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  1. - Top - End - #1
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    Post Destruction Domain: Clerics who find everything a battlefield.

    This page on the homebrewery

    Was expecting to get a runecaster subclass together first, but this is a counterpart to my protection domain, and based on the 4e Runepriest's other rune state.

    The other commentary still holds true:
    Quote Originally Posted by sandmote View Post
    The nice thing about transferring over the two rune states ... is it flavors War Domain a bit more specifically, by peeling off some of the gods that are a bit more focused on a type of war (see Ares vs Athena as examples). The gods then grant a different domain based on how they wage war, rather than all being lumped in together.
    Main notes would be that I'm unsure about giving the subclass both armor and weapon proficiency, and the Befuddling Blow effect flees a bit to DM dependent/weak.
    Fluff
    Gods of destruction include most of the dark seladrine, Bahgtru, Maglubiyet, Umberlee, Blibdoolpoolp, Cyric, Bane, Shiva, Set, and Coatlicue. These gods aren't so much interested in formal warfare as they are in either destructive combat or the destruction itself.

    Domain Spells
    Destruction Domain Spells
    Level Spell
    1st Chaos Bolt, Ensnaring Strike
    3rd Blindness/Deafness, Phantasmal Force
    5th Blinding Smite, Erupting Earth
    7th Blight, Gravity Sinkhole
    9th Holy Weapon, Destructive Wave

    Bonus Proficiency
    At 1st level, you gain proficiency with martial weapons and heavy armor.

    Aid Destruction
    When an ally makes an attack roll targeting a creature within 10 feet of you, you can use your reaction to mark the target, granting your ally advantage on the attack roll.

    You can use this feature a number of times equal to your Wisdom modifier (a minimum of once). You regain all expended uses when you finish a long rest.

    Channel Divinity: Aura of Shattering
    Starting at 2nd level, you can use your Channel Divinity to center yourself in an aura of destructive power and empowering the blows of your allies.

    As an action, you present your holy symbol, choosing up to six creatures you can see within 30 feet of you. Each creature can add your Wisdom modifier to one damage roll it makes before the start of your next turn.

    As an action on your turn, you can extend the duration of the aura. When you do so, each creature chosen when you used this channel divinity option can add can add your Wisdom modifier to one damage roll it makes before the start of your next turn. You can extend the aura to a maximum duration of 1 minute.

    Channel Divinity: Befuddling Blow
    At 6th level, when you make a melee attack against a creature, you can use your Channel Divinity to force that creature to make a Wisdom saving throw or be charmed by you until the end of your next turn as you wrest the knowledge of foe and friend from its mind. If a creature is charmed by you in this manner, you can force it to make a melee attack against a creature of your choice within its reach (no action required by you or the creature).

    Divine Strike
    At 8th level, you gain the ability to infuse your weapon strikes with divine energy. Once on each of your turns when you hit a creature with a weapon attack, you can cause the attack to deal an extra 1d8 damage of the same type dealt by the weapon to the target. When you reach 14th level, the extra damage increases to 2d8.

    Embers of Wrath
    By 17th level, your hunger for ruin lights your weapon and burns your enemies. When you hit a creature with a weapon attack on your turn, you can scar the first creature with celestial flames and immediately make an additional weapon attack against a different creature within reach. On a hit, the second creature is also affected by the flames. For one minute, each creature affected by the flames takes 2d10 fire damage at the start of each of its turns. At the end of each of its turns, an effected creature can make a Wisdom saving throw against your spell save DC, ending the effect on a success.

    Also, each creature affected by this feature also takes 1d10 fire damage each time it takes no damage from a spell or weapon attack that dealt damage to a different creature affected by this feature.

    Once you use this feature, you can't use it again until you finish a long rest.

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    Domain Spells
    Destruction Domain Spells
    Level Spell
    1st Chaos Bolt, Command Ensnaring Strike
    3rd Blindness/Deafness, Phantasmal Force
    5th Bestow Curse, Blinding Smite, Erupting Earth
    7th Blight, Control Water
    9th Holy Weapon, Insect Plague

    Bonus Proficiency
    At 1st level, you gain proficiency with martial weapons and heavy armor.

    Aid Destruction
    When an ally makes an attack roll targeting a creature within 10 feet of you, you can use your reaction to mark the target, granting your ally advantage on the attack roll.

    You can use this feature a number of times equal to your Wisdom modifier (a minimum of once). You regain all expended uses when you finish a long rest.

    Channel Divinity: Aura of Shattering
    Starting at 2nd level, you can use your Channel Divinity to center yourself in an aura of destructive power, hampering the defenses of creatures in your vicinity.

    As an action, you present your holy symbol, surrounding the area within 30 feet of you in a destructive aura until the end of your next turn. Creatures within the Aura have disadvantage on saving throws, and attack rolls against creatures in the aura are made with advantage.

    As an action on your turn, you can extend the duration of the aura by one round, to a maximum of 10 minutes.


    Starting at 2nd level, you can use your Channel Divinity to center yourself in an aura of destructive power and empowering the blows of your allies.

    As an action, you present your holy symbol, choosing up to six creatures within 30 feet of you. The first time one of these creatures deals damage before the end of your next turn, the attack or spell deals additional damage equal to your wisdom modifier.

    As an action on your turn, you can extend the duration of the aura by one round, to a maximum of 10 minutes.

    Channel Divinity: Befuddling Blow
    At 6th level, when you make a melee attack against a creature, you can use your Channel Divinity to force that creature to make a melee attack against another creature of your choice within its reach. The creature does not need to use its reaction to make this attack. The second creature must then making a Wisdom saving throw against your spell save DC or mistake your initial target as hostile to it.

    Divine Strike
    At 8th level, you gain the ability to infuse your weapon strikes with divine energy. Once on each of your turns when you hit a creature with a weapon attack, you can cause the attack to deal an extra 1d8 damage of the same type dealt by the weapon to the target. When you reach 14th level, the extra damage increases to 2d8.

    Mark for Boundless Fury
    As a bonus action, you can mark a creature within 10 feet of yourself to be destroyed. Until the end of your next turn, each creature to start its turn next to the creature can gains an additional action. That action can be used only to take the Attack (one weapon attack only) or Use an Object actions to attack the creature.

    You can use this ability once, and regain it at the end of a short or long rest.
    Last edited by sandmote; 2022-01-03 at 11:54 PM.

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    Default Re: Destruction Domain: Clerics who find everything a battlefield.

    Spells feel a little too... (De)Buff-focused. I was expecting more direct blasting.

    Martial Weapons, Heavy Armor, fine.

    Aid Destruction, fine.

    Aura Of Shattering feels niche-good for an ambush where you know you can alpha them away, but bad in most situations. So definitely not OP.

    Befuddling Blow shouldn't have the second effect-adjudication nightmare there.

    Divine Strike, all good.

    Mark For Boundless Fury feels either too good (Rogues) or not good enough. And in general... I'd like to see it changed. Call it a gut feeling, but it just doesn't FEEL good.
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    Default Re: Destruction Domain: Clerics who find everything a battlefield.

    I’m in agreement with JNA on most points here.

    Out of curiosity, I went back through the 4e Runepriest and looked at the specific benefits granted by the Rune of Destruction in At-Will and Encounter Prayers. I was surprised how many of the benefits were some variation on “you or you allies deal additional damage”. There were a smattering that improved attack bonuses or the ability of your allies to make opportunity attacks, but the majority were pure damage boosts.

    I was really hoping to see more of the Rune of Destruction coming through here, but other than Mark for Boundless Fury being based on the Rune of Boundless Fury, I’m having a difficult time of it. I think Befuddling Blow might be coming from Word of Befuddlement, but it’s a little unclear.

    The Domain Spells stick out to me the most – I would have expected more smite spells or beatstick spells, given the 4e Runepriest’s style of play. Things like Ensnaring Strike and Blinding Smite come to mind, with a consideration given to Spirit Guardians and Skill Empowerment as well. The last two don’t scream Runepriest nearly as loudly, but there were a number of Prayers that could be represented with them.

    I’d be quite interested in seeing your take on a Channel Divinity option with this subclass that allows allies to deal more damage with their attacks. That feels like it would be more in line with the characteristics used to describe the Runepriest:
    Quote Originally Posted by 4e Runepriest Overview Sidebar
    You use melee attacks to harass your enemies and leave them vulnerable to your allies’ attacks. With your heavy armor and your ability to heal, you are ideally suited for standing on the front line.

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    Default Re: Destruction Domain: Clerics who find everything a battlefield.

    Quote Originally Posted by JNAProductions View Post
    Spells feel a little too... (De)Buff-focused. I was expecting more direct blasting.
    Quote Originally Posted by Twelvetrees View Post
    The Domain Spells stick out to me the most – I would have expected more smite spells or beatstick spells, given the 4e Runepriest’s style of play. Things like Ensnaring Strike and Blinding Smite come to mind, with a consideration given to Spirit Guardians and Skill Empowerment as well. The last two don’t scream Runepriest nearly as loudly, but there were a number of Prayers that could be represented with them.
    Skill Empowerment fits the base class well, but not so much the destruction focus. Rest of this is a godd point.

    Quote Originally Posted by JNAProductions View Post
    Aura Of Shattering feels niche-good for an ambush where you know you can alpha them away, but bad in most situations. So definitely not OP.
    Quote Originally Posted by Twelvetrees View Post
    Out of curiosity, I went back through the 4e Runepriest and looked at the specific benefits granted by the Rune of Destruction in At-Will and Encounter Prayers. I was surprised how many of the benefits were some variation on “you or you allies deal additional damage”. There were a smattering that improved attack bonuses or the ability of your allies to make opportunity attacks, but the majority were pure damage boosts.

    I’d be quite interested in seeing your take on a Channel Divinity option with this subclass that allows allies to deal more damage with their attacks. That feels like it would be more in line with the characteristics used to describe the Runepriest:
    I was worried this would be broken, but seeing it written out helped and I think the new version captures this okay.

    Quote Originally Posted by JNAProductions View Post
    Befuddling Blow shouldn't have the second effect-adjudication nightmare there.
    Quote Originally Posted by Twelvetrees View Post
    I was really hoping to see more of the Rune of Destruction coming through here, but other than Mark for Boundless Fury being based on the Rune of Boundless Fury, I’m having a difficult time of it. I think Befuddling Blow might be coming from Word of Befuddlement, but it’s a little unclear.
    Now that I look at it again, would a knockoff of Flames of Purity work alright?

    Channel Divinity: Purging Flame
    At 6th level, you can present your holy symbol as an action, choosing a point within 30 feet, which billows out in flames. You choose each creature in a 10-foot-radius sphere centered on that point to be strengthened by the flames or to make a Dexterity saving throw. A creature strengthened by the flames deals additional fire damage equal to your wisdom modifier the next time it makes a weapon attack before the end of your next turn, and has resistance to cold and fire damage for the duration. A creature that fails the saving throw takes 6d6 fire damage on a failed save, or half as much damage on a successful one.

    Quote Originally Posted by JNAProductions View Post
    Mark For Boundless Fury feels either too good (Rogues) or not good enough. And in general... I'd like to see it changed. Call it a gut feeling, but it just doesn't FEEL good.
    It takes effect on the character's turn. The rogue gets an extra chance to hit rather than an extra sneak attack. What if I it applied off a melee attack, rather than as a bonus action?

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    Default Re: Destruction Domain: Clerics who find everything a battlefield.

    Purging Flame good.

    As for the Rogue bit, it's the ol' Haste trick. Use your main action to Ready an attack, use your bonus action to attack normally. When the Readied attack triggers, it's not your turn anymore, so you get Sneak Attack again.
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    Default Re: Destruction Domain: Clerics who find everything a battlefield.

    Finally getting around to double checking some of my old stuff feels nice. Purging Flame was renamed to "Aura of Shattering" when I added it to the

    Quote Originally Posted by JNAProductions View Post
    Purging Flame good.

    As for the Rogue bit, it's the ol' Haste trick. Use your main action to Ready an attack, use your bonus action to attack normally. When the Readied attack triggers, it's not your turn anymore, so you get Sneak Attack again.
    It seems all the notable published powers available to high level rune priests have similar effects. How's the following?

    Embers of Wrath
    By 17th level, your hunger for ruin lights your weapon and burns your enemies. When you hit a creature with a weapon attack on your turn, you can scar the first creature with celestial flames and immediately make an additional weapon attack against a different creature within reach. On a hit, the second creature is also affected by the flames. For one minute, each creature affected by the flames takes 1d10 fire damage at the start of each of its turns. At the end of each of its turns, an effected creature can make a Wisdom saving throw against your spell save DC, ending the effect on a success.

    Also, each creature affected by this feature also takes 1d4 fire damage each time it takes no damage from a spell or weapon attack that dealt damage to a different creature affected by this feature.

    Once you use this feature, you can't use it again until you finish a long rest.

    Set up to go off on a hit to avoid wasting it, but otherwise similar to the 5th level Rune of the Embers of Wrath runepriest power in 4e. Hoping the result is legible, but I think I need someone else to confirm.

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    Default Re: Destruction Domain: Clerics who find everything a battlefield.

    Quote Originally Posted by sandmote View Post
    Finally getting around to double checking some of my old stuff feels nice. Purging Flame was renamed to "Aura of Shattering" when I added it to the

    It seems all the notable published powers available to high level rune priests have similar effects. How's the following?

    Embers of Wrath
    By 17th level, your hunger for ruin lights your weapon and burns your enemies. When you hit a creature with a weapon attack on your turn, you can scar the first creature with celestial flames and immediately make an additional weapon attack against a different creature within reach. On a hit, the second creature is also affected by the flames. For one minute, each creature affected by the flames takes 1d10 fire damage at the start of each of its turns. At the end of each of its turns, an effected creature can make a Wisdom saving throw against your spell save DC, ending the effect on a success.

    Also, each creature affected by this feature also takes 1d4 fire damage each time it takes no damage from a spell or weapon attack that dealt damage to a different creature affected by this feature.

    Once you use this feature, you can't use it again until you finish a long rest.

    Set up to go off on a hit to avoid wasting it, but otherwise similar to the 5th level Rune of the Embers of Wrath runepriest power in 4e. Hoping the result is legible, but I think I need someone else to confirm.
    That feels pretty paltry for a 17th level feature. Just... Really lackluster. The damage is so small.
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    Default Re: Destruction Domain: Clerics who find everything a battlefield.

    I'm a little confused by Befuddling Blow.

    One, it feels pretty restrictive. The only creature you can guarantee is within melee range is...you. A lot of fights, this ability will just collect dust.

    Two, there's no saving throw? You just roll the attack and they have no option to withstand it? Even creatures immune to psychic, fear and charm? Forced action abilities are really powerful. I can't think of a single one that has no saving throw, resistance, or immunity. And no, "you have to attack" or even "you have to attack and hit" isn't enough for me, considering the ability reads like
    a) you don't even need to hit, and
    b) even if you do, you decide after the attack lands so the ability is never wasted, and
    c) an AC-based attack for a forced action sticks out like a kobold in a shire.

    Three, as others have said, it just doesn't feel like "Destruction". This feels like...Trickery.

    If we're talking Destruction, I'd lean towards a Channel Divinity that fakes being a "Cleric Sorcery Point" for attack spells. Reroll damage dice? Expand the blast radius? Smiting two heathens at once? "Free" upcast? Something that could apply to either multiple or single targets as needed at the time. I would expect a Destruction Cleric casting call lightning or flame strike to be a thing of holy/unholy terror. Any Cleric can cast flame strike. A Destruction Cleric casting flame strike, you should see the flash, hear the screams, and smell the sulfur a mile away. It should be something the party gasps in horror and says "Well thank Il-Matar he can only do that once, otherwise we're cooked".

    I ask you to reconsider.

    This Domain feels fairly balanced to me, mostly because it's so similar to War. I also like the 2nd and 17th level abilities overall, buffing allies is fun and productive. And while the War Cleric is all about hitting the target, then hitting them some more, this guy feels more mixed between the Striker and Leader role. The 6th level power is the only thing that stands out as being both oddly over- and underpowered at the same time and, I'm sorry, just seems to be misfiled from another Domain or class.

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    Default Re: Destruction Domain: Clerics who find everything a battlefield.

    Quote Originally Posted by JNAProductions View Post
    That feels pretty paltry for a 17th level feature. Just... Really lackluster. The damage is so small.
    Off the top of my head I figure this means I can boost the damage, perhaps to 8d10 for an Action surging 10th fighter.

    I'll list other concepts below.

    Quote Originally Posted by Breccia View Post
    One, it feels pretty restrictive. The only creature you can guarantee is within melee range is...you. A lot of fights, this ability will just collect dust.
    This is actually intentional. If there's only one enemy, you can use aura of shattering to give your allies greater destructive potential. If there's lot of enemies you can create some extra attacks between them. I'll take the point that it isn't great through.

    Quote Originally Posted by Breccia View Post
    Two, there's no saving throw? You just roll the attack and they have no option to withstand it? Even creatures immune to psychic, fear and charm? Forced action abilities are really powerful. I can't think of a single one that has no saving throw, resistance, or immunity. And no, "you have to attack" or even "you have to attack and hit" isn't enough for me, considering the ability reads like
    a) you don't even need to hit, and
    b) even if you do, you decide after the attack lands so the ability is never wasted, and
    c) an AC-based attack for a forced action sticks out like a kobold in a shire.

    Three, as others have said, it just doesn't feel like "Destruction". This feels like...Trickery.
    4e allows attacks to target Will instead of AC by default, and this is based on one power that does so.

    Would it work if I changed it to a wisdom save that forced the target to take damage and then be charmed by you until end of turn (on top of the extra attack)?

    Quote Originally Posted by Breccia View Post
    If we're talking Destruction, I'd lean towards a Channel Divinity that fakes being a "Cleric Sorcery Point" for attack spells. Reroll damage dice? Expand the blast radius? Smiting two heathens at once? "Free" upcast? Something that could apply to either multiple or single targets as needed at the time. I would expect a Destruction Cleric casting call lightning or flame strike to be a thing of holy/unholy terror. Any Cleric can cast flame strike. A Destruction Cleric casting flame strike, you should see the flash, hear the screams, and smell the sulfur a mile away. It should be something the party gasps in horror and says "Well thank Il-Matar he can only do that once, otherwise we're cooked".
    You'll smell ozone instead of sulfur but I think the Tempest Domain has this concept on lock. As such, the intent with the subclass is to "spread the destruction around," as it were, bringing in some of the runepriest's leader abilities.

    Other Ideas:
    Tide of Victory, shoving a target pretty far and then stunning them to boot.
    Avenging hammer: Hit a target pretty hard, and can do it again if they attack an ally. Stolen from the Protection rider, maybe also teleport the target next to you before the second attack?
    ...Not sure what else I can take from the original class.

    Quote Originally Posted by Breccia View Post
    This Domain feels fairly balanced to me, mostly because it's so similar to War. I also like the 2nd and 17th level abilities overall, buffing allies is fun and productive. And while the War Cleric is all about hitting the target, then hitting them some more, this guy feels more mixed between the Striker and Leader role.
    ...
    I'm sorry, just seems to be misfiled from another Domain or class.
    I mean, it kind of is misfiled from a Leader class. So I'm trying to thread the needle between "clearly destruction," and "clearly runepriest."

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    Default Re: Destruction Domain: Clerics who find everything a battlefield.

    Quote Originally Posted by sandmote View Post
    This is actually intentional.
    Well okay then.

    Quote Originally Posted by sandmote View Post
    4e allows attacks to target Will instead of AC by default, and this is based on one power that does so.
    Yes, but you could boost your Will defense. It was still something you could do to defend against this kind of attack. 5E doesn't have that.

    Quote Originally Posted by sandmote View Post
    Would it work if I changed it to a wisdom save that forced the target to take damage and then be charmed by you until end of turn (on top of the extra attack)?
    I mean, I still think it would be better off replaced, but forcing another creature to take an action sounds like something that should require a Wisdom saving throw. Just ask yourself "what if I, the DM, used this on the party?" I imagine a lot of players would be irate at being forced to attack their fellow party members with no way to stop it. Again, I can't think of any compulsion-style effects in 5E at all that don't allow a saving throw, mostly Wisdom. It would also assumedly add "creatures immune to the charmed condition are immune to this" which I'd also appreciate.

    If you require a successful attack, I'd recommend allowing the Cleric to use the ability after they know they hit. Otherwise it's too restrictive again. Adding charmed for their next round seems fair, it's a mild add-on but the Cleric is in melee and would appreciate the breather.

    Quote Originally Posted by sandmote View Post
    I mean, it kind of is misfiled from a Leader class. So I'm trying to thread the needle between "clearly destruction," and "clearly runepriest."
    Right, I don't have a problem with a Striker/Leader at all. Striker/Leader with a dash of Controller starts to feel overseasoned.

    You've addressed my concerns, I'm curious to see what you'll end up with. Again, the subclass overall feels pretty good. They'll have fun running with the three reavers we've seen in the last week :D

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    Default Re: Destruction Domain: Clerics who find everything a battlefield.

    Just to add my voice to the crowd that think that whilst fine, it doesn't scream "destruction".

    I would expect spells like shatter, destructive wave, maybe getting cantrips like firebolt that can set things on fire.

    I would expect abilities like doing siege damage to knock down buildings. Bonuses against constructs.

    Buffing allies seems more constructive than destructive. There is nothing wrong with the result per se, just it doesn't match the name in my mind (and I know that the history and the aim is more than the name).

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    Default Re: Destruction Domain: Clerics who find everything a battlefield.

    I was imagining the effect it would have if the thread title was supposed to be taken literally.
    "I found faith, a job and divine powers in this fight"
    Last edited by noob; 2021-12-29 at 05:25 PM.

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    Default Re: Destruction Domain: Clerics who find everything a battlefield.

    Quote Originally Posted by Breccia View Post
    Well okay then.
    To point out again the goal was that the 6th level channel divinity is primarily useful when the 2nd level channel divinity option fails to be. Just what to clarify that I'm not intentionally writing weaker material for the sake of writing weaker material.

    Quote Originally Posted by Breccia View Post
    I mean, I still think it would be better off replaced, but forcing another creature to take an action sounds like something that should require a Wisdom saving throw. Just ask yourself "what if I, the DM, used this on the party?" I imagine a lot of players would be irate at being forced to attack their fellow party members with no way to stop it. Again, I can't think of any compulsion-style effects in 5E at all that don't allow a saving throw, mostly Wisdom. It would also assumedly add "creatures immune to the charmed condition are immune to this" which I'd also appreciate.

    If you require a successful attack, I'd recommend allowing the Cleric to use the ability after they know they hit. Otherwise it's too restrictive again. Adding charmed for their next round seems fair, it's a mild add-on but the Cleric is in melee and would appreciate the breather.
    It no longer feels necessary to deny the cleric the ability to do this on a miss. I also don't feel like the effect should last a full round. How's the following sound as a simplification of the concept?

    Channel Divinity: Befuddling Blow
    At 6th level, when you make a melee attack against a creature, you can use your Channel Divinity to force that creature to make a Wisdom saving throw or be charmed by you until the end of your turn as wrest the knowledge of foe and friend from its mind. If a creature is charmed by you in this manner, you can force it to make a melee attack against a creature of your choice within its reach (no action required by you or the creature).

    If this is too weak, extending the charmed duration to a whole round is probably the easiest fix.

    Quote Originally Posted by MrStabby View Post
    Just to add my voice to the crowd that think that whilst fine, it doesn't scream "destruction".

    I would expect spells like shatter, destructive wave, maybe getting cantrips like firebolt that can set things on fire.

    I would expect abilities like doing siege damage to knock down buildings. Bonuses against constructs.

    Buffing allies seems more constructive than destructive. There is nothing wrong with the result per se, just it doesn't match the name in my mind (and I know that the history and the aim is more than the name).
    As mentioned above, some of this would end up overlapping pretty heavily with the Tempest Domain. Would it help to have gravity sinkhole and destructive wave replace control water and insect plague? But I do want to point out I included Chaos Bolt and Erupting Earth, as spells vaguely similar to shatter that aren't Tempest Domain Spells already.

    Quote Originally Posted by noob View Post
    I was imagining the effect it would have if the thread title was supposed to be taken literally.
    "I found faith, a job and divine powers in this fight"
    I suppose the description reads more like a violent anarchist than a runepriest.

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    Default Re: Destruction Domain: Clerics who find everything a battlefield.

    Quote Originally Posted by sandmote View Post
    It no longer feels necessary to deny the cleric the ability to do this on a miss. I also don't feel like the effect should last a full round. How's the following sound as a simplification of the concept?
    1) Yeah, I guess this is a little more "I need the effect to go off now".
    2) I mean, if it's charmed for one turn, it's also a defensive ability against single targets, which makes it more useful.

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    Default Re: Destruction Domain: Clerics who find everything a battlefield.

    Corellon Larethian... elven deity of magic and battle. That would be 1.

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    Default Re: Destruction Domain: Clerics who find everything a battlefield.

    Erevan Ilesere... elven deity of mischief and trickery. Swords and spells, arcane and divine.

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    Default Re: Destruction Domain: Clerics who find everything a battlefield.

    Quote Originally Posted by CopperElfCleric View Post
    Corellon Larethian... elven deity of magic and battle. That would be 1.
    Quote Originally Posted by CopperElfCleric View Post
    Erevan Ilesere... elven deity of mischief and trickery. Swords and spells, arcane and divine.
    This has nothing to do with the thread.

    Sandmote
    Aura Of Shattering could use some cleanup. Just wording and phrasing. I'd also allow you to extend the aura as an action OR bonus action. (Either or so you can use something like Spiritual Weapon if you like, but can cast spells otherwise.) Initially requiring an action is fine.
    I have a LOT of Homebrew!

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    Default Re: Destruction Domain: Clerics who find everything a battlefield.

    Quote Originally Posted by sandmote View Post
    As mentioned above, some of this would end up overlapping pretty heavily with the Tempest Domain. Would it help to have gravity sinkhole and destructive wave replace control water and insect plague? But I do want to point out I included Chaos Bolt and Erupting Earth, as spells vaguely similar to shatter that aren't Tempest Domain Spells already.
    I think that we would have to accept some overlap if we are going for a destruction theme.

    I won't say its the right way, but rather my personal approach would be to start with the Tempest Cleric and look to differentiate.

    Take the spells that overlap but look to add different abilities. So where the Tempest cleric is heavy armoured, I would go medium armour and cantrip boosts. Use some spells that were not around at the time the tempest cleric was generated - tidal wave, maelstrom, thunderclap (bonus cantrip - though if not melee focussed a limited boost in power), stormsphere, cloud kill, immolation, wrath of nature.

    You could also do something like the Arcan Cleric does and as a capstone, provide access to more spells: I would suggest meteor swarm, Storm of vengeance, Earthquake, Tsunami, Firestorm, Whirlwind, Tenser's Transformation, Chain Lightning.

    I wouldn't feel bad about giving more spells than the arcana cleric does because there is so much overlap between them and the strength of the roup of them averaged over all circumstances is probably a lot less powerful than the Arcana cleric's cherry picked spells.

    That said, I can see that you have a vision for "destruction" that is somewhat different to my own (including I think, some references I don't get), so this is a personal view rather than something I think will match well.

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    Default Re: Destruction Domain: Clerics who find everything a battlefield.

    What would a construction cleric be?

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    Default Re: Destruction Domain: Clerics who find everything a battlefield.

    Quote Originally Posted by Breccia View Post
    1) Yeah, I guess this is a little more "I need the effect to go off now".
    2) I mean, if it's charmed for one turn, it's also a defensive ability against single targets, which makes it more useful.
    Sure.

    Quote Originally Posted by JNAProductions View Post
    Aura Of Shattering could use some cleanup. Just wording and phrasing. I'd also allow you to extend the aura as an action OR bonus action. (Either or so you can use something like Spiritual Weapon if you like, but can cast spells otherwise.) Initially requiring an action is fine.
    I've attempted a cleanup. Not sure about the action/bonus action options; I kind of want the ability that grants +30 max damage per round for multiple rounds to have some additional drawbacks.

    I've also increased the damage on Embers of Wrath and will have it replace Mark for Boundless Fury.

    Quote Originally Posted by MrStabby View Post
    That said, I can see that you have a vision for "destruction" that is somewhat different to my own (including I think, some references I don't get), so this is a personal view rather than something I think will match well.
    Yup- I'm technically converting half a class from 4e d&d here.

    Quote Originally Posted by noob View Post
    What would a construction cleric be?
    I believe they called that the Forge Domain.

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    Default Re: Destruction Domain: Clerics who find everything a battlefield.

    The Aura CAN add +30 damage... If you have at least six allies, and all of them hit with at least one attack before your next turn. Which doesn't feel super likely to me, in most normal-sized games.

    I dunno, I feel like it's something I'd almost never use due to action economy. If your table rolls differently, it can work for you, but to me? Not a very appealing feature.
    I have a LOT of Homebrew!

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    Default Re: Destruction Domain: Clerics who find everything a battlefield.

    Quote Originally Posted by JNAProductions View Post
    The Aura CAN add +30 damage... If you have at least six allies, and all of them hit with at least one attack before your next turn. Which doesn't feel super likely to me, in most normal-sized games.

    I dunno, I feel like it's something I'd almost never use due to action economy. If your table rolls differently, it can work for you, but to me? Not a very appealing feature.
    It applies to damage rolls.
    So if you somehow find a way to deal damage other than by hitting a single target it is much better.
    Ex: two the members of the team have shatter and use it at once to try to kill three targets close to each other: on their own they will dea a total of +30 damage(+10 to each target) without you needing 6 allies.
    Please note it is still not strong and is situational to allies having a way to deal damage to multiple targets with a single damage roll.
    But I think it would be much better if it worked the following way: when you activate it you can make the 6 next damage rolls of allies this turn deal extra damage (so you still get full use without needing 6 allies if your allies have extra attack)
    Then at later level make it spend a bonus action or something so that it is still worth it.

    It is also extremely powerful if you play with the rule that magic missile rolls damage a single time and applies the roll for all missiles: this way you can boost further a nuclear force missile mage.
    Last edited by noob; 2022-01-04 at 10:12 AM.

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    Default Re: Destruction Domain: Clerics who find everything a battlefield.

    Quote Originally Posted by noob View Post
    What would a construction cleric be?
    Gond!

    No really, this is a good question. And I don't remember there being any class/subclass contests for it so...

    EDIT: Okay, this is something I quick threw together because you asked. It's more of a support role, I admit, but I also didn't take it very seriously.

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    Cleric: Construction Domain

    While the Forge Domain is specialized in what it creates, Construction is more open-ended. A diety such as Gond, who rules over craftsmen as a whole, would grant something more all-encompassing.

    This is just something I threw together, not worth its own thread. It's not a serious subclass.

    Construction Domain Spells

    Because "Construction" is so broad, when a Construction Domain Cleric reaches 1st level, they pick from the spells from that level's list. They do the same at 3rd, 5th, 7th and 9th. When a Domain Cleric gets a new level of Cleric, they may change any one of their domain spell choices to another choice from that same level.

    Cleric Level Spells
    1st Pick two from Tenser's Floating Disc, Shield, Mage Armor and Illusionary Script
    3rd Pick two from Arcane Lock, Magic Weapon, Rope Trick and Locate Object
    5th Pick two from Create Food and Water*, Leomund's Tiny Hut, Glyph of Warding and Elemental Weapon
    7th Fabricate, plus pick one from Leomund's Secret Chest, Mordenkainen's Private Sanctum, and Conjure Minor Elementals
    9th Pick two from Aninmate Objects, Creation, Telekenisis and Passwall
    *When casting Create Food and Water, a Construction Cleric may choose the type of food, including ingredients and spices. The effects are the same, but it probably tastes a lot better.

    Cleric Spells That Create An Object
    When this term is used, this refers to spells that
    1) have a duration of at least one round, and
    2) do not create living, undead, or construct creatures
    3) do not modify a living/undead/construct's stats, but instead have stats of their own
    It's the DMs discretion, but it's meant to affect things like Spiritual Weapon and Wall of Force, not Sacred Flame or Flame Strike. A pillar of fire and radiant energy doesn't count, _Brandon_.

    Bonus Proficiencies
    When you choose this domain at 1st level, you gain Proficiency and Expertise in the artisan's tools of your choice. It is assumed your Construction specialty is that skill.

    Building a Sacred Path
    At 1st level, you may use any artisan's tools in which you have Expertise as your spellcasting focus.

    Furthermore, when using any artisan's tools in which you have Expertise, you get the following options:
    1) When making repairs or adjustments on a nonmagical item, the job takes 25% less time and materials/cost. Multiple class effects that reduce time, materials, or cost do not stack.
    2) When making any skill or ability check to create any item, if any natural roll on any d20 is a 5 or lower, you may choose to roll that die again. Any die you reroll that way, you must accept the second result, even if it is lower.

    Divine Quality is not meant to be used to give infinite retries, however. Enough is enough. A die that has already been rerolled by some other effect cannot be rerolled again with Divine Quality, and a reroll from Divine Quality cannot be rerolled by any other method. You failed, _Brandon_, give someone else a turn.
    3) Any nonmagical item you make is of higher quality, and has a number of charges of Divine Quality equal to your proficiency bonus when you make the item. When the item is used as a tool or weapon in any skill check, ability check, or attack roll, any d20 rolled that is a natural 5 or lower, the user may expend one charge of that item's Divine Quality to reroll that die. They must accept the second roll, even if it is lower. Once the item has no charges of Divine Quality left, it still continues to work normally.

    This includes forging items, and bribing people with items.

    **Special Note: I am not aware of any standard 5E rules about making magical items. In any campaign that does that, the assumption is that Construction Domain Clerics can make items of suitable quality to be enchanted.

    Channel Divinity: Empowered Creation

    Starting at 2nd level, you can use your Channel Divinity to imbue you with greater creation ability. If you are Concentrating on a spell that creates or modifies an object -- such as Spiritual Weapon or Telekensis -- and your Concentration is broken, you may use your Reaction and one use of Channel Divinity to extend your Concentration for one more round.

    This means, if you can re-cast the spell quickly enough, you can seem to retain its effects by recasting the new effect where the last one is about to vanish.

    This also means it is temporarily possible to maintain two Concentration spells at the same time...briefly.

    Improved Sacred Building
    Starting at 6th level, the items you make are further improved.
    1) Any single-use expendable item you make that rolls dice, such as acid or a potion of healing, any rolled natural 1's on any of those rolled dice may be rerolled. The second result must be taken. Nonmagical ammunition also has this effect, even though it is not technically single-use.
    2) Divine Quality may be used to give items you create Advantage on any saving throws involved in damaging or breaking the item.
    3) Divine Quality may be used on natural rolls of 7 or lower, instead of 5.
    4) You may "repair" Divine Quality to any item that has run out of uses. This follows the same rules of repairing a damaged item, including your reduction to time and cost. Of course, you have to have the necessary skills to repair the item (i.e. a caligrapher can repair a damaged book, but not a halberd)

    Divine Barrier
    At 8th level, you gain the ability to suddenly create a wall of protection, mimicking the effect of any spell that starts with "Wall Of" whose casting time is 1 action, and whose spell level is one-half your Construction Domain Cleric level, or lower. The wall's appearance may be changed, so it appears to be made out of shapes of items you could make with any artisan's tools you have Expertise with. For example, a caligrapher could make a Wall of Fire out of floating, flaming letters. A carpenter could make Wall of Wind look like a misty pallisade. The appearance change has no effect on the wall's effect.

    As usual, any focus or expensive material component must still be supplied. If the mimicked spell has Concentration, so does Divine Barrier.

    Blade Barrier does not start with "Wall Of". No fair renaming this "Wall of Blades" I see you _Brandon_.

    Once used, this ability cannot be used again until the Construction Domain Cleric takes a long rest.

    Improved Divine Barrier
    At 14th level, any wall you create with Divine Barrier has double hit points and Advantage on any Saving Throws it makes.

    Avatar of Creation
    At 17th level, your ability to create is second only to the dieties themselves.

    1) Divine Quality may now be used on natural rolls of 10 or lower.
    2) During any long rest, you may restore one use of Divine Quality to one item that has no uses left.
    3) When you cast a Cleric spell that creates an object, such as Spiritual Weapon or any use of Divine Barrier, it no longer requires Concentration. However, you cannot cast a second version of that same spell while your first one remains.
    4) Any expendable single-use items you make, or ammunition, magical or otherwise, now reroll all 1's and 2's on any dice rolled to determine their effect. So also do any single-use effects of your Cleric spells that create an object, such as Glyph of Warding. Multiple-use Cleric spells that create an object, such as Wall of Fire and Spiritual Weapon, reroll 1's only.
    5) Any objects you create with Cleric spells have double hit points and Advantage on all Saving Throws, not just Divine Barriers.

    ** If your campaign has special rules for creating other items, such as golems, a 17th-level Construction Domain Cleric should get a non-mandatory boost there as well. For example, if a Construction Domain Cleric is part of making an Iron Golem, perhaps allow the golem to roll its hit points, and if they're too low, the Cleric could say "nevermind, we retroactively take average hit points".


    Please don't bother with criticism -- yes, I know you mean well, but I already know it's not that great. I slapped it together in a half hour. You'd probably be better off making a new one from scratch and entering it into a forum contest. Plus it's not the focus of this thread.
    Last edited by Breccia; 2022-01-04 at 11:37 AM.

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    Default Re: Destruction Domain: Clerics who find everything a battlefield.

    Quote Originally Posted by JNAProductions View Post
    The Aura CAN add +30 damage... If you have at least six allies, and all of them hit with at least one attack before your next turn. Which doesn't feel super likely to me, in most normal-sized games.

    I dunno, I feel like it's something I'd almost never use due to action economy. If your table rolls differently, it can work for you, but to me? Not a very appealing feature.
    I again note that the bit of your suggestion I left out was the one making it easier to apply the effect again for a consecutive round (ie. adding on another +30 damage). It does also apply to spells and non-attack damage.

    Admittedly it probably doesn't scale great given you'll eventually be dealing an average of 26 damage per turn with Toll the Dead. On the other hand its a full caster class and this happens starting at 17th level, so I'm leaving it for now.

    Quote Originally Posted by noob View Post
    Ex: two the members of the team have shatter and use it at once to try to kill three targets close to each other: on their own they will dea a total of +30 damage(+10 to each target) without you needing 6 allies.
    This would be broken and I've attempted to remove it from the latest version of the feature. The effect currently should apply to a single damage roll. For further commentary on this, please see discussion on the Draconic Bloodline Sorcerer's Elemental Affinity feature.

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    Default Re: Destruction Domain: Clerics who find everything a battlefield.

    Quote Originally Posted by sandmote View Post
    This would be broken and I've attempted to remove it from the latest version of the feature. The effect currently should apply to a single damage roll. For further commentary on this, please see discussion on the Draconic Bloodline Sorcerer's Elemental Affinity feature.
    The reason it is broken is because it applies to a single damage roll.
    You throw a single damage roll for an aoe spell and that is why it is strong to modify a damage roll because it affects the entire aoe.
    So if you want to unbreak it make it apply not to a damage roll but instead apply to the damage taken by a single target.
    Discussions about the rules of dnd 5e does not helps here: it is not because some people says "rules means that a single damage roll means it applies to a single target" that it is the only valid interpretation of the rules instead you should make rules that are not ambiguous and needing people to read a discussion of people that makes a decision about how they think the rules works.

    For example I disagree that "single damage roll" means that a single target is affected by the damage roll because I did read a rule that says

    If a spell or other Effect deals damage to more than one target at the same time, roll the damage once for all of them. For example, when a Wizard casts Fireball or a Cleric casts Flame Strike, the spell’s damage is rolled once for all Creatures caught in the blast.
    If there is other rules that contradicts this rule then it means that depending on the table it might be one interpretation that goes or the other and it means that the power of your homebrew class might variate a lot depending on the table.
    You can definitively fix it by not making something that depends on those 5e rules.

    Ex: Each affected target can once during their turn deal extra damage equal to your wisdom modifier to a single target they are dealing damage to.

    So that there is no need to think about the meaning of the rules of 5e and meditate for 4 hours then get a result randomly depending on the gm.
    Because even for some non ambiguous things that have finally been solved such as melee weapon attacks with a weapon the way gms interprets those rules still depends on the table because it is too complicated and they make mistakes.
    Last edited by noob; 2022-01-05 at 09:15 AM.

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