So I havent seen anyone about a bag of holding and the new genie warlock.

[Throne12]

So this is what it say for the bag of holding. Placing a bag of holding inside an extra dimensional space created by a handy haversack, portable hole, or "similar item" instantly destroys both items and opens a gate to the Astral Plane. The gate originates where the one item was placed inside the other. Any creature within 10 feet of the gate is sucked through it to a random location on the Astral Plane. The gate then closes. The gate is one-way only and can't be reopened.

So it calls out items so spells like Rope trick and MMM shouldn't set it off. But the genie's bottle is a item so it should set it off.

So is this right.

[verbatim]

As a DM I would rule that this happens if a player explicitly says they put the item in the Bag of Holding, but I would probably also have the genie tell the player not to do that in character the instant they find a Bag of Holding.

[Throne12]

As a DM I would rule that this happens if a player explicitly says they put the item in the Bag of Holding, but I would probably also have the genie tell the player not to do that in character the instant they find a Bag of Holding.

Well the problem here is a party member can't go into the bottle to get a 10min short rest. Because of the warlocks 10th level ability Sanctuary Vessel.

[Dork_Forge]

Well the problem here is a party member can't go into the bottle to get a 10min short rest. Because of the warlocks 10th level ability Sanctuary Vessel.

You probably don't want everyone just popping in there to begin with though, as the vessel just gets left on the ground. The best course of action is to probably leave the vessel with a familiar, so you can have your invisible imp babysit the bag of holding/portable hole or whatever whilst everyone rests.

[Throne12]

You probably don't want everyone just popping in there to begin with though, as the vessel just gets left on the ground. The best course of action is to probably leave the vessel with a familiar, so you can have your invisible imp babysit the bag of holding/portable hole or whatever whilst everyone rests.

Personally thats what I would do but not all warlocks are chain warlock. And too many player would flip out about having to leave there Precious loot out in the open where the DM can mess with it.

[Dork_Forge]

Personally thats what I would do but not all warlocks are chain warlock. And too many player would flip out about having to leave there Precious loot out in the open where the DM can mess with it.

I see what you mean (Tomelocks can grab a normal familiar fi they like still), though players that don't like leaving stuff outside I think would have a fundamental issue with bottled respite as it doesn't actually give you the protection of Rope Trick, Tiny hut etc.

[BoxANT]

i *wish* I could bring bags of holding in my genie bottle without tearing a hole in reality

[Amdy_vill]

I feel like this s a very petty reading of the rules. this just flies in the face of rule 0 have fun. by forcing players to leave things behind like this all you are doing is being petty and going for their stuff.

[Silpharon]

I'm planning on going Artificer with a level 1 Genie dip. With replicate magic item (bag of holding), there's special new text in Tasha's that says:

"If an infusion ends on an item that contains
other things, like a bag of holding, its contents
harmlessly appear in and around its space."

The Genie vessel says similar. So what we'd have is a big mess on the ground, but no death trap. Now if I took a real bag of holding in...oops!

As for when I don't want this to happen... Just give my bag of holding to someone else!

[Dork_Forge]

I feel like this s a very petty reading of the rules. this just flies in the face of rule 0 have fun. by forcing players to leave things behind like this all you are doing is being petty and going for their stuff.

What? This isn't petty, it's how using extradimensional storage spaces in D&D works and the Genie's ability explicitly leaves behind the vessel. Dealing with the reality of that is hardly petty and you don't even have to have an NPC make a play for their stuff, they can just describe what they do each time and then nothing comes of it. If the players don't like it then they should have used a Tiny Hut instead, which also happens to come online 5 levels earlier than this for the group anyway.

[Hannibal78]

It's entirely up to the DM, how he rule the vessel. There are some differences but also there are some connection between an extradimensional space and a Demiplane.
Every demiplane is an extradimension, but not every extradimension is a demiplane.
Now, every demiplane can has it's own rule. A demiplane can be as small as a room, or as big as a continent or province. Ravenloft and the rest are Demiplanes. Bag of Holding no problems.
You can travel to a demiplane with certain spells, items and abilities.
Now cuz you are using the genie ability, what they give to the character, this is more similar for me for a Demiplane.
And also, i don't think it's fair to the player to cause such pain in the ass with a bag of holding.
Bag of holding, after a certain lvl for a party is relevant, at least one almost always you can find in the possession of a party.

So in my opinion its just fair to say, the vessel is a demiplane, specific rules, which mean you can use your bag of holding or similar item without any problem, cuz the simple extradimension problem not apply.

Btw, if you are in your vessel, and you have the plane shift spell, you can use it, and go back to the material plane anywhere where you want (even of the DM rule that the vessel only an extradimensional place).
Also with that spell is possible (discuss with the DM) to go into your vessel, without the time limit. The extra healing option and the fast short rest option, you should discuss with your dm, how it's working.
If the DM rule, that is working only cuz of the lvl 10 ability, then you can use only that way.
But if the DM rule, that these effects part of the Demiplane (vessel) then you can use anytime, doesn't matter how you or your company will visit the place.
Don't forget to ward your vessel when you can, and especially if you are making a material component for your Plane Shift spell to access to your vessel. If you loose, other can infiltrate into your home.

[Throne12]

It's entirely up to the DM, how he rule the vessel. There are some differences but also there are some connection between an extradimensional space and a Demiplane.
Every demiplane is an extradimension, but not every extradimension is a demiplane.
Now, every demiplane can has it's own rule. A demiplane can be as small as a room, or as big as a continent or province. Ravenloft and the rest are Demiplanes. Bag of Holding no problems.
You can travel to a demiplane with certain spells, items and abilities.
Now cuz you are using the genie ability, what they give to the character, this is more similar for me for a Demiplane.
And also, i don't think it's fair to the player to cause such pain in the ass with a bag of holding.
Bag of holding, after a certain lvl for a party is relevant, at least one almost always you can find in the possession of a party.

So in my opinion its just fair to say, the vessel is a demiplane, specific rules, which mean you can use your bag of holding or similar item without any problem, cuz the simple extradimension problem not apply.

Btw, if you are in your vessel, and you have the plane shift spell, you can use it, and go back to the material plane anywhere where you want (even of the DM rule that the vessel only an extradimensional place).
Also with that spell is possible (discuss with the DM) to go into your vessel, without the time limit. The extra healing option and the fast short rest option, you should discuss with your dm, how it's working.
If the DM rule, that is working only cuz of the lvl 10 ability, then you can use only that way.
But if the DM rule, that these effects part of the Demiplane (vessel) then you can use anytime, doesn't matter how you or your company will visit the place.
Don't forget to ward your vessel when you can, and especially if you are making a material component for your Plane Shift spell to access to your vessel. If you loose, other can infiltrate into your home.

Your misconception is in the wording. A Demiplain and a Extra Dimensional space are different things. There are spells and items that use the wording Extra dimensional space like Bags of holding, rope trick, Genie vessel, mordakien magnificent Mansion, pact of the blade. Then there are other spells, abilities, item that use the wording Demiplane like Demiplane, find familiar, sorry they are the only things I can find or remember that have the wording Demiplane.

My point is a demiplane and extra dimensional space are two different things.

[Hannibal78]

Your misconception is in the wording. A Demiplain and a Extra Dimensional space are different things. There are spells and items that use the wording Extra dimensional space like Bags of holding, rope trick, Genie vessel, mordakien magnificent Mansion, pact of the blade. Then there are other spells, abilities, item that use the wording Demiplane like Demiplane, find familiar, sorry they are the only things I can find or remember that have the wording Demiplane.

My point is a demiplane and extra dimensional space are two different things.

It's not. it's in the PHB 302.


"Demiplanes

Demiplanes are small extradimensional spaces with their own unique rules. They are pieces of reality that don't seem to fit anywhere else. Demiplanes come into being by a variety of means. Some are created by spells, such as demiplane, or generated at the desire of a powerful deity or other force. They may exist naturally, as a fold of existing reality that has been pinched off from the rest of the multiverse, or as a baby universe growing in power. A given demiplane can be entered through a single point where it touches another plane.

Theoretically, a plane shift spell can also carry travelers to a demiplane, but the proper frequency required for the tuning fork is extremely hard to acquire. The gate spell is more reliable, assuming the caster knows of the demiplane."

[Silpharon]

It's not. it's in the PHB 302.


"Demiplanes

Demiplanes are small extradimensional spaces with their own unique rules. They are pieces of reality that don't seem to fit anywhere else. Demiplanes come into being by a variety of means. Some are created by spells, such as demiplane, or generated at the desire of a powerful deity or other force. They may exist naturally, as a fold of existing reality that has been pinched off from the rest of the multiverse, or as a baby universe growing in power. A given demiplane can be entered through a single point where it touches another plane.

Theoretically, a plane shift spell can also carry travelers to a demiplane, but the proper frequency required for the tuning fork is extremely hard to acquire. The gate spell is more reliable, assuming the caster knows of the demiplane."

Agreed, here's another quote from WotC:

"Are extradimensional spaces, such as a demiplane or the space created by rope trick, considered to be on a different plane of existence? An extradimensional space (aka an extraplanar space) is outside other planes. Therefore, if you’re on the Material Plane and your foe is in an extradimensional space, the two of you aren’t considered to be on the same plane of existence."

Source: https://dnd.wizards.com/articles/sag...rs-august-2015

[Hannibal78]

Agreed, here's another quote from WotC:

"Are extradimensional spaces, such as a demiplane or the space created by rope trick, considered to be on a different plane of existence? An extradimensional space (aka an extraplanar space) is outside other planes. Therefore, if you’re on the Material Plane and your foe is in an extradimensional space, the two of you aren’t considered to be on the same plane of existence."

Exactly. Thats why you can use the Plane Shift spell if you are in a Demiplane or in an Extradimensional place. By that statment, you can go inside to a bag of holding, and use the plane shift to go back somewhere else to the material plane.

I don't like the idea though, so i won't encourage my players to do that.

[Mikal]

I feel like this s a very petty reading of the rules. this just flies in the face of rule 0 have fun. by forcing players to leave things behind like this all you are doing is being petty and going for their stuff.

Yeah how DARE you have ANY limits. 🙄

[Lunali]

I'm planning on going Artificer with a level 1 Genie dip. With replicate magic item (bag of holding), there's special new text in Tasha's that says:

"If an infusion ends on an item that contains
other things, like a bag of holding, its contents
harmlessly appear in and around its space."

The Genie vessel says similar. So what we'd have is a big mess on the ground, but no death trap. Now if I took a real bag of holding in...oops!

As for when I don't want this to happen... Just give my bag of holding to someone else!

That's if you end the infusion. If you fail to end the infusion before taking the bag inside, you end up with the results from the bag of holding in an extradimensional item.

[Silpharon]

That's if you end the infusion. If you fail to end the infusion before taking the bag inside, you end up with the results from the bag of holding in an extradimensional item.

Good point, I'll have to be careful then!

[TheMango55]

A genie vessel is not a “similar item” though. It creates breathable air and is not something you can reach into at any time. I doubt it reacts at all to those items being within.

Another hint they aren’t similar, if those items are pierced or destroyed the contents are dumped on the astral plane (even when there are not 2 bags involved), if the genie bottle is destroyed things are dumped out of it harmlessly in the material plane.

[Throne12]

This is a example to how mechanics don't match. Because you can take a bag of holding into a demiplane, MMM, Rope trick. But you can't a bag of holding into a portalable hole. I can see why for game wise. But it makes no sense lore wise if it can work with those spells.

Which makes the Genies vessel up in the air. Because its a item that your patron gives you. But it also a class ability.


Also I was wrong and I'm sorry. I didnt know extradimensional space is just a demiplane. Why the cockatrice are they using two words for the same thing. They could just use Demiplane.

[Silpharon]

So the exploit with portable hole would be that you could have dozens of bags of holding to hold a dragon's hoard worth of loot correct?

If this doesn't cause an astral rift, you could do similar with the Genie vessel right? I could have dozens of bags of holding in there...

[Klorox]

I've been curious about this as well.