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  1. - Top - End - #61
    Bugbear in the Playground
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    Default Re: Why Redcloak is my favourite character.

    So this thread seems like it might be a good place to ask some questions I have been holding in for a while.

    Firstly, if Redcloak is still physically a teenager, it follows that he would have the same hormone levels as a typical teenage guy, right? You wouldn't guess it from his behavior (mostly?) but it stands to reason.

    Second, has he had sex ever? It hasn't explicitly been said that he hasn't, but if he has it certainly hasn't been mentioned either, and his career hasn't really lent itself to a lot of opportunities. He was still at the "haven't asked out the girl next door" stage when SoD opened and he's been pretty much "married to the job" since then.

    Thirdly, is there a particular reason he needed his own bathroom? (I'm assuming it was his since there weren't likely many goblin clerics are among the hobgoblin army, much less goblin clerics who rate their own private bathroom.)

  2. - Top - End - #62
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    Default Re: Why Redcloak is my favourite character.

    Yo Luna, your inbox is full.

    Quote Originally Posted by B. Dandelion View Post
    So this thread seems like it might be a good place to ask some questions I have been holding in for a while.

    Firstly, if Redcloak is still physically a teenager, it follows that he would have the same hormone levels as a typical teenage guy, right? You wouldn't guess it from his behavior (mostly?) but it stands to reason.
    Makes sense.

    [quote]Second, has he had sex ever? It hasn't explicitly been said that he hasn't, but if he has it certainly hasn't been mentioned either, and his career hasn't really lent itself to a lot of opportunities. He was still at the "haven't asked out the girl next door" stage when SoD opened and he's been pretty much "married to the job" since then.[quote]
    I really donít see why this would matter but if I had to guess Iíd say no. Heís too focused on his mission and emotionally stunted to seek intimacy.

    Thirdly, is there a particular reason he needed his own bathroom? (I'm assuming it was his since there weren't likely many goblin clerics are among the hobgoblin army, much less goblin clerics who rate their own private bathroom.)
    Big boss man get big boss room to show other apes who is big boss.

    As the regimeís #2 I would assume he got his own apartments as a matter of course, with bathroom included.
    "Any technology distinguishable from magic is insufficiently advanced."
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    Quote Originally Posted by Peelee View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Fyraltari View Post
    the Vector Legion [is the IFCC's new pawns], mark my words. Way too much unfinished business there and they already know about the Gates.
    I'll take that bet.

  3. - Top - End - #63
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    GreataxeFighterGirl

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    Default Re: Why Redcloak is my favourite character.

    Quote Originally Posted by B. Dandelion View Post
    these questions three
    Okay, I had to crack up -- these questions are very different from what usually is associated with Redcloak.

    First: He's mentally 55 and physically ~18. I don't know how that works out.

    Second: he's married to the job (I can't believe RC and Durkon were chatting so friendly just four strips ago). The Cloak's powers include longetivity, immunity to disease, and the special abilities Bestow Celibacy, which has no saving throw.

    Third: I always assumed that was Jirix's bathroom, but maybe there's an exciting cleric spell that can help people hit the hay.

    ETA: In more seriousness, though, anyone he can be close with would pretty much end up as a #1 target for Xykon.
    Last edited by understatement; 2020-08-12 at 04:52 PM.

  4. - Top - End - #64
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    PaladinGuy

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    Default Re: Why Redcloak is my favourite character.

    Quote Originally Posted by B. Dandelion View Post
    Firstly, if Redcloak is still physically a teenager, it follows that he would have the same hormone levels as a typical teenage guy, right? You wouldn't guess it from his behavior (mostly?) but it stands to reason.
    I would say he has the same level of hormones he had when he was a teenage goblin, which might be different from the "typical" teenage goblin or human. That assumes that the red cloak doesn't alter that along with its arresting of the aging process in him.

    Second, has he had sex ever? It hasn't explicitly been said that he hasn't, but if he has it certainly hasn't been mentioned either, and his career hasn't really lent itself to a lot of opportunities. He was still at the "haven't asked out the girl next door" stage when SoD opened and he's been pretty much "married to the job" since then.
    It's probably none of our business, but my general impression would be no. He hasn't seemed to show much interest in the subject, even when the goblin/hobgoblin supreme leader and High Priest of the Dark One is obviously someone any number of young ambitious female goblins might consider cozying up to. One wonders whether Redcloak ever saw the girl goblin his brother tried to set him up with in Start of Darkness again.

    Thirdly, is there a particular reason he needed his own bathroom? (I'm assuming it was his since there weren't likely many goblin clerics are among the hobgoblin army, much less goblin clerics who rate their own private bathroom.)
    Perks of being the supreme leader, I would imagine, not any special reason.
    Last edited by Jason; 2020-08-12 at 04:43 PM.

  5. - Top - End - #65
    Bugbear in the Playground
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    Default Re: Why Redcloak is my favourite character.

    Quote Originally Posted by Fyraltari View Post
    I really donít see why this would matter but if I had to guess Iíd say no. Heís too focused on his mission and emotionally stunted to seek intimacy.
    I don't know if it specifically matters but I don't know that it specifically doesn't either. The general impression I have within the comic is that sex is an important part of life in general and does factor in to most people's lives to at least some extent. We have some idea of most of the major character's sexual history. 5/6ths of the title characters have had sex at least once during the run of the comic, and the 6th was married. Xykon has no sex drive as a lich, but was sexually active as a younger man. Nale and Sabine have sex constantly. Tarquin is a dirty old man who has sex with women who may or may not be consenting. Lien has a boyfriend and explicitly isn't a virgin. The characters who aren't established as sexually active usually have some comment on it or are too young/immature. MitD is a literal child. Thog is childish and thinks girls have cooties. O-Chul's sex life has never been discussed, but he does have a line about having no interest in such matters as marriage, which has led some to conclude he is asexual. Hinjo's not been shown with a sexual partner but says in a bonus strip he does plan to marry later. Miko is not established as having had sex and this gets thrown in her face as a taunt about being sexually frustrated. (Maaaaybe not the high point of the comic although I still get a chuckle out of "Treasure Type O" in abstract.)

    Somehow it feels especially prurient to focus on Redcloak's sex life or lack thereof (hence my hesitation to broach the topic outside of this thread), but when I think about it I don't entirely know why that is. Why should he be the exception to the general rule about sex in the comic, why does it feel more taboo to talk about him in particular? Or make a risque joke about him that the comic has specifically made about other characters before? He was a young man when his life got derailed, and he may have missed out on what is for most people an important threshold of adulthood. He is shown as having attraction to goblin women. If he is still a virgin so late in his life, he undoubtedly has feelings about it. The comic has progressed in certain ways and may no longer be prone to crack wise about how so-and-so needs to get laid, but I wouldn't necessarily take it for granted that the issue on the whole is something that doesn't warrant thinking about. Going by the track record, the question of "has Redcloak ever had sex" has more than likely been considered by the author.

    Would it detract from his character if it were implied that he has some degree of repressed sexual frustration, as most people would in his position? That being a person with sexual needs and no outlet is something that adds to the general misery of his life, that he tries not to think about? Or that he might have some insecurity about himself that he's never forged that kind of connection with anyone?

    Quote Originally Posted by Fyraltari View Post
    Big boss man get big boss room to show other apes who is big boss.

    As the regimeís #2 I would assume he got his own apartments as a matter of course, with bathroom included.
    That was what I had assumed myself, right up until I starting writing my first post in this thread. I had just been planning to ask my first two questions and then suddenly my brain went in a direction I had not expected, and I couldn't resist adding a third. But I have thought about the private bathroom from time to time just because I have thought "that time Haley led a strike force raid on Redcloak's bathroom" would be a really funny thing to make a call back to later on if/when Haley and Redcloak ever talk face to face. It seemed like it would be slightly embarrassing for her to have to explain, but now it's potentially even more awkward for all parties concerned. So I want it to happen even more.

    Quote Originally Posted by understatement View Post
    Okay, I had to crack up -- these questions are very different from what usually is associated with Redcloak.

    First: He's mentally 55 and physically ~18. I don't know how that works out.

    Second: he's married to the job (I can't believe RC and Durkon were chatting so friendly just four strips ago). The Cloak's powers include longetivity, immunity to disease, and the special abilities Bestow Celibacy, which has no saving throw.

    Third: I always assumed that was Jirix's bathroom, but maybe there's an exciting cleric spell that can help people hit the hay.
    Glad at least one person got a laugh. I hoped more people would, but it is indeed unusual to talk about him in any kind of sexual context and it might be more off-putting than anything.

    Quote Originally Posted by understatement View Post
    ETA: In more seriousness, though, anyone he can be close with would pretty much end up as a #1 target for Xykon.
    Yeah that's probably a factor.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jason View Post
    I would say he has the same level of hormones he had when he was a teenage goblin, which might be different from the "typical" teenage goblin or human. That assumes that the red cloak doesn't alter that along with its arresting of the aging process in him.
    If the Mantle further messes with or suppresses his sexual chemistry that is pretty awful and messed up, IMO.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jason View Post
    It's probably none of our business, but my general impression would be no. He hasn't seemed to show much interest in the subject, even when the goblin/hobgoblin supreme leader and High Priest of the Dark One is obviously someone any number of young ambitious female goblins might consider cozying up to. One wonders whether Redcloak ever saw the girl goblin his brother tried to set him up with in Start of Darkness again.
    It's no less our business than the sex lives of everybody else we already know about. He doesn't appear to be asexual, just celibate. If goblin women have tried to seduce him it's never been mentioned, but he could have other reasons besides a lack of sexual interest to rebuff any such proposition, e.g. fear of making them a target to Xykon or a sense that he would be inappropriately taking advantage of someone he's in a position of authority over.

    I'm hoping for her sake that Kayannara split town after Redcloak turned her down, since that would have saved her from being conscripted into Xykon's army like the rest of the village. Otherwise she's dead along with everybody else. In the first case he hasn't seen her since, in the second he might have though I can't think she'd be especially warm toward him after he both rejected her and indirectly led to her enslavement.

  6. - Top - End - #66
    Firbolg in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: Why Redcloak is my favourite character.

    Quote Originally Posted by B. Dandelion View Post
    I don't know if it specifically matters but I don't know that it specifically doesn't either. The general impression I have within the comic is that sex is an important part of life in general and does factor in to most people's lives to at least some extent. We have some idea of most of the major character's sexual history. 5/6ths of the title characters have had sex at least once during the run of the comic, and the 6th was married. Xykon has no sex drive as a lich, but was sexually active as a younger man. Nale and Sabine have sex constantly. Tarquin is a dirty old man who has sex with women who may or may not be consenting. Lien has a boyfriend and explicitly isn't a virgin. The characters who aren't established as sexually active usually have some comment on it or are too young/immature. MitD is a literal child. Thog is childish and thinks girls have cooties. O-Chul's sex life has never been discussed, but he does have a line about having no interest in such matters as marriage, which has led some to conclude he is asexual. Hinjo's not been shown with a sexual partner but says in a bonus strip he does plan to marry later. Miko is not established as having had sex and this gets thrown in her face as a taunt about being sexually frustrated. (Maaaaybe not the high point of the comic although I still get a chuckle out of "Treasure Type O" in abstract.)

    Somehow it feels especially prurient to focus on Redcloak's sex life or lack thereof (hence my hesitation to broach the topic outside of this thread), but when I think about it I don't entirely know why that is. Why should he be the exception to the general rule about sex in the comic, why does it feel more taboo to talk about him in particular? Or make a risque joke about him that the comic has specifically made about other characters before? He was a young man when his life got derailed, and he may have missed out on what is for most people an important threshold of adulthood. He is shown as having attraction to goblin women. If he is still a virgin so late in his life, he undoubtedly has feelings about it. The comic has progressed in certain ways and may no longer be prone to crack wise about how so-and-so needs to get laid, but I wouldn't necessarily take it for granted that the issue on the whole is something that doesn't warrant thinking about. Going by the track record, the question of "has Redcloak ever had sex" has more than likely been considered by the author.
    Iíd say thatís precisely because the comic doesnít talk about it. It feels more indiscrete in his case because in his case itís not already a topic.
    His attraction to women has been showcased twice but in both case, in my opinion, the sexual aspect was at best secondary. The first time was showing him to be a normal teenager with teenager problems to contrast what he was robbed of/could have been with what he became. And the second was more about the possibility of him stepping of that path to regain said normalcy.



    That was what I had assumed myself, right up until I starting writing my first post in this thread. I had just been planning to ask my first two questions and then suddenly my brain went in a direction I had not expected, and I couldn't resist adding a third. But I have thought about the private bathroom from time to time just because I have thought "that time Haley led a strike force raid on Redcloak's bathroom" would be a really funny thing to make a call back to later on if/when Haley and Redcloak ever talk face to face. It seemed like it would be slightly embarrassing for her to have to explain, but now it's potentially even more awkward for all parties concerned. So I want it to happen even more.
    I donít see why itís weird for a man living alone to have his own bathroom. I mean he has no roommate not partner so who would he share it with?

    Jirix? MitD?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Peelee View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Fyraltari View Post
    the Vector Legion [is the IFCC's new pawns], mark my words. Way too much unfinished business there and they already know about the Gates.
    I'll take that bet.

  7. - Top - End - #67
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    GreataxeFighterGirl

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    Default Re: Why Redcloak is my favourite character.

    Quote Originally Posted by Fyraltari View Post
    I donít see why itís weird for a man living alone to have his own bathroom. I mean he has no roommate not partner so who would he share it with?

    Jirix? MitD?
    Food for the MiTD thread? (in the most literal sense possible).

    ***

    @B. Dandelion: the Mantle most likely did; it seems to be a magical effect that slows aging down to the point where the Bearer is functionally immortal. If RC had put it on at a different, older age, things might've turned out differently.

  8. - Top - End - #68
    Bugbear in the Playground
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    Default Re: Why Redcloak is my favourite character.

    I don't really think there's anything "weird" about a private bathroom that needs to be "explained". Y'all are taking my question literally when I just put it there as a joke with some sex-related questions in order to create innuendo about it. The intent was to provoke people into crying for brain bleach, but I got dry answers and earnest confusion instead.

    Quote Originally Posted by Fyraltari View Post
    Iíd say thatís precisely because the comic doesnít talk about it. It feels more indiscrete in his case because in his case itís not already a topic.

    His attraction to women has been showcased twice but in both case, in my opinion, the sexual aspect was at best secondary. The first time was showing him to be a normal teenager with teenager problems to contrast what he was robbed of/could have been with what he became. And the second was more about the possibility of him stepping of that path to regain said normalcy.
    I don't know, it seems more like most characters are regarded as fair game to speculate about because of the openly adult nature of the setting. Like I remember people on the forum being not shy at all to start making sexual speculation about Laurin and the nature of her "favor", and she wasn't made a sexual topic by the comic first.

    He was robbed of a normal life, part of which would have included sex. It is a normal teenage problem to be shy and to not want to rush, the way his mother did when she started talking about grandkids the second she learned of his crush. Kayannara is more overtly sexual, takes the initiative, and wants an adult date with alcohol. Sex isn't THE point, but it is not an overlooked aspect of normalcy.

    Anyway, we were talking about why this could be relevant, well. Here's one for you: Sabine is still a part of this story. The IFCC want to promote conflict between Team Evil and the Order of the Stick. They want the world destroyed, so they definitely don't want Redcloak to change sides and heal the rifts. What exactly happens if Sabine and Redcloak cross paths, you think he'd give her the treatment Roy did, when Sabine couldn't offer Roy anything he didn't get elsewhere?

  9. - Top - End - #69
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    GreataxeFighterGirl

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    Default Re: Why Redcloak is my favourite character.

    Quote Originally Posted by B. Dandelion View Post
    I don't really think there's anything "weird" about a private bathroom that needs to be "explained". Y'all are taking my question literally when I just put it there as a joke with some sex-related questions in order to create innuendo about it. The intent was to provoke people into crying for brain bleach, but I got dry answers and earnest confusion instead.
    Oh, yeah. Right.

    I don't know, it seems more like most characters are regarded as fair game to speculate about because of the openly adult nature of the setting. Like I remember people on the forum being not shy at all to start making sexual speculation about Laurin and the nature of her "favor", and she wasn't made a sexual topic by the comic first.

    He was robbed of a normal life, part of which would have included sex. It is a normal teenage problem to be shy and to not want to rush, the way his mother did when she started talking about grandkids the second she learned of his crush. Kayannara is more overtly sexual, takes the initiative, and wants an adult date with alcohol. Sex isn't THE point, but it is not an overlooked aspect of normalcy.
    It might be 'cause Laurin was human, and at the time (based on forum trawls) there was this mild trend where new female characters were usually immediately suspected of being another's love interest, for whatever reason.

    Anyway, we were talking about why this could be relevant, well. Here's one for you: Sabine is still a part of this story. The IFCC want to promote conflict between Team Evil and the Order of the Stick. They want the world destroyed, so they definitely don't want Redcloak to change sides and heal the rifts. What exactly happens if Sabine and Redcloak cross paths, you think he'd give her the treatment Roy did, when Sabine couldn't offer Roy anything he didn't get elsewhere?
    Wouldn't Sabine shapeshift into someone Redcloak recognizes instead (such as a family member) to psychologically mess him up even more? But as for your question, Redcloak would probably just kill her. To him, the Plan is just too close to succeeding, and adding an extra character variable would complicate everything.

  10. - Top - End - #70
    Ettin in the Playground
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    Default Re: Why Redcloak is my favourite character.

    Quote Originally Posted by B. Dandelion View Post
    He was still at the "haven't asked out the girl next door" stage when SoD opened and he's been pretty much "married to the job" since then.
    Spoiler: SOD
    Show
    I don't think the statement by one of Redcloak's younger siblings that
    The girl
    who lives in the
    next hut. He has a
    crush on her.
    Is particularly strong evidence that Redcloak actually had a crush on that girl, or anyone else. It's extremely common for kids and adolescents to tease each other about alleged crushes that have no basis in fact. If Redcloak had given us some indication that he was romantically included towards that girl, then it would be another story, but just having a younger sibling tease him about it doesn't mean very much except that they are siblings who tease each other.

  11. - Top - End - #71
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    Default Re: Why Redcloak is my favourite character.

    Quote Originally Posted by 137ben View Post
    Spoiler: SOD
    Show
    I don't think the statement by one of Redcloak's younger siblings that

    Is particularly strong evidence that Redcloak actually had a crush on that girl, or anyone else. It's extremely common for kids and adolescents to tease each other about alleged crushes that have no basis in fact. If Redcloak had given us some indication that he was romantically included towards that girl, then it would be another story, but just having a younger sibling tease him about it doesn't mean very much except that they are siblings who tease each other.
    There's more than just the statement:

    Spoiler
    Show
    Redcloak's mum gets involved, and Redcloak's "I haven't even asked her out yet" seems like a hint that he wanted to, and that the "crush" isn't a complete fabrication.
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  12. - Top - End - #72
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    WolfInSheepsClothing

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    Default Re: Why Redcloak is my favourite character.

    Well I got a laugh from your post.

    imo it seems to be implied that sex/relationships are one more aspect of normal human(oid) connection that Redcloak misses out on due to his choices and what has happened to him? With
    Spoiler
    Show
    the girl in his village and Kayannara
    it seems heavily implied that he would rather have a relationship but canít due to his mission and his evil, petty, manipulative boss. Plus the way his interactions with those two were framed it seems unlikely that he ha had other relationships not shown, since both were suggested to be important information about the degree to which he is isolated and the way he reacts to other options. I mean it wouldnít make much sense to show the second scenario if he were routinely going on dates between work.

    I have wondered vaguely if jokes about this will come up at some point like they have for other characters. I guess with Redcloak it just seems more depressing since itís directly tied to him being isolated, lonely, and miserable in a general sense? Though the same applied to Miko. I also wondered if it was supposed to be a sensitive topic based on
    Spoiler
    Show
    his banter with Right-Eye, they both made fun of each other a lot and were snarky, but Right-Eye never made any comments like suggesting he had ranks in every knowledge skill but carnal or whatever

  13. - Top - End - #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by understatement View Post
    at the time (based on forum trawls) there was this mild trend where new female characters were usually immediately suspected of being another's love interest, for whatever reason.
    Quote Originally Posted by understatement View Post
    at the time
    Oh, my sweet summer child.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Peelee View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Fyraltari View Post
    the Vector Legion [is the IFCC's new pawns], mark my words. Way too much unfinished business there and they already know about the Gates.
    I'll take that bet.

  14. - Top - End - #74
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fyraltari View Post
    Oh, my sweet summer child.
    In my defense I completely forgot about the "would Belkar make a good boyfriend for Minrah or Julia" threads a while back.

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    WolfInSheepsClothing

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    Default Re: Why Redcloak is my favourite character.

    Clearly Redcloak will end up getting a girlfriend who is a goblin wizard specializing in conjuration. They will bond over a shared affinity for summoning element elementals, thus discovering that they have great chemistry.
    Last edited by CriticalFailure; 2020-09-04 at 12:43 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by B. Dandelion View Post
    So this thread seems like it might be a good place to ask some questions I have been holding in for a while.

    Firstly, if Redcloak is still physically a teenager, it follows that he would have the same hormone levels as a typical teenage guy, right? You wouldn't guess it from his behavior (mostly?) but it stands to reason.

    Second, has he had sex ever? It hasn't explicitly been said that he hasn't, but if he has it certainly hasn't been mentioned either, and his career hasn't really lent itself to a lot of opportunities. He was still at the "haven't asked out the girl next door" stage when SoD opened and he's been pretty much "married to the job" since then.

    Thirdly, is there a particular reason he needed his own bathroom? (I'm assuming it was his since there weren't likely many goblin clerics are among the hobgoblin army, much less goblin clerics who rate their own private bathroom.)
    Clearly, all this could have been avoided if Redcloak had been receiving Treasure Type O regularly.

  17. - Top - End - #77
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    Default Re: Why Redcloak is my favourite character.

    Well, we aren't over the forum assuming every new female character is going to be a love interest. But, in my completely un-rigorous estimate, there does seem to be less assumption that every new female character is Redcloak's niece.

  18. - Top - End - #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by 137ben View Post
    Well, we aren't over the forum assuming every new female character is going to be a love interest. But, in my completely un-rigorous estimate, there does seem to be less assumption that every new female character is Redcloak's niece.
    But is that a good thing? Red cloak's niece suggestion is fun, trying to make every female character be defined by a dude they'd sleep with is not fun.
    Arrrgh, here be me extended sig!
    Spoiler: Read this if I've posted a theory in the post above
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    Quote Originally Posted by Schroeswald View Post
    I recognize that Conservation of Detail is Overrated, but I find the event that I am using as evidence for my theory above important enough/given enough focus to qualify for what I call Elanís Exception, ďWho wastes perfectly good foreshadowing like that?Ē. Also I have never correctly predicted any event in any piece of media so take this theory with a grain of salt (I call this Peeleeís Ye Old Reminder).

  19. - Top - End - #79
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    Default Re: Why Redcloak is my favourite character.

    Quote Originally Posted by B. Dandelion View Post
    Anyway, we were talking about why this could be relevant, well. Here's one for you: Sabine is still a part of this story. The IFCC want to promote conflict between Team Evil and the Order of the Stick. They want the world destroyed, so they definitely don't want Redcloak to change sides and heal the rifts. What exactly happens if Sabine and Redcloak cross paths, you think he'd give her the treatment Roy did, when Sabine couldn't offer Roy anything he didn't get elsewhere?
    I think he does the same thing, but is probably more pissed off at her for rubbing in his face what he is missing in life. If he didnít fail his will save for a goblin woman who apparently made his jaw drop he wouldnít for a demon.

  20. - Top - End - #80
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    Default Re: Why Redcloak is my favourite character.

    Quote Originally Posted by B. Dandelion View Post
    The IFCC.... want the world destroyed
    Do they, though?
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  21. - Top - End - #81
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    Default Re: Why Redcloak is my favourite character.

    Quote Originally Posted by Peelee View Post
    Do they, though?
    They seemed pretty direct about it.
    ďEvil is evil. Lesser, greater, middling, it's all the same. Proportions are negotiated, boundaries blurred. I'm not a pious hermit, I haven't done only good in my life. But if I'm to choose between one evil and another, then I prefer not to choose at all.Ē

  22. - Top - End - #82
    Ettin in the Playground
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    Default Re: Why Redcloak is my favourite character.

    Quote Originally Posted by Schroeswald View Post
    But is that a good thing? Red cloak's niece suggestion is fun, trying to make every female character be defined by a dude they'd sleep with is not fun.
    Well, the Redcloak's Niece thing did get kind of old at the peak of its popularity, but I'll admit I greatly prefer it to trying to ship every female character into a romantic relationship.

  23. - Top - End - #83
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    GreataxeFighterGirl

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    Default Re: Why Redcloak is my favourite character.

    Quote Originally Posted by 137ben View Post
    Well, the Redcloak's Niece thing did get kind of old at the peak of its popularity, but I'll admit I greatly prefer it to trying to ship every female character into a romantic relationship.
    Out of curiosity, can I ask what were the prevailing theories on her character?

  24. - Top - End - #84
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    Default Re: Why Redcloak is my favourite character.

    Seeing Luna banned was the most crushing revelation she revealed so far.

  25. - Top - End - #85
    Bugbear in the Playground
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    Default Re: Why Redcloak is my favourite character.

    Quote Originally Posted by understatement View Post
    Oh, yeah. Right.
    This is gonna be my "never live it down" moment, huh.

    Quote Originally Posted by understatement View Post
    Wouldn't Sabine shapeshift into someone Redcloak recognizes instead (such as a family member) to psychologically mess him up even more? But as for your question, Redcloak would probably just kill her. To him, the Plan is just too close to succeeding, and adding an extra character variable would complicate everything.
    You'd have to explain how she'd know what any of Redcloak's decades-dead family looked like. Not to say it's impossible but it would require abilities or resources she hasn't demonstrated access to thus far.

    I don't think he'd kill her out of hand irrespective of what her motives were, or rather what he perceived her motives to be. I could buy it that he just wouldn't trust her under any circumstances, but if she's not trying to push him in a direction other than the one he's inclined toward anyway, it could lessen his suspicion.

    Mind, sending Sabine to Redcloak merely for the purposes of keeping him at a task he's kept himself to for decades seems a little weak when she could potentially show up anywhere. I HAD had the thought that it would be interesting for Sabine to cross paths with Redcloak for another reason entirely, namely that he's explicitly been called out as one of the few people in the world capable of casting True Resurrection. But the Giant is on record as hating that spell, wishing it wouldn't exist and preferring to treat it as unavailable, so I think that greatly lessens the odds of any "Sabine wants Redcloak to bring back Nale" kind of plot complication. (Alas.)

    Quote Originally Posted by hamishspence View Post
    There's more than just the statement:

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    Redcloak's mum gets involved, and Redcloak's "I haven't even asked her out yet" seems like a hint that he wanted to, and that the "crush" isn't a complete fabrication.
    He was also alarmed at the discussion going straight to the babymaking aspect, which has a well-known prerequisite. He didn't want to be rushed... and then a few minutes later he was made functionally immortal.

    Quote Originally Posted by CriticalFailure View Post
    Well I got a laugh from your post.
    Ah, sweet validation.

    Quote Originally Posted by CriticalFailure View Post
    imo it seems to be implied that sex/relationships are one more aspect of normal human(oid) connection that Redcloak misses out on due to his choices and what has happened to him? With
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    the girl in his village and Kayannara
    it seems heavily implied that he would rather have a relationship but canít due to his mission and his evil, petty, manipulative boss. Plus the way his interactions with those two were framed it seems unlikely that he ha had other relationships not shown, since both were suggested to be important information about the degree to which he is isolated and the way he reacts to other options. I mean it wouldnít make much sense to show the second scenario if he were routinely going on dates between work.

    I have wondered vaguely if jokes about this will come up at some point like they have for other characters. I guess with Redcloak it just seems more depressing since itís directly tied to him being isolated, lonely, and miserable in a general sense? Though the same applied to Miko. I also wondered if it was supposed to be a sensitive topic based on
    Spoiler
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    his banter with Right-Eye, they both made fun of each other a lot and were snarky, but Right-Eye never made any comments like suggesting he had ranks in every knowledge skill but carnal or whatever
    "Ranks in every knowledge skill but carnal" is pretty good.

    I think it is a sensitive topic for him. Seems like it'd be hard for it not to be. Especially since his younger brother went out and got a lot more experienced than him. (After getting some extremely explicit advice from Eugene Greenhilt about getting laid -- which was actually directed at both goblin brothers even if Redcloak never heard it.) He reacted with rather melodramatic offense to the notion of a "hunchbacked pity date".

    Miko's sexual humiliation did come off as kind of unnecessarily cruel, and while the comic still makes sex jokes on the regular I don't know that it'd re-create that one. It's possible for him to get involved in other jokes without explicitly making that one a punchline, and it's possible to address it in a different way.

    Quote Originally Posted by CriticalFailure View Post
    I think he does the same thing, but is probably more pissed off at her for rubbing in his face what he is missing in life. If he didnít fail his will save for a goblin woman who apparently made his jaw drop he wouldnít for a demon.
    He almost did fail his will save against a goblin woman who was explicitly meant to tempt him away from the Plan. Sabine's Charisma is higher than that of even a pretty goblin and I don't think she'd be trying to dissuade him from the Plan at all.

    Is he especially wary of demons or succubi? He is evil aligned himself and has summoned fiends against the Resistance. When Xykon and Right-Eye were making sexual comments about the succubus waitress at the evil diner, Redcloak objected to them on the grounds that it wasn't a "locker room" and they were talking about women as objects. If he thought the idea of having sex with a demon woman was dangerous or distasteful purely because of her demonic nature, it didn't come up.

    I don't know. I have no idea if Sabine and Redcloak will even get within 20 yards of each other, much less that she'd specifically try to seduce him -- she doesn't try to seduce EVERYBODY she meets and the targets she's chosen thus far have been said to be attractive. But him being automatically offended by any attempt is a bit of an assumption. It would depend on the context. She was kinda presumptuous in her attempts on Roy and Miko so if she were the same way with him then she'd probably go 0-for-3 as a running gag. If she manages a little more tact maybe the results won't be so violent.

    Quote Originally Posted by Keltest View Post
    That's what I was thinking of, yeah. If the gods destroying the world would be doing their job for them, then having Redcloak keep at a Plan that makes it more likely that the gods will destroy the world seems like it would also be in their interest. While him changing sides and helping to seal the rifts instead would be an outcome to avoid.

    Quote Originally Posted by Precure View Post
    Seeing Luna banned was the most crushing revelation she revealed so far.
    I never even got to talk to her! I was expecting her to come and chastise me for my EXTREMELY inappropriate remarks about her future boyfriend.

  26. - Top - End - #86
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    Quote Originally Posted by CriticalFailure View Post
    Clearly Redcloak will end up getting a girlfriend who is a goblin wizard specializing in conjugation. They will bond over a shared affinity for summoning element elementals, thus discovering that they have great chemistry.
    "Conjugation" as in verb tenses? Or "Conjugation" as in "conjugal visits"? Is speciallizing in that anything like going to college for an "MRS degree"?
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  27. - Top - End - #87
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    WolfInSheepsClothing

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    Default Re: Why Redcloak is my favourite character.

    Quote Originally Posted by B. Dandelion View Post

    Miko's sexual humiliation did come off as kind of unnecessarily cruel, and while the comic still makes sex jokes on the regular I don't know that it'd re-create that one. It's possible for him to get involved in other jokes without explicitly making that one a punchline, and it's possible to address it in a different way.
    Treasure type O was pretty funny but also very personal, I agree the comic seems to be a bit less likely to do that now. However, unnecessarily cruel humiliation basically summarizes Redcloakís work environment and life in general, so if anyone has it coming their way in the story itís probably him. Xykon ordering him not to regenerate the eye he could get back with a few minutes and a spell slot is basically constant unnecessarily cruel humiliation anyways, so petty jokes about not getting laid seem minor in comparison.

    Quote Originally Posted by B. Dandelion View Post

    He almost did fail his will save against a goblin woman who was explicitly meant to tempt him away from the Plan. Sabine's Charisma is higher than that of even a pretty goblin and I don't think she'd be trying to dissuade him from the Plan at all.
    Iím not sure exactly what context Sabine would be trying to do this in, but I got the impression that part of the reason that Redcloak was tempted by Kayannara was that she was also smart and shared his interests - she was someone he could connect with on a more personal level rather than just physically. Which given the lonely lifestyle he chose probably has a lot of emotional appeal on top of attractiveness. Whereas I donít think Sabine would really offer the potential for an emotional connection, and he would likely know she was there to manipulate him. So while her raw CHA is probably higher I think the will saves would be easier since it would be purely based on physical attraction rather than physical attraction + loneliness.

    Quote Originally Posted by B. Dandelion View Post

    Is he especially wary of demons or succubi? He is evil aligned himself and has summoned fiends against the Resistance. When Xykon and Right-Eye were making sexual comments about the succubus waitress at the evil diner, Redcloak objected to them on the grounds that it wasn't a "locker room" and they were talking about women as objects. If he thought the idea of having sex with a demon woman was dangerous or distasteful purely because of her demonic nature, it didn't come up.

    I think it is a sensitive topic for him. Seems like it'd be hard for it not to be. Especially since his younger brother went out and got a lot more experienced than him. (After getting some extremely explicit advice from Eugene Greenhilt about getting laid -- which was actually directed at both goblin brothers even if Redcloak never heard it.) He reacted with rather melodramatic offense to the notion of a "hunchbacked pity date".
    I donít think heís particularly wary of demons or succubi, in that he is willing to be around them and do business with them. Iím not sure he has any interest in getting to know them more personally or sees himself as having anything in common with them, though. Being evil and pragmatic he views them as good for business, but he probably doesnít have any illusions that fiends have mortalsí best interests at heart and is likely not particularly trusting towards them. His ďevil is not one big happy familyĒ attitude probably would come into play.

    I took the conversation in the diner with a Xykon and Right-Eye to indicate that he was generally less comfortable with sexual topics than either of them. I do think that it indicates itís something he isnít really comfortable with, and a bit of a sensitive topic. It also seems to suggest he perhaps isnít comfortable with the idea of casual purely physical relationships and would prefer to be with someone he is more familiar with and respects?

    I agree the dramatic reaction to the ďpity dateĒ also suggests it is a sensitive topic - it kind of seems like he is trying to convince his brother (and maybe himself) that heís happy just following the plan and doesnít want a relationship and isnít lonely. Like itís easier to ignore that entire topic and pretend it doesnít matter to him. I guess it just goes along with the rest of the general denial Redcloak lives in.

    Quote Originally Posted by B. Dandelion View Post
    "Ranks in every knowledge skill but carnal" is pretty good.
    Thanks :)

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Torath View Post
    "Conjugation" as in verb tenses? Or "Conjugation" as in "conjugal visits"? Is speciallizing in that anything like going to college for an "MRS degree"?
    oops, that was supposed to be conjuration.
    Last edited by CriticalFailure; 2020-09-03 at 10:06 AM.

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