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2020-05-01, 03:38 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Things You Never Noticed VII: Wait, This Isnt the MitD Thread?
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2020-05-02, 12:30 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Things You Never Noticed VII: Wait, This Isnt the MitD Thread?
Something I hadn't realized initially (which I'm sure others had noticed): MITD apparently doesn't leave tracks in the snow when painting the doors
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2020-05-02, 05:34 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Mar 2014
Re: Things You Never Noticed VII: Wait, This Isnt the MitD Thread?
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2020-05-03, 06:29 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Mar 2019
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Re: Things You Never Noticed VII: Wait, This Isnt the MitD Thread?
Julio is so focused on defense that he hasn't drawn blood - leading him to only do so when Tarquin starts to put his attention on Elan again.
An explanation of why MitD being any larger than Huge is implausible.
See my extended signature here! May contain wit, candor, and somewhere from 52 to 8127 walruses.
Purple is humorous descriptions made up on the fly
Green is serious talk about hypothetical
Blue is irony and sarcasm
"I think, therefore I am,
I walk, therefore I stand,
I sleep, therefore I dream;
I joke, therefore I meme."
-Squire Doodad
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2020-05-03, 09:02 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Aug 2009
Re: Things You Never Noticed VII: Wait, This Isnt the MitD Thread?
I'm a bit late in responding (less than two months though), but do we know Dvalin ascended to demigodhood during this world? If not, it's possible there were more ties during Godsmoots in previous worlds, back when Hel had clerics.
After writing the above out but before submitting it, I remembered that one of the high priests brings snacks because they were there for the previous tie. So even if Dvalin didn't ascend during this world, there has been at least one other tie during this world's tenure.
Also, Rubyrock's explanation that the Council of Clans still exists, but is not the current Dwarven government makes it sound (to me, anyhow) like the Council of Clans has existed continuously since Dvalin was mortal, which precludes him being a holdover from a previous world, but I suppose it's possible that a previous world also had a dwarven council of clans.
Or...going further out on the limb of the barely-plausible, maybe the mortal predecessor of Dvalin never actually swore such an oath: maybe prior to this world, Dvalin would vote however he liked. But in this world, the dwarves are more honorable than in previous worlds (because Thor told them about the bet), and so they believe that their ascendent former king would be just as honorable as them. Since gods are shaped by belief, Dvalin changed his behavior accordingly. The dwarves' belief also alterted Dvalin's memories of how he voted during previous worlds to match the justification he gave at the Moot.
Note: I make no claim that my hypothesis in the previous paragraph is likely, but I do not immediately see a way in which it can be completely ruled out using the text of the comic.
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2020-05-03, 09:17 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Feb 2013
Re: Things You Never Noticed VII: Wait, This Isnt the MitD Thread?
We really can't say anything, because anything people believe about Dvalin could've been baked in to the world's metaphysics when the place was created. For all we know, Dvalin's been around for the last 50,000 worlds.
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2020-05-03, 09:17 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Things You Never Noticed VII: Wait, This Isnt the MitD Thread?
I can't recall if it's confirmed or just implied, but I took that to mean the former. Dvalin is probably from this world.
Not all gods make it through the interim period, so a demigod is less likely to have survived. Especially since the last batch of Northerners were apparently quite different from this one.An explanation of why MitD being any larger than Huge is implausible.
See my extended signature here! May contain wit, candor, and somewhere from 52 to 8127 walruses.
Purple is humorous descriptions made up on the fly
Green is serious talk about hypothetical
Blue is irony and sarcasm
"I think, therefore I am,
I walk, therefore I stand,
I sleep, therefore I dream;
I joke, therefore I meme."
-Squire Doodad
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2020-05-03, 09:21 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Dec 2009
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- Washington D.C.
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Re: Things You Never Noticed VII: Wait, This Isnt the MitD Thread?
That the Dark One might not be about to survive the transition to a new world, despite being an ascended full God with an entire race solely devoted to him, means that Dvalin is almost certainly from this world.
Not to mention he's the first king of the dwarves, so they presumably have a list going back to him. And, given that they never knew of previous worlds, that lost would be pretty airtight.Last edited by Peelee; 2020-05-04 at 09:00 AM.
Cuthalion's art is the prettiest art of all the art. Like my avatar.
Number of times Roland St. Jude has sworn revenge upon me: 2
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2020-05-03, 09:26 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Mar 2019
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Re: Things You Never Noticed VII: Wait, This Isnt the MitD Thread?
Last edited by Squire Doodad; 2020-05-03 at 09:36 PM.
An explanation of why MitD being any larger than Huge is implausible.
See my extended signature here! May contain wit, candor, and somewhere from 52 to 8127 walruses.
Purple is humorous descriptions made up on the fly
Green is serious talk about hypothetical
Blue is irony and sarcasm
"I think, therefore I am,
I walk, therefore I stand,
I sleep, therefore I dream;
I joke, therefore I meme."
-Squire Doodad
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2020-05-03, 09:45 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Jul 2019
Re: Things You Never Noticed VII: Wait, This Isnt the MitD Thread?
Isn't Arthur "supposed" to be the First King of Britain in a way though? Like he was supposedly the first king to rule over all of Britain (historically I'm pretty sure this wouldn't be accurate in any way but most of King Arthur is so wildly and clearly ahistorical this doesn't really matter)?
Arrrgh, here be me extended sig!
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2020-05-03, 09:54 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Mar 2019
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Re: Things You Never Noticed VII: Wait, This Isnt the MitD Thread?
An explanation of why MitD being any larger than Huge is implausible.
See my extended signature here! May contain wit, candor, and somewhere from 52 to 8127 walruses.
Purple is humorous descriptions made up on the fly
Green is serious talk about hypothetical
Blue is irony and sarcasm
"I think, therefore I am,
I walk, therefore I stand,
I sleep, therefore I dream;
I joke, therefore I meme."
-Squire Doodad
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2020-05-03, 10:09 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jul 2019
Re: Things You Never Noticed VII: Wait, This Isnt the MitD Thread?
I think Uther had a couple rival kings that Arthur defeated? But I'm not sure and that might just be me coming up with something for no reason whatsoever.
But yeah, Arthurian legend is very conflicting, especially because writers can't decide if they want to say that any of the story is real or not.
EDIT: Also, just realized that you just came back today, no wonder I hadn't noticed your sig during my "Read every post on the whole board" thing in awhile.Last edited by Schroeswald; 2020-05-03 at 10:18 PM.
Arrrgh, here be me extended sig!
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2020-05-04, 06:46 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Feb 2007
Re: Things You Never Noticed VII: Wait, This Isnt the MitD Thread?
The notion of "many petty kings, ruled over by a high king" certainly has some precedent in Welsh history as well as Welsh mythology (Arthurian mythos originating from Wales).
However, the earliest iterations of Arthur, tend not to put him in that position - and suggest he may be a "leader of battles" (a general, basically) who led the armies on behalf of the kings.Marut-2 Avatar by Serpentine
New Marut Avatar by Linkele
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2020-05-04, 07:01 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Jan 2012
Re: Things You Never Noticed VII: Wait, This Isnt the MitD Thread?
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2020-05-04, 08:10 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Aug 2007
Re: Things You Never Noticed VII: Wait, This Isnt the MitD Thread?
You may be thinking of this early strip.
Grey WolfInterested in MitD? Join us in MitD's thread.There is a world of imagination
Deep in the corners of your mind
Where reality is an intruder
And myth and legend thrive
Ceterum autem censeo Hilgya malefica est
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2020-05-04, 09:02 AM (ISO 8601)
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2020-05-04, 09:12 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Aug 2007
Re: Things You Never Noticed VII: Wait, This Isnt the MitD Thread?
Maybe not in the specifics, but on the broad sense, it is true that being part of a pantheon means you share the load - Thor stories of beating Loki gives him worship and belief, but also gives Loki belief, and the same is true about Loki stories - sure, they promote him (worship), but increases the belief across the whole pantheon, since the stories will involve the other gods, sooner or later. Heck, that has to be part of how Hel is surviving, since she lacks the priests to instill belief in her - she's dependent on every other priest of the North painting her as the Death god. But none of those stories involve the DO, so he gets none of the belief.
Grey WolfLast edited by Grey_Wolf_c; 2020-05-04 at 09:23 AM.
Interested in MitD? Join us in MitD's thread.There is a world of imagination
Deep in the corners of your mind
Where reality is an intruder
And myth and legend thrive
Ceterum autem censeo Hilgya malefica est
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2020-05-04, 09:23 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Things You Never Noticed VII: Wait, This Isnt the MitD Thread?
Fair point, but TDO still has all goblinoid belief regardless, and a fair share of fervent worship that is undivided.
I see no reason to believe Dvalin is not from this world. The elven gods we don't really know anything about, IIRC; are they demigods that only the elves really worship but were otherwise always in place, like Thrym or Surtur? Were they elves who ascended and became demigods? Don't know (and if we do know, I don't remember). In any event, I would contend that any ascended demigodCuthalion's art is the prettiest art of all the art. Like my avatar.
Number of times Roland St. Jude has sworn revenge upon me: 2
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2020-05-04, 09:42 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Mar 2019
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Re: Things You Never Noticed VII: Wait, This Isnt the MitD Thread?
An explanation of why MitD being any larger than Huge is implausible.
See my extended signature here! May contain wit, candor, and somewhere from 52 to 8127 walruses.
Purple is humorous descriptions made up on the fly
Green is serious talk about hypothetical
Blue is irony and sarcasm
"I think, therefore I am,
I walk, therefore I stand,
I sleep, therefore I dream;
I joke, therefore I meme."
-Squire Doodad
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2020-05-04, 09:43 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Nov 2009
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Re: Things You Never Noticed VII: Wait, This Isnt the MitD Thread?
Spoiler: Start of DarknessI never noticed why Rat is furious (1143): in SoD 42, he informs The Dark One about the Gates, and he is described as one of his few allies. So he had more reason than the rest of the Twelve to be angered by the Dark One's High Priest destroying Azure City.Originally Posted by J.R.R. Tolkien, 1955
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2020-05-04, 09:44 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Mar 2019
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Re: Things You Never Noticed VII: Wait, This Isnt the MitD Thread?
An explanation of why MitD being any larger than Huge is implausible.
See my extended signature here! May contain wit, candor, and somewhere from 52 to 8127 walruses.
Purple is humorous descriptions made up on the fly
Green is serious talk about hypothetical
Blue is irony and sarcasm
"I think, therefore I am,
I walk, therefore I stand,
I sleep, therefore I dream;
I joke, therefore I meme."
-Squire Doodad
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2020-05-04, 09:45 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Aug 2017
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Re: Things You Never Noticed VII: Wait, This Isnt the MitD Thread?
It seems to me that being in a pantheon is an effective survival tactic, if one’s worshipping base is split between several gods like the humans are but as it limits infighting between worshippers. Sure the priests of Loki and Thor aren’t happy about each other but on the whole the various temples of the northern gods are unlikely to try to drive out the competition from their territory when said competition is part of the pantheon and more likely to band together if some hot new cult tried to move on their turf. But since the Dark One is apprently the only one trying to get goblin worship, that’s no issue for him.
The Dark One (and Banjo) is the only god for whom we have an estimate of apotheosis and only the gods shown in the beginning of Shojo’s flashback (Odin, Marduk, Dragon, Thor, the Eastern Pantheon and a couple others) are certified as being there before the worlds. Surtur and Thrym might be ascended Giants for all we know.Forum Wisdom
Mage avatar by smutmulch & linklele.
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2020-05-04, 10:15 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Things You Never Noticed VII: Wait, This Isnt the MitD Thread?
They could indeed. But then why are there so few demigods? Given the uncountable worlds that have existed, even if only one in a million got a mortal to become a demigod, that would still work out to thousands, if not millions, of potential demigods variously. The two simplest answers to this are:
A.) apotheosis even to demigod state is so rare that it's practically unheard of - an answer which also assumes that Dvalin, First King of the Dwarves, who swore an oath to always abide by the will of the council.... wasn't, and didn't, which I am not a fan of - or
2.) demigods don't survive the transition to the new world.Cuthalion's art is the prettiest art of all the art. Like my avatar.
Number of times Roland St. Jude has sworn revenge upon me: 2
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2020-05-04, 10:46 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Things You Never Noticed VII: Wait, This Isnt the MitD Thread?
3) Pantheons only help a mortal achieve godhood when it is in their interest to do so. For example Dvalin may have been sponsored because Thor felt the need for the dwarves to have an ethnic god to help shoulder his burden of shield them from the Bet and when the mortal Dvalin died and the opportunity prensented itself he got enough relatives on-board with the idea.
Forum Wisdom
Mage avatar by smutmulch & linklele.
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2020-05-04, 10:57 AM (ISO 8601)
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2020-05-04, 11:01 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Things You Never Noticed VII: Wait, This Isnt the MitD Thread?
Last edited by Peelee; 2020-05-04 at 11:03 AM.
Cuthalion's art is the prettiest art of all the art. Like my avatar.
Number of times Roland St. Jude has sworn revenge upon me: 2
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2020-05-04, 11:36 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Things You Never Noticed VII: Wait, This Isnt the MitD Thread?
I think we have seen part of the process to become a demigod: one of the believers contacts the clergy of a pantheon and asks for the "godling" to be admitted. If the gods agree and the request isn't retired, the godling becomes a demigod. In the case of the Northern Gods, the chief god (Odin) seems to have a special interest in new applications... or maybe just in puppets. https://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0137.html
We also know what gods need to survive and that new gods may not make it through world iterations. https://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots1144.htmlOriginally Posted by J.R.R. Tolkien, 1955
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2020-05-04, 12:15 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Things You Never Noticed VII: Wait, This Isnt the MitD Thread?
Cuthalion's art is the prettiest art of all the art. Like my avatar.
Number of times Roland St. Jude has sworn revenge upon me: 2
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2020-05-04, 01:17 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Things You Never Noticed VII: Wait, This Isnt the MitD Thread?
Forum Wisdom
Mage avatar by smutmulch & linklele.
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2020-05-04, 01:26 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Things You Never Noticed VII: Wait, This Isnt the MitD Thread?
Warhammer 40,000 Campaign Skirmish Game: Warpstrike
My Spelljammer stuff (including an orbit tracker), 2E AD&D spreadsheet, and Vault of the Drow maps are available in my Dropbox. Feel free to use or not use it as you see fit!
Thri-Kreen Ranger/Psionicist by me, based off of Rich's A Monster for Every Season