Star Wars: The Skywalker Saga Movie Review

[Bartmanhomer]

I'm going to post Star Wars Episode 3: Revenge Of The Sith later on and in case you haven't noticed by now I'm going to post each episode every day so that 1 episode-1 day so that makes it 9 episodes-9 days so that everybody will have a chance to comment their own thoughts and opinions with the movie.

[Raimun]

Here's my summary of all Star Wars movies and what I think about them:

Phantom Menace: I think it's better than people give it credit. Okay, Jar Jar is just a horrible character with no redeeming qualities but if you ignore him (I always did), the rest of the movie is a pretty solid adventure movie. Liam Neeson and Ewan McGregor give us a good look at what the Jedi were all about before all the galactic wars. I also like the world building, including the senate bits and how it starts to slowly build up the ultimate villain of the series. The final multilayered battle is actually really good (there's a ground, space and covert battle and a lightsaber duel happening all at once!) and I especially liked Duel of the Fates theme and the choreography of the lightsaber duel. Darth Maul was all style over substance but even as a kid in 1999, I knew who the real villain was... which wasn't hard to figure out since I knew from EU that The Emperor is named Palpatine. I were able to see his double dealing scheme even back then, which is something that many people didn't get back then. Still, not among my favorite Star Wars-movies but I kind of like it.

Attack of the Clones: I think this was worse than Phantom Menace. The pacing and plot are all over the place and the quality of the dialogue hit an all time low. Christoper Lee's villain Count Dooku was kind of cool but I remember being confused about this new bad guy, especially since you don't even see what he's all about until about halfway of the movie. While the beginning where Anakin and Obi-Wan were together was interesting, all the bits with Anakin and Padme were just... ugh. Basically, the only good bits in this movie are those where Obi-Wan is around, he's consistently brilliant in the PT. The ending with all the fighting was better than than the middle but I don't think the Battle of Geonosis is among the best battles in the series, even though this kind of spectacle really should be there. Even the lightsaber battles at the end were kind of impactless, even though the fight choreography is still solid. I don't hate this, I just think this is mediocre.

The Revenge of the Sith: This is good. So good. While there are still problems with the dialogue, everything else works really well. There are personal stakes and drama, war, world building, big culmination points in the story and more lightsaber battles than in the entire Original Trilogy. This is good.

New Hope: The story is really basic but I think that works in its favor. I always enjoy watching how this grand fictional universe began.

Empire Strikes Back: It's a movie classic, both inside and outside of Star Wars-fandom. The only really original view point I have about this movie or the previous one is that I think Han Solo is a really overrated character. Basically, his character arc was completed in the previous movie and from this point on, he's kind of just driving a ship and hanging around in the story. Sure, he has that budding relationship with Leia but outside of that, Solo doesn't really add much to the story on his own. And he's not even a jedi or anything. Good blasters are no match for force powers and ancient weapons at your side, as Darth Vader demonstrated to him in this movie.

The Return of the Jedi: I think this is the most uneven film of the original trilogy. The first quarter (or is it even the first third?) of the film where they are rescuing this one guy was too long and de-escalated the galactic conflict. I really think they should have cut it down. Maybe start everything in media res at the Sarlacc Pit when Luke is about to jump down and Leia thaws Han there instead of earlier and Han doesn't need to recover in a cell but is still temporarily blind? The ewoks are also kind of meh. I understand what they were trying to do with them and I kind of like it but I guess they should have been wookies instead.
The rest of the film is good however and I really like how they resolved the story. The previous movie had a big twist at the end that everyone talks about but I think this one had one too. I think I were surprised to see Vader changing sides at the very end.

[KillianHawkeye]

even the Jedi Republican.

{scrubbed}

[Delta]

Prequel Trilogy: So.... The first jarring issue is that.... well. The first two movies are utterly irrelevant. Like, I enjoy both Phantom Menace and to a much lesser degree Attack of the Clones. But the only movie that really meshes with the OT is Revenge of the Sith which is easily my favorite of the three. Specifically to Phantom Menace, one of the main issues is Quigon. You get to like Quigon, he's a fun look at a 'loose cannon' jedi knight. Then he dies and the rest of the trilogy is the Jedi council smashing 'CONFORM' into Anakin's face over and over again. Which is another problem with the trilogy, nobody takes even a moment to look at the elephant in the room of Anakin's slipping stability. The closest you get is some concern from Obi-wan in RotS, but for the most part, NOONE seems at all concerned about the chosen ones mental health and how he's not reacting well to being told to temper his ambition.

TBF, I think this is kind of the point. "Jedi Hubris - The Trilogy" could be the subtitle to the prequels as a whole. The Jedi as a whole are so busy being so absolutely certain of their moral superiority that they hardly ever consider even the possibility of a full-fledged Jedi falling to the Dark Side, while Anakin throughout EP2 and especially 3 is just in desparate need of someone to talk to, while in the end everyone just talks over him, leading him to the only guy who seems willing to actually listen to the problems that torture him.

Especially if you watch Clone Wars this becomes even more obvious, the Jedi are most definitely not simply the good guys. Their reaction to the Republic growing corrupt and unable to act (which, to be honest, doesn't ever seem very "democratic" to begin with, accepting hereditary monarchies into their ranks where Senators are just appointed by the royal rulers...) is just expanding their ridiculously unchecked dictatorial powers until there isn't much left from the original idea of a democracy, if there ever was one (Jedi have total immunity from both government oversight and the legal system, and have control of the military on top of that... yeah), at the end of EP2, the Republic has for all intents and purposes already turned into a militaristic theocracy (if you consider Jedi a religion) and they are so convinced of doing the right thing that they actually believe they are doing all this to fight for freedom and democracy.

[PopeLinus1]

{scrubbed}

[Vinyadan]

Episode 2, for me, was surprisingly bad. Dooku appeared too late, as someone well-known to the heroes, but unknown to us. Obi-Wan went on a hard-to-follow detective mission that started with a jarring scene in a modern diner, talking with familiarity to someone we had never seen and will never show up again. Then there was the fest of "told-not-shown": a planet we cannot see on the map can be located thanks to a gravity field that we also cannot see. Once on the planet, we find out that a jedi we never saw or heard about and whose reasons remain mysterious ordered a giant army. And the plot focuses on a law about raising an army. Yet the Republic had no oversight over the Kamino business, in spite of needing a law to raise an army? And the Kaminoans do that routinely?
But I never noticed before that there was a law to fight about (again, told-not-shown). It completely went over my head. This is because they never explain its significance in the movie: that it's the reason why Padme was almost killed, because Palpa wanted an army, but Padme didn't want to give it to him (instead, in the movie, iirc the separatists want her dead, to their own detriment). And then Jar Jar gave Palpatine emergency powers, which is the usual problem of badly explained institutions.

The final part, however, was the one that I really didn't like. First we have the cavalry (the Jedi), then we have the cavalry (the Clone Army), then again the cavalry (Yoda during the duel). There was no clear sense of space or progression. The jedi enter an arena and place themselves all in prime target position. Lots of CGI for the sake of it. Fett dies unsatisfactorily, probably in an attempt to show off Mace Windu.

And R2D2 was turned into some weird sort of unlikable flying jerk.

And how does jedi resignation works? Are all resigned jedi evil?

And the love story doesn't advance the plot at all. Anakin's life story is completely disjointed from the plot, which intuitively is a problem.

What's good about this movie? The seismic charges, those are great. I also like the Kaminoans and their chairs. For the rest, even Dooku's duel is good to watch as a clip, but only dragged on an already overlong movie and didn't add anything plot-wise.

[Delta]

One more nice thing to think about regarding the clone army:

So, we have a Republic that's a republic in name only, it's corrupt, unable to act, the true power lies with the Jedi or some bureaucratic officers. Some people don't like that. Those people belong to organizations that at least going by their name, sound a lot more meritocratic than the Jedi where you get your power as a birthright. Those people try to secede and when the Republic doesn't like that, they build robots to fight for their independence (now of course that opens a whole other can of worms that androids in Star Wars seem to be pretty much full fledged personalities quite capable of independent thought and decision making, but literally everyone in the universe is quite willing to ignore that and consider them property to be used, memory wiped or simply discarded at will, so let's not go there...)

What do the Jedi and the Republic do? They remove the last semblance of democracy by giving all lawmaking power to the Chancellor (up to the point where even lawspeaking is under his control, given how he supervises a trial for treason where it's clearly established that he and a couple Senators can have someone sentenced to death {scrubbed}, then raise a bought-and-paid-for slave army (and it is established canon that for a clone to refuse to fight is considered treason and desertion, up to the point where they can be executed in the field if their CO thinks that's necessary) and place that under the command of the Jedi to force the Separatists back into the fold, no matter how many slaves die along the way.

{scrubbed}

[PopeLinus1]

One more nice thing to think about regarding the clone army:

So, we have a Republic that's a republic in name only, it's corrupt, unable to act, the true power lies with the Jedi or some bureaucratic officers. Some people don't like that. Those people belong to organizations that at least going by their name, sound a lot more meritocratic than the Jedi where you get your power as a birthright. Those people try to secede and when the Republic doesn't like that, they build robots to fight for their independence (now of course that opens a whole other can of worms that androids in Star Wars seem to be pretty much full fledged personalities quite capable of independent thought and decision making, but literally everyone in the universe is quite willing to ignore that and consider them property to be used, memory wiped or simply discarded at will, so let's not go there...)

What do the Jedi and the Republic do? They remove the last semblance of democracy by giving all lawmaking power to the Chancellor (up to the point where even lawspeaking is under his control, given how he supervises a trial for treason where it's clearly established that he and a couple Senators can have someone sentenced to death {scrub the post, scrub the quote}, then raise a bought-and-paid-for slave army (and it is established canon that for a clone to refuse to fight is considered treason and desertion, up to the point where they can be executed in the field if their CO thinks that's necessary) and place that under the command of the Jedi to force the Separatists back into the fold, no matter how many slaves die along the way.

{scrub the post, scrub the quote}

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[Iskar Jarak]

Honestly, The Last Jedi is my favourite of the sequel trilogy. It comes the closest to being a functional movie and has some individually good moments.
The Force Awakens gets too much credit for what it is: a cynical nostalgia-fest without a story of its own.

Spoiler: Rise of Skywalker

Show

The Rise of Skywalker is terrible. I watched it a few days ago. I was expecting a passable action flick but it was boring and exhausting to watch for the first two thirds and outright laughable in the last. Drama and tension are built on cause and effect and clear stakes. This film doesn't understand that. You know your movie is fundamentally broken when a character spins off into the desert at high speed and explodes -- explodes -- and the movie doesn't even try to pretend he's dead or seriously injured. What happens in one scene has little relevance to the next. There are no consequences. The film degenerates into a complete mess of "and then"s in the "finale". It literally feels like the movie was written by a child. A particularly stupid one.
J.J. must be endlessly confused by movies like No Country for Old Men. How can there be tension without planets exploding? We'll never know. If J.J was in charge, the villain would have been a small Death Star. Or perhaps a cloud of even smaller ones.

I've seen people try and excuse the film's hideous pacing because the Last Jedi failed to set it up (which it did). But there's no rising action, just over an hour and a half of pointless, nonsensical, exhausting MacGuffin harvesting. Previously, for me, only Kingsman 2 had captured that special feeling of your soul draining away, but Rise of Skywalker managed to pull it off as well. He filled the time he had with pointless nonsense so he could move onto his "awesome" finale.
I haven't a clue about choregraphy, but it was visibly bad. Ren stabs somebody while moonwalking and later literally bends over and holds his lightsaber behind his back and waits for someone to stab it.
There are no good and memorable shots.
The plot isn't worth talking about except to note its exceptional laziness.
The scenes where J.J pokes at the Last Jedi were amusing, if only because they were so petty and spiteful. The only explanation for Planet Strobe-Light I can come up with is that someone told J.J. that Rian Johnson had epilepsy.
The one moment of real emotion I had was the scene where Chewie learns of the death of Leia. The movie does nothing to earn that scene though -- Chewie has nothing to do this film. Like the other characters without the Force.

I acquired an irrational hatred for Beard, the Expositor and Goggles McExposition. I hate their complete absence of personality; their nonsensical exposition; how they remind me that J.J was too lazy to work exposition in a scene properly and created these abominations instead. I hates them.

I genuinely think this is the worst Star Wars film. Its laziness, desperation and cynicism make it outright repulsive.

[Delta]

Also, if you look at it as a trilogy of trilogies, the main message seems to be: Oh boy, those Jedi are wrong about just about everything, aren't they?

Especially regarding the whole "No attachments!" rule, why did everything so terribly wrong in EP3? Because Anakin was afraid for Padme, but couldn't actually talk to the Jedi about it because he wasn't allowed to be afraid for her (and when he even hinted at anything like this to Yoda, his very helpful advice was "Well, if you're afraid for someone else, you should distance yourself from them and just forget about them!"), and the only guy who at least pretended to take his problems seriously and try to help him was Palpatine.

Then we go to EP6, what saved the day in the end? Oh, right, the fact that Anakin-turned-Vader, for all his villainy villainness, still loved his son. Had he actually followed the Jedi code and distanced himself from emotional attachments, that would've been a very bleak end for Luke on the floor of the Emperor's throne room.

And what is it that made Kylo/Ben finally refuse the Dark Side and help him and Rey bring down Palpatine 2 (Dark Side Boogaloo)? Oh, right, those same emotional attachments the Jedi are so very no-no about.

[Peelee]

TBF, I think this is kind of the point. "Jedi Hubris - The Trilogy" could be the subtitle to the prequels as a whole. The Jedi as a whole are so busy being so absolutely certain of their moral superiority that they hardly ever consider even the possibility of a full-fledged Jedi falling to the Dark Side, while Anakin throughout EP2 and especially 3 is just in desparate need of someone to talk to, while in the end everyone just talks over him, leading him to the only guy who seems willing to actually listen to the problems that torture him.

I strongly disagree; or, at the very least, strongly disagree that it was executed that way. Mace Windu is the only one who really fits that category (and, unsurprisingly, the PT Jedi I most dislike). Yoda constantly urges caution, Kenobi constantly tries to reign Anakin in, and no other Jedi really interact with Anakin or the audience.

[Keltest]

I strongly disagree; or, at the very least, strongly disagree that it was executed that way. Mace Windu is the only one who really fits that category (and, unsurprisingly, the PT Jedi I most dislike). Yoda constantly urges caution, Kenobi constantly tries to reign Anakin in, and no other Jedi really interact with Anakin or the audience.

Indeed. The impression I got just from the movies was that it was Anakin who didn't want to talk to the Jedi about his problems, not the other way around.

Its been a little bit, but my recall is that in AoC, he actually does talk to Yoda about his concerns over his force visions, and basically gets told "life sucks sometimes and we cant control it, so we need to accept it and not let it break us or dictate who we are." which is reasonable advice for a jedi, but not what Anakin wanted to hear.

[Vinyadan]

Indeed. The impression I got just from the movies was that it was Anakin who didn't want to talk to the Jedi about his problems, not the other way around.

Its been a little bit, but my recall is that in AoC, he actually does talk to Yoda about his concerns over his force visions, and basically gets told "life sucks sometimes and we cant control it, so we need to accept it and not let it break us or dictate who we are." which is reasonable advice for a jedi, but not what Anakin wanted to hear.

It's in Ep. 3. "Train yourself to let go of everything you fear to lose."

[Lvl 2 Expert]

From memory, my 2 cents:

Episode 1: Whiny kid, sure, too much emphasis on wacky special effects, I'll give you that, but the dynamic between the two jedi was pretty nice, and pod racing is still easily the most Star Wars thing ever. Just for that I'm going to remember it as the best prequel movie. This one and the second made for probably the best Darths & Droids comics, because they're complex and nonsensical, but not overly so, on both counts.

Episode 2: Like the first movie it went bigger than the original trilogy, inspiring more of a sense of a sprawling complex galaxy. That part works. Whiny adult Anakin is not nearly as badly acted as whiny child Anakin, but is far less of a forgivable character. You're on solid ground here, you're not working with a child actor or doing any kind of creative original character, this is stock stuff, you have to nail it. I feel like this movie was supposed to set up a bunch of stuff that was never used, like perhaps Darth Darth Binks being the master while Palpatine merely becomes the latest apprentice. That would make sense of Palpatine's character arc here, and it would help explain the difference in jedi and sith power levels between these trilogies. It would also be silly, sure, and it might have made for a really bad movie 3. But as it is movie 2 suffers from paths like this being left untraveled.

Episode 3: Darths & Droids had trouble making sense of this sometimes, and their trade is nonsense. There's too much going on, and not enough of it is actually really that important to the story being told. It's one of those movies where you can find yourself snoring through the battlescenes because you stopped caring three galactic council meetings ago.

Episode 4: It's a little amateuristic, honestly. And that hurts it in scenes like the Death Star run. Plus as a stand alone movie it doesn't offer enough answers or closure. It's at least somewhat of a deliberate stylistic choice, the movie was made to look like an old serial feature, but still. Viewed in context of the full series it's probably still the second best movie, but it's also clearly at best only the second best movie.

Episode 5: The pacing is just spot on in this one. The dialogue is clear. The action serves to support the plot. This is a really well told story. It's not overly spectacular through a modern audience's eyes, but it works really well, either as a stand alone movie or as part of the larger series. As far as I'm concerned this movie is the reason the first one became a huge classic rather than a one day fly turned small time cult phenomenon. Remember: this is the one that introduced the Imperial March. It's also the first one that had actual sword fighting.

Episode 6: Some things here are better executed then in part 4. The effects are more convincing, the action is bigger. It's just a little goofed up. And it doesn't completely work. As much as the child in me doesn't want to admit it: the ewoks don't work. Depending on your mood this film might hold up less well than part 1 or 2, though as a product of its time I think it's actually kind of fine.

Episode 7: Well done. Not overly innovative, but well done. It's a good Star Wars movie. It can compete with Episode 4 if you're willing to overlook that it was almost a remake of Episode 4.

Episode 8: Die in a trashcan fire. This thing is an hour too long, and the message of the movie is "Star Wars is bad", because why do cool stuff when you can carefully overthink your actions and not be rash about anything? They have a really good point in the real world, but not in Star Wars.

Episode 9: Haven't seen it yet. Might take me a while to get to it.

Rogue 1: Another movie that might be able to duke it out with Episode 4, which puts it in the top 4 at least. It's a decently done guerrilla movie, with only slightly too much screen time for digital dead people.

Solo: Meh, something is off about it. It doesn't feel like Han Solo all that much. But I'll give them that the whole heist movie style plot was pretty cool.

Caravan of Courage: An Ewok Adventure: I think this was the not bad one of the two, actually kind of entertaining. It's not really up to the level of the good and decent mainline films, but at the very least the ewoks aren't misplaced here, making this a better way to spend your time than screaming at an hour long overly slow chase scene to start moving already.

Ewoks: The Battle for Endor: And that would make this the not not bad one. It already had no budget or grand scale, and then they went and made it a bad movie.

The holiday special: Haven't seen it. Or rather, I think I started on it at some point, but it just wasn't entertaining, and I didn't have any hopes of it becoming more so. Probably ranks between episode 8 and the bad ewoks movie, so it doesn't quite have to die in a trashcan fire.

Anything else, including several Clone Wars versions: I have to draw the line somewhere. Come back when you're live action, and/or good, and/or I've seen you.

[Peelee]

pod racing is still easily the most Star Wars thing ever.

I never really got that impression. I always felt it was a bloated, extraneous scene that was pretty much put in purely for a video game tie-in.

[Keltest]

I never really got that impression. I always felt it was a bloated, extraneous scene that was pretty much put in purely for a video game tie-in.

The two aren't mutually exclusive. Part of the charm of Star Wars is there being more species and cultures and such than bricks in a tub of Lego.

If nothing else, it looked cool, though it might have been better served if the stakes on it hadn't been so high. Anakin was obviously going to win, the plot cant go forward with anything less.

[Peelee]

The two aren't mutually exclusive. Part of the charm of Star Wars is there being more species and cultures and such than bricks in a tub of Lego.

If nothing else, it looked cool, though it might have been better served if the stakes on it hadn't been so high. Anakin was obviously going to win, the plot cant go forward with anything less.

Fair point, but the scene didn't really scream "Star Wars" to me. It was mostly just a race for the race's sake with quasi-spaceships, a couple of "look at how funny this guy is/looks" aliens (I'm looking at you, Ben Quadrinaros and Fode and Beed), and a couple of Star Wars characters thrown in to make it relevant. I didn't even think it really looked that cool, but my biggest complaint by far was how long it took. Which is even worse given that there is zero tension.

[Lvl 2 Expert]

O, the actual scene wasn't very good, I agree. The thing itself is super Star Wars. It's exciting, retro-futuristic, realistically nonsensical, an adventure in and of itself, showy in its execution, and the fact that it is performed in front of audiences that haven't invented sunglasses yet just adds that extra touch of weird.

Those unipod ekranoplan things from episode 8 are just kind of bad to be the most Star Wars thing ever, walker tanks are too slow (although those AT-ST chicken walkers are pretty cool), speeder-bikes are just a tad too normal and useful, so pod racers it is.

[Keltest]

Fair point, but the scene didn't really scream "Star Wars" to me. It was mostly just a race for the race's sake with quasi-spaceships, a couple of "look at how funny this guy is/looks" aliens (I'm looking at you, Ben Quadrinaros and Fode and Beed), and a couple of Star Wars characters thrown in to make it relevant. I didn't even think it really looked that cool, but my biggest complaint by far was how long it took. Which is even worse given that there is zero tension.

The same thing could be said about the death star run. Obviously it isn't going to end with Luke getting shot and Yavin IV blown up.

From a narrative purpose the point is to demonstrate Anakin's piloting skills, and by extension his affinity with the Force. They could have tightened it up a bit, sure, but overall its actually pretty close to the trench run, but with more aliens.

[Peelee]

O, the actual scene wasn't very good, I agree. The thing itself is super Star Wars. It's exciting, retro-futuristic, realistically nonsensical, an adventure in and of itself, showy in its execution, and the fact that it is performed in front of audiences that haven't invented sunglasses yet just adds that extra touch of weird.

That's actually exactly the sort of commentary I was hoping to get (in the first draft of my response I actually asked "how so?", but deleted it because I thought it came off as possibly aggressive or flippant). I didn't see what was Star-Wars-y about it at first, but that breakdown pretty much nails it, and yeah, I now totally agree with you on that.

ETA:

The same thing could be said about the death star run. Obviously it isn't going to end with Luke getting shot and Yavin IV blown up.

From a narrative purpose the point is to demonstrate Anakin's piloting skills, and by extension his affinity with the Force. They could have tightened it up a bit, sure, but overall its actually pretty close to the trench run, but with more aliens.

It's not because the conclusion is foregone, though. It's that there's simply no tension. We know Luke is going to destroy the Death Star, but it's still a tense scene. Heck, in Better Call Saul, we know that Saul will survive to be in Breaking Bad, and even for those who haven't seen BB (like me, when I first got into BCS), every season begins with shots of him in the future. But there are still scenes where Saul/Jimmy is in danger, where there is an incredibly amount of tension. Lucas wasn't able to really capture that.

[Keltest]

It's not because the conclusion is foregone, though. It's that there's simply no tension. We know Luke is going to destroy the Death Star, but it's still a tense scene. Heck, in Better Call Saul, we know that Saul will survive to be in Breaking Bad, and even for those who haven't seen BB (like me, when I first got into BCS), every season begins with shots of him in the future. But there are still scenes where Saul/Jimmy is in danger, where there is an incredibly amount of tension. Lucas wasn't able to really capture that.

Maybe its just because Episode 1 is to me what episode 4 is to you (ie you grew up with it and it was your introduction to Star Wars) but to me there is plenty of tension in the scene.

Could you explain where you think the tension comes from in the trench run that isn't present in the pod race? Besides the race maybe going on a bit long, they seem structured pretty similarly to me.

[Peelee]

Maybe its just because Episode 1 is to me what episode 4 is to you (ie you grew up with it and it was your introduction to Star Wars) but to me there is plenty of tension in the scene.

Could you explain where you think the tension comes from in the trench run that isn't present in the pod race? Besides the race maybe going on a bit long, they seem structured pretty similarly to me.

So funny story, I only really saw Episode IV because my dad wanted to take me to the Special Edition that was coming out, he thought I'd enjoy it. So there was only a 2-year gap between seeing Episode IV and Episode I, I was right in the target demographic for TPM when it came out. The funny part here is I'd heard so much about how Star Wars was so great and everyone loved it and I'm finally watching it and my initial impression after the first minute was, "what is this, just a book in movie form? I'm just going to read the whole thing? Why do people like this?" And then I was completely blown away for the entire rest of the two hours.

Anyway, the music is significantly more tense in the trench run than the podrace (though I think the score from the first movie is the best across the whole series, so there is some bias there). Anakin starts out at a severe disadvantage and catches up to the leader by the second round, so he should win handily as his podracer clearly exceeds the others, but he slows down inexplicably for the final lap, effectively manufacturing tension, which doesn't work. Anakin's problems are also relatively minor; the piece Sebulba broke off causes issues, which are fixed by Anakin pressing a button and flipping a switch, whereas Luke has to have someone else come in and save his life as Luke was too far out of range while Vader had him in his sights (the saving was also the culmination of Han's arc in the movie). The ANH scene was also at the end of the movie, so despite the near-certainty that the heroes will win, there is the incredibly small chance that something unexpected will happen, while the podrace was smack in the middle, so we know it is not the climax and Anakin either has to win to advance the story, or lose and the Jedi will manipulate events to get Anakin regardless, so we don't really need to see the race (or, at least, not so much of it). There's the comic relief throughout the race; Ben and the announcers periodically check in to attempt to add in humor, which undercuts the tension that would otherwise be building up. Meanwhile, the attack on the Death Star is nothing but danger throughout. And finally, there's the reasoning behind each scene. The Death Star attack is borne out of pure desperation, while Anakin is literally going "yipee!" at the chance to podrace. The narrative reason for the scenes to exist to begin with are already on significantly different levels of tension, and how they play out underscores that.

[Keltest]

So funny story, I only really saw Episode IV because my dad wanted to take me to the Special Edition that was coming out, he thought I'd enjoy it. So there was only a 2-year gap between seeing Episode IV and Episode I, I was right in the target demographic for TPM when it came out. The funny part here is I'd heard so much about how Star Wars was so great and everyone loved it and I'm finally watching it and my initial impression after the first minute was, "what is this, just a book in movie form? I'm just going to read the whole thing? Why do people like this?" And then I was completely blown away for the entire rest of the two hours.

Anyway, the music is significantly more tense in the trench run than the podrace (though I think the score from the first movie is the best across the whole series, so there is some bias there). Anakin starts out at a severe disadvantage and catches up to the leader by the second round, so he should win handily as his podracer clearly exceeds the others, but he slows down inexplicably for the final lap, effectively manufacturing tension, which doesn't work. Anakin's problems are also relatively minor; the piece Sebulba broke off causes issues, which are fixed by Anakin pressing a button and flipping a switch, whereas Luke has to have someone else come in and save his life as Luke was too far out of range while Vader had him in his sights (the saving was also the culmination of Han's arc in the movie). The ANH scene was also at the end of the movie, so despite the near-certainty that the heroes will win, there is the incredibly small chance that something unexpected will happen, while the podrace was smack in the middle, so we know it is not the climax and Anakin either has to win to advance the story, or lose and the Jedi will manipulate events to get Anakin regardless, so we don't really need to see the race (or, at least, not so much of it). There's the comic relief throughout the race; Ben and the announcers periodically check in to attempt to add in humor, which undercuts the tension that would otherwise be building up. Meanwhile, the attack on the Death Star is nothing but danger throughout. And finally, there's the reasoning behind each scene. The Death Star attack is borne out of pure desperation, while Anakin is literally going "yipee!" at the chance to podrace. The narrative reason for the scenes to exist to begin with are already on significantly different levels of tension, and how they play out underscores that.

As far as his pod's speed goes, the fact that he isn't forced to dodge out of the way of all the other racers is likely how he's able to catch up. Ultimately, I think it may just be a matter of personal taste. I literally re-watched the pod scene while waiting for a reply (well, technically im watching the whole movie) and actually seeing his pod fall apart and catch fire is plenty tension inducing to me. It comes with a shot of his HUD that suggests that he has to cannibalize one of the engines to get the other working at all, so if he cant slow down Sebulba then he's hosed. None of what you said is factually wrong, but you make it sound duller than I find it in practice. Except for the score bit; im pretty sure that both the trench run and the podrace actually have no music at all once they get started until the climax of each, so I think at least one of us is misremembering there.

[Peelee]

As far as his pod's speed goes, the fact that he isn't forced to dodge out of the way of all the other racers is likely how he's able to catch up. Ultimately, I think it may just be a matter of personal taste. I literally re-watched the pod scene while waiting for a reply (well, technically im watching the whole movie) and actually seeing his pod fall apart and catch fire is plenty tension inducing to me. It comes with a shot of his HUD that suggests that he has to cannibalize one of the engines to get the other working at all, so if he cant slow down Sebulba then he's hosed. None of what you said is factually wrong, but you make it sound duller than I find it in practice. Except for the score bit; im pretty sure that both the trench run and the podrace actually have no music at all once they get started until the climax of each, so I think at least one of us is misremembering there.

Even before handicapping his engines to make up for the flaw (which I hadn't thought of, that makes sense), by the time he caught up with Sebulba it was basically just those two with nobody else to maneuver around. But I can take the self-imposed handicap to fix the issue explanation otherwise.

And if I make it sound duller than it was, that's because that's more or less because that's exactly how dull I find that scene. It's one of the worst scenes in all of Star Wars, IMO, because it could be entirely cut without really missing out on anything and just serves to pad out the runtime (again, IMO). It's just really boring to me.

ETA:

I literally re-watched the pod scene while waiting for a reply (well, technically im watching the whole movie)

I wholly approve of this debate tactic!

[Keltest]

Even before handicapping his engines to make up for the flaw (which I hadn't thought of, that makes sense), by the time he caught up with Sebulba it was basically just those two with nobody else to maneuver around. But I can take the self-imposed handicap to fix the issue explanation otherwise.

And if I make it sound duller than it was, that's because that's more or less because that's exactly how dull I find that scene. It's one of the worst scenes in all of Star Wars, IMO, because it could be entirely cut without really missing out on anything and just serves to pad out the runtime (again, IMO). It's just really boring to me.

ETA:
I wholly approve of this debate tactic!

Its certainly not the pinnacle of storytelling or anything, but I think the characterization it gives to Anakin is something of a necessary evil, given the overall timeline and structure of TPM. Anakin was Obi-wan's student, which means he has to be younger and less experienced. Given Obi-wan's age in this movie, that means he basically has to be a child, and theres a limit to what they can actually have him do. They could have had the entire prequel trilogy take place during the Clone Wars to help with that issue, but that would require scrapping all of TPM, which is I think a little bit of a drastic change to make simply to avoid the podrace (yes, there are other reasons as to why that would be a workable idea, but I don't think those are really germane to the issue).

[Peelee]

Its certainly not the pinnacle of storytelling or anything, but I think the characterization it gives to Anakin is something of a necessary evil, given the overall timeline and structure of TPM. Anakin was Obi-wan's student, which means he has to be younger and less experienced. Given Obi-wan's age in this movie, that means he basically has to be a child, and theres a limit to what they can actually have him do. They could have had the entire prequel trilogy take place during the Clone Wars to help with that issue, but that would require scrapping all of TPM, which is I think a little bit of a drastic change to make simply to avoid the podrace (yes, there are other reasons as to why that would be a workable idea, but I don't think those are really germane to the issue).

I actually disagree on most of those things. Obi Wan said, "Anakin was a good friend. When I first met him, your father was already a great pilot. But I was amazed how strongly the Force was with him." Now, one way you can showcase that is to have Anakin be a nine-year-old who can podrace. That is far from the only way; Anakin could be in his late teens to early twenties, and be an actual competent pilot, much like Luke himself in the beginning on ANH (it'd be like poetry, it rhymes). Obi-Wan's age doesn't need to be relevant here for Obi-Wan to train him, either; Anakin could begin training at roughly Luke's age (it'd be like poetry, it rhymes), and that could both help foster the friendship that old Ben Kenobi clearly reminisces on fondly in addition to being a breeding ground for Anakin's potential resentment, as he could treated similar to much younger Jedi apprentices by others. This would also have an older actor playing him. No slight to Jake Lloyd here, but with terrible direction, there is only so much an actor can do, as we see with Liam Neeson; with a nine-year-old actor, this is even worse, as the child doesn't have the experience or maturity that an older actor would, which could help them regardless.

So far as I can tell, the only reason Anakin was made so young was because Lucas wanted the target audience to be able to connect with him, ignoring that this was not in any way a hurdle to Luke Skywalker's popularity among kids in the OT. General Grievous was also originally intended to be a small child, but at least he got spared that silliness. Anakin did not, sadly.

[Keltest]

I actually disagree on most of those things. Obi Wan said, "Anakin was a good friend. When I first met him, your father was already a great pilot. But I was amazed how strongly the Force was with him." Now, one way you can showcase that is to have Anakin be a nine-year-old who can podrace. That is far from the only way; Anakin could be in his late teens to early twenties, and be an actual competent pilot, much like Luke himself in the beginning on ANH (it'd be like poetry, it rhymes). Obi-Wan's age doesn't need to be relevant here for Obi-Wan to train him, either; Anakin could begin training at roughly Luke's age (it'd be like poetry, it rhymes), and that could both help foster the friendship that old Ben Kenobi clearly reminisces on fondly in addition to being a breeding ground for Anakin's potential resentment, as he could treated similar to much younger Jedi apprentices by others. This would also have an older actor playing him. No slight to Jake Lloyd here, but with terrible direction, there is only so much an actor can do, as we see with Liam Neeson; with a nine-year-old actor, this is even worse, as the child doesn't have the experience or maturity that an older actor would, which could help them regardless.

So far as I can tell, the only reason Anakin was made so young was because Lucas wanted the target audience to be able to connect with him, ignoring that this was not in any way a hurdle to Luke Skywalker's popularity among kids in the OT. General Grievous was also originally intended to be a small child, but at least he got spared that silliness. Anakin did not, sadly.

Frankly, I would count that under "scrap TPM and re-write it completely."

Also, as far as Anakin's age, Yoda mentions that Luke was too old to begin the training. Having Anakin also be too old might be poetry, but it also begs the question of why Yoda wouldn't bring up that the last Jedi who was too old to be trained ended up betraying the Jedi and becoming the Emperor's personal attack dog. And, for that matter, it would beg the question of what makes Anakin a special snowflake to deserve the training while so old.

[Sapphire Guard]

You've probably heard the phrase 'show, don't tell' with regard to writing. The podrace does a lot of storytelling, it amounts to Anakin's CV, where he demonstrates how insane his skills are. All his core skills get demonstrated, piloting, engineering, unconventional thinking, and insane recklessness and disregard for danger and how they could develop.

We also get worldbuilding for Tattooine and how cheap life is regarded there -a bunch of racers explode, and the commentator regards it as normal, Tuskens shooting at racers is just 'huh, okay' and the idea that Anakin can compete in this environment anyway. The older Anakin is, the less impressive his skills become, and the harder they are to easily compare to other Jedi.

[Peelee]

Frankly, I would count that under "scrap TPM and re-write it completely."

Also, as far as Anakin's age, Yoda mentions that Luke was too old to begin the training. Having Anakin also be too old might be poetry, but it also begs the question of why Yoda wouldn't bring up that the last Jedi who was too old to be trained ended up betraying the Jedi and becoming the Emperor's personal attack dog. And, for that matter, it would beg the question of what makes Anakin a special snowflake to deserve the training while so old.

Yoda complained that Anakin was too old, so that issue already exists (though I do not think it's really that big an issue). But yes, a complete rewrite of TPM would have been better. The whole PT, really, though a lot of the bones could be kept.

[Bartmanhomer]

Ok, now I'm going to post Star Wars Episode 3: Revenge Of The Sith.

Spoiler: My Thoughts On Star Wars Episode 3: Revenge Of The Sith

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Three years after the Clone Wars event, Jedi Master Obi-Wan Kenobi and Jedi Knight Anakin Skywalker set on a rescue mission to rescued Chancellor Palpatine from General Grievous the general of the droid army but General Grievous escapes. Suspicion arises from the Jedi Council about Chancellor Palpatine that he made a bond to Anakin Skywalker. Anakin Skywalker embraced the dark side. This movie got everything The best part I like was Obi-Wan Kenobi and Anakin Skywalker was fighting against each other in the magma planet then Obi-Wan cut off Anakin limbs excepted one of his prosthetic arms then Anakin was burning in agonizing pain as Obi-Wan left him. Also, there was a fight of Yoda against Palpatine. Palpatine shoots lightning from his fingertips and even though that Yoda lost I believe it was a good fight. I also like the part when General Grievous was being rude to the droid that the give General Grievous an item and Grievous snatch the item away to the droid and the droid said: "You're welcome." There was some humour in this movie as well. I get to see Darth Vader, Luke Skywalker and Leia Organa for the first time. To be really honest there was not one thing that I dislike about Revenge Of The Sith. It has perfect acting, perfect special effect, perfect music, perfect directing. Everything is perfect about Revenge Of The Best and this is one of the best Star Wars prequels and actually one of the best Star Wars movie in the whole series. I'll give Revenge Of The Sith a 10 out of 10.