Girl Genius XXVIII: Dancink! Ve is here for de dancink!

[TeChameleon]

My vote is going for "Still in Four Pitiful Dimensions"

[Scarlet Knight]

My votes:

1- We can rebuild with Science

2- We're not savages, you know.

[Kantaki]

Healthy? No. Realistic? Very!

It saved his neck right now, didn't it?

[Manga Shoggoth]

All duly noted. (@Zazu Yen - note that the boldface is being removed as it won't appear in the title).

[sihnfahl]

if you kill him after he flies you to the middle of nowhere, how do you ever leave the middle of nowhere? I don't think there are scheduled flights. If anyone does find you, it's probably because they are looking for you with intent to kill or capture you, so it's sorta lose-lose.

Presumably what she intends to find there provides her with a method of leaving the island on her own.

And given the Lady's involvement, and the fact that Zeetha can read the words (kinda), leads me to believe it's probably a backdoor into Skifander.

It saved his neck right now, didn't it?

Makes me wonder how many times he's done this, and follows the exact same script just to stay alive, since he deals with so many of them.

[Zazu Yen]

It saved his neck right now, didn't it?

Makes me wonder how many times he's done this, and follows the exact same script just to stay alive, since he deals with so many of them.

True, it would make sense for this to be a learned survival skill for dealing with a clientele that needs to avoid patrols on a regular basis.

All duly noted. (@Zazu Yen - note that the boldface is being removed as it won't appear in the title).

Got it, thanks.

[sihnfahl]

True, it would make sense for this to be a learned survival skill for dealing with a clientele that needs to avoid patrols on a regular basis.

Not just evade patrols. So that nobody knows where they went, nobody could be used to trace where they went, nobody even knows they left, or were even there in the first place.

So anyone who's not part of The Job is disposable.

[Rockphed]

Wild, completely out there, bonkers theory: It's Bill (or even Barry). The reason he doesn't care is he can take both of them in his sleep. (And possibly mourning for Lucrezia). I literally have no idea why I came up with that.

I would love for this to be true, but Bill was too much of a HERO to ever let people like Madwa continue existence, and Barry was much, much bigger the last time we saw him. Of the two, I am fairly certain that Bill was more heroic and Barry was both smarter and more pragmatic.

[Manga Shoggoth]

I would love for this to be true, but Bill was too much of a HERO to ever let people like Madwa continue existence, and Barry was much, much bigger the last time we saw him. Of the two, I am fairly certain that Bill was more heroic and Barry was both smarter and more pragmatic.

I think that one of the things that went through my mind was that our Captian was a large man, although not as large as Barry in the flashback; however I have always seen that flashback as an exaggerated memory because Agatha was a child, so adults seemed much bigger. As she didn't grow up with Uncle Barry (he disappeared while she was still little) she never got the adult perspective, so to speak.

However yes, on the moral side the characters of both Bill and Barry are too different - even the grim, depressed and focussed Bill we see in the novels after the fall of Mechanicsberg (where he lost his son, and apparantly his wife).

[tonberrian]

Now I'm really curious about if Tarvek is number 1 or number 2, and who the third possible heir could be. A new suitor? A new adversary? Both? Both is good...

[PraetorDragoon]

Very true Krosp. I wonder how far Martellus would have gone if he kept his mouth shut.

[Radar]

Now I'm really curious about if Tarvek is number 1 or number 2, and who the third possible heir could be. A new suitor? A new adversary? Both? Both is good...

It was mentioned at some point that Gilgamesh also has some claim to the Strom King title. Not sure how real it is.

[PhantomFox]

Wow, his whiskers look huge in those last panels

[Traab]

The muse just speaks of a claimant, not an heir. Its entirely possible there is something else going on here. While he never took on the title of king, baron wulfenbach ruled over the majority of europa with an iron fist for decades, AND he had a son and heir to take the "throne" who officially did so. Gil is the defacto ruler of europa despite there being a civil war going on. Think of it this way, if queen elizabeth and her entire known line stopped being queen of england, and 15 generations later someone else took over and ruled then put their child on the throne to replace them, which family line is the TRUE royal line? What happens if one of elizabeths many times great grand nephews shows up and declares he is rightfully the king? Who has the legit claim to the throne? The current king? Or the distant relative of the royal line that hasnt ruled in centuries?

[Radar]

Who has the legit claim to the throne? The current king? Or the distant relative of the royal line that hasnt ruled in centuries?

By the time-honored tradition it will be the one, who can enforce his rule with whatever means they deem fit. Getting rid of the other candidate was a particularly popular choice.

[Shining Wrath]

"I keep thinking he isn't all bad - and then he opens his mouth". Oh, I feel this. Ever want to like someone - a movie star, perhaps, where you like the roles they play - and then they go and talk without a script, and it's ... ewwwww?

Anyway ...

At best a distant third means that someone else has a very strong claim. I wonder if it's Tarvek?

And there's a distinction between heir to a title, and heir to power. There are still people who squabble over who is the proper heir to the Romanov throne in Russia. I believe a key part of the argument is whether or not someone disqualified himself and his entire line in the early 20th century by marrying a commoner. My point being that if one of the competitors somehow gained recognition as Czar, their ability to give orders to Vladimir Putin would remain exactly what it is now ... zero.

If Tarvek were recognized as Storm King, he'd still have very little power. If Martellus' weaker claim were recognized, he'd still have more power, because he's got a military to back him up. Tarvek would probably be a more effective ruler if he had something to rule, but he doesn't.

[slayerx]

Yeah trying to figure out the storm king line of succeesion is a bit difficult since the exact family tree is pretty vague and we don't know the rules. For instance, Terebitha (grandma) who basically runs the family is suggested to be the mother of tarvek's father because of her titles, but Tarvek specifically said he gets his storm king claim from his mother's side of the family (unless the foglio's decided to retcon that detail). Not to mention that red hair seems to be the common factor for everyone related to the storm king and Tarvek's father had red hair

So lets speculate. For rules, Lets assume that the lines of succession is favors men, older siblings, and the status of the parents. Sparkiness is actually NOT a factor for succession because its too unpredictable; Its best for the family to know where someone sits in the line of succession at birth and there's no way to determine sparkiness at birth and breakthrough's may not happen until young adulthood. Sparkiness is highly desirable and respected, but not strictly necessary... though when it comes to returning the storm king to the throne, the family would prefer someone capable instead of an idiot

i expect that Tarvek is actually first in line. One of his parents, whether it be his father or mother, is the oldest child and the other parent is either of high nobility or royal birth. I'm gonna assume there was a retcon; Terebitha is the grandmother of storm kings, she's the mother of Wilhelm and Tarvek actually gets his claim from his father instead of mother. Wilhelm being Terebitha's oldest son is first in line and his wife was from another royal family, thus making Tarvek first in line after him (and he's now dead). In fact, i feel its certain that Tarvek is first in line because Orotine greets him with respect and refers to him as "your majesty" , while she is more disrepecful to Martellus and refers to him with the lesser term "your highness".

lets look at Violetta real quick... she's a cousin of Tarvek but she does not seem to have any status. My assumption is that her mother was one of Terebitha's younger daughters and Violetta was born out of wedlock. Being an illegitmate child invalidates any claim she might have by blood and so Violetta becomes a servant of the family.

Martellus being third, means that someone must be second. My guess is that Orotine is also considering other family lines. Terebitha's family isn't the only family that can draw a clear line back to the storm king. While Tarvek is the first prince from Terebitha's side of the family, the other main contender is the first prince of another family line of which Orotine believes has a fairly equal claim... this would explain why Terebitha seems to regard Tarvek and Martellus as their best choices even though Martellus is "a distant third"; she's not considering the heirs from rival families

Now Martellus. Distant third, at best? That suggests his claim even as third in line could be disputed. My guess is that his parent who he gets his claim from is Terebitha's second child who is also a daughter. This could put him in line for the throne behind Tarvek, but one added wrinkle could be that his other parent is not of high birth and may even be a commoner. Since he is a legitimate child he still has his claim, but since his other parent is low status his claim is a lot weaker than Tarvek's (distant third) and even his spot as third for the throne could be disputed by other cousins who have more noble parentage (at best). This is why Martellus obsesses over recognition, but gets annoyed with those that want to focus on the official line of succession.

So that's my speculation on the whole thing

[Deliverance]

Now I'm really curious about if Tarvek is number 1 or number 2, and who the third possible heir could be. A new suitor? A new adversary? Both? Both is good...

As I pointed out when Orotine first brought this up last year, Gilgamesh. If nothing else then because it is the most frustrating answer.

My reasoning hasn't changed and is now is as sound, or unsound as the case might be, as it was then.

https://forums.giantitp.com/showsing...&postcount=909

As my post doesn't spell out the full context, at the party Orotine made a point of seeing Tarvek, Martellus, and Gilgamesh. Let's revisit those meetings.

First was Tarvek, whom she greeted friendly and had a conversation with the details of which were not disclosed to the reader:
https://www.girlgeniusonline.com/com...?date=20200601

Then Martellus, whom she quickly puts down by pointing out that support of two popes or an army notwithstanding, while there was dispute (to the Muses, at least) as to which of two lines is ascendant, in neither case is Martellus the rightful heir:
https://www.girlgeniusonline.com/com...?date=20200710

And finally she had a conversation with Gilgamesh, which we were privy to, in which she had what appears to give a revealing answer to Gilgamesh when discussing her original purpose, giving advice to the storm king, to which she answers, "and I'd be happy to advise you":
https://www.girlgeniusonline.com/com...?date=20200729

Which of course can be read as an inferred "and my preferred claimant would be happy to/not object to have me advise you", seeing as how Tarvek suggested she speak to Gilgamesh:
https://www.girlgeniusonline.com/com...?date=20200731

But can also be read as a direct reference to Gilgamesh himself, because, by the most simple reading of her answer, that's exactly what it is. And in my theory it is so.

[SZbNAhL]

lets look at Violetta real quick... she's a cousin of Tarvek but she does not seem to have any status. My assumption is that her mother was one of Terebitha's younger daughters and Violetta was born out of wedlock. Being an illegitmate child invalidates any claim she might have by blood and so Violetta becomes a servant of the family.

Not getting into the rest of the speculation right now, but I don't think Violetta's lower status could be from something as recent as the circumstances of her own birth. Her branch of the family has served Tarvek's for generations.

[slayerx]

Not getting into the rest of the speculation right now, but I don't think Violetta's lower status could be from something as recent as the circumstances of her own birth. Her branch of the family has served Tarvek's for generations.

I actually forgot that detail, but this a detail that doesn't really seem to make sense since i seem to recall Violetta referring to Terebitha as "grandma". Odd that she would call her grandma if she wasn't actually her grandmother

Though it is possible that both could be true... Violetta's mother could be the youngest daughter of Terebitha, but (possibly ignoring arranged marriages) married a man from the branch family (which lost their claim to the crown generations ago due to marriage shenanigans). So even though Violletta is a granddaughter of Terebitha like Tarvek, she doesn't get any claim and is instead raised as a full member of her father's family.

[geoduck]

Unless the Foglios spring some new claimant on us, which I hope they don't at this point, it's pretty likely that Tarvek and Gil are the two front-runners for the Storm King title. The novels play it up more than the comic, but the fact that Boris can call Gil "your highness" when Gil takes over the Empire means that he's of royal birth, making him much more palatable to the rest of Europan nobility.

[HandofShadows]

The "Your Highness" from Boris is something that Klaus had him do. Gil is a Prince. But of Skifander. Remember Zeetha is a Princess and she is Gil's sister.

[DeTess]

This has probably been brought up already, but wasn't the last storm king married to a Heterodyne? If there's a child there that continued the Heterodyne line, then that would make them decent claimants as well. My money is going to be on Agatha and Tarvek being the main front-runners for the title, which would also go a bit further to explain why 'marry a (fake) heterodyne' was an important step in the plans of the storm-king conspiracies.

[Rogar Demonblud]

That particular wedding never came off, since the bride disappeared.

Tarvek's claim is through his mother. Most likely, Aaronev was her cousin (royals tending to marry cousins to keep the blood line pure). I suspect everyone calls Terebitha grandmother because she told them to--remember the other two Smoke Knights in Paris also referred to her as such when discussing the party.

[Traab]

Yeah but the point was, if the "storm king" marries a "heterodyne" it strengthens the claim to the throne because now its from both directions. Both lines with a claim to the throne are now united in marriage.

[Rogar Demonblud]

Heterodynes don't have a claim on the throne just because a girl from their family was selected as Royal Breeding Stock. The only claimants are those descended from Andronicus Valois, probably illegitimately since we haven't heard anything about his being married but have had multiple references to his being an Alpha-grade womanizer.

[Traab]

Heterodynes don't have a claim on the throne just because a girl from their family was selected as Royal Breeding Stock. The only claimants are those descended from Andronicus Valois, probably illegitimately since we haven't heard anything about his being married but have had multiple references to his being an Alpha-grade womanizer.

And if he got his heterodyne wife preggers? Wouldnt that mean whatever descendants come from that would have a link to the throne? From how he behaved in paris he loved her dearly, and certainly had more than a single interaction with her. Its entirely possible that agathas great great great etc grandmother was married to the storm king and thus she is descended from that line as well as the heterodynes. And so would have a line to the throne.

[Divayth Fyr]

And if he got his heterodyne wife preggers? Wouldnt that mean whatever descendants come from that would have a link to the throne? From how he behaved in paris he loved her dearly, and certainly had more than a single interaction with her. Its entirely possible that agathas great great great etc grandmother was married to the storm king and thus she is descended from that line as well as the heterodynes. And so would have a line to the throne.

Still an extremely weak claim, requiring that not only he got Euphrosynia pregnant before the wedding, but also that she didn't actually disappear, but returned to her family to give birth. Which is a version supported by nothing we know of. And even if all that happened, the child would be illegitimate, and we don't have a clue on how the laws would work with that.

[PraetorDragoon]

The Stormking-Heterodyne marriage claim is mainly because of the old stories. The Heterodynes can't claim, but if you have a claim and marry the Heterodyne, you make your claim stronger.

[Traab]

Still an extremely weak claim, requiring that not only he got Euphrosynia pregnant before the wedding, but also that she didn't actually disappear, but returned to her family to give birth. Which is a version supported by nothing we know of. And even if all that happened, the child would be illegitimate, and we don't have a clue on how the laws would work with that.

Honestly everything is very vague at this point. From exact line of heredity between tarvek and marty, to who or what could be the source of the third person with the best connection, to how the laws of succession works. All we are doing now is tossing out theories. Im just saying that he was KNOWN to be with Euph (I aint spelling that full name) and setup to marry her. That means any children she may have had would be automatically more acceptable than any mystery claimant descended from whatever random priestess he might have boinked while on break in between military campaigns. We have NO IDEA what truly went on during the time of the storm king. We have gotten hints, confused accounts, signs of betrayal from van rjinn and the heterodynes, a mystery death that wasnt a death, its a god awful mess. Did it ever establish he married her? Or was he arranged to do so and besotted by her but died before they got hitched?