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  1. - Top - End - #961
    Ettin in the Playground
     
    Rockphed's Avatar

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    Default Re: Girl Genius XXVIII: Dancink! Ve is here for de dancink!

    Quote Originally Posted by Fyraltari View Post
    I think I remember it was stated that the Castle's original personality was a copy of a ruling Heterodyne but I can't find a source.
    One of the old cast pages included that tidbit. I don't think it is ever mentioned in comic.
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    Rockphed said it well.
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  2. - Top - End - #962
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    Default Re: Girl Genius XXVIII: Dancink! Ve is here for de dancink!

    Quote Originally Posted by Shining Wrath View Post
    Most Heterodynes deserved to die by conventional moral standards. The Castle has been carefully trained (programmed? raised?) to not share any of those standards of morality. For those of us whose thinking is pretty much embedded in conventional morality (which is probably a good thing), the Castle is almost an alien life form. Predicting its behavior is difficult. It wants to have fun, though, and if it were defining fun as "kill the faux Heterodyne painfully" she'd already be dead.

    I wonder what would happen if she took off the crown and threw it into the crowd?
    Wasn't the Castle AI an upload of some old Heterodyne? Or based on his personality at least?
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  3. - Top - End - #963
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    Default Re: Girl Genius XXVIII: Dancink! Ve is here for de dancink!

    Quote Originally Posted by Rockphed View Post
    One of the old cast pages included that tidbit. I don't think it is ever mentioned in comic.
    It's mentioned in the comic at one point. Even has a picture of it IIRC. It was a long time ago though.
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  4. - Top - End - #964
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    Default Re: Girl Genius XXVIII: Dancink! Ve is here for de dancink!

    Quote Originally Posted by HandofShadows View Post
    It's mentioned in the comic at one point. Even has a picture of it IIRC. It was a long time ago though.
    I stand by my assertion that it never says "the castle is an upload of Faustus Heterodyne". The closest is the first panel of this page.
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    Rockphed said it well.
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    When your pants are full of crickets, you don't need mnemonics.
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  5. - Top - End - #965
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    Default Re: Girl Genius XXVIII: Dancink! Ve is here for de dancink!

    Take off the crown? What makes you think that a "magical" crown, given to you by a spirit entity, that you have to willingly place on your head, can be removed?

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  6. - Top - End - #966
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    Default Re: Girl Genius XXVIII: Dancink! Ve is here for de dancink!

    ... huh.

    Wonder if there's a worldbuilding explanation for something I just noticed on a re-read.

    I just hit the point where Agatha's in England chasing down the Lantern, and noticed that the Sea Serpent that got hijacked was the HMSS Ogo-Pogo.

    Ogopogo is the name given to Nessie's North American cousin, who supposedly lives in Lake Okanagan in British Columbia. The Americas were cut off in the GG universe, so you have to wonder who's doing the naming, and what they know that the rest of the world doesn't.

    Also, that particular myth was called Naitaka in the era that Girl Genius is set in. It didn't get called Ogopogo until 1912 at the earliest, at least as far as I can find from a brief search. That being said, it's a relatively obscure cryptid, so I don't entirely blame the Foglios for missing that bit.

  7. - Top - End - #967
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    Default Re: Girl Genius XXVIII: Dancink! Ve is here for de dancink!

    Ah, I was wondering whe the more sparky minions would show up.
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  8. - Top - End - #968
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    Default Re: Girl Genius XXVIII: Dancink! Ve is here for de dancink!

    Only a single "Yike!" for that? She must be getting tired from all that running around.
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  9. - Top - End - #969
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    Default Re: Girl Genius XXVIII: Dancink! Ve is here for de dancink!

    Quote Originally Posted by Jimor View Post
    Only a single "Yike!" for that? She must be getting tired from all that running around.
    There is simply no time for more. A professional coward would skip any screams and run at full speed already.
    In a war it doesn't matter who's right, only who's left.

  10. - Top - End - #970
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    Default Re: Girl Genius XXVIII: Dancink! Ve is here for de dancink!

    By the look of things, Mechanicsburgians put considerable time and effort into the annual Solstice ritual - that little gadget is at least a night's work for Agatha, so days or weeks for a lesser Spark.

    And that gadget is designed to "grab and hold", not "murder murderously", so another point in favor of the "contest is to capture, not to kill" thesis.
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  11. - Top - End - #971
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    Default Re: Girl Genius XXVIII: Dancink! Ve is here for de dancink!

    I'm increasingly convinced by "Contest is Capture" but.

    Although the play-acting of the "Angry Murderous Mob" seems to be important as well. There were way too many edged weapons in that first mob for it not to be.
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  12. - Top - End - #972
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    Default Re: Girl Genius XXVIII: Dancink! Ve is here for de dancink!

    You're assuming the weapons are actually sharpened instead of being props.

  13. - Top - End - #973
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    Default Re: Girl Genius XXVIII: Dancink! Ve is here for de dancink!

    This is Mechanicsburg. I'm sure they are very good at blunt...
    Warning: This posting may contain wit, wisdom, pathos, irony, satire, sarcasm and puns. And traces of nut.

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  14. - Top - End - #974
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    Default Re: Girl Genius XXVIII: Dancink! Ve is here for de dancink!

    Quote Originally Posted by BRC View Post
    I'm increasingly convinced by "Contest is Capture" but.

    Although the play-acting of the "Angry Murderous Mob" seems to be important as well. There were way too many edged weapons in that first mob for it not to be.
    they might be to keep competing mobs at bay.
    * my emphasis

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  15. - Top - End - #975
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    Default Re: Girl Genius XXVIII: Dancink! Ve is here for de dancink!

    The one thing that's getting me is, if the entire thing is play-acting (as it seems to be) Why keep the Jaegers in the dark?

    Like, turning the Castle off makes sense so the Heterodyne can't cheat, but the Jaegers are explicitly perfectly free-willed.
    "You all go drink, I'm going to go get chased around by the townsfolk all night"
    "Hokay Boss! Haff Fun!"
    And then they just, don't intervene, because they know the Heterodyne is in no real danger, so the Heterodyne can't call upon them to help cheat.

    Which of course raises the question of how old this "Ritual" really is? The Jaegers are, presumably, recruited from the Mechanisburg population, all of which seems to at least be AWARE of the tradition (Giant mobs through the streets are hard not to notice), and seem to undergo the process AFTER reaching Adulthood.

    So, unless the Heterodyne Hunt postdates the youngest Jaegers, at least some of them MUST know what's going on out there.



    Which is of course assumes that the Jaegers Don't Know. We only have Oggie's word that the Jaegers are completely in the dark about what the Heterodyne gets up to after they reach the Jaegerhall after all.

    If the entire thing is a citywide LARP of the Heterodyne getting chased by angry mobs, maybe part of the pageantry is that the Jaegers are unavailable, since even if they didn't intervene, they might lurk around watching things, which would ruin immersion.

    So the Jaegers get a big party so they don't feel bad about missing out on the fun, and all pretend like they have no idea what's going on outside, making jokes like "Wow, I hope the Heterodyne is having a good walk home, and not trying to take the alleyway off Skull Street" "Yeah, I saw a bunch of people putting a bunch of furniture there" "Wow! That's dangerous! If somebody, say, the Heterodyne, were to try to flee down that alley they would be trapped by barricades!"


    Edit:
    Heck, for all we know the Chase is being projected into the Jaegerhall by some version of the Library Map, and the centerpiece of the Party is the Jaegers watching the Heterodyne get chased around by the townsfolk.

    Oggie could have been trying to surprise the Professora.
    Last edited by BRC; Yesterday at 12:47 PM.
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  16. - Top - End - #976
    Firbolg in the Playground
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    Default Re: Girl Genius XXVIII: Dancink! Ve is here for de dancink!

    One thing to remember that Mechanicsburgers seem to view their stuff as private and personal, and the Professora is not a Mechanicsburger.

  17. - Top - End - #977
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    Default Re: Girl Genius XXVIII: Dancink! Ve is here for de dancink!

    Quote Originally Posted by Rogar Demonblud View Post
    One thing to remember that Mechanicsburgers seem to view their stuff as private and personal, and the Professora is not a Mechanicsburger.
    She's married into the family.

    And unless they plan was to buckle her off to bed in a soundproof room, it seems unlikely that she wouldn't have found out.
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  18. - Top - End - #978
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    Default Re: Girl Genius XXVIII: Dancink! Ve is here for de dancink!

    Modern Mechanicsburg is a bit of a tourist trap, they're secretive about some things but they also like to make money off things when they can.

    Presumably there's tons of tourists there this particular year, what with this being the first proper Solstice for the town in years, which is a good opportunity to draw in visitors and sell them genuine Mechanicsburg merchandise. I wouldn't be surprised if there were people selling the out of towners weapons for the big Heterodyne Chase, and people selling 'I caught the Heterodyne and all I got was this stupid T-Shirt' type novelty items.
    Sanity is nice to visit, but I wouldn't want to live there.

  19. - Top - End - #979
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    Default Re: Girl Genius XXVIII: Dancink! Ve is here for de dancink!

    Quote Originally Posted by Grim Portent View Post
    Modern Mechanicsburg is a bit of a tourist trap, they're secretive about some things but they also like to make money off things when they can.

    Presumably there's tons of tourists there this particular year, what with this being the first proper Solstice for the town in years, which is a good opportunity to draw in visitors and sell them genuine Mechanicsburg merchandise. I wouldn't be surprised if there were people selling the out of towners weapons for the big Heterodyne Chase, and people selling 'I caught the Heterodyne and all I got was this stupid T-Shirt' type novelty items.
    And there are probably some bookies doing their work in the crowd that did not want to participate directly.
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  20. - Top - End - #980
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    Default Re: Girl Genius XXVIII: Dancink! Ve is here for de dancink!

    Looking back, I'm pretty sure it's not even supposed to be a secret at all, not from the Jaegers at least

    Look here https://www.girlgeniusonline.com/com...1#.YAXzvehKiUk one of Oggie's descendents is about to say "There's a bit more to it" before the Professora shuts him up.

    It's entierly possible he's about to talk about the whole "Chase the Heterodyne" bit right there, but he gets stopped and the Professora runs off before anybody can finish the story.

    On the previous page https://www.girlgeniusonline.com/com...9#.YAX0ZuhKiUk

    Oggie says "The Heterodynes had their fun", and is about to go into more details, mentioning that the Heterodynes were 'Krezy guys" when the Professora changes the topic to the Boys, which leads into the Touristy version of the Jaegerstomp.

    He's about to get back on topic when he gets distracted again by Maxim and Dimo showing up.

    Nowhere does he actually say the Jaegers don't know what's going on. Quite the opposite, he seems to imply they know EXACTLY what is going on, and is perfectly willing to tell the Professora, they just keep getting interrupted and sidetracked.


    It's the Revelmeisters and town Elders in the cathedral who seem intent on keeping the Chase secret from the Professora. They're positively gleeful at the thought of an out-of-towner playing the Heterodyne, presumably because she doesn't know what's going to happen.

    https://www.girlgeniusonline.com/com...1#.YAX2n-hKiUk it looks like one of them is going to spill the beans, but when the Professora says "Nothing will persuade me" he stops talking. The Castle calls her decision "Bold" when she says she wants to give the town a Traditional Solstice.
    Last edited by BRC; Yesterday at 04:03 PM.
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  21. - Top - End - #981
    Firbolg in the Playground
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    Default Re: Girl Genius XXVIII: Dancink! Ve is here for de dancink!

    So basically a civic-level version of carnies and townies?

    Honestly, it fits.

  22. - Top - End - #982
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    Default Re: Girl Genius XXVIII: Dancink! Ve is here for de dancink!

    Quote Originally Posted by Rogar Demonblud View Post
    So basically a civic-level version of carnies and townies?

    Honestly, it fits.
    I mean, they make mention at one point of the Heterodyne Boys "Opening the Town"

    even if this wasn't an official secret, the fact that Mechanisburg was isolated (It's in the mountains) and hated (Their mad kings regularly send out hordes of monsters to pillage surrounding areas) would mean that knowledge of the Solstice Festival would be uncommon outside the town.

    Throw in the fact that the Heterodyne Boys may or may not have participated, since they spent so little time in Mechanisburg Proper, and seemed to dislike the Jaegers, and then the Long War and Klaus's Occupation of the town.

    It seems like they kept the Parade bit for the tourists, but may have dropped the "Chase" bit as just not especially fun if you're just chasing around some actor.

    Or they may have done the Chase with the actor, the Professora hadn't heard about any of this. But once again, not the same.
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  23. - Top - End - #983
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    SamuraiGuy

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    Default Re: Girl Genius XXVIII: Dancink! Ve is here for de dancink!

    A certain Airman Higgs is a Jager general, and I'll bet you a shiny new nickel that he not only knows what goes on at the Solstice, he can give you stats on which Mechanicsburg Mobs hold the record for most Heterodyne captures, fastest, most broken limbs while still succeeding, and so on. I find it very unlikely that the Spymaster doesn't know something this obvious.

    Unless he's been sworn to secrecy by Heterodynes of yore, the Jagers know, and therefore the Heterodyne was never in any real danger.
    Heterodyne stand-ins may have a more difficult time of it.
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  24. - Top - End - #984
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    Default Re: Girl Genius XXVIII: Dancink! Ve is here for de dancink!

    Quote Originally Posted by BRC View Post
    Or they may have done the Chase with the actor, the Professora hadn't heard about any of this. But once again, not the same.
    I think the actor would have been involved in a more farcical chase, without the crown and so on and probably with clowns and stilts and kid friendly stuff. They imply the man is basically a drunken panto player, so catching him after a long night of festivities wouldn't be hard and would probably end with him in a dunk tank or similar carnival game.

    Chances are the actual Heterodyne would wind up in something like a dunk tank these days as well, Agatha is more likely to consent to a bit of mild humiliation in the name of fun than to enjoy brawling with the townsfolk, and I'd imagine her father and uncle would have similar preferences when they were present for the solstice*.

    The townsfolk themselves have also mellowed out a lot since the boys took over. Several generations have gone by with no direct familiarity or engagement with the old style marauding and general villainy. I wouldn't be surprised if some of the guys who ran with the Jaegers in the bad old days could actually give the Heterodynes a decent beating in a fight, and what they would have considered just jolly fun might have left some more serious damage, even if the Heterodyne could fix it all easily. The current residents would be less open to any more extreme punishments for the Heterodyne upon being caught if only because they are themselves less extreme now, so even if the old tradition was beating the Heterodyne up they would likely have found something else to do now.

    *They didn't spend much time in the castle, but they do still seem to have considered Mechanicsburg as their home and probably came back to it when they didn't have any pressing adventures to take care of.
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  25. - Top - End - #985
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    Default Re: Girl Genius XXVIII: Dancink! Ve is here for de dancink!

    It was mentioned in an early strip that the past several solstices were overseen by a standin (don't recall his name offhand), but it doesn't seem like they did the Heterodyne chase.

    Also... as I mentioned earlier, I've been doing a re-read, and I just hit something that I had totally missed the first time around, and something that kind of... changes things. I haven't been following these threads from the start, so I have no idea if this came up when the strip was new, but, well... Lucrezia is the Muse of Time. That means, that at some future point, Agatha will be working with her mother. To what end, I have no idea, but that kind of suggests that the endgame will not be what we expect- the Other isn't the last boss.

  26. - Top - End - #986
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    Default Re: Girl Genius XXVIII: Dancink! Ve is here for de dancink!

    Quote Originally Posted by TeChameleon View Post
    It was mentioned in an early strip that the past several solstices were overseen by a standin (don't recall his name offhand), but it doesn't seem like they did the Heterodyne chase.

    Also... as I mentioned earlier, I've been doing a re-read, and I just hit something that I had totally missed the first time around, and something that kind of... changes things. I haven't been following these threads from the start, so I have no idea if this came up when the strip was new, but, well... Lucrezia is the Muse of Time. That means, that at some future point, Agatha will be working with her mother. To what end, I have no idea, but that kind of suggests that the endgame will not be what we expect- the Other isn't the last boss.
    The fact that Lucrezia is the Muse of Time doesn't actually mean that anyone who has time-travelling powers (like Agatha will) necessarily needs to work with her. I think it's as simple as "van Rijn noticed her enough and noticed her connection to Time enough that he called her the Muse of Time, despite the fact that he didn't build her like the other Muses". Then he caught her. I don't know if he actually managed to achieve anything by that.

    I think Lucrezia expected someone to rescue her? I also don't know how (or when) that fits in with her being the Other, that's another puzzle piece that hasn't been revealed. But I'm guessing that the "calling" that was in Agatha and Zola, and the one in Anevka, are from "after" she escaped that imprisonment.

    Now if Lucrezia got her time-travelling powers from the Dreen, and Agatha gets hers from the same source or somewhere else, that can still be perfectly consistent with Lucrezia being the Muse of Time.
    I'm pretty much the opposite of concise. If I fail to get to the point, please ask me and I'm happy to (attempt to) clarify.

  27. - Top - End - #987
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    Default Re: Girl Genius XXVIII: Dancink! Ve is here for de dancink!

    Why do people think that Lucrezia is The Other?

    What makes you think that "The Other" has not possessed Lucrezia, and part of the end will be saving her? Driving this horrible "Other" out of Agatha's mother?

    We know that The Other can possess people, right?
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