Sell me the Fighter.

[SociopathFriend]

People really seem to sleep on Fighters getting access to History, Insight, and Intimidation- not just Acrobatics, Athletics, and Survival.

Two of those are built on dealing with other people and the other is about as ripe for RP as they come.

[TeChameleon]

*shrug*

Currently playing a human champion (limited races at the start of the campaign, bleh...) and while I do find him a bit hard to RP at times- my DM is a bit too fond of attaching numbers to every RP attempt, which limits what I can actually do- he's still a valued member of the party simply because... well, because meatshield. 28 AC at level 8 is at least moderately decent, I think. Add in a Cloak of the Manta Ray for drown-proofing, and you're pretty much good to go.

If you're looking for a skillmonkey, yeah, as others have said, keep looking. But don't sell the ability to be da tankiest tank what ever tanked short, either. It can actually noticeably change the tone of the game when the rest of the party knows they have a reliable meatshield ready to take point.

[loki_ragnarock]

*shrug*

Currently playing a human champion (limited races at the start of the campaign, bleh...) and while I do find him a bit hard to RP at times- my DM is a bit too fond of attaching numbers to every RP attempt, which limits what I can actually do- he's still a valued member of the party simply because... well, because meatshield. 28 AC at level 8 is at least moderately decent, I think. Add in a Cloak of the Manta Ray for drown-proofing, and you're pretty much good to go.

If you're looking for a skillmonkey, yeah, as others have said, keep looking. But don't sell the ability to be da tankiest tank what ever tanked short, either. It can actually noticeably change the tone of the game when the rest of the party knows they have a reliable meatshield ready to take point.

I have questions about that AC. Mostly, how?

[Morty]

Having played a battlemaster fighter with a spear (reskinned rapier) and shield in a one-shot... it was alright. It wouldn't have been as fun if it hadn't been a combat-heavy one-shot. And the GM was liberal with short rests - if he hadn't been, I would've run out of maneuvers quickly and been reduced to poking things with basic attacks. The game also began and ended on level 4 - if it had gone to even level 5, casters would've got cool new toys and I'd have been stuck with the same maneuver list. I don't think battlemasters even get to pick new ones on level 5.

[Lokishade]

Fighters have access to all the weapons and all the armors and can use them with no penalty. They have few stats requirements, though you can choose to complexify if you so wish. Fighters are designed to be anything you want to be while cherry tapping the game with mundane means amidst all the chaos and magic. For an RPG, that's solid design.

But here's what I like best about Fighters. They are martials, and as such, they are everything casters cannot be, even with their magic: Unkillable. With heavy armor taken without one bit of penalty (I don't do stealth), you can wade around in a crowd of enemies like an idiot, just to rub your unkillableness in their faces. Ally downed? Nobody calls you an idiot anymore as you do that to save the Cleric. Sudden need to retreat? Just dash. Those five OAs will turn into five misses. Overdoing it? Dodge action and let your team plink at them from a distance because you've successfully drawn all the aggro. Also, being unlucky is not a problem, because you get the second highest hit die of the game. What would be suicide for casters is just another "I do that for a living" tale you tell in the tavern (which, I argue, makes you sexier than the frilly Bard).

But wait, there's more! We haven't touched the feats yet! Here's a non exhaustive list from the PHB alone, one of which can be yours right off the bat if you picked VHuman:
Polearm Master: OA anything that approaches you (don't forget to remind your DM), but you mostly take it for the extra bonus attack (uses a d4, but you max out STR at level 6, so you don't care). Limited to polearms, spears and even a plain long stick.
Sentinel: Pair with PAM for extra cheese. Use a reach weapon and the DM will hate you as you stop 5 foot reach enemies in their tracks... at 10 feet of you.
Crossbow expert: Extra attack, though limited to Hand Crossbow (again, you max out your primary stat at 6). Also, use ranged attacks like melee. And lastly, crossbows become machine guns.
Sharpshooter: Extra damage when hitting easy targets, quality of life for ranged attacks (you can snipe up to 600 feet with a clear view!), makes the Hand Crossbow a melee weapon as well as little more than a trown weapon.
Heavy Armor Master: You're so HAM you receive 3 less damage per hit (limited to mundane hits, but it still covers like 7/8th of the Monster Manual) Because getting attacked repeatedly is fun!
Great Weapon Master: Bonus damage when hitting easy targets (melee version). Bonus: Vestigial Cleave built in.
Shield Master: Add your shield AC to your Dex saves (against single target spells only, not much to brag about) and NEGATE FIREBALLS FOR FREE!!!*

Subclasses from the PHB:
Champion: You don't play a Fighter. You play DnD.
Battlemaster: You play DnD AND you play the Fighter.
Eldritch Knight: Not only you make the casters feel inadequate with your unkillability, you steal a page or two from their spellbook, all without sacrificing one bit of your martial prowess. Talk about rubbing it in!

So, yeah, Fighter. Give it a shot if you feel like it. You get quite a few options from the basics alone, so you bet you're not done exploring with all the supplements.

*Subjected to a Dex save. Unused Reaction required. A shield must be equipped at all times.

[Tanarii]

But here's what I like best about Fighters. They are martials, and as such, they are everything casters cannot be, even with their magic: Unkillable.

I love martials that think they are unkillable. They're very likely to overextend themselves and get themselves killed. The players know they did it to themselves, and they know the all too often TPK that follows is on them too.

Martials aren't as killable as squishies in T1 or T2 by any means. But when they think they're invulnerable and overdo it, it's just fun waiting to happen.

[TeChameleon]

I have questions about that AC. Mostly, how?

How? Lesse, quick breakdown...
* Full Plate +1 (19 AC)
* Shield +2 (+4)
* Armoured Fighting Style (+1)
* Ring of Protection (+1)
* Elven Chain +1 (+2, pretty sure this is a homebrew item)
* Aaaaand there's a miscellaneous +1 that I'm not sure where it comes from, and my notes aren't helping

So maybe it should be 27 AC?

[Tanarii]

How? Lesse, quick breakdown...
* Full Plate +1 (19 AC)
* Shield +2 (+4)
* Armoured Fighting Style (+1)
* Ring of Protection (+1)
* Elven Chain +1 (+2, pretty sure this is a homebrew item)
* Aaaaand there's a miscellaneous +1 that I'm not sure where it comes from, and my notes aren't helping

So maybe it should be 27 AC?

Thats three rare items, an armor with a small chance of appearing in Tier 3, a shield that's got a small chance of appearing in Tier 2, and a ring with a small chance of appearing in Tier 2. Then stacking a second armor (or homebrew).

Realistic expectation of base AC for level 8 HA character would be AC 22 with a Shield +1, maybe AC 23 with a lucky find of either a ring of protection or a Shield +2.

Realistic expectation isn't relevant for your character, it is what it is and more power to you. Not trying to diss your character. It's fantastic for you and your fun! But it matters for selling someone else on the class.

[Droppeddead]

this is a pretty easy one for me: RP isn't a stat. I've played a lot of characters that have little to nothing in terms of RP centric abilities, and always have a blast with roleplaying. Fighter is excellent for the fact that you're not tied to any RP tropes - paladin kind of has to be religious or righteous or something like that, rangers kind of have to be nature warriors, barbarians have to get mad at everything, wizards have to be smart, but fighters can be pretty much whatever you want when the armor's off. Sure, you can subvert those other classes, but I feel that people trying to subvert their archetype tropes becomes a trope in itself (ie, "the dumb wizard" or "the calm barbarian").

Well, the meta-game archetypes that we call classes doesn't really have anything to do with what you as a character is like as a person. A "class" is ajust a set of abstract rules defining what that character has the abilitiy to do. A "barbarian" could just as easily be the member of a holy order who has honed their skills in combat to the point that when they go into their "battle mode" they can use their willpower to shrug of wounds that would kill lesser warriors. A gloom stalker ranger could be nothing more than a rat catcher keeping the city sewers free from vermin, and so on.

That said, fighters are pretty much a blank sheet which makes them perfect for pretty much any kind of hero (or villain). From Achilles to Jamie Lannister, from Joan of Arc to Luke Skywalker, Rambo or even the Terminator, the argument that these are "fighters" can easily be made. It's the versatility of the fighter that makes it such a great class, just look at the many examples in this thread alone.

Besides that, what you shouldn't forget is the fact that fighters can, without any magic whatsoever, perform even the most fantastic feats. You know those four attacks you have at level 20? Those shouldn't just be played as "I attack" four times per turn but as the almost godlike feats that they are. You know how in movies they show of how good the hero (or, again, villain) is by letting them dispatch a bunch of enemies in short order? That's pretty much what extra attacks are. Not just being "a bit quicker than the ranger" but being just as impressive as any 9th level spell. What a wizard needs years of practice, a cleric needs the help of actual gods or a warlock to sell their soul, you can do just because you are just that fracking awesome!

[TeChameleon]

Thats three rare items, an armor with a small chance of appearing in Tier 3, a shield that's got a small chance of appearing in Tier 2, and a ring with a small chance of appearing in Tier 2. Then stacking a second armor (or homebrew).

Realistic expectation of base AC for level 8 HA character would be AC 22 with a Shield +1, maybe AC 23 with a lucky find of either a ring of protection or a Shield +2.

Realistic expectation isn't relevant for your character, it is what it is and more power to you. Not trying to diss your character. It's fantastic for you and your fun! But it matters for selling someone else on the class.

Aye, fair enough- I figured that some of that was just the DM being generous (or just not thinking his treasure drops through, heh). Although I thought the Elven Chain Shirt stacked with other armour, and that was the whole point of it?

[Wizard_Lizard]

One thing I like about fighter is that it does have very little presumptions as a base class. A barbarian is presumed to be angry (note all of these have exceptions) an artificer is a brainy gadget person, a cleric has a god, a Druid is a nature hippie, etc etc a fighter is just.. a person who fights well. The rest is completely up to you!

[Unoriginal]

Aye, fair enough- I figured that some of that was just the DM being generous (or just not thinking his treasure drops through, heh). Although I thought the Elven Chain Shirt stacked with other armour, and that was the whole point of it?

Armors don't stack, in general, and in specific the Elven Chain's whole point is to allow those who only have light armor proficiency to wear a medium armor.