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  1. - Top - End - #241
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    rogue_alchemist's Avatar

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    Default Re: Mafia Capital (WWC XIII): Important Info Here -- READ OPENING POSTS!

    Don't feel you have to leave just because you are a lurker, we welcome lurking until something catches your interest, but I also know that reading through everything can get daunting. If you do leave, good luck in your future endeavors!

  2. - Top - End - #242
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    Default Re: Mafia Capital (WWC XIII): Important Info Here -- READ OPENING POSTS!

    Quote Originally Posted by BasketOfPuppies View Post
    So Ive been lurking since my last game, but I think that Im about ready to head out of the Playground. Yall have fun.
    Hey, same on the lurking thing! I wish you all the best in wherever the future brings you. Who knows, maybe it'll bring you a basket of puppies.
    Avatar made by Bradakhan| Other avatars.
    Spoiler: Quotes
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    Quote Originally Posted by TFT on quicktopic
    Oh no, Duck999 is a mason.

    How can I possibly suspect you of being a wolf now? :(

    :P
    Quote Originally Posted by Legato Endless View Post
    Duck: Mason. A really shifty mason, but a confirmed role nonetheless.

    Slii: Slii is town. He looks better than Duck even with that mason claim.

  3. - Top - End - #243
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    Default Re: Mafia Capital (WWC XIII): Important Info Here -- READ OPENING POSTS!

    I'll miss you, Puppies!
    Spoiler: Quotes
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zar Peter View Post
    Supagoof took the most blows and incidentally took exactly the same damage Xihirli inflicted.
    Quote Originally Posted by Silent_Interim View Post
    Xihirli: Being a better target since 2015.
    Quote Originally Posted by Elenna View Post
    Xihirli, bastion of murder and betrayal.
    Quote Originally Posted by BasketOfPuppies View Post
    Wow I missed a lot today. So, kill Xihirli?
    Quote Originally Posted by AvatarVecna View Post
    Nobody else is gonna be right behind me, right now. Only Xihirli.
    Quote Originally Posted by Rogan View Post
    If Xi and I agree some more, I will start to doubt my own alignment!
    Quote Originally Posted by flat_footed View Post
    I still prefer to see you as the dagger hanging over us all, Xi.

  4. - Top - End - #244
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    BardGuy

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    Default Re: Mafia Capital (WWC XIII): Important Info Here -- READ OPENING POSTS!

    Sorry to lose a good player, BoP!

    Questions about my upcoming game

    I'm debating a few things about my upcoming game (not the next one now, but probably in January sometime). For those of you interested in playing, I'd like to know a few preferences to try to increase the player count.
    Some background: cult-game with some powered characters but mostly vanilla. Unless we have a lot of players, starting with 1 Cultist but their power prevents a D1 Town wins. (It's not a "survives first death", but similar, kinda.)
    I'm doing no private communication between townies as the default.
    Day Phase ends with killing the lynchee. Night phase folk use powers (if any) and cult has to convert someone. (If the cult is entirely inactive, I'll use RNG to convert someone.)

    Questions
    1. Would you prefer the potential power roles be declared ahead of time?
    2. If yes to #1, would you like full descriptions of their powers or just hints?
    3. If yes to #1, would you like me to state which ones make it into the final game?

    4. What do you think of a Town power role that allows 2-3 people to make a QuickTopic? Will probably be able to use watch/track power instead, in case doesn't feel like networking.
    5. What do you think of the Cult knowing who is Cult, but not being able to communicate privately?
    6. What do you think of a Town power that is effectively being a Spy? That is, if converted, they learn some about the Cult (and, if it has a QT, join it), but are really Town. I think this would only be feasible if the Cult can kill itself (akin to Aventine's Witch Hunt game) or the Cult doesn't have a QuickTopic, so that there's a risk to the Spy just publicly declaring who's a cultist.
    If a Spy-type role exists, I think it's only fair to state it exists before game starts, even if the details about other power roles are hidden.

    7. For a cult game, what's the opinion on a town vigilante power and/or a serial killer role? (SK probably only if a fair number of players. Considering a serial killer and survivor neutrals.)

  5. - Top - End - #245
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    WhiteWizardGirl

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    Default Re: Mafia Capital (WWC XIII): Important Info Here -- READ OPENING POSTS!

    Regarding roles, I'm sure you're aware of my preferences toward open formats and against putting pro-Town players into the Scum QT - particularly when the latter is done unannounced.

    A Spy role which appears to be converted but instead remains pro-Town, or one which does that but also learns the identity of 1-2 Cult members seems fine. But if you just tell them the identities of everyone who's a cultist, they're just going to announce who all the cultists are. And if you give them access to the cult QT, they're just going to post the cult QT to the thread.

    A possibly interesting variation on night communication would be to have no QTs, BUT to allow the most senior surviving cultist to send a single one way message to the entire cult, sent in and relayed through the GM once the conversion vote resolves. If there's a Spy, they do get access to this message but do not convert.

    I think that including a serial killer in a cult game would require a very large number of players. A vigilante would require slightly fewer people, but raises the question of what happens if the vigilante is converted - do they retain the ability to kill?

  6. - Top - End - #246
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    Valmark's Avatar

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    Default Re: Mafia Capital (WWC XIII): Important Info Here -- READ OPENING POSTS!

    What ways does Town have to stop conversions?

    By this I mean that, assuming one lynch each day and one conversion each night, the Cult inevitably wins so Town needs valid means to prevent conversions/lynch faster then conversions happen.

    I feel like the question about SK/Vigilante hinges heavily on that.
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  7. - Top - End - #247
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    BardGuy

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    Default Re: Mafia Capital (WWC XIII): Important Info Here -- READ OPENING POSTS!

    Quote Originally Posted by Grek View Post
    A possibly interesting variation on night communication would be to have no QTs, BUT to allow the most senior surviving cultist to send a single one way message to the entire cult, sent in and relayed through the GM once the conversion vote resolves. If there's a Spy, they do get access to this message but do not convert.
    I really like that idea.
    My original thought process was no group QTs (except via one power role's power), and the Spy-type learns the name of 1 Cultist when converted.
    Each Cultist gets to vote nightly on who to convert, with the concensus winning. The Spy's vote would count.

    But the idea of the senior cultist being able to send a message sounds good. Allows some coordination, but not a ton. I might allow every cultist to post a message to their QT that will be shared with everyone -- basically emulating the Cult being able to sneak away to chat for a minute, but not being able to do big discussion.

    Quote Originally Posted by Grek
    I think that including a serial killer in a cult game would require a very large number of players. A vigilante would require slightly fewer people, but raises the question of what happens if the vigilante is converted - do they retain the ability to kill?
    Quote Originally Posted by Valmark View Post
    What ways does Town have to stop conversions?

    By this I mean that, assuming one lynch each day and one conversion each night, the Cult inevitably wins so Town needs valid means to prevent conversions/lynch faster then conversions happen.

    I feel like the question about SK/Vigilante hinges heavily on that.
    Those are good points, and something I hadn't really considered until last night.

    Of the roles I'm envisioning, one would include something like a voider/protector who could stop conversions if they target the right person that night. The vigilante could kill someone, obviously. Also a seer-type to see faction-alignment. If a powered-town is converted, their power changes slightly. I'm thinking a Vigilante (night-kill) becomes a Beast (e.g., if they get lynched, they take a townie with them).

    If a Survivor makes it into the game, they have several 1-use powers, including a void/protect-esque one and probably a kill.
    If a Serial Killer, well, obviously they can eliminate cultists.

    But I highly doubt the game would be big enough to include neutrals. So let's just assume no neutrals.
    So how can game win if 1 lynch per Day? With my current setup: only really if the vigilante or the protector get lucky, which isn't fair.

    I've never seen a cult game before the current one. (Yeah, AV's Cats one had a cult element, but it was a sideline and so unlucky nothing really happened with it.) How do cult games normally work?
    Do the Town normally die if lynched? I could see following RA's game in that you only die if you are cult.

  8. - Top - End - #248
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    Valmark's Avatar

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    Default Re: Mafia Capital (WWC XIII): Important Info Here -- READ OPENING POSTS!

    I have no notable experience with cult games personally, so I can't suggest anything from experience, but this seems useful advice until more experienced users give insight.
    Last edited by Valmark; 2020-12-16 at 12:14 PM.
    I won an argument with my GM -15/08/2017- (20:32 GMT +1)

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  9. - Top - End - #249
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    BardGuy

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    Default Re: Mafia Capital (WWC XIII): Important Info Here -- READ OPENING POSTS!

    Quote Originally Posted by Valmark View Post
    I have no notable experience with cult games personally, so I can't suggest anything from experience, but this seems useful advice until more experienced users give insight.
    Thanks. I should use that website more when designing a game.
    I could see having the Cult Leader be the only one with an actual conversion power, so the cultists effectively become like "Aliens" if their leader dies. I was planning on altering (and slightly powering-up) the abilities of powered townies if converted. If I go that route, I'll probably have the vigilante retain their kill ability if converted.

    If I do that...
    My original idea for Cult Leader was that their was "you cannot die until someone has been recruited to the cult". So if lynched D1 or night-killed N1, nothing happens since no conversion occurred yet, but they could be lynched D2 or killed N2. At least unless the conversion N1 was blocked, in which case the immunity sticks.
    I could see this causing the (in my eyes, humorous) thing of them getting lynched D1 and then D2 basically being a waste of time as they are lynched again. Actually, that sounds less funny as I say it, so I'd probably ask everyone if they want to skip to the next Night... but then it's just All Town vs. 1 weak cultist. Blargh... that website is right that cults are hard to balance.
    Maybe I'll alter it to "you survive one kill". That way the cult should at least get a couple people before getting beheaded.

  10. - Top - End - #250
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    GreenSorcererElf

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    Default Re: Mafia Capital (WWC XIII): Important Info Here -- READ OPENING POSTS!

    Witchhunt has a lot of things contributing to the spy not being an insane and game-breaking role. And it still leaves the game's balance precarious and awkward. I would probably avoid using one here, personally.

    If you're going with mostly vanilla and a few power roles, then I'd argue for open setup.

  11. - Top - End - #251
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    ElfRogueGirl

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    Default Re: Mafia Capital (WWC XIII): Important Info Here -- READ OPENING POSTS!

    @AV based on what happened in The Thing, I'm presuming PoR isn't going to be running their game, so you can probably start recruitment for yours? Or wait until after Christmas, maybe.
    I'm Chaotic Good! Ish!

  12. - Top - End - #252
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    AvatarVecna's Avatar

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    Default Re: Mafia Capital (WWC XIII): Important Info Here -- READ OPENING POSTS!

    The Thing has ended in scum victory.

    Quote Originally Posted by Elenna View Post
    @AV based on what happened in The Thing, I'm presuming PoR isn't going to be running their game, so you can probably start recruitment for yours? Or wait until after Christmas, maybe.
    I'll PM them, and give it a few days. I know they're active on the forum, but if I don't get a response, they'll be pushed back on the list.


    Currently Recruiting WW/Mafia: Unavenger's "UPick 2: Pick Harder"

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  13. - Top - End - #253
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    Default Re: Mafia Capital (WWC XIII): Important Info Here -- READ OPENING POSTS!

    Per POR's PM'd reply, they have been moved back in the schedule, and my game has moved up as a result. Smugglers And Scallywags is open for recruitment.


    Currently Recruiting WW/Mafia: Unavenger's "UPick 2: Pick Harder"

    Avatar by AsteriskAmp

    Aspiring optimizers can try their luck in Zinc Saucier XXXIX: Hoist The Colors High

    Quote Originally Posted by Maat Mons View Post
    Everyone knows Wizards only become adventurers because it's the fastest way to get more Wizard levels.

  14. - Top - End - #254
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    BardGuy

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    Default Re: Mafia Capital (WWC XIII): Important Info Here -- READ OPENING POSTS!

    Due to the complexities and difficulties of balancing a cult game, I asked and some of you gave me feedback. Thinking about it, I'm going with an open (e.g., all roles declared) game. Below is a draft. Any comments welcome.

    I'm particularly worried about the Survivor being too strong, but it seems doubtful we'll have a 16-player game lately anyhow.

    Spoiler: current draft Burning Hate game
    Show

    Pelor Cult

    The village of Smallhaven is a small haven from the dangers of the neighboring forests and mountains. It is a small farming village, with a simple mill and temple for Pelor. Usually, nothing of importance happens here.
    However, there is a major church council meeting happening in a major city down the road, and rumors are that one of the high priests of Pelor is going there to help discredit the heresy of the Burning Hate. Normally that would only mean a feast one night to host the traveling clergy, maybe seeing some awesome magic, but it seems that a priest of the Burning Hate has infiltrated the town. Their goal: to spread their belief, such that the town is able to kill the high priest and prevent him from reaching the council.

    But nobody knows who the heretic is.

    Rules

    During the Day Phase, everyone votes. The person with the most votes at the end of the day is killed. In the case of a tie, a person is randomly chosen.

    During the Night Phase, those with powers can use them. This includes the potential of the cult converting someone to the cult.

    Each player has an individual QuickTopic.
    The Cult has a QuickTopic where they can communicate. The Cult can only talk amongst itself at Night, with the exception that a new convert may make one post in the QuickTopic during the Day. (Try to keep editing it to a minimum.)

    Power Roles

    If there are 10 players, the game will start with 1 Cultists, 4 power Town roles (Town Guard, Healer, Elder, and Town Gossip), and the rest as vanilla town. Less players may mean less power Town roles.
    If there are 14 players, a Serial Killer (neutral) will be added.
    If there are 16 players, a Survivor (neutral) and True Believer (Town) will be added.

    The game starts with 1 Cultist.

    High Priest -- the High Priest of Pelor the Burning Hate. Each night, you must visit someone and convert them to your faith.
    The first time you would die, you do not die. A note is made publicly that "<name> should have died, but did not." This immunity persists if you have failed to convert anyone to the cult.


    Town Guard -- you protect the town from the dangers of the wilds, and you'll try to use your skill to protect from heresy at any cost. Each night, you can target someone and kill them.
    If converted, you become the Fanatic. Each night, you can target someone and kill them; the High Priest cannot convert someone on a night you use this power. If you are lynched, you randomly kill someone who voted for you. (This can kill a fellow cultist who voted you.)

    Healer -- each night, you can protect someone to heal them if they are injured and thus block a night-kill. If you block a night-kill, a note is made publicly that "<name> should have died, but did not." If the person you targeted was targeted for conversion, you learn they were targeted for conversion, but not if it succeeded or not nor who targeted them.
    If converted, you become the Alchemist, making potions to influence people. Each night, you can target someone and either protect them from being killed or prevent them from taking any actions. (In other words, you can bane or void someone.) If you block a night-kill, a note is made publicly that "<name> should have died, but did not." If you void somebody, they are not aware of it (e.g., no special feedback) -- but may realize something happened, such as if the Town Guard fails to kill who they targeted but no text says a bane occurred.

    Elder -- you know the village and the nature of souls. Each night, you can target on someone and learn their alignment (Town, Cult, or Neutral).
    If converted, you become the Prophet. Each night, you can target someone and learn their alignment and role (e.g., Town Gossip, Survivor.)

    Town Gossip -- you know how to sneak and spy, as well as how to discretely talk. Each night, you can use one of these powers
    -you can target someone and see who targets them
    -you can target someone and see who they target
    -you can create a QuickTopic for two people (it can include yourself or be two others). If you pick two others, you can see the QuickTopic but are not allowed to write in it. (This counts as targeting the two people you pick.)
    If converted, you become the Spymaster. Each night, you can use one of these powers
    -you can target someone. You see who targets them, and who they target.
    -the same QuickTopic power as above, but you are allowed to write in QTs with two other players. (If converted, this permission-to-write is retroactively given to any extant QTs.)

    True Believer -- your faith in Pelor is pure, and you cannot be converted to the cult. If targeted for conversion, the cult is told "<name> cannot be converted because he is Neutral." If you are targeted for conversion, you receive the message, "You were targeted for conversion." If there are at least two cultists, you also learn the name of the High Priest. (By implication, if you are targeted but do not learn who the High Priest is, you know there is only 1 cultist.)

    Survivor -- you only care about number one and about lasting through this ordeal. Fortunately, you have a few tricks to help you.
    Each night, you can use one of these powers. You can use each power only once per game.
    -block somebody from being targeted for the night, by spending the night talking to them. This prevents kills, conversions, and any other targeting. The person targeted receives a message "<Survivor's name> spent the night talking with you." If someone did target that person, you receive the message "<target name> was busy talking all night with somebody."
    -target someone and see who they target
    -target someone and see who targets them
    -bane yourself. If you would have died, a note is made publicly that "<name> should have died, but did not."
    If you are targeted for conversion, you receive message "You were targeted for conversion." The cult is told "<name> cannot be converted because he is Neutral."
    You win when the game ends, if you are alive. E.g., if there is a Town, Cult, or Serial Killer win.

    Serial Killer -- You live for killing, and with the fear about the cult, now is your chance. Kill them all! Well, you can let that one loner stay alive; he's cool enough.
    If the Survivor is in the game, you start the game knowing who the Survivor is.
    Each night, target someone and kill them.
    You win when all Town and Cult are dead.
    If you are targeted for conversion, you receive message "You were targeted for conversion." The cult is told "<name> cannot be converted because he is Neutral."


    Clarification Notes and Power Interactions

    If you have an information-gathering power (watch, track, seer) and are somehow stopped, you receive "No information." If you watch/track someone and they do no action, you receive "<target> was not targeted, other than by you" or "<target> did not target anyone."

    If the Town Gossip/Spymaster use the QuickTopic power and any person targeted is blocked by the Survivor, the power fails for the night. The Town Gossip/Spymaster gets the message to learn which person they targeted was targeted by the Survivor.
    If the Town Gossip/Spymaster is itself blocked, they receive no special feedback but the lack of a QT being generated will make it obvious the power failed.
    If the Town Gossip/Spymaster targets two other players, but one of them dies the same night, the QT is still created.
    No using fake names or aliases when writing in QuickTopics. AvatarVecna can use AV, but shouldn't use Some Person or Town Gossip.
    No posting QT links, either publicly or in other QTs. EXCEPTION: the Spymaster may post QT links in the Cult QT to share it with the cult.

    If the High Priest dies, no more cultists can be made. But the Fanatic can still kill even if the High Priest is dead.

    The High Priest's conversion attempt is not optional. The only way to forgo doing it is to have the Fanatic do a kill instead. If the High Priest player does not choose a target, the Narrator will randomly pick one.

    For timing: the conversion happens last, most importantly after night-kills. (So a High Priest targeted with a NK on N1 will always survive.) EXCEPTION: if the Elder targets someone who is being converted, they learn the person was converted that night.
    Voids happen first.
    If two voiders (Alchemist, Survivor) somehow interact in a way that would create an infinite loop of who-stops-who, the Alchemist "wins".


    edit: two additional clarifications
    1. The Gossip's QTs can be used during the Night or Day.
    2. The thing with the High Priest's death-immunity is basically to make sure at least one convert gets made before the Priest dies. If they make a convert without dying, they still have the 'extra life'. But, if for example, they get lynched D1, their extra life is gone. The next time they would die, after making a convert, they don't.
    That does mean they could survive the lynch D1, survive a NK D1 (since no convert yet), make their convert, then get lynched D2 and die (since they had a convert so their immunity doesn't persist.)
    But if they survive D1 fine, survive N1 fine and make a convert, then get lynched D2, they survive, but are no longer immune since at least one convert exists so they could be NKed N2. But their power would still activate and they'd get a conversion N2.
    If by some chance their conversion keeps failing night after night, they would survive until they make a convert. That's part of why I made a conversion attempt mandatory.
    I hope it's straightforward and these clarifications actually clarify instead of clouding the issue.


    Spoiler: revised stuff I plan to post when I make my game
    Show



    Pelor Cult

    The village of Smallhaven is a small haven from the dangers of the neighboring forests and mountains. It is a small farming village, with a simple mill and temple for Pelor. Usually, nothing of importance happens here.
    However, there is a major church council meeting happening in a major city down the road, and rumors are that one of the high priests of Pelor is going there to help discredit the heresy of the Burning Hate. Normally that would only mean a feast one night to host the traveling clergy, maybe seeing some awesome magic, but it seems that a priest of the Burning Hate has infiltrated the town. Their goal: to spread their belief, such that the town is able to kill the high priest and prevent him from reaching the council.

    But nobody knows who the heretic is.

    Spoiler: The Heresy
    Show

    In D&D, Pelor is the Neutral God god of the sun. But also the generally 'good' deity that is worshipped a lot by humans and known for charity, kindness, and hating undead.

    The 'heresy' of the Burning Hate is (to my understanding) a fan-made idea that Pelor is actually evil, and maybe is a psuedonym used by an evil human-centric god. This is based on a few things like a picture in the Player's Handbook of a cleric of Pelor casting an evil spell, something a cleric of a Good deity couldn't do.

    For this game, there isn't daily intervention from the deities, so it's hard to really prove the heresy one way or the other, hence a church council.


    Rules/Mechanics

    During the Day Phase, everyone votes. The person with the most votes at the end of the day is killed. In the case of a tie, a person is randomly chosen.

    During the Night Phase, those with powers can use them. This includes the potential of the cult converting someone to the cult.

    Each player has an individual QuickTopic, which they can use at any time to talk with the Narrator (JeenLeen).
    The Cult has a QuickTopic where they can communicate. The Cult can only talk amongst itself at Night, with two exceptions
    1) the High Priest can post during the Day (but the rest of the Cult cannot respond)
    2) a new convert may make one post in the QuickTopic during the Day. (Try to keep editing it to a minimum.)

    Power Roles

    If there are 10 players, the game will start with 1 Cultist, 4 power Town roles (Town Guard, Healer, Elder, and Town Gossip), and the rest as vanilla town. Less players may mean less power Town roles.
    If there are 14 players, a Serial Killer (neutral) will be added.
    If there are 16 players, a Survivor (neutral) and True Believer (Town) will be added.

    The game starts with 1 Cultist. (If we got a whole lot of players, we may start with 2 cultists, but I doubt that will happen.)

    High Priest -- the High Priest of Pelor the Burning Hate. Each night, you must visit someone and convert them to your faith.
    The first time you would die, you do not die. A note is made publicly that "<name> should have died, but did not." This immunity persists if you have failed to convert anyone to the cult (e.g., you cannot die until at least one conversion has occurred).


    Town Guard -- you protect the town from the dangers of the wilds, and you'll try to use your skill to protect from heresy at any cost. Each night, you can target someone and kill them.
    If converted, you become the Fanatic. Each night, you can target someone and kill them; the High Priest cannot convert someone on a night you use this power. If you are lynched, you randomly kill someone who voted for you. (This can kill a fellow cultist who voted you.)

    Healer -- each night, you can protect someone to heal them if they are injured and thus block a night-kill. If you block a night-kill, a note is made publicly that "<name> should have died, but did not." If the person you targeted was targeted for conversion, you learn they were targeted for conversion, but not if it succeeded or not nor who targeted them.
    If converted, you become the Alchemist, making potions to influence people. Each night, you can target someone and either protect them from being killed or prevent them from taking any actions. (In other words, you can bane or void someone.) If you block a night-kill, a note is made publicly that "<name> should have died, but did not." If you void somebody, they are not aware of it (e.g., no special feedback) -- but may realize something happened, such as if the Town Guard fails to kill who they targeted but no text says a bane occurred.

    Elder -- you know the village and the nature of souls. Each night, you can target on someone and learn their alignment (Town, Cult, or Neutral).
    If converted, you become the Prophet. Each night, you can target someone and learn their alignment and role (e.g., Town Gossip (Town), Survivor (Neutral), vanilla Town.)

    Town Gossip -- you know how to sneak and spy, as well as how to discretely talk. Each night, you can use one of these powers
    -you can target someone and see who targets them
    -you can target someone and see who they target
    -you can create a QuickTopic for two people (it can include yourself or be two others). If you pick two others, you can see the QuickTopic but are not allowed to write in it. (This counts as targeting the two people you pick.)
    If converted, you become the Spymaster. Each night, you can use one of these powers
    -you can target someone. You see who targets them, and who they target.
    -the same QuickTopic power as above, but you are allowed to write in QTs with two other players. (If converted, this permission-to-write is retroactively given to any extant QTs.)
    QuickTopics can be used during Day or Night.

    True Believer -- your faith in Pelor is pure, and you cannot be converted to the cult. If targeted for conversion, the cult is told "<name> cannot be converted because he is Neutral." If you are targeted for conversion, you receive the message, "You were targeted for conversion." If there are at least two cultists, you also learn the name of the High Priest. (By implication, if you are targeted but do not learn who the High Priest is, you know there is only 1 cultist.)

    Survivor -- you only care about number one and about lasting through this ordeal. Fortunately, you have a few tricks to help you.
    Each night, you can use one of these powers. You can use each power only once per game.
    -block somebody from being targeted for the night, by spending the night talking to them. This prevents kills, conversions, and any other targeting. The person targeted receives a message "<Survivor's name> spent the night talking with you." If someone did target that person, they receive the message "<target name> was busy talking all night with somebody."
    -target someone and see who they target
    -target someone and see who targets them
    -bane yourself. If you would have died, a note is made publicly that "<name> should have died, but did not."
    If you are targeted for conversion, you receive message "You were targeted for conversion." The cult is told "<name> cannot be converted because he is Neutral."
    You win when the game ends, if you are alive. E.g., if there is a Town, Cult, or Serial Killer win.

    Serial Killer -- You live for killing, and with the fear about the cult, now is your chance. Kill them all! Well, you can let that one loner stay alive; he's cool enough.
    If the Survivor is in the game, you start the game knowing who the Survivor is.
    Each night, target someone and kill them.
    You win when all Town and Cult are dead.
    If you are targeted for conversion, you receive message "You were targeted for conversion." The cult is told "<name> cannot be converted because he is Neutral."


    Clarification Notes and Power Interactions

    If you have an information-gathering power (watch, track, seer) and are somehow stopped, you receive "No information." If you watch/track someone and they do no action, you receive "<target> was not targeted, other than by you" or "<target> did not target anyone."

    If the Town Gossip/Spymaster use the QuickTopic power and any person targeted is blocked by the Survivor, the power fails for the night. The Town Gossip/Spymaster gets the message to learn which person they targeted was targeted by the Survivor.
    If the Town Gossip/Spymaster is itself blocked, they receive no special feedback but the lack of a QT being generated will make it obvious the power failed.
    If the Town Gossip/Spymaster targets two other players, but one of them dies the same night, the QT is still created. (I'd be willing to create the QT between the Spymaster and a dead person, but no point to it, so I don't plan to.)
    No using fake names or aliases when writing in QuickTopics. AvatarVecna can use AV, but shouldn't use Some Person or Town Gossip.
    No posting QT links, either publicly or in other QTs. EXCEPTION: the Spymaster may post QT links in the Cult QT to share it with the cult.

    If the High Priest dies, no more cultists can be made. But the Fanatic can still kill even if the High Priest is dead.

    The High Priest's conversion attempt is not optional. The only way to forgo doing it is to have the Fanatic do a kill instead. If the High Priest player does not choose a target, the Narrator will randomly pick one. (The High Priest can be voided; the conversion isn't guaranteed, but they have to try.)

    For timing: the conversion happens last, most importantly after night-kills. (So a High Priest targeted with a NK on N1 will always survive.) EXCEPTION: if the Elder targets someone who is being converted, they learn the person was converted that night.
    Voids happen first.
    If two voiders (Alchemist, Survivor) somehow interact in a way that would create an infinite loop of who-stops-who, the Alchemist "wins".

    Last edited by JeenLeen; 2021-01-06 at 09:36 AM.

  15. - Top - End - #255
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    Default Re: Mafia Capital (WWC XIII): Important Info Here -- READ OPENING POSTS!

    It looks good to me. I'm by no means knowledgeable (my recent performances should be enough to indicate that) but I don't think the survivor is too strong. The way I think about it, if he was aligned with town he would be fine. If he was aligned with cult he would be a little strong but fine. So he's probably fine as neutral.
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  16. - Top - End - #256
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    Default Re: Mafia Capital (WWC XIII): Important Info Here -- READ OPENING POSTS!

    I really should have wrote my feedback sooner, as the game I just ran is already muddled in my mind, but I will write what I can.

    I think your power roles sound good and balanced. Though I am not sure about how having both conversions and lynches kill people will interact, as basically town can just lose quicker. Have several neutrals that don't really care one way or the other can also muddle this, but not as badly. I am not saying change it, just something to analyze later.

    I think most everyone has given good analysis on the way to do things. Hopefully it will go well. I will probably use what I can learn from it in trying the Thing again, but with powers to make it a little more interesting. I am kind of glad that the Thing game went for several iterations as it made analysis and scheming actually meaningful instead of just pulling off one trick early on to guarantee victory.

  17. - Top - End - #257
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    Default Re: Mafia Capital (WWC XIII): Important Info Here -- READ OPENING POSTS!

    That moment when you buy an horror game and realize it's based around a Werewolf game (or a Mafia one, not sure) xD

    Worst players of the year too (althoug panicking in such a context and doing crazy stuff is probably fair).
    I won an argument with my GM -15/08/2017- (20:32 GMT +1)

    Want to try a WereWolf or Mafia game? Do you already know it and want to play it? Do you want to see one being played? Nothing is currently recruiting.


  18. - Top - End - #258
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    Default Re: Mafia Capital (WWC XIII): Important Info Here -- READ OPENING POSTS!

    Quote Originally Posted by Valmark View Post
    That moment when you buy an horror game and realize it's based around a Werewolf game (or a Mafia one, not sure) xD

    Worst players of the year too (althoug panicking in such a context and doing crazy stuff is probably fair).
    Which game?

  19. - Top - End - #259
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    Default Re: Mafia Capital (WWC XIII): Important Info Here -- READ OPENING POSTS!

    Quote Originally Posted by JeenLeen View Post
    Which game?
    Raging Loop.

    It's an horror visual novel which turned out to be quite well done- initially I was dubious, but the dubbing's great, the drawing is good enough (not my preferred style) and the plot and characters are pretty well crafted (I can't really say much without spoiling it).

    And despite my tendency at getting bored by scrolling through text the suspence and tension keeps me on my toes quite well, so someone that likes the genre more will like the game more.

    It's not horror in the sense of fear but the other way, so it's probably not suited to those that dislike it.

    Being a visual novel with only some choices there isn't a lot left to player agency and many choices lead to dead ends- but those that are there are meaningful enough that you feel actively partecipating (and the scenario chart allows to rapidly go back when you pick wrong. It's actually fun to see how things change).
    Last edited by Valmark; 2021-01-21 at 10:44 AM.
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  20. - Top - End - #260
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    Default Re: Mafia Capital (WWC XIII): Important Info Here -- READ OPENING POSTS!

    Smugglers & Scallywags has ended in cult victory. PartyOfRouges is being pinged about their game. If I don't get a positive response within 48 hours, they'll get bumped down the schedule and JeenLeen will have the green light.


    Currently Recruiting WW/Mafia: Unavenger's "UPick 2: Pick Harder"

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  21. - Top - End - #261
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    Default Re: Mafia Capital (WWC XIII): Important Info Here -- READ OPENING POSTS!

    I'll throw my name in for running a game sometime. It'll be Love Letter themed (as in the card game).

  22. - Top - End - #262
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    Default Re: Mafia Capital (WWC XIII): Important Info Here -- READ OPENING POSTS!

    Quote Originally Posted by CaoimhinTheCape View Post
    I'll throw my name in for running a game sometime. It'll be Love Letter themed (as in the card game).
    Added to the table.


    Currently Recruiting WW/Mafia: Unavenger's "UPick 2: Pick Harder"

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    Quote Originally Posted by Maat Mons View Post
    Everyone knows Wizards only become adventurers because it's the fastest way to get more Wizard levels.

  23. - Top - End - #263
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    Default Re: Mafia Capital (WWC XIII): Important Info Here -- READ OPENING POSTS!

    Quote Originally Posted by CaoimhinTheCape View Post
    I'll throw my name in for running a game sometime. It'll be Love Letter themed (as in the card game).
    This is a fabulous idea and I am here for it.
    I can see it from the outside.
    And I know you're on the inside... lookin' out.


  24. - Top - End - #264
    Ettin in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: Mafia Capital (WWC XIII): Important Info Here -- READ OPENING POSTS!

    My game is also a cult one, albeit much more "open" format than AV's. If a lot of people feel burnt out on cult after the Thing and AV's game, I could push my down in the queue.
    Anyone with a "not up for cult now" feel who thinks they might be up for it later.

    Though here's hoping PartyOfRouge's game starts up, is non-cult, and has enough space to heal any cultish burnout.

  25. - Top - End - #265
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    AvatarVecna's Avatar

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    Default Re: Mafia Capital (WWC XIII): Important Info Here -- READ OPENING POSTS!

    I've not heard back from them yet. If you'd prefer to delay your game, though, I can ask Unavenger if they're fine getting Upick up and running.

    EDIT: To be clear, I'm not burnt out on cult games, although I could understand if others were.
    Last edited by AvatarVecna; 2021-02-01 at 03:07 AM.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Maat Mons View Post
    Everyone knows Wizards only become adventurers because it's the fastest way to get more Wizard levels.

  26. - Top - End - #266
    Ettin in the Playground
     
    BardGuy

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    Default Re: Mafia Capital (WWC XIII): Important Info Here -- READ OPENING POSTS!

    I'll go ahead with mine.

    FYI: I'm making a tweak to the rules above, in that the Healer is now a baner (blocks kills and conversions) instead of blocks kills and finds out if a conversion was attempted.
    Based on how the game went with 4 baners last time, seems worth empowering Town a wee bit. Especially since I doubt I'll get enough players for a Serial Killer to be around killing folk.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Recruitment started:
    https://forums.giantitp.com/showthre...6#post24909616

  27. - Top - End - #267
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    Default Re: Mafia Capital (WWC XIII): Important Info Here -- READ OPENING POSTS!

    Hello everyone! I am not sure how much you all remember me, but for a few months there I was fairly active on the Werewolf scene on this site. I doubt I will have enough time to dedicate to a Werewolf game like I used to, but I am curious as to what direction things here went. Did things become any more active since that September in 2019 when I left? How are things going in here nowadays?
    Last edited by Requilac; 2021-02-01 at 04:49 PM.
    -
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  28. - Top - End - #268
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    Default Re: Mafia Capital (WWC XIII): Important Info Here -- READ OPENING POSTS!

    Quote Originally Posted by Requilac View Post
    Hello everyone! I am not sure how much you all remember me, but for a few months there I was fairly active on the Werewolf scene on this site. I doubt I will have enough time to dedicate to a Werewolf game like I used to, but I am curious as to what direction things here went. Did things become any more active since that September in 2019 when I left? How are things going in here nowadays?
    September 2019 is when I started just running games for whoever would play as long as I got enough players. We've been running games constantly since then, albeit not with too many of the old guard, and rarely more than a dozen players at once. You chose quite a time to leave.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Maat Mons View Post
    Everyone knows Wizards only become adventurers because it's the fastest way to get more Wizard levels.

  29. - Top - End - #269
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    Flumph

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    Default Re: Mafia Capital (WWC XIII): Important Info Here -- READ OPENING POSTS!

    Quote Originally Posted by AvatarVecna View Post
    September 2019 is when I started just running games for whoever would play as long as I got enough players. We've been running games constantly since then, albeit not with too many of the old guard, and rarely more than a dozen players at once. You chose quite a time to leave.
    "for whoever would play"? I am guessing you all went through with that idea of recruiting for games outside of this sub-forum. then? You would have to do something like that to have games running almost constantly, at least with the number of people who where hanging around back in my day. Or did the Big Bad 'Rona cause more people to be playing Werewolf than before?
    -
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    My D&D 5e Homebrew Content

    The Necronomicon. An >30 Page Cthulhu Mythos Supplement

    Faerie Vampyre Monsters. Won 1st place in the GitP Monster Design Contest: Shapeshifters.

    Check here for my extended homebrew signature!

  30. - Top - End - #270
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    Default Re: Mafia Capital (WWC XIII): Important Info Here -- READ OPENING POSTS!

    Quote Originally Posted by Requilac View Post
    "for whoever would play"? I am guessing you all went through with that idea of recruiting for games outside of this sub-forum. then? You would have to do something like that to have games running almost constantly, at least with the number of people who where hanging around back in my day. Or did the Big Bad 'Rona cause more people to be playing Werewolf than before?
    That's correct, and we've got a buncha new players out of it. idk what role covid has played in things but probably did something.


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    Aspiring optimizers can try their luck in Zinc Saucier XXXIX: Hoist The Colors High

    Quote Originally Posted by Maat Mons View Post
    Everyone knows Wizards only become adventurers because it's the fastest way to get more Wizard levels.

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