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  1. - Top - End - #1
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    NecromancerGuy

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    biggrin Only First Level Goblins: Ideas for a Low Level Goblin Campaign

    So an interesting idea for a goblin based campaign popped into my mind while I was looking into some variants for low level games...


    The premise:

    Spoiler: Explanation
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    Players take the on role of first level goblins in a colony deep within the forest at the edge of your standard "civilized human kingdom."

    This goblin colony is forced to contend with the day-to-day troubles of fending off wild animals, monsters, and the occasional intervention from wandering adventurers speaking in their strange human tongue.

    The players themselves are the best of the best—distinguished first level goblins with the elite array.

    While their goals would ultimately be up to them to decide, I imagine the starting directive from the prophetic village elder would be something to the tune of "survive, thrive, and expand our territory whenever possible."

    Aspects of their narrative progression could include unifying nearby goblin tribes, taming beasts, raiding local settlements, and stockpiling supplies from the adventurers they defeat.



    The proposed mechanics:

    Only first level goblins

    Spoiler: Explanation
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    While the intent here isn't necessarily to make this campaign a "character grinder," I like the idea of the game's focus being on the legacy of the goblin community as a whole rather than the exploits of any individual player.

    As such, I'd like to keep character creation/building simple so that if and when characters do kick the bucket, another otherwise nameless goblin can quickly step forward as their successor.

    I want players to feel like they're playing as the canon fodder that d&d goblins have always been—the low level mooks that newbie adventurers can chew through for breakfast.



    The campaign takes place within an e6 world

    Spoiler: Explanation
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    Although the goblins themselves could only ever reach first level, I like the idea of enemies capping out at a certain point as well.

    All else equal, it just narrows the focus some, and makes the mundane, low level nature of the campaign that much more relevant.



    NPC class options and progression via feats

    Spoiler: Explanation
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    Not exactly sure on this one yet, but I'm tempted to grant characters the option of an npc class (either expert or warrior), the elite array, and a few bonus feats/traits/etc. (perhaps core only?) to define themselves with.

    Perhaps once in a while—say one time in twenty—an upcoming goblin elite will be graced with the skills of an adept and become a fearsome weapon of divine might championing the goblin cause.

    The grizzled goblin veterans that survive multiple encounters would have the chance to gain additional feats, prestige within their clan, and weightier claims to the best loot.



    Make use of the Vitality & Wound Points variant

    Spoiler: Explanation
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    While I do want the players to feel like goblin mooks, I would at least like them to feel like the goblin mooks that make any passing adventurers stop and think "oh, that one must be the leader."

    While a crit would still likely spell their end, I'd at least like the players to be able to take an arrow to the knee and live to tell about it.

    Their unnamed goblin brethren, though? Mooks through and through.




    Thoughts? Suggestions? I feel like something like this could be a lot of fun with the right group.

  2. - Top - End - #2
    Ettin in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: Only First Level Goblins: Ideas for a Low Level Goblin Campaign

    Have you considered the Pathfinder module We Be Goblins which deals with precisely this scenario?

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    NecromancerGuy

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    Default Re: Only First Level Goblins: Ideas for a Low Level Goblin Campaign

    Quote Originally Posted by Saintheart View Post
    Have you considered the Pathfinder module We Be Goblins which deals with precisely this scenario?
    Huh. Quite relevant, that.

    (Thanks for bringing it to my attention. )

    That said...I'd still love to hear any additional thoughts/suggestions on the matter you folks out there might have.

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    Devil

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    Default Re: Only First Level Goblins: Ideas for a Low Level Goblin Campaign

    being a bit generus with the stats for your stated goal..


    personaly i would say EMBRACE your inner goblin.

    Standard point buy with goblin racials only. for stats, so if somthings great other stuff is going to be crap.

    you arer the weak, level 1 starting. PC class alowed, but the ENTIRE world starts at Level 3 (eception of kidds and livestock) any intelegent race Int 3+ gets bumped up to ECL 3

    Embrace the inner discord.....
    Goblins are supposted to comeat with each other internaly for breading rights, the femalles run the harems. Backsabing and ambushes should be the norm....


    paranoya rules!!!

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    Ettin in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: Only First Level Goblins: Ideas for a Low Level Goblin Campaign

    Well, let's talk about the goblin race, since that's what everyone's going to be:

    -2 Strength, +2 Dexterity, -2 Charisma.
    Small size: +1 bonus to Armor Class, +1 bonus on attack rolls, +4 bonus on Hide checks, -4 penalty on grapple checks, lifting and carrying limits ¾ those of Medium characters.
    A goblin’s base land speed is 30 feet.
    Darkvision out to 60 feet.
    +4 racial bonus on Move Silently and Ride checks.
    Automatic Languages: Common, Goblin. Bonus Languages: Draconic, Elven, Giant, Gnoll, Orc.
    Favored Class: Rogue.


    So: Darkvision, Small bonuses to combat without suffering a movement penalty, +4 to Hide, Move Silently, and Ride. +2 DEX, -2 STR and CHA. Assuming max skill ranks, that's a level 1 character with at least a +9 in Move Silently and a +11 in Hide before you factor the actual stats into it. So goblin rogues working at night are going to be solid.

    Mounted combat actually is interesting too. Ride keys off DEX, so that's an instant +5 just from racial bonuses. If you be a bit generous and let them take Saddleback out of PGtF, they can take 10 on Ride checks all the time, which means they can use their Ride check as their Saving Throw, and since they pull a 15 without rolling, they can use their mounts as cover for another +4 to AC. And it's then off down the Mounted Combat path; a goblin charger would be kind of cool.

    Outside a rogue build, I'd be generous with the flaw feats or even offer a freebie. Rangers could work with crossbows, but crossbow archery is heavy on the feats. Mage and cleric aren't disadvantaged by nerfing their operative stats. Fighters, make the Tome of Battle available - Warblade 1s are doable, especially if they pick up Rapid Assault and Punishing Stance for the hilarity of a tiny goblin running in screaming at you with a longsword two-handed and suddenly doing 1d8+2d6+4 on damage, then switching to Sapphire Nightmare Blade and/or Emerald Razor.

    EDIT: In terms of guidance, level 1 is the level at which you can actually add at least a little meaningful resource management to killing things. Not only do they have to traipse around the woods looking for stuff for the tribe, they have to support themselves by foraging if they're out away from their base overnight or longer. Thus, Survival checks at least. You can also meaningfully track encumbrance since they're down to 3/4 of what a Medium creature carries, i.e. they're going to have to travel light, or find mounts or a wagon, and likely set up base camps to leave their stuff behind before raiding a farmhouse or something. They might be out literally mapping (or exploring, anyway) the forest to see whether there are more secure locations for the small tribe. Things like that.

    That aside, at level 1 I suspect a good few encounters should be classic old "surround the big target and perform beatdowns." A Giant Centipede shouldn't be anything to sniff at, or indeed something as prosaic as a wild boar. Even bringing down an elk (use bison stats) could be a plan in itself for these little guys. There's another Pathfinder module - Ironfang Invasion - the first book of which is all about surviving in a forest on low-ish resources, and it's geared to level 1 characters. Maybe take a look there.

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    Default Re: Only First Level Goblins: Ideas for a Low Level Goblin Campaign

    This sounds hilarious. The right table would have a hoot with this.

    I agree with the above suggestion to start with the standard, rather than elite, array. Gobbos gotta earn their success!

    Since it's an E6 world, maybe allow for the PCs to advance in levels? But they can only ever take the 1st level of a class. Forex: Rogue 1/Fighter 1/Marshal 1/Goblin Paragon 1, etc.

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    Default Re: Only First Level Goblins: Ideas for a Low Level Goblin Campaign

    First off love the idea very Re:Monster! Second if your are playing online I would love to join in!

    Finally here are my thoughts:

    Here is a list of what I think is all goblins though I might be wrong, personally I think it would be hilarious to add in Bakemono into the game even if just as monsters roaming the forest that could be tamed. Mostly I have always wanted to play as a Bakemono...
    Spoiler: Goblin Races
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    Bakemono (OA p.146) Small Humanoid (Goblinoid, Shadowlands) LA +0
    Bhuka (Sa p.39) Medium Humanoid (Goblinoid) LA +0
    Blue Small Humanoid (Goblinoid, Psionic) LA +1
    Bugbear Medium Humanoid (Goblinoid) LA +1 (3 RHD)
    Goblin Small Humanoid (Goblinoid) LA +0
    Goblin, Air Small Humanoid (Goblinoid) LA +0
    Goblin, Arctic Small Humanoid (Goblinoid) LA +0
    Goblin, Aquatic Small Humanoid (Aquatic, Goblinoid) LA +0
    Goblin, Dekanter (MoF p.53) Medium (Monstrous?) Humanoid (Goblinoid) LA +3 (2 RHD)
    Goblin, Desert Small Humanoid (Goblinoid) LA +0
    Goblin, Forestkith (MM3 p.64) Small Humanoid (Goblinoid) LA +1
    Goblin, Jungle Small Humanoid (Goblinoid) LA +0
    Goblin, Snow (FR p.136) Small Humanoid (Goblinoid) LA +1
    Goblinoid, Vril (DotU p.123) Small Humanoid (Goblinoid) LA +0 (?)
    Goblyn (Dragon 339 p.55) Medium Humanoid (Goblinoid) LA +2 (4 RHD)
    Hobgoblin Medium Humanoid (Goblinoid) LA +1
    Hobgoblin, Fire Medium Humanoid (Goblinoid) LA +1
    Hobgoblin, Spellscourge (MM5 p.85) Medium Monstrous Humanoid (Goblinoid) LA +2 (5 RHD)
    Hobgoblin, Sunscorch (DM p.9) Medium Humanoid (Dragonblood, Goblinoid) LA +1
    Hobgoblin, Warcaster (MM5 p.86) Medium Monstrous Humanoid (Goblinoid) LA +3 (4 RHD)
    Hobgoblin, Warsoul (MM5 p.87) Medium Monstrous Humanoid (Goblinoid) LA +4 (10 RHD)
    Norker (Dragon 343, p.53) Small Humanoid (Goblinoid) LA +1
    Varag (MM4 p.168) Medium Humanoid (Goblinoid) LA +2 (3 RHD)


    I think this will be very resource driven game and Saintheart has the right idea of that.

    Rather then leveling maybe look at giving skills, feats, and or special abilities out for combat every so often to show some semblance of improvement. Maybe give a 'point' for every 100ex = 1 point = 1 skill point, 5 points = feat, 10 points = other ability? something like that, it would allow players to try and horde points to power up or be skill monkeys as they choose.

    Another fun thing might be to slowly award more goblins to each player to really get that goblin horde feel. Also I would agree that most of the goblins shouldn't have the elite array, but maybe every once in a while. For example every time a player gets a new goblin whether it is because one died or they are being granted a bonus goblin roll d100 and on a 90+ roll they get elite array (or maybe can choose to have a nonstandard goblin?).
    Last edited by liquidformat; 2020-10-21 at 12:07 PM.

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    NecromancerGuy

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    Default Re: Only First Level Goblins: Ideas for a Low Level Goblin Campaign

    Quote Originally Posted by Morty_Jhones View Post
    being a bit generus with the stats for your stated goal..


    personaly i would say EMBRACE your inner goblin.

    Standard point buy with goblin racials only. for stats, so if somthings great other stuff is going to be crap.
    Quote Originally Posted by thorr-kan View Post
    I agree with the above suggestion to start with the standard, rather than elite, array. Gobbos gotta earn their success!

    You know, I think you're absolutely right.

    I like the idea of goblins that are highly skilled in some areas being absolute trash in others. It gives some mechanical reasoning to the random, discordant nature you often see detailed in their fluff.

    Sticking with the point buy of the standard array (15) and factoring in goblin racials would really make the players think about maxing out some ability scores at the expense of others.

    It feels like this would do a good job of creating more distinct characters as well, not unlike the randomly generated captains you see generated in Shadow of Mordor and Shadow of War. (To be honest, that's the sort of feeling I'd like to achieve with these goblin elites.)



    Quote Originally Posted by Morty_Jhones View Post
    Embrace the inner discord.....
    Goblins are supposted to comeat with each other internaly for breading rights, the femalles run the harems. Backsabing and ambushes should be the norm....


    paranoya rules!!!

    Ha, fair. I will say I'd probably be going for something of a silly, yet grounded vibe for the campaign with a fair amount of black humor and meta commentary sprinkled in. Not enough of the latter two elements to be a full-on parody, but enough to keep things fun.

    This all said, I don't feel the need to make goblins seem quite as vicious as they are in the Pathfinder setting—though I suppose that's really up to the players to decide.

    At least as a starting point, though, I'd like focus more on their gullibility, superstitiousness, selfishness, and the balancing act they maintain between their cowardice and pride.



    Quote Originally Posted by Saintheart View Post
    In terms of guidance, level 1 is the level at which you can actually add at least a little meaningful resource management to killing things. Not only do they have to traipse around the woods looking for stuff for the tribe, they have to support themselves by foraging if they're out away from their base overnight or longer. Thus, Survival checks at least. You can also meaningfully track encumbrance since they're down to 3/4 of what a Medium creature carries, i.e. they're going to have to travel light, or find mounts or a wagon, and likely set up base camps to leave their stuff behind before raiding a farmhouse or something. They might be out literally mapping (or exploring, anyway) the forest to see whether there are more secure locations for the small tribe. Things like that.
    Quote Originally Posted by liquidformat View Post
    I think this will be very resource driven game and Saintheart has the right idea of that.
    Another fun thing might be to slowly award more goblins to each player to really get that goblin horde feel.

    Agreed, agreed, agreed. This is where I think things would really shine.

    With limits on advancement that individual goblins can hope to attain, the real focus shifts toward what can be done to maintain and improve the tribe as a whole.

    Essentially I'd like players to start out with next to nothing: tattered goblin rags and their choice of a pointy stick (improvised spear), a sharpish rock (improvised dagger), or a beating log (improvised club). Maybe one knick-knack worth a few silver pieces that serves as their life-long treasure.

    Finding a way to produce/obtain armor, ranged weapons, food, and shelter would be a big factor in establishing their initial foothold.

    While I imagine the colony would start fairly small (~20 goblins, an elder, and the PCs), I definitely second the idea of taking the colony's growth into account.

    Since the campaign would likely span weeks/months/years in-game, I'd probably look at developing some sort of growth rate equation based that factors in birth rate, death rate, outside recruiting, and the overall health/prosperity of their colony.



    Quote Originally Posted by Morty_Jhones View Post
    you arer the weak, level 1 starting. PC class alowed, but the ENTIRE world starts at Level 3 (eception of kidds and livestock) any intelegent race Int 3+ gets bumped up to ECL 3
    Quote Originally Posted by thorr-kan View Post
    Since it's an E6 world, maybe allow for the PCs to advance in levels? But they can only ever take the 1st level of a class. Forex: Rogue 1/Fighter 1/Marshal 1/Goblin Paragon 1, etc.

    Hmm...to be honest, I'm a bit hesitant to offer PC levels to goblin characters.

    I really do want the players themselves to feel like mooks with a couple extra tricks up their sleeves, not standard PCs that just so happen to be goblins.

    I like the idea of true magic-users (adepts) being a rarity; something of a freak accident that makes spells seem that much more potent. (As a side note, I'd probably grant adepts the ability choose their spells from the cleric spell list, rather than the smaller list usually available to the class.)

    That said, for initial character creation, I'm thinking of something along the lines of offering at least 3-5 starting feats, a trait, and two flaws (randomly rolled post-creation) to give each starting elite a bit more depth.

    However, I do think I would see about allowing one of those feats to be selected from the "bonus" feats listed in the srd entry for generic classes, just to keep things interesting.

    Thinking on it a bit more, I'd probably see about opening up feat options from other non-core sources, but I'd have to look a bit more into which ones would be setting appropriate.



    Quote Originally Posted by liquidformat View Post
    Here is a list of what I think is all goblins though I might be wrong
    For example every time a player gets a new goblin whether it is because one died or they are being granted a bonus goblin roll d100 and on a 90+ roll they get elite array (or maybe can choose to have a nonstandard goblin?).
    Haha, oh dear, this could open up some fun narratives throughout the game.

    I can imagine the players going out to explore the neighboring goblin territories and meeting the exotic, totally-not-pop-culture-referenced tribes therein.

    - The desert goblins in their sloppy, mud-walled fortress village declaring that there is no war in Goblin-sing-say.

    - The snow goblins of the Fright Watch to the north, holding vigil over an ancient frozen wall left in place by a long dead necromancer, keeping at bay the small gaggle of zombified goblins beyond.

    - The jungle goblins of Goblinsgard to the south, serving the white goblin Gob-umon and known far and wide for their fearsome worg mounts.

    ...in short, yes, I do agree that opening other goblin racial variants over time could be a fun way to mix things up.
    Last edited by BlackOnyx; 2020-10-21 at 05:23 PM.

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    OrcBarbarianGuy

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    Default Re: Only First Level Goblins: Ideas for a Low Level Goblin Campaign

    Quote Originally Posted by BlackOnyx View Post
    Hmm...to be honest, I'm a bit hesitant to offer PC levels to goblin characters.

    I really do want the players themselves to feel like mooks with a couple extra tricks up their sleeves, not standard PCs that just so happen to be goblins.

    I like the idea of true magic-users (adepts) being a rarity; something of a freak accident that makes spells seem that much more potent. (As a side note, I'd probably grant adepts the ability choose their spells from the cleric spell list, rather than the smaller list usually available to the class.)

    That said, for initial character creation, I'm thinking of something along the lines of offering at least 3-5 starting feats, a trait, and two flaws (randomly rolled post-creation) to give each starting elite a bit more depth.

    However, I do think I would see about allowing one of those feats to be selected from the "bonus" feats listed in the srd entry for generic classes, just to keep things interesting.

    Thinking on it a bit more, I'd probably see about opening up feat options from other non-core sources, but I'd have to look a bit more into which ones would be setting appropriate.
    Rather than using actual caster classes or trying to modify the adept why not just use the Generic Spellcaster it isn't game breaking with only one level and allows for the magically gifted goblins to be unique compared to each other.

    Heck you could just run with using all three generic classes rather than npc classes or player classes, the generics are more powerful than NPC since they will get a class feature but not as powerful as most normal classes.

    Another option that could be interesting rather than giving them adept or generic spellcaster you could give them Magical Training feat from Player's Guide to Faerûn which gives the character an arcane caster level of 1 and either treats them as a wizard giving them a spellbook and 3 0 level spells they can prepare and cast, or as a sorcerer with 3 0 level spells they can spontaneously cast. That keeps them as a mundane but gives them a little magic to work with. You could even step it up a notch and give them Precocious Apprentice on top of Magical Training to give them a slight bit of power.

    Quote Originally Posted by BlackOnyx View Post
    Haha, oh dear, this could open up some fun narratives throughout the game.

    I can imagine the players going out to explore the neighboring goblin territories and meeting the exotic, totally-not-pop-culture-referenced tribes therein.

    - The desert goblins in their sloppy, mud-walled fortress village declaring that there is no war in Goblin-sing-say.

    - The snow goblins of the Fright Watch to the north, holding vigil over an ancient frozen wall left in place by a long dead necromancer, keeping at bay the small gaggle of zombified goblins beyond.

    - The jungle goblins of Goblinsgard to the south, serving the white goblin Gob-umon and known far and wide for their fearsome worg mounts.

    ...in short, yes, I do agree that opening other goblin racial variants over time could be a fun way to mix things up.
    Or visit David Bowie The Goblin King in his labyrinth city!

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    Default Re: Only First Level Goblins: Ideas for a Low Level Goblin Campaign

    Does it have to be D&D? I'd like to suggest Goblinville, a lightweight system made for playing exactly that premise.

    Character creation is collaborative, each character gets its own field of sort-of-expertise, and the system as a whole is really cleverly put together and is really fun to play.
    Hector Morris Ashburnum-Whit - Curse of the Crimson Throne - IC / OoC
    Bosek of Kuru - A Falling Star - IC / OoC
    Gifu Lavoi - Heritage of Kings - IC / OoC

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    Default Re: Only First Level Goblins: Ideas for a Low Level Goblin Campaign

    I would make the players not simply stuck at first level. Have them play E1, so they are stuck at 1st level but get a bonus feat every 1000 exp.

    They are going to be SWIMMING in feats if they are routinely tackling level 6 characters. A level 6 character is a ER 6 encounter and would give them about a feat per two encounters.

    Of course any given encounter is likely to result in the death of one or more of the Goblins, much less if they can't isolate a single human adventurer and attack with a plan.

    And the setting should have some big overarching thing happening that the players just do not care about at all. Like, have a lich king some distance away start attempting to take over the world or something. Keep it somewhat distant, but all the real heroic parties have run off to deal with that and now it's only the oddball lone adventurers left to deal with things like oddly persistent and deadly goblins.

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    Default Re: Only First Level Goblins: Ideas for a Low Level Goblin Campaign

    Quote Originally Posted by BlackOnyx View Post
    Hmm...to be honest, I'm a bit hesitant to offer PC levels to goblin characters.

    I really do want the players themselves to feel like mooks with a couple extra tricks up their sleeves, not standard PCs that just so happen to be goblins.
    Yah know what, I can see the appeal of that. NPC or generic classes only would be really entertaining.

    I'm not sure this would work as a long-term campaign. But as a series of one-shots and/or a short-term campaign, I'd play.

    Let us know how it goes!

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    Default Re: Only First Level Goblins: Ideas for a Low Level Goblin Campaign

    There is a webcomic with a similar premise called Gobins. A group of goblins get tired of their people being seen as monsters and XP fodder so they become adventurers (one has a very poor grasp on how it works and takes 1/11 of all the basic classes).
    See my Extended Signature for my list of silly shenanigans.

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    Default Re: Only First Level Goblins: Ideas for a Low Level Goblin Campaign

    Quote Originally Posted by BlackOnyx View Post
    You know, I think you're absolutely right.

    I like the idea of goblins that are highly skilled in some areas being absolute trash in others. It gives some mechanical reasoning to the random, discordant nature you often see detailed in their fluff.

    Sticking with the point buy of the standard array (15) and factoring in goblin racials would really make the players think about maxing out some ability scores at the expense of others.
    A quick thought that you might find fun, if you want to go with relatively balanced but quite random stats, and have the potential for good scores balancing out the terrible:

    Each goblin starts with scores of 6 across the board.

    Roll 5d6. Each result puts a +4 in a stat, as follows:
    1: Strength
    2: Dexterity
    3: Constitution
    4: Intelligence
    5: Wisdom
    6: Charisma

    Then, roll another 3d6, with each result putting a +2 in a stat. If you'd like, after everything is rolled the player can swap two of their stats.

    If any result would push a stat past 18, reroll it.

    This gives an average result of 12, 12, 12, 10, 10, 10 - slightly above average goblin levels, but not elite array. However, it's going to give you some wild variance in what people are actually capable of.
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    Default Re: Only First Level Goblins: Ideas for a Low Level Goblin Campaign

    Quote Originally Posted by illyahr View Post
    There is a webcomic with a similar premise called Gobins. A group of goblins get tired of their people being seen as monsters and XP fodder so they become adventurers (one has a very poor grasp on how it works and takes 1/11 of all the basic classes).
    Re:Monster has a similar idea though the power level quickly jumps up since in that setting goblins can evolve into more powerful creatures like hobgoblins then ogres and so forth. I have been play around with the idea of a game based around that idea but it literally requires rewriting a lot of monsters to become progressions of each other...

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    Default Re: Only First Level Goblins: Ideas for a Low Level Goblin Campaign

    Quote Originally Posted by liquidformat View Post
    Rather than using actual caster classes or trying to modify the adept why not just use the Generic Spellcaster it isn't game breaking with only one level and allows for the magically gifted goblins to be unique compared to each other.

    Heck you could just run with using all three generic classes rather than npc classes or player classes, the generics are more powerful than NPC since they will get a class feature but not as powerful as most normal classes.
    Quote Originally Posted by thorr-kan View Post
    Yah know what, I can see the appeal of that. NPC or generic classes only would be really entertaining.

    Yeah, giving it some more thought, using those generic classes in lieu of npc classes shouldn't be an issue.

    If anything they give players a few more options to differentiate themselves as far as things like saves & spell options go. (The only small change I'd probably make is tacking on heavy armor proficiency for the generic warrior, whether or not it comes into play at the outset.)



    Quote Originally Posted by iquidformat View Post
    Or visit David Bowie The Goblin King in his labyrinth city!

    ...this could be a lot of fun.



    Quote Originally Posted by thorr-kan View Post
    I'm not sure this would work as a long-term campaign. But as a series of one-shots and/or a short-term campaign, I'd play.

    Yeah, it'd really depend on type of players present and whether or not they found settlement building to be an interesting enough endeavor.

    That said, I think the fact that it could be kept to a one-shot or short-term campaign isn't really a detriment; a DM could vary things up depending how deep or surface-level they wanted to keep it.


    Let us know how it goes!

    Not sure when it might end up playing out in practice (could be a fair while), but I'll keep that in mind.

    (If anyone else wants to take this idea and run it with their group, though, feel free to share your exploits as well!)



    Quote Originally Posted by DrMartin View Post
    Does it have to be D&D? I'd like to suggest Goblinville, a lightweight system made for playing exactly that premise.

    Character creation is collaborative, each character gets its own field of sort-of-expertise, and the system as a whole is really cleverly put together and is really fun to play.

    Hmm...interesting.

    While I am interested in seeing how this would play out under 3.5e rules, I'll certainly see about giving that system a look. (Being rules light, it might be a good option for groups that have a hard time meeting up regularly.)



    Quote Originally Posted by Fouredged Sword View Post
    I would make the players not simply stuck at first level. Have them play E1, so they are stuck at 1st level but get a bonus feat every 1000 exp.

    Yeah, that was the intent. Veteran goblins that do manage to survive encounters would be able to continue advancing themselves as time wore on. As in e6, feats would be the big way players could keep growing/differentiating themselves.


    They are going to be SWIMMING in feats if they are routinely tackling level 6 characters. A level 6 character is a ER 6 encounter and would give them about a feat per two encounters.

    Of course any given encounter is likely to result in the death of one or more of the Goblins, much less if they can't isolate a single human adventurer and attack with a plan.

    Ha, well, I didn't anticipate throwing 6th level adventurers at them right off the bat. That sounds more like an endgame scenario when the top brass of the human empire finally realizes they've become a threat.

    It'd be much more likely that they'd see a slow escalation in human forces as bigger and bigger bigwigs caught wind of their exploits.

    Start with a small contingent of town guards, move on to a couple aspiring first level adventurers, have the local nobility put out a notice when they don't return: something in that vein.

    In either situation though, I agree that divide and conquer will likely be their best line of approach. That, and making sure to continue operating in a way that makes outsiders continue to underestimate their abilities.


    And the setting should have some big overarching thing happening that the players just do not care about at all. Like, have a lich king some distance away start attempting to take over the world or something. Keep it somewhat distant, but all the real heroic parties have run off to deal with that and now it's only the oddball lone adventurers left to deal with things like oddly persistent and deadly goblins.

    Haha, I love the idea of stringing together an outside narrative with the bits and pieces they pick up from their exploits. (It'd a fun meta-narrative to add to keep the players interested, whether or not their characters care much about what's going on.)


    Quote Originally Posted by illyahr View Post
    There is a webcomic with a similar premise called Gobins. A group of goblins get tired of their people being seen as monsters and XP fodder so they become adventurers (one has a very poor grasp on how it works and takes 1/11 of all the basic classes).

    Oy vey. Thank you for the time sink. (As if I didn't have enough on my reading/watch list as is, haha.)

    While I imagine an only first level goblins campaign would be a bit more settlement based (rather than PC based), I'll definitely take a look through that for some further inspiration.
    Last edited by BlackOnyx; 2020-10-22 at 10:29 PM.

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    Default Re: Only First Level Goblins: Ideas for a Low Level Goblin Campaign

    Quote Originally Posted by BlackOnyx View Post

    While I imagine an only first level goblins campaign would be a bit more settlement based (rather than PC based), I'll definitely take a look through that for some further inspiration.
    Have the party be part of a community of a blue-skinned goblin variant living in giant mushroom-houses, and have the recurring villain of the campaign be an ogre shaman with a red cat familiar that wants to eat them. Each session they get to pick (or roll on a table) a quirk or ability and that becomes the name of the character they are going to play for that session
    Hector Morris Ashburnum-Whit - Curse of the Crimson Throne - IC / OoC
    Bosek of Kuru - A Falling Star - IC / OoC
    Gifu Lavoi - Heritage of Kings - IC / OoC

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    Default Re: Only First Level Goblins: Ideas for a Low Level Goblin Campaign

    I'd like to recommend another game that could be interesting for this premise:
    Kobolds ate my baby
    (as the name indicates, it is about Kobolds, but it would be easily refluffed)
    It calls itself the beer and pretzel rpg and is really great for one-shots

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    Default Re: Only First Level Goblins: Ideas for a Low Level Goblin Campaign

    Hall hail King torg!

    One should also mention that kobolds ate my baby is a game made for one shots, where characters have the lifespan of a ticking bomb and having a stack of character sheets printed out for replacement characters is almost mandatory :D
    Hector Morris Ashburnum-Whit - Curse of the Crimson Throne - IC / OoC
    Bosek of Kuru - A Falling Star - IC / OoC
    Gifu Lavoi - Heritage of Kings - IC / OoC

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    Default Re: Only First Level Goblins: Ideas for a Low Level Goblin Campaign

    Quote Originally Posted by Kapow View Post
    I'd like to recommend another game that could be interesting for this premise:
    Kobolds ate my baby
    (as the name indicates, it is about Kobolds, but it would be easily refluffed)
    It calls itself the beer and pretzel rpg and is really great for one-shots
    All Hail King Torg!
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    Default Re: Only First Level Goblins: Ideas for a Low Level Goblin Campaign

    The Goblinoids thread have much info which may be useful

    How about PC classes?
    I mean - Barbarian is a staple of tribal society

    Also - Goblin Beast template: at 1st level, whatever with 2+ HD may be more useful than NPC-class Goblin (presuming non-caster)

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    Default Re: Only First Level Goblins: Ideas for a Low Level Goblin Campaign

    Quote Originally Posted by DrMartin View Post
    Have the party be part of a community of a blue-skinned goblin variant living in giant mushroom-houses, and have the recurring villain of the campaign be an ogre shaman with a red cat familiar that wants to eat them. Each session they get to pick (or roll on a table) a quirk or ability and that becomes the name of the character they are going to play for that session

    This will be the tiny blue goblin village that appears in the intro scene before getting squashed underfoot by a standard goblin warrior as the Only First Level Goblins title card rolls.



    Quote Originally Posted by ShurikVch View Post
    The Goblinoids thread have much info which may be useful

    Hmm. Interesting read, thank you for that.

    I hadn't really given it much thought before, but it is a shame that d&d goblinoids aren't really developed as much as some of the other playable races/cultures. (Though I suppose that just leaves more things open for interpretation on the DM's part.)

    One thought I find myself enjoying is the the idea that goblins don't reproduce sexually; it's more of a Gremlins scenario where new goblins spawn from buds that adult goblins produce from time to time. From what I've heard, it seems greenskins in warhammer take a similar approach.


    How about PC classes?
    I mean - Barbarian is a staple of tribal society

    A fair point...but that said, I still find a bit of allure in the simplicity of only offering NPC or generic classes.

    I like the idea of having players build characters that—one on one—shouldn't really expect to hold a candle to your typical first level player. It's the combined leverage of their individual quirks & the colony's overall numbers that should really win the day in the end.

    The way I see it, goblins with PC levels are goblins best suited to be adventurers. "Only First Level Goblins" is about the rank-and-file goblins that stay behind.


    Also - Goblin Beast template: at 1st level, whatever with 2+ HD may be more useful than NPC-class Goblin (presuming non-caster)

    Interesting. I like the idea of exploring more goblin specific creatures/templates/mechanics in the campaign, player options aside.

    It seems Pathfinder also has a "mutant goblin" template which actually sounds sort of cool as well.

    Going back to the discussion a few lines back; perhaps "chaos & mutation" could be a good tagline for developing the goblinoid races. Like demons, but in a less explicitly destructive/evil sense and more of a natural one. (Reminiscent of fungi, for lack of better analogy.)
    Last edited by BlackOnyx; 2020-10-27 at 01:03 AM.

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