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  1. - Top - End - #1
    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    AssassinGuy

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    Default Help me understand the benefit of a delayed damage pool.

    I'm putting together a summoned companion for a game using Spheres of Might that's supposed to be kind of a tank/area controller. The Guardian Sphere provides a delayed damage pool of 3x BAB. I'm considering trading it away with a drawback because I really just don't get why this all that beneficial but it seems highly rated in guides. I totally understood it on the Crusader in the ToB because you got buffs based on how uch damage was stored up but there don't seem to be any abilities like that here.
    About the only really significant benefit I see to the ability are that if you put more resources into it you can delay the onset of various effects until the end of your turn which gives you a chance to try to heal them before they effect you. Even then it seems less useful than things like treating your threatened area by 10' and making enemies treat all of it as difficult terrain.

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    Ettin in the Playground
     
    The Viscount's Avatar

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    Default Re: Help me understand the benefit of a delayed damage pool.

    The delayed damage pool also allows for temp HP from Stone power or similar to apply twice, once from the extra damage not going in the pool, and again the next turn when the damage leaves the pool. It's less clear on whether it applies to DR twice, but if it does that's also a bonus.
    Last edited by The Viscount; 2020-03-30 at 09:40 AM.
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  3. - Top - End - #3
    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    AssassinGuy

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    Default Re: Help me understand the benefit of a delayed damage pool.

    Quote Originally Posted by The Viscount View Post
    The delayed damage pool also allows for DR and temp HP from Stone power or similar to apply twice, once from the extra damage not going in the pool, and again the next turn when the damage leaves the pool.
    Not on this ability. The wording says DR and Resistances apply before damage goes in to the delayed damage pool and then are bypassed when damage goes go to your HP at the end of your turn. Not sure about Temporary HP but it seems unlikely that it would come into play twice instead of just being a buffer on top of your regular HP like usual.
    Last edited by FinnDarkblade; 2020-03-30 at 09:44 AM.

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    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    exelsisxax's Avatar

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    Default Re: Help me understand the benefit of a delayed damage pool.

    Because being able to take your turn despite having taken insane damage is really powerful. Yes, you can heal yourself to stay up, but you could also just obliterate whatever hit you.

    No, DR never applies twice to delayed damage - but temp HP can. Once going in, once coming out. Get the berserker sphere for at-will temp HP that will let you simply negate even more damage. Then combine it with the talent that makes all delayed damage nonlethal to make your night-immortal, and effectively doubles your healing too.

    Or just load up on damage and nuke whatever hit you.

  5. - Top - End - #5
    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    AssassinGuy

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    Default Re: Help me understand the benefit of a delayed damage pool.

    Quote Originally Posted by exelsisxax View Post
    No, DR never applies twice to delayed damage - but temp HP can. Once going in, once coming out. Get the berserker sphere for at-will temp HP that will let you simply negate even more damage. Then combine it with the talent that makes all delayed damage nonlethal to make your night-immortal, and effectively doubles your healing too.
    Well then that's definitely useful thrn, especially since she has Fast Healing. Consider me sold if my DM agrees bout Temp HP applying going in and out. Do you have a source on that for Pathfinder?

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  6. - Top - End - #6
    Titan in the Playground
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    Default Re: Help me understand the benefit of a delayed damage pool.

    THP aren't damage reduction, they are hit points and are lost as hit points. You can put damage in your delayed damage pool, then use Berserker next round for THP.

    Also, I wrote the Guardian sphere and that is how it is intended to work. If there is some arcane rules issue that somehow prevents it from working right, I have not heard about it. I expect it would have come up.

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    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    AssassinGuy

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    Default Re: Help me understand the benefit of a delayed damage pool.

    Quote Originally Posted by stack View Post
    THP aren't damage reduction, they are hit points and are lost as hit points. You can put damage in your delayed damage pool, then use Berserker next round for THP.

    Also, I wrote the Guardian sphere and that is how it is intended to work. If there is some arcane rules issue that somehow prevents it from working right, I have not heard about it. I expect it would have come up.
    Okay, so the order goes:
    Enemy attack damage -> DDP with excess hitting any THP you may already have and then HP
    Your turn: Use Berseker for new THP -> Damage Hits New THP -> HP.
    And since healing heals regular and nonlethal damage at the same time then, if you have the talent that makes the DDP nonlethal, at the start of your turn any excess damage that went to your HP would be healed while also subtracting the same amount of non-lethal damage from the DDP.

    Thanks! I am definitely sold.

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    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    Beholder

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    Default Re: Help me understand the benefit of a delayed damage pool.

    Quote Originally Posted by FinnDarkblade View Post
    Okay, so the order goes:
    Enemy attack damage -> DDP with excess hitting any THP you may already have and then HP
    Your turn: Use Berseker for new THP -> Damage Hits New THP -> HP.
    And since healing heals regular and nonlethal damage at the same time then, if you have the talent that makes the DDP nonlethal, at the start of your turn any excess damage that went to your HP would be healed while also subtracting the same amount of non-lethal damage from the DDP.

    Thanks! I am definitely sold.
    Oh it gets even better than that with the endure pain talent.

    Invigorate with the painkiller talent from the Life sphere grants temporary hit points and heals an equal amount of nonlethal damage. Which doesn't cost a spell point, just a standard action.

    So you have a meat shield that can be healed of that nonlethal damage whenever its convenient.

  9. - Top - End - #9
    Titan in the Playground
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    Default Re: Help me understand the benefit of a delayed damage pool.

    That combo may not be appropriate at all tables and is the result of what I think is a problem in the design of the life handbook.

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    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    EldritchWeaver's Avatar

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    Default Re: Help me understand the benefit of a delayed damage pool.

    Quote Originally Posted by stack View Post
    That combo may not be appropriate at all tables and is the result of what I think is a problem in the design of the life handbook.
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  11. - Top - End - #11
    Titan in the Playground
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    Default Re: Help me understand the benefit of a delayed damage pool.

    Quote Originally Posted by exelsisxax View Post
    Because being able to take your turn despite having taken insane damage is really powerful. Yes, you can heal yourself to stay up, but you could also just obliterate whatever hit you.
    This pretty much. A round is a long time in D&D. I'd estimate delaying damage a turn is roughly worth taking half of that damage.
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