What subclasses don't yet exist, that you want to exist?

[Valmark]

Speaking of homebrews, there was (well, is) a very cool homebrew class on this site for 3.5- the Evolutionist. Would love to see a similar class for 5e.

[KorvinStarmast]

The artificer isn’t really it, either, but it could make a nice blueprint to build from.

For my money, the Artificer remains poorly constructed, poorly conceptualized, and is a bad fit for D&D 5e.
I realize that this is may involve a matter of taste.

Suggestion to WoTC: don't use it as a blueprint for anything, please.

[jaappleton]

Non-shadowy, non-holy, arcane half caster.

Probably more a class than a subclass, unfortunately, as the ranger and paladin class bones and spell lists already skew things a certain way flavor-wise, and the warlock is too shadow-themed.

The artificer isn’t really it, either, but it could make a nice blueprint to build from.

Probably more of a martial sorcerer than a martial wizard, now that I ponder it; and I don’t think an extra attack origin for sorcerers is enough (and generally high level magic is too much for a well built martial to still feel like a martial).

I do think the "Swordmage", as it were, can exist as an Artificer. Extra attack at 5th level. Flavor it as you give your ally (eventually allies) a device or something for when they're in danger, you can use your reaction to teleport within 5ft of that device and make an attack against their aggressor. Fire / cold / lightning / acid damage boost at some point, maybe that's their 'smite' is charging their weapon with elemental energy?

It can work. It absolutely can.

Plus it fills in a big gap with Artificer: Just let me use a weapon and hit things. Don't make me deal with a pet, or some super specific armor or something. Just let me be a half caster and hit things, please, without the extra stuff.

[Luccan]

-----

Why did they hate Psi Die, someone asked. They didn't. The design team liked it, they wanted a unique mechanic to represent the ebb and flow of psionic power pulsing from a character. However, in the feedback surveys, fans hated the idea of a new mechanic. "Less is more, 5E is supposed to be streamlined and not finnicky, etc".

Which I don't agree with. At all. Its been five years, folks, you can handle the idea of one separate die to keep track of. Seriously.

While some people did insist that psionics should not have a unique mechanic, there was a lot of pushback from other viewpoints. From "Mystic was perfectly serviceable you just needed to tone it down" to "I don't want psionics to be based on randomness" and even "The first draft psi die seems really poorly thought out". I do think it's strange we've heard nothing on psionics since and are getting at least one subclass for it sight unseen. My money is there's no special mechanic for it

---

I'd like a Barbarian with a more obvious malevolent bent. Maybe your rage and strength are fueled by a demon or something from the Far Realm. Maybe it's a curse. It's kind of a vague idea you could represent with basically any existing barbarian, but I'd like to see what a subclass with that in mind looks like.

Something I haven't gotten far with and would love to see are subclasses for fighter and rogue that use Invocations. No extra spells or cantrips. I'm even against giving them pact boons. Just the ones without prereqs besides level. Those that remain are mostly utility and I think it would be interesting to see what people build with that. Other subclass features are the real hard part.

Oh, and explicit fey/infernal origins for sorcerer. Similarly to the lack of a Draconic Pact Warlock, the lack of these seems to be to avoid stepping on toes, but WotC has already shown they don't mind doing that in other cases, so bring 'em on. I also think a Mutant sorcerer would be good. I imagine them being accidentally granted sorcerous magic by exposure to wild magic or direct experimentation. In addition to spells, they would have physical mutations that gave them extra abilities like a third eye (which grants things like Detect Magic) or extra limbs. I also think it would be a great place to introduce an actual Sorcerer gish.

[TrueAlphaGamer]

For my money, the Artificer remains poorly constructed, poorly conceptualized, and is a bad fit for D&D 5e.
I realize that this is may involve a matter of taste.

Suggestion to WoTC: don't use it as a blueprint for anything, please.

Agreed.

I honestly think half their features are ribbons.

[cutlery]

For my money, the Artificer remains poorly constructed, poorly conceptualized, and is a bad fit for D&D 5e.
I realize that this is may involve a matter of taste.

Suggestion to WoTC: don't use it as a blueprint for anything, please.

I was referring more to the half caster-with-cantrips skeleton.

I don't like the flavor of the class at all, but I never liked much from Eberron anyway - tastes differ.

I do think the "Swordmage", as it were, can exist as an Artificer. Extra attack at 5th level. Flavor it as you give your ally (eventually allies) a device or something for when they're in danger, you can use your reaction to teleport within 5ft of that device and make an attack against their aggressor. Fire / cold / lightning / acid damage boost at some point, maybe that's their 'smite' is charging their weapon with elemental energy?

It can work. It absolutely can.

Plus it fills in a big gap with Artificer: Just let me use a weapon and hit things. Don't make me deal with a pet, or some super specific armor or something. Just let me be a half caster and hit things, please, without the extra stuff.

Probably; but they don't seem to do that much reflavoring of base classes with subclasses.

The artificer spell list isn't the sort of one I'd want, anyway.

No blade cantrips, no shield, no mirror image, no steel wind strike; armorer gets some of these.

At least it has blink, I spose.


The shoulder mounted lightning launcher is... well. It's something all right, but not what I think of when I think of someone swinging a big sword with magic sprinkles.


Something sort of like the artificer could work with heavy reflavoring and a different list, but you could same the same for a paladin or ranger.

I'm not the right one to ask at all, though, because I strongly dislike all of the flavor text in the class.

I'd probably play a paladin instead, and I'm not super keen on them, either.

[MadBear]

Would love to see Fantasy avengers be easily playable from level 1. So....

1. artificer who specializes in a single suit of armor (aka fantasy iron man)
2. Unarmed Barbarian who has a giant leap ability and whose rage increases size by 1 increment


I think that's it. From there Battle master fighter can be Captain America, Wizard covers Dr. Strange, Cleric covers Thor, Assassin cover Black Widow, Arcane Archer covers Hawkeye, etc.

[togapika]

You want me to help look up some homebrew

Got any dancer type subclasses? I can look up homebrew, but I don't know shirt when it comes to balance in 5e, so I wouldn't be able to tell if something was fair to play

[MrStabby]

So whenever these threads pop up - every 9 months or so, I usually put down my new wishes. I probably will just focus on others thoughts for now though.

Prismatic magic Wizard, like Initiate of the Sevenfold Veil of 3.5.

When I hear "prismatic wizard" I think things like chromatic orb, color spray... prismatic wall. Maybe hypnotic pattern... So I would love this as a theme, but I think there would need to be a LOT more prismatic spells to make it work, or at least much better ways to upcast them. I would really like to see this, although to me this is more a bard thing than a wizard thing.

This thread isn't about whether a DM will accept it, its about whether it exists. And from some of the views I've seen, even official splatbooks are subject to "Not in my game".

So people leaving the tons of homebrew content out there to go unused is all their fault. I don't buy into stigmas like that. it probably exists somewhere and if you don't want to go find it because the GM will throw it out anyways because you and them expect the same few designers to do everything....thats your problem. keep hoping they will cater to every obscure thing people come up with, I'll wait.

I don't think we need to get to bentout of shape over someone using "existing" in a different way to you. It is just a pretty fun thread about what we might get excited by if it were to be released - a chance to share views and ideas and oppinionson what is cool. Join in with the spirit of the thing. Enjoy it.

Lastly, I would love to see a Debuff Warlock, perhaps flavored as a type of Witch Doctor, casting curses on your enemies. Hexblade tried to be that, but Hexblade is... well, broken as all the lower planes and really all over the place with flavor. A Caster Warlock that gains access to spells like Bane, Confusion, Polymorph, and other such spells would be loads of fun. Considering Warlock's lack of extensive spell slots, Concentration won't limit your versatility as much as most other casters (Concentration Cantrips are extremely few and far between).

I would love a witch doctor. I kind of had some discussions about it... 5 years ago? Between nature cleric, death cleric, what you could do with a lore bard it seemed you could get pretty close. I would say that it would be nice to get more of it under one roof though.

A druidy-monk subclass that focuses on wildshaping.

Would be really up for a druidy monk. Would be so disapointed if it involved wildshaping.

Its kind of probably just me... but if I go to the trouble of picking/creating a character I want to play, then I want to play it. I don't want to play a bear or a dinosaur instead.

But monks with some druid spells would be good - even if only following a similar progression to 4 elements monks. With fairy fire, heat metal, plant growth, conjure fey... you can get a lot of abilities that don't get left behind and are still a good use of an action in a way that damage spells often are not.

Truly, I do not envy the position the design team is in regarding Psionics.

Each version of D&D prior has had Psionics. None of them used the same method of implementation. So every fan of Psionics wants their favorite version. How exactly are they supposed to go about making everyone happy in this instance?

You can look at the 5e Paladin and Cleric and definitely say, "Yup. Those are Paladin and Cleric, 100%"

I am genuinely concerned that people will look at Psionics and not quite know what they're looking at. Or they'll know it instantly, and hate it because it isn't what they had in mind.

-----

Why did they hate Psi Die, someone asked. They didn't. The design team liked it, they wanted a unique mechanic to represent the ebb and flow of psionic power pulsing from a character. However, in the feedback surveys, fans hated the idea of a new mechanic. "Less is more, 5E is supposed to be streamlined and not finnicky, etc".

Which I don't agree with. At all. Its been five years, folks, you can handle the idea of one separate die to keep track of. Seriously.

So I don't really like the fluff for psionics. I think that turns me off a bit. I think bringing it a bit more in line with classical fantasy would appease me. That said, I thought the psi-die was pretty cool; my only issue was that as a subclass thing it was a bit too small of a part of what the whole character might offer.

I would like a plant druid... like the equivalent for moon druid, but for transforming into a plant form.

Just... yes. On the theme... On the delivery I would prefer something like the Shepherd druid. Instead of buffing summon spells it buffs spells like entangle, plant growth, grasping vine and similar.

For my money, the Artificer remains poorly constructed, poorly conceptualized, and is a bad fit for D&D 5e.
I realize that this is may involve a matter of taste.

Suggestion to WoTC: don't use it as a blueprint for anything, please.

I have mixed views on the arificer. On the one hand I hate it. On the other hand it has grown on me a bit and I mrely dislike it and believe it has no place in my games. I would be a lot more amenable to it if it had been more generic at first then Eberron subclasses were added that gave the magitech flavour. So an arificer based round scrolls, round runes or caligrapher's tools, round forging and using great weapons - something that is a bit easier to fit into different worlds. I guess I want a high level artificer to feel more like Sauron and less like Tony Stark.

[Temperjoke]

I'd like a class that's like the Blue Mages of Final Fantasy, where they somehow acquire the abilities/powers that enemy creatures naturally possess.

[clash]

Got any dancer type subclasses? I can look up homebrew, but I don't know shirt when it comes to balance in 5e, so I wouldn't be able to tell if something was fair to play

Honestly if you rename the abilities from drunken master monk it works perfectly as a dancer subclass.

Level 3:
Proficiency in performance and see if you can swap brewers tools for a musical instrument.

For the rest I have suggestions in this old thread
https://forums.giantitp.com/showthre...master-refluff

[Cybren]

Hello? Is it me you're looking for?

no, it’s not

[Wraith]

I would like a plant druid... like the equivalent for moon druid, but for transforming into a plant form.

I like this one. Then again, having seen this I would now like to go back down the route of the Planar Shepherd - pick a Domain/Plane/Patron/Bloodline equivalent, and now you get spells and wildshapes of that type instead of Beasts.
Maybe tone it back from the 3.5 version which was OP as all heck, but "Druid of a non-Material Plane type" has always been a favourite of mine.

I'd also like to see a Druid of the Swarm - loses some wildshapes/spells/etc in order to gain rules that let them turn into a Swarm-type, with appropriate rules for scaling up in levels. Creepy, but fun.

I'd also like a Cleric Domain which changes their Turn Undead ability into a way to affect other creature types - Maybe one that can choose to specialise in Fiends or Fae for example, or just make them a full-on Exorcist-type character that can Turn several other creatures as they improve in level, perhaps gaining Preferred Enemy-type upgrades. Not optimal, but I feel that Turning is a fun yet underutilized mechanic that could stand to have a bit of tweaking.

First and foremost though, as others have mentioned earlier, I'd like to see Ranger rebuilt to be viable. I'm sure it can be done with a fairly small amount of effort to give it's niche back, and I'd be sad to see it be left to stagnate for a few more years until D&D 6th Ed. comes out and the cycle starts again.

[Spiritchaser]

I’d like to see some more melee/debuff, melee control options.

Two or more attacks, primarily damage is by weapon, but with a focus on party protection.

At present this does exist, with EchK 3+/Ancestral Guardian3+ and sentinel you get a great single target controller/debuffer and with conquest Paladin you get a great multi target controller/debuffer. EK wizard or bladesmith wizard mixes can Possibly do this as well (though it’s often better to stay out of melee with these). You can also sort of get there with a tortle druid but there’s plenty of design space for more mechanics.

Make an arcane sword mage with a spell list that strongly favours those wonderful wizard control spells, and give them a reason to stay in melee.

Make a Ranger subclass with a weak but scalable summon capacity, and a secondary power to control foes adjacent to summons?

Make a monk with the capacity to generate walls/clouds/reflections?

There are probably no end of good ideas, and some of them would likely even balance out pretty well.

[EggKookoo]

A combat healer might be fun. Someone who generates healing/buffing based on damage output.

[Mikal]

It would be nice to finally have a subclass that can make two weapon fighting worth it.

Felt we were getting there with the Brute, but then it fell by the wayside.

[Asisreo1]

Blood Sorcerer. The concept is sooo good but it's clear as day how difficult the actual execution is.

[jojosskul]

I have mixed views on the arificer. On the one hand I hate it. On the other hand it has grown on me a bit and I mrely dislike it and believe it has no place in my games. I would be a lot more amenable to it if it had been more generic at first then Eberron subclasses were added that gave the magitech flavour. So an arificer based round scrolls, round runes or caligrapher's tools, round forging and using great weapons - something that is a bit easier to fit into different worlds. I guess I want a high level artificer to feel more like Sauron and less like Tony Stark.

I'm finally getting a chance to play artificer for the first time, and oddly that's the exact flavoring I went with. He has proficiency in calligrapher's tools which he uses to magically place runes on different objects to give them power. He places the runes on himself to represent his prepared spells for the day, and plans on going artillerest (horrible name but mechanically fits the theme) since they get proficiency in woodcarver's tools, so he's just placing the same runes a different way.

His cannons will be represented more as magical wellsprings of destructive or protective magic. I'm hoping that when Tasha's comes out and we get the "de-Eberonned" version of Artificer we get something like this as a suggestion flavorwise. It took a little work, but I'm very happy with the results and am excited to play them. It's even easier for the Alchemist to make them fit in a more traditional fantasy setting. Instead of thinking of them as "uses magic with the power of steampunk" I tend to think of them as "channels magic through objects" and it gave me more of a blank slate to work with.

[Millstone85]

Artificer

• Archivist
• Armorer

Cleric

• Love Domain
• Travel Domain

Druid

• Circle of Plants
• Circle of Swarms

Monk

• Way of the Astral Self

Paladin

• Oath of Balance
• Oath of Freedom

Sorcerer:

• Celestial Heritage
• Clockwork Soul
• Fey Ancestry
• Fiendish Legacy
• Sea Sorcery
• Stone Sorcery
• Sun Sorcery

Warlock

• The Inevitable
• The Vestige
• The Wyrm

[Nalistri]

Moon Sorcerer currently playing a characer who is from the Gates of the moon

[Amnestic]

I'm finally getting a chance to play artificer for the first time, and oddly that's the exact flavoring I went with. He has proficiency in calligrapher's tools which he uses to magically place runes on different objects to give them power. He places the runes on himself to represent his prepared spells for the day, and plans on going artillerest (horrible name but mechanically fits the theme) since they get proficiency in woodcarver's tools, so he's just placing the same runes a different way.

His cannons will be represented more as magical wellsprings of destructive or protective magic. I'm hoping that when Tasha's comes out and we get the "de-Eberonned" version of Artificer we get something like this as a suggestion flavorwise. It took a little work, but I'm very happy with the results and am excited to play them. It's even easier for the Alchemist to make them fit in a more traditional fantasy setting. Instead of thinking of them as "uses magic with the power of steampunk" I tend to think of them as "channels magic through objects" and it gave me more of a blank slate to work with.

The Magic of Artifice sidebar in Rising of the Last War already says "fluff your spellcasting through tools however you like"

THE MAGIC OF ARTIFICE
As an artificer, you use tools when you cast your spells. When describing your spellcasting, think about how you're using a tool to perform the spell effect. If you cast cure wounds using alchemist's supplies, you could be quickly producing a salve. If you cast it using tinker's tools, you might have a miniature mechanical spider that binds wounds. When you cast poison spray, you could fling foul chemicals or use a wand that spits venom. The effect of the spell is the same as for a spellcaster of any other class, but your method of spellcasting is special. The same principle applies when you prepare your spells.

As an artificer, you don't study a spellbook or pray to prepare your spells. Instead, you work with your tools and create the specialized items you'll use to produce your effects. If you replace cure wounds with heat metal, you might be altering the device you use to heal-perhaps modifying a tool so that it channels heat instead of heal*ing energy. Such details don't limit you in any way or provide you with any benefit beyond the spell's effects. You don't have to justify how you're using tools to cast a spell. But de*scribing your spellcasting creatively is a fun way to distin*guish yourself from other spellcasters.

So it's kinda there already?

[zinycor]

I have mixed views on the arificer. On the one hand I hate it. On the other hand it has grown on me a bit and I mrely dislike it and believe it has no place in my games. I would be a lot more amenable to it if it had been more generic at first then Eberron subclasses were added that gave the magitech flavour. So an arificer based round scrolls, round runes or caligrapher's tools, round forging and using great weapons - something that is a bit easier to fit into different worlds. I guess I want a high level artificer to feel more like Sauron and less like Tony Stark.

I agree, an artificer version that was close to Sauron would be very nice and fitting on the standard DnD settings.

[Wildstag]

I'd really like to see a monk that gets armor proficiency and the ability to use Martial Arts while armored.

Alternatively, a bonded-armor fighter would be good. There was this set of old Dragon Magazine alternate class features for the Fighter that basically made them bond with a particular set of armor. While bonded, they got fun bonuses (fun, not necessarily strong).

At 1st level, they could get ignore encumbrance from armor and max-dex was improved by 1. At 4th, they could get evasion while lightly encumbered, but only from spells and magical effects. At 8th, they got to ignore don/doff speed and a scaling bonus to AC while wearing that suit of armor. At level 18 was the ACF that gave spell resistance equal to 11 + HD while wearing heavy or medium armor.

And weirdly, an ACF in the same article overlapped with the spell resistance ACF, and that gave Fortification 25%/75%/100% at the cost of the 10th/14th/18th level feats.

In 5e form, I could see the 3/7/10/15/18 breakdown being in order: lose stealth disadvantage and add +1 dex to heavy armor; add proficiency bonus to Dexterity saves against spell effects while armored; +1 AC while wearing bonded armor (increases at 15 and 18) and able to don/doff as a round/action; 50% chance for a critical hit to become a normal hit (can't overshine adamantine armor completely); Resistant to damage from spells or a way to become immune for a number of rounds per day equal to level (maybe?).

I'll admit, the 18th level one is hard to figure out. Maybe it'd work better as combining the one Paladin aura with the one Gnome feature that gives advantage on Int/Wis/Cha saves against spells? That could work. I'd call the archetype the "Eldritch Juggernaut" despite that being the name of the capstone feature in the 3.5 Dragon article. Its abilities would be magical in nature, and it'd make the Fighter basically chock full of passives, but it'd also allow the Fighter to focus on offensive feat options or fighting styles because the archetype will strengthen their defenses.

[Kyutaru]

Dragoon - Fighter

For some, jumping is an Athletics check.

For dragoons, it is a way of life.

[rlc]

A ranger that drives around a giant robot

[cutlery]

Dragoon - Fighter

For some, jumping is an Athletics check.

For dragoons, it is a way of life.

A short rest recharge jump or two that works like a round of blink would be pretty neat; have it boost crit range to 19-20 for a round when they land.

Increase the jump range from 10 to 20 then 30 feet later, and...uh. Something else for the later martial archetype features.

[Millstone85]

So it's kinda there already?

More than kinda, and I think that previous posters have been unfair to RftLW's presentation of the class.

The artificer is someone who crafts and enchants items, and is in no way confined to the magitek aesthetic of Eberron.

[samcifer]

I loved, loved the Swordmage. That's what the Stone Sorcerer from UA was trying to be, but IMO it just doesn't fit on a d6 class. Super tough to put it on the Fighter, then, without stepping all over the EK. No idea how they'd get it done.

I do think the Monk needs an overall damage boost, that's why I want a Smite-style one. Something that can really nova. It'd likely solve the issue if they could get some more magic item support, some weapons designed specifically with unarmed strikes in mind. Its an immensely small list as to what can truly help a Monk offensively as far as magic items go. The issue I find, as a class, is that all other martial warrior classes (And some gishes, like Bladelocks) get an outright damage boost at level 11 or 12. For Rangers, this is based into their subclass. Paladins get Improved Divine Smite. Fighters get their third attack. Barbarians get... well, the ability to defy death to keep them fighting.

Monks? Their unarmed strikes go from a d6 to a d8. Assuming you've been using a weapon for your first two attacks in a row up to that point, you've already been doing a d8 via a quarterstaff or similar weapon. So for your unarmed strikes, you're now doing another 1 damage per attack on average. That's just... So sorely lacking.

EDIT: As far as damage boosting subclass, I think the closest we've seen is the Way of Mercy (What an ironic name, considering). It allows them to do a quasi-smite style attack once per turn, but you need to have incapacitated (Stunning Strike'd?) the target, or have them be poisoned. And any feature relying on Poison in 5E is just... Damn, design team, go back to the drawing board.

I tend to take 1 level of Hexblade warlock for the hexblade curse extra damage. It seems to help, but hurts the build overall otherwise, it seems, due to needing 13+ Charisma.

[Arkhios]

Reading up on this thread brought up an idea I've never had before: Astral Soul Sorcerer. Honestly not sure what it would be like, but the thought alone is quite intriguing.

Rage Mage Barbarian would be nice, but honestly, I'm kinda happy with my own 'brew (link below, in my signature). Even if I didn't get to play one myself, I'd be happy to let my players use it. You're of course free to peruse it as well.

Sacred Fist Monk. A monastic order with ties to a deity and divine magics.

Spellsword. As the old prestige class. A half-caster with spells from wizard's list specifically, with knightly orders. Not kuite Eldritch Knight but something between that and Bladesinger wizard, with a chassis more akin to paladin, ranger, and artificer. And no, artificer doesn't have the right feel either.

Warlord. An obvious answer from me. Again, I'm relatively happy with the one I brewed myself years ago, but I'd like to see an official one as well. Battle Master isn't that, neither is Banneret.

Paladin who bonds with a Domain as their Oath.

Rogue with extra attack. My Thug is an attempt to make something like that, with a twist, at the expense of reducing sneak attacks.

[jaappleton]

I tend to take 1 level of Hexblade warlock for the hexblade curse extra damage. It seems to help, but hurts the build overall otherwise, it seems, due to needing 13+ Charisma.

With Genie becoming official, its likely a better route than Hexblade since the +Prof Bonus damage is always on.

Still, its a solid idea and delays things only one level. Its not a bad route to go. Even so, compared to something like Lifedrinker or Improved Divine Smite, it pales in comparasin.