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  1. - Top - End - #241
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    Default Re: The Mandalorian Season 2

    Quote Originally Posted by Peelee View Post
    The sequel trilogy had a plan?
    Spoiler: J.J. Abrams leaked secret original plan for the sequel trilogy
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    Step 1: remake Star Wars with a bigger Death Star.
    Step 2: ???
    Step 3: Profit.

    Quote Originally Posted by Wraith View Post
    In A New Hope, the Stromtroopers start out as being nigh-superhuman as they invade Leia's ship and slaughter an unknown number of rebels in minutes,
    While Ibam generally on the side that the stormtroopers' poor reputation is undeserved, I fell thisbis swinging the pendulum the other way too far. In this scene the 'troopers get stuck at the door for a long while unable to shoot their opponents down even though most of them have no cover whatsoever and R2 and 3PO can just waltz through the fireline just fine. When they do get through they've had some losses and they suffer another one when they capture Leia. This scene shows them as competent soldiers not nigh-unstoppable killing machines.

    Quote Originally Posted by Peelee View Post
    I actually disagree that Rey was all that powerful in a sense; she clearly progresses far faster than anyone else we've seen on film, TV, or books in the canon, yes, but this isn't so much "Rey is super powerful" as it is "Abrams has no grasp on how to handle power creep and Johnson just went along with it". Poe is objectively the single greatest starpilot in the galaxy; in TFA, he shoots down 8 TIEs in 10 seconds - the number may be a bit off, since I don't remember the exact count, but it's close enough for the point: it's an insane level of skill not seen anywhere else in the SW universe, because Abrams believes the only way to showcase someone being a good and effective pilot is for them to be ridiculously over-the-top. Poe flies better than Jedi do. TLJ worsens this, as he's able to single-handedly take on a dreadnaught, which is seemingly made of papier-mâché, and still managed to destroy TIE fighters despite an entire enemy squadron flying against him alone while he has non-functional weapons.

    This is, quite simply, a ****ing insane level of skill. And the rest of the characters aren't far off. Han has literally faster-than-lightspeed reflexes. Holdo can absolutely nail a one-in-a-million shot where both her allies and her enemies are completely, 100% sure it will work. Palpatine can fry a hundred-thousand Star Destroyers (actually probably a million or more) at the same time.

    Rey is absurdly powerful by the standards of the rest of the Star Wars universe, but by the standards of the sequel trilogy? Rey is a pretty average Jedi. Everyone's powers, skills, and abilities in that series was jacked up to a frankly stupidly high level to the point that if Rey weren't as powerful as she was, she would be worse than the non-Force users. So no, I don't think she needs the "Force Nobility" line when nobody else needs to be descended from god-tier pilot parents or hyperspace-fast-hands grandparents.
    Hm, that's an interesting take. I hadn't considered it that way before. (It was ten TIEs and three stormtroopers, by the way. Twice the number of hostiles a pilot needs to shoot down in an entire engagement to earn the title of "ace".)

    For most of these I'll agree with, but TLJ did have non-sensical/nonexistant characterization (the lack of any chemistry or romance forshadowing with Rose and Finn until she kisses him), it does have logically inconsistent plot devices (Rose and Finn crashing in No Man's Land far from the base while actively under heavy enemy fire, yet somehow returning to the base without dying was super easy, barely an inconvenience, the aforementioned capability of ships to leave the chase and then return (especially the capability to do this while returning within incredibly close range of the opposing fleet)), and Deejay was (arguably) the very definition of inorganic (and inarguably a plot device rather than a character). Regardless of whether people like or dislike the movie, there are definite issues with the structure, though I do completely agree that it is wrong to call it objectively bad.
    I am not saying the narrative structure is flawless. I am saying that 1) it isn't the utter nonsense some claims, and, in my opinion, it's good enough to work and 2) narrative structure is just one criterion on which to judge a work of fiction not the be-all-and-all that the Internet collectively seems to believe it is and that flaws in the narrative refer to things bigger and more important than the cinemasins-like nitpicks that are all too frequent these days.

    I would normally agree with you but in this case it's not a question of spatial physics so much as it is a question of continuity. We never see any lasers curve in any other Star Wars movies or shows. We even see other First Order Star Destroyers in the other movies, which do not have curving lasers. Having them curve in one and only one movie breaks from how they are established to work in every other Star Wars media.
    *Shrug* maybe it's new weapons, maybe that's what happens when you shoot at something that's barely out of range. I really don't see why it would matter.

    A very brief instance of interest which has no staying power. Something which disappoints by failing to deliver anything of value, despite a showy beginning. A sudden spasmodic effort that accomplishes nothing. One that appears promising but turns out to be disappointing or worthless.

    Multiple dictionary definitions that don't really nail how I mean it (because I somehow can't quite put it that well myself at the moment) but point in the general direction.
    Okay, I think I got it. Thanks.


    Quote Originally Posted by HolyDraconus View Post
    There's plenty of Star Wars stories where the main character is a nobody that becomes strong in the Force. Rey being a nobody or of "nobility" SHOULDN'T have even been a thing, but it BECAME one because of how absurdly powerful that Rey was.
    No, it became one because Rey spends the whole of TFA longing for her family and when the main character focuses on something for the whole movie, the fans want to find an answer and because SW has had an issue with always tying everything back to the original trilogy including by having protagonsists be related to the heroes of that trilogy.
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  2. - Top - End - #242
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    Default Re: The Mandalorian Season 2

    Quote Originally Posted by Fyraltari View Post
    While I am generally on the side that the stormtroopers' poor reputation is undeserved, I fell this is swinging the pendulum the other way too far. In this scene the 'troopers get stuck at the door for a long while unable to shoot their opponents down even though most of them have no cover whatsoever and R2 and 3PO can just waltz through the fireline just fine. When they do get through they've had some losses and they suffer another one when they capture Leia. This scene shows them as competent soldiers not nigh-unstoppable killing machines.
    That's fair, I admit I probably exaggerated for narrative/comedic effect. I think you get my point though - in The Mandalorian there is a clear escalation in the quality of troopers, and it's subtly explained by their situation from rag-tag Outer Rim dregs with The Client, to drilled veterans under Gideon, to Death Troopers later.

    There are "bad storm troopers" and they get sent off to guard dirt-farms on the edge of the galaxy where all that's needed is an Imperial flag and someone to keep the lights on, whereas "normal" Storm Troopers are competent and dangerous, if fallibly human. I think that the episodic show makes this a lot clearer than the movies who, despite their woefully padded run-time, don't have as much opportunity to characterise its mooks while there's Protagonists still in need of a few more seconds of time to complain about something and then trip over a plot-device.
    Last edited by Wraith; 2020-11-23 at 08:01 AM.
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  3. - Top - End - #243
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    Default Re: The Mandalorian Season 2

    Quote Originally Posted by Wraith View Post
    But then the meme kicks in - they can't shoot straight, and dozens of them are chasing an untrained farm-boy around for ages without a single shot hitting it's mark. It's so egregious that fans have made up conspiracy theories about it; the Troopers were under orders to allow Skywalker to escape so that he could bring the leaked Death Star plans to the rebels where the trap would be sprung and they'd be wiped out forever, etc.
    It's less "fans made a conspiracy theory about this" and more "Leia openly speculates this in the movie, and then Vader and Tarkin directly admit it". Like, how is this a conspiracy theory when three main characters actually say it onscreen?
    Last edited by Peelee; 2020-11-23 at 08:39 AM.
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  4. - Top - End - #244
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    Default Re: The Mandalorian Season 2

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    No way is it going to be Snoke, if only because that doesn't really make any sense. Snoke is the Emperor's thing, and he's off on Exogul in secrecy. I'm thinking Gideon wants ot make himself a Force user.

    The thing in the tank looks a lot like him. Maybe an early failed version? What will Gideon making himself force sensitive do? He'll just be a cheap knockoff Jedi with no training to use his powers.

    The Mandolorian, however, has managed to raise the stakes subtly and effectively. The first stormtroopers we see in Episode 01 are slovenly and unprofessional - their armour is rusty and they talk back to the visitor with barely concealed apathy. These guys get justifiably Batman'd by the hero over the space of about 10 minutes.

    The next time we see them, however, are under the command of Moth Gideon - their armour is shiny, there's a platoon of them, and they mortally wound Mando. The day is only saved by the death of two named protagonists.
    They're notably more competent, better equipped and organised and it shows - culminating in the most recent episode where we've gone from shabby, barely threatening dregs up to black-armoured Super Troopers who the average audience member probably doesn't recognise, but they can make an educated guess at an escalating threat when they see it.

    This is why, I think, the jokes work better in the TV show. The characters have mostly seen the Grunts of a disenfranchised army, but there's plenty more waiting in the wings; Mando knows this, because those same reinforcements have killed one of his friends, and he notably doesn't join in when the other Mandolorians are making jokes about Trooper incompetence.

    I entirely disagree, I don't think Stormtroopers have ever been handled so poorly. (I don't remember much about Rebels, admittedly)

    The early ones under the Client require a plan and effort to deal with.

    Mando makes the first stormtrooper joke himself in the prison episode

    "I used to be an Imperial Sharpshooter"
    "That's not saying much."
    "I wasn't a Stormtrooper!"

    Moff Gideon's troops are cleaner, but much less effective. Their inaccuracy is proved when they can't even shoot nearby cans, and they present no real threat despite their overwhelming advantage. Moff Gideon himself mortally wounds Mando, and he only manages that because he happens to be standing near an ammo dump.

    Even in the end, they only present a threat due to their overwhelming advantage of having the leads completely exposed on a slow moving raft, and fail completely to capitalise on it.

    Then, Season 2. The Mandalorians carve their way through the ship with no real effort, including that joke about the cargo bay. They get pinned in one doorway very briefly, but Mando's plan to overcome this is to walk directly into the line of fire because even concentrated fire can't actually hurt him.

    Then this episode. The base looks shoddy as a disguise, but is actually well equipped (they comment on how valuable that transport is), and our three leads (and a random accountant they brought along for no apparent reason) solo the base.

    Their armoured transport is pursued by three scout troopers and four TIEs, and even with such an overwhelming advantage they can't do damage worth a damn, and are even more helpless against the Razor Crest, which is an old, decrepit, barely functional ship that was completely wrecked two hours ago.

    I don't think Stormtroopers have ever been handled this poorly. Even with an overwhelming advantage, they barely present a threat and can't actually accomplish any damage.


  5. - Top - End - #245
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    Default Re: The Mandalorian Season 2

    Quote Originally Posted by Mechalich View Post
    There was no plan. This really isn't a matter of debate at this point. While several of the people involved have tried to use weasel words to cover this monumental failure somewhat, there's more than enough information out there regarding the ST to make it quite clear that no overarching plan for all three movies existed beyond rough notes and no individual oversaw the projects or made the directors respect said notes.

    Mandalorian, by contrast, clearly has a plan, conceived by Favreau and Filoni, and the difference is clear to see despite the much more episodic nature of the TV series structure.
    I agree.
    Its amazing so far the only bit I didn't like was when they tried to pass off a bad joke instead of adding a line to explain that far better.
    I was more annoyed at the photo shot for the directors at the end that could have been skipped along with the giant spider landing atop the Razorcrest and just let Din fly the ship out of there would have been a far better ending for that episode.

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    The line is just having the Frog Lady explain she NOTICED there were eggs missing and used the Razorcrest sensors to locate that spa so she could manually check the eggs as the canister's bio-scan indicated the viable eggs were still there.
    Thus when Baby Yoda scanned the eggs they only took and ate the eggs that were either not viable or might have posed a problem to the viable eggs meaning what he did was actually helping her.
    This would explain why she reacted like she did, how she located that spa and explain what Baby Yoda was doing all without having to claim it was a bad joke


    Sorry chapter 10 still annoys me.

  6. - Top - End - #246
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    Default Re: The Mandalorian Season 2

    Quote Originally Posted by Sapphire Guard View Post
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    The thing in the tank looks a lot like him. Maybe an early failed version? What will Gideon making himself force sensitive do? He'll just be a cheap knockoff Jedi with no training to use his powers.
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    In what way does the thing in the tank look like Snoke? The tanks contain vaguely humanoid shapes, so it's just as accurate to say that the things in the tanks look like a hairless Wookiee. Gideon knows the Emperor was a Force user, so Gideon would probably see having Force powers as advantageous (even more so than the other advantages that come with it).

    Why would he want to make a separate Force sensitive creature that will itself be a cheap knockoff Jedi with no training? Dude doesn't seem to be looking for someone to rule over him, and if something is going to be able to use the Force, why not him instead of someone else?
    Last edited by Peelee; 2020-11-23 at 09:37 AM.
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    Default Re: The Mandalorian Season 2

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    I thought I heard volunteer so i assumed whoever volunteered to be the new genetic template for the clones used for those experiments might be all about finding a way to imbue anyone with force sensitivity.

    Wouldn't they have run scans among themselves if they could discern a targets M level?

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    Default Re: The Mandalorian Season 2

    Quote Originally Posted by Hopeless View Post
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    I thought I heard volunteer so i assumed whoever volunteered to be the new genetic template for the clones used for those experiments might be all about finding a way to imbue anyone with force sensitivity.

    Wouldn't they have run scans among themselves if they could discern a targets M level?
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    Yes, whoever "volunteered".
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    Default Re: The Mandalorian Season 2

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    I don't want to sound like a broken record, but I must state again that it looks like Gideon is trying to build himself an army of Force-wielding troopers to march on... wait, what planet did the teacher droid say the capital was on again?
    Last edited by Fyraltari; 2020-11-23 at 10:54 AM.

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    Default Re: The Mandalorian Season 2

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    This being the Empire, I heard it as "volunteer". As in, not actually voluntary.

    Re Snokes. Same scar. Or similar enough, anyway.

    Eh, we'll see.

    Last edited by Sapphire Guard; 2020-11-23 at 11:29 AM.

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    Default Re: The Mandalorian Season 2

    Quote Originally Posted by Fyraltari View Post
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    I don't want to sound like a broken record, but I must state again that it looks like Gideon is trying to build himself an army of Force-wielding troopers to march on... wait, what planet did the teacher droid say the capital was on again?
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    Chandrila. If Coruscant is the Manhattan of the Star Wars universe, Chandrila is the Hamptons. Or, if you prefer, if Coruscant is Paris, Chandrila is the Riviera.

    Not a perfect analogy but it gets the gist across, I think. Also, the New Republic capital is mobile and not permanently situated on any one city - its just in Chandrila currently.
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    Default Re: The Mandalorian Season 2

    Spoiler: volunteers
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    This being the post RotJ Empire I wouldn't rule out them being actual volunteers (at least the firdt batch before everyone starts dying). Everyone still wearing the Imperial colors is a fanatic, getting magic powers to restore the True Order of galaxy by injecting potentially lethal things in you body is a thing they would totally do.


    Quote Originally Posted by Peelee View Post
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    Chandrila. If Coruscant is the Manhattan of the Star Wars universe, Chandrila is the Hamptons. Or, if you prefer, if Coruscant is Paris, Chandrila is the Riviera.

    Not a perfect analogy but it gets the gist across, I think. Also, the New Republic capital is mobile and not permanently situated on any one city - its just in Chandrila currently.
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    I know the capital moves I just didn't catch the name said in the episode. Isn't that Mon Mothma's homeplanet? So it's full of tourists and people on vacations?
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    Default Re: The Mandalorian Season 2

    Quote Originally Posted by Fyraltari View Post
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    I know the capital moves I just didn't catch the name said in the episode. Isn't that Mon Mothma's homeplanet? So it's full of tourists and people on vacations?
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    Yep, Mon Mothma's planet. I more meant "less completely urbanized, more in tune with nature, highly developed planet with high cost of living and seen as a desirable place." Like I said, not a great analogy, but close enough for government work.

    Maybe I should have used Scandinavia or Switzerland instead?
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    Default Re: The Mandalorian Season 2

    Quote Originally Posted by Peelee View Post
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    Gideon knows the Emperor was a Force user
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    Does he? I thought the Emperor kept that mostly to himself.

    For instance in A New Hope the table of high ranking imperials (or at least Admiral Motti) seemed to regard Vader as being wierd for following 'that ancient religion', so unless I am missing something I don't know if Gideon would have any reason to know that the Emperor was a force user.

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    Default Re: The Mandalorian Season 2

    Quote Originally Posted by dancrilis View Post
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    Does he? I thought the Emperor kept that mostly to himself.

    For instance in A New Hope the table of high ranking imperials (or at least Admiral Motti) seemed to regard Vader as being wierd for following 'that ancient religion', so unless I am missing something I don't know if Gideon would have any reason to know that the Emperor was a force user.
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    Fair point, but he at least knows about Force Powers and would likely want them and not want to be ruled by someone with them, so that makes it even less likely that he's making Snoke.
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    Default Re: The Mandalorian Season 2

    Quote Originally Posted by Peelee View Post
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    Also, the thought of bodies rejecting the injections and volunteers (or "volunteers" as I'm almost positive is the case) means that they're trying on already-existing creatures. So I think the "Moff Gideon wants to make himself a Force user" is the stronger theory. Maybe also try to create an entire class of Force users under his control.
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    I agree with this. I believe Gideon wants to get force power for himself, and to give force power to people he already knows are loyal to him.


    Quote Originally Posted by Wraith View Post
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    ...Then again, wasn't that similar to Finn's aborted background in the new trilogy? He was a force-sensitive child kidnapped and forced to grow up as a storm trooper who somehow slipped through screening - just like an entire spaceship full of similar troopers that they discovered in The Rise of Skywalker.
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    Is there anything in the Disney's trilogy that makes sense?
    In fact, the only things that makes sense in Disney's Star Wars are Rebels, Rogue One and Mandalorian, and the already have issues.
    And they are the projects KK was the less involved with.


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    Or they might write-off the movies altogether and ignore it. I doubt it will be a completely clean break, given how many references and Easter eggs have already appeared in the show so far, but we won't know how much further they'll go until they do it.
    Spoiler: KK
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    Not likely to happen as long as KK is on board, even if this is the bast way to improve SW.
    I blame her much more than Jar Jar Abrams or Ruin Johnson for the failure of the ST. She's the one who hired them, didn't give them time to work (TFA was made in less than 2 years IIRC), imposed some of her ideas, and did throw Lucas's plan away and didn't get a full plan before launching the project.

    And BTW, KK sound very relevantly as bad as you may think in French.



    Quote Originally Posted by dancrilis View Post
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    If not is it possible that Palpatine cloned Yoda, stored him out of the way until he was more mature?
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    Given the time frame, it could have been a project of Plagueis.


    Quote Originally Posted by Spacewolf View Post
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    It's a shame Stormtroopers are so toothless, it's difficult to feel danger when they are fighting them because of it. There used to be alot of talk about how the Stormtroopers where only incompetent in 4 because they wanted the heroes to escape, then they were competent during 5 but I think the Ewoks basically sealed their fate as joke characters. Even though they did get some respect during some of the EU books.
    The Stormtroopers in the OT are very competent every time they don't face a main character or an ewok.

    Quote Originally Posted by Peelee View Post
    I agree with everything except "until Mando". The comics, and more importantly The Clone Wars and Rebels, also push this forth (eg. Rex pretty much claiming that the stormtrooper (not clonetrooper) helmets are crap and is why they can't hit anything). Both Lucasfilm and Disney have pushed this narrative forward on screen. Mandalorian almost certainly does it solely because of Filoni.
    Even Rex himself has an hard time hitting things with this helmet.

    And Rebels show some Troopers to be competent. I remember one going toe to toe with Kanan in hands-to-hands until Kanan use the Force in one of earlier episode.

    Quote Originally Posted by Fyraltari View Post
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    Definitely one of the best Leodagan's moment.
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    Default Re: The Mandalorian Season 2

    Quote Originally Posted by Petrocorus View Post
    Jar Jar Abrams or Ruin Johnson
    [...]
    And BTW, KK sound very relevantly as bad as you may think in French.
    Could we please do that without any childish name-calling.


    Definitely one of the best Leodagan's moment.
    All of Léodagan's moments are the best Léodagan's moments.

    Also Loïc Varraut deserves praise for how smoothly, quickly and stealthily he placed his hand into position. And now you can't unsee it.
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    Default Re: The Mandalorian Season 2

    Quote Originally Posted by Fyraltari View Post
    Could we please do that without any childish name-calling.
    You're probably right, but in their case, i've a hard time restraining myself.

    Though i fear i'm not the only one being childish. Johnson especially have had quite childish behaviours, like the "RJJA was there" picture.

    But yeah, i should not go down to this level.

    All of Léodagan's moments are the best Léodagan's moments.

    Also Loïc Varraut deserves praise for how smoothly, quickly and stealthily he placed his hand into position. And now you can't unsee it.
    I love Loïc Varraut for all his work in the serie.
    And i do not thank you for making me see this.
    Last edited by Petrocorus; 2020-11-23 at 04:36 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sam K View Post
    Sun Tzu never had tier problems. If he had to deal with D&D, the Art of War would read "Full casters or GTFO".
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    Default Re: The Mandalorian Season 2

    Quote Originally Posted by Petrocorus View Post
    I love Loïc Varraut for all his work in the serie.
    And i do not thank you for making me see this.
    All must suffer as I was made to suffer.
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    Default Re: The Mandalorian Season 2

    Quote Originally Posted by Petrocorus View Post
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    Not likely to happen as long as KK is on board, even if this is the bast way to improve SW.
    I blame her much more than Jar Jar Abrams or Ruin Johnson for the failure of the ST. She's the one who hired them, didn't give them time to work (TFA was made in less than 2 years IIRC), imposed some of her ideas, and did throw Lucas's plan away and didn't get a full plan before launching the project.
    I disagree with the hate against Kathleen Kennedy - she has a long and very well-established career as being a positive force on cinematic ideas and has produced a large number of some of the most culturally loved movies in history, such as Back to the Future, Indiana Jones, Jurassic Park, and E.T., along with numerous other movies.

    If Bob hires Steve for a delivery job and Steve wrecks the company car, I'm going to blame Steve way more I'll blame Bob, especially if Bob has a proven track record.
    Quote Originally Posted by Petrocorus View Post
    The Stormtroopers in the OT are very competent every time they don't face a main character or an ewok.
    In ESB the stormtroopers herd Luke to the carbon freezing chamber. The last thing you want as a stormtrooper is to tick off Darth Vader, and blasting the person that he has set up an enormous trap and tortured people for some time to get would probably do that. Missing intentionally and doing so in a way that seems as if you are trying to hit is definite competence, I would claim. Also they shoot Leia in two different movies.
    Quote Originally Posted by Petrocorus View Post
    Even Rex himself has an hard time hitting things with this helmet.
    Yeah, that's just more going with the joke that I dislike. Luke claimed he couldn't see a thing in the helmet in ANH while getting in the elevator, and then when exiting the elevator had perfect aim and was able to help clear the room. If anything, Luke's line should be taken to mean because he hasn't been properly trained to use the helmet's capabilities. Rex has no excuse.
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    Default Re: The Mandalorian Season 2

    Quote Originally Posted by Peelee View Post
    Yeah, that's just more going with the joke that I dislike. Luke claimed he couldn't see a thing in the helmet in ANH while getting in the elevator, and then when exiting the elevator had perfect aim and was able to help clear the room. If anything, Luke's line should be taken to mean because he hasn't been properly trained to use the helmet's capabilities. Rex has no excuse.
    That line wasn't in the script. Mark Hamill thought the cameras had stopped rolling and complained about the oversized helmet. And why is the helmet oversized? Because Luke is a little short for a stormtrooper.

    Turns out that mugging ennemy soldiers for their uniforms is no guarantee you'll find your size. Who knew?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fyraltari View Post
    That line wasn't in the script. Mark Hamill thought the cameras had stopped rolling and complained about the oversized helmet. And why is the helmet oversized? Because Luke is a little short for a stormtrooper.

    Turns out that mugging ennemy soldiers for their uniforms is no guarantee you'll find your size. Who knew?
    A.) Regardless, Luke said it so it exists and I can try to justify it.
    2.) It wasn't really oversized; there are generally two types of Stormtrooper armor in ANH, Hero and Stunt*. The Hero suits were made for the heroes - Mark Hamill and Harrison Ford. They were sized for those people in mind. That being said, the helmets are bigger than you would expect when you hold them.
    iii.) IRL, no, Hamill called it. You can't see a thing in those helmets. Especially if they fog up, which happens all the time. Fun fact, 501st events will nearly always have handlers.

    *Don't ask me the differences. I've read it all and even I can't tell you.
    Last edited by Peelee; 2020-11-23 at 05:03 PM.
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    Default Re: The Mandalorian Season 2

    Quote Originally Posted by Peelee View Post
    If Bob hires Steve for a delivery job and Steve wrecks the company car, I'm going to blame Steve way more I'll blame Bob, especially if Bob has a proven track record.
    This is exactly my logic for blaming KK over JJA or RJ.
    But maybe i should go up to Iger.

    Yeah, that's just more going with the joke that I dislike. Luke claimed he couldn't see a thing in the helmet in ANH while getting in the elevator, and then when exiting the elevator had perfect aim and was able to help clear the room. If anything, Luke's line should be taken to mean because he hasn't been properly trained to use the helmet's capabilities. Rex has no excuse.
    In Rex's defence, his own helmet is kinda different.
    He makes a point about the overall quality of the armor in the same episode IIRC.
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    Default Re: The Mandalorian Season 2

    KK hate is just the same trick the fandom pulls with George. If they like something, people say "Oh, thank god (other creator) was able to save this from George" Whereas if they don't like something, the fandom goes "Dammit George, why did you have so much control." It's a scummy trick to avoid crediting him with anything, it's where this idea that his work was 'saved in the edit' comes from.

    KK gets the same, blamed for the Sequels people dislike, but Mandalorian and TCW get credited to Dave and John, because people have to find a way to blame her for one thing but not credit her with the things they like.

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    Default Re: The Mandalorian Season 2

    Quote Originally Posted by Peelee View Post
    A.) Regardless, Luke said it so it exists and I can try to justify it.
    2.) It wasn't really oversized; there are generally two types of Stormtrooper armor in ANH, Hero and Stunt*. The Hero suits were made for the heroes - Mark Hamill and Harrison Ford. They were sized for those people in mind. That being said, the helmets are bigger than you would expect when you hold them.
    iii.) IRL, no, Hamill called it. You can't see a thing in those helmets. Especially if they fog up, which happens all the time. Fun fact, 501st events will nearly always have handlers.
    Right, so the helmet aren't oversized but foggy in real life.

    In universe though, Luke is called out as being shorter than the average stormtrooper and wearing an uniform not designed with him in mind. So it's likely he can't see jack becaue the helmet isn't a good fit.

    *Don't ask me the differences. I've read it all and even I can't tell you.
    The hero suits were made for the actors playing the heroes to wear while the stunt suits were made for the stuntmen playing the bad guys to wear?
    Last edited by Fyraltari; 2020-11-23 at 05:31 PM.
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    Default Re: The Mandalorian Season 2

    Originally Posted by dancrilis
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    ...unless I am missing something I don't know if Gideon would have any reason to know that the Emperor was a force user.
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    Remember that Moff Gideon was former Imperial Intelligence, and if anyone would know the Emperor used the Force it would be Gideon and his colleagues.

    Given his age, Gideon probably joined up around the time that Palpatine declared the Empire, so Gideon may well have cut his teeth pursuing fugitive Jedi and other Force-users. If so, he probably knows much more about the Force than ordinary Imperials, and would have access to a great deal of sensitive intel regarding Force-users and their capabilities. This seems likely given his extreme interest in the Child and midichlorians, so it's reasonable to assume that at some point he became aware the Emperor was in that same category.
    Last edited by Palanan; 2020-11-23 at 06:08 PM.

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    Default Re: The Mandalorian Season 2

    Quote Originally Posted by Petrocorus View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Peelee View Post
    If Bob hires Steve for a delivery job and Steve wrecks the company car, I'm going to blame Steve way more I'll blame Bob, especially if Bob has a proven track record.
    This is exactly my logic for blaming KK over JJA or RJ.
    It is?
    Quote Originally Posted by Petrocorus View Post
    I blame her much more than Jar Jar Abrams or Ruin Johnson for the failure of the ST. She's the one who hired them
    Like, in my analogy, Kathleen Kennedy is Bob and Abrams is Steve.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sapphire Guard View Post
    KK hate is just the same trick the fandom pulls with George. If they like something, people say "Oh, thank god (other creator) was able to save this from George" Whereas if they don't like something, the fandom goes "Dammit George, why did you have so much control." It's a scummy trick to avoid crediting him with anything, it's where this idea that his work was 'saved in the edit' comes from.

    KK gets the same, blamed for the Sequels people dislike, but Mandalorian and TCW get credited to Dave and John, because people have to find a way to blame her for one thing but not credit her with the things they like.
    Agreed. If she's the most to blame for the Sequel Trilogy, then she's the most to credit for The Mandalorian. Street goes both ways.
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    Default Re: The Mandalorian Season 2

    The Mandalorian was produced with very little meddling from higher-ups, including KK, simply because when it first came out, even Disney had no more confidence on SW. They didn't even have merchandise for the show, and had to rush to make some Baby Yoda merch in time for Christmas.

    So, no, KK doesn't get any credit here. Nor does Bob Iger.

    I'm not even a big SW fan, but KK and Iger deserve all the criticism they get for their effects in SW.
    Last edited by Lemmy; 2020-11-23 at 06:58 PM.
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    Default Re: The Mandalorian Season 2

    Quote Originally Posted by Lemmy View Post
    The Mandalorian was produced with very little meddling from higher-ups, including KK, simply because when it first came out, even Disney had no more confidence on SW.

    So, no, KK doesn't get any credit here.
    The President of Lucasfilm was not allowed to have control over Lucasfilm because she made Disney nearly five billion dollars out of three movies?

    Imean, that's certainly an interesting theory.
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    Default Re: The Mandalorian Season 2

    Quote Originally Posted by Peelee View Post
    The President of Lucasfilm was not allowed to have control over Lucasfilm because she made Disney nearly five billion dollars out of three movies?

    Imean, that's certainly an interesting theory.
    Not so much "wasn't allowed" as much as "no one had interest in working with SW anymore, because they had lost faith in the franchise, so the producers of The Mandalorian got little to no oversight".

    And "made 5 billions" is quite disingenuous way of putting way... It ignores the cost of the movies' productions, the dwindling ticket sales with each movie, and merch sales going down so badly that the CEO of two major toy companies straight up said there was no demand for it.

    It's actually quite telling that the one good Disney SW production is the one that had little to no involvement from KK, Iger and/or Abrams.
    Last edited by Lemmy; 2020-11-23 at 07:05 PM.
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