Pokémon Thread XXX: Hot Skitty on Wailord Action!

[Bartmanhomer]

You know, I never realized just how well this theme-team synergizes. I don't think I ever made a team with that good a distribution of weaknesses and resistances on purpose. That's the power of a water/grass/fire core I guess.



They even have a good diversity in roles between them, and it even works relatively well trying to base their moves/items/roles on their character traits.

Spoiler: One option for specifics

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Leonardo (Wartortle) @ Shell Bell
Ability: Torrent
EVs: 128 Atk / 128 SpA / 252 Spe
- Surf
- Aqua Jet
- Ice Punch
- Brick Break

Donatello (Grotle) @ Zoom Lens
Ability: Shell Armor
EVs: 252 HP / 128 Atk / 128 Def
- Leech Seed
- Body Slam
- Iron Tail
- Synthesis

Raphael (Torkoal) @ Life Orb
Ability: White Smoke
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 SpA
- Overheat
- Superpower
- Double-Edge
- Explosion

Michaelangelo (Shuckle) @ Leftovers
Ability: Contrary
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 SpD
- Knock Off
- Encore
- Infestation
- Toxic

Splinter (Raticate) @ Expert Belt
Ability: Guts
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
- Sucker Punch
- Facade
- Rock Smash
- U-turn

(In gen8 Wartortle can have Shell Smash, which is too perfect, but some of the other mon haven't been released for gen8 (yet?).)

(Raticate Splinter probably also kind of works as a supportive HM user for the group.)

I may have to do a run as April O'Neil now.

Spoiler: Choosing Shuckle over Tirtouga/Carracosta

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Okay, so Shuckle is not really a turtle. But it looks like one. Tirtouga/Carracosta do not have a middle stage, making whichever one you pick look the least like a teenager. They also have a type overlap with both Wartortle and Shuckle, losing us some of that sweet synergy. Tirtouga would also be easily the weakest Pokémon on the team. Carracosta would in terms of total base stats still be a little weaker then Shuckle, but Shuckle is such an overspecialized creature that in practice it fits the power level of the team better than Carracosta does. Shuckle also kind of works for Mikey's personality as a mon that just keeps hopping around its opponent without going down while annoying it. Plus it gets not one but two fitting abilities in Contrary and Gluttony. Color scheme wise you could argue for replacing Grotle with Tirtouga/Carracosta as Donatello, but that just gives you double type overlap. If only Grotle got Wood Hammer, then I'd have a definitive argument for making it the definitive best Donatello.

Oh cool! That's awesome! Heroes in the half-shell, turtle power!

[boj0]

This was back in 5th gen, if I remember; I was running Blastoise (Donny), Torkoal (Raph), Torterra (Mikey), Carracosta (Leo), Raticate (Splinter), and Bisharp (Shredder). Blastoise was a bulky rapid spinner with counter/mirror coat, Torkoal was specs, Torterra was rock polish physical attacker, and Carracosta was a shell smash sweeper. Raticate was flame orb guts, and Bisharp was a basic SD + Dark spam.
The team was okay at getting some wins in low to mid OU, despite being a UU team. Nothing crazy, but it was fun and people got a chuckle out of playing it.

[Rater202]

Ice Type is very good for offense, dealing double damage to four types, but not so good at defense--it takes double damage from four rather common types.

Despite this, most pure or primary ice types favor defense over offense in stat distribution.

[Bartmanhomer]

You know what, I'm thinking of writing my own Pokemon Fan Fiction Story only with Generation 1 from the Let's Go Pikachu/Eevee Game. I thought about the character's main origin story that the story will start in Viridian City instead of Pallet Town and his Pokemon team is Ground/Flying Type. What do you think?

[Spore]

Despite this, most pure or primary ice types favor defense over offense in stat distribution.

It really is a shame though isn't it? Anyone who tries to remove ice, (proper ice, not slush or a bit of rough snow) can attest to it being incredibly hard to the touch. Ice should be a GREAT defensive type, and at least resist fighting. Ever punched an ice cube before? Yea, that is not going well. And while you are at it, it might resist dragon and fairy too.

[Lord Raziere]

It really is a shame though isn't it? Anyone who tries to remove ice, (proper ice, not slush or a bit of rough snow) can attest to it being incredibly hard to the touch. Ice should be a GREAT defensive type, and at least resist fighting. Ever punched an ice cube before? Yea, that is not going well. And while you are at it, it might resist dragon and fairy too.

I remember like just a few days ago when I had to shovel off snow out of my drive way. I was recovering from two or three hours of work for two days and I felt aches and pains all over my body. snow is heavy. and thats not even real ice as you say.

[Rater202]

I remember like just a few days ago when I had to shovel off snow out of my drive way. I was recovering from two or three hours of work for two days and I felt aches and pains all over my body. snow is heavy. and thats not even real ice as you say.

Yeah.

In a vacuum, Ice makes sense as a defensive typing.

But in practice the way it matches up to other types it's not so good for what is clearly its intended purpose.

Like, people say that Grass is the worst type for tanks and that's why chikorita isn't a good starter but most of grass weaknesses aren't exactly common. Anyone whose watch TFS's Nuzlockes knows that that evolutionary line is a great tank.

[danzibr]

You know what, I'm thinking of writing my own Pokemon Fan Fiction Story only with Generation 1 from the Let's Go Pikachu/Eevee Game. I thought about the character's main origin story that the story will start in Viridian City instead of Pallet Town and his Pokemon team is Ground/Flying Type. What do you think?

Yeah man, go for it!

[Saambell]

So sometime tomorrow or the day after the Pokemon Company is doing a big stream or something with some kind of big news. Given a few hints their build up tweets and reminders have contained, the current fear/hope is Gen 4 remakes. But not just any Gen 4 remakes, remakes in the style of Lets Go. Which personally is something I am really hoping for. A few friends of mine who have gotten tired of the normal Pokemon mechanics say Lets Go were the best Pokemon games they have played in years. Also it would be a great way to annoy those super competitive power gamers who think the last two Lets Go were bad cause they couldn't do their usual meta game nonsense with them.

So here's hoping the news brings some people joy, for what ever reason it may be.

[Emmerlaus]

You know what, I'm thinking of writing my own Pokemon Fan Fiction Story only with Generation 1 from the Let's Go Pikachu/Eevee Game. I thought about the character's main origin story that the story will start in Viridian City instead of Pallet Town and his Pokemon team is Ground/Flying Type. What do you think?

Sure! But do it for yourself, not your readers! I did this mistake once. Now I write only for my own pleasure and not for other approuval... even if the approuval IS nice lol!

[Rater202]

So sometime tomorrow or the day after the Pokemon Company is doing a big stream or something with some kind of big news. Given a few hints their build up tweets and reminders have contained, the current fear/hope is Gen 4 remakes. But not just any Gen 4 remakes, remakes in the style of Lets Go. Which personally is something I am really hoping for. A few friends of mine who have gotten tired of the normal Pokemon mechanics say Lets Go were the best Pokemon games they have played in years. Also it would be a great way to annoy those super competitive power gamers who think the last two Lets Go were bad cause they couldn't do their usual meta game nonsense with them.

So here's hoping the news brings some people joy, for what ever reason it may be.

Could be interesting.

[Bartmanhomer]

Yeah man, go for it!

Thank you.

Sure! But do it for yourself, not your readers! I did this mistake once. Now I write only for my own pleasure and not for other approuval... even if the approuval IS nice lol!

Good advice. Thank you.

[Rater202]

The idea of a pokemon region based on Texas popped into my head.

It would have a regional variant of Tauros, fire/steel with a rather intimidating almost demonic visage and horns like those of texas longhorn cattle.

The fire/steal typing and demonic visage would be an allusion to the song Ghost Riders in The Sky: "Their brands were still on fire and their hooves were made of steel, their horns were black and shiny and their hot breath he could feel."

[boj0]

Well to the surprise of no one, we are getting Diamond and Pearl remakes. Gen 4 looks like a chibi version of the DS games, personally I would have preferred them doing something like the Link's Awakening remake, where they made it especially stylized and more details added. So it currently looks just as bare, but shinier.

Legends Arceus is looking like the open world Pokemon heartbreaker people have been clamoring for; at the very least being able to actually just throw a ball without needing to battle will be refreshing. Cyndaquil coming back as a starter is what's going to get me on board. Honestly, I'm far more interested in the side game than the remakes.

[Bartmanhomer]

The idea of a pokemon region based on Texas popped into my head.

It would have a regional variant of Tauros, fire/steel with a rather intimidating almost demonic visage and horns like those of texas longhorn cattle.

The fire/steal typing and demonic visage would be an allusion to the song Ghost Riders in The Sky: "Their brands were still on fire and their hooves were made of steel, their horns were black and shiny and their hot breath he could feel."

I love that idea of Tauros.

Anyway, I got a question to ask everyone. Have Pokemon ever changed your life in a minor or major way?

[Rater202]

I learned not to trust people blindly when my cousin stole my pokemon cards and his mother and my parents just let him leave with them when I said they were mine.

He insisted they were his but he pulled them out of our cabinet and almost every card in my album was gone.

I'm not angry at him anymore(though he still insists they were his cards) but I can't help but be angry in general thinking about it... I had a Rocket's Moltres for fricks sake! but...

Nobody but me seems to think it's a big deal but god damn.

[Bartmanhomer]

I learned not to trust people blindly when my cousin stole my pokemon cards and his mother and my parents just let him leave with them when I said they were mine.

He insisted they were his but he pulled them out of our cabinet and almost every card in my album was gone.

I'm not angry at him anymore(though he still insists they were his cards) but I can't help but be angry in general thinking about it... I had a Rocket's Moltres for fricks sake! but...

Nobody but me seems to think it's a big deal but god damn.

Well, I remember a friend of mine back in my childhood school when Generation 1 Pokemon cards were popular back then. His Charizard card was stolen but he got it back. They banned Pokemon cards at my school after that.

[Emmerlaus]

I got a question to ask everyone. Have Pokemon ever changed your life in a minor or major way?

It made me learn English early. I was literally recording the episodes because I wasnt home when they went into air. When I was watching them, I would have a dictionnary by my side so I would be able to pause, look up the word and continue once I get it.

It also was the game I threw myself into (Pokemon Blue I think or maybe Silver) when my parents divorced. So it helped me get over this event.

I also felt like an hipster where I live as went they were translated and started to get popular, I could say I was into it way before them as I discovered the Pokemon serie at the same time as the American lol

EDIT: As for thievery goes, I never played Pokemon TCG but my brother was stealing my MTG cards and a guy at school was ripping me off for cards sell so I just stopped caring and sold my cards. But yeah, never trusted my brother after that or totally forgave him... in fact, I put in my will that my brother will get no money from me but instead get my collection of MTG cards. And before you judge me, Its not like he has money problem, he makes WAY more then me. But it's a nice jab at him while giving him something of value that my soulmate doesn't want lol

Thievery is so common when it comes to TCG and I know your pain. I was stolen once in my own locker as well in high-school. I think that cimented my decision to "never buy mtg cards again"... well until I discovered the C0mmander format decennies later lol

[Bartmanhomer]

It made me learn English early. I was literally recording the episodes because I wasnt home when they went into air. When I was watching them, I would have a dictionnary by my side so I would be able to pause, look up the word and continue once I get it.

It also was the game I threw myself into (Pokemon Blue I think or maybe Silver) when my parents divorced. So it helped me get over this event.

I also felt like an hipster where I live as went they were translated and started to get popular, I could say I was into it way before them as I discovered the Pokemon serie at the same time as the American lol

EDIT: As for thievery goes, I never played Pokemon TCG but my brother was stealing my MTG cards and a guy at school was ripping me off for cards sell so I just stopped caring and sold my cards. But yeah, never trusted my brother after that or totally forgave him... in fact, I put in my will that my brother will get no money from me but instead get my collection of MTG cards. And before you judge me, Its not like he has money problem, he makes WAY more then me. But it's a nice jab at him while giving him something of value that my soulmate doesn't want lol

Thievery is so common when it comes to TCG and I know your pain. I was stolen once in my own locker as well in high-school. I think that cimented my decision to "never buy mtg cards again"... well until I discovered the C0mmander format decennies later lol

That's very cool that you learn English by watching old Pokemon episode.

Anyway I need your opinion and feedback if this a good Ground/Flying Pokemon team:

Kanto Sandslash
Mega Charizard Y
Nidoqueen
Butterfree
Nidoking
Mega Pidgeot

[Fable Wright]

That's very cool that you learn English by watching old Pokemon episode.

Anyway I need your opinion and feedback if this a good Ground/Flying Pokemon team:

Kanto Sandslash
Mega Charizard Y
Nidoqueen
Butterfree
Nidoking
Mega Pidgeot

For singles or doubles?

If it's for singles: It's awful. You've got no ice-type switch-ins, you've got two pokemon taking 4x damage for stealth rocks, no Sand Stream user to set up for only rapid spinner to spin without getting KO'd, and doubling up on Poison/Ground is just really bad. And why are you using PU tier pokemon (butterfree) on a team with an OU powerhouse? There's also the nonbo of Mega Charizard Y's drought decreasing Hurricane's accuracy.

Oh, and of course, the fact that you've got two megas on the same team when both of those pokemon are really bad when not Mega'd. So there is that.

[Bartmanhomer]

For singles or doubles?

If it's for singles: It's awful. You've got no ice-type switch-ins, you've got two pokemon taking 4x damage for stealth rocks, no Sand Stream user to set up for only rapid spinner to spin without getting KO'd, and doubling up on Poison/Ground is just really bad. And why are you using PU tier pokemon (butterfree) on a team with an OU powerhouse? There's also the nonbo of Mega Charizard Y's drought decreasing Hurricane's accuracy.

Oh, and of course, the fact that you've got two megas on the same team when both of those pokemon are really bad when not Mega'd. So there is that.

Oh, man! Thank you for your critique of my Ground/Flying Team.

[Lvl 2 Expert]

For singles or doubles?

For his Let's Go based fanfiction.

You know what, I'm thinking of writing my own Pokemon Fan Fiction Story only with Generation 1 from the Let's Go Pikachu/Eevee Game. I thought about the character's main origin story that the story will start in Viridian City instead of Pallet Town and his Pokemon team is Ground/Flying Type. What do you think?

Anyway I need your opinion and feedback if this a good Ground/Flying Pokemon team:

Kanto Sandslash
Mega Charizard Y
Nidoqueen
Butterfree
Nidoking
Mega Pidgeot

Honestly I think it's pretty good for what you had to work with. It's just, you know, Kanto only, you don't have a lot to work with.

Let's start with the obvious: both Ground and Flying types are weak to Ice. It's not a common Pokémon type for opponents to carry, but it's a great type for coverage moves. Smart opponents will often have some Ice move user on their team. (Also there's Lorelei in the Elite 4, if that's going to be in the story.) To have a Pokémon that's not weak to Ice you need to have a double type with Ice itself, Water, Steel or Fire. Of these two Steel and Water would be by far the most preferable. Steelix or Mantine or Quagsire could improve the team's type coverage a lot. Piloswine/Mamoswine would have a bunch of weaknesses, because Ice types are defensively bad in general, but at least it's not really doubling up on things your team is already weak to. Charizard is the best pick Kanto has to offer, and it's a good choice for your mega, seeing that if it fails to stop that ice beam user your team is dead. But compared to choices available outside of Kanto it's super bad. It even adds another Water weakness to the team.

Another big one is Ground/Rock types. Not the worst in general, but borderline unusable on a Ground typed team, and in this case a half Ground typed team. You just can't use double Grass and Water weaknesses if half your team is weak to Water and Grass already. Kanto is full of them. You found this problem, and used none of them, but to do that you had to resort to using both Nidoking and Nidoqueen, which offer very much the same things, it might almost as well be a duplicate Pokémon. It's just not elegant.

And these type problems stemming from only using a single generation worth of Pokémon mean you're also struggling on team roles and stat distributions. Yeah, you have some more speedy sweepers and some more bulky tanks, but an annoying wall would be quite nice to have too. I guess Nidoking, Nidoqueen and Pidgeot are decent scouts, as in good Pokémon to throw out first to meet whatever the enemy brings, but more setup options definitely wouldn't hurt either. And I can't really suggest improvements because you're limited by the format.

If I were you I might just cheat and write about a version of Let's Go Kanto where people use a few mon from outside the region every now and then. Just a single Johto Pokémon and maybe an alternate form (Alolan Dugtrio?) or a later evolution of one of the Kanto mon or something could help a lot.

[Fable Wright]

For his Let's Go based fanfiction.

Oh. In that case...

Mega Charizard Y is definitely the core of the team, and the sweeper that you want to protect.

Adding in Gyarados as your second flier adds a physical wall to the team, even if it doesn't combo well with drought, and it's a second pokemon that can take an ice beam. It can help act as a physical wall with Intimidate, and can set up threateningly with Dragon Dance. Could be a bulky pivot that can set up if given a chance?

Both of them have a stealth rocks weakness, so... yeah, Sandslash is necessary here for the 'spin, even if it's not good at the job. It just needs to get there.

Nidoking is useful as a good offensive wallbreaker with Stealth Rocks support, that gets Ice Beam. It's really good to have around.

Crowbat can be surprisingly bulky, even if they weren't in the original Kanto, and its Taunt/Roost/Brave Bird combo and super good resistances/immunities means that it's going to have some chances to really shine.

Finally, Dragonite is... well, definitely the best left in Kanto, but Aerodactyl isn't bad. Dragonite has a key water resist when Aerodactyl has a key water weakness, it can set up, it can hit like a truck, it's practically cheating. Aerodactyl suffers from role overlap with Crobat, but could be your other Stealth Rock user, and is great at checking other Flying pokemon in general. You could start out with Butterfree in this slot, and move to an Aerodactyl/Dragonite when you reach the endgame, perhaps?

[Lvl 2 Expert]

Adding in Gyarados

Gyarados! Gyarados is good old gen 1! How did I not think of that while actually name dropping Mantine. Totally yes, Gyarados makes this team so much better.

Gyarados makes anything better, really. Especially stories. Big scary sea monster dragon looking raging mystery from the depths giant serpent beast.

[Emmerlaus]

Gyarados! Gyarados is good old gen 1! How did I not think of that while actually name dropping Mantine. Totally yes, Gyarados makes this team so much better.

Gyarados makes anything better, really. Especially stories. Big scary sea monster dragon looking raging mystery from the depths giant serpent beast.

I know Im the oddball on this but Mantine make me think of Depth Charge from Beast-Wars and to Crocodile Dundee death from a manta ray stinger. Since Mata rays are not to be overlooked, I feel the same for Mantine. I know its a weird way of thinking but what can I say, I explained my way of thinking th best I could. Oh and Mantine pre-evo is one of the cutest Pokemon lol

ALSO... I have more interest in a fanfic that goes the extra lenght to give limelight to Pokemon that aren't in the strong Meta or popular like Guyrados.

[Bartmanhomer]

For his Let's Go based fanfiction.





Honestly I think it's pretty good for what you had to work with. It's just, you know, Kanto only, you don't have a lot to work with.

Let's start with the obvious: both Ground and Flying types are weak to Ice. It's not a common Pokémon type for opponents to carry, but it's a great type for coverage moves. Smart opponents will often have some Ice move user on their team. (Also there's Lorelei in the Elite 4, if that's going to be in the story.) To have a Pokémon that's not weak to Ice you need to have a double type with Ice itself, Water, Steel or Fire. Of these two Steel and Water would be by far the most preferable. Steelix or Mantine or Quagsire could improve the team's type coverage a lot. Piloswine/Mamoswine would have a bunch of weaknesses, because Ice types are defensively bad in general, but at least it's not really doubling up on things your team is already weak to. Charizard is the best pick Kanto has to offer, and it's a good choice for your mega, seeing that if it fails to stop that ice beam user your team is dead. But compared to choices available outside of Kanto it's super bad. It even adds another Water weakness to the team.

Another big one is Ground/Rock types. Not the worst in general, but borderline unusable on a Ground typed team, and in this case a half Ground typed team. You just can't use double Grass and Water weaknesses if half your team is weak to Water and Grass already. Kanto is full of them. You found this problem, and used none of them, but to do that you had to resort to using both Nidoking and Nidoqueen, which offer very much the same things, it might almost as well be a duplicate Pokémon. It's just not elegant.

And these type problems stemming from only using a single generation worth of Pokémon mean you're also struggling on team roles and stat distributions. Yeah, you have some more speedy sweepers and some more bulky tanks, but an annoying wall would be quite nice to have too. I guess Nidoking, Nidoqueen and Pidgeot are decent scouts, as in good Pokémon to throw out first to meet whatever the enemy brings, but more setup options definitely wouldn't hurt either. And I can't really suggest improvements because you're limited by the format.

If I were you I might just cheat and write about a version of Let's Go Kanto where people use a few mon from outside the region every now and then. Just a single Johto Pokémon and maybe an alternate form (Alolan Dugtrio?) or a later evolution of one of the Kanto mon or something could help a lot.

You're right. I guess I can use a Pokemon outside of the region. 😃

[Lvl 2 Expert]

Fable Wright, what would you think about Scyther in the "I wanted a Bug type for more options vs Grass" slot? Maybe like a Swords Dance set, the protagonist could get an Eviolite at some point (if this fanfiction uses held items) to give it a bit more bulk on the setup turn for some battles.

Because I feel like the flying half of the team actually looks pretty good with Charizard (Y), Gyarados and Scyther.

The ground half would be a little tougher, but with the minimal amount of cheating the protagonist could evolve an Onix to get Sandslash, Nidoking and Steelix.

The team still has four Water weaknesses (Emolga (or Zapdos) is a lot of fun on Ground/Flying teams as well, especially in doubles), but it doesn't feel too bad aside from that...


Of course, @Bartmanhomer, as Emmerlaus pointed out, we're just theorycrafting a good team given the restrictions. We cannot account for your main character's personality or the things that just happen on their journey. The original team you proposed is a good team to write a story about, as is any other variation. I'm mostly thinking about this from the angle of "if I were trying to do this as a challenge run, what could I do to make things easier/beat the game at a lower level."

And yes, my answer was "cheat". I'm disappointed in me.

[Fable Wright]

Fable Wright, what would you think about Scyther in the "I wanted a Bug type for more options vs Grass" slot? Maybe like a Swords Dance set, the protagonist could get an Eviolite at some point (if this fanfiction uses held items) to give it a bit more bulk on the setup turn for some battles.

I feel like grass is already a really good matchup at the moment. Only Gyarados and Sandslash have a weakness to grass, while Crobat and Charizard have a 4x resist, and Nidoking hits it for super effective poison damage.

The main issue with Scyther, and the only reason I didn't include it, is that 4x weakness to rock.

I ran with a USUM Mono-Bug team and loved it to pieces in competitive.

You do not know pain until you send out Volcarona or Mega-Pinsir and they immediately lose half their health. You already have one 'mon like that in Charizard, and the other flying 'mons have issues switching into rocks already. (Also, Stone Edge is a super common coverage move and it's just bad feels when you run into it.)

This slot is basically Crobat vs Scyther, and I think Crobat does a lot more stuff that the team could really need. Fast Taunts, Defogs to remove rocks, and it can Roost to remove Stealth Rock chip. Can also pivot quite well with U-Turn to scout and slip in your best sweeper, though that's either in the Brave Bird or Taunt slot which limits utility.

The ground half would be a little tougher, but with the minimal amount of cheating the protagonist could evolve an Onix to get Sandslash, Nidoking and Steelix.

The team still has four Water weaknesses (Emolga (or Zapdos) is a lot of fun on Ground/Flying teams as well, especially in doubles), but it doesn't feel too bad aside from that...

So the water weakness is partially mitigated by Charizard's Drought, but anyone setting Rain Dance is... going to give you a bad time. A really bad time.

Also, if you didn't want to cheat, I feel like you could still do well by using Dugtrio in the Steelix slot. It is, to be clear, not that bulky, and doesn't add any new resistances. By all rights, it should be bad.

But. Arena trap. Memento. Final Gambit. Reversal/Focus Sash. Dugtrio's going down to most anything, so who cares what type it is? It's basically a typeless utility move user, which the team could really use.

[Bartmanhomer]

Well, my main protagonist will start with only a Sandshrew that he got from his family and will start from Pallet Town which he was moved from Viridian City, and start his adventure from there.

[DataNinja]

Are you asking me about it?

It's a spambot that copies stuff earlier in the thread to repost to try and slip past the spambot detection.