The Elder Scrolls XVI: Sworn to Carry Your Burdens

[Divayth Fyr]

The document is still a Temple-made recording of an Ashlander prophecy. Those are specifically oral-only (hence several of them becoming lost to the tribes), so we cannot be certain about the accuracy of the writing regarding such details as a hyphen.

[Keltest]

Do the ashlanders even recognize the Nine? Would the name Dragonborn have meaning to them beyond its relation to the Empire?

[Aeson]

The document is still a Temple-made recording of an Ashlander prophecy. Those are specifically oral-only (hence several of them becoming lost to the tribes), so we cannot be certain about the accuracy of the writing regarding such details as a hyphen.

I wasn't talking in-universe when I said that this was a document written by a modern human with a typical understanding of the rules of contemporary English punctuation meant for the consumption of other modern humans with typical understandings of the rules of contemporary English punctuation rather than being some ancient manuscript handed down from antiquity.

[veti]

Except that this is not a manuscript handed down from antiquity and full of transcription and transmission errors, it is a document written and intended to be read by modern humans who have essentially the same understanding of the rules of modern English punctuation as you or I do.

Err... no, that doesn't work. If it's a "document", then you're talking in-universe, and you have to allow for the possibility of all those sources of errors. If you're getting all meta about it, then it's not really a "document" at all - it's more like a stage prop, its function is to create atmosphere and tension, not to impart useful or actionable information.

Occam's Razor says the simplest hypothesis is the best hypothesis, and the simplest hypothesis in the absence of any obvious typographical or grammatical errors is that the document was meant to be read as it is written.

"Meant" by whom, specifically? And, even more importantly, to what end? It seems to me far-fetched to maintain that a scriptwriter in Bethesda circa 2000 was fully primed on the deeper theological meaning of "dragon-born", which wouldn't emerge in published works for another ten years or more. And if they were so primed - which is to say, this wording was written or personally vetted by someone who already knew the plot of Skyrim - it seems even more far-fetched to assume that this person would forget that the Ashlanders wouldn't share that understanding.

But if we put that aside for a moment, what makes you think that this singularly well-informed-yet-forgetful scriptwriter was intent on imparting accurate information? - as opposed to merely generating a particular tone and mood, without fretting too much about the long-term implications? Indeed, since the dragon-born-ness of the Nerevarine has absolutely no significance in that game - and the Hero of Kvatch's inability to wear the Amulet points directly against their being DB - it seems to me more likely that the term "dragon-born" was not really defined or thought through until Skyrim was in development. We know there is no canonical answer, and maybe there simply isn't meant to be one. I wouldn't be surprised if there are fierce disagreements to this day among Bethesda's own writers as to the exact meaning of that prophecy.

To me, the "simplest" hypothesis is that "dragon-born" is a poetic phrase that cannot be meaningfully assigned a precise theological significance, either with or without a hyphen.

[LibraryOgre]

Decided to back up a bit and do Bloodmoon... I want Cana to recognize things when she comes back in Skyrim (and it's been more than 10 years since I played it). So, I'll pick up Oblivion when I get back (I'm in Kvatch), but for now, I'm off to the land of the ice and snow, of the midnight sun where the hot springs flow.

[Divayth Fyr]

I wasn't talking in-universe when I said that this was a document written by a modern human with a typical understanding of the rules of contemporary English punctuation meant for the consumption of other modern humans with typical understandings of the rules of contemporary English punctuation rather than being some ancient manuscript handed down from antiquity.

In that case, the hyphen may have very well been added because the person writing the text liked it that way. Or considered it more "mystical". Or did it on a whim. We'll almost certainly never know.

[LibraryOgre]

Oh. My. Glob. I have been having so much fun in Bloodmoon.

See, I am now pretty stupidly high level. I have a ton of HP, and way more magicka than any sane person should have ("Altmer AND Atronach?"). I've got constant effect healing and stamina recovery. So I have a new, fun, way to explore:

A 100 point Jump spell, and a ring that instantly drains my Intelligence by 100 points for about 3 seconds when used.

The first lets me cover huge amounts of ground without the levitation problem (i.e. where you're stuck moving at levitation speed even though you don't need to fly anymore). The second lets me completely recharge my Magicka whenever I need to.

Cast. Jump. Cast. Jump. Cast. Jump. Drain. Cast. Jump.

I am pogoing my way across Solstheim. I am abusing the Mazed Band to jump back to Mournhold and sell stupid amounts of equipment, then Recalling myself to Fort Frostmoth. Sometimes, I'm Almsivi myself by to Gnisis to sell there.

Boingy boingy boingy.

[Resileaf]

Imagine the legends that will be told about your Nerevarine in the future.

[Kareeah_Indaga]

The first lets me cover huge amounts of ground without the levitation problem (i.e. where you're stuck moving at levitation speed even though you don't need to fly anymore).

Wait, this is a problem?

[LibraryOgre]

Wait, this is a problem?

With all of my stuff, I usually clock in at a 124 speed. With my pants and shirt, I regenerate something like 15 Fatigue per second. I can run a lot faster than I can fly, so long as the ground doesn't get in the way.

And, for the stories told about my Nerevarine? Not only does does she leap everywhere (and quite often flew), she also really liked potions of light (especially once she had unreasonable amounts of money), so she often glowed like a star, flying through the air, wearing artifact armor, artifact helmet (which put her Personality to 130), and carrying an artifact hammer.

[Kareeah_Indaga]

And, for the stories told about my Nerevarine? Not only does does she leap everywhere (and quite often flew), she also really liked potions of light (especially once she had unreasonable amounts of money), so she often glowed like a star, flying through the air, wearing artifact armor, artifact helmet (which put her Personality to 130), and carrying an artifact hammer.

Probably inaccurate, but in my head I see a glowing female Thor.

[LibraryOgre]

Probably inaccurate, but in my head I see a glowing female Thor.

She's Altmer, so it doesn't QUITE work, but it's not unreasonable. Since her origin in Arena was as a Healer, I've given her a marked preference for blunt weapons (and Skullcrusher frickin' rocks in Morrowind... essentially weightless when weilded, great damage, and an attack boost).

[Caelestion]

Didn't they fix the 0 Int magicka bug in the MPP? They certainly have in OpenMW.

[LibraryOgre]

Didn't they fix the 0 Int magicka bug in the MPP? They certainly have in OpenMW.

Not a clue. Don't have that one, so it's working fine for me... but I'm also glad I didn't work it out during the actual game. It makes things a little easy.

[Caelestion]

You're not even using the MW Code Patch? That and the Patch for Purists are essential mods for non-OMW games.

[Aeson]

You're not even using the MW Code Patch? That and the Patch for Purists are essential mods for non-OMW games.

That's your opinion; I personally run Morrowind completely unmodded, unless you count the expansions and official add-ons as mods.

[veti]

You're not even using the MW Code Patch? That and the Patch for Purists are essential mods for non-OMW games.

So, I read the list of fixes, and I still don't see a mention of the bug where: if you make a spell with one timed effect (bound bow) and a spell effect that runs out before the timer (soul trap), then the timed effect becomes permanent.

Have I missed it? Is it still there? Please don't make me go through getting Morrowind to run again just to check it...

[LibraryOgre]

You're not even using the MW Code Patch? That and the Patch for Purists are essential mods for non-OMW games.

I didn't have any of the problems they outlined, tbh.

[Caelestion]

That's your opinion; I personally run Morrowind completely unmodded, unless you count the expansions and official add-ons as mods.

You're right. That is my opinion. Well done.

So, I read the list of fixes, and I still don't see a mention of the bug where: if you make a spell with one timed effect (bound bow) and a spell effect that runs out before the timer (soul trap), then the timed effect becomes permanent.

As far as I know, the Soultrap glitch still exists, but I wouldn't know for certain. I don't have an encyclopaedic knowledge of which glitches weren't fixed!

I didn't have any of the problems they outlined, tbh.

That rather depends on (a) how stable your game is and (b) whether you consider various exploits, such as the Drain Intelligence bug, to be a problem or not, wouldn't you say?

[LibraryOgre]

That rather depends on (a) how stable your game is and (b) whether you consider various exploits, such as the Drain Intelligence bug, to be a problem or not, wouldn't you say?

Fairly stable, and I don't have a problem with the Drain Intelligence bug... especially not since I discovered it after having completed Mournhould and the main quest, so now it's just me ****ing around on Solstheim like a methed up bunny rabbit.

[Caelestion]

One of my favourite pastimes back on the original Xbox was Soul Trap glitching the Jump spell and bouncing around Vvardenfell at a tremendous rate of knots.

[LibraryOgre]

Back to Oblivion. Going through Knights of the Nine first, just so I have it done with before I become king of the thieves and assassins.

[Rynjin]

Back to Oblivion. Going through Knights of the Nine first, just so I have it done with before I become king of the thieves and assassins.

Ah, so you DON'T plan to use anything from the DLC for the rest of your playthrough?

[LibraryOgre]

Ah, so you DON'T plan to use anything from the DLC for the rest of your playthrough?

For the most part? No. I might purge myself of infamy every so often, but, really, I've played this several times before (just never completing the main quest), and I know what I like.

I might skip the Dark Brotherhood quest, though. It takes a while and just leaves me feeling dirty.

[Triaxx]

I honestly never do the 'master of all guilds' thing. Mostly because when I do the Theives Guild and Dark Brotherhood I have to be the right sort of character.
I might go from the theives guild to the Knights of the Nine but that's a character who would never join the Dark Brotherhood.

But someone who's going all in on the DB? Nah they'll join the Thieves because it's a natural fit. I don't care about the lives of people why would I care about the nature of ownership of material goods.

[veti]

Newish Skyrim mod: "Death Consumes All". Mild spoilers follow.

The good: lots of content, some superb quality. The mod's follower is a delight. Voice acting in particular is top notch, best I've heard since - well, Dawnguard really. Atmosphere is great - there's a feeling of helplessness when contemplating an enemy that can't be beaten by stabbing it in the face. The zombies are - well, zombies. They're suitably grotesque, and run the gamut from "naked" to "surprisingly worth looting (but you'll need to be quick, the bodies disappear)".

The bad: serious balance issues. The zombies are, for some reason, pretty much completely immune to fus-ro-dah - which wouldn't matter so much if there weren't literally hundreds of the things in one battle. One battle lasted me from lunchtime til dusk - obviously all living NPCs fool enough to stay outdoors went down in the first wave, leaving me and the companion to handle the next ten-or-whatever-it-was waves all by ourselves. I swear, my one-handed skill has increased 20 points in a couple of days. Another battle was so overwhelming that I just had to toggle god mode: while I was a match for any two or three of the enemies at once, there was no option that didn't involve taking on many times that number.

Also, some iffy quest design. Things that are supposed to happen - just don't, and there's no clue as to why not. If I have to meet some other requirement before I can, for instance, ask a character about something, then for crying out loud give me some hint as to what that requirement might be! There's nothing.

Apparently the writer wanted to avoid the common (and completely justifiable) accusation of spoonfeeding, but I think he's gone rather too far the other way. For instance, at the beginning of the mod, we're told to "go find somebody". That's - pretty much all the clue, you have to go talking to the numerous new NPCs added and ask them "have you seen somebody?" After a while you get a clue as to what the person might look like, and eventually you're told they might have gone "north west". This is a pointer that (I gather) you're supposed to get in Whiterun, but I got it in Windhelm - so I wasted the next half hour combing Dawnstar and Winterhold. There are other instances through the mod, where the clues you're given are maddeningly vague.

And there are other times when you get the dreaded, all-too-specific "Another settlement needs your help!" notice, and you have to rush to its aid. Rorikstead is literally razed to the ground (scripted, unavoidable), but Riverwood can be saved. (Once, at least.) Although saving it may be the wrong thing to do.

Finally: although the plague feels like an enemy that can't be stabbed in the face, guess what the solution is? Hint, it's not about isolation and vaccination.

All in all, I can't recommend this right now. Maybe when more of the bugs are beaten out, and when someone has documented the quests so you have some chance of spotting the difference between "not working" and "not supposed to work" - but my opinion is, it's not yet as cool as it wants to be.

[Rynjin]

Yeah, I picked the mod up, and it's in my estimation in a similar state to how Project AHO was on its initial release; full of potential with a lot of frustrating elements. Some of the SAME frustrating elements, even. Namely the whole "essentially random quest start trigger with no way to opt out once it's started". It's not QUITE as bad as a random NPC walking up to you (which was unavoidable, previously) and going "*BONK* You're a slave now" from AHO, but still pretty bad.

[veti]

Made a big, big mistake today. I tried to upgrade from NMM to Vortex, without finishing my present character first.

Estimated time to rebuild my load order, about a week. That's assuming I don't have to reinstall, which is a real possibility right now.

They tell you it's all simple and straightforward. They lie.

[Rynjin]

Using Vortex? It has some wonky bits to it, and overall I think it has superior overall functionality to NMM, it's just a little less up front user friendly IMO.

Swapping over? Whoever said it was simple is full of ****. Or maybe not. I guess it is "simple and straightforward" in the sense that if you just delete and reinstall every single mod you have ever used, it's simple; just not EASY.

[Lord Raziere]

Using Vortex? It has some wonky bits to it, and overall I think it has superior overall functionality to NMM, it's just a little less up front user friendly IMO.

Swapping over? Whoever said it was simple is full of ****. Or maybe not. I guess it is "simple and straightforward" in the sense that if you just delete and reinstall every single mod you have ever used, it's simple; just not EASY.

Yeeeeah, if that is what it takes to transfer over, my hunch that it would take too much hassle and sticking to NMM was right from the get-go. I've built up my mods too much to do that.