what are some ultimate items in this game?

[skunk3]

Because the activation method described doesn't allow it, annoying but RAW. You don't have the permission to make an attack roll to throw it into a square. Noting in the description indicates that. You have to "cast it into the air" and not "throw it on the ground".

And a "20ft. spread" is something defined by the rules and you aren't allowed to change em as you wish. As comprehension see spellcasting where you need metamagic feats to be able to alter the shape of spelleffects. If you don't have the permission by other (rule-altering) rules, you are not allowed to alter the shape rules given in 3.5.


On a sidenote, imho, just think about it:

It's a cursed item (!), so it has to have drawbacks. And where is the drawback if you could throw it from a safe distance? It would just be a straight powerful item and would have no logical reason to be called a cures item. Everything in the description indicates that you cast it into the air around you and not somewhere else targeted.

It is a fine dust contained in... what? A bag? Vellum? A pouch? Who knows? It doesn't say how it is stored when you buy it. I see no logical reason why anyone couldn't sprinkle it down from above and avoid its effects. I also see no reason why a PC couldn't just put the loose dust inside some sort of container and turn it into a thrown weapon. It's kinda hard to take fine dust in your hand and make a ranged attack with it but once said dust is put into, let's say, a small glass bottle (or anything that will shatter / open on impact) then that's a perfectly viable option. Why would it ONLY work if you threw it up into the air, exposing yourself to its effects? Is it self-aware? Would it refuse to 'work' unless dispersed exactly as it wills?

Anyway, the dust is clearly a powerful item and as a DM I would take a dim view of anyone using it more than once in a blue moon, especially if they are a good-aligned character. Using this dust is basically the same as using a poison and it should influence once's alignment.

[Bohandas]

Just use that mirror of opposition trick (Aha! Found it here!) to clone one a bunch.

That trick is overly complicated. It says that it duplicates a "creature". Just put the items on a dog and have a blind man in padded armor hold the dog up to the mirror.

[Kelb_Panthera]

Dust of sneezing and choking references dust of appearance. They're supposed to be indistinguishable from one another without the usual tricks for identifying cursed items.

That being the case:

Dust of appearance is typically stored in small silk packets or hollow bone tubes.

The text for both cleary indicates an AoE centered on the user.

[Gruftzwerg]

It is a fine dust contained in... what? A bag? Vellum? A pouch? Who knows? It doesn't say how it is stored when you buy it. I see no logical reason why anyone couldn't sprinkle it down from above and avoid its effects. I also see no reason why a PC couldn't just put the loose dust inside some sort of container and turn it into a thrown weapon. It's kinda hard to take fine dust in your hand and make a ranged attack with it but once said dust is put into, let's say, a small glass bottle (or anything that will shatter / open on impact) then that's a perfectly viable option. Why would it ONLY work if you threw it up into the air, exposing yourself to its effects? Is it self-aware? Would it refuse to 'work' unless dispersed exactly as it wills?

Anyway, the dust is clearly a powerful item and as a DM I would take a dim view of anyone using it more than once in a blue moon, especially if they are a good-aligned character. Using this dust is basically the same as using a poison and it should influence once's alignment.

First, if you want to worsen your situation as DM by houseruling it stronger than intended, it's up to you ;)
RAW doesn't give you the option, simple as that.

And if you want to hear the implied intention/reasoning behind it, well..
I assume that you need to whirl it forcefully around you, so it can take effect in the right height.

Like, I could throw some dirt into you eye and cause a momentary effect on you. But what would it help if I would use the same dirt to throw it at you feet. Unless the dirt is so light and enough wind is there to pull it up to your eyes, there is no way that the dirt on your shoes will have an effect on your eyes.

So if I throw sneezing powder at your feet. How high is the chance that you sneeze? Unless the sneezing powder is so light or come with some sort of explosive to produce a burst of expansion, there is no way. Maybe you will sneeze once, but you are not as handicapped as with a direct hit.

The powder of sneezing and choking is the same. It doesn't work when you throw it on the ground because the powder ain't light enough to take of the ground and reach the the desired heights to take full effect.

And last, imagine it like trying to make a dust screen without explosives and with just whirling stuff around. Could you assure that the air in your space isn't covered by dust too? Including wind conditions? The rules are binary here. Either you put enough force and get a 20ft spread (and nothing else) or you don't and thus the attempt is wasted.

[MaxiDuRaritry]

That trick is overly complicated. It says that it duplicates a "creature". Just put the items on a dog and have a blind man in padded armor hold the dog up to the mirror.

I think the idea is that you have full control over the summons, so you have it do exactly what you want. The specially prepared pit (with quintessence) is to trap the clone before it can attack so there's a 0% chance of things going wrong, so either the clone or the summon (and thus the clone) dies. Then, since the clone is trapped in time, the duration of the mirror's effects is indefinite, keeping the cloned gear around.

Having a dog, even a trained one, held up to the mirror just means that the clone immediately attacks, and there's a good chance that one will die. Then you lose the cloned gear.

There needs to be that level of complexity, else it won't work.

[Bohandas]

I think the idea is that you have full control over the summons, so you have it do exactly what you want. The specially prepared pit (with quintessence) is to trap the clone before it can attack so there's a 0% chance of things going wrong, so either the clone or the summon (and thus the clone) dies. Then, since the clone is trapped in time, the duration of the mirror's effects is indefinite, keeping the cloned gear around.

Having a dog, even a trained one, held up to the mirror just means that the clone immediately attacks, and there's a good chance that one will die. Then you lose the cloned gear.

There needs to be that level of complexity, else it won't work.

How about a transparent wall (Stronghold Builder's Guidebook pg.38 and pg.40) then? It's only 3000 gp plus the cost of the wall the effect is applied to.

[MaxiDuRaritry]

How about a transparent wall (Stronghold Builder's Guidebook pg.38 and pg.40) then? It's only 3000 gp plus the cost of the wall the effect is applied to.

You don't think that trapping your enemy in a, for them, inescapable prison isn't defeating them? Because I'm pretty sure that counts as defeating them.

Instantaneously being encased in time-stopping quintessence means that, yes, the summons is defeated, but it's defeated by stopping the passage of time. It can't wink out because there's no time to do so.

Defeating it by trapping it just means you've wasted your time and effort (and money).

[Bohandas]

You don't think that trapping your enemy in a, for them, inescapable prison isn't defeating them? Because I'm pretty sure that counts as defeating them.

Instantaneously being encased in time-stopping quintessence means that, yes, the summons is defeated, but it's defeated by stopping the passage of time. It can't wink out because there's no time to do so.

Defeating it by trapping it just means you've wasted your time and effort (and money).

No, the room would have a door, it just wouldn't have a door to the room where the original is. And optimal'y the transparency would be one way so that the encounter can't start at all. Then you let the dog live out its life somewhere nice and free of conflict and after it gets old and dies preserve the body and put it in a secure location because the description doesn't mention death, just defeat or destruction

Instantaneously being encased in time-stopping quintessence means that, yes, the summons is defeated, but it's defeated by stopping the passage of time. It can't wink out because there's no time to do so.

Perhaps, but time would resume for the items once you removed them from the quintessence and they would wink out.

[MaxiDuRaritry]

No, the room would have a door, it just wouldn't have a door to the room where the original is. And optimal'y the transparency would be one way so that the encounter can't start at all. Then you let the dog live out its life somewhere nice and free of conflict and after it gets old and dies preserve the body and put it in a secure location because the description doesn't mention death, just defeat or destruction

I'm pretty sure that dying will end it regardless. Still best to just keep it on ice.

Perhaps, but time would resume for the items once you removed them from the quintessence and they would wink out.

Which is why you slide the mirror right into the quintessence after you've used up the charges for the day but before you remove the items from the quintessence, so the mirror is in stasis, too, which quite possibly will keep the effect going. Feel free to have a second mirror so you can clone it for the next round.

[OrbanSirgen]

constructs and undead and other creatures that don't breathe are imho immune to the entire effect, since "sneezing and coughing" requires breathing in the first place. They aren't legal targets.

Which is why I suggested having the construct, undead, or whatever that is immune to its effects be the one to use it... That way you can be out of its area of effect and whatever uses it would also not be affected...

[skunk3]

Dust of sneezing and choking references dust of appearance. They're supposed to be indistinguishable from one another without the usual tricks for identifying cursed items.

That being the case:



The text for both cleary indicates an AoE centered on the user.

I just read the entry for the dust of appearance and I see no reason why either of these items couldn't be used from above or turned into a grenade-like weapon. If I was flying above a suspected invisible enemy, I wouldn't be able to sprinkle it down into the squares below and get the same effect? Why not? There's lots of items in the game that can be used in a multitude of ways. If I put the dust of choking and sneezing into a small potion bottle, why couldn't I hurl it at a wall, the ceiling, a pillar, etc? Why couldn't I use the dust in conjunction with some sort of wind spell or effect to blow it exactly where I want it to go? Is that not allowed either?

RAW doesn't provide every use for every single item. D&D is a game of creativity and to say that an item cannot be used in a certain way just because it doesn't have it in the description is silly because we do it all of the time. Think about how many things we use ropes for, or mirrors, or grease, or glue. Even quarterstaffs and daggers can be used in tons of ways. This is kinda like saying that a healing potion only works if drank straight from the potion bottle and it cannot be transferred to another container, like a chalice.

[sorcererlover]

I just read the entry for the dust of appearance and I see no reason why either of these items couldn't be used from above or turned into a grenade-like weapon. If I was flying above a suspected invisible enemy, I wouldn't be able to sprinkle it down into the squares below and get the same effect? Why not? There's lots of items in the game that can be used in a multitude of ways. If I put the dust of choking and sneezing into a small potion bottle, why couldn't I hurl it at a wall, the ceiling, a pillar, etc? Why couldn't I use the dust in conjunction with some sort of wind spell or effect to blow it exactly where I want it to go? Is that not allowed either?

RAW doesn't provide every use for every single item. D&D is a game of creativity and to say that an item cannot be used in a certain way just because it doesn't have it in the description is silly because we do it all of the time. Think about how many things we use ropes for, or mirrors, or grease, or glue. Even quarterstaffs and daggers can be used in tons of ways. This is kinda like saying that a healing potion only works if drank straight from the potion bottle and it cannot be transferred to another container, like a chalice.

Except you're not being creative. You're trying to cheese. You're already using an item in a way that not only betrays author intent but also completely trivializes a good deal of encounters. Now you're saying you should be allowed to defy written rules and write your own rules to make it easier for you to cheese.

Suicide bombing with a cursed item meant to completely screw over PCs to completely screw monsters instead is hilarious and in genius. Flagrantly defying and making up your own rules just so you can cheese all your encounters is not funny, not fun, and not in genius.

What if I followed your example and said that teleport, despite targeting creatures, can target objects as well because I say so with some stupid logic regarding construct's dual nature as both object and creature, and then I teleport a portable hole underneath my opponent and then a bag of holding and create a rift in spacetime?

Dust of appearance, being a magic item, has only one method of activation and it is activated by flinging it into the air. Pouring or otherwise doing anything other than flinging it in the air does not activate the item.

[Gruftzwerg]

I just read the entry for the dust of appearance and I see no reason why either of these items couldn't be used from above or turned into a grenade-like weapon. If I was flying above a suspected invisible enemy, I wouldn't be able to sprinkle it down into the squares below and get the same effect? Why not? There's lots of items in the game that can be used in a multitude of ways. If I put the dust of choking and sneezing into a small potion bottle, why couldn't I hurl it at a wall, the ceiling, a pillar, etc? Why couldn't I use the dust in conjunction with some sort of wind spell or effect to blow it exactly where I want it to go? Is that not allowed either?

RAW doesn't provide every use for every single item. D&D is a game of creativity and to say that an item cannot be used in a certain way just because it doesn't have it in the description is silly because we do it all of the time. Think about how many things we use ropes for, or mirrors, or grease, or glue. Even quarterstaffs and daggers can be used in tons of ways. This is kinda like saying that a healing potion only works if drank straight from the potion bottle and it cannot be transferred to another container, like a chalice.

1. D&D is permission based. Rules give you the permission to do things. If the rule doesn't explicitly say how to do it, you are free to be creative, otherwise not. In this chase we have a single activation method (centered on you) and effect shape (20ft spread), which are defined thing in 3.5. Thus the rule leaves no room to be creative in "this chase". The wording is clear here, sorry.

2. Think about it like you would try to make smoke screen with throwing sand around you:
- throwing the sand at the feet on an enemy (into a square) won't help to emulate a smoke screen
- putting the sand into bottle before throwing it won't help either here to get a smoke screen.
- throwing the sand into your enemies face may have some momentary effect on the target if he fails his reflex roll, but woudn't cause the sand to spread to an smoke screen either.
When you want to make a smoke screen from sand you have to do something like this here:
(the ability starts at 0:27. Somehow the timestamp link doesn't work as supposed..)

This is how the effect of the item is supposed to be activated and than spread 20ft around you. Anything else wouldn't work or cause the desired effect (shape). And the items text doesn't allow for alteration. It gives permission to use it in a single way with no option left to alter it.

Unless you find some item/spell that would work with such kind of substances/items as target. Dunno if there is a grenade type of item to spreads powders/substances around? Maybe, but unless you either find or homebrew one it won't happen.
If you know of such a item, pls let me know, cause I would be honestly interested in that. (no joke, so pls let me know if anybody knows such an item).

[Quertus]

I'm with you on this. The wording says "normally." Weapon attacks do not normally offer half damage on a successful save like this. It would only become "normal" after the PC has purchased/crafted/has access to a Ring of Evasion.

Also, and I've seen some arguments about this, but is my RAI opinion the Starmantle Cloak ONLY halves the physical damage -- not the total damage including stuff like holy/frost/flaming/etc.

The Starmantle Cloak is cheesy enough as it is. To allow it to work in conjunction with a Ring of Evasion to make a character immune to melee attacks is ludicrous.

What is cheesy and completely RAW legal is pairing the Starmantle Cloak with the Retributive Amulet. Get hit with a magical weapon in combat, make a measly DC15 reflex save, take half damage... but wait, there's more! The damage that you should take is then divided into two and half goes to you and half goes back to the attacker. So basically, you're taking 1/4th the damage and reflecting 1/4 of it back. As a cherry on top, the amulet also gives you a +2 sacred bonus to AC, which can be sometimes hard to get.

Raw is often ludicrous. Welcome to RAW. I tend to agree about the elemental damage, and disagree about the usefulness (for *most* PCs) of only dealing as much damage as they take over just not taking the damage in the first place.

I'm curious if anyone has solid ground on the use of the word "normally" in 3e - is there a precedent for it referring to "without this feat / spell / ability / whatever"? Otherwise, that does make it difficult to read the Playground-standard way

Anyway, the dust is clearly a powerful item and as a DM I would take a dim view of anyone using it more than once in a blue moon, especially if they are a good-aligned character. Using this dust is basically the same as using a poison and it should influence once's alignment.

Others have already started in on the "I can't even" of the rest of this post, so I'll stab at this piece.

It's powerful, therefore it's evil? No, I can't even.

It's poison, therefore it's evil? Um… in what way is dust poison?

In what way is debilitating your foe evil? Keep in mind, your answers need to be consistent with your stance on Web, Grappling, Stunning Fist, etc etc etc.

and people wonder why I prefer to start the game as evil… I don't usually have to deal with any of this alignment change nonsense as an evil character.

[Troacctid]

I just read the entry for the dust of appearance and I see no reason why either of these items couldn't be used from above or turned into a grenade-like weapon. If I was flying above a suspected invisible enemy, I wouldn't be able to sprinkle it down into the squares below and get the same effect? Why not? There's lots of items in the game that can be used in a multitude of ways. If I put the dust of choking and sneezing into a small potion bottle, why couldn't I hurl it at a wall, the ceiling, a pillar, etc? Why couldn't I use the dust in conjunction with some sort of wind spell or effect to blow it exactly where I want it to go? Is that not allowed either?

RAW doesn't provide every use for every single item. D&D is a game of creativity and to say that an item cannot be used in a certain way just because it doesn't have it in the description is silly because we do it all of the time. Think about how many things we use ropes for, or mirrors, or grease, or glue. Even quarterstaffs and daggers can be used in tons of ways. This is kinda like saying that a healing potion only works if drank straight from the potion bottle and it cannot be transferred to another container, like a chalice.

You can try this at home. Fill a bottle with sand. Throw it at a hard surface. Does it create a cloud in a 20-foot radius? Please report back ASAP, we are all on tenterhooks for your results.

[Bohandas]

Regarding the dust, what if you combined it with a contingent gust of wind

You don't think that trapping your enemy in a, for them, inescapable prison isn't defeating them? Because I'm pretty sure that counts as defeating them.

Instantaneously being encased in time-stopping quintessence means that, yes, the summons is defeated, but it's defeated by stopping the passage of time. It can't wink out because there's no time to do so.

Defeating it by trapping it just means you've wasted your time and effort (and money).

If it doesn;t have any time in which to disappear, then surely it doesn't have time in which to appear either. Bearing in mind that it's not being inserted into the quintessence but rather conjured into it

[MaxiDuRaritry]

You can try this at home. Fill a bottle with sand. Throw it at a hard surface. Does it create a cloud in a 20-foot radius? Please report back ASAP, we are all on tenterhooks for your results.

A glass bottle, when shattered with force, does tend to spray its contents everywhere. Powder often acts similarly to a liquid in fluid dynamics, especially when sudden force is involved.

Dry sand in a glass bottle, when thrown at a wall? It splashes very much like water does, and water sprays everywhere. Sand, however, is too heavy and dense. Even if you threw it like you're supposed to with DoSaC, it wouldn't make a 20' cloud either. Something lighter, like powdery wood ash, which is more what I imagine dust of sneezing and choking to be like? It'd go everywhere.

[edit]

If it doesn;t have any time in which to disappear, then surely it doesn't have time in which to appear either. Bearing in mind that it's not being inserted into the quintessence but rather conjured into it

You can push stuff into the quintessence, so it's clearly able to be affected by outside forces. The clone would appear and be instantaneously time-locked, because time instantaneously stops at that point.

[Gruftzwerg]

A glass bottle, when shattered with force, does tend to spray its contents everywhere. Powder often acts similarly to a liquid in fluid dynamics, especially when sudden force is involved.

Dry sand in a glass bottle, when thrown at a wall? It splashes very much like water does, and water sprays everywhere. Sand, however, is too heavy and dense. Even if you threw it like you're supposed to with DoSaC, it wouldn't make a 20' cloud either. Something lighter, like powdery wood ash, which is more what I imagine dust of sneezing and choking to be like? It'd go everywhere.

I get what you mean, but you are assuming that it is powder and we don't even know if it is in powder condition. From what the rules gives you as activation method, you have to assume that it is heavier and denser like sand. Since the rules indicate this way of interpretation, it would be illogical to assume the other way (that it behaves like very light powder).

[MaxiDuRaritry]

I get what you mean, but you are assuming that it is powder and we don't even know if it is in powder condition. From what the rules gives you as activation method, you have to assume that it is heavier and denser like sand. Since the rules indicate this way of interpretation, it would be illogical to assume the other way (that it behaves like very light powder).

Even dry sand, as heavy and dense as it is, acts like a liquid when it's moved energetically. It flows in largely the same way, meaning a glass bottle thrown at a wall will splash sand everywhere like water does.

Wet sand...not so much.

[Gruftzwerg]

Even dry sand, as heavy and dense as it is, acts like a liquid when it's moved energetically. It flows in largely the same way, meaning a glass bottle thrown at a wall will splash sand everywhere like water does.

Wet sand...not so much.

And for how many rounds would it "hang" in the air before dropping`? barely a single round (6 seconds)?
You need to cause turbulences so it will stay longer in the air before dropping to ground. And this is the reason why you are wildly whirling it around you in a 20ft spread. Nothing in the text implies that it is soft/light enough to work when thrown against a solid object to cause the desired spread.

If it would be a regular magic item we are talking about, I could see why one assumes that it might work in other ways too, but we are talking about a cured item. And the drawback is that you can't throw it and have to stay inside the spread. There are still enough ways to abuse the item, as some have been pointed out. There is no need to make an already powerful cured item, less restricting than the rules demanding it.

[Bohandas]

If part of the curse is that it always targets the user that opens it up to countermeasures against being targeted with magical items

[skunk3]

1. D&D is permission based. Rules give you the permission to do things. If the rule doesn't explicitly say how to do it, you are free to be creative, otherwise not. In this chase we have a single activation method (centered on you) and effect shape (20ft spread), which are defined thing in 3.5. Thus the rule leaves no room to be creative in "this chase". The wording is clear here, sorry.

2. Think about it like you would try to make smoke screen with throwing sand around you:
- throwing the sand at the feet on an enemy (into a square) won't help to emulate a smoke screen
- putting the sand into bottle before throwing it won't help either here to get a smoke screen.
- throwing the sand into your enemies face may have some momentary effect on the target if he fails his reflex roll, but woudn't cause the sand to spread to an smoke screen either.
When you want to make a smoke screen from sand you have to do something like this here:
(the ability starts at 0:27. Somehow the timestamp link doesn't work as supposed..)

This is how the effect of the item is supposed to be activated and than spread 20ft around you. Anything else wouldn't work or cause the desired effect (shape). And the items text doesn't allow for alteration. It gives permission to use it in a single way with no option left to alter it.

Unless you find some item/spell that would work with such kind of substances/items as target. Dunno if there is a grenade type of item to spreads powders/substances around? Maybe, but unless you either find or homebrew one it won't happen.
If you know of such a item, pls let me know, cause I would be honestly interested in that. (no joke, so pls let me know if anybody knows such an item).

Personally, I think the item is super cheesy and I'd be against seeing it more than once or twice in an entire campaign. I'm just trying to make a point. The description of the item says "if cast into the air..." Why does that mean that it needs to be flung straight up, potentially affecting the person using it? If I am above the target(s) and I open a vial of this powder and fling it downwards, is that not the same as casting it into the air? The ONLY way to use this without affecting one's self is to either use it from above or to put it in some sort of a container and use it as a grenade-like weapon.

Also, on your other points you talk about sand. This dust is described as a "fine dust" which is going to be significantly less dense and heavy than sand. Have you ever accidentally shot some baby powder or talcum powder into the air? It lingers for a while like a cloud. It's not at all like sand, which falls straight to the ground. Have you ever driven a hot country road and seen the plume of clay dust that stays in the air for hundreds of feet behind your vehicle? If that were sand it would fall to the ground in a second or two at most.

Obviously, turning it into an improvised ranged grenade-like weapon of sorts could limit its area of effect, like say a 10' or even 5' radius rather than 20', but it should still work, especially if the dust is trailing down from above. I am pretty sure that if I took a handful of some fine powder IRL and threw it up in the air right above me the area of its spread wouldn't be THAT much different than if I put it in a weak container of some sort and threw it at a 20-30' ceiling. Heck, it might spread even further.

Cursed items are considered to be "cursed" (generally speaking) because unless a PC has the ability to determine whether it is cursed or not, they might assume that it is another non-cursed item that appears to be identical and has a different purpose. (DM's often specifically tell people that it is the other item, hence cursed.) If the PC has correctly identified the item for what it is and/or created the item specifically for its effect, they can avoid the pitfalls. The difference between a cursed item and a non-cursed item is the PC's ability to recognize it for *what it is.*

All of this notwithstanding, a PC could still use the item within its area of effect if they just take some basic counter-measure like wrapping their face with fabric, no? EDIT: I've since read the description for inhaled poisons and barring some sort of full face mask it would still affect them.

[skunk3]

You can try this at home. Fill a bottle with sand. Throw it at a hard surface. Does it create a cloud in a 20-foot radius? Please report back ASAP, we are all on tenterhooks for your results.

Sand and "fine dust" are not the same thing at all.

[MaxiDuRaritry]

Dust of negation (LoM 214) acts as an AMF wherever you throw it. Find a way to mix it alchemically with dust of sneezing and choking without negating the latter, and stuff like the necklace of adaptation (one of the very few ways to protect against the DoSaC) suddenly no longer works. Bye bye, ECL +10 encounter.

[skunk3]

It's powerful, therefore it's evil? No, I can't even.

It's poison, therefore it's evil? Um… in what way is dust poison?

The item is crafted with the Poison spell. It's used by Assassins, Blackguards, and others. Poison use is generally considered to be evil in 3.5 AFAIK but there are a few exceptions.

Also, since this is an inhaled poison effect (basically), I will copy + paste what the SRD says about inhaled poisons: Inhaled poisons are usually contained in fragile vials or eggshells. They can be thrown as a ranged attack with a range increment of 10 feet. When it strikes a hard surface (or is struck hard), the container releases its poison. One dose spreads to fill the volume of a 10-foot cube. Each creature within the area must make a saving throw. (Holding one’s breath is ineffective against inhaled poisons; they affect the nasal membranes, tear ducts, and other parts of the body.)

Make of that what you will. I rule that the Dust of Sneezing and Choking can be used as a grenade-like weapon. Obviously I am not advocating that anyone abuse this item. Anyway, even possessing such an item is illegal in many places (if correctly identified) and anyone crafting it would know exactly wtf it is lol. This item is clearly not intended for use by good-aligned characters, except by accident.

[Gruftzwerg]

The item is crafted with the Poison spell. It's used by Assassins, Blackguards, and others. Poison use is generally considered to be evil in 3.5 AFAIK but there are a few exceptions.

Also, since this is an inhaled poison effect (basically), I will copy + paste what the SRD says about inhaled poisons: Inhaled poisons are usually contained in fragile vials or eggshells. They can be thrown as a ranged attack with a range increment of 10 feet. When it strikes a hard surface (or is struck hard), the container releases its poison. One dose spreads to fill the volume of a 10-foot cube. Each creature within the area must make a saving throw. (Holding one’s breath is ineffective against inhaled poisons; they affect the nasal membranes, tear ducts, and other parts of the body.)

Make of that what you will. I rule that the Dust of Sneezing and Choking can be used as a grenade-like weapon. Obviously I am not advocating that anyone abuse this item. Anyway, even possessing such an item is illegal in many places (if correctly identified) and anyone crafting it would know exactly wtf it is lol. This item is clearly not intended for use by good-aligned characters, except by accident.

A pretty strong argument, I have to admit. And maybe it even was the RAI. But by RAW it's not declared as Poison and thus doesn't fall under the poison rules. Further keep in mind that antidotes and sometimes medication is also based on poisons, so the use of poison for crafting doesn't has to always be evil and can have results with good intentions.

[skunk3]

A pretty strong argument, I have to admit. And maybe it even was the RAI. But by RAW it's not declared as Poison and thus doesn't fall under the poison rules. Further keep in mind that antidotes and sometimes medication is also based on poisons, so the use of poison for crafting doesn't has to always be evil and can have results with good intentions.

Yeah, which is why I said there are a few exceptions.

While the description of the dust doesn't specifically state that it is a poison, it's clearly a poison lol. I'm the type of person who believes that RAI trumps RAW as long as the RAI is logically consistent and generally makes sense. These game rules aren't holy scripture. They are just a general framework by which we can play a game, and as everyone knows there are numerous problems with 3.5, especially if we are going by RAW. This is why games I play in tend to have a lot of house rules and amendments, from feats to how certain spells work to streamlining certain skills. For example, we combine hide and move silently by turning it into 'stealth.' We also combine listen and spot into 'perception.' Weak, crappy feats sometimes are combined with another (dodge + mobility or toughness + improved toughness) or count as half a feat.

We also tend to completely axe anything that is too powerful / broken. Nobody is going to run around our games using Shivering Touch on everything.

As I said before, people can play however they wish and if that means exposing yourself to the dust of sneezing and choking, that's fine. Personally, I think that's kinda dumb but different strokes for different folks.

[MaxiDuRaritry]

Yeah, which is why I said there are a few exceptions.

While the description of the dust doesn't specifically state that it is a poison, it's clearly a poison lol.

It's not. If it were, it would be affected by heal and neutralize poison. It is not.

[Quertus]

Yeah, which is why I said there are a few exceptions.

While the description of the dust doesn't specifically state that it is a poison, it's clearly a poison lol. I'm the type of person who believes that RAI trumps RAW as long as the RAI is logically consistent and generally makes sense. These game rules aren't holy scripture. They are just a general framework by which we can play a game, and as everyone knows there are numerous problems with 3.5, especially if we are going by RAW. This is why games I play in tend to have a lot of house rules and amendments, from feats to how certain spells work to streamlining certain skills. For example, we combine hide and move silently by turning it into 'stealth.' We also combine listen and spot into 'perception.' Weak, crappy feats sometimes are combined with another (dodge + mobility or toughness + improved toughness) or count as half a feat.

We also tend to completely axe anything that is too powerful / broken. Nobody is going to run around our games using Shivering Touch on everything.

As I said before, people can play however they wish and if that means exposing yourself to the dust of sneezing and choking, that's fine. Personally, I think that's kinda dumb but different strokes for different folks.

While, of course, it is the GM's prerogative to do world-building, discussions are generally RAW unless otherwise noted.

So, by RAW, it uses the Poison spell, but is not explicitly classified as a poison? By RAW, is the Poison spell [evil]? Is there any RAW basis for your stance beyond "it just feels evil"?

[Bohandas]

Unless you find some item/spell that would work with such kind of substances/items as target. Dunno if there is a grenade type of item to spreads powders/substances around? Maybe, but unless you either find or homebrew one it won't happen.
If you know of such a item, pls let me know, cause I would be honestly interested in that. (no joke, so pls let me know if anybody knows such an item).

Use the spell Gust of Wind, activated either via contingency, or an automatic magic item, or a readied action from another party member.