Worst module you've ever seen?

[Lord Torath]

Also "Vampire Pawn", maybe they know they're minions?
Maybe they're actually seagoing crustaceans (similar to the crocodiles)

That would be "prawn", not "pawn".

[Batcathat]

I think this thread has made reading snarky reviews of bad modules my new favorite hobby.

This room contains six inexplicably-Vampiric crocodiles in a twelve foot deep pool, each of which gets a hilarious DC 9 Dominate attack and the ability to create Vampire Spawn but only out of other crocodiles.

Clearly this is for when the lich gets bored.

Why does this matter? Because she has Weapon Finesse (Snakes), which is probably intended to only mean her hair-snakes, but actually means she could beat you to death very effectively with a summoned snake if she had one, and if the GM was feeling silly enough.

Now I kinda want to make a character that specializes in snakes. Snake whip, snake club, throwing snakes... the possibilities are endless.

[LibraryOgre]

Now I kinda want to make a character that specializes in snakes. Snake whip, snake club, throwing snakes... the possibilities are endless.

In 2e, due to some mind-blowingly eccentric reading of the rules for Animal Friendship, a DM allowed a player to make the Squirrel Master, who had 16 squirrels per level for Animal Friends, which he used as a swarm attack.

[comicshorse]

In 2e, due to some mind-blowingly eccentric reading of the rules for Animal Friendship, a DM allowed a player to make the Squirrel Master, who had 16 squirrels per level for Animal Friends, which he used as a swarm attack.

Talk about an over powered build

https://marvel.fandom.com/wiki/Doreen_Green_(Earth-616)

[LibraryOgre]

Talk about an over powered build

https://marvel.fandom.com/wiki/Doreen_Green_(Earth-616)

This is before Doreen became a well-known character, but, yes.

[DrMartin]

I think we have yet to touch rock-bottom.

let me try:

Empty Threats, an adventure for Chtulhutech.

The GM is instructed to pick a victim among the PCs. The victim will be abducted, no matter what - the GM is encouraged to use every tool in their toolbox to make sure that this happens. The abducters don´t have stats but they would not really be relevant, as they are considered to have perfect knowledge of the victim´s habits and routine and can plan the perfect abduction.

The victim has been chosen, in universe, at random - so there is not even the chance that the characters would even have a hint to prepare for it.

I´m going to gloss over what happens to the victim after the abduction, and what the victim has to witness being done to the other people who have been abducted, but know that if is inhumane, gross, unnecessarily graphic, orrifying and degrading it is included.

Meanwhile the rest of the party will try to find their missing companion, right? the module says that whatever they try, it fails. The kidnappers have studied medicine and criminology for years, so you see, it´s impossible to find them. Not even an impossibly hard roll - they just cannot succeed, no matter how clever they are. Until they get ther lucky break, in the form of a mysterious phone call, that tells them where the victim has been taken.

They get there and can free the victim. The module says that the villains should make it back to their hideout when the party is there to free their companion, but otherwise leaves it up to the GM what happens - they are not given stats, and they are not a treat in a direct confrontation. There is some more handwavey description of what happens if the PC give chase if the villains flee, call the authorities, etc.

Paltry rewards are given, the end.

This is not an adventure, this is (at most) a backstory setting the mood for the setting. No chance to avoid abduction, no chance to solve the mistery before the lucky break, no meaningful confrontation at any stage.

[LibraryOgre]

I think we have yet to touch rock-bottom.

let me try:

Empty Threats, an adventure for Chtulhutech.

...that is an amazingly large sack of horse**** masquerading as an adventure.

[Xervous]

...that is an amazingly large sack of horse**** masquerading as an adventure.

To be fair it’s cthulutech.

[comicshorse]

As soon as I read Cthultech I was expecting this :

I´m going to gloss over what happens to the victim after the abduction, and what the victim has to witness being done to the other people who have been abducted, but know that if is inhumane, gross, unnecessarily graphic, orrifying and degrading it is included.

[King of Nowhere]

The kidnappers have studied medicine and criminology for years, so you see, it´s impossible to find them.

this is where it hits rock bottom for me. anyone who's ever studied anything for years will know limited that concept it.
i mean, those game designers have studied how to write a module for years, it's impossible for them to make a crappy one, isn't it?

by the way, if the players cannot do anything, what are they supposed to do with the module besides answering the mystery call?

[Batcathat]

by the way, if the players cannot do anything, what are they supposed to do with the module besides answering the mystery call?

Indeed. There's padding an adventure with meaningless busy work and then there's literally not being able to do anything meaningful at all (yet somehow it's even worse for the kidnapped character, who presumably can't even try to do anything but getting grossed out).

[DrMartin]

The module makes a concession that an extremely clever and resourceful victim could escape their cage - no further details on how this could come to pass though.

Just to give an idea of the level of resourcefulness this requires: the cage is too small for standing up or laying down, laced with barbed wire all around, made of steel, and locked with a 4 digit padlock that locks itself for 20 minutes if the wrong code is punched in 3 times in a row. The captors shock the victims with a stungun before taking them out of the cage. The victim is of course naked. More thought has been put into this setup than in the rest of the module.

if somehow the victim manages to get free, the GM should have that coincide with the group finding the hideout and helping the victim out.

The rest of the party, on the other hand, can try what they want, but any avenue of investigation will just fail. They don't know that, of course, so they are still supposed to try to rescue their friend.

As I said, rock bottom!

[Batcathat]

So the character who pretty much can't do anything in-character is technically allowed to accomplish something while the characters who have endless possibilities in-character aren't allowed to actually accomplish anything? Man, this is an impressive combination of screwing everyone over in and out of character.

[Quertus]

Actually, other than the fact that apparently the module writer doesn't understand basic concepts like "agency" or "understanding", my personal "rock bottom" here is that they think that an understanding of *medicine* will help them get away with an abduction.

Or maybe we're being too hard on them. Maybe this is a pure *role-playing* module, where the point of the setup isn't actually *engaging* the setup, it's role-playing what your characters *do* and *feel* in that setup.

Yeah, that's it.

[Unavenger]

my personal "rock bottom" here is that they think that an understanding of *medicine* will help them get away with an abduction.

Uhm?

Understanding human physiology and how to drug someone safely are absolutely gonna be important if you want to abduct someone without them waking up in the middle of the kidnapping attempt? Like, this module is... bad. But I don't see how medical knowledge helping you kidnap someone is a particularly smoothbrained moment.

[Saint-Just]

Uhm?

Understanding human physiology and how to drug someone safely are absolutely gonna be important if you want to abduct someone without them waking up in the middle of the kidnapping attempt? Like, this module is... bad. But I don't see how medical knowledge helping you kidnap someone is a particularly smoothbrained moment.

DrMartin's description seems to imply that the module states that knowledge of medicine is among the factors that will allow them to get away with kidnapping (or to be undetectable in general). Your example demonstrates that it is technically true, but I do not see people normally using "it allows X questionable activity to be undetectable" as equivalent to "it allows X questionably activity to happen".

But that's arguing semantics about the text I have not seen.

[Tanarii]

Or maybe we're being too hard on them. Maybe this is a pure *role-playing* module, where the point of the setup isn't actually *engaging* the setup, it's role-playing what your characters *do* and *feel* in that setup.

Sadly, there are far to many module writers and even renowned RPG designers that believe this kind of thing.

[Quertus]

Yeah, it being stated as the "logic" behind "why the PCs cannot possibly find the kidnappers" makes no sense.

They have Druid "traceless step"? They have a ShadowRun cleansing spell? They are Vecna-blooded? I can at least see *why* someone would (wrongly) believe that it would be *impossible* for anyone to find the missing PC.

But "I know karate, you can't find me"? Lol nope.

[Unavenger]

I still think that "A knowledge of medicine will help you get away with kidnapping, potentially avoiding leaving as much evidence as is needed to track you down" is the least weird thing out of all the weird things that have been brought up about the module, even if it's a little questionable how much it would help.

[Quertus]

Sadly, there are far to many module writers and even renowned RPG designers that believe this kind of thing.

Really? I was being facetious; I wasn't aware that there were beings who grokked role-playing, but not Agency, let alone that they might have any prominence.

As soon as I read Cthultech I was expecting this :

So, are there any (3rd party?) Cthultech modules which might be suitable for younger audiences?

I still think that "A knowledge of medicine will help you get away with kidnapping, potentially avoiding leaving as much evidence as is needed to track you down" is the least weird thing out of all the weird things that have been brought up about the module, even if it's a little questionable how much it would help.

I could buy "highly knowledgeable in *forensics* and *forensic medicine*" and "the target was knocked out by drugs" as a set of criteria that would greatly increase the difficulty of advancing certain avenues of evidence.

But that does nothing about the tracking device I have implanted in each pilot, or the security cameras, or the tire tracks, or witnesses, or…

So telling me that my mom (who is a nurse) went along, therefore the crime is unsolvable? Yeah, no.

[King of Nowhere]

So telling me that my mom (who is a nurse) went along, therefore the crime is unsolvable? Yeah, no.

Plot twist! your mother is the kidnapper!
and that's why you can't discover it: would you ever suspect your own mother?

[MoiMagnus]

This is not an adventure, this is (at most) a backstory setting the mood for the setting. No chance to avoid abduction, no chance to solve the mistery before the lucky break, no meaningful confrontation at any stage.

For me, it looks like

"I improvised a scenario for my gaming session, in which I abducted the cleverer PC that started to feel too invulnerable to my taste. I've constantly added new protections to his cage as he was trying to get out, because I wanted him to be saved by the others (he still eventually managed to get out in the end).

The others did not get a lot of good idea, and failed at their few good ideas, so I had to give them a mystery call to guide them to the solution at the end of the session.

Now, since I'm paid to write a module, I just need to write down this plot and ensure the PCs cannot deviate from it, otherwise I would need to ... gasp ... give stats to my NPCs."

[Eldan]

So, are there any (3rd party?) Cthultech modules which might be suitable for younger audiences?

I seeeeeriously doubt it. Cthulhutech, despite being an interesting idea in theory, is very open about taking inspiration for its tone from... certain anime.

[Quertus]

Now, since I'm paid to write a module, I just need to write down this plot and ensure the PCs cannot deviate from it, otherwise I would need to ... gasp ... give stats to my NPCs."

Because, if you give stats to your NPCs, then your PCs might want to *gasp* pull off a successful abduction of their own!

Giving these NPCs stats would be like giving the players actual target numbers, or rules! We can't have that.

I seeeeeriously doubt it. Cthulhutech, despite being an interesting idea in theory, is very open about taking inspiration for its tone from... certain anime.

Huh. OK, how about a "not *just* giant robots" game / system that might be kid-friendly? There's definite interest in giant robots (Battletech), and in magical things… does adding in "age-appropriate" return the empty set? I was going to research Cthulhu tech, but I guess that's a fall.

[The Glyphstone]

Mutants and Masterminds had a Mecha source book, and is as kid friendly as any d20 system can be. But thats more of a generic cop-out than a specialized system.

[Eldan]

Because, if you give stats to your NPCs, then your PCs might want to *gasp* pull off a successful abduction of their own!

Giving these NPCs stats would be like giving the players actual target numbers, or rules! We can't have that.



Huh. OK, how about a "not *just* giant robots" game / system that might be kid-friendly? There's definite interest in giant robots (Battletech), and in magical things… does adding in "age-appropriate" return the empty set? I was going to research Cthulhu tech, but I guess that's a fall.

Might have a look at Lancer, then. Haven't played it, but it does seem to be going a bit for that combination of Eldritch aliens and mechs, though quite action heavy.

Alternatively, Eclipse Phase technically has mechs too.

[DrMartin]

Some adventures of Chtulhutech aren´t horrible. Most of them are, though. And even if leaving out the gross side dressing of carnal violence, racism, mysoginy, body horror etc that is present in most of the writing, they are bad because most of them give you no real chance to do anything meaningful, in a 90´s metaplot kind of way, while some of them won´t let you to do anything *at all* like the one I summarized above.

I´m going from memory, but most of them are at the human (investigator) or super-human (tagers, which are like eldritch guyvers) level - can´t recall adventures with mechas. But maybe is just some defense mechanism in my braincells :)

It´s a shame the game´s mechanics are bleh and the writing is so gross, because the setting idea is great and the art is really good. The mecha design was also to my likings - too bad the mechanics were really bland. The stats of the mechas didn´t support what they were supposed to do in-universe, for one (as in mech X was developed as a counter to mech Y...except the rules didn´t agree with those statements, almost never, at all).

The mechas were given point costs too, to make it more like a skirmish game than an rpg - as if the system didn´t suffer already enough from a core concept too thinly diluted already.

I would second the suggestion to try Lancer - magic exists in the setting, even though the mechanics for it are left quite blank in a "you can fluff your character signature abilities as magic, if you like, sure" - unless that has changed lately, I haven´t checked the product line in quite a while. But magic aside the mecha design is great.

Dragonmech is a setting for dnd 3.5 where the dwarves build giant robots (one is as big as a city) to defend against creepy moon dragons. hell yeah.

Adeptus Evangelion takes the system of dark heresy and tries to give you teenage existential drama with giant robots.

The mecha genre really forces you to ask what aspects you wanna focus on though: the pilots and their relationships, the mecha and the balttes? It´s hard to find something that does both.

[DataNinja]

I would second the suggestion to try Lancer - magic exists in the setting, even though the mechanics for it are left quite blank in a "you can fluff your character signature abilities as magic, if you like, sure" - unless that has changed lately, I haven´t checked the product line in quite a while. But magic aside the mecha design is great.

The magic (which is mostly just parallel-dimension math demons) is not an integral part of any adventure, and so can pretty much be ignored as background noise if you want. So, don't need to worry about that, if you just want mechs smashing at people in even the default setting. It's a tight series of rules, and is a lot of fun to play. Even if you refluff it. (I have a friend who ran Lancer refluffed as magical girls, and it went amazingly well, apparently.)

[Eldan]

And it's by the guy who made Kill Six Billion Demons, so the art is excellent too. (If you like the style.)
[IMG]https://miro.medium.com/max/700/1*lj03JTbhWV9RAJf5EmPlmw.jpeg[/IMG]

[Quertus]

So, it looks like Ed Greenwood produced *at least* two more published modules: The Endless Stair, and Haunted Halls of Eveningstar.

Has anyone ever played / read either, to know if they're as bad as Halls of the High King?