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  1. - Top - End - #181
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    Default Re: Fyraltari watches The Clone Wars (2008) for the first time

    Quote Originally Posted by Fyraltari View Post

    We open with the last scene of the previous episode, which gives me the opportunity to point out that last time Anakin said he could still feel Bane even though he was dead. This coming from a guy who belongs to an order whose core tenets include "your eyes deceive you, trust in the Force." Anakin is a bad Jedi, is what I'm saying. Anyhoo, as the clone leave the shuttle, some green blood is spotted (I don't remember bane getting injured but okay), they realize what's up and try to stop Bane from escaping. They fail. Sure hope that doesn't become a habit! it does.
    I think the clones that held Bane at gunpoint managed to hit him offscreen before he killed them.
    The Clone Wars really likes characters escaping. It's better that they escape, rather than die and take their storyline with them, but it isn't exactly good either.

    Quote Originally Posted by Fyraltari View Post
    Then again one is levitating toy blocks for funsies. Clearly being able to do that without any training makes them a MArie Sue of the highest order. At least, I'm told that's how it works.
    I think the single stupidest complaint I've ever seen about Rey is that she shouldn't be able to defeat men because they weigh more than she does.

    Quote Originally Posted by Fyraltari View Post
    It's good to have Sidious act vilainous once in a while. Even though his scene with Anakin was visibly manipualtion-free it establishes that he doesn't want to deal with Ahsoka which, I'm guessing, will come more into play later as she gets suspissious of him.
    The camera zooms in on Palpatine's evil little smile every time he gets manipulating.

  2. - Top - End - #182
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    Default Re: Fyraltari watches The Clone Wars (2008) for the first time

    Quote Originally Posted by Fyraltari View Post
    Meh, I don't think the Force is comparable to motor control, it's more spiritual than that. It doesn't look like Force users really have to think of how much (physical) force to apply and where they need to get the precise acceleration they want so that the object will move the way they want to. It seems more that they just have to want the object to move and it moves how they want to.

    They don't move the object as much as, through the Force, make it want to move.

    It's like drawing, in a way. The first time you try to draw you are disappointed because even though you have a lcear picture in your head you don't have (yet) the fine motor control required to actually translate that image on the paper. With the Force the image gets translated from you mind to reality without having to go through all these annoying muscles.

    Quote Originally Posted by Iskar Jarak View Post
    I think the single stupidest complaint I've ever seen about Rey is that she shouldn't be able to defeat men because they weigh more than she does.
    ....wow. Yeah, that one would be hard to top.
    Last edited by Peelee; 2020-07-05 at 06:36 PM.
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  3. - Top - End - #183
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    Default Re: Fyraltari watches The Clone Wars (2008) for the first time

    Quote Originally Posted by Iskar Jarak View Post
    I think the single stupidest complaint I've ever seen about Rey is that she shouldn't be able to defeat men because they weigh more than she does.
    I mean it can always get dumber.
    Quote Originally Posted by Peelee View Post
    That's becaus he wasn't focusing on the present moment but being anxious about the future/his friends.
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    Default Re: Fyraltari watches The Clone Wars (2008) for the first time

    Quote Originally Posted by Fyraltari View Post
    That's becaus he wasn't focusing on the present moment but being anxious about the future/his friends.
    Yoda also admonishes Luke for not concentrating during yet another handstand when he drops everything, when he is focusing on the present moment, so I would disagree somewhat.
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    Default Re: Fyraltari watches The Clone Wars (2008) for the first time

    Quote Originally Posted by Peelee View Post
    Yoda also admonishes Luke for not concentrating during yet another handstand when he drops everything, when he is focusing on the present moment, so I would disagree somewhat.
    Isn't that the one where he's having a vision of Vader torturing Han?
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    Default Re: Fyraltari watches The Clone Wars (2008) for the first time

    Quote Originally Posted by Fyraltari View Post
    Isn't that the one where he's having a vision of Vader torturing Han?
    No, that's still the "control" part, IIRC. The "concentrate" bit is when the X-Wing is sinking.
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  7. - Top - End - #187
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    Default Re: Fyraltari watches The Clone Wars (2008) for the first time

    Quote Originally Posted by Fyraltari View Post
    Season 2, Episode 4
    Hey, that means the arc containing the season's two best episodes (the second and fourth episodes of the four-episode arc, specifically) starts next! It gets harder and harder to pick favorites as the seasons go on, as the competition gets fierce as average episode quality rises....

    Quote Originally Posted by Fyraltari View Post
    However Anakin eventually has to leave as he's been ignoring Obi-Wan's calls for several "clicks" (the hell are those, even?)
    Beats me, this is the first occurrence of the term as a unit of time in Star Wars. (A klick, meanwhile, is a kilometer; no bets on if whoever wrote the draft went with the first word for "measurement unit that sounds military!" and didn't think about it again)

    Quote Originally Posted by Fyraltari View Post
    One thing that I found weird was the the episode refusal to actually say Padmé and Clovis were dating. Like they insist they were "friends" but never say "lovers", "dating", "in love", "boy/girlfriend" or any other romantic term. What's up with that?
    Cartoon Network had...esoteric standards of what they allowed to be shown/said, is the best I could determine. (Have we seen any blood other that Bane's plot-advancing drips?)

    Quote Originally Posted by Fyraltari View Post
    I'm completely lost on how the CIS works however. It was my understanding that the Trade Federation, the Techno-Union, the ISB and a few other Megacorporations were pooling their resources (and private army) to organize a rebellion against the Republic in order to basically turn the galaxy into an anarcho-capitalist money-making machine while making a half-assed claim of defending the Outer Rims from Core-ist oppression. But this epsiode seems to present these same megacorps as war profiteers who deal with both parties? Even though previous episodes showed Gunray and Tambor in charge of Separatist armies and empowered to negotiate on the CIS's behalf.
    Well, with some assumptions of continuity that I'm not always sure the series cares to uphold....
    Spoiler: Compiled from multiple later episodes
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    The military forces of the CIS come from several extraplanetary corporations/guilds/etc.; but the Confederacy of Independent Systems also comprises...independent systems, that were tired of being economically/politically screwed over by the Republic and rallied behind the stated cause CIS when it started out. We even see the Separatist Senate in "action" at one point.

    The Trade Federation and InterGalactic Banking Clan, both of which "happen" to be economic guilds, profess to be neutral between the Republic and Confederacy and deal with (planets on) both sides. Lott Dod's claims that Nute Gunray is a rebellious ******* whose actions don't represent the Trade Federation as a whole are helped by the fact that Nute Gunray is indeed an *******. There's an entire arc centered around Clovis and the InterGalactic Banking Clan in post-original-ending season six, so I'm not going to go into detail here.
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  8. - Top - End - #188
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    Default Re: Fyraltari watches The Clone Wars (2008) for the first time

    Quote Originally Posted by Jasdoif View Post
    Hey, that means the arc containing the season's two best episodes (the second and fourth episodes of the four-episode arc, specifically) starts next!
    That's an odd wat to spell "the eleventh episode."
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  9. - Top - End - #189
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    Default Re: Fyraltari watches The Clone Wars (2008) for the first time

    Quote Originally Posted by Peelee View Post
    That's an odd wat to spell "the eleventh episode."
    Since "the sixth episode" and "the eighth episode" are not "the eleventh episode", I'm not surprised. I just said it got harder to pick favorites since the last season!
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    Default Re: Fyraltari watches The Clone Wars (2008) for the first time

    Season 2, Episode 5: Landing at Point Rain

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    The war isn't exactly going the Republicans' way: with their army spread out to fight Grievous, several occupied Separatist planets have taken up arms and kicked the GAR out, this includes Geonosis, theater of the war's very first battle. Apparently the Geonotians were rallied by their leader Archduke Poggle the Lesser, who celebrated by inauguring a brand new droid foundry (I'm guessing the one discussed last time) which would supply even more troops to the CIS forces. In response the Republic has sent a massive invasion fleet (a whopping 15 cruisers, more than twice what Ryloth was worth) to retake the planet and capture Poggle.

    On-board Kenobi and Ki-Adi Mundi are reminiscing about the last time they were there and deplore that they underestimating the natives' strength as well as thei loyalty to Dooku. 'coz clearly they rebelled against the army occupying their homeland out of personnal loyalty to that one guy, no other reason. Anakin and Ahsoka arrive fresh from some other battles and are having a kill-count competion, Anakin won 76 to 65. Everybody meets up for a breifing session with Yoda, Windu and Palpatine. Luminara Unduli is also there by hologram but not, apparently in the same place as the other three. I guess she is leadign another prt of the planetary assault. Poggle is holed up at his foundry, protected by a shield generator meaning that Kenobi, Skywalker and Mundi will lead that one attack to maximize their chances at reaching both of their objectives. Their forces are to split up into three group: Obi- Wan and Cody will lead an assault from the North-East, Ki-Adi from the East and Anakin, Ahsoka and rex from the South-East. They will meet up at a landing area close to the shiled then proceed innside to take out the generators. Ahsoka is worried about a wall covered with gun on the map but Skywalker assures her they aren't going anywhere near it. Yeah and we don't go to Ravenholme anymore.

    The following battles takes up 80% of the episode and it's a pretty intense one. It's insteresting that for one the ennemy isn't battle droids but organics, in the form of Geonotian soldiers. Also their fighters look like a mid-point between Vulture droids and some TIE fighter types. It very quickly becomes apparent that they have underestimated the natives again as they are greeted by a storm of laser fire (one clone even comments that the "bugs" can't aim just before his dropship is shot down) that takes a serious toll on them. To wit: Ki-adi crashes approximately one planet away from the landing area, Anakin crashes closer but has lost all his tanks and most of his unit and Obi-Wan's dropship is shot down. Only Cody managed to reach the landing area with his and Obi-Wan's tanks but they are welcomed by a metric flood of ennemies.

    Cody orders the tanks to form a circle and to withstand the ennemy fire until the others get there. Having spotted his boss's downed gunship he sends two troopers there to rescue the survivors. It's our friends Boil and Waxxer, as happy as always to be getting the "fun" missions. Obi-Wan and another clone named Chopper are the only survivors and Obi-Wan seems wounded. Once they make it to to the circle again, Obi-Wan concludes that they have no choice but to wait for their allies. Yularen is contacted but he declines their request for some additional air support because veerything he gives them he'll have to take from another battle on the planet. He does order to scrap any fighter than can be spared, though.

    Mundi and his guys have reached some kind of mountain-thingie that the Jedi's instincts are telling hi mis the shortest route to the others. They have some idea of the general situation and are hoping to regroup with Skywalker on their way. The tanks can't follow them through the tunnel they are about to cross, though, so they elect to leave them behind with a squad to protect them. Unfortunately for them the tunnel is guarded by winged Geonotians. It's a tough battle but they power through, resorting to flame-throwers in the end.

    Anakin aand his motley crew, meanwhile are ont he other side of the mountain-thing but their way is barred by the huge wall Ahsoka mentionned, which she is quick to remind Anakin they weren't suposed to go near. They also have a moment where they learn that Kenobi's ship is down and Anakin laments that the one time he's asking for his former Master's help he can't get it, while Ahsoka is just worried about Obi-Wan. Anakin admits that he worries too, but there's nothing they can't do right now. The wall is the one thing staffed by droids for some reason. Anakin and Ahsoka climb up the mountain and attack the droids (Anakin even inquires about Ahsoka's kill-count of 25). They fight off a couple droidekas with Rex's help (how did he get up there so fast?) and throw two bags full of grenades in a manhole a B1 convieniently opened for them. Then they throw Rex off the wall and jump using the Force to cushion their fall and protect them from the debris of the wall (from two backpacks of grenades? What's it made of? Pizza dough?). Rex is about as thrilled by the expereince as you can imagine.

    Anakin and co meet up with Ki-Adi who explains that Obi-Wan's position is under fire. Anakin calls Yularen who informs him that he has managed to get a squadron for them. Said squadron proceeds to throw the ennemy into retreat. Anakin and Ahsoka are elated to see that Obi-Wan is still alive even if he is apprently wounded and Mundi isn't in much better condition. Right, now that the easy part is done, time to destroy that generator. Anakin and Ahsoka lead a squad under the shield and throw EMP grenades at the cannons that defend it, that allows their remaining tanks to get close enough to blow it up and the gunships move in to finish the job. The surviving Geonotians surrender. As Obi-Wan and Ki-adi are leaving, Ahsoka insists on comparing their kill-counts, Ankin says it's not the right time but eventually gives in: 55 to 60 Ahsoka wins. Anakin, tries to claim a tie since he called the airstrike but Ki-Adi Mundi interjects: his own count is of 65, so what has he won? My everlasting respect, says Skywalker. Mundi is disappointed even as Obi-Wan says that is a rare gift. It's funny because the Geonotians died screaming.




    Spoiler: My thoughts
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    This is a war-focused episode, which is a good thing ot have in a franchise called Star Wars, and it's a good one. The tension is up for almost all the episode. The only bits I found a bit weak wear Anakin aand Ahsoka's battle against the wall and the final assault against the shield generators that felt like an afterthought. While not being one of the best so far, this episode is above the average of last season as it was very entertaining from start to finish, which makes me curious to see why jasdoif is hyping the next one. There are quit a few gems too. I like Obi-wan's grim resignation to fight even wounded when the landing area is being overtaken followed by his relief at the reinforcement's arrival. It's also interesting to see that he feels the war is dragging on (with reason, he's literally back to square one). The kill-count game is also interesting as while it's not unexpected from Anakin and someone as young as Ahsoka to treat this all as a game, that a master of the council like Mundi is partaking is probably a bad sign: the Jedi are supposed to uphold peace not compete to see who can kill the most. It's probably not coincidence that this happens in the one episode where the ennemy is not made of interchangeable indentical faceless robots but people. Interchangeable indentical facless bug-people, but still. Speaking of, I hope that the next episodes acknowledge that, unlike other episodes, the Jedi are not leading a defensive action against an invader but leading and invasion agaisnt people fighting for their planet. It won't ever be framed as comparable to tambor's occupation of Ryloth but still, it would beintersting to see Ahsoka question the morality of what they're doing.

    One last thing, Palpatine says that it may not be good idea to put three of their best Jedi in the same battle in case it turns wrong and during the battle one clone says that it's like the Geonotians knew their every move. Has Sidious told Poggle what the Jedi were planning?
    Last edited by Fyraltari; 2021-08-15 at 02:04 PM.

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    Default Re: Fyraltari watches The Clone Wars (2008) for the first time

    Quote Originally Posted by Fyraltari View Post
    (from two backpacks of grenades? What's it made of? Pizza dough?).
    I can't decide if this was closer to firing a proton torpedo down a small thermal exhaust port right below the main port, picking a high point on the wide range of explosive power in portrayals of thermal detonators, or the time the Tick thwarted the Breadmaster's plot to envelop the City in a soufflé by borrowing the Human Cannon's cannon to make it collapse on itself.
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  12. - Top - End - #192
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    Default Re: Fyraltari watches The Clone Wars (2008) for the first time

    Quote Originally Posted by Jasdoif View Post
    I can't decide if this was closer to firing a proton torpedo down a small thermal exhaust port right below the main port
    I don't think that wall has a reactor, though.
    Quote Originally Posted by Jasdoif View Post
    picking a high point on the wide range of explosive power in portrayals of thermal detonators
    Most likely that one.
    Quote Originally Posted by Jasdoif View Post
    or the time the Tick thwarted the Breadmaster's plot to envelop the City in a soufflé by borrowing the Human Cannon's cannon to make it collapse on itself.
    That is certainly a sentence.
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    Default Re: Fyraltari watches The Clone Wars (2008) for the first time

    Fyr, I regret to inform you that you've been pronouncing the Republic's capital planet all wrong. Fortunately, I found a pronunciation guide that can help!

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    Default Re: Fyraltari watches The Clone Wars (2008) for the first time

    Quote Originally Posted by Peelee View Post
    Fyr, I regret to inform you that you've been pronouncing the Republic's capital planet all wrong. Fortunately, I found a pronunciation guide that can help!

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    Wa? That's not how you pronounce Trantor.

    Season 2, Episode 6: Weapons Factory

    Spoiler: Recap
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    Moving on from they were last time, Anakin and Ahsoka are planning their assault on the droid factory. Ahsoka is supposed to be giving the debriefing on the defenses to the clone officers but Anakin constantly talks over her to her growing frustration. He denies her accusation of not trusting her: he just wants to be sure the job is well done, which is of course the exact same thing. They are interrupted by Luminara Unduli and her own Padawan Barris Offee come to reinforce them. Unduli explains that the Separatist defenses are too strong for them to breach without a blood bath, as they'd have to cross a moat on an exposed bridge but fortunately, the foundry is built over tunnels (she says catacombs, but I don't really see why a factory would need that and there isn't any dead body in there so they are more like dormitories) some of which are very close to the moat. Barris has memorized all two-hundred-odd turns needed to go from the moat, through the tunnels to the factory's power room, so the plan is that a team is sent there to plant bombs while the rest of the army mounts an attack to serve as a diversion (I thought the point was not to cross the bridge to avoid casualties?). Unduli suggests Ahsoka and Offee do the metal gear thing while Skywalker and herself lead the assault. Anakin is opposed but Ahsoka says there's no resaon to worry: she'll be with "reliable" Barris, after all, and he backs down.

    Unduli and Skywalker march their troops, parade-like along the bridge and are welcomed by a swarm of droids. "Not to worry, says Anakin, as long as we destroy them faster than they build them." They progress relatively well until flying geonotians spring out of the columns on both sides of the bridge. Once that is dealt with, Poggle unleashes his new secret weapon (I forget is that the fourth or the sixth Seppie secret weapon?) super tanks! They're just like regular tanks but super! Teir shielding is strong enough to withstand everyhting the clone artillery has to offer but they have to roll it back to fire. Kind of an obvious design flaw if you ask me. Once his artillery has gone up in smoke Ani orders a retreat. This vexes Rex: "We can't just turn our backs and run!" Great tactical thinking there rex, I'm sure you do your instructors back on Kamino proud. Anyway, the clone obeys and Luminara and Anakin climb down the bridge, putting bombs on the underside of it and then detonates them sending the tanks crashing down into the chasm below. But the Jedi are trapped on the other side of the moat with a fresh batch of battle droids.

    Meanwhile Ahsoka and Barris made their way into the tunnels. They have to go through a romm full of sleeping geonotian soldiers (gotta respect their strict observance of naptime). Ahsoka is visibly much cooler under pressure than Offee who almost panics as a sleeping warrior's hand touches her head. As they leave said warrior wakes up and follows them. Offee is momentarily lost until she remembers that one particular turn wasn't "left" but "up", this worries Ahsoka but they do make it into the main power room and start planting bombs everywhere and setting their timers. The geonotian meanwhile goes to warn Poggle and his tactical droid about the intrusion. They barge into the power room with a few warriors, some droids and one supertank. Why is the corridor leading to the power room big enough for a tank? Did their architect graduate from the Moria's School of Unnecessarily Large Passageways?
    As the padawans fight the droids the geonotians start taking the bombs away and flee through the the tunnels with them. Ahsoka throws a bomb to the supertank. The tactical droid laughs and states that such a bomb cannot possibly penetrates the tank's armour. As he stands next to the bomb as is destroyed when it goes off. Who programmed these guys? Poggle leaves and the Padawans are left alon with the tank. It tries to fire on them but in doing so exposes its intrior hull, allowing Offee to carve a hole intto the roof and take down the droid drivers. The two Jedi-learers ponder what to do for a moment before settling on using the tank's weapons on the generator even though they will be caught in the explosion. Ahsoka radios in Anakin to tell him that they won't make it out and fires as he objects.

    Anakin and Offee are still in front of the foundry and Rex implores them to leave the blast radius (but Rex, they can' tjsut turn their backs and run!). Too late. Anakin goes resteless with grief and starts combing the debris, mobilizing the clone's tank crriers to move the biggest chunks, while Unduli says they should accept their padawans' passing with dignity and restraint as they can't possibly find them in time. Offee and Ahsoka are still alive inside what used to be the ank but runnign out of air. Barris is fine with their sacrifice, as it alledgedly saved the thousand of lives the droids built by the factory would have taken. Ahsoka says she's about to save save theirs and uses a batterry to hotwire her broken comm-link (something her master taught her) to send a signal to Anakin. Faint as it may be it allows them to find the girls and Ani and Luminara conjointly levitate the debris away from their pupils. As they reunite Barris assures Unduli and Skywalker that Ahsoka did most of the job.
    And we're apparently to the point where they don't even bother showing the Separatist Council members escapign anymore, because of course Poggle wasn't into the besieged building as it blew up.



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    That was a good episode but I really wish the episode where Ahsoka is colly in command, the episode where Anakin unconditionnally trusts Ahsoka but she has to learn leadership and the episode where Anakin learns to trust Ahsoka waere shown in the reverse order. I'm starting to wonder if season 6 won't have an episode where Ahsoka learns to use the Force or something.
    The conflict of the episode is mostly an excuse for exploring Anakin's over-protectiveness of Ahsoka but some bits feel a bit forced to thart end like that the breakdown was Masters on one side and Padawans on the other rather than the more natural one Master-Padawan team on each side. The contrats between Luminara and Skywalker's style of teaching was nice: strict and proper but kind of cold versus free-form but but rocky. Barris cutting a rock with her lightsaber in a rectangular shape rather than the usual circle was a nice touch. As was undescoring of the fact that Luminara and Skywalker both care for their pupils even if they don't express it the same way. Also the usula vader-shadowing with Anakin's unwilligness to give up translating into agression.

    But seriously, the joke I made about the Erso family designing the Separatists' droids and weapons feels less improbable with each new weapon.
    Last edited by Fyraltari; 2021-08-15 at 02:26 PM.

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    Default Re: Fyraltari watches The Clone Wars (2008) for the first time

    Quote Originally Posted by Fyraltari View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Jasdoif View Post
    or the time the Tick thwarted the Breadmaster's plot to envelop the City in a soufflé by borrowing the Human Cannon's cannon to make it collapse on itself.
    That is certainly a sentence.
    One of the side effects of having a really good long-term memory and pattern recognition, is that deliberately absurd phrases like "wall of pizza dough" sometimes remind me of stuff I watched over a quarter century ago....



    Quote Originally Posted by Fyraltari View Post
    Once that is dealt with, Poggle unleashes his new secret weapon (I forget is that the fourth or the sixth Seppie secret weapon?) super tanks! They're just like regular tanks but super! Teir shielding is strong enough to withstand everyhting the clone artillery has to offer but they have to roll it back to fire. Kind of an obvious design flaw if you ask me.
    I like to think they have huge stockpiles labelled "Generic Secret Weapon ComponentsTM", and each one has a dedicated designer whose instructions are "you have a strict time limit to make as many functional Lego aberrations out of these as possible"; and so there are a bunch of superweapon cousins, none of which had time spared for a thorough testing phase.


    I'm not sure if I'm talking about in-universe weapons engineers trying to save themselves, or out-of-universe writers trying to forcefully cause additional conflict for the story to resolve. Maybe both.
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    Default Re: Fyraltari watches The Clone Wars (2008) for the first time

    Quote Originally Posted by Fyraltari View Post
    Season 2, Episode 6
    Something that's always bothered/amused me about this episode is how the Jedi temporarily drop the "capture Poggle" objective and are content to just blow him up with the factory. Complete nonspoiler for the next episode but said objective becomes their main focus while nobody acknowledges that if not for that one drone waking up and sounding the alarm Poggle would just be dead and they wouldn't be able to get any of the info they wanted out of him. Pretty big hole in the Jedi plan imo.

    That being said, the next episode is my personal favorite in the series so I'm looking forward to its coverage. I hope you enjoy it!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Fyraltari
    She says catacombs, but I don't really see why a factory would need that and there isn't any dead body in there so they are more like dormitories
    Of course she says catacombs: it sounds much cooler than dormitories. And really, dormitories are just catacombs for people that are still alive.

    Quote Originally Posted by Fyraltari
    ...the plan is that a team is sent there to plant bombs while the rest of the army mounts an attack to serve as a diversion (I thought the point was not to cross the bridge to avoid casualties?)
    Order 66 works for a reason.


    Quote Originally Posted by Fyraltari
    That was a good episode but I really wish the episode where Ahsoka is colly in command, the episode where Anakin unconditionnally trusts Ahsoka but she has to learn leadership and the episode where Anakin learns to trust Ahsoka waere shown in the reverse order. I'm starting to wonder if season 6 won't have an episode where Ahsoka learns to use the Force or something.
    Happily, there's only one other episode I can think of that has a similar problem and this is the most awkward instance (that I can recall).

    Quote Originally Posted by Fyraltari
    But seriously, made joke that the Erso family designed the Separatists' droids and weapons feels less improbable with each new weapon.
    The Separatists' endless stream of "super" weapons is actually ingenious worldbuilding disguised as sloppy writing. The weapons are all designed by independent contractors competing for funding. Every Separatist weapons-designer aspires to design a vaguely adjacent to semi-functional weapon and are all unwilling to share the reward that such an almost effective weapon would bring. This lack of teamwork and oversight results in obviously flawed designs. Whatever is in charge of allocating Separatist R&D resources is willing to squander piles of credits on flashy designs, or any chance of winning the war -- which results in designers being encouraged to attempt grandiose super weapons and desperately puffing up their flimsy designs. Once the "super" weapon fails, the Separatists scrap the design and funnel resources into a different design that hasn't yet had the chance to fail spectacularly.

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    Quote Originally Posted by moossabi View Post
    Something that's always bothered/amused me about this episode is how the Jedi temporarily drop the "capture Poggle" objective and are content to just blow him up with the factory. Complete nonspoiler for the next episode but said objective becomes their main focus while nobody acknowledges that if not for that one drone waking up and sounding the alarm Poggle would just be dead and they wouldn't be able to get any of the info they wanted out of him. Pretty big hole in the Jedi plan imo.

    That being said, the next episode is my personal favorite in the series so I'm looking forward to its coverage. I hope you enjoy it!
    Their main aim in capturing Poggle seems to be to ensure that the Geonotian do not rise again, to that end, killing him is just as good as taking him alive. Also why are you calling that guy a drone? They seemed completely organic to me. Anyway...

    Season 2, Episode 7: Legacy of Terror

    You know, I'd like to see an alien insectoid species where the "queens" just do the same thing as real-world insect queen do: pop eggs, rather than go with the misconception that they command anything.

    Spoiler: Recap
    Show
    Luminara Unduli is surveying the ruins of the factory when she is joined by a healed Obi-Wan Kenobi. They discuss their victory but agree that for it to mean much they must capture Poggle the Lesser, to this end, Unduli takes off on a speeder with a singel clone escort to try and find him. Obi-Wan heads to their planetary HQ (or whatever this place is) and meets up with Ki-Adi Mundi and Anakin. Poggle, meanwhile is fleeing with a single (non-super) tank, a couple B1s and some crates. They lose one but Poggle insists they don't have time to stop and pick it up. Unduli and her escort find the crate and tell the other Jedi. It seems that Poggle is headed for "the Progate temple" which is weird because it was bombed and so there probably isn't anything left there (it's not like the previous episode established that every Geonotian building comes with an elaborate tunnel network, heh?). Obi-Wan advises agaisnt further pursuit at the moment because a huge sandstorm is headed this way but Luminara thinks the risk is acceptable. Poggle gets caught up in the sandstorm and when a B1 can't follow elects to abandon it. This is a weird moment, it's th emost humanized the B1 have been so far, but it deosn't impact anything in the episode, in fact it's thz last time the B1s, tank and crates (identified as ammunition) are seen. Odd. Unduli and her bodyguard arrive at the the temple just after Poggle but he seems to have vanished. As they contact the other Jedi, they are attacked by offscreen ennemies and the communication is cut short. Anakin is worried but Obi-Wan trusts Master Unduli to fend for herself. At least until the storm dies down and they actually are able to go there and help.

    Anakin, Obi-Wan, Cody and seven more clones land at the temple. That's kind of light for such an important mission against an unknown ennemy, no? They find the corpse of Luminara's soldier and her lightsaber. They don't think Poggle could ahev done that and wonder who could be responsible. As the temple is adorned with statues of some kind of Geonotian goddess, Anakin wonders if she could be responsible and Obi-Wan if that's the rumored Geonotian queen, whose existence was never confirmed. Right on both counts. They find an entrance to the catacombs (this time it actually is catacombs) and proceed in. Unduli, meanwhile, wakes up, she is being carried away by several sickly looking geonotians accompanied by Poggle. She starts fighting, her handcuffs forcing her to use soem nice tae-kwon-do kicks, but as her foot gets caught inside the stomach of a warrior she recoils in horror as that doesn't stop him from trying to grab her. She takes her comm-link and calls Kenobi, telling him not to follow her and leaves immediately. Obviously this just make him want to go further down. They get ambushed by some geonotian warriors and it soon becomes apparent that these guys don't die when you shoot them in the head. It just makes a little worm crawl out of their nose and back inside. Yup, zombi alien insects because why the **** not? The good guys flee after losing two clones and Obi-Wan sends two more to report to Mundi when it turns out that they are to deep to callt he surface. These two don't make it ten meters away form the group that they get ganked by some more zombis. Anakin wants to go himself but Kenobi doesn't thik it wise to divide their forces further.

    They keep going and reach the main chamber. The queen is sitting on some kind of oversized throne-sofa and is about twice or thrice as big as Jabba. Poggle is talking to her and Unduli is chained to the throne. Also present are a butt-load of zombis. Anakin starts planning an assault but Obi-Wan wants to talk to the queen. She's taken Luminara alive rather than kill her so she probably won't want them dead right away and he wants to understand how she controls her undead minions. He still orders Cody and the three other clones to circle the room and be ready to flash the ennemy with their helmets' flashlight: as they spend their time inside poorly lit caverns they will be more sensible to it so they'll be confused. still once that wears off better target the pillars: they can't kill the soldiers but they can bury them in rubble. Anakin and Obi-Wan advance while bantering about each other's approach to tactics. Unduli berates Obi-Wan for not listening to her and he says Anakin is rubbing off on him. Cute. The queen asks what they are doing here. Wait, if Poggle is a front for her as the episode implies, why can't he speak Basic when she can? That would be much more useful to him than her. Of course the real reason is that they needed somebody to speak for the geonotians here and Poggle was already established as not speaking Basic, but still. Obi-Wan tells the queen that her rule is at an end and to submit to Republic authority. Great opening, there oh wise and subtle diplomat. She rants for a bit about how her rule is forever (apparently she means both that her servant serve in death and that she is very long-lived as she calls the obviously aged Poggle "young") and how she only had one Jedi but now she has three. Her guards disarm Obi-wan and Anakin, she presents her "child" another worm that will burrow into Unduli's cranium and mind control her. Err, would that even work? I mean, these things eveolved to do that on Geonotian brains not on... whatever species Unduli and Offee are. Also the queen calss Geonosis "Geonotia", not sure what to make of that. Obi-wan is curious about the process, Anakin less so, Unduli even less so. Finally they give the order and Force pull their lightsabers (and the worm) as Cody & Co blind the aliens. Anakin frees Unduli and gives her her ligthsaber while Obi-wan grabs Poggle and cuffs him. The clone shoot the pillars and everything starts to collapse. Anakin sees Unduli's worm in Obi-Wan's hand and assumes it's attacking so he grabs it and stomps on it. "I was going to study that! -Study the back of my boot!" The heroes and their prisoner make their way out as the temple collapses on its catacombs, burying the queen and her servants. Obi-Wan remarks that her really wanted to figure out the hive mind/mind control/zombification thing. Anakin says that hopefully the secret is buried with the queen. Ani, either there's only one queen (improbable) and you've just condemmned an entire species to extinction or there are other queens who would most likely know the trick.



    Spoiler: My thoughts
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    Sorry moossabi, but this one I found kind of forgettable. I remember reading the second zombi story ever when I was very little and being so terrified of it that I for the longest time couldn't stomach any story with zombis or or any forced transformation from good guy to bad guy. This doesn't bother me anymore but I think this is the core element of the zombi subgenre that this story lacks, the ennemy isn't your allies raised agaisnt you it's just some uglier tougher variant of the aliens you've been fighting for two episodes. There isn't really any character work either, although the Kenobi-Skywalker banter is leagues ahead of season 1, they actually sound like friends throwing friendly jabs at each other (both in tone and meaning) rather than two angry co-workers stuck together and throwing blame at one another.
    I'm not really sure what the villains where trying to accomplish either, why was Poggle carrying ammo? Why did he meet with the queen, what was she hoping to acocmplish with a couple of Jedi that she risked revealing herself even though the existence of the queens was apparently secret for who-knows-how-long? I'm guessing Poggle and Watt Tambor will escape together, seeing them co-operate might help to give them some distinct character traits. I wonder if Poggle will stay relevant to the show as this story basically relegates him from leader to spokeperson but also shows that the Separatists are keeping secrets from each other.
    Last edited by Fyraltari; 2021-08-16 at 07:17 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Fyraltari View Post
    You know, I'd like to see an alien insectoid species where the "queens" just do the same thing as real-world insect queen do: pop eggs, rather than go with the misconception that they command anything.
    The Slurm Queen was pretty close to that. She was still the boss, but that was mostly because her Queen ability kept the operation running, so kind of a natural evolution of how a sentient race with a queen would be.
    Quote Originally Posted by Fyraltari View Post
    Sorry moossabi, but this one I found kind of forgettable.
    That's OK, it's not episode 11.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Peelee View Post
    The Slurm Queen was pretty close to that. She was still the boss, but that was mostly because her Queen ability kept the operation running, so kind of a natural evolution of how a sentient race with a queen would be.
    ...

    I haven't the faintest clue what you are talking about.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fyraltari View Post
    ...

    I haven't the faintest clue what you are talking about.
    He's making a Futurama reference ("Fry and the Slurm Factory").
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    Note to self, rally for a Fyraltari Futurama Watchthrough thread at some point.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Peelee View Post
    Note to self, rally for a Fyraltari Futurama Watchthrough thread at some point.
    I feel like comedy doesn't really lend itself as well to reviewing just by its very nature, but, hey, I've been surprised before.
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    Quote Originally Posted by DataNinja View Post
    I feel like comedy doesn't really lend itself as well to reviewing just by its very nature, but, hey, I've been surprised before.
    Excuse my language but I have had it with you ruffling my petticoats!
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fyraltari View Post
    Also why are you calling that guy a drone? They seemed completely organic to me. Anyway...
    I mostly meant it as a general term for a lower class insectoid, however apparently in that context it apparently has a more specific definition than I was aware of ("a male bee in a colony of social bees, which does no work but can fertilize a queen", TIL).

    Quote Originally Posted by Fyraltari View Post
    Sorry moossabi, but this one I found kind of forgettable.
    No need to apologize, you basically hit what I liked about it the most anyways:
    Quote Originally Posted by Fyraltari View Post
    the Kenobi-Skywalker banter is leagues ahead of season 1, they actually sound like friends throwing friendly jabs at each other (both in tone and meaning) rather than two angry co-workers stuck together and throwing blame at one another.
    I enjoy it as a solidly-paced romp along the lines of what I assume a D&D session is like; it's nowhere near the top of others' lists of favorite episodes, I just have a thing for it I guess

    Quote Originally Posted by Peelee View Post
    I'm guessing Poggle and Watt Tambor will escape together, seeing them co-operate might help to give them some distinct character traits. I wonder if Poggle will stay relevant to the show as this story basically relegates him from leader to spokeperson but also shows that the Separatists are keeping secrets from each other.
    Spoiler: moos rants about TCW's villains for an undue amount of time, not too spoilery but has things like "x character comes back y times" so if you care about that then just ignore this
    Show
    The Separatist Council is absolutely squandered in this show. Of the AotC/RotS members the only three that appear are Nute Gunray, Wat Tambor, and Poggle. San Hill and the Banking Clan's direct involvement in the founding of the CIS are completely ignored in favor of a completely different hierarchy and everyone else is nowhere to be found outside the occasional namedrop of the other corporations. By this point in the show, Nute Gunray is completely out of it. Instead of trying to do some good character work with him (which they were making headway on in Cloak of Darkness), the Trade Federation is just inexplicably neutral and Lott Dod shows up constantly from here on out. After their respective first outings, Tambor and Poggle receive cameos on prison monitors way off in season 5 but are otherwise completely absent for the next god-knows-how-many episodes until season 7.

    The show doesn't really care that much about who the Republic has captured at any given point. In season 7, Wat Tambor is just spontaneously out of jail and pulling the same "my company was totally neutral all along guys" schtick as Dod and the Trade Federation despite his warcrimes on Ryloth and the fact that he says outright to Windu's face "We will all perish for the glory of the Separatist Alliance!" for the duration of his season 7 arc. Poggle actually has a throughline for how he got out of jail in the book Rogue One prequel book Catalyst, but there are no ties to this in the show. What you're talking about sounds like a fantastic series of episodes to watch, this show's villains are at their strongest when they're interacting and bouncing off of each other, but this happens so rarely in the grand scheme of things that I think the showrunners just didn't care about giving any of the CIS villains (outside of Ventress, occasionally Dooku, and if you really want to push it then Grievous) actual character development.


    Quote Originally Posted by Peelee View Post
    That's OK, it's not episode 11.
    I had to look up which one you were talking about, and I consider myself a fan of the first two seasons.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Peelee View Post
    Note to self, rally for a Fyraltari Futurama Watchthrough thread at some point.
    Unlikely.
    Quote Originally Posted by moossabi
    I mostly meant it as a general term for a lower class insectoid, however apparently in that context it apparently has a more specific definition than I was aware of ("a male bee in a colony of social bees, which does no work but can fertilize a queen", TIL).
    See, I thought that only meant the remote contolled flying robot thingie because we borrowed that word from you guys, but the male bees we call "fake bumblebees".

    No need to apologize, you basically hit what I liked about it the most anyways:

    I enjoy it as a solidly-paced romp along the lines of what I assume a D&D session is like; it's nowhere near the top of others' lists of favorite episodes, I just have a thing for it I guess
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    Season 2, Episode 8: Brain Invaders

    Spoiler: Recap
    Show
    Well, the Queen's dead, long live the Queen and her name was Karina the Great, apparently? Anyway, Anakin and Luminara are taking Poggle to Coruscant to stand trial for his crimes (I mean, beside treason, what did he do?), but Ahsoka and Barris have another mission: they must go to Ord cestis (the hopital space station from way back in Season 1) to pick up some supplies to deliver to Master Windu on Dantooine whose troops are in a bad situation.
    Spoiler: I think he can handle it
    Show

    Meanwhile, a group of clones is taking a nap near the ruins of the Temple, and one of Karina's mind control worms hatches and slither into a clone's nose. They are woken up by their commanding officer who tells them they are being assigned to the Padawans' mission. As they embark, we see that the possessed clone, Cy, has picked up some more worm-eggs and is taking them along.

    During the flight most people onboard go to bed but Cy wakes up and starts putting eggs near his clones' beds and the worm hatch and takes them over. He then takes two of them to the cockpit and shoots the pilot dead before engaging autopilot. While this is going on, Ahsoka has trouble sleeping. If you ask me that'd be because they don't have bedsheets and are forced to sleep fully clothed (well as fully clothed as Ahsoka can get anyway) which is probably not ideal after battles on a desert planet. She, however, attributes it to the sudden change from unrelenting action to quiet. Offee tells her to just enjoy the peace while it lasts but Ahsoka would rather take her on a midnight snack. As they eat (Ahsoka is holding her fork backward like her lightsaber that's so cute), Ahsoka admits that she can't really reconcile the Jedi's theoritical role as peacekeepers and their current role as warriors and whe wonders how they will act once the war is over. Barris admits she doesn't have the answer and asks her what Anakin makes of all this. She says that Anakin's thoughts are probably a bit too radical for Offee's liking, alwyas doing "what needs to be done" and that she (Ahsoka) isn't sure how he'll function in peace-time.

    They are interrupted by two clones attacking them. They knock them out easily but two more arrive, including the clone commander, Trap. Trap and his cohort put their weapons down, convincing the Jedi they're on their side. Ahsoka wonders if this is the same as the time Anakin and Obi-wan were betrayed (hey, continuity !). The bridge doesn't respond so Trap convinces the two learners to leave the two mutineers under Havoc's (the other clone) eyes and go to the bridge with him. However there are security laser-shields stopping the way to the cockpit (does that kind of security ever show up on any other ship?) and Trap attacks while the Padawans are distracted. Yeah, you can totally take them on one-on-two. During the struggle, his worm tries to leap out to Offee who stabs Trap (oops, just killed a friendly!) but Ahsoka cuts it in two. They quickly guess what's going on (mind control parasites from Geonosis) and head for the comm center to warn Ord Cestis. Also Trap was Ahsoka's friend, apparently?

    On their way, they see several clones, speaking Geonotian, including Cy, forcefully infect another one with a worm. Before they can do anything, they are attacked by Havoc and forced to fight the clones. They escape through the air vents and Offee decides they need to split up. Ahsoka goes to the comm center and she to the engine room. And if worst comes to worst, Ahsoka will have to "do what needs to be done". Ahsoka immediately reaches the comm room and inform Fisto on Ord Cestis (wait, why doesn't he do the supply run?) Fisto wants them to board anyway so the worms can be studied assuring her that they'll take every precaution. I'm with him, there's only, what two dozen infected? And they have plenty of face-covering gear. Barris isn't as lucky though, as she falls into a trap that shocks her, making her drop her lightsaber. One clone remarks that "if there's one thing we clones know how to do, it's to stop Jedi". Oooh 66-shadowing. Anyway she forgets that she has magic powers and is infected.

    Ahsoka calls Anakin, who had started to worry that they lost communication despite Obi-Wan's insistence that this is basically her taking after him. Wait, if this is nighttime on Ahsoka's ship's clock why would she report in now? Hell, how is this not nighttime on these guys' ship; they left from the the same place at the same time? Anyway, Anakin tells her to keep her wristwatch open and to find Barris, he'll go interrogate Poggle. As he goes in the cell, he dismisses the guards, and, once Poggle brushes off his mind trick, slaps him hard enough to throw him on the floor and Force-strangles him as the Imperial March plays. Oooh. He then goes to the Jedi and informs them of the situation. Apparently the worms are looking for hosts because the Queen is dead. But Poggle told him how to beat them. The other Jedi are a bit worried he interrogated the Geonotian on his own and wonder how he got him to talk, questions that he brushes off.

    Ahsoka is joined by Barris just as Anakin hangs up. Offee does that thing slasher movie monsters do, where they stand ominously behind a window for no reason and attacks. Should have pretended to be un-infected Barriss, like Trap did. Ahsoka tries the good ol' "I know you're in there somewher" bit. Doesn't work. She hides in the air vents (how does that work on Barris?) and is contacted by Anakin. the worms can't stand cold so she has to rupture the coolant system. She heads to the main air conditionner room , or whaterver this is supposed to be, and pushes the buttons that realease the cooling fluid into all the rooms of the ship. Sounds like terrible design, if you ask me. This knowcks the clones out but not Offe (I guess her species has a more active metabolism than humans?). Ahsoka has barely enough time to regret her chosen outfit before having to fight her again.

    Their ship come out of hyperspace but is flying towards the station way too fast despite the two ships with tractor beams that Fisto sent to stop them. Who programmed this auto-pilot? Fisto has all the alarms sound and orders a quarantine to be put in place. Ahsoka reaches the bridge but Offe attacks her again before she can slow down the ship. She sprays cooling fluid at Barriss, this allows her to regain control long enough to beg Ahsoka to kill her, which she refuses to do. Offee attacks again and her worm decides to poke out of her mouth for some stupid reason (yeah, let's go out in the cold where I'm exposed to my ennemy!). And Ahsoka cuts the worm in two. Like they try to make it look like she killed Barris, but come on. The ship is lowed down and Fisto boards with some clones (the Jedi isn't wearing any protection!) and they find the Padawans.

    Ahsoka wakes up in an hospital bed with Anakin next to her. He informs her that Barris and the clones are allright (I have doubts concerning Trap's allrightness), and Fisto comes in to inform them that the worms are the same type of creature that they had found on Geonosis. Thnak you, Master Obvious! Also, they couldn't analyse the worms they found last time, so what the hell, Fisto? Anakin wants a warning to be given to the troops on Geonosis, as he suspects the worms helped the Separatsists' retaking of the planet. Ahsoka privately asks if she should have killed Barris when she told her to, she feels like the fact that she couldn't is a failure of her part to follow the Jedi code. Anakin tells her that letting go of their attachment is hard for all Jedi and that she was right to follow her instincts. Besides Barris didn't know the cold would take out the worms when she said that. This reassures Ahsoka.





    Spoiler: My thoughts
    Show
    That was a good one overall even if the the bad guys' actions don't really make sense (which is understandable since they seem to only be animal acting on instinct now that their quenn mother is dead) and everybody oversells their threat. I mean, they can't make more worms without a queen so the notion that thousands would be in danger if they reached the station is ridiculous.
    The way the worm control their hosts is also incoherent. Like they speak Geonotian at one point implying the host's personnality is gone, but one clone still takes pride in his clone-ness when they capture Offee and she can still use the Force implying the host is still there.

    The real meat of the episode, however, is the interactions between the Jedi. Ahsoka and Offee's developping friendship is great and I hope to see more of it, they nicely play off each other with Ahsoka being more impulsive and Offee more collected. Ahsoka's puzzlement over the Jedi's actions and their code is just as nice as it really feels that Anakin is acting as a techer even though he himself doesn't agree with the Jedi way that much. His slip to the dark side is getting more attention as seen when he tortures (there are no other words for that scene) Poggle for information. I have more to say on Anakin's fall so far, but I'll wait until I ma through this season before going into details in case there are more scenes like this one.

    As far as zombi plots go, this one was better than last time because, as I said, the heroes are fighting their allies this time, but it doesn't really feel like one either, but I don't think it's really trying to do so actually, as the zombis are more a generic threat for Anakin to be afraid of Ahsoka facing rahter than the focus here.
    Last edited by Fyraltari; 2021-08-16 at 07:37 AM.

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    Default Re: Fyraltari watches The Clone Wars (2008) for the first time

    Also, I had noticed the different hair colors among clones, which can be easily explained with dyes, but on this episode I spotted various eye colors. Are they wearing contact lenses? That would probably be cumbersome after a day of combat. Especially in deserts like on Geonosis.
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    Default Re: Fyraltari watches The Clone Wars (2008) for the first time

    Quote Originally Posted by Fyraltari View Post
    Also, I had noticed the different hair colors among clones, which can be easily explained with dyes, but on this episode I spotted various eye colors. Are they wearing contact lenses? That would probably be cumbersome after a day of combat. Especially in deserts like on Geonosis.
    I don't think cosmetic eye coloration tech is a stretch in the SW universe. Probably a booming business started centuries ago by Darth Practical to hide his glowing yellow eyes in public.
    Last edited by Dire_Flumph; 2020-07-19 at 11:09 AM.

  30. - Top - End - #210
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    Default Re: Fyraltari watches The Clone Wars (2008) for the first time

    I've just watched the next episode and , I gotta say, "a Hutt soap opera is not what I signed for" wasn't a thought I ever thought I would express, but here we are!
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