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  1. - Top - End - #481
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    AssassinGuy

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    Default Re: Grrl Power VI: Stripping The Hero Doesnt Work

    I think this is leading to "you've lawyered your way out of open conflict, but i think its best if you maybe dont be on earth for a long while Cora." Because in a lot of ways she's as problematic as Max for her ability to shut down threats and conflicts.
    “Evil is evil. Lesser, greater, middling, it's all the same. Proportions are negotiated, boundaries blurred. I'm not a pious hermit, I haven't done only good in my life. But if I'm to choose between one evil and another, then I prefer not to choose at all.”

  2. - Top - End - #482
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    Default Re: Grrl Power VI: Stripping The Hero Doesnt Work

    Quote Originally Posted by Keltest View Post
    I think this is leading to "you've lawyered your way out of open conflict, but i think its best if you maybe dont be on earth for a long while Cora." Because in a lot of ways she's as problematic as Max for her ability to shut down threats and conflicts.
    I dont even think it takes much lawyering. She literally saved an officer of the laws life. Aint nobody going to press charges against her in that scenario. All she has to do is say, "When I reached the area the perp had his gun pointed at the officers head and his own men were trying to stop him from pulling the trigger and failing. So I opened fire and put him down with a single shot." Even if technically she may have had a dozen nonlethal methods possible, a life threatening situation is pretty clear cut. Yes his death was more... spectacular than you normally expect, but he still died fast and with minimal pain. Its not like he died screaming while his body was dragged and compressed into a micro singularity in his shoulder over the course of 30 seconds.

    All that said, yeah, pretty sure she is either going to be asked to leave or is just not allowed out on law enforcement scenarios anymore. Because while not illegal, its also not the way they want to handle things. Also, I get the feeling that one of Coras main purposes in this story is to showcase as many hilariously over the top weapons as are sci fi possible. I figure the next gun turns the target inside out and ties the skeleton into a nice macramé design. The one after that converts soft tissue into bone eating acid. The final weapon copies the powers of trafalger d law and randomly swaps body parts around in a 10 foot sphere while somehow keeping the target/s alive.
    "Interdum feror cupidine partium magnarum Europae vincendarum"
    Translation: "Sometimes I get this urge to conquer large parts of Europe."

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  3. - Top - End - #483
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    Default Re: Grrl Power VI: Stripping The Hero Doesnt Work

    Yeah, Cora's not going to be punished for this, not in any sort of legal sense. Maybe in the sense of not being brought along on missions unless/until she's officially part of Archon and thus has to meet their standards, but I doubt more than that.

    I do think she'll be punished in that sense, because I fully believe she deliberately killed this guy, and Maxima can tell. And Maxima is upset that Sydney was traumatized by the experience. And Cora could have easily avoided that with less over the top ordnance.

    That being said, besides the trauma, I don't think Cora really made a bad decision. They do still have prisoners in the goons, plus whatever Concerta can tell them. And who knows what contingencies the man had on him? He could've used Concentia as a hostage, or had a panic button, or teleported away, ect.
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  4. - Top - End - #484
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    Default Re: Grrl Power VI: Stripping The Hero Doesnt Work

    The issue here is with Cora's choice of ordinance, not with her actions. If she'd just shot the guy with a conventional (or something resembling conventional) ammunition Maxima might have been annoyed the guy was dead but the decision would be perfectly justified. The 'unwinder' round, however, is the sort of thing that probably qualifies as an illegal weapon under any generalized interpretation of law you choose. It's use provides Archon with a perfect excuse to go through Cora's entire ordinance setup very thoroughly and decide exactly what she's allowed to even have on planet.

    Honestly, that was probably inevitable anyway. This whole incident is about unregulated alien tourism, and some form of regulation is pretty much inevitable following the wrap-up. Cora's actions, overall, are likely to result in considerably tighter controls on off-world weaponry than they might have otherwise.
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  5. - Top - End - #485
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    Default Re: Grrl Power VI: Stripping The Hero Doesnt Work

    Or at least attempts at tighter controls; the various Earth governments are pretty clearly salivating at the thought of getting their hands on as much alien tech as possible, which is going to hinder regulation. They're not going to block it coming in if there's a chance they can obtain it (buy, beg, borrow or steal, I doubt they care much).

    I honestly doubt that Cora will stick around in the long run; narratively, she overlaps too strongly with Dabbler, and her tech unbalances the status quo enough (especially since she doesn't seem to be nearly as cautious about spreading it as Dabbler is) that dealing with it and its repercussions would rapidly come to dominate the story, which doesn't seem to be the story Dave wants to tell.

    All that being said, from what little I understand, the unwinder round would be in a weird grey area, legally speaking. Most of the war-crime-type-weapons that I'm familiar with are of the sort that cause undue pain and/or suffering; if anything, the unwinder would be more humane than the average, since it's an instantaneous, apparently painless kill (beyond the initial impact, of course). That being said, it's so visceral and gross that it might get filed under 'war crimes' just for that.

    And it's hard not to feel kind of bad for Sydney here; she may like the notion of firing off a minigun, but nothing about her says she wants to fire it at anyone. It's actually a bit weird that they haven't put her through basic, since being able to cope with killing enemies is sort of important for military personnel.

    EDIT- weird from an in-story perspective, that is. Out-of-story, we tend to like our super-types to have a no-killing moral code, since pulling out all the stops leads to things like Miracleman, which tends to read like Lovecraftian horror, with unstoppable forces crushing feeble humanity while barely even aware of our presence. Well written? Sure, if sort of depressing. Superheroic? Eeeeeeh...
    Last edited by TeChameleon; 2021-03-02 at 05:38 AM.

  6. - Top - End - #486
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    Quote Originally Posted by TeChameleon View Post
    Or at least attempts at tighter controls; the various Earth governments are pretty clearly salivating at the thought of getting their hands on as much alien tech as possible, which is going to hinder regulation. They're not going to block it coming in if there's a chance they can obtain it (buy, beg, borrow or steal, I doubt they care much).

    I honestly doubt that Cora will stick around in the long run; narratively, she overlaps too strongly with Dabbler, and her tech unbalances the status quo enough (especially since she doesn't seem to be nearly as cautious about spreading it as Dabbler is) that dealing with it and its repercussions would rapidly come to dominate the story, which doesn't seem to be the story Dave wants to tell.

    All that being said, from what little I understand, the unwinder round would be in a weird grey area, legally speaking. Most of the war-crime-type-weapons that I'm familiar with are of the sort that cause undue pain and/or suffering; if anything, the unwinder would be more humane than the average, since it's an instantaneous, apparently painless kill (beyond the initial impact, of course). That being said, it's so visceral and gross that it might get filed under 'war crimes' just for that.

    And it's hard not to feel kind of bad for Sydney here; she may like the notion of firing off a minigun, but nothing about her says she wants to fire it at anyone. It's actually a bit weird that they haven't put her through basic, since being able to cope with killing enemies is sort of important for military personnel.

    EDIT- weird from an in-story perspective, that is. Out-of-story, we tend to like our super-types to have a no-killing moral code, since pulling out all the stops leads to things like Miracleman, which tends to read like Lovecraftian horror, with unstoppable forces crushing feeble humanity while barely even aware of our presence. Well written? Sure, if sort of depressing. Superheroic? Eeeeeeh...
    She HAS been through basic, we have seen plenty of it. She gets physical training, range training, she has classes on a wide variety of subjects. About the only thing she has been missing that I can tell is formation marching which... isnt really a thing she needs to learn. The problem is, she hasnt finished it yet but her powers keep being needed for emergency scenarios that get her called out. And its not helped that she has seen enough action that most regular military units would have been sent home on leave to recover. But again, her powers are unique enough that they cant easily switch her out for however long would be ideal for her to recover and recuperate. You could easily turn this into a sad story about sydneys slow descent into psychological breakdown as she is constantly exposed to the horrors of military action without real rest because of how needed she is in the field, but I doubt dave is going that way so i expect it to be taken care of in a similar way as her time in space. A couple comics of her having issues, a couple talking to frost, then more or less done with that and she moves on.
    "Interdum feror cupidine partium magnarum Europae vincendarum"
    Translation: "Sometimes I get this urge to conquer large parts of Europe."

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  7. - Top - End - #487
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    Default Re: Grrl Power VI: Stripping The Hero Doesnt Work

    I think Sydney was going to be messed up even if Cora hadn't liquified the bad guy right in front of her eyes. But her first reaction was of course to reach for the Fuggedaboutit syringe. It sure didn't help.

    I also don't think Maxima has the authority to ban Cora from the planet. And it would be hypocritical (and legally dubious) to physically assault Cora when she's not threatening anyone right now. Really, there's not much Maxima can do other than snarl at her and file a report asking the government to do something.

    Cora won't get invited on Archon outings any longer, and she may be OK with that - it's a big galaxy, filled with sexy manimals. Who needs Earth?
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  8. - Top - End - #488
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    Default Re: Grrl Power VI: Stripping The Hero Doesnt Work

    Quote Originally Posted by Shining Wrath View Post
    Really, there's not much Maxima can do other than snarl at her and file a report asking the government to do something.
    Which would be effectively nothing. At Cora's tech level, the only counter to an offensive Cora is ... Archon.

    Cora won't get invited on Archon outings any longer, and she may be OK with that - it's a big galaxy, filled with sexy manimals. Who needs Earth?
    And that doesn't mean much, not when there are other Nations (Galtyn, say?) that would be happy to have an alien mercenary on contract.
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  9. - Top - End - #489
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    Default Re: Grrl Power VI: Stripping The Hero Doesnt Work

    Quote Originally Posted by sihnfahl View Post
    Which would be effectively nothing. At Cora's tech level, the only counter to an offensive Cora is ... Archon.


    And that doesn't mean much, not when there are other Nations (Galtyn, say?) that would be happy to have an alien mercenary on contract.
    Well, if Archon declares Cora persona non grata on Earth, other nations have to think twice before employing her. The USG has various ways of making its displeasure known short of invasion. Before unleashing Maxima, they'd unleash Arianna, so to speak.
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  10. - Top - End - #490
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    Default Re: Grrl Power VI: Stripping The Hero Doesnt Work

    Quote Originally Posted by Shining Wrath View Post
    Well, if Archon declares Cora persona non grata on Earth, other nations have to think twice before employing her. The USG has various ways of making its displeasure known short of invasion. Before unleashing Maxima, they'd unleash Arianna, so to speak.
    To say nothing of the fact that a significant number of western nations would almost certainly simply agree with the logic that they dont want a vigilante running around with weapons that turn people into lasagna and then spray them all over the room, independently of what Archon wants.
    “Evil is evil. Lesser, greater, middling, it's all the same. Proportions are negotiated, boundaries blurred. I'm not a pious hermit, I haven't done only good in my life. But if I'm to choose between one evil and another, then I prefer not to choose at all.”

  11. - Top - End - #491
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    Default Re: Grrl Power VI: Stripping The Hero Doesnt Work

    Quote Originally Posted by Shining Wrath View Post
    Well, if Archon declares Cora persona non grata on Earth, other nations have to think twice before employing her. The USG has various ways of making its displeasure known short of invasion. Before unleashing Maxima, they'd unleash Arianna, so to speak.
    Considering the massive advantage the US has via their salvaged space ship, I'm pretty sure other nations would be more than willing to take that risk.
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  12. - Top - End - #492
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    Default Re: Grrl Power VI: Stripping The Hero Doesnt Work

    It's also worth considering that some or even most of Sydney's state right now might be due to the bad reaction she had with the truth serum. She was already looking pretty bad even before Lasagna McGee threatened to shoot her and got killed.
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  13. - Top - End - #493
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    Default Re: Grrl Power VI: Stripping The Hero Doesnt Work

    Quote Originally Posted by PoeticallyPsyco View Post
    It's also worth considering that some or even most of Sydney's state right now might be due to the bad reaction she had with the truth serum. She was already looking pretty bad even before Lasagna McGee threatened to shoot her and got killed.
    Its i think, the second time she has been basically helpless in the hands of someone who would gladly kill her since she started in arcswat. First being sciona when the save point fired off. In all other scenarios she still had her orbs and was able to fight or protect herself. Even stuck in an alien world she had something she could DO about it. But total helplessness is a shocking thing in the face of a life threatening situation. It can really mess with your mind.
    "Interdum feror cupidine partium magnarum Europae vincendarum"
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  14. - Top - End - #494
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    Default Re: Grrl Power VI: Stripping The Hero Doesnt Work

    She is going to need to work on how to keep her orbs from getting yoinked like happened here, solving that would probably help her work through some of this.
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  15. - Top - End - #495
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    Default Re: Grrl Power VI: Stripping The Hero Doesnt Work

    Quote Originally Posted by Max_Killjoy View Post
    She is going to need to work on how to keep her orbs from getting yoinked like happened here, solving that would probably help her work through some of this.
    I honestly don't think there's much she could do. Even if she had an orb secured in her pocket at all times, Concretia could've just wrapped her body up instead.
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  16. - Top - End - #496
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    Default Re: Grrl Power VI: Stripping The Hero Doesnt Work

    Quote Originally Posted by Forum Explorer View Post
    I honestly don't think there's much she could do. Even if she had an orb secured in her pocket at all times, Concretia could've just wrapped her body up instead.
    Yeah, short of being in her shield at all times, there really isnt much she can do to stop sneak attacks.
    "Interdum feror cupidine partium magnarum Europae vincendarum"
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nerd-o-rama View Post
    Traab is yelling everything that I'm thinking already.
    "If you don't get those cameras out of my face, I'm gonna go 8.6 on the Richter scale with gastric emissions that'll clear this room."

  17. - Top - End - #497
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    Default Re: Grrl Power VI: Stripping The Hero Doesnt Work

    Cora's gun has 4 barrels. I wonder what was chambered in the fourth one? I'm going to guess an armor piercing round for hard targets. Which would have gone right through Lasagna McGee (name stolen) and carried on for who knows how long.

    And now we know why Cora let the sidekicks get away. They are leading Archon straight to HQ, after sanitization of course.

    Maxima knows she's lost this round (pun intended) but she doesn't like it.
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  18. - Top - End - #498
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    Default Re: Grrl Power VI: Stripping The Hero Doesnt Work

    Sydney looks like she's doing better as well. She's sassing Cora, which is a good sign.
    “Evil is evil. Lesser, greater, middling, it's all the same. Proportions are negotiated, boundaries blurred. I'm not a pious hermit, I haven't done only good in my life. But if I'm to choose between one evil and another, then I prefer not to choose at all.”

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    Default Re: Grrl Power VI: Stripping The Hero Doesnt Work

    Quote Originally Posted by Shining Wrath View Post
    Well, if Archon declares Cora persona non grata on Earth, other nations have to think twice before employing her. The USG has various ways of making its displeasure known short of invasion. Before unleashing Maxima, they'd unleash Arianna, so to speak.
    Which really doesn't matter in nations that don't really care what the USG thinks.

    Quote Originally Posted by Keltest View Post
    To say nothing of the fact that a significant number of western nations would almost certainly simply agree with the logic that they dont want a vigilante running around with weapons that turn people into lasagna and then spray them all over the room, independently of what Archon wants.
    There are other nations than western that would welcome alien tourism and mercenaries.

    A vigilante that has a lot of high tech that would help them end any insurgency faster by 'tagging' the ones that flee an altercation.

    Or even just 'tag' an anti-government protestor, watch where they go, what they do, who they come into contact with and then sweep them all up in the name of national security.


    And then consider superpowered observers. Can you imagine what someone like Krona could do if they just 'looked' at an alien spaceship?
    Last edited by sihnfahl; 2021-03-05 at 11:22 AM.
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    Default Re: Grrl Power VI: Stripping The Hero Doesnt Work

    And now, a romantic interlude featuring lip tusks. For some slightly creepy definitions of "romantic".
    This ... is my signature finishing move!

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    Default Re: Grrl Power VI: Stripping The Hero Doesnt Work

    Quote Originally Posted by Shining Wrath View Post
    And now, a romantic interlude featuring lip tusks. For some slightly creepy definitions of "romantic".
    Superheroes and even ill-defined contract-based superpowers, I can suspend my disbelief for.

    Dude making a pass at a woman by grinding into her butt in a completely inappropriate situation and having it well-received? Gonna file that under 'too far into the realm of the imaginary to be believed.'

  22. - Top - End - #502
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    Default Re: Grrl Power VI: Stripping The Hero Doesnt Work

    This has been a wasted week of updates.
    It is one thing to suspend your disbelief. It is another thing entirely to hang it by the neck until dead.

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    Default Re: Grrl Power VI: Stripping The Hero Doesnt Work

    Quote Originally Posted by Max_Killjoy View Post
    This has been a wasted week of updates.
    Has it? The punchline here was great.
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    Default Re: Grrl Power VI: Stripping The Hero Doesnt Work

    Quote Originally Posted by Dragonus45 View Post
    Has it? The punchline here was great.
    What punchline?

    Dave does two updates a week, and he wasted both this week on setting up a single sad trombone noise.
    Last edited by Max_Killjoy; 2021-03-11 at 09:37 AM.
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    The concern is not realism in speculative fiction, but rather the sense that a setting or story could be real, fostered by internal consistency and coherence.

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    Default Re: Grrl Power VI: Stripping The Hero Doesnt Work

    Quote Originally Posted by Max_Killjoy View Post
    What punchline?

    Dave does two updates a week, and he wasted both this week on setting up a single sad trombone noise.
    Huh, I didn't know he added sound into the comic anywhere. Must have missed it since I have the page muted at work. I figured he just spent the last two comics developing the side characters a little, expositing a little about the aliens mission and opinions about having to deal with Max again, and then a great joke about people and how stupid they can be.
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  26. - Top - End - #506
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    Default Re: Grrl Power VI: Stripping The Hero Doesnt Work

    Meh, its not easy to balance developing characters with advancing the storyline. Some people just really hate it when plot progression halts briefly to tell a joke, or to flesh out a side character in some way. Its understandable really, especially in a twice weekly updating comic.
    "Interdum feror cupidine partium magnarum Europae vincendarum"
    Translation: "Sometimes I get this urge to conquer large parts of Europe."

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    Default Re: Grrl Power VI: Stripping The Hero Doesnt Work

    The last bit of plot advancement was finding out that Cora was watching the henchmen and didn't just let them get away.
    And then we get flirting between two possibly-not-anatomically-compatible aliens. If these two are going to be recurring characters, it's an investment. If not, it's throwaway scripts for the funny.
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  28. - Top - End - #508
    Titan in the Playground
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    Default Re: Grrl Power VI: Stripping The Hero Doesnt Work

    Quote Originally Posted by Shining Wrath View Post
    The last bit of plot advancement was finding out that Cora was watching the henchmen and didn't just let them get away.
    And then we get flirting between two possibly-not-anatomically-compatible aliens. If these two are going to be recurring characters, it's an investment. If not, it's throwaway scripts for the funny.
    And its all of two comics. There is more to the comic than progressing the plot with every single page. Sometimes, its ok to make jokes.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nerd-o-rama View Post
    Traab is yelling everything that I'm thinking already.
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  29. - Top - End - #509
    Troll in the Playground
     
    Dragonus45's Avatar

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    Mar 2007
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    Default Re: Grrl Power VI: Stripping The Hero Doesnt Work

    Quote Originally Posted by Traab View Post
    And its all of two comics. There is more to the comic than progressing the plot with every single page. Sometimes, its ok to make jokes.
    Considering Dave said multiple times this is a gag comic with some plot and action added in rather then the other way around you might say there it's more then ok to make them.
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    If i had superpowers. I would go to conventions dressed as myself, and see if i got complimented on my authenticity.

  30. - Top - End - #510
    Ogre in the Playground
    Join Date
    Jul 2015

    Default Re: Grrl Power VI: Stripping The Hero Doesnt Work

    Quote Originally Posted by Dragonus45 View Post
    Considering Dave said multiple times this is a gag comic with some plot and action added in rather then the other way around you might say there it's more then ok to make them.
    Honestly, in some ways it's a vehicle to draw thinly-disguised pinups of whatever takes Dave's fancy with some gags added in to enable fun poses. This has led to some real character bloat though.

    I don't mind spending most of the time on jokes (though I certainly would say this week's funny banter was far from a comic highlight), but it would be better to spend less time with complete throw-away characters. The cast continues to balloon ever-further, making any advancement of the actual plot take longer and spreading such development as there is thinner and thinner across more people.
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