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Thread: Smallest Playable Race?
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2020-09-16, 04:32 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Feb 2011
Smallest Playable Race?
Are there any races in Pathfinder which are smaller than the usual Small races? I知 aware of at least half a dozen in the Small category, but are there any playable races which are further on down the scale?
For my purposes I知 only interested in the natural, unmodified size of a given race悠知 not looking for any kind of shenanigans involving reduce person, psionic powers, etc. I知 open to anything from official Paizo content. Am I overlooking something, or is there nothing smaller than Small?
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2020-09-16, 04:37 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jun 2007
Re: Smallest Playable Race?
Kitsune can stay in fox form indefinitely, making them tiny.
Guide to the Magus, the Pathfinder Gish class.
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2020-09-16, 04:44 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Jul 2019
Re: Smallest Playable Race?
Nope small is the smallest a race can get with its base form (if you don't count the kitsune's Superior Shapeshifter that provides the fox shape feat, and foxes are tiny)
Last edited by Trandir; 2020-09-16 at 04:44 PM.
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2020-09-16, 06:27 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Jul 2005
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- Vancouver, BC, Canada
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2020-09-16, 06:35 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Feb 2011
Re: Smallest Playable Race?
Thanks, but for my purposes I'm not looking for templates or other ways to modify the baseline size of any given race.
So, are there any strong reasons against having playable races from smaller size categories?
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2020-09-16, 06:51 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jun 2011
Re: Smallest Playable Race?
Reach gets to be a pain with tiny sizes and massive stealth bonuses could be an issue.
Bat skinwalkers (bloodmarked) have a feat to turn into a diminutive bat.Last edited by stack; 2020-09-16 at 06:53 PM.
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2020-09-16, 06:53 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jan 2012
Re: Smallest Playable Race?
Pathfinder has rules for playing as any monster. So go nuts.
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2020-09-16, 08:26 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Feb 2011
Re: Smallest Playable Race?
Originally Posted by stack
Reach gets to be a pain with tiny sizes and massive stealth bonuses could be an issue.
Originally Posted by SimonMoon6
Pathfinder has rules for playing as any monster. So go nuts.
I found a section on the AoNPRD about playing monsters, but it leads with this warning:
"Monsters are not designed with the rules for players in mind, and as such can be very unbalancing if not handled carefully."
It also suggests that all-monster parties are the best way to approach the issue. I知 not sure what book this is from, though, and if there are more detailed rules on monster PCs I壇 be very glad to give them a look.
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2020-09-17, 03:22 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Mar 2017
Re: Smallest Playable Race?
I don't think so.
Even from the point of Paizo-published "balance" Tiny size should not be an issue, as they included it in their custom race creator.
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2020-09-17, 03:34 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jun 2007
Re: Smallest Playable Race?
Guide to the Magus, the Pathfinder Gish class.
"I would really like to see a game made by Obryn, Kurald Galain, and Knaight from these forums. I'm not joking one bit. I would buy the hell out of that." -- ChubbyRain
Crystal Shard Studios - Freeware games designed by Kurald and others!
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2020-09-17, 06:53 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Nov 2011
Re: Smallest Playable Race?
I'm not quite sure how pathfinder handles them; in 3.5 Grig (one of the sprites) are tiny and have a listed LA. I don't know what pathfinder does/did for such things.
I don't see anything explicit allowing it; but in general they did try to maintain 3.5 compatibility, so I just don't know, maybe there's something somewhere.Last edited by zlefin; 2020-09-17 at 06:54 AM.
A neat custom class for 3.5 system
http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=94616
A good set of benchmarks for PF/3.5
https://rpgwillikers.wordpress.com/2...y-the-numbers/
An alternate craft point system I made for 3.5
http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showt...t-Point-system
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2020-09-17, 08:50 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jan 2012
Re: Smallest Playable Race?
The relevant part is right below that:
If you are including a single monster character in a group of standard characters, make sure the group is of a level that is at least as high as the monster's CR. Treat the monster's CR as class levels when determining the monster PC's overall levels. For example, in a group of 6th-level characters, a minotaur (CR 4) would possess 2 levels of a core class, such as barbarian.
Note that in a mixed group, the value of racial Hit Dice and abilities diminish as a character gains levels. It is recommended that for every 3 levels gained by the group, the monster character should gain an extra level, received halfway between the 2nd and 3rd levels. Repeat this process a number of times equal to half the monster's CR, rounded down. Using the minotaur example, when the group is at a point between 6th and 7th level, the minotaur gains a level, and then again at 7th, making him a minotaur barbarian 4. This process repeats at 10th level, making him a minotaur barbarian 8 when the group reaches 10th level. From that point onward, he gains levels normally.
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2020-09-17, 12:12 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Feb 2019
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Re: Smallest Playable Race?
Vanilla races? Not really. There are some 3pp things that have Tiny races, and I know the Gonzo Kitchen Sink book has a Diminutive race called the Lilliputians.
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