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  1. - Top - End - #241
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    AssassinGuy

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    Default Re: Gunnerkrigg Court 8: Thrown for a Loup

    "a higher power than ours"

    I guess the bird wasn't looking in Coyote's direction, or he was too far away, else Annie would have recognized him. The one panel with just Coyote in it doesn't have the thick corners, so it seems like a reasonable assumption.
    Awesome OOTS-style Fallout New Vegas avatar by Ceika. Or it was, before Photobucket started charging money.

    General nerd person. Mostly computer games and manga.

  2. - Top - End - #242
    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    RedWizardGuy

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    Default Re: Gunnerkrigg Court 8: Thrown for a Loup

    So it looks like this Kat is responsible for every sighting of the bird that the main characters have ever seen. But the only robot for it to make any appearance in front of was Seraph-13, who would have been too distracted to notice. Why would the court robots be aware of them for a long time and consider them a "mythical orthnithonic"? Is she going to make a second bird?

  3. - Top - End - #243
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    Flumph

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    Default Re: Gunnerkrigg Court 8: Thrown for a Loup

    Quote Originally Posted by JavaScribe View Post
    So it looks like this Kat is responsible for every sighting of the bird that the main characters have ever seen. But the only robot for it to make any appearance in front of was Seraph-13, who would have been too distracted to notice. Why would the court robots be aware of them for a long time and consider them a "mythical orthnithonic"? Is she going to make a second bird?
    Huh. It would have made more sense if she had other issues with hopping around either before or right after trying to get away from Zimmy.

  4. - Top - End - #244
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    ElfPirate

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    Default Re: Gunnerkrigg Court 8: Thrown for a Loup

    At the beginning of this Norns sequence, didn't they mention that she "usually" brings a remote to control the bird? This might not be the only time she does so. (Or it could be the only time, and the Norns are just viewing time wierdly).
    Quote Originally Posted by Darths & Droids
    When you combine the two most devious, sneaky, manipulative, underhanded, cunning, and diabolical forces in the known universe, the consequences can be world-shattering. Those forces are, of course, players and GMs.
    Quote Originally Posted by OgresAreCute View Post
    Realism, the natural predator of D&D mechanics.

  5. - Top - End - #245
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    AssassinGuy

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    Default Re: Gunnerkrigg Court 8: Thrown for a Loup

    I think we're supposed to infer that Kat will visit the Norns, multiple times, in the future for the purpose of sending more birds back. Even if a robot did spot the bird when it guided Kat's parents, I don't think that was far enough in the past for it to become a mythical thing.

    If so, the question is why?

    Maybe Kat is trying to learn about something that happened in the past of the Court. Or maybe she's trying to change something? Since the robots spotted the birds in the past, maybe she's...closing the loops?

    Or some time in the future Kat will go off the deep end and start messing with time, fully embracing her Angel status.
    Awesome OOTS-style Fallout New Vegas avatar by Ceika. Or it was, before Photobucket started charging money.

    General nerd person. Mostly computer games and manga.

  6. - Top - End - #246
    Firbolg in the Playground
     
    MindFlayer

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    Default Re: Gunnerkrigg Court 8: Thrown for a Loup

    What was the point of this chapter, or anything about the bird? I don't see why "Kat created the bird, and therefore we have to justify how it was there in the past" progressed the story at all. It's one of those things that doesn't at all feel like it was planned for and built up, it was added in as a plot point later and this is "fixing" a plot hole that that development causes, but I don't see what value the development added in the first place. I was expecting the Norns to be able to shed some light on the timelines that these two Annies came from and where the original Annie went, but somehow that's not time-related and so they can't.

  7. - Top - End - #247
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    AssassinGuy

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    Default Re: Gunnerkrigg Court 8: Thrown for a Loup

    Quote Originally Posted by Nettlekid View Post
    What was the point of this chapter, or anything about the bird? I don't see why "Kat created the bird, and therefore we have to justify how it was there in the past" progressed the story at all. It's one of those things that doesn't at all feel like it was planned for and built up, it was added in as a plot point later and this is "fixing" a plot hole that that development causes, but I don't see what value the development added in the first place. I was expecting the Norns to be able to shed some light on the timelines that these two Annies came from and where the original Annie went, but somehow that's not time-related and so they can't.
    Kat meeting the Norse goddesses of fate, finding out that they know her from the future, and borrowing their time pool is not a significant development?

    I get that the two Annies thing has been going on for almost two years, but this is just how Gunnerkrigg Court rolls. Ten years passed between Jeanne's introduction and the resolution of her plot.
    Awesome OOTS-style Fallout New Vegas avatar by Ceika. Or it was, before Photobucket started charging money.

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  8. - Top - End - #248
    Ettin in the Playground
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    Default Re: Gunnerkrigg Court 8: Thrown for a Loup

    End of the chapter and we still have no idea why Ys burred the bird.

  9. - Top - End - #249
    Firbolg in the Playground
     
    MindFlayer

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    Default Re: Gunnerkrigg Court 8: Thrown for a Loup

    Quote Originally Posted by Haruspex_Pariah View Post
    Kat meeting the Norse goddesses of fate, finding out that they know her from the future, and borrowing their time pool is not a significant development?

    I get that the two Annies thing has been going on for almost two years, but this is just how Gunnerkrigg Court rolls. Ten years passed between Jeanne's introduction and the resolution of her plot.
    I mean...no, it's not. Not unless this is the first step toward building something else to which the pool is significant, such as restoring Coyote from the past or something. It's certainly a "Big Deal" but it doesn't reflect any significant development of the plot. The birds being mechanical wasn't a mystery that needed solving until it was revealed that Kat was the one who built them, and that was only revealed as the setup to introduce this time pool, which (so far) was only introduced to close the plot hole of Kat being the one who invented the birds! The whole thing didn't need to happen.

  10. - Top - End - #250
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    AssassinGuy

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    Default Re: Gunnerkrigg Court 8: Thrown for a Loup

    Quote Originally Posted by Nettlekid View Post
    I mean...no, it's not. Not unless this is the first step toward building something else to which the pool is significant, such as restoring Coyote from the past or something.
    Well, there's the problem. In my understanding of the comic, Tom will randomly add elements like this and then leave things hanging while he abruptly jumps to something else. He'll resolve the hanging thread at some unspecified time, if ever. I'm perfectly cool with that. I don't think it's "bad" in any real sense, since IMHO the story runs on that sense of mystery and sudden twists.

    And there's certainly a place for "nothing" or breather chapters, I think. But then I watch a lot of anime, where filler comes with the territory.
    Awesome OOTS-style Fallout New Vegas avatar by Ceika. Or it was, before Photobucket started charging money.

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  11. - Top - End - #251
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    slayerx's Avatar

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    Default Re: Gunnerkrigg Court 8: Thrown for a Loup

    Quote Originally Posted by JavaScribe View Post
    So it looks like this Kat is responsible for every sighting of the bird that the main characters have ever seen. But the only robot for it to make any appearance in front of was Seraph-13, who would have been too distracted to notice. Why would the court robots be aware of them for a long time and consider them a "mythical orthnithonic"? Is she going to make a second bird?
    Ya that's one thing that's seriously missing from this. I actually was expecting her to send the bird back in time to see the seed bismuth; That would have dated the bird's first sighting to before the court. Add in some more cases of Kat spying on the past and you will get multiple sightings of the birds through history that would lead to the robots creating a mythology around them. Heck if Kat was using the birds to spy on important events then that would only make them seem even MORE mythical since they end up being sighted anytime something important happens.

    What was the point of this chapter, or anything about the bird? I don't see why "Kat created the bird, and therefore we have to justify how it was there in the past" progressed the story at all. It's one of those things that doesn't at all feel like it was planned for and built up, it was added in as a plot point later and this is "fixing" a plot hole that that development causes, but I don't see what value the development added in the first place. I was expecting the Norns to be able to shed some light on the timelines that these two Annies came from and where the original Annie went, but somehow that's not time-related and so they can't.
    Ya i kind of feel the same way... I mean the story makes for a somewhat interesting anecdote, but i was kind of expecting something more significant out of the birds than "Kat really cares about Annie". I also stand by my earlier annoyance with how these time travel shenanigans have played out as i feel like the time loop and alternate timelines lack an internal logic ajust don't make a whole lot of sense...

    One thing that bugs me is just how simple it all was because the Norns just GIVE Kat the chance to change the past. Kat didn't even have to give them a compelling reason since they just associate her with the previous Kats... there are TONS of people who would love the chance to change the past to save a loved one, so i think that alone ends up feeling like a weak reason for the Norns to help Kat in particular. Anja even points out how many people spent their whole lives trying to find a way to change the past; turns out they just didn't have the norn's phone number. I just feel like it would have been WAY more compelling if future Kat actually figured out how to alter time herself. THAT i think would have added a lot more weight to the birds


    Frankly i feel like what would have been a more satisfying development and made more sense is if future Kat had figured out how to mess with time herself. The first Kat did it to save annie, but other kats figured it out after they figure out what the first Kat did and end up using that power for other reasons(maybe our kat would try to figure it out to help fix the two annie problem). The birds seen in the court end up being different instances of a Kat looking into the past. The Kats would spy on the history of the court and inadvertently create a mythology around the bird. This even could even play into the already existing subplot of Kat possibly becoming divine. A very big and possibly scary future for Kat
    Last edited by slayerx; 2020-10-01 at 08:26 PM.

  12. - Top - End - #252
    Bugbear in the Playground
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    Default Re: Gunnerkrigg Court 8: Thrown for a Loup

    I think the biggest problem with this chapter that people seem to be having is that it lacks conflict. Like, they set a goal to send the bird back in time, then someone gives them the way to do it, and then they do it. They don't have to figure anything out, or overcome any obstacles, they just... do it.

    It lacks one of the primary components of storytelling, conflict, so that's why it feels weird to me. It's definitely a unique approach for the chapter and I wonder how it'll fit in in the overall story.

  13. - Top - End - #253
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    SolithKnightGuy

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    Default Re: Gunnerkrigg Court 8: Thrown for a Loup

    I think the entire point of this story is just to show Kats growth. She's on the path to being a deity and every now and then we do a check in to see how she's handling things she can't control or understand. In this chapter we saw her take a bit of knowledge that she couldn't understand and seek a path to accepting it (even though she still couldn't understand it). The resolution of the story is not some resolution of a major conflict - it's showing the depths that Kat is capable of going to in order to save her friend. It's another step along her journey.

  14. - Top - End - #254
    Troll in the Playground
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    Default Re: Gunnerkrigg Court 8: Thrown for a Loup

    I'm hoping there's not going to be a big "But-" here leading to breakup.

  15. - Top - End - #255
    Ettin in the Playground
     
    Lateral's Avatar

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    Default Re: Gunnerkrigg Court 8: Thrown for a Loup

    Quote Originally Posted by eee View Post
    I'm hoping there's not going to be a big "But-" here leading to breakup.
    This is exactly the vibe I've been getting from this whole chapter.

  16. - Top - End - #256
    Ettin in the Playground
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    Default Re: Gunnerkrigg Court 8: Thrown for a Loup

    And if it does end in a break-up, I hope the result isn't Paz hating the Annies for "taking Kat away from her."

  17. - Top - End - #257
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    ElfPirate

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    Default Re: Gunnerkrigg Court 8: Thrown for a Loup

    Quote Originally Posted by Lateral View Post
    This is exactly the vibe I've been getting from this whole chapter.
    Really? I'm not getting that impression at all. If one of them is planning to break up, they're remarkably happy about it, since it's been mostly smiles and hand-holding from the two of them.
    Quote Originally Posted by Darths & Droids
    When you combine the two most devious, sneaky, manipulative, underhanded, cunning, and diabolical forces in the known universe, the consequences can be world-shattering. Those forces are, of course, players and GMs.
    Quote Originally Posted by OgresAreCute View Post
    Realism, the natural predator of D&D mechanics.

  18. - Top - End - #258
    Troll in the Playground
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    Default Re: Gunnerkrigg Court 8: Thrown for a Loup

    And no break up. Thank goodness. But maybe a pirate ship attack.

  19. - Top - End - #259
    Troll in the Playground
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    Default Re: Gunnerkrigg Court 8: Thrown for a Loup

    OK, that's uh... that's uhhhh....

    Really pretty darned ominous.

  20. - Top - End - #260
    Ettin in the Playground
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    Default Re: Gunnerkrigg Court 8: Thrown for a Loup

    Last we heard the court was "done" with Zimmy.

  21. - Top - End - #261
    Orc in the Playground
     
    wingnutx's Avatar

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    Default Re: Gunnerkrigg Court 8: Thrown for a Loup

    Yay, Zimmy's back!

  22. - Top - End - #262
    Bugbear in the Playground
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    Default Re: Gunnerkrigg Court 8: Thrown for a Loup

    And tired judging by the nice big jawn!

  23. - Top - End - #263
    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    Clertar's Avatar

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    Default Re: Gunnerkrigg Court 8: Thrown for a Loup

    {scrubbed}
    Last edited by Peelee; 2020-11-05 at 11:05 AM.
    "Like the old proverb says, if one sees something not right, one must draw out his sword to intervene"

  24. - Top - End - #264
    Ettin in the Playground
     
    Chimera

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    Default Re: Gunnerkrigg Court 8: Thrown for a Loup

    Quote Originally Posted by Clertar View Post
    {scrub the post, scrub the quote}
    No, she just walked into a store for the first time this month and realized that it is wall-to-wall Christmas decorations.
    Last edited by Peelee; 2020-11-05 at 11:05 AM.

  25. - Top - End - #265
    Orc in the Playground
     
    wingnutx's Avatar

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    Default Re: Gunnerkrigg Court 8: Thrown for a Loup

    I had forgotten that Gunnerkrigg Court made an appearance in Girl Genius.

  26. - Top - End - #266
    Titan in the Playground
     
    Max_Killjoy's Avatar

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    Default Re: Gunnerkrigg Court 8: Thrown for a Loup

    Quote Originally Posted by wingnutx View Post
    I had forgotten that Gunnerkrigg Court made an appearance in Girl Genius.
    Same page has Buck Gadot, The Devil's Panties, Home on the Strange, Dominic Deagan, and Wapsi Square.

    Next page has Questionable Content, Freefall, and Shortpacked.
    It is one thing to suspend your disbelief. It is another thing entirely to hang it by the neck until dead.

    Verisimilitude -- n, the appearance or semblance of truth, likelihood, or probability.

    The concern is not realism in speculative fiction, but rather the sense that a setting or story could be real, fostered by internal consistency and coherence.

    The Worldbuilding Forum -- where realities are born.

  27. - Top - End - #267
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    Yuki Akuma's Avatar

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    Default Re: Gunnerkrigg Court 8: Thrown for a Loup

    Quote Originally Posted by Max_Killjoy View Post
    Same page has Buck Gadot, The Devil's Panties, Home on the Strange, Dominic Deagan, and Wapsi Square.

    Next page has Questionable Content, Freefall, and Shortpacked.
    Next page also has Order of the Stick, and I have no idea how you missed that.

    Also Bob the Angry Flower.
    Last edited by Yuki Akuma; 2020-11-06 at 12:13 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by archaeo View Post
    Man, this is just one of those things you see and realize, "I live in a weird and banal future."

  28. - Top - End - #268
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    Iruka's Avatar

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    Default Re: Gunnerkrigg Court 8: Thrown for a Loup

    Quote Originally Posted by Yuki Akuma View Post
    Next page also has Order of the Stick, and I have no idea how you missed that.

    Also Bob the Angry Flower.
    I would assume all of them are webcomics. Digger, Girls with Slingshots and Something Positive are also here.


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    Somebody should have that sigged.
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  29. - Top - End - #269
    Ettin in the Playground
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    Default Re: Gunnerkrigg Court 8: Thrown for a Loup

    Spoiler: Today's page
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    So is this Court Annie disguising herself as Forest Annie to try to connect with Anthony?

  30. - Top - End - #270
    Troll in the Playground
     
    GnomeWizardGuy

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    Default Re: Gunnerkrigg Court 8: Thrown for a Loup

    Quote Originally Posted by Iruka View Post
    I would assume all of them are webcomics. Digger, Girls with Slingshots and Something Positive are also here.
    One I never noticed before is "read Arcane Times", which turns out to be Cheyenne Wright's artist page.


    Spoiler: Today's page
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    And failing miserably.

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