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  1. - Top - End - #91
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    knag's Avatar

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    Default Re: Number of Character Appearances VII - To Absent Friends

    1209: Durkon Allotrope Thundershield, Redcloak
    You found the secret message! Don't forget to edit the wiki!

  2. - Top - End - #92
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    Flumph

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    Default Re: Number of Character Appearances VII - To Absent Friends

    Updated through 1209
    Durkon Allotrope Thundershield (+1), Redcloak (+1), My Morale (-100)

    No, I'm obviously not going to actually include that last one. That would be silly. And engaging in such silliness would be very silly.
    Last edited by Emanick; 2020-08-03 at 11:45 PM.
    Number of Character Appearances VII - To Absent Friends

    Currently playing a level 20 aasimar necromancer named Zebulun Salathiel and a level 9 goliath diviner named Lo-Kag.

    Quote Originally Posted by Fyraltari View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Peelee View Post
    Player: Bob twists the vault door super hard, that should open it.
    DM: Why would you think that?
    Player: Well, Bob thinks it. And since Bob has high Int and Wis, and a lot of points in Dungeoneering, he would probably know a thing or two about how to open vault doors.
    Ah yes, the Dungeon-Kruger effect.

  3. - Top - End - #93
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    GreataxeFighterGirl

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    Default Re: Number of Character Appearances VII - To Absent Friends

    Quote Originally Posted by Emanick View Post
    Updated through 1209
    Durkon Allotrope Thundershield (+1), Redcloak (+1), My Morale (-100)

    No, I'm obviously not going to actually include that last one. That would be silly. And engaging in such silliness would be very silly.
    Out of curiosity, how many times has this last "character" appeared for you?

    ETA: Sorry, this question came out really wrong and insensitive and sounded way better in my head. I meant in essence how many times the comic has delivered soul-crushing morale.
    Last edited by understatement; 2020-08-04 at 01:45 AM.

  4. - Top - End - #94
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    Flumph

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    Default Re: Number of Character Appearances VII - To Absent Friends

    Quote Originally Posted by understatement View Post
    Out of curiosity, how many times has this last "character" appeared for you?
    More times than I can count. Which, given my job here, is saying a lot.
    Number of Character Appearances VII - To Absent Friends

    Currently playing a level 20 aasimar necromancer named Zebulun Salathiel and a level 9 goliath diviner named Lo-Kag.

    Quote Originally Posted by Fyraltari View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Peelee View Post
    Player: Bob twists the vault door super hard, that should open it.
    DM: Why would you think that?
    Player: Well, Bob thinks it. And since Bob has high Int and Wis, and a lot of points in Dungeoneering, he would probably know a thing or two about how to open vault doors.
    Ah yes, the Dungeon-Kruger effect.

  5. - Top - End - #95
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    Default Re: Number of Character Appearances VII - To Absent Friends

    1210: Durkon Allotrope Thundershield, Redcloak, Kraagor (as statue), Minrah Elle Shaleshoe (!)
    A student by vocation, a D&Der by avocation (a wizard by evocation).

    Order of the Stick Trivia XXIII: 50% More Entertaining than Speculating About MitD!

  6. - Top - End - #96
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    Flumph

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    Default Re: Number of Character Appearances VII - To Absent Friends

    Updated through 1210
    Durkon Allotrope Thundershield, Kraagor (as statue), Minrah Elle Shaleshoe (as Large size), Redcloak

    I'm considering adding "imploded" as a "notable alteration," both for Durkon and for the elves that Redcloak imploded way back in Book 5. I'm not sure whether it counts as an "alternate magical form," though - it certainly seems on par with being charmed, which counts, and it's certainly a magical alteration, but is it really an "alternate form"? Thoughts?

    Also, Minrah has now appeared in as many strips as Thog. By that metric, she's now tied as the 19th-most-significant character!
    Last edited by Emanick; 2020-08-16 at 12:58 AM.
    Number of Character Appearances VII - To Absent Friends

    Currently playing a level 20 aasimar necromancer named Zebulun Salathiel and a level 9 goliath diviner named Lo-Kag.

    Quote Originally Posted by Fyraltari View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Peelee View Post
    Player: Bob twists the vault door super hard, that should open it.
    DM: Why would you think that?
    Player: Well, Bob thinks it. And since Bob has high Int and Wis, and a lot of points in Dungeoneering, he would probably know a thing or two about how to open vault doors.
    Ah yes, the Dungeon-Kruger effect.

  7. - Top - End - #97
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    Default Re: Number of Character Appearances VII - To Absent Friends

    Quote Originally Posted by Emanick View Post
    Updated through 1210
    Durkon Allotrope Thundershield, Kraagor (as statue), Minrah Elle Shaleshoe (as Large size), Redcloak

    I'm considering adding "imploded" as a "notable alteration," both for Durkon and for the elves that Redcloak imploded way back in Book 5. I'm not sure whether it counts as an "alternate magical form," though - it certainly seems on par with being charmed, which counts, and it's certainly a magical alteration, but is it really an "alternate form"? Thoughts?

    Also, Minrah has now appeared in as many strips as Thog. By that metric, she's now tied as the 19th-most-significant character!
    By my page count metric she's the 22nd most important character, being the most appearing character to not appear on over 100 pages, 7 more than Bandana and 24 less than the Demon Roaches.

    She'll probably move up past 22nd but I don't know when, as the 21 above her include only six characters that will be fairly stable for awhile, and Thog is the lowest appearing of those with thirty more pages than her.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Schroeswald View Post
    I recognize that Conservation of Detail is Overrated, but I find the event that I am using as evidence for my theory above important enough/given enough focus to qualify for what I call Elan’s Exception, “Who wastes perfectly good foreshadowing like that?”. Also I have never correctly predicted any event in any piece of media so take this theory with a grain of salt (I call this Peelee’s Ye Old Reminder).

  8. - Top - End - #98
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    Quote Originally Posted by Schroeswald View Post
    She'll probably move up past 22nd but I don't know when, as the 21 above her include only six characters that will be fairly stable for awhile,
    That's what I thought, that Minrah will keep appearing and become the sixth member of the Order when Belkar dies. But then the Giant pretty much jossed that in the 2020-03-01 answer post on Patreon. So now I think that no, Minrah will die again in the next fight, before Belkar.

  9. - Top - End - #99
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    Quote Originally Posted by b_jonas View Post
    That's what I thought, that Minrah will keep appearing and become the sixth member of the Order when Belkar dies. But then the Giant pretty much jossed that in the 2020-03-01 answer post on Patreon. So now I think that no, Minrah will die again in the next fight, before Belkar.
    Is Minrah surviving and not joining the Order not an option?

  10. - Top - End - #100
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    Quote Originally Posted by Quebbster View Post
    Is Minrah surviving and not joining the Order not an option?
    Yes, but the first time Minrah died, it caught everyone by surprise, even though it should have been obvious. I won't make that mistake again. This is the last book, so someone has to die. Belkar will, but there will probably be more victims. Elan and Haley probably won't die because of the prophecy. Roy may die, but not before he defeats Xykon. Minrah chose to go to the place where there will probably be a big final confrontation with Xykon and Redcloak, and is actively helping Durkon. She's underleveled and not as developed as a character. Durkon, Minrah, and Vaarsuvius are all prime candidates to die, they could deliberately heroically sacrifice themselves to accomplish something, or just die in the ensuing fight. But Vaarsuvius and Durkon will probably only die later in the comic, whereas Minrah is less protected by the narrative, she could die any time. I wouldn't be too surprised if Redcloak killed him in the next panel. Redcloak may still be in the middle of the effect of his Implosion spell, in which case he can freely target Minrah the next turn. But even if he isn't, he probably has another level 9 spell prepared and some other ways to fight.

  11. - Top - End - #101
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    Default Re: Number of Character Appearances VII - To Absent Friends

    Updated through 1211
    Durkon Allotrope Thundershield, Kraagor (as statue), Minrah Elle Shaleshoe (as Large Size), Redcloak

    Quote Originally Posted by b_jonas View Post
    Yes, but the first time Minrah died, it caught everyone by surprise, even though it should have been obvious. I won't make that mistake again. This is the last book, so someone has to die. Belkar will, but there will probably be more victims. Elan and Haley probably won't die because of the prophecy. Roy may die, but not before he defeats Xykon. Minrah chose to go to the place where there will probably be a big final confrontation with Xykon and Redcloak, and is actively helping Durkon. She's underleveled and not as developed as a character. Durkon, Minrah, and Vaarsuvius are all prime candidates to die, they could deliberately heroically sacrifice themselves to accomplish something, or just die in the ensuing fight. But Vaarsuvius and Durkon will probably only die later in the comic, whereas Minrah is less protected by the narrative, she could die any time. I wouldn't be too surprised if Redcloak killed him in the next panel. Redcloak may still be in the middle of the effect of his Implosion spell, in which case he can freely target Minrah the next turn. But even if he isn't, he probably has another level 9 spell prepared and some other ways to fight.
    Narratively speaking, I don't think Minrah has done quite enough yet to justify her presence in Book 7, so I'll be quite surprised if she dies now (unless Durkon raises her, which now that I think about it seems fairly likely).

    Durkon has died twice already, and his ending is already muddied by the fact that he has messy-but-important responsibilities to grow into back at home. It seems really unlikely that he'll die for good during this book.

    Besides Belkar, V seems like the only member of the Order who might plausibly die a permanent death in this book. I think Elan, Haley and Roy are all probably protected by Elan's prophecy; an ending in which Haley is killed would be a tragedy for Elan, and one in which Roy dies would be bittersweet at best. I guess Minrah could die, but probably not yet.
    Last edited by Emanick; 2020-08-18 at 10:29 PM.
    Number of Character Appearances VII - To Absent Friends

    Currently playing a level 20 aasimar necromancer named Zebulun Salathiel and a level 9 goliath diviner named Lo-Kag.

    Quote Originally Posted by Fyraltari View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Peelee View Post
    Player: Bob twists the vault door super hard, that should open it.
    DM: Why would you think that?
    Player: Well, Bob thinks it. And since Bob has high Int and Wis, and a lot of points in Dungeoneering, he would probably know a thing or two about how to open vault doors.
    Ah yes, the Dungeon-Kruger effect.

  12. - Top - End - #102
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    Quote Originally Posted by Emanick View Post
    Narratively speaking, I don't think Minrah has done quite enough yet to justify her presence in Book 7, so I'll be quite surprised if she dies now (unless Durkon raises her, which now that I think about it seems fairly likely).
    I am not saying that he'll die right now, only that he will probably die before he has a chance to become the sixth member of the Order, so before Belkar dies or soon enough after. Minrah may also survive, but also not become the sixth member because Belkar dies shorty before Xykon and Redcloak are defeated and there's no more need to have an Order of the Stick, but I consider this less likely.

    Update: More relevantly to this thread. In #415 third panel, Xykon says "TeeVo" with a capital "V", but this thread lists them as "Teevo" with a small "v". Is this deliberate, and where does the latter come from?
    Last edited by b_jonas; 2020-08-19 at 05:54 AM.

  13. - Top - End - #103
    Ettin in the Playground
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    Default Re: Number of Character Appearances VII - To Absent Friends

    Teevo itself when it says its name and the most recent mention of it:
    https://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0918.html
    THE SCRYING EYE AT THE END OF STRIP #698 WAS ZZ'DTRI'S (SOURCE)

  14. - Top - End - #104
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    Default Re: Number of Character Appearances VII - To Absent Friends

    #1212: Durkon Allotrope Thundershield, Greyview, Kraagor (as statue), Minrah Elle Shaleshoe (as large size), Oona, Redcloak
    You found the secret message! Don't forget to edit the wiki!

  15. - Top - End - #105
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    Default Re: Number of Character Appearances VII - To Absent Friends

    Updated through 1212
    Durkon Allotrope Thundershield, Greyview, Kraagor (as statue), Minrah Elle Shaleshoe (as Large Size) (+1), Oona, Redcloak (+1)
    Number of Character Appearances VII - To Absent Friends

    Currently playing a level 20 aasimar necromancer named Zebulun Salathiel and a level 9 goliath diviner named Lo-Kag.

    Quote Originally Posted by Fyraltari View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Peelee View Post
    Player: Bob twists the vault door super hard, that should open it.
    DM: Why would you think that?
    Player: Well, Bob thinks it. And since Bob has high Int and Wis, and a lot of points in Dungeoneering, he would probably know a thing or two about how to open vault doors.
    Ah yes, the Dungeon-Kruger effect.

  16. - Top - End - #106
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    WolfInSheepsClothing

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    Default Re: Number of Character Appearances VII - To Absent Friends

    Some interesting (?) facts from the new update:

    Minrah has now spoken more words (2,938) than Qarr, pulling into 27th place.
    Oona jumped over the Cleric of Loki, Thanh, and the Narrator from the intro comics in DCF to 76th place
    Book 7 currently has the 7th highest number of words per panel at 27.35, and it’s in 1st place if you leave out the calendars.

    Also, I’ve done some extrapolation of the word count for this book, based on the previous six data points. Depending on the calculation method, there’s a wide variety of possibilities of lengths:

    Linear best fit: 97,619
    Exponential: 117,330
    5th-order polynomial: 22,636

    If it’s close to the polynomial, we are already over a third of the way into book 7!

  17. - Top - End - #107
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yxylu View Post
    If it’s close to the polynomial, we are already over a third of the way into book 7!
    I'm going to take a wild guess and say that there will be more than one hundred strips in this book, based on, literally everything.
    Arrrgh, here be me extended sig!
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    Quote Originally Posted by Schroeswald View Post
    I recognize that Conservation of Detail is Overrated, but I find the event that I am using as evidence for my theory above important enough/given enough focus to qualify for what I call Elan’s Exception, “Who wastes perfectly good foreshadowing like that?”. Also I have never correctly predicted any event in any piece of media so take this theory with a grain of salt (I call this Peelee’s Ye Old Reminder).

  18. - Top - End - #108
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    Default Re: Number of Character Appearances VII - To Absent Friends

    1213: Durkon Allotrope Thundershield, Greyview, Kraagor (as statue), Minrah Elle Shaleshoe (also as large size), Oona, Redcloak
    Last edited by understatement; 2020-09-03 at 11:13 PM.

  19. - Top - End - #109
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    Flumph

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    Default Re: Number of Character Appearances VII - To Absent Friends

    Updated through 1213
    Durkon Allotrope Thundershield, Greyview, Kraagor (as statue) (as animated statue), Minrah Elle Shaleshoe (as Large Size), Oona, Redcloak

    Redcloak has now appeared in as many online strips as Nale. If Nale isn't careful, he'll lose his status as the main villain of the comic.

    I've added in "alternate magical forms" entries for Team Peregrine Commander and Team Peregrine Lieutenant for when each of them were imploded, and made a couple of other minor tweaks not worth mentioning (spelling and stuff).

    Edit: I'd like to revive the discussion about tweaking the categories we place each character in. Back in May, I proposed raising the threshold for who counts as a "supporting" or "secondary" character, but after 2.5 cats replied, the conversation quite understandably turned elsewhere when somebody raised the question of whether martianmister might still be alive. I think it's a question worth bringing up again, though.

    Here's 2.5 cats's suggestion for a new set of categories:

    Quote Originally Posted by 2.5 cats View Post
    Seems reasonable. How about...

    Major: 60+
    Secondary: 30 - 59
    Supporting: 20 - 29
    Recurring: 11 - 19 (If you're feeling ambitious, make it 10 - 19).
    Personally, I think this is the best solution. I was going to suggest making the Supporting Characters bracket a bit wider, but I noticed that that would make the Secondary Characters bracket a little too small. Besides, characters like Gontor, Eugene and Sigdi seem more like Secondary Characters than Supporting ones anyway.
    Last edited by Emanick; 2020-09-05 at 11:39 PM.
    Number of Character Appearances VII - To Absent Friends

    Currently playing a level 20 aasimar necromancer named Zebulun Salathiel and a level 9 goliath diviner named Lo-Kag.

    Quote Originally Posted by Fyraltari View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Peelee View Post
    Player: Bob twists the vault door super hard, that should open it.
    DM: Why would you think that?
    Player: Well, Bob thinks it. And since Bob has high Int and Wis, and a lot of points in Dungeoneering, he would probably know a thing or two about how to open vault doors.
    Ah yes, the Dungeon-Kruger effect.

  20. - Top - End - #110
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    Lizardfolk

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    Default Re: Number of Character Appearances VII - To Absent Friends

    Quote Originally Posted by Emanick View Post
    Updated through 1213
    Durkon Allotrope Thundershield, Greyview, Kraagor (as statue) (as animated statue), Minrah Elle Shaleshoe (as Large Size), Oona, Redcloak

    Redcloak has now appeared in as many online strips as Nale. If Nale isn't careful, he'll lose his status as the main villain of the comic.
    Redcloak being a more important character than Nale? Perish the thought!

  21. - Top - End - #111
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    Default Re: Number of Character Appearances VII - To Absent Friends

    Redcloak and Nale were never the real villains. The real villains of OotS are Xykon and Trigak.
    Last edited by b_jonas; 2020-09-06 at 03:46 AM.

  22. - Top - End - #112
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    Flumph

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    Default Re: Number of Character Appearances VII - To Absent Friends

    Quote Originally Posted by b_jonas View Post
    Redcloak and Nale were never the real villains. The real villains of OotS are Xykon and Trigak.
    I'm still pulling for a surprise appearance from Yakyak - I know we're all expecting Trigak to be the final Big Bad, which is what would make that kind of surprise reveal so effective.

    On a much less important note, I've finally updated the thread to reflect the change in how we've decided to treat vampires. In accordance with the methodology we discussed earlier, there are about a half-dozen minor characters gone (e.g. Vampire Spirit with Blonde Hair), another half-dozen or so added (e.g. Vampire Goliath), and some characters now have more appearances than they used to (e.g. Vampire Sandstone). I've also gotten rid of the "interesting alterations" that simply reflected a character who had been vampirized (with the exception of Vampire Roy in Haley and Belkar's imagination, since that was definitely a significant visual alteration but not a new character as such).

    There are also some other updates - I realized that there are a number of alterations that haven't been updated in ages, such as the number of times Redcloak has appeared with one eye and the number of times Vaarsuvius has appeared as an invisible outline. Hopefully the thread should now be fully up to speed, with the exception of the smilies for the new characters, which I really have to get around to dealing with sooner or later.
    Number of Character Appearances VII - To Absent Friends

    Currently playing a level 20 aasimar necromancer named Zebulun Salathiel and a level 9 goliath diviner named Lo-Kag.

    Quote Originally Posted by Fyraltari View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Peelee View Post
    Player: Bob twists the vault door super hard, that should open it.
    DM: Why would you think that?
    Player: Well, Bob thinks it. And since Bob has high Int and Wis, and a lot of points in Dungeoneering, he would probably know a thing or two about how to open vault doors.
    Ah yes, the Dungeon-Kruger effect.

  23. - Top - End - #113
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    Default Re: Number of Character Appearances VII - To Absent Friends

    Quote Originally Posted by Emanick View Post


    Here's 2.5 cats's suggestion for a new set of categories:
    I endorse upping the category requirements to the 2.5 cat's brackets. I might suggest we make the cutoff for secondary to be 29, just to preserve Tsukiko on that list.
    You found the secret message! Don't forget to edit the wiki!

  24. - Top - End - #114
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    WolfInSheepsClothing

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    Default Re: Number of Character Appearances VII - To Absent Friends

    For 1214:

    Durkon Allotrope Thundershield
    Greyview
    Kraagor (as statue) (as animated statue)
    Minrah Elle Shaleshoe
    Oona
    Redcloak
    Xykon

    Plus Oona’s Bug Swarm and 4 panels with sound effects, for those keeping track.

  25. - Top - End - #115
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    WolfInSheepsClothing

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    Default Re: Number of Character Appearances VII - To Absent Friends

    For 1215:

    Durkon Allotrope Thundershield
    Kraagor (as statue) (as animated statue?)
    Minrah Elle Shaleshoe
    Redcloak
    Xykon

    Plus Oona’s Bug Swarm and 5 panels with sound effects.

  26. - Top - End - #116
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    Default Re: Number of Character Appearances VII - To Absent Friends

    If the Fire Ants from 36/38 count, then so do the bugs-in-a-jar. Oona's Bugs? Distracting Insect Swarm?
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  27. - Top - End - #117
    Ettin in the Playground
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    Default Re: Number of Character Appearances VII - To Absent Friends

    Bugbear Bugs?
    THE SCRYING EYE AT THE END OF STRIP #698 WAS ZZ'DTRI'S (SOURCE)

  28. - Top - End - #118
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    Default Re: Number of Character Appearances VII - To Absent Friends

    Quote Originally Posted by Gift Jeraff View Post
    Bugbear Bugs?
    Oooh I like what you did there. Pre-emptively updating the wiki to that name in hopes the tail will wag the dog.
    You found the secret message! Don't forget to edit the wiki!

  29. - Top - End - #119
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    Quote Originally Posted by knag View Post
    Oooh I like what you did there. Pre-emptively updating the wiki to that name in hopes the tail will wag the dog.
    I just updated my tally with that name.

    I won’t be sad to see them go. Zooming way in to count pixels is not super fun (I get 897 in ten panels).

  30. - Top - End - #120
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    Default Re: Number of Character Appearances VII - To Absent Friends

    Quote Originally Posted by Yxylu View Post
    I just updated my tally with that name.

    I won’t be sad to see them go. Zooming way in to count pixels is not super fun (I get 897 in ten panels).
    No you didn't! You counted them? Did you... did you by any chance get a count of how many are in 1214 and how many are in 1215?
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