murder", most demons (but not all) would be probably guilty, as most probably killed somebody at some point or at least ruined someone's life such that it's as bad as murder. Any former angels who fell would be guilty, due to the act of Falling and thus spiritually killing their self.
    Angels who murder in the work of heaven would not be considered guilty. Nor would simply being dissonant or Outcast be equivalent.

    I want to think some if "corrupting someone such that they go to Hell" would count or not. I'm leaning towards "not" because, although it is bad, Judgement is about meting out for crimes committed. A person who meets their Fate deserves Hell; Judgement doesn't consider it "not really their fault" even if they were ridden by a shedite. The person is still culpable in that they committed the acts and were corrupted by the acts.
    That said, a person who met their Fate might be guilty enough, in that they did the act that damns themself and thus, in a sense, killed themself spiritually.

  26. - Top - End - #26
    Orc in the Playground
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    Default Re: [In Nomine] The City of Pentagram

    Cool. I'm referring to your chargen post to work on it. Are you doing the free Song of Wings here or is that from your old game? Also, when buying vessel resources, do you round up or down after dividing by two?

  27. - Top - End - #27
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    BardGuy

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    Default Re: [In Nomine] The City of Pentagram

    Quote Originally Posted by UselessBlob View Post
    Cool. I'm referring to your chargen post to work on it. Are you doing the free Song of Wings here or is that from your old game? Also, when buying vessel resources, do you round up or down after dividing by two?
    You get the free Numinous Corpus: Wings.

    For vessel Status/Rank, you round up. Same as for Servants, though I'm not recommending any Servants to start as they are mechanically a bit complicated and hard to make useful but not broken.

    A neat mechanical thing that is not allowed: if you have a rank 1 vessel, with Role 2/Status 1, and -2 charisma, it's free! Rank 1 vessel costs 3 points. 2*1/2=1, so Role 2/Status 1 is 1 point, so 4 total. -2 charisma gives 4 points. For a net of 0.

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    RedKnightGirl

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    Default Re: [In Nomine] The City of Pentagram

    Quote Originally Posted by JeenLeen View Post
    Regarding attunements, I forgot to mention that, although the rulebook doesn't give a metaphysical basis, this is my 'headcanon': [explanation cut]
    You're totally right about this.

    Ignoring for a sec that as the story teller, you make it easier for everyone by deciding rulings, the errata online explicitly (and Liber Canticorum with Israfel on page 10) agree with your headcanon. Sorry I didn't check better and sooner. My source is outdated, in that it's not errata friendly, and you even put a link up to the FAQ, so it was lazy of me not to double check before asking. Also, being able to buy choir attunements from any Superior is just a lot more fun and enriching and just plain intuitive.


    Possible number changes.

    This is mostly my feelings and thought process for an Angel of Redemption approach.

    Spoiler
    Show
    Corporeal Forces dropped to (as per page 35 of In Nomine) above average human levels, but Celestial Forces raised. So really not a fighter at all. Ever. Ultimately the hope is to enable more Mercurian goodness. Their Perception based ability (Perception now raised to 10) should make it likely to get details when it's important. It also gives a good foundation to hopefully spot trouble ahead of time.

    Ethereal Forces were left at 3 to support the newfound Song(s) of Harmony. Points were placed in all Harmony songs. This because of the +2 check digit (Liber Canticorum, page 16) bonus all now get. The celestial version is great because the option to help Dissonant Angels really appeals to me (same for Song of Ecstacy). But the Ethereal version is the best. It opens up defensive and storyline options while Mercurians also get a +1 check digit on it. Win win win.

    Speaking of police, Status has been bumped to 4. But Charisma has been dropped to 1. This is more honest to what I imagined. Any authority she has comes largely from her job. Otherwise, she draws the eye in a pretty-if-plain way. Definitely won't be running for mayor any time soon.


    @Jeen, this is where I need your ruling. Would it be okay to invest in Knowledge: Local Area? If it's not disallowed because we're new to the city, that makes sense. My hopes was Knowledge: Local Area & Intelligence 8 to enable more options when seeking situation (problem &) solutions, Sandbox style. If Knowledge: Local Area isn't allowed, I'll probably go back to Detect Lies again.


    So together,

    Spoiler: Camael, Mercurian of Redemption
    Show

    Camael, Mercurian of Redemption.

    Corporeal Forces: 2 (Strength 4 & Agility 4)
    Ethereal Forces: 3 (Intelligence 8 & Precision 4)
    Celestial Forces: 4 (Will 6 & Perception 10)

    Skills:

    Fast Talk: 4 Expert.
    Pistol: 3 Competent practitioner, professional. Necessary for Policeman.
    Knowledge: (Local Area) 3 Competent practitioner, professional. Necessary for Policeman.

    Attunement:

    Mercurian of Redemption choir attunement, free.

    Role: Police Officer, Level 3, Status 4. Cost: 6.

    Vessel: Level 3 vessel, Body Hits: 20, Charisma: 1. Cost: 11.

    Songs:

    Song of Harmony, Corporeal: 1
    Song of Harmony, Ethereal: 6.
    Song of Harmony, Celestial: 1
    Song of Ecstacy, Celestial: 1


    Spoiler: Picture
    Show
    [imgl]https://i.pinimg.com/736x/c7/20/00/c72000846339357de09ab50542945bb4--resident-evil-rebecca-chambers.jpg[/img]
    Last edited by JoyWonderLove; 2019-11-29 at 12:37 PM.

  29. - Top - End - #29
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    BardGuy

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    Default Re: [In Nomine] The City of Pentagram

    All in all, changes to the character sound good and I think will let you do a lot more of what you'd enjoy, from how you've described the concept.
    General Note on Resonances: I've found a TN of 9 is good for Resonances for them to succeed well enough. In the game I'm playing in, I have Perception 8 and it's annoying how often my Resonance fails due to it landing on a 9.

    One possible exception is your Role/Status. You can only have Status as high as the Rank of the role, since your financial backing and respect in the world (status) can't be 'more' than how real your role is to the world (rank). But maybe you meant Role 4/Status 3?
    (If what I'm saying doesn't make sense, perhaps attribute it to a cold and being tired. But I think I read that your Status is above the Rank of your Role.)

    EDIT: another potential issue is Song of Ecstasy. It's a secret song, that is, one known to just a few Superiors. I realize that, in the Big 16, I say not "restricted Songs", but I meant no "Secret Songs".
    However, I'm fine with Ecstasy. It's known by Andrealphus, Eli, and Novalis, though I'm sure Metanoia would have picked it up via some redeemed or as a former Servitor of Novalis. Also, it's not like it's one of the broken ones. Just note that, if you become known to have it, it could draw extra attention from Servitors of Lust. Though perhaps that's a handy thing, if you wanna redeem one.

    Quote Originally Posted by JoyWonderLove View Post
    @Jeen, this is where I need your ruling. Would it be okay to invest in Knowledge: Local Area? If it's not disallowed because we're new to the city, that makes sense. My hopes was Knowledge: Local Area & Intelligence 8 to enable more options when seeking situation (problem &) solutions, Sandbox style. If Knowledge: Local Area isn't allowed, I'll probably go back to Detect Lies again.
    I'm fine with Local Area.
    When granting a vessel, the Archangel instills certain knowledge. Most notably whatever knowledge comes with a Role, but also the local language. Hence why you don't have to spend points to be fluent in English despite angels not knowing it innately.
    With being moved to this city, it could make sense that Metanoia altered your knowledge to the local area. Just like if you were reassigned to Spain, you'd probably no longer know English but now know Spanish.

    Well, it's a bit of a stretch, since it's the same vessel, but a stretch I'm willing to handwave for the enjoyment of the game.

    That said, I plan to be somewhat lenient regarding skill usage (especially social or knowledge-based skills). I'd be fine with your Role's rank as allowing you knowledge about local crime- and police-related things. So you could roll Int + Police Officer Rank to find, say, a place where local drug dealers are known to stay or a back-alley medic. But if you want to branch out into things that would be beyond what your job would give you insights to, Local Knowledge is the way to do it.
    Last edited by JeenLeen; 2019-11-29 at 10:15 PM.

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    RedKnightGirl

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    Default Re: [In Nomine] The City of Pentagram

    Quote Originally Posted by JeenLeen View Post
    All in all, changes to the character sound good and I think will let you do a lot more of what you'd enjoy, from how you've described the concept. [Lots of insights]
    Well, Jeen, recover quick, and hopefully you feel great again soon. Taking care of three little ones must take energy, so I appreciate you taking time and being open-minded to my concept. That said, numbers and mechanics are not the part I like, and I keep thinking I should change and rechange things. Anyway, you've been great in helping me build it this far.

    @Mordar Hey, are you still with us? We have a potential detective and policeman, so really curious what your idea is, so we can build some connections.
    Last edited by JoyWonderLove; 2019-11-30 at 04:57 PM.

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